If National wins ...

[fungus pudding]

What have you been reading NBT?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance

No, I'm not conflicted over Labour values in general. You have failed to make a case against most of my arguments so far, and you have to realise that the Labour party is a lot more broad-based than you think it is. Labour doesn't try to run businesses. They will have ideas to lead them in certain directions, for the common good. Labour also leave behind good strong policy during their terms, which is not unwound by National.

Which Labour is that? Robertson Labour, Parker Labour, Little Labour or Mahuta Labour?

[Sgt Pepper]

What have you been reading NBT?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance

No, I'm not conflicted over Labour values in general. You have failed to make a case against most of my arguments so far, and you have to realise that the Labour party is a lot more broad-based than you think it is. Labour doesn't try to run businesses. They will have ideas to lead them in certain directions, for the common good. Labour also leave behind good strong policy during their terms, which is not unwound by National.

At the moment, under National, the tax take has just about recovered to where it was in 2008. Govt costs are about the same. Employment as a percentage is down, unemployment is up, GDP/capita is recovering post GFC but is well behind Australia's. Manufacturing jobs are well down, hardship is more prevalent in many suburbs of NZ. Our crown debt is still rising quickly from almost a net zero under Labour. It's now more than an entire year's govt income. House prices in major cities are leaping ahead, a statistic National said they'd sort out. Exports as a percentage of GDP, also way below target.

I think you'll have to admit that National has done very little to steer NZ into better waters, they have only managed to keep the ship afloat by borrowing and hoping.

In fact, core crown residual cash won't return to surplus until at least 2017/18, based on latest Treasury figures.

http://www.treasury.govt.nz/budget/f...fu2014/016.htm

Correct EZ

I am afraid John Keys " step change" is proving somewhat elusive. In the end we remain a small economy with a narrow range of exports, over reliant on one market and an absurd proportion of wealth tied up in housing I don't detect anything so far that the " step change" is imminent. No doubt Major and FP will disagree as they believe everything John Key does is perfect. Ah yes the rose tinted glasses of true believers, Goebbels would be proud

[fungus pudding]

Correct EZ

I am afraid John Keys " step change" is proving somewhat elusive. In the end we remain a small economy with a narrow range of exports, over reliant on one market and an absurd proportion of wealth tied up in housing I don't detect anything so far that the " step change" is imminent. No doubt Major and FP will disagree as they believe everything John Key does is perfect.

Well, well, well - that's news to me.

[iceman]

The Huawei gear is good, they're very organised once the plastic tubing is in place and the fibre is at the outside of the house. From there it's about 3 hrs work for two. The modem is fed from another conversion box under the desk, and the wifi range is good. Speed tests show 30 on the dial, both ways. I'm paying less for this with a bigger data cap than I was paying Vodafone for broadband, as I was being pinged for extra traffic each month (my son is into gaming). Vodafone offered a discount, too late. The fibre link still has short pauses when loading up websites with advertising on them, which might just be my computer being a bit older. On wifi the link is up to 5x faster than with broadband, for us.

Thanks for that EZ. Sounds quite respectable.

Hey do you agree with Sir Bob Jones when he says :
"Currently Labour's best chance of victory in 2017 lies in National's total demise through their MPs all dying of laughter at Labour's leadership woes."?

I think he may be on to it :-)

[elZorro]

Thanks for that EZ. Sounds quite respectable.

Hey do you agree with Sir Bob Jones when he says :
"Currently Labour's best chance of victory in 2017 lies in National's total demise through their MPs all dying of laughter at Labour's leadership woes."?

I think he may be on to it :-)

I do accept that if Labour was a business, and that its brand was important, the shareholders wouldn't be impressed if several paid staff members spoke out of turn to the press, having a go at each other. Or if they disobeyed the board of directors and all thought they should be the new CEO.

[elZorro]

This article out today about the extent of interest free borrowing in NZ, and how residential property investors are working the system.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/mone...-off-mortgages

[artemis]

This article out today about the extent of interest free borrowing in NZ, and how residential property investors are working the system.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/mone...-off-mortgages

Interest free? Don't think so.

[fungus pudding]

Interest free? Don't think so.

Of course they are not interest free as eZ seems to think. It's a dopey article anyway. Property investors, at least in the first few years, should aim to increase mortgages - not decrease them. It's a capital intensive business, and like manufacturing, retailing, wholesaling and a host of other activities needs the backing of a banker. There's nothing to criticise even with homeowners who choose interest only. The risk that lead to the GFC was lending irresponsibly; that is loans in excess of a sensible level. If it's a safe loan at the beginning it should be fine if the principal is constant throughout the term.

[Major von Tempsky]

I'm intrigued by EZ's use of the phrase "You have failed to make a case against most of my arguments so far" above. He could at least add "in my view".

I note that about 70% of ST posters in the poll before the election were voting National - I would have thought that implies that about 70% of ST posters think that he has made a case "against most of your arguments so far".

In the end it's the electorate's view that matters, not EZ's and very recently somewhere between 52% and 75% thought that there is a very convincing and compelling case against EZ's views. You need a sense of proportion and connectness with reality EZ, and a little more modesty, in fact rather a lot more modesty.

For someone who's party only just achieved 25% of the vote (when it used to achieve between 40% and 50% and under Kirk in 1972 over 50% of the vote) all this grandiose "you have failed to make a case" just looks absurd and laughable!

[Sgt Pepper]

I'm intrigued by EZ's use of the phrase "You have failed to make a case against most of my arguments so far" above. He could at least add "in my view".

I note that about 70% of ST posters in the poll before the election were voting National - I would have thought that implies that about 70% of ST posters think that he has made a case "against most of your arguments so far".

In the end it's the electorate's view that matters, not EZ's and very recently somewhere between 52% and 75% thought that there is a very convincing and compelling case against EZ's views. You need a sense of proportion and connectness with reality EZ, and a little more modesty, in fact rather a lot more modesty.

For someone who's party only just achieved 25% of the vote (when it used to achieve between 40% and 50% and under Kirk in 1972 over 50% of the vote) all this grandiose "you have failed to make a case" just looks absurd and laughable!

MVT

"For someone who's party only just achieved 25% of the vote

I recall that National only had 20.93% of the vote in 2002. Social Democracy will make a comeback, perhaps once housing tanks, dairy farms with mortgagee sales signs at the farm gates, strikes in the health service. Perhaps when GFC part two occurs? Perhaps when John Key gets bored, gets his knighthood and decamps to London as High Commissioner?? What is your opinion?
i