KID KidiCorp Group -

[communist]

These have been doing nothing for a while now but have recently started going up.

What do you think? Does anyone know why?
Good/Bad invest.

Sorry i'm really a novice here.

[Mr Murphy]

Hi Comm

Up top right of the screen there is a search function, put in KID and there are about 5 threads on this company. Pay to check these out as there is a lot of info in there.

Cheers
Murph

PS with a name like communist you are going to have some lively debates with some people on this site [:p]

[willy_wonker]

quote:Originally posted by Mr Murphy


PS with a name like communist you are going to have some lively debates with some people on this site [:p]


I am surprise Nightmare havnt noticed this thread and posted.

[communist]

Cheers Mr Murphy,
Will do.

[tim23]

Some positive news lately; anyone own shares in the company?

[Steve]

Bought in May but sold out @ 24 for a small profit. If only...

[drum]

The pay rates for childcare workers are pretty low (my partner works in this field). The price you pay for childcare is very expensive. Must be a recipe for success if management is good. They have some pretty ambitous growth plans by the sound of it. It looks like there is resistance at 26c though.

Disc: Dont hold

[Steve]

If the price were to get back to say 20-22, then I would look at getting back in.

[marinesalvor]

I think its a yes
Marinesalvoress is a teacher - the pressure on early age education is huge - massive demand, a businesslike response to the demand should do well

[clearasmud]

Isn't this an OPT ?

[Steve]

quote:[i]Isn't this an OPT ?

What is an OPT?!

TIA

[Steve]

quote:Originally posted by Steve

If the price were to get back to say 20-22, then I would look at getting back in.


Well it was one hell of a drop back down to 20c today. Do I pull the trigger and get some is the question?

[marinesalvor]

I like it and will be in soon, could go to 19 today - then its a def buy

[amistad]

I’m a total novice to investing in shares and new to this site. I was thinking of buying kidicorp shares because of the Govt childcare policies that come into effect form October this year. The subsidies are being increased substantially over the next few years - the total amount building to $1.1 billion a year in 2007. From October this year, for instance families (on an income of $1,110.00) with 3 children will receive $2.84 per child per hour, ($1.99 at present), and in October next year it’ll increase to $3.12 etc......... Given this it would have to be a good investment wouldn’t it??

[Long Strangle]

Believe this will go a lot lower than 19c but wouldn't buy based on the fact that they have missed previously guided earnings. LS :)

[Steve]

I put a buy order in @ 20c, but it would appear that i have missed out (for now, at least)

[kittydashwood]

Have been watching the business appears a sound prospect. However seems a little like AIR, must be near capacity to make a profit. Also what a fragile business, just one bad staff member, one bad touching incident, one parental compliant making the paper, KID would be gone. Staff quality and child safety would have to be excellent for this to succeed.

[foodee]

Kittyd
Agreed. Once each unit in any locality reaches full capacity there is little extra growth unless the unit is enlarged or more units are established, or increase charges and/or cost cutting. Staffing qualities are bound to be variable especially when they are not stake holders.
After all said, the market is there and no doubt will be met.

Cheers

[communist]

No i don't agree foodee - they are no where near full capacity - they only just opened thier first unit in the south island. I got in a while ago at 18c and haven't looked back.

[marinesalvor]

I hear what you say Kitty - but also see the lifestyle trends and envirnoment changes that make childcare a boom industry

I think Kidicorp have a number of brands out there - so may be able to insulate from a "touching" incident

[foodee]

Com
You have done well getting in at that level. I merely point out that once capacity is filled there is little growth and will just tick along.
My viewing of the coy is only at the perceptial stage only.

[amistad]

Just about everyone HAS to work these days, not just in New Zealand but world wide things just aren't as easy as they used to be and families on one income are few and far between. The govt Subsidies coming into effect in October will virtually mean free child care........The amount that I'll be paying for my 3 children at afterschool care will be negigable- a few cents a session so I believe that allot more people will be using these childcare services. (There was a bit in the news this morning also about how important/vital pre school education is for children)

Amistad what would the benefit to society be if the Govt. paid the same subsidies to stay home mothers instead of to child care. My opinion is we would have better balanced children less crime and a far better society.

[blackcap]

quote:Originally posted by ENIGMA

Amistad what would the benefit to society be if the Govt. paid the same subsidies to stay home mothers instead of to child care. My opinion is we would have better balanced children less crime and a far better society.


Enigma, I fully concur with that statement.

[amistad]

I'm not saying I aggree with it. I feel that the policies are pretty anti family (and anti business) but to make ends meet most women HAVE to work. I have my children in after school care 2 nites a week so I can concentrate on my business - it took 4 years to finally get through the guilt etc and book them in but should have done it years ago. They LOVE it and they come back with arm fulls of drawings etc. People have time for them there. I only WISH I had the time.

[Mr Murphy]

Well we are getting a bit off share trading here but I don't see how society would be more balanced if you paid the subsidies to stay home mums for children to stay at home. This would mean that children would miss out on social interactions with other children which is essential for their growth at that age. To achieve balance in this area a child should be going to either child care or an environment that they can interact with other children of a similar age and learn social skills.

I think kids should go to child care at least twice a week, but that is my personal preferance. They also spend alot of energy at kindy which makes them sleep better at night hehehe

Cheers
Murph

Mr Murphy on your reasoning then subsidies should not be paid for childcare either. We have a lot more crime and maladjusted children now than when one wage was sufficient to live on. Ban subsidiesfor childcare and Kiddicorp would not last 5 days. Why should tax payers subsidise big business.

[Mr Murphy]

Don't get me wrong here I am dead against subsidies and do not agree with the reasoning put up on this thread that because subsidies will be increased to families that KID is a good buy. To me relying on govt subsidies to artificially pick up a sector, well it is artificial, especially with an election coming up, not good sense in there for me.

One other point govt is not subsidising big business but families, there is a difference there enigma, the families have a choice as to where to spend this money.

I don't think that child care facilities should be looked on as bad as they teach the kids very valuable skills and the teachers I would say have more time and energy than parents to develop games, activities and learning’s to keep the kids amused, that the large majority of parents would not have the time or energy to undertake.

Cheers
Murph

[Steve]

For what it is worth, my buy order is in @ 20c...

Mr Murphy as the subsidies go to the child care centres parents don't have a choice where they spend the money If it went to the parents they could opt to stay home. (And check my theory please as i have not been checking NZ childcare legislation for a good number of years.)Some of the smaller more intimate and so better for the children are not elegible for the subsidies as they are run by non profit organisations. This is why Isay it is a subsidy for business

[donnie]

Looks like somethings up in aussie regarding the child care centres most of them are in a trading halt.

could be a merger in the wind.

[foodee]

Interesting insight into 'child care' in the current TV series on TVone 'Child in our time'

[donnie]

If KID grows enough might see KID get taken over too.

overall good news for people who own the childcare shares in OZ.

$800m merger as easy as ABC
9/09/04 By: James Seabrook

Child Care Centres Australia Limited (CDC), Peppercorn Management Group Limited (PMG) and its associated investment fund (PIV) this afternoon announced they would merge with A.B.C. Learning Centres Limited (ABS) to create Australia’s largest childcare provider. The deal will see the ABC acquire 115 childcare businesses from Peppercorn, and will be financed by the issue of $300 million in ordinary shares and a convertible security.




With the boards of both Peppercorn and Child Care Centres unanimously supporting the proposal, the directors of ABC explained that the merger would only be effected if the capital raising were not successfully completed.

Outlining the proposal, ABC’s CEO Mr Groves said that PMG shareholders would receive $10.80 cash, which represents a 25% premium to the price of PMG shares based on the closing market price on 6 September 2004.

”CDC shareholders will receive 7 ABC ordinary shares for every 18 CDC ordinary shares they own, implying a value of $1.40 per share and representing a premium of 14% over the CDC closing market price of $1.23 on 6 September 2004,” Mr Groves added.

The company highlighted that the merger would create significant benefits for shareholders, commenting that pro-forma combined revenues for the year to 30 June 2005 are expected to be approximately $164 million increasing to $383 million in 2007.

“There are also substantial synergy benefits, estimated to be in the order of $20 million in 2006 and $24 million in 2007,” the group said.

The company concluded that the merger would push market capitalisation past $800 million with a combined ownership of 550 centres and 228 managed centres.

At 1505 AEST, shares in A.B.C Learning Centres were up 25c to $3.80, Child Care Centres Australia climbed 21c to $1.44, while Peppercorn Management Group gained $1.60 to $10.30.

[donnie]

an interesting read about the owners of ABS and PMG and.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,10729636%255E643,00.html

[Steve]

Interesting article in todays paper:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3074442a13,00.html

Given that KID is a private childcare facility, how do you see its long-term future working out given that only community-based childcare facilities will receive the Govt. subsidy?

Obviously the playing field is not going to be level...

[marinesalvor]

hmmm seems to be in freefall since the peppercorn thing - any thoughts??

[Long Strangle]

Seems they are treading water to a certain extent. Buying assets in the form of childcare facilities, then selling the land & buildings to fund operations. Not too long before they come unstuck.

All the best.
LS.

[marinesalvor]

ok - what gives!!! dropping like a stone

[lambton]

quote:Originally posted by marinesalvor

ok - what gives!!! dropping like a stone


I don't know, but might be lack of liquidity or else Fisher & Co who hold a big chunk are playing games.
Nearly pulled the trigger today taking a loss, but decided to hold until budget when daycares might be the recipient of good tidings - like occurred in Australia. If not this could be a "down the tubes" Charlie.

[capitalgain]

Dont you know....a fights broken out in the playground (something about someone pulling somebody elses hair!) but Timmy's gone to get teacher so everything will be back to normal soon
-There will be an announcement this afternoon

[capitalgain]

Dont you know....a fights broken out in the playground (something about someone pulling somebody elses hair!) but Timmy's gone to get teacher so everything will be back to normal soon
-There will be an announcement this afternoon

[marinesalvor]

as long as there isnt an infestation of knits - or too many red sugary lollies around

[lambton]

quote:Originally posted by capitalgain

Dont you know....a fights broken out in the playground (something about someone pulling somebody elses hair!) but Timmy's gone to get teacher so everything will be back to normal soon
-There will be an announcement this afternoon


Thanks for that information.

[Anna Naum]

Another Fisher Funds stock

[K9]

quote:Originally posted by lambton


quote:Originally posted by marinesalvor

ok - what gives!!! dropping like a stone


I don't know, but might be lack of liquidity or else Fisher & Co who hold a big chunk are playing games.
Nearly pulled the trigger today taking a loss, but decided to hold until budget when daycares might be the recipient of good tidings - like occurred in Australia. If not this could be a "down the tubes" Charlie.



LOOKS LIKE THE EXTRA FUNDING IS TO BE ANNOUNCED TOMORROW.

[Zaphod]

What does everyone make of this announcement? Should we be concerned?

-----------------

NZX Regulation Announcement
KidiCorp Group Limited ["KID"]
Mowbray Collectables Limited ["MOW"]
Pacific Edge Biotechnology Limited ["PEB"]
Late Annual Reports


NZX Regulation advises that the following Issuers have not provided their Annual Reports for the period ending 31 March 2005, which under Listing Rule 10.5.1 was due to be issued to NZX on 30 June 2005:

KidiCorp Group Limited (KID)
Mowbray Collectables Limited (MOW)
Pacific Edge Biotechnology Limited (PEB)

Pursuant to the policy set out in Footnote 2 of Listing Rule 5.4.3, if an Issuer has not issued its Annual or Half Year report within 5 Business Days of the due date, quotation of that Issuer's Securities will be suspended until the Issuer has made issued its Annual or Half Year report in accordance with Listing Rule 10.4.1.

If any of the above named Issuers have not issued their annual reports by close of business Thursday, 7 July 2005, NZX gives notice that trading in that Issuer's securities will be suspended effective from the commencement of trading Friday, 08 July 2005.

[Halebop]

It doesn't have to mean bad news but it hardly ever means good news.

[lambton]

quote:Originally posted by Halebop

It doesn't have to mean bad news but it hardly ever means good news.


Too true. But there has been a little strength in the s/p last couple of days. Who knows - might be someone playing games as I earlier suggested. Will wait and see.

[lambton]

Kidicorp now suspended from trading - oops. better get those accounts out fellows, or are you hiding bad tidings?:(

[jrbl]

why pretel hasn't this stock received a boost in SP , the reds have jsut fed it part of an extra 100 million funding specifically for this companies market? Is it that much of a dog ?

[zazaza]

quote:Originally posted by lambton

Kidicorp now suspended from trading - oops. better get those accounts out fellows, or are you hiding bad tidings?:(


Time to do the runner as fast as you can from this sinking ship.....

[Footsie]

Thought it was about time this stock was discussed again.

They are reporting this month and I suspect it will be their maiden profit result. somewhere in the region of $2-2.5m
Which puts them on a p/e of 14-15x

Not bad for a coy which is getting more funding from govt each year and is still growing organically and through acquisitions.

They may even declare their fist div, or at least outline a div policy now they are making money.

They actually have 66 centres around NZ. my nephew attends one in auckland and he was on the waiting list for a year before being accepted.

watch this space

[patsy]

If you want to get into this industry, then I suggest you seriously look at ABS in the ASX. It's the biggest operator of child care centres in Oz, with some 20% of the market in an industry that is heavily fragmented. They've been expanding to the USA and have recently raised a few hundred millions for further aquisitions there. It's still somewhat under the radar....

[marinesalvor]

an article on KID featured in the latest unlimited - was pretty good. Certainly childcare is a megatrend for our modern world. Only question is - is KID a good vehicle to take advantage of it

I have these in my investor picks for the year - was a punt, but you never know

[Mr D C]

More good news for Kididcorp in the budget:

Early childhood education funding will rise by $162 million over the next four years.

Most of the money is earmarked for implementation of Labour's election promise of 20 hours' free early childhood education for three and four-year-olds.

About $30 million will go towards higher funding rates for providers to recognise rule changes requiring a greater level of qualifications in the sector.

[patsy]

quote:Originally posted by Mr D C

More good news for Kididcorp in the budget:

Early childhood education funding will rise by $162 million over the next four years.

Most of the money is earmarked for implementation of Labour's election promise of 20 hours' free early childhood education for three and four-year-olds.

About $30 million will go towards higher funding rates for providers to recognise rule changes requiring a greater level of qualifications in the sector.




Wrong! The hourly rate proposed can barely cover the variable costs of an increase in children attendance (at Kidicorp or any other private provider). It may actually lead to the closure of some centers.

[Footsie]

SOrry Patsy, but I dont see how an increase in govt funding is bad for KID

Logically is good for them, esp as NZ's largest provider

[Footsie]

Excellent result out today. NPBT of $2.04m as I outlined a month ago.

Rev up 29% to $32m as well.

With 59% growth in childcare centre capacity in FY06 (most in the latter half of the year), there is plenty of capacity for growth to flow through to FY07.

Now, just need to find out if they are going to pay a div. Might phone to ask if they will disclose to the market their div policy.
;)

[Footsie]

I emailed Wayne Wright CEO today.
He told me:
Their current policy is to retain all earnings to fund growth (acquisitions).
But this policy is reviewed regularly, although he didn't elaborate.

He also said he expects growth of 15-20% p.a. for the next few years.


Good news folks

[Panic E-Button]

Current price 19c/share makes KID right in value with P/E 22.3

[Footsie]

my forecast for FY07 is NPAT of 2.5m

which puts them on an FY07 p/e of 13x

In my opinion a revalutation of KID by the market within the next year is highly likely, esp if the small caps come back into favour.

[Panic E-Button]

Today group of kids (3-4 y. o.) with teachers had a walk via Wellington m-way tunnel. There is no safety barrier and speed limit still 100km/h. Teachers got fine $250 each.
Kidicorp should be more in control of their employees.
Not the best advertisement for Kidicorp, as it was in the News at 6pm today.

[zazaza]

3 & 4 year olds walking down the good old Terrace Tunnel, what a bunch of idiots, not a great way to advitise how Kiddie Corp look after your toddlers!!

[croesus]

Lucky its not Kiddie Corpse

[Zaphod]

This NZ Herald article provides an interesting bit of background regarding the latest 5 million share issue.

It all makes sense now...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=3&ObjectID=10389154

[Footsie]

Because there is no coverage by any of the brokers on this stock
I decided to do my own DCF valuation and came up with the following.

Current Price 16c
Valuation 29c
Upside 81%

Assumptions
Beta 1.2
WACC 13%
Terminal growth rate 1%

Note my assumptions were relatively conservative, you could quite easily get a valuation of 40c without too much difficulty.

Its given me a clear indication of a target price now, and i'm also more comfortable buyin stock at these levels

[Zaphod]

This particular share is still very much in favour with me, despite the overall lack of market recognition it has received.

Reading the balance sheet, it would seem that $2.8m of revenue is directly attributable to the sales of property with a view to lease back from the purchaser. Deducting this from the total revenue, would produce a slight loss for the financial year.

Given that the latest report indicates a movement away from purchasing existing centres, to building new centres, what effect do you think this will have on their performance?

[waikare]

Looks to be a good by at it current price of 17 cents per share

[richierich]

I have not frequented this forum for a few years... but I have been holding on to this share since it was still feverpitch... hopefully this time it will really move...

[Phaedrus]

KID has been in a downtrend for about 2 years, so far. Having been as high as 30 cents, it closed today at 17 cents. If you are keen to buy this stock, why not wait until it stops making lower highs? At the very least, why not wait until it breaks above its long-term trendline? It would also be good to see some bigger players getting in - rather than out!

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-2/1151662/KID74001.gif

[waikare]

Thanks Phaedrus for the info, I just might hang on a little longer and wait to they level out or start to rise.

Or maybe take little punt now and get them now, with the view they will not dip any lower than 17 cents

[Zaphod]

quote:Originally posted by waikare

Thanks Phaedrus for the info, I just might hang on a little longer and wait to they level out or start to rise.

Or maybe take little punt now and get them now, with the view they will not dip any lower than 17 cents


Personally, I'd heed Phaedrus' warning - wait until the long term downward trend is broken. It is not a sure thing that they can't go below 17cps.

[Footsie]

there is pleny of support at 16c, from me included

some selling at 18-19,

so yes, once the momentum builds and it breaks 18c Phaedrus may well be right

as per my previous post, im very happy to buy around here as my DCF is 29c
and this will be realised at some point over the next 1- 2 yrs

[Panic E-Button]

P/E to high at present as market is in positive mood, but what happen if sentiment change? High P/E stocks gona be dumped.
Holding none.

[waikare]

They are having their AGM on Momday 10th, I'll see what comes out of this before I increase my holding.

[Footsie]

PEB
what makes u say the mkt is in positive mood?

I actually think the opposite.

ppl are quite bearish in NZ

if the mkt was positive KID would be 30c

which is why buying at 16c is good value

[Panic E-Button]

Look @ index:
NZX 50 Index 3,642 up 39 + 1.1%
NZAX All Index 1,309 up 18 + 1.4%
NZX MidCap Index 8,655 up 58 + 0.7%
NZX SmallCap Index 22,304 up 64 +0.3%
NZX All Index 3,637 up 39 +1.1%

If you see decline for number of days in the row we'll talk about bearish mood and we'll see what the KID will do.
P/E is the key. If you pay more then 16 times earnings, your investment is more in risk when come to market correction.

[Footsie]

PEB

What angle are you coming from?

high p/e ? i hardly think a p/e of 18x or 19x is high do you?

high p/e stocks often go higher....sure you have a point if the market crashes, high p/e stocks ie something like rak get carved back but come on ! 18x.

IF KID are forecasting eps growth of 20%, then a forecast p/e of say 15x is pretty modest i'd say.

but the market will be the judge...

dont forget this stock has traded well above 20c long before it even had any E

[Panic E-Button]

If you're happy with self-explanation above, I'm happy for you too. Enjoy today's share price hike and prosper.

[Paddy]

Anyone get to the AGM?

[Footsie]

yes AGM was good.
Some useful info came out re their forecast growth etc.

I'll summarise below:

-To grow to 6,300 licences within 4 years.
-Macquarie buying centres at a price of $14k per licence.
-KID will try to grow organically or through building new centres at a cost of 5k per licence.
-new capital raising cancelled due to takeovers infringement so Wright sold down to other directors to get below 50% level.
- possibility of divs in the future. dependent on what level of cashflow is req for growth

on rough calcs currently 3,373 licences @ 14k = $47.2m or 27c p/share
6,300 licences @ 14k = $88.2m or 50c


I re-did my DCF valuation based on the above assumptions and came up with 37-39c

i'm long and still buying.

Enough ramping, i'm going to shut up for a while. If u haven't bought now then, well u obviously dont believe the story - its pretty compelling.

[waikare]

Thanks for your imput Footise, I see a very small number of shares went through at 18 cents today.

I guess it time to get a few more.

[Paper Tiger]

Takeover offer at the princely sum of 19c (http://stocknessmonster.com/news-item?S=KID&E=NZSE&N=134590)

[Pennywise]

When all is looking good for the future....

After all the small shareholders lost and lost, on both the original junk co and the morph into Kidi


when things look good, management wants it back

typical rape.


This won't go for 19c, that is far too lean an offer.

[Footsie]

THere is more to this than meets the eye.
at the AGM , the chairman let slip that he thinks the share should be trading at 30c

I've checked whose been selling lately and its none other than wayne wright jnr! the son of the guy who is making the takeover bid.....

My guess is that WW jnr has been keeping a lid on the price for dad...

WW snr obviously knows he wont get close to acceptance at 19c esp with scrooge Fisher funds holding 19% !

So why do it?
A number of reasons in my mind
1. He wants to "flush" out other buyers like Maq or ABC to trump his bid and cash out...spend life on the beach at Tauranga
2. He sees plenty of upside - wants it all for himeslf, and he intends to increase his offer but wanted to start out low...
or
3. He wants to find out what the independent valuation comes in at so he can shop that around to MAq & abc...see point 1.

My own analysis suggests the valuation will come in north of 30c...
Either way... PLENTY OF UPSIDE.... (i'm on the bid at 19c)

I told you phaedrus - can't always listen to the charts, they are merely a guide not the gospel! besides now its "broken" the resistance at 18.5-19c... so you can all pile in

[Paper Tiger]

or
4. WWsnr was forced to sell a few shares (to fellow directors) as a result of the buy-back and "accidentally" slipping over the 50% mark, and this is just the necessary procedural stuff in order to now buy them back.

Disc: It is a long(ish) story but I ended up day trading 20000 KID shares today for $340 profit. :)

[Pennywise]

Footsie, senario B is my pick.

a mere million on the last result (easy with the upside from 80% preschool occupancy with new Govt help coming along) and Kidi will be trading on PE 14.

[waikare]

(Footsie 28/7) My own analysis suggests the valuation will come in north of 30c...
Either way... PLENTY OF UPSIDE.... (i'm on the bid at 19c

Yep agree with Footsie -------- it will be interesting see what the Independent Vaulation comes up with.

I brought mine a couple of weeks back with a long term view and maybe a divi, not all that happy to sell at 19cps.

[sniper]

This from a company where millions of dollars of shares were freely available from ???? a few months ago at 17 cents. Who is kidding who?

[Footsie]

from what i know of w wright snr he is a very astute businessman...

quote from NZ herald "....if i wanted to 100% the price wouldn't be 19c would it"

smoke and mirrors, who in their right mind is going to sell to him when they can sell in the market above 19c
why bother with the cost of a full takeover for a few million shares
THe story about him wanting 50% is BS
if you count his son, he is comfortably over 50%
+++ he never owned over 50% it was always 49.4% it only went over when 5 m shares were cancelled by lombard finance (as a payback for building a centre) consequently he was recently forced to sell down by the takeovers panel to go back below 50% to stop him having to mount a full takeover....and now he has.... ridiculous ...
there is more to it than that, esp with WW jnr selling on market at 18-18.5c in the last few weeks

KID is in PLAY
This is a great story, get on board while its still cheap!

[waikare]

I also read the article in Sat Herarld ----- why would he go to the extent of a full take over when he only wants a few more share to take him over 50% so he can be in control.

To quote Mr Wright from the Herald "The offer realy speaks for itself. There is nothing sinister there" ........... yeah right

I am sure Mr & MRs Wright Snr, Mr & Mrs Wright Jnr, the Family Trust and other family members their total holdings would well exceed the 50%.

[Footsie]

Waikere.... exactly ....echoes my earlier points

[sniper]

Plenty on offer at 19 cents. I wonder why?

So "The offer realy speaks for itself. There is nothing sinister there". Of course ......;)

[Footsie]

IMHO if you are selling stock at 19c you are stupid

Why do it when you are going to be paid, 19c by WWright with no brokerage!

if everyone held out...he wouldnt't get the supposed 3m shares he requires.... plus why not wait for the indepenent val

Its a gift horse for Wwright

[sniper]

Because WWright will get swamped with shares at 19 cents and as he only wants to keep the sp up ..oops only 50% ... you will get scaled to buggery and then, sp will fall back like a stone.

[Footsie]

Sniper..."Drop like stone", ... what back to 18c....;)

[waikare]

Wright is offering 19c.

A total trade of 269k today (02/08) all went through at 19c except for 5100 at 19.2c and we haven't see the Independents report yet.

It doesn't quite stack up here?

[shandy]

Any idea why someone would be selling today at 18.5c ??

[Footsie]

uninformed investor who is too impatient to wait even a day to sell at 19c let alone a few weeks for the takevoer offer.

Ultimately People have hundreds of reasons for selling. Could be someone raising cash to invest in TWR...;) who knows.

[sniper]

quote:Originally posted by shandy

Any idea why someone would be selling today at 18.5c ??


Because many in the market have already been offered shares by a shareholder at under 19 cents before this 'takeover' offer.

Ever wonder why Wright did not take up that offer to build his stake up? ;)

[waikare]

Can probably understand there being a few uninformed sellers out there.

I first heard about the takeover on Thursday afternoon 27 July. Two weeks latter I still have not received notication of the offer in the post.

What is really going on here?

1)Wright Snr claims he only wants a few more shares to take him over the 50%

2)Then why is Snr going for a full take over.

3)Why is the offer in the name of the family trust

4)Wouldn't it be easier if his son or other family members brought a few more.

(Could it be other family members are not giving this their full support in answer to the above)

[sniper]

quote:Originally posted by Footsie

uninformed investor who is too impatient to wait even a day to sell at 19c let alone a few weeks for the takevoer offer.

Ultimately People have hundreds of reasons for selling. Could be someone raising cash to invest in TWR...;) who knows.


Plenty being offered at 18 cents.

Easy money for you to make, Footsie.

Keep buying at 18 cents and flick them in the t/o at 19 cents.

[Mr D C]

Sniper

On the 31/07 you suggested the take over will get scaled, given it is a full take over offer can they scale acceptances??

[sniper]

quote:Originally posted by Mr D C

Sniper

On the 31/07 you suggested the take over will get scaled, given it is a full take over offer can they scale acceptances??


It is still an intention to make a full t/o bid subject to various conditions. Wright is open about the fact that he only wants enough to get to 50.1%. Looks like a blatant attempt to ramp up the sp which has failed. So expect him to change the bid to 50.1%.

[Footsie]

the independent valution will produce a decent number for sure....

this is still a 1-2 year story tho - wait till the govt offers the 20 hrs free education next year and see what that does for the bottom line...... plus govt always pays KID 3 months in advance

Sure i think its worth north of 30c right now, but i believe it will take the market a while to wake up to this....

SNIPER - yes i have been buying, but unfortunately i dont have a bottomless pit of cash....
picked up another 100k odd.

why dont you get out there and hoover!!!!

[waikare]

i]Originally posted by Mr D C[/i]

Sniper

On the 31/07 you suggested the take over will get scaled, given it is a full take over offer can they scale acceptances??
[/quote]

The NZ Stock Ex without doubt will have particular rules and regulations covering all aspects of a take over.

If it is the case of scaling down, this goes hard against the whole idea of a takeover. (Wright has said from the start the trust was only after 50.1% ) there must be other ways of getting a controlling interest in KID.

His trust is after 50.1% what about his and other family members shares in KID, are they going to accept the 19 cents takeover offer?

I guess we will just have to wait to see whats in the offer and Independent Valuation report.

[Footsie]

to be honest... i think WW SNR will take as me as he can get at 19c.... gobble gobble i say

dont forget "if i wanted 100% the offer wouldn't be 19c would it" quote WW

[shandy]

Whats people take on all this ???

Kidicorp Independent Directors say REJECT offer

In response to the Mitchell Investment Trust takeover offer to acquire shares in Kidicorp Group Limited at a price of $0.19 cents, the independent directors of Kidicorp are recommending shareholders reject the offer.

The independent directors committee comprises Richard Waddel as chairman, Victoria Carter and Stephen Tietjens. Wayne Wright, executive director, does not sit on the committee because he is a trustee of Mitchell Investment Trust.

The Independent Directors formed a committee and commissioned an independent adviser's report from Ferrier Hodgson on the merits of the Offer, as required by the Takeovers Code. This report along with the target company statement and directors' recommendation is being mailed out to all shareholders during next week. The Mitchell Investment Trust offer is being mailed today.

Ferrier Hodgson's valuation of Kidicorp is a range between $0.21 to $0.28 with midpoint of $0.245 per share.

The Independent Directors say that they have evaluated the information and advice available and unanimously recommend that shareholders reject this offer. They say they will not be accepting the offer for their own direct or indirect shareholdings at the current offer price.

Says Chairman, Richard Waddel, "In arriving at the recommendation, we considered a range of factors including the following:

o The offer is below Ferrier Hodgson's assessed value of the Kidicorp
shares (being in the range of $0.21 to $0.28 and below their mid point valuation of $0.245 per share.

o The offer does not contain any premium for control. Mr Wright has
advised Ferrier Hodgson that he considers the trust already has effective control of Kidicorp with 49.3%.

However, the stated reason for the offer is to increase the trust's shareholding over the 50% control threshold. This threshold ensures that the trust can pass most ordinary resolutions and the trust may be able to "creep" under the Takeovers Code provisions."

Mr Waddel continued, "obviously our recommendation is necessarily general and does not take into account the specific circumstances of any particular shareholder.

"In particular, we are conscious that the trading of the shares on the NZSX has been thin, and that Kidicorp shares currently have limited liquidity. This offer is an opportunity for shareholders to sell at $0.19 per share without paying brokerage fees and, given that the offer is a full offer, acceptances will not be scaled."

Mitchell Investment Trust only requires acceptance for 1,175,264 shares (or 1.3% of the shares in the company that it does not already hold), so there is a reasonable prospect that the offer will become unconditional and that effective control will pass.

Mr Waddel reminded shareholders that wish to sell that they should note that, under the Takeovers Code, the offer must be open for at least 30 days, and may be extended. In addition, should the offer price be increased the increased price would be available to all shareholders that accept the offer.

[Pennywise]

sounds like trouble in the boardroom.

[Footsie]

Well, well, well

I told you so.....

you should have all been buying the stock at 18c over the last few weeks..... and you could have sold them out for a nice wee profit with no bro .... back to WW

25c mid range valuation.....probably fair but i still think someome would have to pay 30+ to gain full "control"

This is a great story boys and girls. Perfect LT investment for the Kids :D

[waikare]

Quote from this mornings Herald Sat 26/08

"Wright said shares were trading at 18 cents when he made the 19c a share offer and he was confident enough shareholders would take up the offer before it closed"

Not too sure how to take this............. happy to take whats on offer, to take him over the 51% to get full control and leave it at that........... or beleives that we are a lot of fools and will sell out cheaply to him, when he knows as well as most of us they are worth a lot more than 19 cents.

[Footsie]

waikare how many do you hold?

what about you sniper?>

[waikare]

quote:Originally posted by Footsie

waikare how many do you hold?

what about you sniper?>


In my portfolio I alway try to enclude one company as a spec, with no set rules, just sell it when it goes up a little.

KID is my current spec, I purchased 20,000 at 17 cents early July.

Footsie, can I be so bold as to enquire why you are seeking this information from Sniper and myself?

[Footsie]

i was just curious to see if we had a big buyer out there

but i saw from the offer docs today that fisher funds has bought close to 700k since the takevoer - so that effectively answers my q

[shandy]

ok, im a newbie ... My very first purchase of equities was 120,000 units in KID a couple of months ago, didnt give it to much though apart from my general knowledge that kid centres are cash cows and any small movement in the share price at 0.18c would result in a good gain (or loss) ... looked like a pretty good move now :-). I today rejected the 0.19c takeover bid ... I have a feeling that when they release there propfit results in a few months ?? It would be a good result.

Also ABC in australia just announced a circa $80mio profit and may be on the hunt for more aquisitions ??

[Footsie]

Shandy

Pure and simple mate..... wont be long before KID is gobbled up by an Aussie..... just like all the retirement coy's

and thanks to the independent report......we now know what they have to pay, and the longer they wait, the more that val goes up !!

[Lane]

ABC is a classic example - agree Shandy, childcare centres are a cash cow - even finding space to get your kids into one is hard enough particulary here in Auckland. And then on top of that you have the Govt subsidising 20 hours per week so more parents can get back to work - I know that will ease my own cost of kindy etc for our kids.

Disc- have kids - hold KID

[Footsie]

anyone read the full independent val?

numbers look good.
quote from WW " i'll go as high as i need to get a million or two shares or whatever would take me over 50%)

so if they price is trading over 19c then the offer may go to 20c +

projections are for revenue to grow from 32m to 82m in 4 years and EBITDA to grow to 11m

:D:D

great long term hold

[shandy]

what does this all mean ????

At 10:19 am on Wednesday Sep 06, 2006, (NZ Local Time) the following announcement was made:

SSH: KID: SSH Notice Wayne Wright , Chloe Angela Wright
KID
06/09/2006
SSH

REL: 1019 HRS KidiCorp Group Limited

SSH: KID: SSH Notice Wayne Wright , Chloe Angela Wright

NOTICE 27507 DETAILS

Submitted Date : 06-Sep-2006 10:16
Status : Accepted

Substantial : Y Director : N
Add Holder : N Change Holder : Y
Ceased Holder : N Change Nature : N

Issuer Code : KID KidiCorp Group Limited
Holder : Wayne Wright Snr, Chloe Angela Wright and Graeme
Richard Holmes

Address : 119 Kaylene Place
: RD 2
: Tauranga
Country : New Zealand

Contact Name : Bruce Woodward
Phone : 07 577 9263

Total of Interest : 91674159
Total Issued : 177145844
Total % : 51.75

Class : KID
Votes Attached : 1

Beneficial
Total of Interest : 91674159
Current % held : 51.75
Last % held : 49.34
Names : Wayne Wright, Chloe Angela Wright & Graeme Richard
Holmes jointly

Transaction Dates : 5 September 2006
Total Votes : 4276500
Considerations : 812535

Non Beneficial
Total of Interest :

Description :
Acceptance received pursuant to full takeover offer by trustees of the
Mitchell Investment Trust

Lombard Finance & Investments and others
Documentation
With Notice : No
Not Filed : No
Been Filed : No
Number of pages : 0

Date of Last Notice : 03-Jul-2006

Submitted By : Bruce Gavin Woodward

[Paper Tiger]

It means:
Wayne as already got what he wants (at 19c).
If you want to sell to him at 19c you still can.
If you want to sell for more Wayne will not buy them off you.

[shandy]

quote:Originally posted by Paper Tiger

It means:
Wayne as already got what he wants (at 19c).
If you want to sell to him at 19c you still can.
If you want to sell for more Wayne will not buy them off you.


Thanks for explaining Paper Tiger, I think I'll hold anyway.

[waikare]

quote:Originally posted by Footsie

anyone read the full independent val?

numbers look good.
quote from WW " i'll go as high as i need to get a million or two shares or whatever would take me over 50%)

so if they price is trading over 19c then the offer may go to 20c +

projections are for revenue to grow from 32m to 82m in 4 years and EBITDA to grow to 11m

:D:D

great long term hold


Had a bit of a quick read when I got it in the post a few days back.

Agree the forcast figures look ok, adding onto Footise numbers.

Projectd Net Profit 1 - 4 years
2007: 858,000
2008: 2866,000
2009: 4110,000
2010: 5406,000

Probably the only question mark is the teachers salaries, where will they be in 4 or 5 years time?

Wright's Trust has gone over the 51%, so I guess he's happy with that, and will no doubt take all that's on offer at 19 cents.

For the last few days they have been trading above his offer price.

[Mr D C]

Any ideas why the projected profit fot 07 is down to 858K from 1.54m for 06?. Given the PE is currently 21 odd, a reduction of profit to 858K would put the PE to near 40 and would surely put some donward pressure on the SP is the short term.

[Paper Tiger]

quote:Originally posted by waikare


Projectd Net Profit 1 - 4 years
2007: 858,000
2008: 2866,000
2009: 4110,000
2010: 5406,000



I would appreciate it if you could confirm that these profit projections are based on GAAP (or IFRS).

Must admit I am surprised by the low level of the profit for next year.

[waikare]

quote:Originally posted by Paper Tiger


quote:Originally posted by waikare


Projectd Net Profit 1 - 4 years
2007: 858,000
2008: 2866,000
2009: 4110,000
2010: 5406,000



I would appreciate it if you could confirm that these profit projections are based on GAAP (or IFRS).

Must admit I am surprised by the low level of the profit for next year.


I also noticed the decrease in forcast profit for 2007, below is a quote from page 7 of the Independent Report may help explain the downturn in profit:

"Budget revenue for the 2007 finanical year of $43.5m compares to actual revenue of $32m (including property sales of $2.8m) In December 2005 Kidicorp acquried 21 centres from First Steps, which it previously managed under contract for First Steps. Accordingly 2007 is the first full year of revenue recognition for these centres. Projected revenue from these centres for 2007 equates to circa $14m."

Sorry Paper Tiger, don't know which method has been used for the forcasts.

[Footsie]

The accounts are IFRS from 2008 onwards.

NPAT is down in 2007 as they want to get as much of the amortising done while they still can

Note also the forecasts do not include an uplift from the 20 free hours

so one could say they are quite conservative numbers

[Paper Tiger]

Thanks for the responses folks.

The problems with forecasts of future earnings, especially when you have not read the document they come from, is that the further in the future the greater the degree of uncertainity.
So after dismissing 2009 and 2010 as fiction, worrying about why they feel the need to write off so much goodwill pre-IFRS and taking 2008 at face value:
I arrive at the conclusion that the current SP of $0.195 represents no great bargain, but this could be one of the better performers in the coming year or two.

Target price for June 07: $0.22/$0.23
Target price for June 08: $0.25/$0.26

Disc: hold none

[Footsie]

PT in 2008 this stock will be worth 40c if it hasnt already been taken out.

those numbers are based on organic growth only - not factoring 20 free hours from govt or any acquisitions

[Paper Tiger]

I have to ask why do these figures not factor in the 20 free hours?
There likely affect is noted in the 2006 annual report so why omit them from a prediction of future NPAT?

[Footsie]

KID due to report in the next few days.....

will be interesting to see if NPAT is in fact down due to IFRS and by how much revenue is up etc etc

Buying starting to firm up again...

i heard there is a large buy order out there at 18c . Anyone else know of that?

but i'm definitely not a seller!

[Paddy]

Not sure, not selling

[metro]

Re: Footsie, bringing this thread to Page 1. Stock requires further investigation and resaearch

[Footsie]

would be nice if a broker covered this

[metro]

u still work in a sharebrokerrs office Footsie? you have some influence?
otherwise I can ask to get it added to http://www.smallcaps.co.nz

[Footsie]

Hi Metro

I don't work for a brokerage firm anymore, but will certainly beat the drum with my broker and see what he says.

Would be good if you could have it added to smallcaps.co

THANKS :)

[Footsie]

some decent buyin today

[zyreon]

its on my list for the basic, and maybe the advanced report if i get time

cheers

[zyreon]

ok not enough coffee yet, the basic report already is here: http://www.smallcaps.co.nz/KIDv1.htm

advanced: maybe ready next week sometime

[metro]

excellent thanks zyreon

[patsy]

I may be missing something important here because I can see little reason to buy into KID for the long-term when there is ABS in the ASX.

ABS is exposed to the same industry dynamics as KID but ABS is a dominant player in a incredibly fragmented market. On top of that, ABS has a huge cash war chest that has been using consistently to take over US and UK operators.

[Footsie]

Patsy
for what its worth i own both KID and ABS
;)

[Steve]

Excited Kids (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/3/story.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10419820)
There's been some more excitement at listed early childhood education provider KidiCorp in the past few weeks.

The share price has risen from just below 18c near the start of last week to close at 20c yesterday.

On a couple of days, more than 200,000 shares have changed hands.

The buying interest had one analyst scratching her head for reasons.

But Frank Jasper, a senior portfolio manager at Fisher Funds Management, which has nearly 19 per cent of KidiCorp, had one theory.

He said ABC Learning - Australasia's biggest provider of early childhood education - had bought some New Zealand centres in mid-December.

That may have led some people to take a speculative interest in Kidicorp, thinking it might become the subject of ABC Learning interest.

Last August, an appraisal by Ferrier Hodgson - issued after a 19c a share offer for KidiCorp by the Mitchell Investment Trust - put a value of 21c to 28c on the stock.

In November, KidiCorp reported a half-year unaudited trading profit of $360,000, just under a projection contained in the Ferrier Hodgson report to shareholders.

The company said then that developments planned or in progress would ensure it exceeded its 15 per cent growth target for expanding existing facilities or developing new centres this financial year.

It also expected implementation of the Government's 20 free hours of early childhood education scheme for 3 to 4-year-olds would increase demand for quality services.

As the Herald reported yesterday, there's concern that many centres have little or no capacity to meet additional demand.

[zyreon]

That about sums it up.

I think there's both long-term growth and short-term speculative reasons to buy this company.

[Steve]

Big two join free-childcare plan (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10420008)
Two of the biggest early childcare providers are to join the Government's programme offering 20 hours each week of free early childhood education for 3- and 4-year-olds.

Barnardos and KidiCorp, which run about 80 centres, have said they will join the programme, which is set to begin on July 1.

The sign-up of the two is a victory for Education Minister Steve Maharey.

However, other providers in high-demand, inner-city areas are still struggling to decide whether they will follow suit.

The scheme can be opted into, but many providers claim the funding offer of up to $212 per child a week is well below what they currently earn from Government subsidies and parent fees and will not cover their costs unless they cut services.

[Footsie]

Toot Toot !

Well been on holiday for a week . come back and KID has popped the 20c mark
trading 22c

Woohoo

Metro
How many did you buy at 17.5c !!!

[8D]

FYI
Another undervalued company is TUR....
GPG must have something up their sleeve.
TUR has 200m of property assets alone and the m/cap is less than that

[metro]

Footsie: enough to be happy right now
I think my average price is around 0.18 though
What was your entry price?

[metro]

Footsie: not so sure about TUA but will start looking at it and see what I uncover.

metro

[COLIN]

quote:Originally posted by metro

Footsie: not so sure about TUA but will start looking at it and see what I uncover.

metro


I think he means TURNERS AND GROWERS (TUR), not Turners Auctions (TUA).

[metro]

ah ok. thanks

[metro]

Footsie: I owe yu one for KID and thanks...I'm enjoying the ride
:)

[Footsie]

Not sure what my average is probably round 17c

bought over the past 9 months at 16c 17c 18c and 18.5c

unfortunately i was away all last week otherwise i would have liked to help "push" it through the 20c

quite big volume going thru, so i wonder who the buyer is?

have to check on Iress in a few weeks.

yes turners and growers TUR

[Steve]

No growing pains for Kidicorp investors (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/3/story.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10420376)
Last week Kidicorp's share price rose from just below 18c to close at 20c on Friday.

Chief executive Wayne Wright said yesterday he was not sure why there had been a run on shares.

"It's a well-known fact that we don't run on full capacity at our centres so people might have deduced from that that there were some more [centres] coming down the line."

The transactions had showed there had been no one buyer, he said.

[waikare]

KID
31/05/2007
TAKEOVER

REL: 1729 HRS KidiCorp Group Limited

TAKEOVER: KID: RECEIPT OF TAKEOVER NOTICE FROM POSITIVE EDUCARE

RECEIPT OF TAKEOVER NOTICE FROM POSITIVE EDUCARE

Kidicorp Group Limited (NZX: KID) advise that Positive Educare Limited, a
company associated with substantial shareholder the Mitchell Investment Trust
and Wayne Wright, has given notice to the company pursuant to Rule 41 of the
Takeovers Code of its intention to make a full offer to acquire all the
ordinary fully paid shares in Kidicorp Group Limited.

The consideration of the proposed takeover offer is 24 cents in cash for each
share. The proposed offer is conditional upon Positive Educare Limited
receiving acceptance in respect of not less than 90% of the voting rights in
Kidicorp Group (which condition cannot be waived), and a number of other
conditions. A copy of the Takeover Notice is attached.

In accordance with Rule 21 of the Takeovers Code, the independent directors
propose to obtain a report from an Independent Adviser on the merits of the
offer and will prepare a target company statement.

Until the Independent Adviser Report is received the independent directors
recommend that shareholders DO NOT SELL their shares.

The above is a press release that came after the market closed today. The last takeover in August of last year was made by Mitchell Investment Trust for $0.19 cents, this one is by Postive Educare for $0.24, probably Wayne Wrigth in dragg.

Ferrin & Hodgen produced the last Independent Report and gave them a value of between 21 - 28 cents, 24.5 being midway.

All this comes the next day after downturn in profit............

[Zaphod]

quote:Originally posted by waikare

The above is a press release that came after the market closed today. The last takeover in August of last year was made by Mitchell Investment Trust for $0.19 cents, this one is by Postive Educare for $0.24, probably Wayne Wrigth in dragg.

Ferrin & Hodgen produced the last Independent Report and gave them a value of between 21 - 28 cents, 24.5 being midway.

All this comes the next day after downturn in profit............


The relationship is mentioned in the press release. Not at all surprised he's at it again.

Well timed after the profit announcement, I'm sure the shares from dissatisfied holders will come in very useful.

[Yossarian]

Zaphod, agree that it's unwholesome. in my view, WW has manipulated the profit to virtually nothing (mainly by not increasing fees in a year where staffing costs have increased dramatically...?) so that he has a reasonable chance of success with this offer.

No comment yet from Fisher....

[Zaphod]

quote:Originally posted by Yossarian

Zaphod, agree that it's unwholesome. in my view, WW has manipulated the profit to virtually nothing (mainly by not increasing fees in a year where staffing costs have increased dramatically...?) so that he has a reasonable chance of success with this offer.

No comment yet from Fisher....


I see you read my other post.

Dumped my shares this afternoon - I don't trust the management and am not willing to take the risk with hold further. Plenty of other opportunities out there, but will be very weary of any companies bearing WW's name as a significant holder or Director.

Waiting with anticipation to hear from Fisher.

[Yossarian]

v tempted to do the same. Real pity that this is the NZX's only chilcare outfit.

[Footsie]

i'd rather take the 24c and not pay my broker the commision as well as losing a cent

plus there is always the chance he'll sweeten the offer.

If i was Fisher i'd say to him, sure we'll sell at 30c
Make him pay up - hed have no choice. Even to 26c. At least make him pay the top end of the independent valuation.

he obviously wants control so will have to pay a premium for it.

[zyreon]

agreed.

[Hoop]

It seems we will be getting Waynes offer in the mail any day now.
Haven't heard anything about the valuation. I would've assumed that it should all be together..shouldn't it???

Of interest....... How many child Caring facilties are in your city or region [?]
Answer: http://www.teamup.co.nz/earlyyears/about/ECE_Listing/default.htm Have a guess before you click on the "search now" button.

I wasn't even close with my guess for Hamilton City!!! [:0][:o)][:I]

Also of interest

....2) Kohanga Reo and Playcentres miss out:
Children attending high quality, genuine community building Kohanga Reo and Playcentres will miss the government subsidy for the free hours because these centres typically do not have qualified teachers..... www.scoop.co.nz
(These centres are run by parents)

.....more than 65,000 children across New Zealand are receiving twenty hours of free early childhood education," said Rick Barker.
( 20 hours "free" started today 2nd July. Didn't the Govt say 92,000 in the Budget?)

[Yossarian]

no, KID can issue the valuation report after the offer (up to 2 weeks after, i think).

no word from Fishers yet - that will be decisive i think.

i hope the valuers don't put too much emphasis on the paltry profit for last year!! These are still good assets with a lot of potential, imho.

[Yossarian]

the funding arrangement from DB Zwirn is interesting.

Suggests to me that they have deeper pockets for this offer - I reckon they'll definitely go higher to get the whole thing this time. We should all be holding out for 30c at least.

[Yossarian]

Grant Samuel say 24 to 31.1

i'll sell at 31.1

it's up to Fishers now

[Hoop]

The valuation report is PDF file 36 pages. I found the report very informative.
http://www.kidicorp.co.nz/res/docs/rKidicorpTakeover0707.pdf

[Treetops]

Major Kidicorp shareholder Fisher Funds said it intends to accept a 24 NZ cents per share takeover offer from Positive Educare.

http://www.theage.com.au/news/Business/NZs-Fisher-Funds-to-take-Kidicorp-offer/2007/07/09/1183833420505.html

[Yossarian]

disappointing.

[Treetops]

Probably what Carmel thought about the sp growth as well. Time to cull it.

[Yossarian]

true. still, disappointing they couldn't squeeze a few more cents out of Mr Wright

[Treetops]

I found it unusual too given Carmel's track record and the valuation range making the offer just acceptable. She must have been wanting to exit anyway.

[Yossarian]

"accept" the independents say

another one bites the dust

[Zaphod]

A wise move on Fishers behalf. That snake Wright would have found another way to shed the shareholders anyway.

Long out of this stock. Thanks goodness.

[Yossarian]

looks like we're in for a long boring wait on this one.

I'd prefer Fishers just hurried up and accepted.. why draw it all out unnecessarily...?

[Yossarian]

odd... Wright says he has 83% but Fishers have not officially declared any sell down yet??

Somebody has cocked up I think ??

[Yossarian]

it's all over...

SSH: KID: SSH Notice From Positive Educare Limited

NOTICE 29028 DETAILS

Submitted Date : 08-Aug-2007 12:15
Status : Accepted

Substantial : Y Director : N
Add Holder : N Change Holder : Y
Ceased Holder : N Change Nature : N

Issuer Code : KID KidiCorp Group Limited
Holder : Positive Educare Limited

Address : 119 Kaylene Place
: RD 2
: Tauranga
Country : New Zealand

Contact Name : Wayne Wright
Phone : +64 272 748 198

Total of Interest : 161864670
Total Issued : 177145844
Total % : 91.37

[Hoop]

Not quite Yossarian.
Still conditional pending finance agreements.

[Hoop]

Now unconditional.....yippee!! :D:D
Must admit, I was a tad worried about the financial part especially with this so-called world credit crunch.
No mention of payday however :(

[waikare]

Now unconditional.....yippee!! :D:D
Must admit, I was a tad worried about the financial part especially with this so-called world credit crunch.
No mention of payday however :(

I for one was/is not a willing seller, first he offerd 19 cents then a short time latter came up with a further 5 cents. Our loss his gain, just wondering what will be his next move, as Mr Wright will have a little overdarft to settle.

[Yossarian]

he'll probably turn around and flog them to ABC for a tidy profit!!!

Also definitely not a happy seller. oh well, better dig that form out....

[Hoop]

I'm a happy seller
..... I thought I did my homework but when the Govt interfered I did not realise was a 2 edged sword.
......Huge number of small day care centres, most not registered, operate with lower overheads as they don't have to pay huge labour costs to qualified personnel, nor need to abide by all Govt regulations. They can manage very profitably by keeping the hourly rate low.
.....Applying for 20hour free care subsidy, must have qualified staff, abide by all Govt regulations..all are extra costs....subsidy is at minimum end...need to charge others more to make a profit, however charges limited to unregulated centres competition and by Govt threats.

....KID has low profit, and large debt ( I was surprised at the debt level). KID is growing but at a cost. Needs to cut expenses ..not many options..delisting is one option.
....Govt is major influence.... this creates investor uncertainty.
....KID financials are average at best...many NZX companies are better.

I made 40% profit on a very average, medium risk small company...an excellent result in anyones language.

Remember Fisher sold without a fight, this implies they wanted out as well.

That is why I'm a happy seller :D

Mr Wright has spent his $$millions$$ he is intitled to make a good profit as there is risk. The best of luck to him.

[Hoop]

I put some facts to how huge is huge in my previous post.
There are 142 ECE centres in Hamilton city alone. This does not include the informal setups e.g solo mum looking after 3 to 4 kids for extra pocket money under the counter stuff.
There are 402 ECE centres in the Waikato Region and only 172 ECE centres of that 402 offer the 20 hours free care.

Reference http://www.teamup.co.nz/earlyyears/about/ECE_Listing/default.htm


ECE ....Early Childhood Education