Direct Broking

[rainey]

Does anyone know when direct takes over from ANZ Some months ago, there was great urgency to register and get details in order but we havn"t heard any more

[couta1]

Does anyone know when direct takes over from ANZ Some months ago, there was great urgency to register and get details in order but we havn"t heard any more Dec 7th is the changeover.

[rainey]

Dec 7th is the changeover.

Thanks for that

[777]

Placed a buy order at about 10.09 this morning. Account says placed at 10.11. It is now 10.51 and has yet to appear on depth page. Some shares traded at 10.14 at my bid and the buy price queue has grown with my order yet to show. Emailed them for explanation. Yet to receive a reply.

A market is when all bids and offers are shown. If not shown then it is not a market.

[whatsup]

Placed a buy order at about 10.09 this morning. Account says placed at 10.11. It is now 10.51 and has yet to appear on depth page. Some shares traded at 10.14 at my bid and the buy price queue has grown with my order yet to show. Emailed them for explanation. Yet to receive a reply.

A market is when all bids and offers are shown. If not shown then it is not a market.

I always phone them up if there are issues they don't mind .

[777]

Left the order in for an hour. No change so cancelled it.

Replaced the order. It took 5 minutes before it showed on the depth page. This did not matter in this case but in a quick moving market I would have been annoyed at the delay in placing and showing in the market.

[bull....]

Left the order in for an hour. No change so cancelled it.

Replaced the order. It took 5 minutes before it showed on the depth page. This did not matter in this case but in a quick moving market I would have been annoyed at the delay in placing and showing in the market.

this is a common issue with brokers in nz , there is no such thing as direct to market order on the nzx for retail clients. they will first check to see if they can match your order in house then they will check to make sure your order will not distort the market then they may place your order. in a fast moving market crash most people will not be able to exit quickly.

[777]

this is a common issue with brokers in nz , there is no such thing as direct to market order on the nzx for retail clients. they will first check to see if they can match your order in house then they will check to make sure your order will not distort the market then they may place your order. in a fast moving market crash most people will not be able to exit quickly.

Yet I put a sell order in a few minutes ago and already have the contract note.

This is what I expect.

I think in my earlier order that it was simply forgotten about in their processing.

Still no reply from email sent.

[littletramp]

Hi 777, I had the virtually the same experience yesterday, with processing an order which show up as placed on the screen but not showing in the market depth for some time so I rang one of their traders. It turns out that there is a manual component involved at their end to put an order through to the markets. They were short staffed yesterday due to January holidays and were struggling to keep up with the amount of orders.
Hence if there is ever a rush for the exits, we are no show to get an order in the queue.

[forest]

Yet I put a sell order in a few minutes ago and already have the contract note.

This is what I expect.

I think in my earlier order that it was simply forgotten about in their processing.

Still no reply from email sent.

Don't hold you breath for a reply. I send a e-mail more than a week before Christmas and you guessed ..............no reply.

[t.rexjr]

Is CHI-X no longer quoted in the depth and sales?

(Answer yes it does but not until market open it would seem)

[kizame]

I was asked to complete a survey on improvements to the platform before the sale went through,by first nz capital,none of the improvements for traders ever happened,the only difference they added shareclarity which I couldn't care about anyway.
So same old same old I'm afraid,it takes forever to to see your order go to depth,even if you buy or sell at bid or ask it takes ages to go through.
I sent an email and told them I was totally unimpressed with it. My main hope was that the data would go live,but no such luck.

[t.rexjr]

I was asked to complete a survey on improvements to the platform before the sale went through,by first nz capital,none of the improvements for traders ever happened,the only difference they added shareclarity which I couldn't care about anyway.
So same old same old I'm afraid,it takes forever to to see your order go to depth,even if you buy or sell at bid or ask it takes ages to go through.
I sent an email and told them I was totally unimpressed with it. My main hope was that the data would go live,but no such luck.

It's straight out hopeless for trading. The data is live. Your orders simply aren't placed until the broker is back from their coffee/toilet break. Took them 41 minutes to place a market sell once. I now only use them for my looooong term investments where it's unlikely that I'll need to take hasty action.

[couta1]

It's straight out hopeless for trading. The data is live. Your orders simply aren't placed until the broker is back from their coffee/toilet break. Took them 41 minutes to place a market sell once. I now only use them for my looooong term investments where it's unlikely that I'll need to take hasty action. It's hopeless if you want to buy quickly on a sudden dip like with A2 earlier today but otherwise I find the slowness often works in my favor on the sell side(A few minutes not 41) they do have other problems with their platform which are not good.

[Beagle]

I find the way they use their discretion with my orders extremely irksome and slowness to market is often very problematic.
Maybe ASB securities is better now days, it wouldn't be hard to be lol
Only improvement is the call account interest rate of 2% for over $50K which is nice. Share clarity is completely useless in my opinion.

[t.rexjr]

I find the way they use their discretion with my orders extremely irksome and slowness to market is often very problematic.
Maybe ASB securities is better now days, it wouldn't be hard to be lol
Only improvement is the call account interest rate of 2% for over $50K which is nice. Share clarity is completely useless in my opinion.

ASB is instant so use them for trading activities. I find the Direct Broking interface better though so view my trade goings on via DB and literally just use ASB to place the order

[forest]

I find the way they use their discretion with my orders extremely irksome and slowness to market is often very problematic.
Maybe ASB securities is better now days, it wouldn't be hard to be lol
Only improvement is the call account interest rate of 2% for over $50K which is nice. Share clarity is completely useless in my opinion.


Aaron McGrath
Client Experience Manager
Aaron joined FNZC in 2018 as Client Experience Manager in the Direct Wealth division as part of the Direct Broking acquisition (originally ANZ Securities). He is responsible for ensuring our Direct Broking clients have a seamless and world class experience from account opening (on-boarding) through to client queries and trade executions.

Prior to joining FNZC, Aaron worked in various roles at ANZ Bank. Starting in 2001, he worked in Institutional Operations leading International Payments and Market Operations teams. He was part of the integration of ANZ NZ Securities (formerly Direct Broking Limited) into ANZ Market Operations in 2013 and most recently has been Operations Manager of ANZ NZ Securities covering equity and fixed interest settlements, Client On-boarding (account opening) and the Client Service Team.

Outside of work, Aaron enjoys restoring classic cars and will jump at any opportunity to head out on the water in summer.

[Vaygor1]

ASB is instant so use them for trading activities. I find the Direct Broking interface better though so view my trade goings on via DB and literally just use ASB to place the order

I was a dedicated long-term fan of ASB Securities, but completely left them about a year ago.

Direct Broking are yet to prove themselves inept (if they in fact are) but I eventually found ASB Securities hopeless to deal with. It took a great deal of work and 5 months to get myself out from under the Margin Lending stranglehold they had on me. I feel so relieved to have done so. So far I've had no problems with ANZSecurities/Direct Broking.. fingers crossed.

[forest]

I was a dedicated long-term fan of ASB Securities, but completely left them about a year ago.

Direct Broking are yet to prove themselves inept (if they in fact are) but I eventually found ASB Securities hopeless to deal with. It took a great deal of work and 5 months to get myself out from under the Margin Lending stranglehold they had on me. I feel so relieved to have done so. So far I've had no problems with ANZSecurities/Direct Broking.. fingers crossed.

DB used to get orders to market within 1 or 2 minutes. Now at times it can take the best part of an hour.
I even have had an Buy order partly filled, and the balance of the order not showing up on the debt. Subsequent transactions were lower than my buy order which was being ignored, then the price jumped and I had to increase the buy offer to get it filled.
I suspect that they tried to fill the order in house.

On top of that it seems returning e-mails is not a priority, still waiting for an answer of an e-mail send in December.
Yesterday and today I tried to get hold of Aaron McGrath, the Client Experience Manager by phone no luck.
I am not impressed.
Sad sad way how direct broking seem to be loosing the plot. :(

[777]

Send all the principal's a link to this thread.

[forest]

Send all the principal's a link to this thread.

Great, lets hope DB will step up to the mark improve their systems and participate in the discussion.

[blackcap]

DB used to get orders to market within 1 or 2 minutes. Now at times it can take the best part of an hour.
I even have had an Buy order partly filled, and the balance of the order not showing up on the debt. Subsequent transactions were lower than my buy order which was being ignored, then the price jumped and I had to increase the buy offer to get it filled.
I suspect that they tried to fill the order in house.

On top of that it seems returning e-mails is not a priority, still waiting for an answer of an e-mail send in December.
Yesterday and today I tried to get hold of Aaron McGrath, the Client Experience Manager by phone no luck.
I am not impressed.
Sad sad way how direct broking seem to be loosing the plot. :(

They probably do not care. No money in the traditional retail client side of things anyway. So they can ignore you and hope you go away. And if they do they go great, that's another customer that makes us no money that we do not have to worry about. Maybe a bit cynical or sarcastic maybe, but I wonder if there is any money in making $30 a trade with NZ retail punters with all the costs involved. Real money to be made elsewhere of course.
So why did FNZC purchase Direct Broking off ANZ? Probably for the database of clients to be able to sell their IPO's and other products to. And after a year when brokerage may go up, plenty may leave and try ASB out for size. Not sure if I even am correct here but that is how I see it.
If there was real money to be made in NZ selling brokerage at $30 a pop there would be more operators out there. But there are not. Access could not do it back in the day and went under and Direct back in the day was not a cash cow. It did ok but that was about it.

[dodgy]

They probably do not care. No money in the traditional retail client side of things anyway. So they can ignore you and hope you go away. And if they do they go great, that's another customer that makes us no money that we do not have to worry about. Maybe a bit cynical or sarcastic maybe, but I wonder if there is any money in making $30 a trade with NZ retail punters with all the costs involved. Real money to be made elsewhere of course.
So why did FNZC purchase Direct Broking off ANZ? Probably for the database of clients to be able to sell their IPO's and other products to. And after a year when brokerage may go up, plenty may leave and try ASB out for size. Not sure if I even am correct here but that is how I see it.
If there was real money to be made in NZ selling brokerage at $30 a pop there would be more operators out there. But there are not. Access could not do it back in the day and went under and Direct back in the day was not a cash cow. It did ok but that was about it.
Hi Blackcap,
I use a site in the USA for US stuff and they are trade commission free.
Check out Firstrade.
Regards,
-dodgy

[kizame]

It's straight out hopeless for trading. The data is live. Your orders simply aren't placed until the broker is back from their coffee/toilet break. Took them 41 minutes to place a market sell once. I now only use them for my looooong term investments where it's unlikely that I'll need to take hasty action.

Sorry but on my PC and their platform the data isn't live,on my TA platform (tradingview)the data is live and changes as price and volume changes,it isn't on direct broking unless you refresh.

[Xerof]

Is CHI-X no longer quoted in the depth and sales?

(Answer yes it does but not until market open it would seem)

Thats simply because CHI-X don't run pre-open and close auction processes

I had always found ANZ SEC order processing appalling, but it seems it's got even worse. I have never had a problem with ASB, as they use Straight through Order Processes, but their exchange rates are usurious

[couta1]

They probably do not care. No money in the traditional retail client side of things anyway. So they can ignore you and hope you go away. And if they do they go great, that's another customer that makes us no money that we do not have to worry about. Maybe a bit cynical or sarcastic maybe, but I wonder if there is any money in making $30 a trade with NZ retail punters with all the costs involved. Real money to be made elsewhere of course.
So why did FNZC purchase Direct Broking off ANZ? Probably for the database of clients to be able to sell their IPO's and other products to. And after a year when brokerage may go up, plenty may leave and try ASB out for size. Not sure if I even am correct here but that is how I see it.
If there was real money to be made in NZ selling brokerage at $30 a pop there would be more operators out there. But there are not. Access could not do it back in the day and went under and Direct back in the day was not a cash cow. It did ok but that was about it. Make no mistake they will be making money with a lot of ability to match orders in house and double clip the ticket.

[kizame]

I think there are a lot on here that maybe havn't paid $30 for a trade for a long time,myself included,because they trade bigger quantities,I actually tried to get my brokerage dropped without any luck, because I did think with the antiquated system they have,and with the extra pain of not knowing for ages whether your trade has gone through or not,it was just such easy money for them.And lets remember that's in and out, of a trade.

[blackcap]

Make no mistake they will be making money with a lot of ability to match orders in house and double clip the ticket.

How is that double clipping the ticket? There is a buy order, yours, and a sell order someone else's. If they match you both off in house its $30 bucks a pop or $60. If they buy yours on market and sell the other order on market its still $30 each. So not really double clipping is it.

[couta1]

How is that double clipping the ticket? There is a buy order, yours, and a sell order someone else's. If they match you both off in house its $30 bucks a pop or $60. If they buy yours on market and sell the other order on market its still $30 each. So not really double clipping is it. Your assuming that both buyer and seller are DB clients yet a lot of the time they are only gaining the $30 from one side of the transaction unless both buyer and seller are DB clients.They have a far wider matching ability now with FNZC on tap and a much bigger pool of easily accessible clients for matching orders.

[forest]

Your assuming that both buyer and seller are DB clients yet a lot of the time they are only gaining the $30 from one side of the transaction unless both buyer and seller are DB clients.They have a far wider matching ability now with FNZC on tap and a much bigger pool of easily accessible clients for matching orders.

You right Couta and that I think works in DB clients disadvantage.
It seems when a order is placed that FNZC is trying to trade the order in house, this can give time delays maybe an hour or so.
They are creating 2 problems with that, firstly the market can move agains you. But of even more concern is the extra time spend wondering if the order has been actioned on and /if the order is completed or needs adjusting.

[blackcap]

Your assuming that both buyer and seller are DB clients yet a lot of the time they are only gaining the $30 from one side of the transaction unless both buyer and seller are DB clients.They have a far wider matching ability now with FNZC on tap and a much bigger pool of easily accessible clients for matching orders.

no disagree. FNZC owns DB (DB is FNZC) so still no double clipping as you had put it. Sorry but the only reason I can think of for matching in house is to get better outcomes for both sets (or at least one) of clients.

Ie you say sell my TRA down to 2.28 for an order or 100k. FNZC know they also have a buyer wanting to buy x amount that day at all sorts of prices ranging from 2.30 to 2.33. They might then fill your sell order at 2.31 with the client so that you get a better deal and the client picks up some at a good price too.

[couta1]

no disagree. FNZC owns DB (DB is FNZC) so still no double clipping as you had put it. Sorry but the only reason I can think of for matching in house is to get better outcomes for both sets (or at least one) of clients.

Ie you say sell my TRA down to 2.28 for an order or 100k. FNZC know they also have a buyer wanting to buy x amount that day at all sorts of prices ranging from 2.30 to 2.33. They might then fill your sell order at 2.31 with the client so that you get a better deal and the client picks up some at a good price too. We will agree to disagree, we seem to be looking at things very differently, regardless they are making heaps.

[blackcap]

We will agree to disagree, we seem to be looking at things very differently, regardless they are making heaps.

Fair enough.

What I am not happy about with DB is the amount of time it takes to get the order to market. And there are no excuses for that whatsoever.

When I used to work for DB as a broker (long time ago now) when an order came in you were supposed to get it to market within 30 seconds. See the order, check if there are other DB orders it could be matched with, if so, do the match, if not, execute the order on screen.
I am guessing that since most FNZC orders will not be on the screen to start with it can be a complicated mess asking all the other brokers "do you have a buyer for xxx" or does anyone have a seller for "xxx". Especially if said broker is out to lunch or on a call.
At DB we did have institutional brokers but they usually told us what they were looking for to buy or sell so you had a pretty good idea of what could be in house matched. Sometimes I did put something on the screen (executed a trade) to have a broker angrily come and say "i had a client who wanted those" but generally it worked fine.

[Onion]

Fair enough.

What I am not happy about with DB is the amount of time it takes to get the order to market. And there are no excuses for that whatsoever.

When I used to work for DB as a broker (long time ago now) when an order came in you were supposed to get it to market within 30 seconds. See the order, check if there are other DB orders it could be matched with, if so, do the match, if not, execute the order on screen.
I am guessing that since most FNZC orders will not be on the screen to start with it can be a complicated mess asking all the other brokers "do you have a buyer for xxx" or does anyone have a seller for "xxx". Especially if said broker is out to lunch or on a call.
At DB we did have institutional brokers but they usually told us what they were looking for to buy or sell so you had a pretty good idea of what could be in house matched. Sometimes I did put something on the screen (executed a trade) to have a broker angrily come and say "i had a client who wanted those" but generally it worked fine.

You describe mechanisms that computers do very well very quickly.

[Beagle]

Fair enough.

What I am not happy about with DB is the amount of time it takes to get the order to market. And there are no excuses for that whatsoever.



It is very concerning. I am also deeply concerned with the cultural difference between how ANZ securities ran the business and FCNZ.
FCNZ take an extremely liberal approach to using their market discretion. Let me post a good example. The other day I placed a small top up order for 1500 Synlait with a $9.68 limit. There were several thousand on offer at that price. It did not appear to be processed for about 10 minutes so I phoned to find out what was going on.
Best bid was $9.62 and the previous days close was $9.56 (down 32 cps). I was told the didn't want to hit the bid at $9.68 because that would involve an untoward movement in the share price.
They want stability and order in the market, or words to that effect. This seems bizarre given the previous days share price decline. I hardly think a trade that adds 12 cents to the share price after a 32 cents per share decline the day before is disorderly or inappropriate in any way.
My response. Well if the share price runs away north I expect you have a legal obligation to fill my order at $9.68 and I'll be looking to enforce that obligation. As long as its clear the risk is on FCNZ that's fine. The order was filled at $9.65 about 2 hours later but the point is I placed an order at a price limit for immediate execution and they delayed it for reasons that I think are unreasonable.
This discretion thing they have and use is really getting on my nerves.

[bull....]

It is very concerning. I am also deeply concerned with the cultural difference between how ANZ securities ran the business and FCNZ.
FCNZ take an extremely liberal approach to using their market discretion. Let me post a good example. The other day I placed a small top up order for 1500 Synlait with a $9.68 limit. There were several thousand on offer at that price. It did not appear to be processed for about 10 minutes so I phoned to find out what was going on.
Best bid was $9.62 and the previous days close was $9.56 (down 32 cps). I was told the didn't want to hit the bid at $9.68 because that would involve an untoward movement in the share price.
They want stability and order in the market, or words to that effect. This seems bizarre given the previous days share price decline. I hardly think a trade that adds 12 cents to the share price after a 32 cents per share decline the day before is disorderly or inappropriate in any way.
My response. Well if the share price runs away north I expect you have a legal obligation to fill my order at $9.68 and I'll be looking to enforce that obligation. As long as its clear the risk is on FCNZ that's fine. The order was filled at $9.65 about 2 hours later but the point is I placed an order at a price limit for immediate execution and they delayed it for reasons that I think are unreasonable.
This discretion thing they have and use is really getting on my nerves.

they are following nzx rules , these very silly rules discourage trading hence why i do more overseas now than nz

[forest]

It is very concerning. I am also deeply concerned with the cultural difference between how ANZ securities ran the business and FCNZ.
FCNZ take an extremely liberal approach to using their market discretion. Let me post a good example. The other day I placed a small top up order for 1500 Synlait with a $9.68 limit. There were several thousand on offer at that price. It did not appear to be processed for about 10 minutes so I phoned to find out what was going on.
Best bid was $9.62 and the previous days close was $9.56 (down 32 cps). I was told the didn't want to hit the bid at $9.68 because that would involve an untoward movement in the share price.
They want stability and order in the market, or words to that effect. This seems bizarre given the previous days share price decline. I hardly think a trade that adds 12 cents to the share price after a 32 cents per share decline the day before is disorderly or inappropriate in any way.
My response. Well if the share price runs away north I expect you have a legal obligation to fill my order at $9.68 and I'll be looking to enforce that obligation. As long as its clear the risk is on FCNZ that's fine. The order was filled at $9.65 about 2 hours later but the point is I placed an order at a price limit for immediate execution and they delayed it for reasons that I think are unreasonable.
This discretion thing they have and use is really getting on my nerves.

Frustrating, if the same happens with a sell order than your funds are locked up for this extra time, that can easily prevent you from timely putting the next buy order in.
We are experience investors/traders, we are the market and we should decide if share prices are flat lining, go up or down slow or fast. We do not want baby sitting by our broker, full stop.

[forest]

I would be surprised if it was NZX rules causing such extreme delays. Trades used to go to market within seconds. Read blackcap post, he is an ex DB broker employee.

[Beagle]

Frustrating, if the same happens with a sell order than your funds are locked up for this extra time, that can easily prevent you from timely putting the next buy order in.
We are experience investors/traders, we are the market and we should decide if share prices are flat lining, go up or down slow or fast. We do not want baby sitting by our broker, full stop.

Exactly Forest. What on earth is wrong with a 12 cents share price rise on a $9.56 share, only a little over 1% when ATM the same morning was up 50 cents per share.
Do they realise that these two companies fortunes are inextricably linked or don't they care about timely execution of orders ?
Maybe its time to revisit the idea of dealing with ASB securities even though their brokerage rates are a bit higher...

Agree with your last post too. Oder execution is extremely slow...not enough staff. They fully deserve to lose a significant amount of business if they continue to conduct themselves in this manner. No point emailing Fiona McKenzie their so called head of operations because she never replies or returns phone calls.
https://www.fnzc.co.nz/direct-broking-team/

[bull....]

In ensuring their trading conduct promotes and helps maintain an orderly market, NZXParticipants consider a range of circumstances relevant to the current conditions of the marketfor any financial product. Accordingly, in allowing each Order to proceed through to the market,NZX Participants must first determine (among other things): Whether the execution of that Order is consistent with the recent trading activity in therelevant financial product; andGUIDANCE NOTE – TRADING CONDUCT – MARCH 2018 6 of 32 Whether the execution of that Order will materially affect the price or market for therelevant financial product.1

https://s3-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/nzx-prod-c84t3un4/comfy/cms/files/files/000/003/333/original/Trading_Conduct_%28March_2018%29.pdf


silly nzx rules discourage trading

[kizame]

Exactly Forest. What on earth is wrong with a 12 cents share price rise on a $9.56 share, only a little over 1% when ATM the same morning was up 50 cents per share.
Do they realise that these two companies fortunes are inextricably linked or don't they care about timely execution of orders ?
Maybe its time to revisit the idea of dealing with ASB securities even though their brokerage rates are a bit higher...

Agree with your last post too. Oder execution is extremely slow...not enough staff. They fully deserve to lose a significant amount of business if they continue to conduct themselves in this manner. No point emailing Fiona McKenzie their so called head of operations because she never replies or returns phone calls.
https://www.fnzc.co.nz/direct-broking-team/

I havn't had this but this mornings trade,should have been electronically instant,they do come up with BS excuses,last time I enquired why it took so long for orders to even appear I was told that they had to check my csn no. now common(anz sec)in this digitally enhanced age.
I am starting to think that what happened to you was more not ruffling FNZC managed clients holdings,I don't know just a thought.

[Beagle]

In ensuring their trading conduct promotes and helps maintain an orderly market, NZXParticipants consider a range of circumstances relevant to the current conditions of the marketfor any financial product. Accordingly, in allowing each Order to proceed through to the market,NZX Participants must first determine (among other things): Whether the execution of that Order is consistent with the recent trading activity in therelevant financial product; andGUIDANCE NOTE – TRADING CONDUCT – MARCH 2018 6 of 32 Whether the execution of that Order will materially affect the price or market for therelevant financial product.1

https://s3-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/nzx-prod-c84t3un4/comfy/cms/files/files/000/003/333/original/Trading_Conduct_%28March_2018%29.pdf


silly nzx rules discourage trading

Thanks for posting the link. Section 3 "Orderly Markets" On a quick review I note the examples they give refer to a 20% price increase and a 14% price decrease respectively. The example I gave above refers to a 1.25% price increase on Synlait and was well within the scope of the price the shares traded at during the previous days trading range. I would therefore conclude that Direct Broking wrongly used their discretion in the example I posted above and are in breech of their fiduciary obligation to put their clients best interests first. I felt that at the time which is why I warned them, (all calls are recorded) that if the order wasn't filled at $9.68 the risk was on them and I would expect them to honour my buy order at that price.

I think there is a MAJOR cultural difference between FCNZ trading as Direct Broking and the former ANZ securities and I find it very annoying.

[777]

Time for another online broker to appear.

[bull....]

Thanks for posting the link. Section 3 "Orderly Markets" On a quick review I note the examples they give refer to a 20% price increase and a 14% price decrease respectively. The example I gave above refers to a 1.25% price increase on Synlait and was well within the scope of the price the shares traded at during the previous days trading range. I would therefore conclude that Direct Broking wrongly used their discretion in the example I posted above and are in breech of their fiduciary obligation to put their clients best interests first. I felt that at the time which is why I warned them, (all calls are recorded) that if the order wasn't filled at $9.68 the risk was on them and I would expect them to honour my buy order at that price.

I think there is a MAJOR cultural difference between FCNZ trading as Direct Broking and the former ANZ securities and I find it very annoying.

if you dont think they are implementing the rules satisfactory i think there is a disapline panel you can complain to who will investigate.

i got sick and tired of this silly rules ruining my trading on nzx and after all my complaints to broker where just we follow the rules etc i decided oh well more money for overseas brokers

[airedale]

In the past I have used Etrade on the ASX {but not for some time}. Trades were lightning fast. Orders were filled in no time. and contract notes followed very quickly.

[blackcap]

I would be surprised if it was NZX rules causing such extreme delays. Trades used to go to market within seconds. Read blackcap post, he is an ex DB broker employee.

NZX rules do state you have to ensure an orderly market and cannot place bids offers that are too far removed from market etc. Not set in stone as such but some brokers adhere to these guidelines more strictly than others. Say the bid is 20 cents and offer is 50 cents and last trade was at 22 cents. Most brokers would not execute an order to buy at 50 cents.

[blackcap]

I havn't had this but this mornings trade,should have been electronically instant,they do come up with BS excuses,last time I enquired why it took so long for orders to even appear I was told that they had to check my csn no. now common(anz sec)in this digitally enhanced age.
I am starting to think that what happened to you was more not ruffling FNZC managed clients holdings,I don't know just a thought.

They do have to check CSN if you are selling to ensure that the shares are there available to sell. But should take no longer than 30 seconds.

[RTM]

Time for another online broker to appear.

Like Halifax ?

[forest]

NZX rules do state you have to ensure an orderly market and cannot place bids offers that are too far removed from market etc. Not set in stone as such but some brokers adhere to these guidelines more strictly than others. Say the bid is 20 cents and offer is 50 cents and last trade was at 22 cents. Most brokers would not execute an order to buy at 50 cents.

Yeah, I understand that.
I am talking about the normal spread, a few cents her or there and a share price over 10 dollars ea. RYM

[forest]

Time for another online broker to appear.

Yes, I agree.

[Beagle]

NZX rules do state you have to ensure an orderly market and cannot place bids offers that are too far removed from market etc. Not set in stone as such but some brokers adhere to these guidelines more strictly than others. Say the bid is 20 cents and offer is 50 cents and last trade was at 22 cents. Most brokers would not execute an order to buy at 50 cents.

Best bid $9.62 but broker won't execute a buy order at $9.68 just 6 cents more suggests to me that the wheels have well and truly come off at so called "Direct" Broking. Just 0.6% higher when the share moved in a 32 cent range the previous day...for goodness sake...what they did was actionable and I would have done exactly that if my order didn't get filled at $9.68 or under.

Not the first time either, the previous day I placed an order for some HLG shares at $4.34 to ensure in the opening match process I got a fill.
They dialed the order back to $4.30 of their own volition and I didn't get a fill. Some barking ensued later that morning and I demanded they give me a fill at the opening match price of $4.31.
Sure there was a jump on the opening bid but they had just issued a trading update !

[bull....]

direct broking, asb just as bad each other. pitiful state of broking and nzx rules in nz. look at the pitiful volumes on such a big news day

[Onion]

They dialed the order back to $4.30 of their own volition and I didn't get a fill. Some barking ensued later that morning and I demanded they give me a fill at the opening match price of $4.31.

Not wise to get between Beagle and a bowl of HLG.

[gbogo]

this is very concerning to me. i have had similarly disquieting experiences as the Beagle hasnhadbwith FNZC. They swear they are using discretion to do the best they can but I don’t feel comfortable with it, because i know i am small fry and i know they will always look after the big guys first.

however, i was told “if you want DMA and instant satisfaction etc, use Direct Broking when we buy them”, which I was considering doing for my active trading, at least. But not if this is how it works.

In addition, IIRC, the NZX is concerned about the growing % of off-market crossings and if DB orders are sucked into the FNZC pool, that % is going to grow even higher.

And be in no doubt, a broker loves it when they get both sides of the trade. fees and info.

[RTM]

This is all very concerning, thanks for sharing, I really had no idea that they could play god like this. When you add the off-market transactions to this picture...well..do we really have a market at all ? Does anyone know how this compares with the ASX ?

[ordop]

The market is changing significantly and the NZX will/should be worried - not that some of their employees seemed concerned last year when I talked to them about it. The FNZ have the breadth of the market now ~ 50% market share (retail, advisory, wealth, insto). FNZ are now a market themselves really. The market that you see displayed by the NZX now is a very opaque looking market. Craigs will hold orders to fill inhouse, For Barrs will do the same as they're both obviously competing with FNZC for flow and so the only broker now showing orders to market in any real fashion is ASB Sec. Also, the NZX looked to install some new broker rules last year around the restriction of crossings. After lobbying from brokers the NZX implemented a watered down version which restricts crossings under $50k in value - this in effect stopped ANZ securities and ASB securities doing crossings as most of their flow is smaller than $50k but FNZC, Craigs and For Barrs just bundle the orders up over time and cross when larger than $50k - hence the slow time to market.

[t.rexjr]

This is all very concerning, thanks for sharing, I really had no idea that they could play god like this. When you add the off-market transactions to this picture...well..do we really have a market at all ? Does anyone know how this compares with the ASX ?

The ASX is the Wild West and about as un-orderly as it gets.

[forest]

The market is changing significantly and the NZX will/should be worried - not that some of their employees seemed concerned last year when I talked to them about it. The FNZ have the breadth of the market now ~ 50% market share (retail, advisory, wealth, insto). FNZ are now a market themselves really. The market that you see displayed by the NZX now is a very opaque looking market. Craigs will hold orders to fill inhouse, For Barrs will do the same as they're both obviously competing with FNZC for flow and so the only broker now showing orders to market in any real fashion is ASB Sec. Also, the NZX looked to install some new broker rules last year around the restriction of crossings. After lobbying from brokers the NZX implemented a watered down version which restricts crossings under $50k in value - this in effect stopped ANZ securities and ASB securities doing crossings as most of their flow is smaller than $50k but FNZC, Craigs and For Barrs just bundle the orders up over time and cross when larger than $50k - hence the slow time to market.

Mm, thanks ordop your post explains the following. I had an order filled with direct broking but no combination in the recent trades column would combine to the number of shares I had purchased. The trade was slow so it is likely it was held up for the reason your outlined.
Is this allowed by the NZX rules?

[Vaygor1]

All my bad experiences have been with ASBSec so far, and I have plenty of examples. Only joined ANZ Sec about Oct last year and cut all ties with ASBSec.

My worst experience was when ASBSec refused outright to carry out my instruction to purchase a $10k share parcel for a price 0.2c/share higher than the previous day's close, but 0.2c/share lower then the previous days intra-day high.... nothing short of pathetic.

Direct Broking and ASBSec are as bad as each other by the looks but Direct Broking hasn't let me down yet.

Just when did these brokering companies stop performing brokerage services to become puppets of the NZX? Rather than looking after their customers, they are now focussed on policing trade activities and seem hell bent on opposing market forces in the interest of 'stability'.

[silu]

Too often, like now, an unexpected error has happened.

[Timesurfer]

I thought it was just me not knowing how to play the game.
I have on a number of occaisions thought that if (as ASB imlied) the pocket money I am playing with is enough to manipulate or break the NZSX then I probably shouldn't have any money in it!

[t.rexjr]

Just missed scooping up a share parcel that was dropped on market 10% lower than last trade due to DB not processing order requests. 25 min and counting. The next sell parcel is 25% higher than that dropped parcel. WTF is wrong with these muppets

40 minutes...

60 minutes...

1hr 20 minutes...

2hrs...

4hrs and finally the request was processed!

Oop, my mistake, it was actually 5hrs...

[whatsup]

Just missed scooping up a share parcel that was dropped on market 10% lower than last trade due to DB not processing order requests. 25 min and counting. The next sell parcel is 25% higher than that dropped parcel. WTF is wrong with these muppets

To be sure of picking up a special such as that one t.r I think best if you do a phone transaction as Im picking that the now owners are playing "funny games " !

[couta1]

It's been a hopeless week for any trading with a data delay of 10 mins or more on the NZX all week.

[bull....]

looks like the brokers are creaming the spread on you db clients lol or slippage bit here and there adds up too many millions over time

[airedale]

I just rang the DB trading desk to enquire about a sell order sitting there for about an hour. There is a problem with their Aussie provider UBS so no trading is possible and there is no end in sight.

[BobbyMorocco]

Something pretty strange happened to me on Direct Broking today too. I received a contract note for a buy order that was partly filled. I thought this was strange as I didn't think the share price dropped to my buy price all day. I checked the market depth and it says that no trades went through at my buy price - the lowest trade of the day was 1c higher. Looked at my portfolio and it includes the same amount of shares from the contract note but when I look at my orders it says the completed quantity is zero, as I would expect it to be. I'm not sure if I own these shares or not now. I'm certainly not going to pay for them until someone can verify if it's a mistake or a legitimate purchase.

[couta1]

Something pretty strange happened to me on Direct Broking today too. I received a contract note for a buy order that was partly filled. I thought this was strange as I didn't think the share price dropped to my buy price all day. I checked the market depth and it says that no trades went through at my buy price - the lowest trade of the day was 1c higher. Looked at my portfolio and it includes the same amount of shares from the contract note but when I look at my orders it says the completed quantity is zero, as I would expect it to be. I'm not sure if I own these shares or not now. I'm certainly not going to pay for them until someone can verify if it's a mistake or a legitimate purchase. The completed quantity showing zero doesn't mean your order hasn't transacted.

[Beagle]

Something pretty strange happened to me on Direct Broking today too. I received a contract note for a buy order that was partly filled. I thought this was strange as I didn't think the share price dropped to my buy price all day. I checked the market depth and it says that no trades went through at my buy price - the lowest trade of the day was 1c higher. Looked at my portfolio and it includes the same amount of shares from the contract note but when I look at my orders it says the completed quantity is zero, as I would expect it to be. I'm not sure if I own these shares or not now. I'm certainly not going to pay for them until someone can verify if it's a mistake or a legitimate purchase.

Makes you wonder if they give you just a very few at your low buy price just to clip the ticket for $30 brokerage. I have wondered this on more than one occasion.

[blackcap]

Something pretty strange happened to me on Direct Broking today too. I received a contract note for a buy order that was partly filled. I thought this was strange as I didn't think the share price dropped to my buy price all day. I checked the market depth and it says that no trades went through at my buy price - the lowest trade of the day was 1c higher. Looked at my portfolio and it includes the same amount of shares from the contract note but when I look at my orders it says the completed quantity is zero, as I would expect it to be. I'm not sure if I own these shares or not now. I'm certainly not going to pay for them until someone can verify if it's a mistake or a legitimate purchase.

I dare say the term "contract note" implies it is a legitimate purchase. But I would definitely ask them for an explanation as to what happened. NZX not going to be happy if they are doing trades and not showing them on screen.

[777]

The following is on the website now trying to justify their interference in actioning what orders we place.

I don't want their so called expertise. I just want my orders actioned when I place them.

Latest Update - Placing a high volume or complex order?
For significant orders, either in terms of size or complexity, the Direct Broking trading team leverage’s FNZC’s extensive market depth and coverage to achieve the best possible outcome for our clients. This means it may take a little longer to process these orders, but we believe our capital markets expertise will give you the best outcome for your portfolio. close

[RGR367]

The following is on the website now trying to justify their interference in actioning what orders we place.

I don't want their so called expertise. I just want my orders actioned when I place them.

Latest Update - Placing a high volume or complex order?
.......................

You're right. What's the difficulty in placing a high volume buy/order transaction? And what's a complex order? Are they in the process of accepting multi-nested IF and AND limit orders now?

[777]

You're right. What's the difficulty in placing a high volume buy/order transaction? And what's a complex order? Are they in the process of accepting multi-nested IF and AND limit orders now?

This is a problem of a full service brokerage getting involved with an online brokerage. The reason I started using an online one is simply because I did want anything to do with a full service one. They forget that we are the market and the system is not for their benefit to manipulate.


I have emailed them to tell them that I don't think they should play with clients orders in this way.

[BobbyMorocco]

I dare say the term "contract note" implies it is a legitimate purchase. But I would definitely ask them for an explanation as to what happened. NZX not going to be happy if they are doing trades and not showing them on screen.

Well I just spoke with one of the team at Direct Broking and you guys were right. It was a legitimate purchase but the guy I spoke to could not explain how they were able to fill some of my order at a buy price that was about 3% lower than the lowest price these shares supposedly traded for on Friday.

I did wonder about them just doing it to clip the ticket and pick up the brokerage, but then I thought they could have given me a much smaller parcel of shares and still done this. In the end it wasn't an insignificant amount that I received.

I'm also still a bit confused as to why it doesn't show up that they partly filled my order when I look at my outstanding orders. Usually they show. Oh well :confused:.

[bull....]

The following is on the website now trying to justify their interference in actioning what orders we place.

I don't want their so called expertise. I just want my orders actioned when I place them.

Latest Update - Placing a high volume or complex order?
For significant orders, either in terms of size or complexity, the Direct Broking trading team leverage’s FNZC’s extensive market depth and coverage to achieve the best possible outcome for our clients. This means it may take a little longer to process these orders, but we believe our capital markets expertise will give you the best outcome for your portfolio. close

matching orders in house means more profit for brokers

[777]

matching orders in house means more profit for brokers

I have no problem with that but don't sit on an order for some length of time to achieve that.

[bull....]

I have no problem with that but don't sit on an order for some length of time to achieve that.

your right its totally un acceptable not to put an order straight to market if there is a seller at the price you want

[RTM]

your right its totally un acceptable not to put an order straight to market if there is a seller at the price you want

“high volume or complex order?”
They need to define what this. And if our orders are not within the parameters, process them promptly. This stinks IMO,

[glennj]

your right its totally un acceptable not to put an order straight to market if there is a seller at the price you want

I phoned them a few weeks ago about my internet order not showing in the depth yet there being a seller willing to sell at the price I was prepared to pay. They
told me they were bundling my order with others to try and get me a lower price thru. a wholesale buy. I replied that they were not my instructions and that
I expected them to put thru. my orders as submitted. I gave them till the end of the day to secure my order at cheaper than my bid price to which they agreed
but soon after speaking with them my buy offer turned up in the depth as per my original order. It seemed a bit shonky at the time but I did not lay a complaint
and it has not happened on a subsequent purchase of shares in the same company. Not actioning my original order probably cost me what would have been a good buy as the
price moved up in the period that my order was not submitted.

[kizame]

Honestly it's a shonky platform,I really thought they were going to move it ahead when they bought the company, today my trading view platform has the correct price whereas direct broking even after refreshing several times is 1 cent behind,very very poor in my opinion.

[thestg]

Has been good with me. Updating quickly, I put a buy order in for SPK this morning, it showed in the Bids in less than a minute, 5 minutes later the trade was complete & 15 minutes after that my contract note arrived in my Email.

[SilverBack]

Placing orders on ASX is abysmal and it seems that a Limit Order status is returned when their ASX broker accepts the order but this is before the order has actually been placed on the ASX. This is shonky and deceptive.
I would very much like to open an account with an Aussie broker and also need an Aussie bank account for this. I used to have a bank account but it was closed by nthe bank when the anti-money laundering rules came in. I have not yet found how I can get a new account since I am not Aussie resident. Can anyone give advice on this?

[jg8512]

silverback, like a lot of others I suspect, i use CBA and CommSec. no problems joining both as an NZ resident, they've been good to deal with, and no issues. the only thing I don't like is they off-market matching of your orders - not always thru the exchange, but does happen quickly.

[SilverBack]

Thanks jg, I will check it out. Others I looked only accept AU residents.

[voltage]

yes, I use commsec too, also no issues

[Onion]

yes, I use commsec too, also no issues

Do you deal directly with commsec? Or via ASB Securities?

ASB Securities sign you up with a Commsec account too. Their web site (https://www.asb.co.nz/asb-securities/shares.html) says:


If you buy Australian shares through us, your shares will be held by Commonwealth Securities in your name and registered to your Holder Identification Number (HIN). This is known as a CHESS-sponsored holding. If you have share trading accounts with different Australian brokers, you’ll have a HIN for each broker. When you join ASB Securities, we also register you with Commonwealth Securities so you can trade on Australian markets

[jg8512]

ASB use Commsec but charge their own fees, etc. What voltage and I are suggesting (and doing) is bypasssing the middleman and using Commsec direct. I suspect there are quite a few people in that category.

I have a Commsec account (CDIA - Commsec Direct Investment A/c I think it stands for), and a bank account at CBA. I can log onto CBA or COmmsec, and access all accounts etc and broking thru that one log-in. I pay no bank or account fees, and get minimal interest (~2% pap), and get pretty reasonable broker rates.



Do you deal directly with commsec? Or via ASB Securities?

ASB Securities sign you up with a Commsec account too. Their web site (https://www.asb.co.nz/asb-securities/shares.html) says:

[bull....]

yes i have 2 brokerage a/c's in aus by passing nz brokers and brokerage is great .1% commissions on asx trades

[couta1]

yes i have 2 brokerage a/c's in aus by passing nz brokers and brokerage is great .1% commissions on asx trades .1 % is better than the large volume rate in NZ, still no point in getting a cheaper rate with a company like Halifax and losing all your capital, at least both no frills broking companies in NZ are rock solid.

[voltage]

I deal with commsec direct. You need a CBA bank account. Did this on a trip to Australia. I may be wrong but you may need a physical address, I use a relative over there for this. Commsec is not the cheapest but the cheapest is not always the best as indicated by couta1.

[bull....]

.1 % is better than the large volume rate in NZ, still no point in getting a cheaper rate with a company like Halifax and losing all your capital, at least both no frills broking companies in NZ are rock solid.

are you saying comsec is not secure , i think they are more secure than nz brokers and they charge .12% for asx trades its about the going rate in aus around .1 - .12%

[couta1]

are you saying comsec is not secure , i think they are more secure than nz brokers and they charge .12% for asx trades its about the going rate in aus around .1 - .12% I didnt mention Commsec only Halifax which obviously wasn't secure and who knows whether all of the many no frills broking companies in Aussie are or not. PS-I doubt you can get much more secure than ASB or FNZC when it comes to no frills outfits.

[SilverBack]

yes i have 2 brokerage a/c's in aus by passing nz brokers and brokerage is great .1% commissions on asx trades
Can you name the brokers and indicate if an account can be opened using a NZ address?

[SilverBack]

I didnt mention Commsec only Halifax which obviously wasn't secure and who knows whether all of the many no frills broking companies in Aussie are or not. PS-I doubt you can get much more secure than ASB or FNZC when it comes to no frills outfits.

The issue is not their financial security although FNZC has a lower credit rating than ANZ Securities which had ANZ Bank behind it. The issue is the adverse effect of having an Aussie broker between the NZ broker and the ASX. Under ANZ Securities these impacts were noticeable in terms of delays in getting orders posted but these have worsened under FNZC and there have been other issues whereby access to the ASX quotes/depth has been lost or delayed. I have lost deals becasue of these issues and as a result have lost tolerance with DirectBroking.

[bull....]

Can you name the brokers and indicate if an account can be opened using a NZ address?

no names of whom i with but i did open them with a nz address , was a long time ago i dont know if things have changed you would need to do your own research by contacting brokers your interested in doing bussiness with.

[bull....]

I didnt mention Commsec only Halifax which obviously wasn't secure and who knows whether all of the many no frills broking companies in Aussie are or not. PS-I doubt you can get much more secure than ASB or FNZC when it comes to no frills outfits.

halifax had separate businesses in aus / nz most nz people would have had accounts in nz

[couta1]

The issue is not their financial security although FNZC has a lower credit rating than ANZ Securities which had ANZ Bank behind it. The issue is the adverse effect of having an Aussie broker between the NZ broker and the ASX. Under ANZ Securities these impacts were noticeable in terms of delays in getting orders posted but these have worsened under FNZC and there have been other issues whereby access to the ASX quotes/depth has been lost or delayed. I have lost deals becasue of these issues and as a result have lost tolerance with DirectBroking. I only trade NZX stocks and although some are dual listed and I could use a different broker for them the whole currency conversion thing comes into play so just not worth going elsewhere.The reason the brokerage fees are higher apart from the lack of competition is due to the fee gouging by NZX themselves. PS-I agree the problems have been a real pain in the rear end.PPS-Just had a detailed look at the Commsec fee structure and as always the devil is in the detail eg they charge a platform data fee and $1.95 for a posted contract note for a start(Yes I'm old school and like all my contract notes sent out in paper form)

[RTM]

halifax had separate businesses in aus / nz most nz people would have had accounts in nz

The businesses weren’t as separate as they should have been !

[Beagle]

Speed to market should materially improve for the next two and a bit weeks. A really prolific trader I know has gone on holiday.

[iceman]

DB running a survey to find out what they can do better. Open util 25 March. Good opportunity to voice the concerns raised on this forum guys and gals

[QOH]

DB running a survey to find out what they can do better. Open util 25 March. Good opportunity to voice the concerns raised on this forum guys and gals

Bit of a rip off, i did it within about 15 minutes of getting email, get to the end and they tell you all the free trades have gone.

[Beagle]

Bit of a rip off, i did it within about 15 minutes of getting email, get to the end and they tell you all the free trades have gone.

The sign of a real mean spirited company. Size of the reward completely out of kilter with the number of clients and expected respondents. Everyone doing the survey should get a free trade.

[777]

They are obviously not asking everyone as I have 3 accounts and no emails.

[Sideshow Bob]

Asked me and I've never traded with them - only because I had an ANZ Securities account.

[QOH]

The sign of a real mean spirited company. Size of the reward completely out of kilter with the number of clients and expected respondents. Everyone doing the survey should get a free trade.
It wouldnt have been so bad if they hadnt even mentioned the freetrades if they had already gone, just annoying to say at the very end, they have all gone.

[Beagle]

Speed to market should materially improve for the next two and a bit weeks. A really prolific trader I know has gone on holiday.

Interesting they do this survey on the same day their top trader leaves for an extended overseas holiday...I won't name the person and breech their confidence.

I have a fair bit to say to them so will do the survey in due course.

[Snow Leopard]

...and breech their confidence.

You already have with the rest of your statements. :t_down: :t_down: :t_down:


...I have a fair bit to say to them so will do the survey in due course.

I am sure they are looking forward to that. :t_up: :D :t_up:

PS: I was a secret agent, but I can not tell you who for.

[Jantar]

It wouldnt have been so bad if they hadnt even mentioned the freetrades if they had already gone, just annoying to say at the very end, they have all gone.
I got the message at the beginning of the survey that the free trades had gone and asked if I would continue with the survey anyway.

[sb9]

Anyone having issues with ASB Sec log in this morning.

[swissboy]

Yes , it goes sometimes only. Error message other times

[bull....]

it amazes me a bank that makes millions in profits has a platform that crashes quite frequently

[sb9]

it amazes me a bank that makes millions in profits has a platform that crashes quite frequently

Its appalling to say the least.

[blackcap]

Its appalling to say the least.

The thing is, in NZ there is pretty much no competition for brokers. So they can really do what they want. No wonder many are looking over towards the ASX and US exchanges. NZX is a bit slow on the uptake and continues to suffer.

[sb9]

The thing is, in NZ there is pretty much no competition for brokers. So they can really do what they want. No wonder many are looking over towards the ASX and US exchanges. NZX is a bit slow on the uptake and continues to suffer.

Think its about time some reputable overseas firm (AUS) to offer a trading platform, I'm sure most on this forum would give their business to them.

[blackcap]

Think its about time some reputable overseas firm (AUS) to offer a trading platform, I'm sure most on this forum would give their business to them.

They probably would, but no way fees would be any less than the $30 per trade it is currently. Thank the NZX for that one.

[Leftfield]

They probably would, but no way fees would be any less than the $30 per trade it is currently. Thank the NZX for that one.

It is only a matter of time before an broker like this (https://investing.robinhood.com) comes to NZ.

I suspect the recent survey by DB is aimed equally at both improving their offering and preventing disruption from a large outside investor. (oops broker)

[blackcap]

It is only a matter of time before an broker like this (https://investing.robinhood.com) comes to NZ.

I suspect the recent survey by DB is aimed equally at both improving their offering and preventing disruption from a large outside investor.

Maybe, it is already possible with CFD's but to actually own shares in your own name is still pricy. Sharesies, invest now etc do aggregate and there is no brokerage (well $30 per year) but you cannot determine the price you pay for your orders so trading is pretty much out and the offerings are limited. If they were to offer their services on all stock I dare say the fees would have to increase markedly as the NZ market is just not big enough.
Not sure how the robin hood concept would work in the NZ framework. I know from experience that the "discount" brokers are not charging overly exorbitant fees thanks to the NZX.

[Jay]

Maybe if the NZX lowered their fees they might get a few more investors/traders (as long as the broking firms reduced their prices as well of course) - wonder if they have thought of that - sort of build it and they will come. Could say the same may apply to Sky, though rather than coming stop them from going.

[777]

There are obviously some young people on here. I can remember paying between 1.5% and 2.5%.

.2% is quite acceptable.

Sorry for being an old f..t.

[bull....]

There are obviously some young people on here. I can remember paying between 1.5% and 2.5%.

.2% is quite acceptable.

Sorry for being an old f..t.

in a world of declining brokerage rates .2% is considered very high by world standards

[777]

in a world of declining brokerage rates .2% is considered very high by world standards

We are still a very small market which doesn't help. I doubt anyone decides not trade due to the cost of brokerage.

[okay]

I just completed the DB survey. I mostly hammered home the request for the ability to have exposure to other overseas share markets (besides asx) at reasonable rates, it is quite farcical the current situation in NZ. I hope others have or will also ask for this. Cheers.

[peat]

There are obviously some young people on here. I can remember paying between 1.5% and 2.5%.

.2% is quite acceptable.

Sorry for being an old f..t.

lol yeh of course I dont want to overpay but I find DB's rates very acceptable. Less happy with Craigs though to be honest. But I'm just a minnow and am wary of overtrading so not the greatest of customers really.

[Jantar]

There are obviously some young people on here. I can remember paying between 1.5% and 2.5%.

.2% is quite acceptable.

Sorry for being an old f..t. I would love to pay 1.5% again. But $30 on a $1000 trade is 3%.

[peat]

I would love to pay 1.5% again. But $30 on a $1000 trade is 3%.

trading in $1000 lots is always going to be inefficient.
at that amount per trade no one cares about you. and would you expect otherwise?

[bonne vie]

Been away for weekend and thought I would catch up on how the depth looked at the end of the week for a couple of companies, only last trades showing and not the depth. I am sure I have looked at the depth in the weekend before - is this another anomaly since the Direct Broking taking over from ANZ?

[777]

Been away for weekend and thought I would catch up on how the depth looked at the end of the week for a couple of companies, only last trades showing and not the depth. I am sure I have looked at the depth in the weekend before - is this another anomaly since the Direct Broking taking over from ANZ?

Always been the case for NZ stocks. NZX shuts down. Aussie ones show.

[Valiant]

Hey, does anyone use the Direct Broking app? What’s the deal, this only for First NZ Capital members I assume?

[Grimy]

Just placed an order and it was settled and my contract note received within about 5 minutes. Much better than my previous dealing with them.

[cyclist]

Well, I 've been a bit thick, so thought I would post this story in case others were going to make the same mistake.

Using ANZ, a 'Buy" was settled by direct debit from my nominated account. Somehow, I had it in my head after reading the Direct Broking info that I now needed to fund my Cash Management Account in order to purchase, so did that for the first time earlier this week. Upon making my first "Buy" I noticed on the acknowledgement "Your transaction will be settled by direct debit from account xx-xxxx-xxxxxxx-xx" (or words to that affect). I rang them to double check - turns out the direct debit method still works and I was still set up for it. They kindly transferred the funds in my cash management account back to my nominated account that day.

Random aside, but based on first use I was very happy. Quick response to my phone call. Very quick placement of order to the market (quicker than it ever was with ANZ). All good so far. Maybe they have ironed out the kinks a bit.

[Grimy]

Certainly seem to be better than when they first took over the ANZ business. One thing that bothered me was that when transferring funds from my (ANZ) bank account to Direct Broking- say on a Monday - it didn't show until quite late Tuesday-quite often not until the afternoon. The last couple of transfers I've done have shown when I've checked just after 10am, so much better.

[stoploss]

Certainly seem to be better than when they first took over the ANZ business. One thing that bothered me was that when transferring funds from my (ANZ) bank account to Direct Broking- say on a Monday - it didn't show until quite late Tuesday-quite often not until the afternoon. The last couple of transfers I've done have shown when I've checked just after 10am, so much better.

Those transfer times are awful . I sent money via a intl xfer company to my daughter in Australia . I'm ANZ , transferred to BNZ account of the transfer provider @ 2pm in the afternoon, she had it in her Account in Australia that night.

[whatsup]

Q, Im selling some shares today through a broker and I cannot see them on the sell column of Direct , does Direct only list shares for sale for their own clients , if so where can one see all the listed shares that have a sell order on then, NZX does not seem to have a quote system ?

[stoploss]

Q, Im selling some shares today through a broker and I cannot see them on the sell column of Direct , does Direct only list shares for sale for their own clients , if so where can one see all the listed shares that have a sell order on then, NZX does not seem to have a quote system ?

Whats the stock and quantity I will have a look on my system ...It could be they have not input it ,trying to match internally .....

[peat]

does Direct only list shares for sale for their own clients
I dont believe so - I'm pretty sure what we see here is the whole market

[whatsup]

Whats the stock and quantity I will have a look on my system ...It could be they have not input it ,trying to match internally .....

Thank you for your help, the sale went through but at the time the amount was not shown on the Direct sale info, may have been an offmarket sale at the brokers office.

[777]

Thank you for your help, the sale went through but at the time the amount was not shown on the Direct sale info, may have been an offmarket sale at the brokers office.

A number of small trades may have made up your total.

[JoeGrogan]

NZX data delayed still?

Why do i still have a direct broking account...

[minimoke]

NZX data delayed still?

Why do i still have a direct broking account...Its up to date from where I sit eg can see a ATM trade at 15:25

[777]

Been Ok for me all day.

[minimoke]

Anyone tried teh Direct Broking app.

I've installed Join Dirtect Broking but it doesnt recognize any of my emails and locks my phone up so I have to do the shutdown phone / restart trick

[777]

Change in interest rates.

Currency Daily Balance Interest Rate
NZD
up to 14,999.99 1.00% p.a.
15,000.00 to 49,999.99 1.25% p.a.
50,000.00 to 199,999.99 1.75% p.a.
200,000.00+ 1.75% p.a.

[couta1]

Change in interest rates.

Currency Daily Balance Interest Rate
NZD
up to 14,999.99 1.00% p.a.
15,000.00 to 49,999.99 1.25% p.a.
50,000.00 to 199,999.99 1.75% p.a.
200,000.00+ 1.75% p.a. Had to happen still that 1.75% rate is pretty good compared to ASB securities.

[bottomfeeder]

Just clicked on my normal log in and received this message.
This site is not secure
This might mean that someone’s trying to fool you or steal any info you send to the server. You should close this site immediately.


res://ieframe.dll/shieldcheck.icoClose this tab




res://ieframe.dll/down.png (res://ieframe.dll/hstscerterror.htm?SSLError=12170#)
More information

Has anyone else had this problem. It appears site certificate has been revoked, this is the ANZ Securities redirection site.

[Leftfield]

Just clicked on my normal log in and received this message.
This site is not secure




.....Has anyone else had this problem. It appears site certificate has been revoked, this is the ANZ Securities redirection site.





Yep had this issue a week ago. I sent them a screen pic of the error and had a response within a day redirecting me to the site below. Seems they have changed addresses and/or an older redirection is no longer working.
The fix was to delete my older 'bookmark' address and replace with this one.

https://www.directbroking.co.nz/DirectTrade/static/home.aspx

All works fine now.

[hogie]

Yep had this issue a week ago. I sent them a screen pic of the error and had a response within a day redirecting me to the site below. Seems they have changed addresses and/or an older redirection is no longer working.
The fix was to delete my older 'bookmark' address and replace with this one.

https://www.directbroking.co.nz/DirectTrade/static/home.aspx

All works fine now.


Whoops ... if they want to keep this particular URL active publicly then they'd better get their IT team to update the cert or find out what happened ... potentially embarrassing :)

I go straight from the DirectBrokering site now ... no redirects ...

https://www.directbroking.co.nz/directtrade/static/home.aspx

[minimoke]

Tried the App but it doent link to my account. How dumb is that. I cant be bothered getting all the info together when the already have it

[Leftfield]

Tried the App but it doent link to my account. How dumb is that. I cant be bothered getting all the info together when the already have it

Agree.....the DB App is not at all customer friendly (if you are an existing customer.) They need to get their act together.

[Ggcc]

Tried the App but it doent link to my account. How dumb is that. I cant be bothered getting all the info together when the already have it
I gave up on this from the start.

[peat]

I'm getting this error from the website today. Anyone else or just me? I dont think this error is important but still makes me nervous. Any comments from anyone?

Your connection is not privateAttackers might be trying to steal your information from www.anzsecurities.co.nz (for example, passwords, messages or credit cards). Learn more (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/chrome-error://chromewebdata/#)
NET::ERR_CERT_REVOKED
Subject: www.anzsecurities.co.nz
Issuer: DigiCert SHA2 Extended Validation Server CA
Expires on: 20 Apr 2020
Current date: 27 May 2019

[Xerof]

The old link has probably done its dash. I just reloaded a bookmark using the new URL for directbroking

[minimoke]

I'm getting this error from the website today. Anyone else or just me? I dont think this error is important but still makes me nervous. Any comments from anyone?

Your connection is not private

Attackers might be trying to steal your information from www.anzsecurities.co.nz (http://www.anzsecurities.co.nz) (for example, passwords, messages or credit cards). Learn more (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/chrome-error://chromewebdata/#)
NET::ERR_CERT_REVOKED
Subject: www.anzsecurities.co.nz (http://www.anzsecurities.co.nz)
Issuer: DigiCert SHA2 Extended Validation Server CA
Expires on: 20 Apr 2020
Current date: 27 May 2019





See post #146

[Onion]

I'm getting this error from the website today. Anyone else or just me? I dont think this error is important but still makes me nervous. Any comments from anyone?

Your connection is not private

Attackers might be trying to steal your information from www.anzsecurities.co.nz (http://www.anzsecurities.co.nz) (for example, passwords, messages or credit cards). Learn more (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/chrome-error://chromewebdata/#)
NET::ERR_CERT_REVOKED
Subject: www.anzsecurities.co.nz (http://www.anzsecurities.co.nz)
Issuer: DigiCert SHA2 Extended Validation Server CA
Expires on: 20 Apr 2020
Current date: 27 May 2019



It is good to be cautious, especially when money is involved. A certificate will have expired and the responsibility will fall somewhere between ANZ Securities and FCNZ (Direct Broking).

Use the Direct Broking site (https://www.directbroking.co.nz (https://www.directbroking.co.nz/)) and you won't have that problem. ANZ Securities doesn't exist anymore so you are best to update your bookmarks to the current site.

[peat]

It is good to be cautious, especially when money is involved. A certificate will have expired and the responsibility will fall somewhere between ANZ Securities and FCNZ (Direct Broking).

Use the Direct Broking site (https://www.directbroking.co.nz (https://www.directbroking.co.nz/)) and you won't have that problem. ANZ Securities doesn't exist anymore so you are best to update your bookmarks to the current site.

thanks Onion, really appreciate the response.

[peat]

and thanks to Xerof and Minimoke tooo,
I havent been reading the boards so much recently , I should have seen this!!

[777]

Is it just my account or is the closing match prices missing for all accounts.

Just came right 1 minute before close.

[dubya]

Is it just my account or is the closing match prices missing for all accounts.

Just came right 1 minute before close.

It was missing for quite a while. I was refreshing but no change. I guess it was everyones accounts.

[777]

It was missing for quite a while. I was refreshing but no change. I guess it was everyones accounts.

Thanks. Happened yesterday as well but not for as long.

[percy]

Seemed to come right at 4 mins past 5.

[see weed]

Is it just my account or is the closing match prices missing for all accounts.

Just came right 1 minute before close.
Give Direct broking a phone call and find out what is happening, that is not good enough. I am with ASB Securities.

[bottomfeeder]

Site seems to be on a go slow today, not updating buys, stock price delays, and order delayed.

[Ggcc]

So slow at the close today. Any ideas how to buy or sell when it’s like this?

[777]

The answer I got on 19/6/19 when asking about the match prices and volume at session close.

"There is an IT issue with our site on the depth screen and they will be running a fix tonight so this should rectify the issue come pre close tomorrow"

Nothing has changed today 21/6/19

[Ggcc]

lovely my depth has gone in all shares, has this affected anybody else?

[Mickey]

lovely my depth has gone in all shares, has this affected anybody else?

Yep - same here

From Direct Broking - working with data providers to fix current fault of live market data
We are currently working with our data providers to resolve an issue with live market data. We'll get this back up as soon as possible.e currently working with our data providers to resolve an issue with live market data. We'll get this back up as soon as possible.

[bonne vie]

Can anyone point to where the codes on the depth chart for ASX are now. With ANZ there was a help on the same page. Yesterday 2 very large sales (suspect USB) with a 4 letter code and today CEXT. Not in glossary.

[RTM]

Can anyone point to where the codes on the depth chart for ASX are now. With ANZ there was a help on the same page. Yesterday 2 very large sales (suspect USB) with a 4 letter code and today CEXT. Not in glossary.

I've had trouble with this before. I emailed them and they provided me the answers I needed.

[SilverBack]

Can anyone point to where the codes on the depth chart for ASX are now. With ANZ there was a help on the same page. Yesterday 2 very large sales (suspect USB) with a 4 letter code and today CEXT. Not in glossary.

If I remember correctly, CEXT refers to a transaction on the Chi-x exchange rather than the ASX. This exchange is primarily used by high volume traders. You will often find Chi-x transactions with 0.25 or 0.75 increments when they are not supported on the ASX.

[peat]

It would be really nice if Direct Broking provided the attachments to the NZX announcements.
Personally I find it a bit galling to read an announcement that says nothing and refers one to the attached document which isn't there. Which means I then have to go to NZX to obtain.

e.g.

Attached is a Notice under Listing Rule X.xx.x in respect of blah blah blah





quite frankly this sux
I'm a busy retired person I aint got time fo dis. :p

Just a suggestion guys, if you wanna be client focussed.

Delete them all after a month if space is an issue, but I cant really imagine it would be a serious issue.
Just get the attachments on your site , or links direct to the nzx if thats easier.

TIA

[Oliver Mander]

Has anyone else noticed this? I've seen it for a while, and keep forgetting...but it is seriously frustrating. Basically - when you click into a depth view of a share, the share price displayed as the 'header' does not actually reflect the most recent trade. It never used to...has only started doing that a few months ago. It got me into a spot of bother once, which DB were very quick to fix for me. But it isn't a one-off...it keeps showing up in the view. Check out the example....right now its doing it with PLX as well.

10758

[iceman]

Has anyone else noticed this? I've seen it for a while, and keep forgetting...but it is seriously frustrating. Basically - when you click into a depth view of a share, the share price displayed as the 'header' does not actually reflect the most recent trade. It never used to...has only started doing that a few months ago. It got me into a spot of bother once, which DB were very quick to fix for me. But it isn't a one-off...it keeps showing up in the view. Check out the example....right now its doing it with PLX as well.

10758

Yep, noticced this on several occasions. But I think its always when there are very small trades ( BOTs) so maybe that has something to do with it !?

[Snow Leopard]

Small trades below a certain volume or value are excluded from setting a market price.

It goes back to the days when having bought 9998 of the 10,000 shares at $1 in your order the broker bought the last 2 at any price just to close the d*** order.

[peat]

Here are the trade conditions but they aren't shown so much these days

10760

https://www.directbroking.co.nz/DirectTrade/help/hlp_glossary.aspx

[blackcap]

It would be really nice if Direct Broking provided the attachments to the NZX announcements.
Personally I find it a bit galling to read an announcement that says nothing and refers one to the attached document which isn't there. Which means I then have to go to NZX to obtain.

e.g.

Attached is a Notice under Listing Rule X.xx.x in respect of blah blah blah





quite frankly this sux
I'm a busy retired person I aint got time fo dis. :p

Just a suggestion guys, if you wanna be client focussed.

Delete them all after a month if space is an issue, but I cant really imagine it would be a serious issue.
Just get the attachments on your site , or links direct to the nzx if thats easier.

TIA






Well done Direct Broking. I saw a link at the bottom of the announcement that refers straight to the NZX site. Brilliant.

[RTM]

Well done Direct Broking. I saw a link at the bottom of the announcement that refers straight to the NZX site. Brilliant.

Yes that's much better. Thanks for highlighting it...hadn't seen it there....has it always been there ?

[peat]

I wasn’t sure if it was there before and wondered if I’d made ass of myself haha, but if I haven’t then yeh big ups to DB

[bottomfeeder]

Had to email DB on odd lot trading. Understandbly there will always be short trades, and unfortunately odd lot trades. But it is really annoying and adds to the cost of trading. I put an order in today for 500 WBC and picked up 2 plus brokerage. Not so dramatic with $30 shares but when buying MPG it would be a real downer. I emailed DB and suggested they really need to come up with a policy, whereby odd lot trading below a certain value should not incur brokerage until a substantial part of the order is filled.

Will let you know the outcome.

[Grimy]

When I have had an order not completely filled I have been charged the $29.95 (or whatever) and then when the order is completed with subsequent trades there has been no extra brokerage charged, so the complete order goes through with $29.95 brokerage.
I guess they charge it with the initial trade as if it was not done until the majority of the purchase was completed someone could get 2 or 10 or 100 shares, no brokerage and then cancel the outstanding order. Could get messy.

[blackcap]

When I have had an order not completely filled I have been charged the $29.95 (or whatever) and then when the order is completed with subsequent trades there has been no extra brokerage charged, so the complete order goes through with $29.95 brokerage.
I guess they charge it with the initial trade as if it was not done until the majority of the purchase was completed someone could get 2 or 10 or 100 shares, no brokerage and then cancel the outstanding order. Could get messy.

That makes perfect sense. Same amount of work for DB if they purchase 2 shares or 1000. Once a purchase (or sell) has been initiated they should charge bro on it. Indeed if you decided to cancel an order and then had to post date brokerage etc. Could get messy in the back office too. If you get hit for 2 shares you have a month to buy the remainder. Just up the bid to the ask and get the rest. Simple really.

[bottomfeeder]

I have been looking at the trades on a few shares, and wow there are so many odd lot trades going on, it is becoming a real problem. I do a lot of trading and getting to the stage where there is a gap between the buys and sells, I am so reluctant to put in a sell or buy order because if the risk of getting an odd lot but not proceeding with any further of the order. They become expensive shares. Odd lots are just a nuisance, and creates brokerage for brokers.

[couta1]

I have been looking at the trades on a few shares, and wow there are so many odd lot trades going on, it is becoming a real problem. I do a lot of trading and getting to the stage where there is a gap between the buys and sells, I am so reluctant to put in a sell or buy order because if the risk of getting an odd lot but not proceeding with any further of the order. They become expensive shares. Odd lots are just a nuisance, and creates brokerage for brokers. Blame sharesies.

[bottomfeeder]

Look at CVT today, there was a seller of 2000 at 313. There was odd lot trading, quite a bit. Then as the price dropped, the seller had to reduce their ask to 310, just to make the sell order worthwhile. Stinks, just where do all of these odd lot trades come from. They must be losing money for the seller with the brokerage on selling two shares. I just dont believe that there is honesty going on here. I did once think someone shafted me on a little traded share once, where I appeared to be bidding against another buyer, when we were jockeying for a position, then an odd lot trade. Either the other party was getting free brokerage or they eere quite willing to lose $30 just to annoy me.

[couta1]

Look at CVT today, there was a seller of 2000 at 313. There was odd lot trading, quite a bit. Then as the price dropped, the seller had to reduce their ask to 310, just to make the sell order worthwhile. Stinks, just where do all of these odd lot trades come from. They must be losing money for the seller with the brokerage on selling two shares. I just dont believe that there is honesty going on here. I did once think someone shafted me on a little traded share once, where I appeared to be bidding against another buyer, when we were jockeying for a position, then an odd lot trade. Either the other party was getting free brokerage or they eere quite willing to lose $30 just to annoy me. Bots work both sides of the market simultaneously, they only lose to make more. Lol

[RTM]

Look at CVT today, there was a seller of 2000 at 313. There was odd lot trading, quite a bit. Then as the price dropped, the seller had to reduce their ask to 310, just to make the sell order worthwhile. Stinks, just where do all of these odd lot trades come from. They must be losing money for the seller with the brokerage on selling two shares. I just dont believe that there is honesty going on here. I did once think someone shafted me on a little traded share once, where I appeared to be bidding against another buyer, when we were jockeying for a position, then an odd lot trade. Either the other party was getting free brokerage or they eere quite willing to lose $30 just to annoy me.

That sounds aweful. Doesn’t affect me so much as I only make a few transactions.
Have you discussed the matter with DB ? Can they/ will they help ?

[bottomfeeder]

WTF, nearly every share I am following has odd lot trading going on. Just what is going on. There used to be a system of uneconomic parcels, which could not be bought and sold. Every now and then a company would buy up the uneconomuc parcels and get rid of them. I think brokers are doing this on purpose to generate brokerage. The $30 min brokerage, doesnt cover the cost to the exchange, or the company for processing the share transfer. Its like the freeloaders in the Koro Lounge. Not that I have ever been in there. But it must be annoying for those that paid the full cost to be members.

[couta1]

That sounds aweful. Doesn’t affect me so much as I only make a few transactions.
Have you discussed the matter with DB ? Can they/ will they help ? They can only help with a brokerage negotiation but the machine trading is a big part of the market now and is legal(Cough,Cough) and here to stay.PS-It must be unsettling for you guys that dont trade much but for people like myself we've been working with the machines for years now, we can smell their presence yet live and work around them(Sounds a bit like Transformers aye)

[bottomfeeder]

The DB website, gives minimum holding requirements for shares at certain value. They state that orders will be reversed for those not fullfilled at these min holdings, yet so many odd lot trades going on. Ive been caught a few times. I was buying mpg at one stage where I bought one share at 50cents. That was an expensive share. I rang DB, and cancelled the purchase. They said they would do it this time. I have been caught out again and again. I have not seen so much odd lot trades going through as have been carrying on recently.

[bottomfeeder]

Just looking at WBC (westpac) on the NZX. There is a purchaser sitting there for one share at 3100. That means at min brokerage, you are paying $60 per share. Way above mv even at 3100, let alone $60. It looks to me that someone is trying to discourage large dufferences in buy and sell quotes, by making it uneconomic, with odd lot trades ir something. The sell quote is 3150, the buy quote is 1 at 3100 and last sale and second in line is at 3070.

Got to get to the bottom of this. I have also emailed the NZX.

Who is it tgat wants to buy one share at $60. I presume ut us someone who doesnt pay brokerage. ie a broker.

[couta1]

Your not listening bottomfeeder(Rise of the machines)

[winner69]

Your not listening bottomfeeder.

...but bottomfeeder say he’s going ‘to get to the bottom of this’ ....sorry, couldn’t resist

[couta1]

...but bottomfeeder say he’s going ‘to get to the bottom of this’ ....sorry, couldn’t resist Lol hope hes not on blood pressure meds then.

[bottomfeeder]

Maybe not, but there was a seller of WBC on the NZX who had a sell quote at 500 for 3155, which is way above recent trades and I am sure when the ASX opens it will never hit thoat high for a while, who just got lumbered with the one share sale. I would bet my holding of WBC, that the balance of his order will not be fullfilled before it expires. He will either have to lump it, or reduce his sell price to make it economic for him.

I am nit listening, because no seems to be doing anything about it. This needs investigation.

[bottomfeeder]

My feeds will keep going till we get to the bottom of this.

[couta1]

My feeds will keep going till we get to the bottom of this. I admire your tenacity but trust me when it comes to this, think head and brick wall.

[bottomfeeder]

More ranting. I trade a bit so I get acces to depth, but for those who have infrequent trades, and dont gave access to depth, be careful how you place your order, or you will get shafted as well.

Hang on I just take another pill, and get on my high horse again.

[winner69]

Lol hope hes not on blood pressure meds then.

Watching the depth closely can lead you to the ‘depths of despair’ if you don’t take care eh Couts

[peat]

We should be factually informed though, as bottom feeder suggests, and not just having everyone guessing, isnt transparency meant to be important to the correct functioning of markets.
or is this just another case of the dark side taking over

[couta1]

We should be factually informed though, as bottom feeder suggests, and not just having everyone guessing, isnt transparency meant to be important to the correct functioning of markets.
or is this just another case of the dark side taking over Whose guessing? the market is so highly manipulated(Legally of course,cough,cough) that the dark side is well and truly in control.

[bottomfeeder]

Oh man its just ridiculous. Today on WBC on the NZX there are so many odd lot trades its ridiculous. Just what has changed recently, I have never seen so much odd lot trades coming through. Not so bad if your order is subsequently filled, but mostly they invade your order at a value that may not be filled.

I just dont know what has changed, I have never seen the extent to which it is carrying on now. Its ruining the market.

DB did not reply to my previous email so I have emailed them again. I have also emailed the NZX, but they havent replied. It needs a thorough investigation.

[bottomfeeder]

Had a call fron DB. Its definitely sharesies that is ruining the market. I just dont understand how sharesies members make their money. The certainly dont pay minimum brokerage, they seem to be under some sort of subscription and percentage. So if they want WBC, they just say I want $40 worth. It probably costs them a dollar. Just a big nuisance. Because sharesies is a nominee holder, they have a marketable parcel with balance of the holding. If this keeps going on I will have to think if you cant beat them join them. And aha, DB says there are a lot of other people getting annoyed the same as I am.

[RTM]

Had a call fron DB. Its definitely sharsies that is ruining the market. I just dont understand how sharsies members make their money. The certainly dont pay minimum brokerage, they seem to be under some sort of dubscription and percentage. So if they want WBC, they just say I want $40 worth. It probably costs them a dollar. Just a big nuisance. Because sharsies is a nominee holder, they have a marketable parcel with balance of the holding. If this keeps going on I will have to think if you cant beat them join them. And aha, DB sats there are a lot of other people getting annoyed the same as I am.

Thanks for update BF. I regularly look at the DB site to see the value of my portfolio. If the last price is based on sale of very very few shares....then am I really seeing reality ? I can't be sure. Maybe you can answer this.....are the very small transactions in general very close to the price of larger transactions ?
If not...then what I am looking at is potentially fiction....right ?

[couta1]

Blame sharesies. As I was saying last week. Lol

[bottomfeeder]

The prices are all over the place, they dont seem to care whether the price is close to market value, they just buy and sell on the quoted buy and sell prices no matter what they are. There is no minimum brokerage, and work on a subscription of $30 per year, plus a portfolio fee of they say .34%.

The only thing is that I would rather have the shares in my name.

I am sure if the NZX lets sharesies continue in its present form, it will signal the end of minimum brokerage. I am finding it difficult to put in a buy or sell order that may only be fullfilled by an odd lot trade. This is partucularly true if there is a substantial shift in the sp. That is you may not always be able to buy or sell at the best possible value.

The other thing that worries me about signing up to sharesies is if the nzx does something, sharesies will have to up their brokerage to everyone to either convert their holdings or realise their investments. Just how safe are they. Oops just got a reply from the nzx, will let you know.

[peat]

there is a Sharesies thread somewhere bottomfeeder.
as you say they are a nominee holder.

Thanks for obtaining confirmation (from DB) that this odd lot type issue is a result of Sharesies discount broking.
It does make depth essential for any trader.
Would it solve the problem if the broker said they wouldn't accept odd lot orders. Odd lots are ok, in reason but these are pushing the boundaries of what is allowed under regulations in my opinion. eg misleading the market and I'm sure there are other rules that touch on them.
Also doesn't the 'complete an order' minimum brokerage principle suggest they would still be paying high brokerage if putting in bids at extreme prices for small parcels.
There is still a whiff of something in this situation if you ask me. Not that I am super fussed by it but yeh it strikes me as odd.

[RTM]

I think what I am hearing from BF is this.
I could place a buy order for say $20K of something at a lowish price.
I might get a very small number of shares filled on this order at the lowish price.
The complete order might never fill....and I would be hit with the full commission.
Is this correct ?
Hmmmm….yes....this does concern me. I've done the above before and got a few surprises sometime later in the month when the price does drop and the order fills. Usually its been OK. I've never had an order partially fill, although some have taken a while. Note to self: Need to take care and understand this. Fortunately, at the moment I am neither buying or selling.
Does the NZX want / need this ?
How does the ASX manage this ?

[bottomfeeder]

Yes I think most brokers didnt mind because they were getting minimum brokerage on any odd lot trade that was not fully filled. It is only when "adult" traders start to complain and revolt that someone will do something about it. Either odd lots will have to trade on a separate board or a no brokerage on odd lot trades. The NZX said odd lots do not affect market statistics, so why should they affect brokerage.

I am sick of it. It is costing me money. It cost me on MPG where I was sitting at 38 cent order for 20,000 and bought one share for 38 cents plus $30 brokerage. I had to increase my buy price to 39 cents and it cost me an extra $200 just because of the principle that I didnt want one MPG share at $30-38 or thereabouts. Not the first time either. I may be looking for a new broker, depends how this pans out.

I note there is a sharesies thread, but the answer to thus has to be a different minimum brokerage approach from Direct Broking.

[JayRiggs]

Yes I think most brokers didnt mind because they were getting minimum brokerage on any odd lot trade that was not fully filled. It is only when "adult" traders start to complain and revolt that someone will do something about it. Either odd lots will have to trade on a separate board or a no brokerage on odd lot trades. The NZX said odd lots do not affect market statistics, so why should they affect brokerage.

I am sick of it. It is costing me money. It cost me on MPG where I was sitting at 38 cent order for 20,000 and bought one share for 38 cents plus $30 brokerage. I had to increase my buy price to 39 cents and it cost me an extra $200 just because of the principle that I didnt want one MPG share at $30-38 or thereabouts. Not the first time either. I may be looking for a new broker, depends how this pans out.

I note there is a sharesies thread, but the answer to thus has to be a different minimum brokerage approach from Direct Broking.

Hey bottomfeeder,
Just want to clarify, are you saying you're getting charged $30 brokerage multiple times for every odd lot trade?
That doesn't sound right. I'd say it's a problem with Direct Broking.
For ASB Securities, recently when I sold one parcel of shares, it was traded with 10 different lots, but I only got charged $30 once.

[bottomfeeder]

No only one $30, but for one share. If I complete the order, it OK and all good. But if you are top of the queue on a buy or sell order on a market moving against you you will only end up with one share plus the cost of min brokerage. The order may well expire thereafter. Then you may have bought one share of the most unprofitable trade you have ever had. The more of these anomalies that occur, the more pressure will be put on DB for a free brokerage on odd lots.

[JayRiggs]

No only one $30, but for one share. If I complete the order, it OK and all good. But if you are top of the queue on a buy or sell order on a market moving against you you will only end up with one share plus the cost of min brokerage. The order may well expire thereafter. Then you may have bought one share of the most unprofitable trade you have ever had. The more of these anomalies that occur, the more pressure will be put on DB for a free brokerage on odd lots.

Oh yeap I get you. I was thinking the same thing as you.
When I saw one trade going through for $100, then $5 a few mins later, I thought.... crap what if the price goes down and I can't sell the rest of my parcel???
Eventually my parcel got sold in 10 different lots, but I woulda been peeved off had my trade never completed.

[couta1]

My issue with Sharesies is that they highjack the live depth chart while all their orders fill upon market open, for trading this is a big negative that the NZX need to sort out pronto.

[bottomfeeder]

At least ASB, has a min brokerage of $15-00 on trades under $1000. So an odd lot hijack will be cheaper. But when I spoke to ASB, I had quite a bit of difficulty getting through to him. I think as Sharesies is becoming so popular, they will all know what it means.
#riseofthehumantraders

[mshierlaw]

A nice easy question to end the day.

I have a bid due to expire at the end of the week & I am 1/2 way down the queue of bids at that price.

If I extend the expiry date is my place in the queue reset?

[bottomfeeder]

I would say you can't extend an order, and that any change will take you to the end of the queue unless you change your price only.
But will be interesting to hear who h broker you with and what you do. Which equity is it.

[mshierlaw]

I would say you can't extend an order, and that any change will take you to the end of the queue unless you change your price only.
But will be interesting to hear who h broker you with and what you do. Which equity is it.

With DB & have a 62c bid on BRM EXP end of the week. I can change EXP within the app.

Cheers

[bottomfeeder]

My issue with Sharesies is that they highjack the live depth chart while all their orders fill upon market open, for trading this is a big negative that the NZX need to sort out pronto.

This morning it stinks. So many examples of 9 bids for 40 shares at the top of the queue.

Effectively my small margin higher volume trading has become so difficult now that I have to exit the market for this type of trading. It is just so f******ed.

[Onion]

A nice easy question to end the day.

I have a bid due to expire at the end of the week & I am 1/2 way down the queue of bids at that price.

If I extend the expiry date is my place in the queue reset?

It is a market. If your price doesn't match the market price then you won't get those shares. Your bid must have been in the market for 3 weeks without being matched -- have you considered that you've got the wrong bid price for the current market?. If you want to move up the queue then offer a higher price!

You can adjust the price you are offering and complete the trade -- DB allow you to change the price without starting again with a new brokerage charge.

[winner69]

It is a market. If your price doesn't match the market price then you won't get those shares. Your bid must have been in the market for 3 weeks without being matched -- have you considered that you've got the wrong bid price for the current market?. If you want to move up the queue then offer a higher price!

You can adjust the price you are offering and complete the trade -- DB allow you to change the price without starting again with a new brokerage charge.

Good point ....but bottomfeeder is his name

[t.rexjr]

It is a market. If your price doesn't match the market price then you won't get those shares. Your bid must have been in the market for 3 weeks without being matched -- have you considered that you've got the wrong bid price for the current market?. If you want to move up the queue then offer a higher price!

You can adjust the price you are offering and complete the trade -- DB allow you to change the price without starting again with a new brokerage charge.

That's their point though isn't it? Their buy price is X, not X+1 or X+5. If their brokerage is triggered at their buy price of X by 1 share, that share becomes X+$30. Thus if the market moves off then they are somewhat forced to chase the market to gain a marketable share. Don't forget to sell that 1 share it would be another $30 brokerage so break even would be 1X + $60

It's far more common than just an issue caused by Sharesies and it's the commonality that is the issue

[bottomfeeder]

Winner not me, but I dont just buy and sell at any price either, but at a price that suits me.
Also its not an open market in sone shares. Especially those with primary listing on the ASX , some are less frequently traded, have big differences between buy and sell as well dont often trade till the ASX opens. So odd lots mixing it up, does create a false market. Sone of those odd lot trades just dont really care about what the pay or sell.

[whatsup]

Is the Direct link out atm or is it just me ?

[peat]

Is the Direct link out atm or is it just me ?

all good here

[whatsup]

all good here

peat, yes could not link up for 5 minutes only, thank you

[RTM]

All....When I logged in yesterday morning I found I had lost one of my key Watch Lists. The one that mirrors...as much as possible, my portfolio.
Direct Broking have been unable to help, other than to tell me to recreate it if it has not reappeared this morning. It hasn't.

Has anyone else experienced this ?

[bottomfeeder]

No, never has happened to me.

[Independent Observer AUNZ]

bottomfeeder I've had the issue occur when selling a parcel of 250 shares (I dabbled in Westpac at one point, God knows why) - and the trade went through for only 220 shares at the price I was happy with. The next day, as I had anticipated, the price crashed and so I was left with 30 shares that if I allowed my SELL order to expire would cost an extra broking charge to get rid of. So I changed my price to where the market had shifted just not to be "stuck" with a parcel of only 30. I still came out on top and the average sell price was a good outcome, but it is tricky operating with some small trades with the broking fee as it currently operates because you can get caught out.

[Independent Observer AUNZ]

All....When I logged in yesterday morning I found I had lost one of my key Watch Lists. The one that mirrors...as much as possible, my portfolio.
Direct Broking have been unable to help, other than to tell me to recreate it if it has not reappeared this morning. It hasn't.

Has anyone else experienced this ?

Not something I've noticed - but I don't use the watchlists very actively really.

[Ggcc]

All....When I logged in yesterday morning I found I had lost one of my key Watch Lists. The one that mirrors...as much as possible, my portfolio.
Direct Broking have been unable to help, other than to tell me to recreate it if it has not reappeared this morning. It hasn't.

Has anyone else experienced this ?
I have experienced this twice, but before the takeover of direct broking. It happened to someone I also know recently after the takeover

[RTM]

Thanks all for your responses.
I use the watch lists pretty extensively so losing one is not something I want to happen. They help with some of the limitations of the information in the Portfolio.
GGCC...i'll pass your comment on to DB.....I thought maybe it was just me and that I had done something wrong !

[tomm]

Just a quick question to the advance , how long do you have until you have to pay back the shares you shorted with direct Broking ( same day) ? Thanks.

[blackcap]

You can now place limit orders via Sharesies. Is this the slow death of discount Broking in NZ as it has been for the past 25 years?

[couta1]

You can now place limit orders via Sharesies. Is this the slow death of discount Broking in NZ as it has been for the past 25 years? How would it work for fast and furious trading?

[blackcap]

How would it work for fast and furious trading?

Well its even quicker than Direct or ASB as your order goes straight through is my understanding. So there is no middle man like currently at the brokerage. So even better if you are the fast and furious type :)

[couta1]

Well its even quicker than Direct or ASB as your order goes straight through is my understanding. So there is no middle man like currently at the brokerage. So even better if you are the fast and furious type :) Do you get a live depth chart?

[blackcap]

Do you get a live depth chart?

Good questions, I do not think so but have not checked with them. But I doubt it very much. Data is also 20 min delayed.. Still you can get depth from one source and trade on the other.

[bottomfeeder]

Direct on a go slow. Put a sell order in. The buyer is sitting there, 10 minutes later still sitting there. Hope I meet the sale and someone else doesn't pip me and then I sell 1 share only. Just taking too long.

[RTM]

Direct on a go slow. Put a sell order in. The buyer is sitting there, 10 minutes later still sitting there. Hope I meet the sale and someone else doesn't pip me and then I sell 1 share only. Just taking too long.

Call them. I have found them responsive.

[bottomfeeder]

Much better this morning. Put in a buy order and it appeared on the nzx within a minute. I wonder why we have these differences.

[blackcap]

Much better this morning. Put in a buy order and it appeared on the nzx within a minute. I wonder why we have these differences.

They probably have one operator, 2 tops for internet orders. Lunch time, 1 operator is out at lunch, the other needs to take a dump. There is your 6 min delay.... quite simple that is probably what the explanation is.

[iceman]

Much better this morning. Put in a buy order and it appeared on the nzx within a minute. I wonder why we have these differences.

I have experienced this on many occasions. When it annoys me, I call them. They are very responsive when you call them. I think blackcap is probably correct about just 1 or 2 traders working on internet orders but we can't really complain. It is a cheap service and in reality I think we get pretty much what we pay for and I'm satisfied with that.

[couta1]

Depth chart movements delayed by over 30 mins, pathetic, happening every day now.

[Davexl]

Depth chart movements delayed by over 30 mins, pathetic, happening every day now.

ASB Sec always available, very stable...

[couta1]

ASB Sec always available, very stable... Rates too dear for me, Aussie trades work out at 0.1% with DB for 30k.

[Davexl]

Rates too dear for me, Aussie trades work out at 0.1% with DB for 30k.

Are you ex ASB couta ? Much new to learn on DB? I've got used to ASB and rates are still cheap regardless, but DB tempting...

[couta1]

Are you ex ASB couta ? Much new to learn on DB? I've got used to ASB and rates are still cheap regardless, but DB tempting... No never been with ASB, DB are upgrading their systems in the new year thank goodness but they cant solve NZX issues.

[Davexl]

No never been with ASB, DB are upgrading their systems in the new year thank goodness but they cant solve NZX issues.

Might keep an eye on that development, see how things settle down first, didn't realise it was NZX issue, haven't noticed it when trading yet myself...

[King1212]

Called the call center and they awared with it...in the process of fixing it....

[couta1]

Called the call center and they awared with it...in the process of fixing it.... They are doing my head in today, multiple problems with skeleton staff, incredibly frustrating for trading.

[iceman]

That probably explains why they’re not answering the phone couta1. Have been trying for last hour off and on

[King1212]

Yup...felling u couta...what shares are u trading?

[peat]

What does ticking the adjusted box in the charting actually achieve?