Trademe 2.0

[Dlownz]

Would you really want too
I hardly use it anymore as it became just a rubbish seller other may be in a different boat.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/watchlist-trade-me-owners-eyeing-re-listing-in-2024/6F6USG55D5D4VEZZ67A2ULNZZQ/

[nztx]

Would you really want too
I hardly use it anymore as it became just a rubbish seller other may be in a different boat.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/watchlist-trade-me-owners-eyeing-re-listing-in-2024/6F6USG55D5D4VEZZ67A2ULNZZQ/


What is likely to be asked by Private Equity for this if & when it gets tossed back on the market

$6.45 or something north ? ;)

Good luck with that ..

[777]

I keep getting offers for "no selling fee" weekends. No money in that for them.

[Sideshow Bob]

Yawn......

Another PE suck it dry exercise, put a bit of lippy on it and then foist back on to unsuspecting punters...

No thank you.

[SailorRob]

What is likely to be asked by Private Equity for this if & when it gets tossed back on the market

$6.45 or something north ? ;)

Good luck with that ..


What if there are 10 shares?

Would $64.50 be a fair price for the whole company?

What does the $6.45 have to do with anything? Don't we need another piece of information?

[Habits]

Order some As1an fluff now

[percy]

I am really looking forward to reading and looking at the prospectus.
Will need a great deal of cleavage.?....lol.

[kiwical]

I'm a pro TradeMe seller. Have been for 20 years. While the glory days and bidding wars are pretty much gone, I still make a decent living from the website. For casual sellers hocking off that fridge there does seem to be alternative options now. The free selling weekends is a pretty obvious attempt to compete with that. Overall my profits generally increase each year. I have room for more growth but the next stage would be employing staff. I prefer to keep ticking over as a do it all myself sole trader.

It's certainly no dead duck from where I'm sitting. I would very likely invest if it was relisted.

[percy]

I'm a pro TradeMe seller. Have been for 20 years. While the glory days and bidding wars are pretty much gone, I still make a decent living from the website. For casual sellers hocking off that fridge there does seem to be alternative options now. The free selling weekends is a pretty obvious attempt to compete with that. Overall my profits generally increase each year. I have room for more growth but the next stage would be employing staff. I prefer to keep ticking over as a do it all myself sole trader.

It's certainly no dead duck from where I'm sitting. I would very likely invest if it was relisted.

Thanks for your post.
So we should expect a high yield and low growth.?

[Habits]

I'm a pro TradeMe seller. Have been for 20 years. While the glory days and bidding wars are pretty much gone, I still make a decent living from the website. For casual sellers hocking off that fridge there does seem to be alternative options now. The free selling weekends is a pretty obvious attempt to compete with that. Overall my profits generally increase each year. I have room for more growth but the next stage would be employing staff. I prefer to keep ticking over as a do it all myself sole trader.

It's certainly no dead duck from where I'm sitting. I would very likely invest if it was relisted.

Have fees increased by much lately

[SailorRob]

I'm a pro TradeMe seller. Have been for 20 years. While the glory days and bidding wars are pretty much gone, I still make a decent living from the website. For casual sellers hocking off that fridge there does seem to be alternative options now. The free selling weekends is a pretty obvious attempt to compete with that. Overall my profits generally increase each year. I have room for more growth but the next stage would be employing staff. I prefer to keep ticking over as a do it all myself sole trader.

It's certainly no dead duck from where I'm sitting. I would very likely invest if it was relisted.

Would your decision not be based on the listing PRICE????

[hogie]

I only sell on Trademe during "No fees" promotions ... the fees have become extortionate and I believe Facebook Marketplace has already started eroding the customer-base for Trademe. I do the majority of my buying and selling on Facebook Marketplace now.

[clip]

Personally I find facebook marketplace quicker to sell, higher success rates from selling, and 0 fees means more money for selling the same things.

[Sideshow Bob]

Personally I find facebook marketplace quicker to sell, higher success rates from selling, and 0 fees means more money for selling the same things.

And generally no courier costs - or admin having to send something by courier.

Although plenty of scammers on FB marketplace.....

[kiwical]

Yes FB marketplace has it's own set of issues. No buyer protection. Plenty of "no-shows" for sellers. It's all a bit wild west. But if you are buying or selling something locally and tick all the usual safety boxes first it can be good. Surely though FB will eventually attempt to monetise it somehow.

[Baa_Baa]

My recent experience was a bit disappointing, selling a car, got a couple of emails from punters via the 'trademe ask a question', both of which looked suss, so I didn't reply. Sure enough Trademe emailed me a day later to say those emails were scams and not to respond or click on any links, luckily I hadn't.

Trademe have to sort out, imo, the scum who populate their site and have figured out how to masquerade as Trademe legitimate emails to sellers, when they're not. I haven't figured out how it's easier to scam a seller than a buyer, but I'm not inclined to do so, it's not my problem, Trademe should fix this.

Even being compared to the wild west, full of shonky dealers Facebook marketplace is an embarrassment.

Would I invest again in Trademe, yeah nah? It's past it's prime, needs to show growth, profit and returns to shareholders, which private equity will dress up any way they can, to do for their exit. Eyes on, this is end-of-life exit, which punters pay to own, not a bright future with growth and returns.

[Rawz]

Divided yield of 10% and priced on a 8 or 9 PE would be acceptable.

I base this on:

1) Private equity have ruined their name so who’s going to trust them for new listings.
2) FB market place hard to beat on the household items.
3) One roof is better than trade me property.
4) seek is better than trade me jobs.

Trade me win the motor, boats, tractors, diggers used private sales etc. other than that I see no growth so low P/e is appropriate and to make up for it you want double digit div yield.

Just my thoughts

[Muse]

Divided yield of 10% and priced on a 8 or 9 PE would be acceptable.

I base this on:

1) Private equity have ruined their name so who’s going to trust them for new listings.
2) FB market place hard to beat on the household items.
3) One roof is better than trade me property.
4) seek is better than trade me jobs.

Trade me win the motor, boats, tractors, diggers used private sales etc. other than that I see no growth so low P/e is appropriate and to make up for it you want double digit div yield.

Just my thoughts

agreed. but the PE and yield would need to be on a very sensible and maintainable basis. None of this "it's only a forecast PE/Yield of X" when X is up miraculously up 20% on the previous year or two which were in turn preceded by years of stagnation or decline. There would need to be an almost anti embarrassment pricing element to it, given the woeful quality of vast majority of floats occurring on the NZX over the last many years. Even then I most likely wouldn't participate. These marketplaces are increasingly filled with rubbish. Facebook marketplace is a scammers paradise. Trademe is probably just better suited to being a secondary to another private equity firm - they can all play hotcakes / musical chairs with it.

[SailorRob]

Yes FB marketplace has it's own set of issues. No buyer protection. Plenty of "no-shows" for sellers. It's all a bit wild west. But if you are buying or selling something locally and tick all the usual safety boxes first it can be good. Surely though FB will eventually attempt to monetise it somehow.

If a product is free, YOU are the product.

Already monetised.

[SailorRob]

Divided yield of 10% and priced on a 8 or 9 PE would be acceptable.

I base this on:

1) Private equity have ruined their name so who’s going to trust them for new listings.
2) FB market place hard to beat on the household items.
3) One roof is better than trade me property.
4) seek is better than trade me jobs.

Trade me win the motor, boats, tractors, diggers used private sales etc. other than that I see no growth so low P/e is appropriate and to make up for it you want double digit div yield.

Just my thoughts

Strongly agree and with what Fiordland Moose said.

You can't just invest like Kiwical. There's a little bit more to this game.

[t.rexjr]

Trade Me has been inundated with scammers recently taking over people accounts and selling fake products pilfered from overseas classifieds.

I'd be very wary of the forward growth curve of the Trade Me platform. The discounted and free selling promotions are increasingly offered as a way of coaxing sellers back. There is still huge uasage but i suspect once FB decides to improve their marketplace platform it will take (more) huge chunks away from the used sellers market on Trade Me.

[Wheelspanner]

Yes, it happened to me just a week ago.
After updating my detail, another scammer came in requesting with "update your detail", which i did (without looking at their URL). Just 10 minutes later my bank notified me your credit card is blocked. This scammer's website must be well known to the Bank's security team and they acted quickly and saved my money. But I am having the hassle of going through new card, entering new card number into other honest merchants systems.

[Dlownz]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/trade-mes-finances-reveal-debt-load-equity-payouts-to-execs/SEJPE34BNZCBFKGRS6UYVGH3H4/

[kiwical]

The focus of many here seems to be on the core Trade Me website. I don't know what percentage of their total earnings that comprises. If they are listed on the NZX does that mean are all their other fingers in the pie or outright ownership businesses are not part of that? (homes.co.nz, Trade Me insurance, Findsomeone, pay station, holiday houses, motorweb, autobase, tradevine) They also have, or did have, investments in sharesies $44.6m and harmoney <- probably not going so great that one.

[nztx]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/trade-mes-finances-reveal-debt-load-equity-payouts-to-execs/SEJPE34BNZCBFKGRS6UYVGH3H4/


Anyone worked out where the $1.6 Billion they borrowed went ?

seems like a h4ll of a lot of hock for an online market place .. did PE owners want their dough in one lot
in a h4ll of a hurry ? ;)

[whatsup]

Who in HE!! would anyone ever invest in trademe123 or 100 what a mess/stuff up of a share it now has become $1.6 BILLION debt, you have to be joking, if it is offered then how about leaving the debt with the fish heads and price it at a P E of 2, it then might have a chance of being taken up.

[Waltzing]

tack så mycket. for posting the link.... tangled web ...

[nztx]

Who in HE!! would anyone ever invest in trademe123 or 100 what a mess/stuff up of a share it now has become $1.6 BILLION debt, you have to be joking, if it is offered then how about leaving the debt with the fish heads and price it at a P E of 2, it then might have a chance of being taken up.


Seen the $100 m return of Capital / Equity in the most recent accounts ?

Another $300m or $400m of related party debt repaid - looks like funded as part of the $1.6 Billion

Was that all added to slate on USD Hock borrowed up ?

How much did this outfit make - a Loss or $25 mil ?


What was the Interest charge against local income - $150 m odd ?

Where are interest rates & exchange rates now or since headed ?


Must be a huge band of eager investors out there really wanting to step into the fray
and help PE pay back the $1.6 accumulated hock on all the c*cked up time they
have held the show - in the eyes of those in PE's Head Office :)

Would they accept paua and pipi shells for shares they want to quit and be able to
give any wanting to risk it a Call option back, if all turned to crap and it sunk under
the large pool of US Debt they have stacked in there ?

At worst at Liquidator's values who on earth would pay the amounts they have on the card for
all the various forms of Intangibles in latest reports ? ;)

It probably puts a whole new meaning on "going concern" .. :)

A quick change in the prevailing winds and it easily may start looking like "going down the toilet" instead ;)


So where did the Billions of Debt go - could it have been some very zealous Revaluations
of Intangibles .. then carefully extracted back out into PE's pockets ?

Many years ago when listed what was the Debt load then ? - less that $100m or $200m ? ;)


It might be worth $5.00 a share - if and only if PE pay back the $1.6 Billion they added
in hock during their ownership, but that probably wont happen :)

With the Debt load left onboard and most recent reported results - let's guess now 50c - 75c a share ? ;)




What are the usual warnings when PE get involved, do their usual thing on the target
and then look to disappear into the distance after the extraction exercise is done ? ;)