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Snow Leopard
26-09-2004, 06:43 AM
quote:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3044621a13,00.html

Turners and Growers to list
25 September 2004
By KAREN CHAN and SUE ALLEN

Turners and Growers has announced it will list on the stock market next week, but has surprised observers by staying silent over the question of a share offering.


It had been speculated that the company would raise up to $100 million in a share issue or selloff at the time of listing.

The move to list would give more than 900 existing Turners and Growers shareholders the chance to trade shares more easily on a more sophisticated market than at present, chairman Tony Gibbs said.

Turners and Growers shares had been traded on the NZX unlisted trading facility, but its closure in June has driven the company to seek a full listing.

Mr Gibbs, who is overseas, did not specifically refer to the market's previous expectation that the company would make a public share offering on listing, but said in the listing document that doing so would "enable the company to more efficiently access the capital markets in the future should it wish".

Turners and Growers forecast net profit after tax would drop by nearly 27 per cent to $8.6 million in the year to December 2004 as revenue slipped 5.8 per cent to $564.7 million.

The company said it had assumed projected revenue and profit to December 2004 would be adversely affected by foreign exchange trends, a small drop in pipfruit volumes and weaker prices compared with 2003.

In the listing document, Mr Gibbs confirmed it would go ahead with plans to separate off its juice manufacturing arm, Enzafoods.

Gryffyn
26-09-2004, 08:37 AM
More details required about the float though.

k1w1
26-09-2004, 12:38 PM
If you remember that the object of this exercise is to make a sh*tload of cash for Tony Gibbs and GPG then what happens next will make sense...

KJ
26-09-2004, 03:31 PM
Kiwi-I hope you are correct as a GPG shareholder-but you will recall that the TUA float made a lot of money for TUA shareholders.Perhaps this one will be the same.

k1w1
26-09-2004, 06:18 PM
KJ what did they do with TUA as the Enza situation is probably similar ?

KJ
26-09-2004, 08:02 PM
Kiwi-I do not see how it is similar-perhaps I do not understand your question.

k1w1
27-09-2004, 08:24 AM
Well Turners & Growers spun Turners Auctions off as an IPO and now they are talking about spinning Enza off as an IPO. Thats what I thought was similar. Why do you reckon they are listing without an IPO whats up with that KJ ?

airedale
27-09-2004, 08:30 AM
Hi K1W1, the object of most floats in the market is to make a shirtload of cash for someone. There is nothing inherently wrong with that, we just bear it in mind at decision time when we decide to buy,sell, or stand aside.

k1w1
27-09-2004, 08:50 AM
Airedale, I dont disagree.Normally a seller would do an IPO- here there has not been one.

I think that the clue to this is not anything about Turners but the history of GPG. Istead of selling out in the past they have had rights issues which they have underwritten to increase their holdings in the company. Capral Aluminium and Tower are two examples.I am wondering whether they may do the same thing here.

KJ
27-09-2004, 11:13 AM
Kiwi-TUR acquired ENZA in 2002 which will allow them to combine export operations into a single marketing structure,rationalise property holdings,and realise certain synergies in warehousing in transport,warehousing,IT etc.

There is no intention to spin off ENZA as an IPO.Their intention is to spin off Enzafoods-a very small part of ENZA with a turnover of approx $61m.There is no need to list to do this.

Listing will increase awareness of the coy,open the door to new investors,and give the coy better access to capital markets.I think that this is the reason for listing.Hopefully it will lift the shareprice.

k1w1
27-09-2004, 01:39 PM
KJ thanks for clarifying about Enza Foods not Enza being spun off. I still stick with my view that spinning off is more to make a buck than because it doesnt fit aka Turner Auctions.

Making a buck for shareholders is great. Its just that I suspect that the shareholders Gibb wants to make bucks for are GPG not T& G.

Just means that you have to be on your guard as a T&G shareholder and take everything they tell you with a grain of salt. My experience as a Tower and Capral Aluminium shareholder has taught me this. Basically you disregard what they say and do what they do and you will be okay.

I dont think Tony Gibbs gives a rats about improved shareholder liquidity I think its a bit more basic than that.

KJ
27-09-2004, 01:52 PM
Fair enough Kiwi-good points.I am sure that they will have been giving thought for a while on a profitable exit for GPG from TUR.
Listing may flush out other interested parties.

Gryffyn
27-09-2004, 02:14 PM
Probably another reason GPG price has been on the up last few weeks :-)

Disc: GPG

Ted2
27-09-2004, 02:18 PM
quote:Originally posted by k1w1

KJ thanks for clarifying about Enza Foods not Enza being spun off. I still stick with my view that spinning off is more to make a buck than because it doesnt fit aka Turner Auctions.

Making a buck for shareholders is great. Its just that I suspect that the shareholders Gibb wants to make bucks for are GPG not T& G.

Just means that you have to be on your guard as a T&G shareholder and take everything they tell you with a grain of salt. My experience as a Tower and Capral Aluminium shareholder has taught me this. Basically you disregard what they say and do what they do and you will be okay.

I dont think Tony Gibbs gives a rats about improved shareholder liquidity I think its a bit more basic than that.


Buy GPG then!!!
:D:D

k1w1
27-09-2004, 03:17 PM
GPG didnt have that flash a year last year altho they retain the trust of the sharemarket as their share price shows. I don't think one year is all that important as basically these guys are the company equivalent of property developers. They buy something run down, fix it up and flog it off. Most of their current projects are still works in progress in my view, TUA is finished, CAA is not till next year, Coates is a real long termer. So this year if they want to make a wedge then T & G is where its going to happen. Thats why I decided to go T&G with my GPG money. Whats really interesting is how they maximise profit for themselves. They are not scared to let a SP fall as they buy more, or of rights issues.

Something clever may be about to happen judging from the GPG share price.

warthog
27-09-2004, 06:58 PM
quote:Originally posted by k1w1

GPG didnt have that flash a year last year altho they retain the trust of the sharemarket as their share price shows. I don't think one year is all that important as basically these guys are the company equivalent of property developers. They buy something run down, fix it up and flog it off. Most of their current projects are still works in progress in my view

Ron must have read your posting before he wrote his latest chairman's statement on the 25th of August where he says pretty much exactly this. Oh wait ...

So besides the obvious Coats, T&G and Tower projects, obviously in progress, is there anything else that couldn't be identified as a work in progress by your average 5 year-old?

k1w1
27-09-2004, 07:36 PM
Warthog, Tower and T& G seem to be turned around to me. Capral is about a year away and Coates is a while to go as are some of the more minor ones.

In my five year old way I have decided that Tower and T &G will be where GPG make their profits in the short term. So I will try and get my return by directly investing in them rather than get it by the profits going back to GPG, get diluted in the Coates turn around, get the directors fees cut off the top, be paid in paper with bonus shares which dilute EPS and not rely that Coates will turn around.

The market sentiment, history and shareprice show that GPG is priced on the basis that it will succeed with its works in progress. My personal view is that if something does go wrong with Coates then the SP will be revisited as happened to BRY with its hotel project.Even if it doesnt go wrong its a big turnaround with a large number of things that could take more time than first thought.

Its a risk I can eliminate by moving out of GPG in the short term and directly into its two projects most likely to be successful this year and be rewarded by the market.

If I am wrong and T&G and Tower dont make substantial returns for shareholders then I lose my gains from holding on to GPG. Although I have the insight of a five year old I promise not to cry if this happens.:)

Gryffyn
27-09-2004, 08:02 PM
Good on ya for having a strategy and going for it. I'm convinced about TWR, don't know enough about T&G but also have money in GPG - directors fees or no, they have grown my investment handsomely.

warthog
28-09-2004, 06:44 AM
Now now. Maybe I was too caustic, in my own, patented, 5 year-old way

I would say all of these are still in turnaround mode in that a business isn't turned-around until it's back manking healthy profits, as opposed to bleeding money. But I would agree that Tower and T&G are at later stages.

I don't know anything about Capral...pray tell.


quote:Originally posted by k1w1

Warthog, Tower and T& G seem to be turned around to me. Capral is about a year away and Coates is a while to go as are some of the more minor ones.

In my five year old way I have decided that Tower and T &G will be where GPG make their profits in the short term. So I will try and get my return by directly investing in them rather than get it by the profits going back to GPG, get diluted in the Coates turn around, get the directors fees cut off the top, be paid in paper with bonus shares which dilute EPS and not rely that Coates will turn around.

The market sentiment, history and shareprice show that GPG is priced on the basis that it will succeed with its works in progress. My personal view is that if something does go wrong with Coates then the SP will be revisited as happened to BRY with its hotel project.Even if it doesnt go wrong its a big turnaround with a large number of things that could take more time than first thought.

Its a risk I can eliminate by moving out of GPG in the short term and directly into its two projects most likely to be successful this year and be rewarded by the market.

If I am wrong and T&G and Tower dont make substantial returns for shareholders then I lose my gains from holding on to GPG. Although I have the insight of a five year old I promise not to cry if this happens.:)
:D

k1w1
28-09-2004, 09:02 AM
Actually Warthog it was quite clever and made me think about what I was trying to say.

If Sir Ron says they do turnarounds thats good enough for me. I am not trying to be original when I restate that. My point is that these guys try to organise things so that profits are harvested in a way that makes for market pleasing annual results, profits, bonus payouts and shareholders happy to be paid in scrip.

The next decent size candidates ready for market appear to be Tower ad T & G. Capral is CAA in Australia. Its about a year away. They manufacture aluminium extrusions. GPG bought in when they were making a loss due to imported products. The numbers were crunched and it was worked out that a highly mechanised factory could turn out the product with a small labour force ( hence no need to relocate to China )in a way that would be highly profitable on current product prices.

So the factory was commissioned and built in Brisbane and redundancies were paid out to most of the staff and management in Sydney. Just like Tower GPG then grouped together a lot of one off bad news and put out a head shaking, this is a sick puppy we need a capital raising issue which they underwrote and ended up with a larger number of shares at lower prices, in advance of the good news starting to flow. The trick was just like with Tower. Do what GPG do, not what they say, and put up more cash , you will end up fine. Not quite so fine as the big shareholders mind you, but still just fine.

So when I look at T & G they arent all that gee whiz wow to me . Why are GPG listing now , and why not an IPO?

I don't believe all that market speak they gave for it. I am looking for a move that will benefit GPG at least as much as it does T & G.

k1w1
30-09-2004, 07:40 AM
Okay, so stock relists steadily, Gibbs has no plans for a short term share issue, hinting capital notes issue to retire debt, stock seen as pricey on fundamentals but with potential by brokers.

What happens next ?

According to the Dom's Karen Chan:

"But managing director Michael Dosser said an initial public offering of shares was still "on the cards".

"We will be looking at some sort of an IPO or something during the course of next year, for the purposes of reducing debt and financing a couple of specific projects that we've got in mind," he said, though he would not offer details on expansion plans.

Chairman Tony Gibbs, who is also executive director of Turners & Growers' major shareholder, Guinness Peat Group, said the company could raise up to $100 million if it tapped the market. GPG had no plans to sell down any of its 78 per cent stake at the moment, but would not rule it out."

k1w1
02-10-2004, 10:03 AM
10% gain in SP in the week since publicly listing.

Round one to Tony Gibbs :D

Felonius
13-10-2004, 08:56 AM
Currently trading about $3.40, which is 10% up on the $3.10 at which they listed recently.
The stock seems expensive on fundamentals.

I am a shareholder and cannot decide whether to hang in or move on .. Any ideas ?

Snow Leopard
16-03-2005, 06:28 AM
quote:
TUR
15/03/2005
HALTRECQ

REL: 1827 HRS Turners & Growers Limited

HALTRECQ: TUR: Trading Halt of Ordinary Shares

NZX Regulation Announcement
Turners & Growers Limited ("TUR")
Trading Halt of Ordinary Shares

At the request of Turners & Growers Limited (TUR), NZX Regulation has granted
a trading halt in TUR ordinary shares to facilitate the sell down by Guinness
Peat Group Plc (GPG) of part of its shareholding in TUR. GPG intends to sell
up to 20,250,000 shares by way of an accelerated book build offering. Should
all these shares be placed, GPG will hold approximately 50.1% of all TUR
shares.

The trading halt will remain in place until 10am Friday 18 March 2005 unless
advised earlier by TUR.

ENDS
End CA:00112840 For:TUR Type:HALTRECQ Time:2005-03-15:18:27:13

Greyhound
16-03-2005, 01:11 PM
GPG not the only ones"baling out".In the last couple of weeks a few orchardists have withdrawn their crops from them as well.

truedragon
18-03-2005, 05:36 AM
I though GPG selling their stack down because they have to by regulation.

Any of you buying into this?

DISC: not a holder but looks interesting.

truedragon
18-03-2005, 02:28 PM
Price dropping to below GPG sale price?

Gryffyn
18-03-2005, 04:32 PM
A certain amount of liquidity is required.

truedragon
04-04-2005, 03:49 PM
2.30 from the hight 2 level.... could this be testing 2? I saw some "Gala" and "NZ beauty" pretty sure they are both TUR in Taiwan supermarket yesterday, bought some and taste fine. I think if sub 2, this TUR worth a serious look, given people like N.Z product for it's green image, eventual come down of NZD good for export and the GPG factor.... oh and the 12 cent divy in May.

I am definitely keeping an eye out, although fruit biz is hardly sexy.

DISC: Hold none.

Gryffyn
04-04-2005, 04:53 PM
Why not just buy GPG?

Disc: GPG

Snow Leopard
04-04-2005, 05:46 PM
quote:Originally posted by Gryffyn

Why not just buy GPG?

Disc: GPG

You expect GPG to go sub$2 before TUR [:0]

truedragon
04-08-2005, 12:53 PM
Hi TUR holders

Still hoding your nerve? How do you guys read the last annoucement regarding the apple market price been disastrous and consquent profit downgrade?

DISC: HOLD TUR

winner69
04-08-2005, 01:18 PM
Used the term price destruction in the ann .... that might happen to the shareprice

So full year might be down only a bit this year so less than $10M but plenty of time for things either to improve or get worse ... chances are they will get worse

A PE of 15 gives a share price of about 200 ... a PE of ten about 130 ... maybe some where in between

Bloody apple growers throughout the world ... hope vegies and flowers keep the ship upright

morv
04-08-2005, 04:40 PM
can assure you that nz internal and export fruit and vege have been a pricing bloodbath since dec 2004. they are also facing a new internal banana seller backed by sumitomo. case hire and transport divisions doing well due to excess production in nz, property arm doing well on revaluations but core basics of selling fruit and veg annus horribilis

winner69
04-08-2005, 07:20 PM
quote:Originally posted by morv

can assure you that nz internal and export fruit and vege have been a pricing bloodbath since dec 2004. they are also facing a new internal banana seller backed by sumitomo. case hire and transport divisions doing well due to excess production in nz, property arm doing well on revaluations but core basics of selling fruit and veg annus horribilis


Good stuff morv

So there real reason for being is going through difficult times and the share is richly priced as well.

If some/lot of the profits coming from property revaluations it seems as if cash flows could be bit stretched

Thoughts

Greyhound
05-08-2005, 05:35 AM
When the Aussies finally let our apples in,that will see good times return for orchardists.T&G will benefit enormously.

rawdata
06-08-2005, 12:12 PM
Buy GPG, folks. They sold down TUA and TUR very well!

That's how money is made & lost.

truedragon
07-08-2005, 08:15 PM
I think the depreciation of NZD in the future will be good for TUR and plus people should eat more fruit where N.Z has a healthy brand as environmental clean and etc. I think it's too early to say TUR is a sell. If fact I think if the price further deteriorate due to scare of competition, it may be good time to buy.

DISC: hold TUR

Misc
11-08-2005, 03:01 PM
Hmmmm , this could get real ugly ! ENZA advances moneys to growers based on cartons packed and deducts those advances from sales proceeds..... now , if the sale proceeds are less than the advances (very likely it seems) then ENZA would have to chase growers for the outstanding balance ... this may be $1~$2 per carton , or even more so potentially huge bad debt coming.
Onions and other export veges are not any better this year I believe.

I understand ENZA exported about 8m cartons of apples this year.

Next year looks as bad if not worse based on escalating shipping costs , big fruit stock over-carries in key markets and our high FX rate.


Misc

morv
12-08-2005, 12:21 PM
sell now buy back later
mite be a skip the divi year

Misc
16-08-2005, 12:06 PM
Shares going lower ..... the news from Europe is likely much worse than forecast imo.

A punt at $1.50 ??

Misc

morv
16-08-2005, 12:30 PM
it will break the $2 barrier without bad news
reentry point maybe half of that when the bad news at agm also includes a skipped divi.

Misc
16-08-2005, 02:54 PM
Yikes .... who were the 'lucky' guys that bought GPG's shares at $2.75 a few months ago ?
Might be a few 'interesting' questions put to the GPG Directors at the AGM !

Misc

Bling_Bling
16-08-2005, 03:04 PM
Looks like GPG just got out in time. Poor mums and dads got their bottoms burnt again.

Steve
16-08-2005, 08:17 PM
I'm surprised that the shareprice has held up above $2 for this long since the profit warning...

Snow Leopard
17-08-2005, 01:22 PM
I reckon the NTA for this company is well north of the current SP, I calculate at least $2.63.

They are talking about profit for the year.
Hummmm...

Misc
17-08-2005, 01:53 PM
How do you arrive at $2.63 nta Tiger ??

With world apple markets in complete meltdown , and no obvious end to the pain in sight for along time (ever?), who would be the logical (or any) buyer for most of TNG's assets ?

The Chinese have massacred international produce markets ... and they aint finished yet!

The only 'glimmer' of hope for the NZ apple industry is the possibility of getting access to Aust and Japan in the next few years.

Misc

Snow Leopard
17-08-2005, 02:15 PM
usual way, tangible assets - liabilites divided by number of shares, info from the 2004 FY.

Bling_Bling
17-08-2005, 02:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by Paper Tiger


They are talking about profit for the year.
Hummmm...


Who are they? The same guys that sold down their holdings? ummmm... indeed.

A falling knife.

Anyone have research info on this company?

Misc
17-08-2005, 05:32 PM
"usual way, tangible assets - liabilites divided by number of shares, info from the 2004 FY"

Brilliant , Tiger.

Try spreading the bloated overhead over 5.5m cartons of apples (vs 7.5m 2004) and average commission of 50c per carton (vs $1 2004), and add on clawbacks (read bad debts) of perhaps $10m , and any new 'grower assistance' (read more bad debts coming)...... then revalue the apple assets at 30% less than last year and finally writeoff at least $2m committed to the planned new packhouse in HB.

Do you still get $2.63?

Oh , forgot , I expect ENZA Foods is currently unprofitable also , thats likely the reason for not spinning it off (again China killing that biz).

Misc

Snow Leopard
17-08-2005, 07:02 PM
quote:
Brilliant , Tiger

I know :D

Has you are busy stomping around whinging about it all, perhaps you could provide a better figure for our enlightenment?

Misc
17-08-2005, 08:55 PM
Better figure ?? Impossible to value imo.

Closer to a 'donut' than $2.63 though I suspect.

Staff bailing left/right and centre ... heard even long term apple guy Clive Durant has bailed.

I dont hold these , but I'm sure the market is 'doing them a favour' at $1.90 , no stomping or whinging , just something for holders to think about. You long at $2.75 Tiger ??

Misc

Snow Leopard
18-08-2005, 05:49 AM
Disc: Never held, just watching

winner69
18-08-2005, 07:01 AM
One positive about the NTA is the bulk of it is real tangible stuff ... like land and property

That Mt Wellington site of their must be real valuable, now and into the future.

However selling about $600M worth of stuff and if misc is right making no money on all that activity (this year) is not a good sign and isn't generating the cash it should be

Also hear rumblings from HO about the difficulties being encountered ... new boss trying to make changes when the **** is hitting the fan in the daily operations always difficult .... esp if aspirations (prb GPGs) are high

But on that level of activity IF they could make $50M a year watch the price fly.

Snow Leopard
18-08-2005, 09:10 AM
$50m a year? I think we can expect no more than $9m absolute tops.

winner69
18-08-2005, 09:17 AM
quote:Originally posted by Paper Tiger

$50m a year? I think we can expect no more than $9m absolute tops.


was talking aspirational stuff (whoops letting the cat out of the bag)based on benchmarking against the world etc

And misc seems to suggest that even $9m is impossible in the short term ... he seems pretty clued up about their activities and it looks all doom and gloom cut your throuat slash your wrists stuff doesn't it

Phaedrus
18-08-2005, 10:49 AM
TUR has been technically weak right from the start. There have been numerous warnings, allowing plenty of time to exit this stock and limit losses.
(1) Price started to fall as soon as trading commenced.
(2) Resistance met at opening price (no uptrend here)
(3) Previous support level broken and downtrend begins.
(4) Smart money exits (see OBV)
(5) Resistance at $2.60
(6) Previous support at $2.30 broken.

http://home.ripway.com/2003-11/39768/TUR818001.gif

morv
18-08-2005, 11:02 AM
must agree with misc,apple market in euro huge
problems that will reach further into the balance sheet than just reduction in commision income
local market turnover value in vege dropped by 40%
at a guess plus losing % of business to an attacking opposition.
new banana importer backed by sumitomo fruit having a go at their supermarket banana trade,
result an unhappy no.2 shareholder
lot of unhappy staff,espicially in local fruit and vege sales. lovely job 2am to noon with bonuses on turnover factor. i am unsure how much
the property revaluations and the good
performance of case hire and transport will hide the red ink
discl;sold holding to make nogoc into nog

truedragon
24-08-2005, 06:51 PM
What do u guys think about the results. No mention of dividend!! Is there one?

DISC: Hold TUR




Turners & Growers Limited - Announcements




TUR
24/08/2005
HALFYR

REL: 1618 HRS Turners & Growers Limited

HALFYR: TUR: HY to 30/6/05 IFRS$5.92m ($8.06m restated IFRS)

TURNERS & GROWERS LIMITED AND SUBSIDIARY COMPANIES
HALF YEARLY REPORT TO JUNE 2005

The Board announces the results for the half year to 30th June 2005. These
have been prepared under N.Z. International Financial Reporting Standards
(IFRS) and the comparative figures have been restated accordingly.
The figures are unaudited.

$000
OPERATING REVENUE (05) 248,191 (04) 284,565 -12.8%

EBITDA (05) 18,941 (04) 22,129 -14.4%
Depreciation (05) (9,082) (04) (10,197) -10.9%
Amortisation (05) (832) (04) (564) +47.5%

EBIT (05) 9,027 (04) 11,368 -20.6%
Interest Income (05) 305 (04) 338 -9.8%
Interest Expense (05) (3,411) (04) (3,640) -6.3%

OPERATING SURPLUS
BEFORE INCOME TAX (05) 5,921 (04) 8,066 -26.6%
Income Tax (05) (1,105) (04) (2,662) -58.5%

OPERATING SURPLUS
AFTER INCOME TAX (05) 4,816 (04) 5,404 -10.9%

Minority Interests
In deficit of subsids (05) (69) (04) (92) -25.0%

NET SURPLUS (05) 4,747 (04) 5,312 -10.6%

DIRECTORS' COMMENTARY

The group profit before tax (unaudited) for the half year to June 2005 was $6
million, compared with the first half result for 2004 of $7.5 million
(restated this year under IFRS at $8 million). The most significant
contributor to this reduction has been the export apple sector.

ENZA INTERNATIONAL

The season got off to a late start owing to summer climatic factors, with a
significant reduction in the availability of exportable product. While it is
probable that ENZA has maintained its export market share, this overall
reduction has translated into a significant shortfall in tray-carton
equivalents (tces) actually shipped, with a final figure in the region of
about 5.5 million tces.

The late start to the season has been further compounded by a generally
oversupplied European market which also held carryover stocks of last
season's northern hemisphere fruit. Coupled with recent weak consumer demand
over a broad range of fruit and produce generally, these factors have had a
marked impact on returns to our grower clients and on group commissions. The
intransigently high exchange rates, remaining well above preseason budget
levels in most core currencies, have also reduced overall returns.

United Kingdom fruit sales have been steadier than in Europe and it is to be
hoped that prices will hold up in the later part of the season. North America
has generally achieved good prices to date with the US dollar rate being the
main challenge. However some evidence of weakness is emerging with the
arrival of northern hemisphere new season varieties, and because of
unnecessarily low price offers from other NZ exporters.

The problems in the apple industry affect all global producers. While there
is serious concern about New Zealand growers continuing to pull out trees of
the traditional varieties or exit the industry, Enza remains confident of a
longer term future for the new Jazz variety in which it holds exclusive
world-wide production and marketing rights. The next two or three years will
see increasing quantities of this variety becoming available for overseas
sale. The pricing premium this variety is commanding is both necessary and
reassuring.

The Board continues to be pleased with the investment in the Latitude 41
Packhouse in Nelson which performed most effectively for its clients and the
group during its second packing season, and is looking to replicate the
facility in Hawkes Bay on the Whakatu site.

FRESH DOMESTIC SECTOR

The industry environment continues to be both competitive and dynamic. The
company appears to be holding market share with results up on the equivalent
six months in 2004.

One strategic objective of management has been the endeavour

Bling_Bling
25-08-2005, 09:42 AM
Assuming they can make $10 million profit full year for the next 3 years, puts them on a PE over 14.5x at current price of $1.96. Still expensive in my books for a company going through downgrades and long term fundamental problem.

It is turning, but it aint growing.

disc: not a shareholder

Sky Tower
26-08-2005, 12:01 PM
From New Zealand Herald:

Apples spoil T&G's half-year
26.08.05

Produce company Turners & Growers says apple export problems are the main reason for its unaudited profit before tax for the June half year falling from $8 million to $6 million.

Revenue dropped 12.8 per cent to $248.6 million and earnings before interest and tax fell 20.6 per cent to $9m. No dividend has been declared.

Three weeks ago the company, which owns Enza, the biggest marketer of New Zealand apples, issued a downgraded profit forecast because of the apple problems.

In the half-yearly report Turners & Growers said it estimated its full-year result may be down somewhat on last year, "although not by large amounts".

The report said apple exports had started slowly last season due to climatic factors and there had been a reduction in shipments.

The late start to the season had been compounded by an oversupply of the European market, which also held carryover stocks of last season's Northern Hemisphere fruit.

British fruit sales had been steadier than in Europe and it was hoped prices would hold up in the later part of the season.

North America had generally achieved good prices to date with the exchange rate being the main challenge. But some evidence of weakness was emerging with the arrival of Northern Hemisphere new season varieties, and because of unnecessarily low price offers from other New Zealand exporters.

While there was serious concern about New Zealand apple growers continuing to pull out trees of the traditional varieties or exit the industry, the report said Enza remained confident of a longer term future for the new jazz variety in which it held exclusive world-wide production and marketing rights.

"Our medium and longer term future in pipfruit is also predicated on our involvement with jazz, which we are confident will prove a strong strategic advantage."

Apart from prices and exchange rates, the report said the company's concern was a continuing loss of production as growers moved to alternative land uses.

Overall in the fresh domestic sector, the company said it appeared to be holding market share with results up on the equivalent six months of last year.

Misc
02-09-2005, 08:18 PM
"In the half-yearly report Turners & Growers said it estimated its full-year result may be down somewhat on last year, "although not by large amounts".

YEAH RIGHT LOL

Latest apple industry rumour suggest ENZA have close to 1m cartons of apples holed up in Europe with no chance of sales now the Northern Hemisphere season has started ......... whatever is left up there now will be dumped incurring further losses , perhaps $20m if the carton numbers rumoured to be unsold are vaguely accurate.

The company is simply NOT being honest with its shareholders IMHO!

Misc

Base Trader
02-09-2005, 09:47 PM
It maybe while GPG dumped a chunk or TUR not long ago.

The French Apples are now hitting stores and are very cheap (well the French do not need to generate income from the sale of their goods afterall).

Bling_Bling
05-09-2005, 08:05 AM
quote:Originally posted by Misc


The company is simply NOT being honest with its shareholders IMHO!

Misc





AGREE !

I recall when GPG did the placement of shares. The brokers that placed those shares was telling the investors how great the company is doing and how the pit fruit market is booming. A poor mate of mine got sucked into the BS.

truedragon
05-09-2005, 12:26 PM
Let's not forget the fact that GPG is still the MAJOR shareholder by far. I don't think its in their interest to see the share go down.

DISC: Hold TUR

Misc
05-09-2005, 02:04 PM
Quite right TD. It is not in GPG's interest to have the share price go down ..... thats basically why I distrust the half yearly report so much !!

Did you buy at $2.75 ??

Misc

haka
06-09-2005, 06:27 AM
quote:Originally posted by Misc

Quite right TD. It is not in GPG's interest to have the share price go down ..... thats basically why I distrust the half yearly report so much !!

Did you buy at $2.75 ??

Misc


Says one mug to the other. :D

kittydashwood
06-09-2005, 08:07 AM
haka you are the quintessential "wrecker and hater"
keep on digging mate
:D

Bling_Bling
06-09-2005, 08:17 AM
quote:Originally posted by haka


quote:Originally posted by Misc

Quite right TD. It is not in GPG's interest to have the share price go down ..... thats basically why I distrust the half yearly report so much !!

Did you buy at $2.75 ??

Misc


Says one mug to the other. :D


I have to agree with you there Haka.

GPG says thanks for coming guys. Made their money floating this at high IPO price and then placing some of their shares just before the bad news.

haka
06-09-2005, 09:22 AM
quote:Originally posted by kittydashwood


haka you are the quintessential "wrecker and hater"
keep on digging mate
:D


Only a fool would write that it's not in GPG's interest to have TUR's share price down so the results cannot be trusted!

Heck, GPG could only offload 12.25m of the 20.25m shares they tried to place and only mugs (no institutions) took them.

port hills
06-09-2005, 09:41 AM
Haka

Maybe I'm confused but I think you have misunderstood MISC.

I think he/she means that he distrusts the report as he believes the situation is worse than stated, where as you seem to have interperated him/her to be saying that it is better than stated.

morv
06-09-2005, 10:30 AM
i havent pulled the half year to bits but my impression is that the disasters and turnover slumps are being covered by property price increases which make good reading but do not do alot for cash flow. do a macdunk go ask the staff, even the tealadies. [at a local branch they can not get approval for a $20 part to repair a forkhoist, it sits idle. 3 months ago gpg broker was supporting @ 238 and then reselling @245/250, but ev en that couldnt stem the tide.

Misc
06-09-2005, 12:39 PM
Anyone know what GPG's 'carrying cost' is in relation to their 61% TUR stake ??

misc

morv
06-09-2005, 02:45 PM
from memory they bought out a faction of the turner family and a few other willing sellers bout 96-97 at $1-$1.20 range,covered their butt with the sale of central auckland market site,then added a large carry cost with enza purchase.

truedragon
19-09-2005, 11:27 PM
Nice to see the little rebound although it's still in the downtrend. I think it need to go above 2.40 for a trend line break.... long way to go...

Any improvement from the supply end and fundamental part for this fruit exporter? TUR export kiwi fruit also though... does any of you Zespri has any association with TUR? They sell Zespri in Asia quite well I think.

DIS: hold TUR

winner69
13-10-2005, 06:08 PM
Back in August the story was.... we estimate our full year result may be down somewhat on last year, although not by large amounts.

I wonder what somewhat means?

Assume that this year comes in at $9M ... at shareprice of 180 about 15 times earnings still

Hope that the full year is $9M or else you won't want to be in this

Going back in this thread Misc seems to be on the case .... what's your latest read of the situation mate

Market cap been halved over the last year ..... something has to give

Mick100
13-10-2005, 06:38 PM
quote:Originally posted by morv

i havent pulled the half year to bits but my impression is that the disasters and turnover slumps are being covered by property price increases which make good reading but do not do alot for cash flow. do a macdunk go ask the staff, even the tealadies. [at a local branch they can not get approval for a $20 part to repair a forkhoist, it sits idle. 3 months ago gpg broker was supporting @ 238 and then reselling @245/250, but ev en that couldnt stem the tide.


I have been close to the action in this company for the past 2 1/2 yrs. I don,t want to go into any detail. All I can say is that there is incompetence at senior levels of managment.

I wouldn't touch this company with a forty foot barge pole.

disc. hold GPG
,

Greyhound
13-10-2005, 07:55 PM
Enza are making an "aggressive" stand in chasing more growers to supply them.This is positive news for strapped growers.I can tell you that my boss has had a broader smile on his dial in the last 24 hours.The 'anti' has been upped twice this week from first Enza and now his previous exporter.

truedragon
14-10-2005, 02:11 AM
Anybody in the know think that GPG will go in and clean up the management and hopefully make this co more profitable?

Commodity price suppose to be good with inflation everywhere... what's going on?

DISC: hold quite a lot

Raptor
20-04-2006, 08:16 AM
There has been a bit of buying by directors and their wives lately. Do they know something that we don't?
TUR pays a 12 cent dividend in 2 weeks time but that can hardly be the reason.

Greyhound
29-04-2006, 11:39 PM
quote:Originally posted by Raptor

There has been a bit of buying by directors and their wives lately. Do they know something that we don't?
TUR pays a 12 cent dividend in 2 weeks time but that can hardly be the reason.


Could be because(believe it or not) there is a shortage of apples this season-as much as 20% in one particular variety.That'll help the price per carton,not to mention the $.

Phaedrus
30-04-2006, 08:57 AM
Here is an update of the chart posted on page 3 of this thread. Some more long-term indicators have been added, giving eight altogether. They are :-
1. Longterm trendline.
2. Directional Movement Indicator (40)
3. Variable Moving Average (50)
4. Relative Strength Index (60)
5. Slow Stochastic oscillator (100)
6. Simple Moving Average (105)
7. Exponential Moving Average (110)
8. Triangular Moving Average (125)

The blue arrows mark BUY signals - all of these separate indicators triggered within a few days and a few cents of each other. Since then, TUR has been rising at about 2% per week and is up 30% so far. Price action has now reached a previous resistance level.

The On Balance Volume clearly showed the "big money" getting out of TUR ahead of the slump in March 2005, but did not pick up the recent insider buying mentioned by Raptor. I guess smart money is not invariably big money. All too often we assume that these are one and the same.

http://h1.ripway.com/Phaedrus/TUR430001.gif
Chart edited 30/4/06 to enable identification of individual moving averages. I received a complaint!

Misc
30-04-2006, 07:22 PM
Shortage of apples ??? Where ?? Certianly not in key markets like Europe USA and Taiwan.
The returns should be better this year , but the apple industry is still fundamentally bankrupt !!

Misc

Footsie
30-04-2006, 08:41 PM
I recently added this stock to my p/f.

It always gives me great confidence when Directors by substantial stakes. When people have their own money on the line, they'll always work harder.

When the div is paid, theres likely to be some weakness in s/p. perhaps back to 2.40

Greyhound
01-05-2006, 08:04 PM
quote:Originally posted by Misc

Shortage of apples ??? Where ?? Certianly not in key markets like Europe USA and Taiwan.
The returns should be better this year , but the apple industry is still fundamentally bankrupt !!

Misc


Germany.

Footsie
01-05-2006, 09:04 PM
Closed today above the 2.60 resistance level

Phaedrus
07-07-2006, 12:28 PM
After firing off a bunch of "Buy" signals early this year, TUR has gone into a nice uptrend. There is now a confirmed trendline in place and price action breaking below this would give a "Sell" signal. (As would a break of the Trailing stop plotted in Magenta) A 50 day ema would be yet another suitable exit indicator. The 4 moving averages that provided such good entry points have been left behind and are too far below current price action to give timely exit signals. I charted so many different types of moving average to show that the type of ma you use is not critical. All 4 worked well and gave signals very close together.

The current trendline has a slope equivalent to TUR rising at a rate of over 100% annually. Clearly this is too steep to be sustained. I have got an exit strategy - have you?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v418/789456/TUR77001.gif

Footsie
09-07-2006, 02:30 PM
Phaedrus

Are you actually admitting you own this stock?
Because it would be the first time i've ever heard you say such a thing. A slip perhaps?

My strategy. sell when the price approaches my valuation. or if i feel the price is sufficiently overheated that it would be prudent to sell

Phaedrus
09-07-2006, 03:23 PM
Yes, Footsie - I hold TUR. Whether I hold or not, the chart is the same!

The first time you've ever heard me admit to holding a specific stock? I guess you are a fairly new ShareTrader participant. I could give you plenty of examples where my position has been no secret. FBU, CAV, CEN, NPX, STU, WAM to name but a few. My exit from SCT was very public and quite gruelling! I once even listed every stock that I held both here and on the ASX. I think perhaps you have been sucked in by McDunks periodical ranting and chest-beating propaganda!

It's good that you have an exit strategy - what is your current valuation for TUR?

Footsie
09-07-2006, 07:38 PM
I have actually been a member here since 2000
but i haven't been on all that often over that time, hence the number of posts and also why i don't know your trading history

anyway...

DCF valuation of $5.02

However, dont forget they have another $2.90 worth of property.

so if this were a grant samuel valuation the number would be more like $7.92


DCF of $5.02 gives an EV of $372m... and a current EV/EBITDA of 9.3x

Compare that to other similar businesses and its not expensive...

I know plenty of Aussie PE firms who'd pay 10x EV/EBITDA for this firm, plus then there is the value of property.

So why isnt TUR a takeover target....GPG would never sell, well not unless the offer was well north of $6 i'd say.

winner69
24-08-2006, 06:06 PM
Footsie ... not that inspiring 1/2 year result or commentary was it

I see the share price hanging around this mark for some time now until performance sort of catches up with it ... just got ahead of itself

I take it Phaedrus is still on holiday so he won't be updating that chart ... but I have a feeling he wouldn't be holding at the mo

Footsie
24-08-2006, 08:56 PM
YEah winner it was a little uninspiring wasn't it.

I still believe the real value in the stock lies with a the properties they hold....

in the current commercial property market it would be easy to sell the whole lot, and i do note they've flicked one off for 12m
$200m in property assets, which is more than the current m/cap

GPG are in for the long haul and my take is they will strip this down so its lean and mean, maybe even flog of one or two of the businesses. aka twr.

to be honest i was only expectin 15-20% growth and they should be able to deliver that in the full year. their first half is always the weakest.

Footsie
22-01-2007, 08:48 PM
It's on the move !!!

winner69
23-01-2007, 05:57 AM
Metro moves the market again ... should have been more patient mate

Hell, T&G don't know why according to this story .... they should monitor sharetrader


Share price spike puzzles Turners & Growers

Tuesday January 23, 2007

By Stephen Ward

Fresh produce company Turners & Growers is mystified by a spike in its share price which has followed a jump in buying last week.

NZX data showed more than 222,000 shares changed hands on a single day last week at below $2.50.

That was the highest daily turnover by far since early last month.

The price climbed as high as 25c to $2.75 yesterday before ending the day up 20c at $2.70. But volume was low at 27,000 shares.

The $2.75 price compared with a high of $2.80 and a low of $2 in the past year, while net tangible assets were at $2.73, NZX data showed.

Turners & Growers chief financial officer Paul Alston said yesterday the company - about 60 per cent owned by GPG - was not sure of the reason for the price spike or who was responsible for last week's buying.

"We haven't heard anything."

Brokers contacted yesterday were also puzzled.

Alston suspected the spike might be because the stock was not very liquid.

In its most recent half-year report, Turners & Growers recorded a 22 per cent lift in unaudited pre-tax profit to $7.2 million for the six months to June last year.

metro
23-01-2007, 04:53 PM
Its becoming quite a habit!! I'm enjoying it! All my stocks doing quite well at the moment. :)


quote:Originally posted by winner69

Metro moves the market again ...

Footsie
23-01-2007, 08:12 PM
Metro

If only this were true ha! You could have some real fun

BTW how big is your portfolio in $ terms?

What else is in your portfolio?

I have a few other names that i think may move in the next 3 months.....

but i'll wait till you are ready to pounce !!;)

metro
24-01-2007, 07:17 PM
Footsie:

FBU (long term hold), RNS, CHA, KID and now TUR, the last four through my family trust (short term holdiings).
Looking at FIN but other than that....I would love some fresh ideas to research and get my teeth into.

Footsie
24-01-2007, 09:08 PM
Metro

I realised today i have 22 stocks in my p/f and no cash

This is getting out of hand...... i'm now Deworsified!!

Its hard to think of any to sell though, i like them all !!

the worst performing is a small olive oil coy on the asx. RLA they are destined for big things. bought at 33c now 25c. I phoned the ceo to check their performance was on track recently and bought more today
at 25c this stock could easily be $1 in 2 years. Its in a downtrend currently and picking the bottom is imposssible. But my small cap experience with CHA and KID tells me to be patient.

My favourite NZX pick is still ABA, i think it has the potential to trade on a p.e of 25 like RYM. Implying in 12 months it could be $4 +
I also think DGL is a takeover target............. and will probably go this year or next

Finally TUR is worth a lot more than 2.60 IMHO, i note Aspiring Asset hold them too.

winner69
25-01-2007, 05:48 AM
Interesting that the share price just happens to move a week after the execs get 1 million options exercised at $2.75 as part of their incentive plan

Suddenly their rewards for doing well just got easier to achieve

Never mind ... they are now 'incentivised' to get the share price up now ..... maybe sell that property off now eh footsie

Just a cynical observation on a Thursday morning

Footsie
27-02-2007, 08:11 PM
nice result out today
market liked it too.... $17m NPAT

they must have had a big 2nd half

Bonus issue too.... :D
Which will be good if the price holds

oh and 14c div ....

Toot toot.......

Been a 10 month wait for me..... but looks like it was worth it

oh and property revals up too..

Still with me on this one Metro?

Footsie
04-03-2007, 09:10 PM
Through $3 at last...

winner69
24-05-2007, 05:38 PM
Even allowing for the bonus issue TUR looking a bit weak at the mo being more than 10% of its recent high.

Looking at a long term chart last time it reached a decent peak it almost halved in price over the next year or so .... surely not this time around?

Footsie
24-05-2007, 09:22 PM
TUR have moved on since then

..... i'm confident Santa will deliver

i'd say realistically they shuld be able to deliver 15-20% profit growth this year and next
which means div growth too.

Phaedrus
25-05-2007, 09:52 AM
W69, TUR seems to specialise in 50% retracements. The most recent one is marked here in blue. If this pattern continues, the current downtrend ought to reverse at about $2.29.

This is NOT a prediction - I'm not a Fibonacci type of guy.

http://h1.ripway.com/Phaedrus/TUR525001.gif
(This chart has been corrected for the recent 1 for 5 bonus issue).

winner69
25-05-2007, 12:14 PM
Interesting there was a period of consolidation at around the 50% mark when TUR went from 280 to 140 odd in 2005.

Fibonacci type of things based on things that happen in nature but amazing how often Fibonacci things pop up in stock charts

Where appropriate and there does seem to be regular cycles Fibonacci things always worth a look at

Footsie
26-05-2007, 03:51 PM
nice head and shoulders top....

perhaps 2.35 will provide support.

i know there a few insto's keen on this stock
and with a p/e of 12.7 15-20% eps growth and 6% div its not expensive

Lizard
01-04-2010, 08:23 PM
Many company annual reports are a word-for-word match with the prelim announcement, so of little interest beyond the glossy pics. However, some aren't, so it's often worth a quick flick. In this case, the comments of MD, Jeff Wesley, appear considerably brighter than the prelim Tony Gibbs version. Worth noting under outlook:

"The new year has started surprisingly well, with very satisfactory profits being generated in January and February"
Although bearish on the state of the global economy:

"...I believe the economic recovery in western countries, including New Zealand, will be another 2-3 years in the making"
And finally:

Domestic Markets all point to a much better 2010 than 2009. If ENZA International and ENZA Foods have a much better 2010, then it could prove a very profitable year indeed.

Worth noting that the 2009 result of $8.6m NPAT to equity holders looks to have been after $5.1m of forex losses included in operating expenses. In addition, there was a net gain of $3.3m in reserves arising from revaluations of property assets. Taking these into account, and a brighter outlook, TUR does not look as expensive at $1.46 as the superficial profit figures suggest - perhaps forward P/E of under 10.5?

Given P/S of 0.26 and Pr/NTA at 0.57 (with a large propoertion of asset value being covered by property and liquid assets), I suggest putting it back on the "buy" list for a recovery. Though, given their large holding, some might prefer to wait until GPG's plan for unlocking value from their shares emerges to consider any potential impact.

Lizard
13-04-2010, 07:41 AM
Stuff - NZ Apple Growers in WTO Win (http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/3573529/NZ-apple-growers-in-WTO-win-reports)

Probably not worth more than perhaps a brief sp blip for now, but could be a future positive for TUR in it.

Lizard
10-06-2010, 07:17 PM
An amusing twist today as a note attached to the Notice of Meeting shows a shareholder has put forward a proposal for directors to request PWC to look at options for splitting up TUR to extract value... isn't this exactly what we'd have expected major shareholder, GPG, to be doing with TUR? Seems the shareholders are tired of waiting...

Lizard
12-08-2010, 04:24 PM
HY result out today - seasonal business, so not easy to extrapolate to a FY forecast. Debt/cashflow swing wildly between halves too. Seems they are always full of big plans, yet so slow to show much for them - perhaps typical of most of the larger pies GPG seem to have had their fingers in for the past few years.

My best guess is for a forward P/E about 9 - 9.5 at $1.40 (excluding depreciation tax adjustments). Price to NTA reduced by the depreciation changes, but still about 0.66 - either their valuations are a little generous or they need to extract more value from their assets. Cheap but dull - and hard to get inspired. If their forecast for improved profit can be trusted, then perhaps they make a fair hold with an eye to FY turnaround...

percy
12-08-2010, 04:41 PM
HY result out today - seasonal business, so not easy to extrapolate to a FY forecast. Debt/cashflow swing wildly between halves too. Seems they are always full of big plans, yet so slow to show much for them - perhaps typical of most of the larger pies GPG seem to have had their fingers in for the past few years.

My best guess is for a forward P/E about 9 - 9.5 at $1.40 (excluding depreciation tax adjustments). Price to NTA reduced by the depreciation changes, but still about 0.66 - either their valuations are a little generous or they need to extract more value from their assets. Cheap but dull - and hard to get inspired. If their forecast for improved profit can be trusted, then perhaps they make a fair hold with an eye to FY turnaround...

Does not sound as though you think they "are well positioned" for the upturn Lizard.! Dull hold.!!! lol.

Lizard
01-12-2010, 07:00 AM
After a backwards blip with kiwifruit PSA, comes an upward blip with another step forward in the move to sell apples into Australia:

Growers Jubilant at Apple Win - Stuff.co.nz (http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/4403527/Growers-jubliant-at-apple-win)

Difficult to compute the value for TUR, though I think Apples are the largest contributor to revenue. Presumably what is good for NZ apples is good for TUR.

Also, here an interesting link to MAF 2010 forecasts (apples page 34):
http://www.maf.govt.nz/mafnet/rural-nz/statistics-and-forecasts/sonzaf/2010/2010-sonzaf.pdf

A few factors align to suggest a good year for TUR in 2012... seems at lower end risk for longer term hold, but "dull hold" is correct!

Lizard
20-01-2011, 11:39 AM
Not many sellers around for TUR of late - perhaps a result of the Aussie floods. One source here suggesting prices of some fruit and vege items could quadruple there.

Australia's Flood Losses could be New Zealand's Gain (http://www.freshfruitportal.com/2011/01/10/australias-flood-losses-could-be-new-zealands-gain/)

Lizard
20-04-2011, 09:50 AM
Announcement of a "strategic review" aimed at improving the share price seems to have a few takers. Not sure that pulling out the $2.50 NTA is enough of a reason to claim it is cheap - that just highlights that the return on capital for this operation is sub-par, even taking into account the growth plans in place.

However, I hold - and picked it in the comp this year - so I'm not too bearish on TUR in the short term. I believe they have established a good footing to grow profits from - and perhaps a strategic review could find a way to free up some of the less productive capital in the business?

Lizard
29-08-2011, 04:26 PM
Turners half year result out - down on pcp at NPBT level, partly due to high NZD, but also a notable increase in administration expenses. This extra $7m is only explained by the comment:

Overheads have increased from 2010 due mainly to higher than expected professional fees. These are one-off in nature and not expected to continue in future years.

Presumably that means much of this cost increase is associated with the previously announced strategic review process, which is designed to realise value. So the update to the review is:


STRATEGIC REVIEW
As investors are aware the company has been conducting a strategic review during this period. The objective of this review is to identify ways in which to get the full value recognition for shareholders. The company is engaged with a number of parties which have expressed interest in the business.

So strategic review, (as is often the case) is really just a euphemism for "find a buyer for the business so our major shareholder can exit"? After all, the market price of TUR's shares might have been quite simply improved by letting an extra $7m slip through to the bottom line...

I guess the price would have to be good to achieve it, but would be disappointing to see old TUR go full takeover to an overseas buyer, given their holdings of NZ property and plant variety rights.

winner69
10-11-2011, 09:24 AM
Bloody foreigners again ... and germans at that .... and 185 seems cheap but GPG prob happy

Snoopy
11-11-2011, 11:32 AM
Bloody foreigners again ... and germans at that .... and 185 seems cheap but GPG prob happy


The BayWa offer was a 9% premium to the closing price of $1.70 on November 9th. Not exactly generous and IIRC way under the net asset backing of the company. I hope enough shareholders will reject the offer so that this company remains listed in NZ. Other bidders interested but this was the best price GPG could get. I do hope the sales process was robust and not a give away at all costs as happened with the other Turner's (Auctions).

I see in the Dompost that a local oufit "Elevation Capital" have been buying since January 2009 at an average cost of $1.35 per share. MD Chris Swasbrook was quoted as saying.

"We'll just accept and move on. Sometimes it is better to move on in these situations and that is our plan."

Did a quick search on Elevation Capital to find out more about them and came up with this:

"Elevation Capital Management Limited was established in 2006 and since inception has focused on a disciplined approach to value investing. This means as investment managers we focus primarily on undervalued assets, balance sheet strength, and dividends."

Sounds good, but why are they content to sell of this one so cheaply, at a time of historically low profitability, and at well below NTA? Is this yet another concern with a Warren Buffet cover that is really a mask for ill disciplined trading? They should sack their staff and employ Lizard I reckon.

Basically the deal hands over control of the downstream distribution chain and intellectual property of NZ's apple crop to outsider control! Surely not a good deal for growers in this country?

SNOOPY

Lizard
10-08-2012, 11:00 AM
TUR got halfway there with "a relentless upward trajectory"... unfortunately, it was for the NZD exchange rate, not their profits or share price!

winner69
16-12-2012, 02:51 PM
Most of the management team and oio asking a few questions

Baywa firmly in control

In a year that the nz market has seen really big gains minority shareholders in tur been left lamenting. ......perils f being a minority I assume

Anybody still holding?

noodles
12-08-2013, 09:03 PM
It is worth revisiting this one? Eps for the 6 months were announced quietly after hours on thursday night.

Eps = 14c. With a share price at 1.65, we could be in for a massive re-rating once the full year results come in.

Cashflows are terrible, but looking at last years reports, they make up for it in the second half.

Liquidity is poor.

The results included some gains on sale of property.

Any thoughts?

Disc: am holding tur.nz

Dej
12-08-2013, 10:24 PM
It is worth revisiting this one? Eps for the 6 months were announced quietly after hours on thursday night.

Eps = 14c. With a share price at 1.65, we could be in for a massive re-rating once the full year results come in.

Cashflows are terrible, but looking at last years reports, they make up for it in the second half.

Liquidity is poor.

The results included some gains on sale of property.

Any thoughts?

Disc: am holding tur.nz

While Australia goes into a resource based recession, New Zealand could go into a soft commodity boom because of the free trade agreement with China. Potentially on my watch list.

"Liquidity is poor." - thats an understatement!!

Snow Leopard
14-09-2016, 01:42 PM
Just noticed a few SSH notices for TGG and as they mention Tiger Ventures NZ I thought I had better check whether I had been sleep selling again.

But it is definitely not me.

So something else agricultural that now has a significant Chinese shareholder.

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

winner69
19-12-2018, 07:42 AM
Still struggling to grow profits

Suppose chart tells the story

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/TGG/328609/292711.pdf

kiora
19-12-2018, 09:22 AM
Still struggling to grow profits

Suppose chart tells the story

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/TGG/328609/292711.pdf

Hmmm cyclical agricultural stock.How soon before this disappears to overseas ownership as well?

mfd
06-08-2020, 12:01 PM
Not a lot of interest on this one here, but a nice result from TGG today. Revenues, profit and net assets all up nicely and a great result from the Apple division thanks to chartering a ship for their European apples to sidestep the covid disruption. Even after the 10% bounce in share price today, this trades at a 14% discount to net tangible assets.

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/357513

Joshuatree
06-08-2020, 03:27 PM
Pretty impressive recovery from last half (although lumpy by nature i guess)there mfd to my shallow graze.S/P up re 7% atp. A good sector to be exposed to and there ain't many on the NZX.

iceman
02-09-2020, 07:52 AM
Deleted deleted

SCOTTY
02-09-2020, 08:06 AM
Interesting reading https://businessdesk.co.nz/article/retail/turners-car-yard-fight-rolexes-muscle-cars-and-late-night-texts

Hi iceman
I think this article should be on the TRA site
Cheers

turnip
26-11-2020, 05:08 PM
A 6 cent interim dividend declared toay, a sign of confidence ahead of the NZ apple harvest?

(I have a small holding in TGG.)

nztx
27-11-2020, 02:53 PM
A 6 cent interim dividend declared toay, a sign of confidence ahead of the NZ apple harvest?

(I have a small holding in TGG.)


Anyone else see that NZX have this recorded as 600.00 cps & Imputation Crs similarly overstated
on the NZX Dividends List ? ;)

https://www.nzx.com/markets/NZSX/dividends

TGG 03 Dec 2020 Interim 600.000c 0.000c 233.333c 11 Dec 2020 NZD

The Thread Title here probably needs fixing for corrected new TGG NZX Ticker too ..

JSwan
27-11-2020, 07:21 PM
It’s ridiculous how the data on the NZX website are often wrong, flashback to incorrect NTA saga

Ggcc
28-11-2020, 03:13 AM
It’s ridiculous how the data on the NZX website are often wrong, flashback to incorrect NTA saga
Maybe that woman from Westpac works there. The one that gave millions away by accident

LaserEyeKiwi
01-03-2021, 09:36 AM
Interesting reading today of the annual report.

Any ideas on dividend going forward? will they stick with just a 6c dividend?

mfd
18-06-2021, 09:02 AM
Back to two 6c dividends a year, currently sitting on a gross yield of about 5.7%.

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/374139

777
18-06-2021, 09:20 AM
Wrong thread

nztx
21-06-2021, 08:57 PM
Thread looks correct

Same beast - with a New Name - 'T&G Global Ltd' and New Ticker - TGG - since opening posting in 2004
here, I believe ..

- Am I correct - '777' ? ;)

777
22-06-2021, 03:39 PM
Thread looks correct

Same beast - with a New Name - 'T&G Global Ltd' and New Ticker - TGG - since opening posting in 2004
here, I believe ..

- Am I correct - '777' ? ;)

Sorry. It was me who posted on the wrong thread. Thought I was on TRA. Dumb eh?

mfd
22-06-2021, 03:58 PM
Sorry. It was me who posted on the wrong thread. Thought I was on TRA. Dumb eh?

Don't worry about it, we're just glad to have some kind of action in this thread. The last 20 or so posts cover 8 years...

Getty
22-09-2021, 01:12 PM
No, its not Easter, but I thought I would resurrect this thread.

The Germans Bay wa hold @74%, the Chinese co @20% hoo ha, and outside the top 20, the puha only own 2.47%.

Must be ripe for buyout, or are the Germans snookered?

Under takeover rules, if the Germans t/o the Chinese, then the puha have to go too., ie, 90% thresh hold.

If the Germans were happy to buy 74%, surely they would want the rest.

Jay
22-09-2021, 02:40 PM
wrong thread -oops

Ggcc
22-09-2021, 02:43 PM
I read the other day that AutoSelect is closing their Auckland and CH CH yards and Fleet partners, owners of AutoSelect, will send their ex-lease cars to Turners to sell - should be a boost for them
Wrong thread. But hey nice to see TRA getting more advertising

Jay
22-09-2021, 02:44 PM
Just realised that GGcc - will amend

Getty
22-09-2021, 02:58 PM
Nah, you fella's took the wrong Turn.

Tina is on the other yard, with all the other patina's.

nztx
22-09-2021, 08:18 PM
Nah, you fella's took the wrong Turn.

Tina is on the other yard, with all the other patina's.


but didn't she say the Internet is everywhere ? ;)

kiora
26-10-2021, 07:55 AM
"A new apple orchard worth about $18 million has been planted on the outskirts of Napier."
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/revealed-plans-for-new-18m-napier-apple-orchard/66665ZNDLEXNIMSUYCCUQJS4ZI/?utm_source=ST&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=ShareTrader+AM+Update+for+Tuesday+26+ October+2021

Onion
26-10-2021, 08:38 AM
"A new apple orchard worth about $18 million has been planted on the outskirts of Napier."
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/revealed-plans-for-new-18m-napier-apple-orchard/66665ZNDLEXNIMSUYCCUQJS4ZI/?utm_source=ST&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=ShareTrader+AM+Update+for+Tuesday+26+ October+2021

Someone's calculator must have broken! :confused:


Watters said the orchard will produce an estimated four million tonnes of apples a year in the future.

That is off 40 hectares of planted apples.


In 2020, the export volume of apples produced in New Zealand amounted to around 402 thousand metric tons. New Zealand exported apples to 80 different countries in that year.

New Zealand: export volume of apples 2020 | Statista (https://www.statista.com/statistics/1008394/new-zealand-apple-production-national-exports/)

40 hectares of apples.... producing 10 times NZ's total export volume.

Tonnes? Trays? Both start with "t".

Sideshow Bob
12-02-2024, 08:07 AM
Thread dredge, but this has got to hurt.....

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/425985

The Board of Directors of T&G Global Ltd advises that Group Profit for the 2023 financial year is now forecast to be a loss before income tax of between ($60.0) to ($67.0) million.
This compares to the outlook provided on 18 May 2023 which indicated a full year loss before income tax for the 2023 financial year between ($28.0) to ($34.0) million which was based on the initial assessment of the losses, and the expected insurance recovery to be recognised in the 2023 financial year.
The main reason for the variance is that the complexity of the insurance claim from the damage caused by Cyclone Gabrielle has caused delays in finalising the value of the insurance claim receivable at balance date.
The Company expects to announce its 2023 full-year results to the market on 29 February 2024.

kiora
12-02-2024, 11:03 AM
Thread dredge, but this has got to hurt.....

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/425985

The Board of Directors of T&G Global Ltd advises that Group Profit for the 2023 financial year is now forecast to be a loss before income tax of between ($60.0) to ($67.0) million.
This compares to the outlook provided on 18 May 2023 which indicated a full year loss before income tax for the 2023 financial year between ($28.0) to ($34.0) million which was based on the initial assessment of the losses, and the expected insurance recovery to be recognised in the 2023 financial year.
The main reason for the variance is that the complexity of the insurance claim from the damage caused by Cyclone Gabrielle has caused delays in finalising the value of the insurance claim receivable at balance date.
The Company expects to announce its 2023 full-year results to the market on 29 February 2024.

Takeover time then?

Ggcc
12-02-2024, 11:38 AM
Takeover time then?
In all honesty who would have the kahoonas to buy a business that is reliant on 3-5 months worth of harvest to make money, then this harvest has just had the hardest year in History for the bay with the cyclone and then climate change happening with seasons getting shorter for apples due to increased temperatures and rain forecasts. I wouldn’t buy this company for a dollar unless they created a new variety of fruit that would not be upset by the idea of Mother Natures wrath. Ps I have worked for these guys before. Some of the Management is not bad and from what I hear they are getting rid of the difficult ones. Some of the old guard still believe stat holidays can just be days you change to suit the company.

kiora
12-02-2024, 01:27 PM
There largest shareholder ?

BAYWA AG
90,671,206 73.99 % 113 M $

Ggcc
12-02-2024, 02:31 PM
There largest shareholder ?

BAYWA AG
90,671,206 73.99 % 113 M $
I don’t feel they would sell, but I was advised by a manager that TGG was a great investment. They were very wrong and in the know. I never invested as I saw what maybe he was missing in the field and in the pack houses

Sideshow Bob
29-02-2024, 08:02 AM
Ouch!! :scared:

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/427070

Cyclone-related loss clouds positive strategic progress
At a glance:
• Revenue: $1.33 billion, up from $1.30 billion
• Operating (loss)/profit: ($45.6 million), down from $20.4 million
• Net loss before tax: ($64.2 million), down from ($3.3 million)
• Net loss after tax: ($46.6 million), down from ($0.9 million)