Smartshares on the NZX -how smart are they?

[voltage]

Are you use any of these products. I would be interested for comments on the new ETFs offered on the NZX. Are they too expensive, or are they a good solution to access global etfs, property, cash and bond funds.

[Bobdn]

I have SmartMzy and SmartOzy ETFs. I own SmartMzy through Superlife which charges slighter lower fees I think even though it's owned by NZX. ETFs are relatively expensive in NZ with fees around .5% compared to the extremely low fees in the US but I'm ok with that - they're convenient, there are no tax issues, and and I can drip feed money every month, which I do.

I use Superlife's managed/index funds for my global investing. I'm not intending to add any more ETF's to my portfolio at this stage but will keep Mzy and Ozy for years to come. BHP dominates the SmartOzy and as a result this poor litte ETF hasn't been doing all that well of late. But that's the beauty of drip feeding I guess. High NZD and poor performing companies means I get a good bang for my buck every month at the moment.

[voltage]

Thanks Bobdn. There has been a number of new ones added but the high fee as you say of around .5% is expensive. A number of these are available on the asx at a much lower cost.I too use superlife. If I use my share broker to buy any of these say on the US market, then there is a custodial fee of .35%. We seem to have little choice from NZ without making things so complicated.

[Bobdn]

Yes, sorry, new ones, I realized that after I posted. We do have limited choices as you say. I probably eventually will (via Superlife) dip into another ETF at some stage, maybe the S&P 500 one. I fritter away money pretty easily so the regular drip feeding works well for me. Whatever the fees are, it's nothing to what I can blow on a Saturday night shopping online at the Warehouse:) Free cash for me is spent pretty quickly.

I used to own US shares through the custodial arrangement thing (MSFT/Apple/ and BP ADR) but I started bumping up against that $50,000 threshold after which I would have had to pay tax on gains. I think the custodian was .5% or thereabouts. Index and ETFs do meet my lazy investing ways better.

[trader_jackson]

I am invested in ASF, as a young guy I have a small parcel with monthly contributions near the minimum. Although it hasn't been that great capital wise (losing about 5%), the dividend yield has been ok (around 4.5%) and I believe long term the aussie financial sector will continue to do well, maybe not as well as the past 20 years, but still better than that of investing $50 into a bank.... "better to own the banks than save with them"

Anyone else own any ASF? Thoughts on it?

[Bobdn]

Sounds good Trader Jackson, as long as you're in for a good period of time (I think maybe 10 years plus) and that is not where all your funds are going. Otherwise it would be a pretty narrow investment with everything pegged to the Australian economy and its banks. Some poor people thought years ago that diversification meant having investments in a variety of NZ finance companies.

Not that I'm saying this is you of course. As it happens I have far too much invested in the Australian economy at the moment through ETFs, managed funds and my ANZ shares. It's just that the NZD is pretty good at the moment and I have a fair of missing out.

[trader_jackson]

Sounds good Trader Jackson, as long as you're in for a good period of time (I think maybe 10 years plus) and that is not where all your funds are going. Otherwise it would be a pretty narrow investment with everything pegged to the Australian economy and its banks. Some poor people thought years ago that diversification meant having investments in a variety of NZ finance companies.

Not that I'm saying this is you of course. As it happens I have far too much invested in the Australian economy at the moment through ETFs, managed funds and my ANZ shares. It's just that the NZD is pretty good at the moment and I have a fair of missing out.

Yes I like to think I understand about diversification, currently it represents less than 10% of my portfolio, and I do plan to hold this 'bag' of shares for at least 10 years, potentially decades. For me, being a relatively 'small' investor, brokerage is a bit of a pain, so I like the fact I can put a small monthly amount, brokerage free, into ASF.

I am also assuming the ASF fund will take into account currency fluctuations, and this should have a positive effect, over time.

[Fisherking]

Are you use any of these products. I would be interested for comments on the new ETFs offered on the NZX. Are they too expensive, or are they a good solution to access global etfs, property, cash and bond funds.
I put some money into the S&P 500, from the research I did this particular fund had the best long term record.

[trader_jackson]

Has anyone else noticed that the ASF smart share is undervalued (relative to NTA) by approximately 10%?

I suppose due to liquidity... but thought I would see if anyone else thought this was an usually high deviation

[Jaa]

Has anyone else noticed that the ASF smart share is undervalued (relative to NTA) by approximately 10%?

I suppose due to liquidity... but thought I would see if anyone else thought this was an usually high deviation

I thought they used Craigs as a marketmaker to prevent this?

[trader_jackson]

I thought they used Craigs as a marketmaker to prevent this?

Not entirely sure how it works, but ASF jumped 7% or so this morning, about time it happened as it was lagging well behind NTA at one stage!

[Harvey Specter]

I thought they used Craigs as a marketmaker to prevent this?I may be wrong but I think the market maker just keeps the spread tight and liquidity up, not necessarily keep the price close to NTA.

[mfd]

Not entirely sure how it works, but ASF jumped 7% or so this morning, about time it happened as it was lagging well behind NTA at one stage!

From my limited experience of their other funds, the price is very jumpy as it just reflects the last trade made, which might happen once every few days. However, someone is making a market with a spread around the nta so the price reported doesn't necessarily reflect the price you can achieve. E.g. ASR has a market price of 2.89 but I could sell right now at 2.939.

[Harvey Specter]

The way I think of a market maker, they are just there to ensure liquidity. So if you have $100k to sell, you will be able to sell to someone, but that doesn't mean you will be able to do so at NTA. Trying doing that for a small cap share and the share price will probably gap down big time and you still wont be able to get your order filled.

[trader_jackson]

Is anyone else seeing this???
NTA of $7.33 (+ stocks rising today), but someone traded at $5.94??

19% difference in asset backing and current price? (with 37500 orders to sell between $5.95 and $6.00?

Can anyone explain this?

Would be much appreciated...

[trader_jackson]

and just like that it is gone... how bizarre

[trader_jackson]

Now at $7.40?? This is alot more realistic, but crazy it went down to under $6 for seemingly no reason

[Harvey Specter]

Looks to be on low volume - 666 shares (per google). I thought the market maker was meant to stop this sort of thing, at least on low volume.

Are you monitoring this for the purposes of arbitrage or just out of interest.

[trader_jackson]

Mainly just out of interest... just happened to see this occurring (as a holder)

[Grunter]

Interesting - potential arbitrage opportunities with these?