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  1. #12121
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    Quote Originally Posted by elZorro View Post
    I'm not so sure, as a sole trader still has to tell a govt department what they're up to, legally. If they operate under the table, that might be different.
    .
    I'm a sole trader but I do not tell any govt department what I'm up to. What are you smoking today ElZorro?

  2. #12122
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    Sole traders have to complete an IR10 and I think (not 100% sure) that is what Stats use for the birth/deaths measure. However, whether sole traders or not, not all IR10 filers are included in that measure as they do not meet the criteria.

    So they come and go under the Stats radar. There will be very many of them.

  3. #12123
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackcap View Post
    I'm a sole trader but I do not tell any govt department what I'm up to. What are you smoking today ElZorro?
    But you have to tell the IRD what you're up to, Blackcap.

    Here's an IR10 form for you, and IRD have helpfully spelt it out:

    Find out about: Tax rates and codes

    Sole traders

    A sole trader is a person trading on their own. They control, manage and own the business.
    How does being a sole trader work?

    A sole trader usually has no formal or legal processes to set up the business. The owner/manager is personally entitled to all profits, but is also personally liable for all business taxes and debts.
    What are "drawings"?

    If you are a sole trader you're probably not paying yourself a wage, but simply taking money from the business when you need it for personal use. These takings are called drawings. They are:

    • a part of your profit and taxed accordingly
    • not a deductible business expense when calculating your profit.

    Record your drawings in your cashbook so that you can reconcile your cashbook with your bank statements, ensuring that there is enough money in the business to cover any bills owing.
    What are the tax rates for sole traders?

    A sole trader is taxed at the individual tax rates.
    Example
    Sales $177,000
    less all deductible expenses $108,500
    Net profit (taxable income) $68,500
    So even if you're selling stuff repeatedly on Trademe or similar, that's a business, as you're in it to generate a profit. I'm not sure how this works practically, as just about everything I buy on Trademe, even the stuff that has been indented, doesn't come with a tax invoice of any kind.

  4. #12124
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    Quote Originally Posted by elZorro View Post
    But you have to tell the IRD what you're up to, Blackcap.

    Here's an IR10 form for you, and IRD have helpfully spelt it out:



    So even if you're selling stuff repeatedly on Trademe or similar, that's a business, as you're in it to generate a profit. I'm not sure how this works practically, as just about everything I buy on Trademe, even the stuff that has been indented, doesn't come with a tax invoice of any kind.
    You do not have to tell the IRD what you are doing. Normally they won't ask, but naturally you must report your income. If you don't they will uncover all your activities in an investigation.

  5. #12125
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    Quote Originally Posted by elZorro View Post
    But you have to tell the IRD what you're up to, Blackcap.

    Here's an IR10 form for you, and IRD have helpfully spelt it out:



    So even if you're selling stuff repeatedly on Trademe or similar, that's a business, as you're in it to generate a profit. I'm not sure how this works practically, as just about everything I buy on Trademe, even the stuff that has been indented, doesn't come with a tax invoice of any kind.
    Hi ElZorro, I do fill out an IR 10 form, I do know my tax obligations. But even then I do not tell them what I do. For all they know my Sales might be from pimping my body to willing and paying clients, or the income comes from sales of illicit substances. All they see is that there is a multiple activity indicator yes or no, and the $$ amounts of income and expenses. I do not do the balance sheet part and have not been queried on that to date.

  6. #12126
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackcap View Post
    Hi ElZorro, I do fill out an IR 10 form, I do know my tax obligations. But even then I do not tell them what I do. For all they know my Sales might be from pimping my body to willing and paying clients, or the income comes from sales of illicit substances. All they see is that there is a multiple activity indicator yes or no, and the $$ amounts of income and expenses. I do not do the balance sheet part and have not been queried on that to date.
    That's interesting, I'm not sure how they can get all the enterprise data then. I get surveyed by Statistics NZ reasonably regularly, so they certainly know what I'm up to.

  7. #12127
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    Quote Originally Posted by elZorro View Post
    That's interesting, I'm not sure how they can get all the enterprise data then. I get surveyed by Statistics NZ reasonably regularly, so they certainly know what I'm up to.
    They survey a handful of enterprises, but your claim that you have to tell some (unspecified) govt. dept. what you do is unsurprisingly wrong.

  8. #12128
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    You have to declare an industy (ANZSIC) classification to IRD which it gives to Statistics NZ and if you change your predominant industry they get that info within a year.

  9. #12129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Major von Tempsky View Post
    You have to declare an industy (ANZSIC) classification to IRD which it gives to Statistics NZ and if you change your predominant industry they get that info within a year.
    And of course, ACC levies depend on the industry type too.

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