Should we run a wasteage list for the Labour govt ?

If so ,

Aborted media rationalisation. $23,000,000 +
Aborted Cycleway , Harbour Bridge, $55,000,000 +

That's small change compared to the $20 Billion we would have lost by 2031 from the NZ Superannuation fund, if National had won the 2020 election & implemented their policy to halt contributions to the Superannuation fund.

National's always short sighted, looking for short term gains & pass the costs on to future governments, never look long term, thats why the hospitals, roads, water infrastructure needs so much money spent on it now.
Remember they increased the allowable weight limits for freight trucks & look at the damage that's caused to our road network.
Zero increase in hospital budgets for several years, despite big immigration & buildings desperately needing maintenance.
And so on...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blue Skies

Remember they increased the allowable weight limits for freight trucks & look at the damage that's caused to our road network.
Zero increase in hospital budgets for several years, despite big immigration & buildings desperately needing maintenance.
And so on...

---

Luxon.. "our country's in a real mess atm" (ignoring the nine years of National).

Reporter: "ok, so how are you going to fix it?"

Luxon: Talks about labour again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Luxon.. "our country's in a real mess atm" (ignoring the nine years of National).

Reporter: "ok, so how are you going to fix it?"

Luxon: Talks about labour again.

---

Panda, Dont let the truth get in the way of a good B S story. J Key increased the health budget from $9 bil under H Davis to $15 B under his watch !!

Luxon says that healthcare is wasteful spending though and he won’t increase it by more than CPI (despite all the new migrants he wants to bring in).

It’s all going towards income tax cuts.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Luxon says that healthcare is wasteful spending though and he won’t increase it by more than CPI (despite the new migrants he wants to bring in).

It’s all going towards income tax cuts.

---

Please provide a link to where Luxon says that "healthcare is wasteful spending".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Luxon says that healthcare is wasteful spending though and he won’t increase it by more than CPI (despite the new migrants he wants to bring in).

It’s all going towards income tax cuts.

---

Income tax cuts are a good thing. It means I have more of my money and less is stolen by the government. It means I can determine how and where I spend my money and not some faceless bloated beauracrat who has no idea.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jonu

Please provide a link to where Luxon says that "healthcare is wasteful spending".

---

He won't because he can't. He makes wild statements all the time and never comes up with any evidence for them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by blackcap

Income tax cuts are a good thing. It means I have more of my money and less is stolen by the government. It means I can determine how and where I spend my money and not some faceless bloated beauracrat who has no idea.

---

A person working full time on the new minimum wage and a few weekends in overtime, now gets into the 30% bracket. The Government constantly increasing minimum wages on businesses, that then run right through to all other employees of the business and from there into prices of goods & services, while not adjusting tax brackets. This is just a clever (some say dishonest) increase in the tax take paid for by all businesses and consumers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by iceman

A person working full time on the new minimum wage and a few weekends in overtime, now gets into the 30% bracket. The Government constantly increasing minimum wages on businesses, that then run right through to all other employees of the business and from there into prices of goods & services, while not adjusting tax brackets. This is just a clever (some say dishonest) increase in the tax take paid for by all businesses and consumers.

---

Think of it as a tax to fund universal super (which is by far NZ's largest expense). It takes the place of higher kiwisaver contributions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by iceman

A person working full time on the new minimum wage and a few weekends in overtime, now gets into the 30% bracket. The Government constantly increasing minimum wages on businesses, that then run right through to all other employees of the business and from there into prices of goods & services, while not adjusting tax brackets. This is just a clever (some say dishonest) increase in the tax take paid for by all businesses and consumers.

---

Lets not forget that everyone else in the organisation also has to have a pay increase of similar magnitude. It is inflationary and is going to bite them on the bum big time. I know plenty of people that were earning above minimum wage and were happy about it. Not anymore. They are going to have to have a commensurate increase and the cost is going to be borne by the consumer ultimately. Not a good thing. (Tax take will go up like you say. Tax increases by stealth. No one ever said this Labour govt were not sneaky)

Who is the consumer? The one getting the wage rise.

Or the beneficiary who's pay is directly linked to CPI.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Who is the consumer? The one getting the wage rise.

Or the beneficiary who's pay is directly linked to CPI.

---

Both of the above as well as just about everyone else in the country !! Why are benefits tied to CPI while nothing else is ? Dumb.

Wouldn't it be nice if food and electricity went up by CPI only (rather than 10%).

Many businesses raise their prices by more than inflation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by blackcap

Lets not forget that everyone else in the organisation also has to have a pay increase of similar magnitude. It is inflationary and is going to bite them on the bum big time. I know plenty of people that were earning above minimum wage and were happy about it. Not anymore. They are going to have to have a commensurate increase and the cost is going to be borne by the consumer ultimately. Not a good thing. (Tax take will go up like you say. Tax increases by stealth. No one ever said this Labour govt were not sneaky)

---

That’s silly - they don’t all HAVE to get a pay rise. Once again (as happens each year) the sky is going to fall in on April 01.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tim23

That’s silly - they don’t all HAVE to get a pay rise. Once again (as happens each year) the sky is going to fall in on April 01.

---

Though going by their track record it's going to be a golden age for NZ this year :)

Predicting doom since 2017 and the opposite happens.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Though going by their track record it's going to be a golden age for NZ this year :)

Predicting doom since 2017 and the opposite happens.

---

Yet another woke leftist maggot moment - ignoramus economic garbage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Who is the consumer? The one getting the wage rise.

Or the beneficiary who's pay is directly linked to CPI.

---

More inflationary creep .. Who's stumping up this time - Robbo ? .. it surely can't be the bunch of turkey's
in your back office :)

I wouldn't bet my last $ on it, but I suggest that Robertson, Hipkins & Co are 'keeping the powder dry'. They are cynical & 'consummate' politicians who will do whatever is required to hold on to power.

As a result don't be surprised if sometime within the next 6 months, an upward adjustment is made to the first 3 tax tiers/brackets. Making the sheeple feel good again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTG

I wouldn't bet my last $ on it, but I suggest that Robertson, Hipkins & Co are 'keeping the powder dry'. They are cynical & 'consummate' politicians who will do whatever is required to hold on to power.

As a result don't be surprised if sometime within the next 6 months, an upward adjustment is made to the first 3 tax tiers/brackets. Making the sheeple feel good again.

---

The powder in the northern regions must be all but sodden, if not washed away

But the muddied masses probably still have their brickbats ready to wave at any stupid or
untoward central Govt politician or nearer targets, without much further provocation ..

Going to take a fair bit more than tinkering with the lowest wage or any bracket sweeteners to keep those
ones happy & content now .. Labour's largest audience washed out on their lilo's with a further
instalment on the way and years ahead of even returning many to previous normality

King sized lollypops from Gobbo Robbo's larder of taxpayer funded goodies on order soon or
is everyone still kitted out in their Beehive bunkers sweetly dreaming about Oct 2023 ? ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nztx

King sized lollypops from Gobbo Robbo's larder of taxpayer funded goodies on order soon or
is everyone still kitted out in their Beehive bunkers sweetly dreaming about Oct 2023 ? ;)

---

No need, if you vote Labour you can keep all your public holidays, rest breaks, employment rights and can retire at 65, rather than 67.

There's plenty of incentives without adding in new goodies.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Luxon says that healthcare is wasteful spending though and he won’t increase it by more than CPI (despite all the new migrants he wants to bring in).

It’s all going towards income tax cuts.

---

Luxon decried wasteful government spending as stoking inflation. When did he specify Healthcare?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by blackcap

Income tax cuts are a good thing. It means I have more of my money and less is stolen by the government. It means I can determine how and where I spend my money and not some faceless bloated beauracrat who has no idea.

---

Income tax cuts without higher tax elsewhere, or govt spending and public services cuts, are not necessarily a good thing. The right wing ideologues in the UK tried that, and their beloved "free market" showed them what it thought. The British people then ended up with no tax cuts yet suffered fewer public services, and even higher interest rates.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bjauck

Income tax cuts without higher tax elsewhere, or govt spending and public services cuts, are not necessarily a good thing. The right wing ideologues in the UK tried that, and their beloved "free market" showed them what it thought. The British people then ended up with no tax cuts yet suffered fewer public services, and even higher interest rates.

---

The bracket creep over the last few years means we are literally getting income tax increases each year. It is getting ridiculous that an average salary for a person 2-3 years out of Uni is hitting the top tax rate, the one introduced to "tax the rich".
Even worse is the fact that someone working full time on the minimum wage and a few hours of OT a year, is about to hit the 30% tax rate.
So maybe it is time to seriously cut out wastage in the system and there is plenty to select from.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bjauck

Luxon decried wasteful government spending as stoking inflation. When did he specify Healthcare?

---

When labour recently proposed increasing health spending he called that wasteful.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by iceman

So maybe it is time to seriously cut out wastage in the system and there is plenty to select from.

---

He wants you to work an extra day per year and get nothing for it (get rid of one public holiday).

Then make you work until you're 67.

So you'll be paying for it in one way or another.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

When labour recently proposed increasing health spending he called that wasteful.

---

Getting down to the gutter level of lying - just like the Labour Party does all the time.

Same garbage from this maggot panda-NZ about the US appointing people based purely on merit, unlike China.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Balance

Getting down to the gutter level of lying - just like the Labour Party does all the time.

Same garbage from this maggot panda-NZ about the US appointing people based purely on merit, unlike China.

---

Balance is the Majorie Taylor Greene of ShareTrader. "LIAR!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An86W8YvriM

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by iceman

The bracket creep over the last few years means we are literally getting income tax increases each year. It is getting ridiculous that an average salary for a person 2-3 years out of Uni is hitting the top tax rate, the one introduced to "tax the rich".
Even worse is the fact that someone working full time on the minimum wage and a few hours of OT a year, is about to hit the 30% tax rate.
So maybe it is time to seriously cut out wastage in the system and there is plenty to select from.

---

I remember a time when our tax rates were similar (although different) when I was fresh eyed out of Uni and new grads started on $29,000 per annum. That is $15 per hour give or take. We were in the tax bracket below 30% or 33% or whatever it was. Now days, straight out of uni and you are already in the 30% bracket. That is just sillyness. The amounts need to be adjusted pronto. I would suggest:

0-$25 0%
$25k-$80K 17.5%
$80k-$200k 33%
$200k+ 39%


That would make things simpler (eliminating the stupid 30% and 33% rates and combining in one and realign for the effects of inflation.)

Doing it at this time would be inflationary and raise interest rates (resulting in even more profits going to Australian banks).

Eventually of course, it has to and will happen. In five years it should be safe to do so.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Doing it at this time would be inflationary and raise interest rates (resulting in more profits going to Australian banks).

Eventually of course, it has to and will happen.

---

Garbage as usual - hoiw about Luxon paying no tax according to you?

What we have on ST now is the Labour poster cabal - dedicated to spreading lies, misinformation and BS like their dear leaders Hipkins and the departed political corpse Clueless Cindy.

So quickly they try now to hide her behind the spin of yesterday does not matter.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Balance

Garbage as usual - hoiw about Luxon paying no tax according to you?

---

Yes the guy who wants to remove the bright line test and put back on interest deductibility (..why?).

He has 8 suitable properties to live in but claims taxpayer support for "accommodation".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Yes the guy who wants to remove the bright line test and put back on interest deductibility (..why?).

---

Why not?

Better than the lies, mistruths and BS you are busy spreading out there.

How about Luxon not paying any tax according to you?

Remember this :

"Study hard, work hard and save hard so we can take ftom you to give to those who don't." Labour

According to Robertson, no money was wasted on cancelled projects like TVNZ/RNZ merger :

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political...er-were-wasted

Of course not as the money does not belong to him or the Labour Party - it's the people's money to be squandered on wasteful spending.

Labour - the party which makes consultants rich while breeding beneficiaries.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Balance

Why not?

---

You have to be fiscally responsible. :)

We'll be at risk of a credit rating downgrade if there are too many unfunded tax cuts.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

You have to be fiscally responsible. ;)

We'll be at risk of a credit rating downgrade if there are too many unfunded tax cuts.

---

Garbage.

And where are the fuel subsidies and increased welfare payments coming from?

What about Luxon paying no tax according to you?

And Trump only employed people based on merit according to you too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by blackcap

I remember a time when our tax rates were similar (although different) when I was fresh eyed out of Uni and new grads started on $29,000 per annum. That is $15 per hour give or take. We were in the tax bracket below 30% or 33% or whatever it was. Now days, straight out of uni and you are already in the 30% bracket. That is just sillyness. The amounts need to be adjusted pronto. I would suggest:

0-$25 0%
$25k-$80K 17.5%
$80k-$200k 33%
$200k+ 39%


That would make things simpler (eliminating the stupid 30% and 33% rates and combining in one and realign for the effects of inflation.)

---

I think your suggestion would be much fairer than the craziness we currently have. I've always been in favour of a 0% tax rate for very low income to encourage people into part time work. I brought it up at a political meeting with our MP many years ago and he suggested it could be done for the first $15 k or so without the need for a major shake up of the whole income tax system and without too much of a burden.

But as we can see in post30, Labour is not in favour of reducing tax on workers and use any excuse possible, such as the lunacy that reducing tax is inflationary but constantly increasing wages, welfare & fuel subsidies is not. No wonder this country is where it is !

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by iceman

No wonder this country is where it is !

---

Where is this country exactly, and how does it compare to the overseas experience during these times?

double post.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Where is this country and how does it compare to the overseas experience during these times?

---

No comparison with Labour breeding beneficiaries while making consultants rich.

Jobseeker numbers are going down since we have a strong economy under labour & you would hope that there are experts advising the govt.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Jobseeker numbers are going down since we have a strong economy under labour & you would hope that there are experts advising the govt.

---

Same experts who advised Hipkins and Labour on Kiwibuild, emergency housing, child poverty and the bike bridge to nowhere.

What about Luxon not paying any tax according to you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by blackcap

I remember a time when our tax rates were similar (although different) when I was fresh eyed out of Uni and new grads started on $29,000 per annum. That is $15 per hour give or take. We were in the tax bracket below 30% or 33% or whatever it was. Now days, straight out of uni and you are already in the 30% bracket. That is just sillyness. The amounts need to be adjusted pronto. I would suggest:

0-$25 0%
$25k-$80K 17.5%
$80k-$200k 33%
$200k+ 39%


That would make things simpler (eliminating the stupid 30% and 33% rates and combining in one and realign for the effects of inflation.)

---

It would be a start Blackcap, but realistically, even that is just 'tinkering'. If we keep doing the same stupid things, we are going to keep getting the same stupid outcomes. As a country we need to be bold, brave, innovative & revolutionary with our fiscal set-up. As dramatic as it sounds, the harsh reality is we are on the slow, winding, bumpy pathway to Banana Republic status; if we aren't careful.

- "Flatten the (tax bracket) Curve".
- Standardise Individual, Company & Trust tax rates (& Lower!)
- Implement a Gross Revenue/Turnover Tax which will capture ALL economic activity. Which through implication will also capture 'capital gains' for non-productive transactions, e.g. casual residential property speculators.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by iceman

The bracket creep over the last few years means we are literally getting income tax increases each year. It is getting ridiculous that an average salary for a person 2-3 years out of Uni is hitting the top tax rate, the one introduced to "tax the rich".
Even worse is the fact that someone working full time on the minimum wage and a few hours of OT a year, is about to hit the 30% tax rate.
So maybe it is time to seriously cut out wastage in the system and there is plenty to select from.

---

I agree that govt does rely on sly income tax increases by virtue of bracket creep, which is worse in a high inflationary environment. Increasing income tax also does not get to the rich, it just gets those who produce productive taxable incomes. To increase taxes from the “rich”, NZ would need to overhaul its tax system and introduce new taxes. Neither of the major parties have the stomach to do that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by blackcap

I remember a time when our tax rates were similar (although different) when I was fresh eyed out of Uni and new grads started on $29,000 per annum. That is $15 per hour give or take. We were in the tax bracket below 30% or 33% or whatever it was. Now days, straight out of uni and you are already in the 30% bracket. That is just sillyness. The amounts need to be adjusted pronto. I would suggest:

0-$25 0%
$25k-$80K 17.5%
$80k-$200k 33%
$200k+ 39%


That would make things simpler (eliminating the stupid 30% and 33% rates and combining in one and realign for the effects of inflation.)

---

It is ridiculous when starter salaries are already in higher tax brackets, while in the meantime property owners can receive untaxed capital gains from their homes and investment properties worth more than annual salaries. Do many of our young need to become exiles to get ahead whilst they wait to inherit their parents properties?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bjauck

It is ridiculous when starter salaries are already in higher tax brackets, while in the meantime property owners can receive untaxed capital gains from their homes and investment properties worth more than annual salaries. Do many of our young need to become exiles to get ahead whilst they wait to inherit their parents properties?

---

As Clueless Cindy is now politically a smelly corpse, her captain's call to can CGT is now invalid.

Why is Hipkins not pushing for the CGT to be introduced?

Or is he waiting for after the election to announce its introduction, win or lose?

Despicable hypocrite is the chip of Ardern block.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/financ...FBKOIDR5WCT6A/

Finance Minister Grant Robertson disputes millions spent on TVNZ-RNZ merger were ‘wasted’


Yep no waste - Robbo .. just a waste of space sitting atop the taxpayer money pile who can't work out where it disappeared to .. perhaps Willie Wonka might know which consultants got refeathered nests ? :)

Must hurt when another of your favourite hobby horse projects (aka another expensive waste of space) gets wiped off the list in the large clean out by the Schoolboy trying to cover his backside from following in another impending slide down the greasy slope that the earlier excuse for failed leadership got pushed down, to get her out of sight ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Panda-NZ-

Jobseeker numbers are going down since we have a strong economy under labour & you would hope that there are experts advising the govt.

---

Yes they are slowly trending down after the huge spike in 2020-2021. But what you forget to mention is that they are still much higher than they were in 2019. That's despite job vacancies everywhere. Jobseeker support should be limited to 3 months,.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by iceman

Yes they are slowly trending down after the huge spike in 2020-2021. But what you forget to mention is that they are still much higher than they were in 2019. That's despite job vacancies everywhere. Jobseeker support should be limited to 3 months,.

---

Labour is the party which breeds beneficiaries - the more the better as they get hooked on welfare and stay Labour voters.

"Study hard, work hard and save hard so we can take from you to give to those who don't." Labour

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Balance

Labour is the party which breeds beneficiaries - the more the better as they get hooked on welfare and stay Labour voters.

"Study hard, work hard and save hard so we can take from you to give to those who don't." Labour

---

The parrot is rattling his cage again.

westerly

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by westerly

The parrot is rattling his cage again.

westerly

---

That is because you are slow in accepting that he is correct.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 777

That is because you are slow in accepting that he is correct.

---

There are at least 777 reasons you made the wrong call with that post. Balance correct - you are having a lend!😀

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tim23

There are at least 777 reasons you made the wrong call with that post. Balance correct - you are having a lend!��

---

You are correct, I should have included you with westerly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTG

It would be a start Blackcap, but realistically, even that is just 'tinkering'. If we keep doing the same stupid things, we are going to keep getting the same stupid outcomes. As a country we need to be bold, brave, innovative & revolutionary with our fiscal set-up. As dramatic as it sounds, the harsh reality is we are on the slow, winding, bumpy pathway to Banana Republic status; if we aren't careful.

- "Flatten the (tax bracket) Curve".
- Standardise Individual, Company & Trust tax rates (& Lower!)
- Implement a Gross Revenue/Turnover Tax which will capture ALL economic activity. Which through implication will also capture 'capital gains' for non-productive transactions, e.g. casual residential property speculators.

---

The highlighted would be a transaction-type tax, as with GST ? That would equally capture loss-making activity too. You would also need to tax capital profits at the same rate as income profits and salaries, if you want to try to further eliminate tax system bias.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bjauck

The highlighted would be a transaction-type tax, as with GST ?

---

I think I know what you are getting at, but Mmmm no, not really.

GST/VAT is a consumption (Indirect) tax, where the 'final consumer' in the Goods/Services chain 'pays the tab'. IOW, the provider of the Goods/Services charges their price and then adds the tax (GST) to the bill; collecting the tax from the end 'user" on behalf of the State.

IMO GST is not a good tax. In fact it is hideous. For a start, the Compliance, Administrational, Regulatory costs to the broader economy are disproportionately high.

A 'Turnover' Tax on the other hand is far more straightforward/direct. If a TT was introduced, then in unison, one would best remove the GST tax regime. Plus eventually dismantle the INC TAX system. It would also allow the the nominal rate to be much lower (as in <10%) and flatter across the board. Regardless of the Turnover/Gross Income quantum of the Individual, Company, Family Trust etc.

Examples:

- Minimum Wage/Salary Earner (from 1st April) - $48,000 pa @ 7% = $3,360 TT payable. As opposed to $7,420 at the moment, but then having monetary & admin double handling happening by getting back various benefits/tax credits. e.g. WFF, Accom' Sup, etc

- Salary Earner on $100,000 pa @ 7% = $7,000 TT payable. As opposed to $23,920 currently payable, but then getting back benefits/tax credits, e.g. WFF

- Sole Trader (e.g. Tradie) - Gross T/O = $500,000 @ 7% = $35,000 TT payable. As opposed to where they currently try to make their taxable profit as 'efficient' as possible, so say $150,000, so $40,020 (+net GST collected) tax currently paid.

- SME (e.g. retail, manufacturer etc) - Gross T/O = $6,000,000 @ 7% = $420,000 TT payable. As opposed to say 10% EBITDA ($600K, so say $500K EBT) = $140,000 (+ Net GST collected) tax currently paid

- Briscoes Group - Gross T/O = $745m (FY22) @ 7% = $52m TT payable. As opposed to $34m (+ Net GST collected) Tax paid currently.

- Sale of an asset class e.g. House. Punter buys house in 2010 for $500K. Sells it in 2020 for $1.2M so hence a Gross Income (via capital gain) of $700K. @ 7% makes $49,000 TT payable. As opposed to Zilch, Zero, Nada currently.!

Turnover is gross sales. As I understand it, your TT would be tax levied without deduction of input costs and whether a business is profitable or not. Whereas you allow House owners to deduct the input cost purchase price of the property. So your system would still be biassed in favour of real estate owners, and would further discourage investment in business.

Yes, in the ideal world the State should not use tax policy to encourage/discourage economic activity for particular sectors and asset classes. Do that and the more the tax-payer will attempt to "game the system". Ultimately this leads to damaging economic distortions that in turn artificially inflate/suppress the targeted sector/asset class. Moreover, it inevitably produces a raft of 'unintended consequences" (economic & social) that politicians fail to anticipate and of course recognise & take responsibility for, when they inevitably hit.

Sadly, the current Labour Government are recidivous offenders at attempting to 'screw the scrum', through tax policy. Tremendous amounts of financial waste can be found littered in all corners of the NZ economy currently. That reckless & negligent behaviour is and will continue to negatively impact us all.

The good news is that a Turnover Tax is far more difficult to 'game', much easier to administer and treats each Gross income earner the same (No corporate socialism!).

Bjauck, you make comment about a TT system not referencing whether a business is profitable or not. Agreed, but surely you recognise that this situation already exists with the current Tax framework?

- A Salary/Wage earner currently pays PAYE on the Gross Income/"Turnover". That tax is deducted at source, at the prescribed rate, regardless of whether the taxpayer's household "P & L' is 'profitable' or not.
- A business can show a P & L loss but still be a significant net payer of tax (GST).

As an aside, I here one ask, "what about for a high-growth mode entity that may be showing large cash-burn due to having no/low income?" Simple, under a TT regime, little/no tax would be payable!

Polytechs amalgamation and how much wasted money has been spent on this ? 50 mil ?

Some kindly soul sent me this nice little poem.........

Dear Jacinda:

You may have run away
From your five years in the sun
But I will not forgive you
For the damage you have done
Our beautiful New Zealand
Can it ever be the same?
Now ravaged by division
And you alone to blame.
You've left us with so much to fix
You've made things so much worse
Your reckless overspending
Has drained the public purse.
Children still in poverty
Criminals running rife
Race based legislation
Set to ruin Kiwi life.
You grasped your socialist dagger
And you plunged it in our heart
Creating vile apartheid
Which will tear us all apart.

So I'm glad you're gone, Jacinda,
But does Hipkins wear your smile?
I fear the face of innocence
Just masks the crocodile.

I see in todays news via News Hub that the Polytech rejig fishheads have asked for a $300,000,000 interest free advance from the govt as part of a $425,000,000 costings !!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTG

Yes, in the ideal world the State should not use tax policy to encourage/discourage economic activity for particular sectors and asset classes. Do that and the more the tax-payer will attempt to "game the system". Ultimately this leads to damaging economic distortions that in turn artificially inflate/suppress the targeted sector/asset class. Moreover, it inevitably produces a raft of 'unintended consequences" (economic & social) that politicians fail to anticipate and of course recognise & take responsibility for, when they inevitably hit.

Sadly, the current Labour Government are recidivous offenders at attempting to 'screw the scrum', through tax policy. Tremendous amounts of financial waste can be found littered in all corners of the NZ economy currently. That reckless & negligent behaviour is and will continue to negatively impact us all.

The good news is that a Turnover Tax is far more difficult to 'game', much easier to administer and treats each Gross income earner the same (No corporate socialism!).

Bjauck, you make comment about a TT system not referencing whether a business is profitable or not. Agreed, but surely you recognise that this situation already exists with the current Tax framework?

- A Salary/Wage earner currently pays PAYE on the Gross Income/"Turnover". That tax is deducted at source, at the prescribed rate, regardless of whether the taxpayer's household "P & L' is 'profitable' or not.
- A business can show a P & L loss but still be a significant net payer of tax (GST).
!

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Q. Is the business a payer of tax, or merely an agent, collecting tax for and on behalf of the IRD?
A. The latter.

The wasteage list must include the whole Govt front bench now - surely ? ;)

Even Handy Andy is now on high level defensive chasing imaginary Russian images around the Chathams :)

The hospitals & Pikers River appear to have still haven't recovered from the handiwork imposed on them ;)