How to beat the Obesity and type 2 diabetes epidemic - nutritional info

[Major von Tempsky]

Ok, I'll declare I do have a personal interest, I have mild type 2 diabetes and I'm overweight.

But get out there and start studying what to do nutritionally and its as bad, no its worse than Climategate!

When I was diagnosed nothing happened for 2 months.

Then I was referred to the hospital nutritionist. She, very obviously, had no interest in the subject but had got a qualification, a meal ticket, did not read the latest info on the Internet and told me such things as eggs were bad for me and I should restrict myself to 1 egg a week.
My doctor who appears relatively young is still brainwashed by mantras such as cholesterol is bad and bananas and fruit may be bad for you because of fruit sugar, and breakfast cereal is good, bacon and eggs are bad..
However by the time these things happened (nutritionist appointment &) I had already devised and applied my own diet and through sheer dint of avoiding sugar, bike riding like a maniac and restricting my food intake by just pigging out in the late afternoon early evening. I managed to lose a substantial amount of weight and cut my blood sugar level to below 7 which the doctor thought was wonderful.

However due to various family and other social events and general social whirl and social pressures I have been slipping back a bit and last test (I have an annual blood test) my last blood test was over 8. My doctor panicked. Cure yourself within 3 months or you will have to take pills he ordered.
Depression set in. I've lost some weight but not yet enough.

Then I saw "Fat Head" on the Documentary channel recently and all suddenly became clear. This incorporates the latest medical and scientific research and shows up some massive misconceptions in current nutritionist and medical practice. And the effect of the corn-belt lobbyists.
The villains are not sugar, fat and cholesterol. The villains are sugar and carbo-hydrates. Heart attacks are caused not by cholesterol but by stress, smoking and high blood sugar.
The guy narrating the documentary proved his thesis by losing 10 lbs in a month quite easily by avoiding sugar, carbo-hydrates and trans-oil fats and breakfast cereal. Instead he ate bacon and eggs for breakfast, ate fruit and vegetables and lean meat and exercised and drank diet coke.

Since I saw this program I have put his regime into effect - and I feel better already and I can take my belt in one more notch.
I have also made a point of making a special trip to the supermarket to read the nutritional info. I was appalled to note for example, that cruskits - that star of the weight losers Bible, is over 72% carbo-hydrates and is only 2% fat.
The program pointed out that the brain is mostly fat/cholesterol and other body parts have a high requirement for fat. In fact avoiding fat causes depression which then requires anti-depression medication. The program also noted that most breakfast cereals are richer in sugar than the equivalent weight in sugar! I looked at the nutritional info on eggs and noted that they are just 1% sugar and 1% carbo-hydrates. In fact eggs are the perfect food for type 2 diabetes, not something to be heavily avoided.

However I do have one question which someone may be able to help with; I noted when looking at the nutritional info on a packet of crumpets that they (I look at the column of grams of things like sugar per 100 gram total weight of the item) that they were about 32gs carbo-hydrates, 1 gram sugar, 1 gram fat, 9 grams protein, so many milligms sodium BUT! And this happens with a lot of the nutritional info, the disclosed ingredients came nowhere near 100gms! Is there a simple answer such as the missing 50+ grams is water? And if so why isn't it disclosed?

[shasta]

Ok, I'll declare I do have a personal interest, I have mild type 2 diabetes and I'm overweight.

But get out there and start studying what to do nutritionally and its as bad, no its worse than Climategate!

When I was diagnosed nothing happened for 2 months.

Then I was referred to the hospital nutritionist. She, very obviously, had no interest in the subject but had got a qualification, a meal ticket, did not read the latest info on the Internet and told me such things as eggs were bad for me and I should restrict myself to 1 egg a week.
My doctor who appears relatively young is still brainwashed by mantras such as cholesterol is bad and bananas and fruit may be bad for you because of fruit sugar, and breakfast cereal is good, bacon and eggs are bad..
However by the time these things happened (nutritionist appointment &) I had already devised and applied my own diet and through sheer dint of avoiding sugar, bike riding like a maniac and restricting my food intake by just pigging out in the late afternoon early evening. I managed to lose a substantial amount of weight and cut my blood sugar level to below 7 which the doctor thought was wonderful.

However due to various family and other social events and general social whirl and social pressures I have been slipping back a bit and last test (I have an annual blood test) my last blood test was over 8. My doctor panicked. Cure yourself within 3 months or you will have to take pills he ordered.
Depression set in. I've lost some weight but not yet enough.

Then I saw "Fat Head" on the Documentary channel recently and all suddenly became clear. This incorporates the latest medical and scientific research and shows up some massive misconceptions in current nutritionist and medical practice. And the effect of the corn-belt lobbyists.
The villains are not sugar, fat and cholesterol. The villains are sugar and carbo-hydrates. Heart attacks are caused not by cholesterol but by stress, smoking and high blood sugar.
The guy narrating the documentary proved his thesis by losing 10 lbs in a month quite easily by avoiding sugar, carbo-hydrates and trans-oil fats and breakfast cereal. Instead he ate bacon and eggs for breakfast, ate fruit and vegetables and lean meat and exercised and drank diet coke.

Since I saw this program I have put his regime into effect - and I feel better already and I can take my belt in one more notch.
I have also made a point of making a special trip to the supermarket to read the nutritional info. I was appalled to note for example, that cruskits - that star of the weight losers Bible, is over 72% carbo-hydrates and is only 2% fat.
The program pointed out that the brain is mostly fat/cholesterol and other body parts have a high requirement for fat. In fact avoiding fat causes depression which then requires anti-depression medication. The program also noted that most breakfast cereals are richer in sugar than the equivalent weight in sugar! I looked at the nutritional info on eggs and noted that they are just 1% sugar and 1% carbo-hydrates. In fact eggs are the perfect food for type 2 diabetes, not something to be heavily avoided.

However I do have one question which someone may be able to help with; I noted when looking at the nutritional info on a packet of crumpets that they (I look at the column of grams of things like sugar per 100 gram total weight of the item) that they were about 32gs carbo-hydrates, 1 gram sugar, 1 gram fat, 9 grams protein, so many milligms sodium BUT! And this happens with a lot of the nutritional info, the disclosed ingredients came nowhere near 100gms! Is there a simple answer such as the missing 50+ grams is water? And if so why isn't it disclosed?

Good question, i'll pay more attention next time im in the supermarket (whats the bet the supermarket workers wont know either!)

Try going around the supermarket & looking for food alternatives that have less than 15% carbohydrates in them per serving.

It's not as easy as it sounds, but then look for the foods with less than 20% of the carbs total, being sugary carbs.

Sugary carbs are worse than sugar & fat combined, as it stores as fat if not burned off

We eat so much processed crap these days, & its all due to sugary carbs IMO or short term energy.

[craic]

I have been on modified version of the Atkins diet for a couple of months. For breakfast I have three fried eggs, a large onion fried and two slices of bacon and a mug of coffee. Lunch is usually deli meats, cheese and some fruit and tea. Main meal is usually meat and veges, avoiding potato. For alcohol,I drink spirits with diet coke. The main feature is to avoid carbohydrates where possible but do not avoid fat. I often boost vegetables with a large chunk of butter. Sugar is, in my view, the main poison in todays diet,followed by refined flour. If we go out to dinner or a social function, I eat a normal meal but with a mind to the diet. Blood pressure drops like a stone on this regime.

[peat]

yeh i got told my blood sugar was high a couple of years ago so I changed diet as the initial response and then and started cycling again.... 3 rides a week of about an hour each seems to have permanently sorted things.
Carbs and sugars are whats bad for you if you're not able to effectively convert the glucose they become in your blood stream. The lack of efffectiveness of (my) insulin seems to have been sorted by the regular exercise coz now I eat what I want within reason and yet the blood sugar levels havent reverted. I guess thats not going to be the case for everyone.
type 2 is a lifestyle thing from what I've figured out. make appropriate lifestyle changes : sorted!

[ynot]

I have no doubt you are on the right track here Major. The fact that a low carb diet with plenty of protein and saturated fats is the best diet out there, is one of the better kept secrets these days and must please the large food corporates no end. All they are concerned with is the production of artificial foods made from over-refined carbohydrates.
I recommend you read Gary Taubes book, Good calories Bad calories. Barry Groves, Mary Enig and Mark Sisson are also worth reading.

[skeet]

I gym 4 days a week for about an hour (mostly Cardio), eat small meals but often and dont really touch any sugars other than a half teaspon in my coffee. On any given day my diet would be porridge, fruit, rice, chicken, protein shake after gym and plenty of water.

[George]

Man has been used to eating meat, fish, eggs, plants, berries etc. for a million years but grains and sugars for only a few thousand years. Perhaps humans are not yet used to flour and sugar and even less to processed foods. No wonder then many have problems. It's not what we eat but what we assimilate I believe. Also, in nature, humans went for various periods each year with no or little food ie. fasting. This has been shown to be beneficial for both humans and animals. Try a day or two once a week or fortnight without anything but water and see what happens.
George

[belgarion]

George, Which "Man" are you refering too? Many human skulls show significant teeth grinding which probably indicates the grinding of seeds like wheat. Also, sugar cane has eaten for many, many years. Totally agree with the processed food part tho.

[garman]

Its not rocket science' there are basically 2 things involved diet and exercise, for sure you can not eat what you like and think you can exercise it off you will fail. Check out what the heart foundation say heaps of fruit and vegetables lean meats fish very limited butter and cheese avoid listening to unqualified experts etc etc.

[George]

Belg
Before about 10,000 yrs ago man would not have been able to consume grains in any quantity so not sure what skulls you mean.
A big worm in this can is the presence of various pesticides, artificial fertilizers etc. so that so-called healthy, nutritious foods may not be so. You take a few substances on their own are harmless, mix and get an explosive. So how is one to know what single substance in all the foods they eat is causing them problems? It has been shown for eg. that inorganic celery has the highest levels of pesticides. A lot to be said for going organic.

[Major von Tempsky]

Is the Heart Foundation really that far behind the play? That's rather sad, I wonder what date they said that about very limited butter and cheese.
In the evolution of man, in the last few million years, homo's natural diet has been high in animal fat and the latest medical and scientific research in the program I quoted "Fat Head" on the Documentary channel made the point several times and in different ways that fat (and cholesterol) in the diet is not to blame for heart attacks (blame stress, smoking and high blood sugar) but sugar and carbo-hydrates including all those so called "healthy" breakfast cereals are, and trans fats in allegedly healthy vegetable cooking oil. Unfortunately we are suffering a huge overhang of ignorance and lobbyist/big commercial interests hypocrisy. Cruskits for example trumpet that they are "98% Fat Free" with a particular emphasis of avoiding saturated fat which our bodies need for our brains and nervous systems. And as mentioned before lack of fat in the diet causes depression which causes your doctor to prescribe you anti-depressants with severe side effects.
Unhappily what I am writing, the repetition I have to make, is an illustration of what happens on all major threads - along comes a "contributor" who can't be bothered reading the main lead article or trying to understand it and tries to make a series of quick cheap ignorant points. And the only cure is to repeat ad infinitum the salient points of the main lead article....
I note that no-one has offered any suggestion as to what the major missing ingredients are in most nutritional labels on food - however I noticed a column by a nutritionist over the weekend giving her (why are nutritionists only ever women?) email address for asking questions so I'll give it a shot and share the answer with you. Lets hope she is somewhat more up to date and better read than the full time "professional" hospital nutrionist!

[garman]

Major you say the heart foundation is not up with the play but I notice that you also say that you have "mild type 2 diabetes and are overweight" so it doesn't sound as though what you are doing is working, I pretty much follow what the heart foundation say and are getting good results IE excellent blood pressure and are correct weight for my height, I notice that you mention stress, in general as far as my research tells me, the jury is out on what role stress plays, my own personal opinion is that if you overstress an unfit person with narrowing of the arteries that person may have a heart attack the same as if you thrash a car that has done 300,000 miles and has only ever had 1 oil change, in other words if you stress something that is already in poor shape it may well blow up, this is proven by the fact that almost zero people die of a heart attack under 30 years of age, so why is this? people under thirty are still stressed in yet it is people over thirty that die, the only logical reason for this is that their body is not up to it so it fails, you say blame stress for heart attacks but there is no proof whatsoever that stress will narrow your arteries, you also blame cigarettes, I agree with you there, but only a small proportion smoke these days, but the heart attacks are still happening, Step 1: Healthy lifestyle
The best way to keep your blood pressure down is to make sensible lifestyle choices and avoid known triggers. Here are some tips that will help:

Cut down on salt – check food labels for salt content.
Be active – find some form of exercise you enjoy and do it each day.
Quit smoking – try nicotine replacement therapy, such as patches or join a support group.
Cut back on alcohol – the occasional drink will not harm you but excess alcohol will.
Eat a balanced, nutritious, low-fat diet – cook with fresh ingredients, include whole grains, fruit and vegetables and reduce your saturated fat intake.
Lose excess weight – by changing your eating habits and doing regular exercise.

[minimoke]

Well MVT. I'll try to stay on topic and keep in touch with the gist of your lead thread.

If I was to enter politics there would be two portfolios I'd be after. First up would be Minister of Children and in my first term you’d see legislation passed that would have any obese child come under the care of CYFS. Any morbidly obese child would in the first instance see the parents / guardians sterilised and after one year the child is to have lost weight. If the child remains morbidly obese it’s off to prison you go. Why - well it’s the parent’s jobs to get their head around the nutritional value of food going down their kid’s throats and part of that is reading the labels.

Next up I'd be Minister of Health and you’d see any Fat Bastard going to the bottom of the list. I fully respect the right of adults to eat what they like but don't expect the tax payer to come to the rescue when you end up flat on your back and your heart not beating due to your inability to read labels.

So - that rant over. Food labelling is not designed to help the consumer. It’s designed to meet the aspirations of the Marketing Department who are pandering to an image conscious group of numpties. Take for example the Heart Foundations "Tick" and them giving it to Milo. That’s just bull****. What about weight watchers saying MacDonald’s meals are OK - the meals may be OK but going to Maccas isn't.

Number one rule for food labels: If you can't say/pronounce the word on the label don't eat it. Rule Number 2; If its 98% Fat Free its probably bad for you. Rule Number Three: If its "Lite" then stay clear its so overly processed and probably devoid of any nutritional value you’d be nuts to eat it. Rule number four if it’s got additives all those different letter / number additives - stay clear. Rule number Five – if it has a label you should probably stay clear.

Food labels aren’t designed to be read - that defeats the purpose. A consumer has to get past the packaging which is specifically designed to draw the eye. Like the mum who buys wee Jimmy a box of Freddie Fiddlers Fancy Pops because it will make him an All Black. Or the 20% extra for free - that just gets you used to a different box which will eventually hold less for the same price. Or the "Lite" Olive Oil which has been processed so many times you'd probably find it would be better used as a biofuel.

So the best way to get your head around food labels is to buy food that doesn't have labels. Like Eggs, Banana, Potatoes, Oranges, Peppers, Carrots - all those things which come ready wrapped (pesticides is a sub issue - but a problem all the same). Meat doesn't come ready wrapped so avoid sausages but partiality wrapped is fine - like chicken with skin on and steak with fat around the edges. When you're ready to hit the lables get the ones that don't need much info - for breakfast its porridge or san bran; for dinner its brown rice.

If you want to check some labels that go as far as guaranteeing weight loss read the very tiny print - you'll see "coupled with exercise" and that’s a big clue. Trouble is people have no idea how much they need to exercise to burn of those extra calories. Try heading down to the gym and jumping on one of those machines that shows the calories burnt - it’s a darn sight easier ingesting calories than burning them off.

Hers the Havard Food Pyramid which show why you don’t need labels.

[craic]

Outside my window is a load of firewood ready for delivery ,It is one of about thirty or so that I chopped this winter for sale. The front porch is ripped up and 75% replaced and there are many other physical jobs that await my attention including a few more loads of firewood. I will go to the RSA tomorrow lucnh time and down about eight or nine shots of rum and maybe another couple when I get home. I used to eat lots of bread and potatoes and lean meat but my blood pressure stayed high and in spite of my labours, I got fatter. Noe I don't eat bread or potatoes or any high carbohydrate food. My weight is now 87 kg. and my doctor tells me that my blood pressure has dropped 20 points and he is very happy.I don't go out of my way to eat fat but its bacon and eggs for breakfast each day ( done in a frypan) and an average of three dozen eggs a week and if something tastes a bit dry or whatever, on goes a big dollop of butter. I do not have colesterol or blood sugar problems. I have just read my blood pressure and it is 157/73 and a pusle rate of69 which is probably quite reasonable for a 72 year old.

[garman]

top
What diets are recommended? There are many so-called diets publicised in the media, most of them focus on weight loss. If you want to lose weight, the most sensible things to do are to reduce the fat in your diet and total energy intake and increase levels of regular, moderate physical activity.

It is important to find out where dietary fat is coming from and work out ways to reduce it.

This is particularly important for those at risk of heart disease.

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What types of fat are there? Saturated or animal fats are solid at room temperature and can increase blood cholesterol levels.

Mono and polyunsaturated fats are liquid or semi-solid at room temperature and are usually found in plant products.

Transfatty acids are a type of unsaturated fat produced in processing, e.g. margarine. They also occur naturally in butter. Transfatty acids are unsaturated fats but behave more like saturated fats.

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Is margarine better than butter? Use both butter and margarine in only small amounts.

Both butter and margarine contain 75-80 per cent fat however butter is very high in saturated fat. The cholesterol-raising fat in margarine is 30 per cent compared to butter at 70 per cent. Butter, therefore, is considerably worse for blood cholesterol levels and heart health.

What about eggs? Eggs can be included as part of a normal varied healthy eating pattern.

If you have heart or blood vessel disease check with your local doctor before including a lot of eggs in your diet.

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Should I eat soy-based foods? Soy beans are high in fibre, low in fat, rich in vitamins and minerals and a good source of protein.

Soy foods are nutritious and provide additional health benefits, one of which is to reduce blood cholesterol levels. People with raised blood-cholesterol may achieve greater advantages from replacing animal protein with soy-based foods.

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Is alcohol good or bad? Alcohol in small to moderate amounts can protect against cardiovascular disease. If you choose to drink it is recommended women enjoy up to two standard drinks a day and up to three for men. A standard drink is one can of beer, one glass of wine or one nip of spirits.

The protective effect raises the levels of HDL (good) cholesterol and decreases the tendency for blood to clot.

Alcohol does not have a protective effect in young people as they are not at high risk of heart disease.

[peat]

dont forget that fat in the diet isnt the main issue for diabetes II sufferers - its actally carbs and sugars. I'm not saying to suck on cakes of lard but a diet to deal with diabetes is not the same as a diet for heart concerns - they will have common aspects sure - but different emphasis.
With diabetes you need to differentiate between starchy vegetables such as potato, kumara, corn, pumpkin as they are high in carbohydrate and should be reduced compared to non starch veges e.g. broccoli, peas, green beans, lettuce, etc

this site covers it all
http://www.diabetes.org.nz/

[minimoke]

top
What diets are recommended? There are many so-called diets publicised in the media, most of them focus on weight loss. If you want to lose weight, the most sensible things to do are to reduce the fat in your diet and total energy intake and increase levels of regular, moderate physical activity.


Heres what I can't figure about the Heart Foundation. Its not the fats in the diet that are problem its the type of fats. If eaten in moderation a person shouldn't be reducing their intake of Mono and polyunsaturated fats like olive oil, walnuts, avocado and pumkin seeds.

What they should really be stressing is getting rid of the trans fats from a diet - the fats thats in margarine and spreads, most mass produced baking, snack food, fried food and a good chunk of "convenience" food. Just think what they have to do to make a runny vegetable oil into something solid and you'll see why you don't want to eat the stuff.

Cutting back on the saturated fats (like what is on meat, or in dairy products or palm oil) is a pretty good idea - but not to cut it out all together. The good thing about the saturated fats is it helps the food taste good. A bit of fat should help satiate the urge to eat more food. Its also good at increasing HDL and lowering Lp(a). It also helps the immune systeme, lung and brain function

[George]

Hi MVT, guess you mean my comments, sorry to be off topic but in a round about way was trying to offer suggestions.
Can't help with the labelling issue, but agree with you 100% that food and diet is almost a religious topic and that there's nothing wrong with eggs - preferably free range.
Fasting is something I really believe in when all else fails and have read that it may be beneficial for type 2 diabetes but is bad for type 1, don't know the details. Problem is most people have no desire to try a period without food so will never know the benefits. We are brainwashed into thinking we must eat every day and all sorts of bad things will happen if we don't. Garbage.

[Dr_Who]

Eat more fresh food instead of processed food eg: buy fresh veges instead of frozen or canned veges. Do more outdoor activities and exercise. Simply put, more output then inputs will ensure you have a healthy lifestyle. Fresh air, exercise and a good fresh balanced diet. Keep it simple and basic.

[belgarion]

Eat more fresh food instead of processed food eg: buy fresh veges instead of frozen or canned veges. Do more outdoor activities and exercise. Simply put, more output then inputs will ensure you have a healthy lifestyle. Fresh air, exercise and a good fresh balanced diet. Keep it simple and basic.

And choose your parents (genes) carefully ;)

[fungus pudding]

Eat more fresh food instead of processed food eg: buy fresh veges instead of frozen or canned veges. Do more outdoor activities and exercise. Simply put, more output then inputs will ensure you have a healthy lifestyle. Fresh air, exercise and a good fresh balanced diet. Keep it simple and basic.

Frozen vegetables have been found to be as good as fresh nutrition-wise. I'll go along with the rest of your comments.

[root]

Eat more fresh food instead of processed food eg: buy fresh veges instead of frozen or canned veges. Do more outdoor activities and exercise. Simply put, more output then inputs will ensure you have a healthy lifestyle. Fresh air, exercise and a good fresh balanced diet. Keep it simple and basic.

You're onto it Doc, it sounds simple , it is simple, it's just difficult to keep sticking to it as the decades roll past. It's even harder to get your kids out there playing sport and eating good food, but there is no other option.