PEB - Pacific Edge Ltd

[Minerbarejet]

Ouch
So it's just the good news you want. Got it. :)
Helps to maintain a positive attitude in the current disrupted and plague ridden environment with bad news at every turn or so it seems.
Something like this is a shot in the arm. :)

[Harrie]

I would far rather read skeptics posts than cheerleaders, however it worries me given your track record with a2 milk in the early days, to see that you are now turning positive on this company.
Maybe I should scale back somewhat. Maybe you should look more closely at the P/E ratio and the lack of earnings as you did with a2 milk to make me feel more comfortable with my holding!

[Dlownz]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/377504
More good news

[850man]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/377504
More good news

It is very good news indeed but you read it here 1st thanks to Mr Psychic


Encouraging stuff, use of Monitor during Covid

https://www.auajournals.org/doi/abs/10.1097/JU.0000000000002107.12

[Mel]

Always good to see an opposing view, as it provides a shot of realism to the optimism that we often exhibit. Conversely, let's report and celebrate when there's some good news based on objective appraisals - as is the case with Psychic's latest post.


Encouraging stuff, use of Monitor during Covid

https://www.auajournals.org/doi/abs/10.1097/JU.0000000000002107.12

[Minerbarejet]

As long as it is just a shot now and then its fine.

Its not fine when it all degenerates into the, in many cases, unjustified and unsubstantiated, full scale bombardment level that we had on here for a number of years resulting in serious depletion of Shareholder value to around 7 or 8 cents

Good to see the reversing of Psychics polarity.
Was the battery in the wrong way round, mate? :)

[850man]

Psychic gets a thumbs up from me. Defo need a balanced view even if delivered with a bit of emotion. Forums like this would be worthless if it was just a mutual pumping contest

[Balance]

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/PEB/377579/352596.pdf

Institutional holders continue to 'quietly' lighten up their stake in PEB.

[Greekwatchdog]

And they also sold down Asset Plus. They buy and sell all the time. Get this, SP was up today go figure?? ZZZZ

[thegreatestben]

Lighten not slash and burn

[Retired Doc]

Greetings all and sundry ...
As a long term holder in this corporate, with its fluctuating fortunes over the years, I thought that on the reading of Michael Lewis's latest; "The Premonition" would give a fundamental insight as to the reasons for the various delays / obfuscations etc in obtaining the 'permissions' that are required to succeed in the American health system.
Chapter six - The Red Phone - Page 157 et seq - gives one a good understanding of the tribulations of dealing with the internecine "snakes and ladders" of the health bureaucracy in the USA.
Enjoy.



Disc: Holding 10k @ 26c [ after many ups and downs ]

Yes Yottie. At your prompting I went back to "The Premonition" which I have as an audiobook and reprised from chapter six and it certainly does give some general background insights (quite alarming) into the scandalously capricious nature of the health system that PEB has been trying to negotiate. Thanks for the reminder.:)
PS Take a look at "Dr Death" streaming on TV One for further confirmation.

[Balance]

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/PEB/377579/352596.pdf

Institutional holders continue to 'quietly' lighten up their stake in PEB.

So Salt has gone from nearly 12% at the beginning of the year and as tracked through their SPHs this year, are now down to 6.95%.

[calledone]

So Salt has gone from nearly 12% at the beginning of the year and as tracked through their SPHs this year, are now down to 6.95%.

Yes, quite a substantial reduction but at least ANZ has been increasing and their average holding now stands at $1.06.

[pierre]

Yes, quite a substantial reduction but at least ANZ has been increasing and their average holding now stands at $1.06.

Yes, meantime the SP is slowly creeping north - looks like PEB could open at 128 today.

[Balance]

Yes, meantime the SP is slowly creeping north - looks like PEB could open at 128 today.

Good, isn’t it?

[Leftfield]

Yes, meantime the SP is slowly creeping north - looks like PEB could open at 128 today.

The patient are being well rewarded Pierre.

[Greekwatchdog]

Someone just purchased a chunk at $1.28.

[pierre]

The patient are being well rewarded Pierre.

That's true LF - and there are more rewards to come for those who have the intestinal fortitude to stay on the PEB roller coaster. It's not always an easy ride though is it?

Better to be patient than to be a patient needing PEB's products, but it's great to know their technology is widely available in NZ, and increasingly in other markets, to help those unfortunate enough to require it.

[Leftfield]

That's true LF - and there are more rewards to come for those who have the intestinal fortitude to stay on the PEB roller coaster. It's not always an easy ride though is it?
Better to be patient than to be a patient needing PEB's products, but it's great to know their technology is widely available in NZ, and increasingly in other markets, to help those unfortunate enough to require it.

Agree.... the moral side of investments is important (well, to me at least) ........so no gambling stocks, no mining, no tobacco etc (yes, I appreciate, not for everyone...call me crazy - but it eliminates a lot of crap), so something like PEB, FPH (my two largest holdings these days) makes me sleep well.

[Biscuit]

........so no gambling stocks, no mining, ........

I bet you use the products of mining though?

[Merc]

I wonder how much this has to do with the Reserve Bank not changing the rate plus bored people at home in Lockdown?

The Good Returns Newsletter on Friday made some comments on this.

[McPussPuss]

Interesting price action the past week. A string of higher closes coming all of a sudden after being in a range, maybe the handful of recent positive releases is having an effect now after some insto's lightened themselves up recently.

[calledone]

Interesting price action the past week. A string of higher closes coming all of a sudden after being in a range, maybe the handful of recent positive releases is having an effect now after some insto's lightened themselves up recently.

Yes, the price was being squashed for a while now. I think the combination of lockdown effects and instos probably done unloading for the time being is probably causing this bounce. But knowing there are a number of potential positive price sensitive news this financial year, could this bounce indicate something else? Wonder if we will see some other good news before next months newsletter!

[McPussPuss]

Looking at the price sensitive announcements over the past 12+ months they have all seemed to genuinely take the market by surprise......no precedent for leaks with PEB in my opinion. All good if there is something in the pipeline though!

[thegreatestben]

Happy for it to creep up to the $1.50 mark :)

[Riskkiwi]

1.20-1.25 big selers done ... target old highs now

[Maxtrade]

Yes, the price was being squashed for a while now. I think the combination of lockdown effects and instos probably done unloading for the time being is probably causing this bounce. But knowing there are a number of potential positive price sensitive news this financial year, could this bounce indicate something else? Wonder if we will see some other good news before next months newsletter!

Yeah finally that block at 1.25 has cleared out, now the SP can naturally progress in a positive direction. Also many new investors are starting to hear about PEB with the ongoing positive news in the media. So we should see a larger volume on the buy side pushing through, especially now that the various institutions have mostly completed their portfolio rebalances. A positive update from PEB next will surely push SP to finally break 1.40 (as analysts had forecast a while back). With continued good news 1.5 might be the next resistance level.

[Leftfield]

Yeah finally that block at 1.25 has cleared out, now the SP can naturally progress in a positive direction. Also many new investors are starting to hear about PEB with the ongoing positive news in the media.....

Nice day for holders, long may it continue. Bollinger bands squeezed (can be painful)..... poised to take off.

[pierre]

Nice day for holders, long may it continue. Bollinger bands squeezed (can be painful)..... poised to take off.

Sure was a nice day LF - PEB now close to 25% of my portfolio value today. More to come.:t_up:

[Leftfield]

Sure was a nice day LF - PEB now close to 25% of my portfolio value today. More to come.:t_up:

Good on you Pierre, 30% of my portfolio and 120% up on my DCA so very happy....and that's after bought a few more yesterday. ;) (I suspect I'm not as patient as you as I got out for several years, however got back in last lockdown as things started to change.) As Percy would say, 'Well positioned."

I'm expecting good news soon maybe an update from the Singapore trials plus maybe some news on a new CEO......

[Minerbarejet]

Things looking a bit skinny on the sell side.:)

[calledone]

Things looking a bit skinny on the sell side.:)

I think people might be wondering "why on earth is this happening! without any kind of known news or without any kind of street talk". My theory is someone or some insto wants the price pushed up to some value for whatever reason! So who wants to sell now lol!

[Greekwatchdog]

I see late last week Illumina bought a Cancer Diagnostic business. https://www.tipranks.com/news/illumina-acquires-healthcare-firm-grail

[calledone]

I see late last week Illumina bought a Cancer Diagnostic business. https://www.tipranks.com/news/illumina-acquires-healthcare-firm-grail

Yeah read that, but certainly hope PEB will not cave into being bought out unless it's some kind of partnership.

[pierre]

I think people might be wondering "why on earth is this happening! without any kind of known news or without any kind of street talk". My theory is someone or some insto wants the price pushed up to some value for whatever reason! So who wants to sell now lol!

FOMO at play here I think. Can't recall which one, but earlier this year a broker had a target price of $1.40 - that's now gone (SP 143 as I write). Another broker had a target of 160 - doesn't seem too far fetched based on today's action.

[whatsup]

$1-50 here we come.

Imagine what will happen to the S P "IF " a U S pharma wants in !!

[Ggcc]

Jeepers what the heck is going on here?? insider knowledge/trading?? FOMO?? I just had a shower and earned more than my monthly wage by the time I got out.

[Minerbarejet]

Salt funds selling down and tidying up their accounts probably accounted for the undetected depressed price at the 1.20 mark.

With the handbrake off there seems to be a rerate in progress.:)

[Leftfield]

Salt funds selling down and tidying up their accounts probably accounted for the undetected depressed price at the 1.20 mark.
With the handbrake off there seems to be a rerate in progress.:)

Hope you doing well Miner, you've been a staunch advocate for PEB and I've much appreciated your contributions over the years. GLH.

[Minerbarejet]

Hope you doing well Miner, you've been a staunch advocate for PEB and I've much appreciated your contributions over the years. GLH.
Yes, pretty good so far on paper.
My term deposits of unknown length and unknown interest rate appear to be well in excess of current bank rates at the moment even given the seven years it has taken to get here.:)

[pierre]

Oops - down she goes. FOMO definitely well underway earlier today.

[Minerbarejet]

Oops - down she goes. FOMO definitely well underway earlier today.
Followed by the inevitable tree shaking to shake out day traders as it peaked.

[pierre]

Followed by the inevitable tree shaking to shake out day traders as it peaked.

Yep - need the next good news announcement to sustain much northward movement from the current level.

[Harrie]

While there is no new news currently, its just a matter of time before Cxbladder becomes the gold standard globally for an initial diagnostic tool. Its in the interests of both insurance companies and clients to use Cxbladder initially to determine more reliably than existing procedures the possibility that a cancer exists or not before any expensive invasive proceedure with the risk of further infection and discomfort is used. My understanding is that there is a NPV of 98% for Cxbladder. I think that if I got that result I would be happy to not have to undo go any further investigation.

There is obviously vested interest at play here. My understanding is that with HPV (Human Papiloma virus) the diagnostic test which requires a cervical smear, there is a lot more cost associated with this including long training times for screeners plus fees and collection costs, than a self administered PCR (polymerase chain reaction) test. This is a vaginal swab costing $4.50 plus collection costs which are a lot lower than costs associated with a smear test, which is $40.00 plus a collection fee of $63.00. In addition the reliability of a PCR test is far greater than a smear test which even among experienced screeners has a success rate of 60 to 70%

It has taken some time for the PCR test to gain ascendancy as the gold standard simply not because of the science but because there is more money to be made out of ongoing smear tests. Its called ongoing renewable income streams.
Its just a matter of time before knowledge of alternatives, with a wider dispersion of information for Cxbladder to gain more traction and with it an exponential acceptance. This would also be helped with insurers paying out for further investigative procedures only after an initial investigation through a simple urine test showed further investigation was necessary.

As they say, it won't happen overnight but it will happen, but it might happen sooner than we think!

[calledone]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/378145

Dual listing in ASX coming up.

[thegreatestben]

Would this be why the SP jumped up in the last week?

[Balance]

Would this be why the SP jumped up in the last week?

Hope it's not a repeat of PX1 ! :scared:

[zs_cecil]

Hmm.. are we going to see a revenue growth from Australia soon?

[Minerbarejet]

Hmm.. are we going to see a revenue growth from Australia soon?

Quite possibly, they have been hammering away at the thicker side of the Tasman Plate for quite some time. :)

[Riskkiwi]

should have gone NASDAQ

[zs_cecil]

Quite possibly, they have been hammering away at the thicker side of the Tasman Plate for quite some time. :)

It makes this listing more meaningful if this is the case. Let's wait and see. :-)

[Maxtrade]

should have gone NASDAQ

You would think so with US being their key market currently.

[calledone]

I think people might be wondering "why on earth is this happening! without any kind of known news or without any kind of street talk". My theory is someone or some insto wants the price pushed up to some value for whatever reason! So who wants to sell now lol!

So maybe my theory was right. Anyone know how they price the SP when cross listing? One thing being in ASX is we could see much wilder swings in SP, just look at BD1 for eg. But PEB at the moment is a lot more stable and has more focused potential than BD1 so maybe this could be a more meaningful listing.

[Minerbarejet]

You would think so with US being their key market currently.
More to follow perhaps.

One step at a time.

The cxBladder market in the US is not assured yet but I think there may be some stirrings in the land of Oz sufficient to warrant a listing.

[whatsup]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/378145

Dual listing in ASX coming up.

Im picking that the Aust instos said " we are interested " to the PEB fish heads but only when you are listed in Aust !!

[LEMON]

I will pick up some more shares today, this is good news, almost recovered my big A2 loses with PEB, may the good times continue

[winner69]

Share price should doublenow-- maybe not double but least +50%

[Getty]

Share price should doublenow-- maybe not double but least +50%

Wow, what an easy way to get rich.

Without improving the fundamentals of a company, all they have to do is list on the ASX for 50% gain.

Lets hope all NZX companies list on ASX speedy as.

[calledone]

Share price should doublenow-- maybe not double but least +50%

What are the chances of PEB becoming the next ATM (I mean like how it was in 2017 for ATM)!. Hopefully this wont turn out to be like PX1 lol.

[850man]

What are the chances of PEB becoming the next ATM (I mean like how it was in 2017 for ATM)!. Hopefully this wont turn out to be like PX1 lol.
Perhaps safer to wish PEB a future along the lines of FPH :t_up:

[calledone]

Perhaps safer to wish PEB a future along the lines of FPH :t_up:

Maybe a partnership of some kind with someone like GlaxoSmithKline may do that.

[Minerbarejet]

Maybe a partnership of some kind with someone like GlaxoSmithKline may do that.
We have been down that road.

[barney]

should have gone NASDAQ

This topic came up at the last ASM. The question was answered by Anatole Masfen who said they had looked at the NASDAQ but there were a lot of risks involved in a NASDAQ listing at the moment. I can't recall what those risks were but he did mention that had PEB listed on the NASDAQ at some point then PEB would no longer exist today.

[Greekwatchdog]

The timing is very interesting Half Year closes in 1 month. They will need to sell the story to those Aussies so there may be something brewing. Let us not forget they did want to raise more cash to grow.. Exciting times..

[stoploss]

Why do the journo's at Good returns keep saying this is at all time highs ?


SELL
03/02/2014
-7,500
NZD
175
13,125.00
39.38
13,085.62

[Harrie]

Wouldn't get too excited about the dual listing because at the end of the day its the fundamentals that count. What it does do though is provide more liquidity and also open up bigger opportunities for Australian institutions and investors to research the company more thoroughly. It also opens up the opportunity to more easily fund capital raises if required. It certainly is a positive move with absolutely no negatives. A smaller advantage for Aussy investors is the fact that no currency conversion needs to take place. Trades can be settled in A$.
Very positive comment along with this announcement, which has a greater impact than dual listing, is the growing lab throughput. This is the metric that will drive the SP

[blu3]

Newbie question: when a dual listing is being put in place, I would have assumed that all the existing public shares would initially be exclusively held on the NZX exchange, so where are ASX buyers buying their shares from? Seeing the discrepancy between the share price of other dual listed stocks (e.g.: NZZ.DGC and ASX.DGL), I would have thought that shares being sold on one exchange would not be available to be bough from both exchanges? Does it mean that it's like a second IPO for PEB and that they will raise some more capital by making some of their own shares available on the ASX exchange?

[Retired Doc]

Newbie question: when a dual listing is being put in place, I would have assumed that all the existing public shares would initially be exclusively held on the NZX exchange, so where are ASX buyers buying their shares from? Seeing the discrepancy between the share price of other dual listed stocks (e.g.: NZZ.DGC and ASX.DGL), I would have thought that shares being sold on one exchange would not be available to be bough from both exchanges? Does it mean that it's like a second IPO for PEB and that they will raise some more capital by making some of their own shares available on the ASX exchange?

Great question as I am also uncertain how this works and look forward to some enlightenment if someone has the time? TIA

[t.rexjr]

Newbie question: when a dual listing is being put in place, I would have assumed that all the existing public shares would initially be exclusively held on the NZX exchange, so where are ASX buyers buying their shares from? Seeing the discrepancy between the share price of other dual listed stocks (e.g.: NZZ.DGC and ASX.DGL), I would have thought that shares being sold on one exchange would not be available to be bough from both exchanges? Does it mean that it's like a second IPO for PEB and that they will raise some more capital by making some of their own shares available on the ASX exchange?

Shares can be sold on either exchange. Via a broker... DIY trading accounts cant do it as far as I'm aware...

[mondograss]

You can transfer your shares from one exchange to another, your broker normally has a form for doing it but I think you can also do it via the share registry that PEB uses. This will presumably be something that PEB facilitates automatically when they dual list. Thereafter the shares just get shuffled from one exchange to the other as necessary. There's no need for them to do it by raising capital.

[winner69]

You can transfer your shares from one exchange to another, your broker normally has a form for doing it but I think you can also do it via the share registry that PEB uses. This will presumably be something that PEB facilitates automatically when they dual list. Thereafter the shares just get shuffled from one exchange to the other as necessary. There's no need for them to do it by raising capital.

Brokers call it 'shunting' shares back and forth across the Tasman

[Harrie]

Newbie question: when a dual listing is being put in place, I would have assumed that all the existing public shares would initially be exclusively held on the NZX exchange, so where are ASX buyers buying their shares from? Seeing the discrepancy between the share price of other dual listed stocks (e.g.: NZZ.DGC and ASX.DGL), I would have thought that shares being sold on one exchange would not be available to be bough from both exchanges? Does it mean that it's like a second IPO for PEB and that they will raise some more capital by making some of their own shares available on the ASX exchange?

I'm not exactly sure about the mechanisms used to have NZ shares listed in $A and transacted in $A on the ASX, but what I do know is that no new shares are issued. The price in $A on the ASX will convert to the NZ$ equivilent in NZ at around the NZ$/A$ mid rate. eg NZ$ 1.42 would show on the ASX as approx A$1.36. This would need to be the case otherwise arbitrage opportunities between the two exchanges would exist for exactly the same share. Dual listing has been achieved many times before eg ATM to A2M.

This is a brilliant move and provides a much wider exposure for PEB in Australia and globally

[blu3]

Thanks a lot for all the answers, much appreciated!

[Retired Doc]

Thanks a lot for all the answers, much appreciated!

Ditto. I appreciate the answers also.

[Harrie]

The medical profession seem to be reasonably slow in using new methods. There is a good reason for this and it comes down to the protection against legal liability from a false diagnosis using a method that has not been 100% sanctioned by the relevant professional authority. PEB have compiled many years of evidence to show that their tests have a higher NPV score than an invasive cystoscopy procedure which urologists in the USA and worldwide are still using. Eventually it has to break through both from a cost and effectiveness point of view
I'm happy to wait. Its just a matter of time before it becomes a world wide accepted diagnostic and monitoring test Tick Tok Tick Toc

[Minerbarejet]

The medical profession seem to be reasonably slow in using new methods. There is a good reason for this and it comes down to the protection against legal liability from a false diagnosis using a method that has not been 100% sanctioned by the relevant professional authority. PEB have compiled many years of evidence to show that their tests have a higher NPV score than an invasive cystoscopy procedure which urologists in the USA and worldwide are still using. Eventually it has to break through both from a cost and effectiveness point of view
I'm happy to wait. Its just a matter of time before it becomes a world wide accepted diagnostic and monitoring test Tick Tok Tick Toc
That high NPV score in the upper 90s is also a very high bar for any prospective competitor to improve on especially in the Monitor situation.

[Harrie]

That high NPV score in the upper 90s is also a very high bar for any prospective competitor to improve on especially in the Monitor situation.

Not only that, but it takes a long time to build a long history of sustainable proof to supersede a proceedure which has a NPV value around 98%. Who would actually spend millions of dollars developing a diagnostic proceedure to beat that?.
Not sure there would be many takers

[Minerbarejet]

Lab throughput obviously cranking up a bit if not a replacement hire.

https://mail.google.com/mail/u/1/#inbox/FMfcgzGkbDccclfFgkFbKrWkxzrfMZMW

[thegreatestben]

Lab throughput obviously cranking up a bit if not a replacement hire.

https://mail.google.com/mail/u/1/#inbox/FMfcgzGkbDccclfFgkFbKrWkxzrfMZMW

You need to update your link, possibly referring to one of these roles:
https://www.seek.co.nz/pacific-edge-jobs

[Minerbarejet]

You need to update your link, possibly referring to one of these roles:
https://www.seek.co.nz/pacific-edge-jobs
Sorry, its on Indeed.











1 new Pacific Edge Diagnostics job in hummelstown



These job ads match your saved job alert *

























Clinical Laboratory Aide (https://www.indeed.com/rc/clk/dl?jk=0c70248c4d7147e0&from=ja&qd=RnZhMybXSk4M3QtTVGXWoemvDUpWFEDNK4iGlAM1fL0_fum vnI7wNhpXZtnjWTIi-cA6HIdApbiHxntNDRMm1ytRN7VTyfF3fQVb1Jn5VkOQ5ckdDWi Ks7HJbHG2QBMV&rd=fqiY8RJDvosIMzxD6v1HZV_MKnaSAFGAsD6kfERFt3g&tk=1fegcvvc7tga1800&alid=573d336fe4b0f90143fe1408)


Pacific Edge - Hummelstown, PA


The Clinical Lab Aide will provide support to Lab Technicians and the Lab Supervisor. Perform general laboratory duties of monitoring equipment temperatures,…

[Longhaul]

Old news - post removed.

[calledone]

Favourable article published in the AUA journal of urology this month for CxBladder monitoring during COVID. Might explain the lift today.

"CxM was feasible and safe for patients on surveillance for NMIBC and decreased frequency of cystoscopy. CxM may be used to further risk stratify patients to deintensify surveillance for NMIBC during the COVID-19 pandemic and beyond. Additional study of patient ease and acceptability is ongoing."

https://www.auajournals.org/doi/abs/10.1097/JU.0000000000002107.12

Thats old news.

[whatsup]

Pushing $1-50 !

[pierre]

Pushing $1-50 !

Closed at 149.

Half a million shares traded today - so reasonable volume. There were some decent transactions at the close but it did look like quite a bit of Sharesies action earlier in the day.

No news to drive this surge though, so FOMO might be the impetus once again - or maybe some Aussies buying on the NZX in advance of the ASX listing later this month.

Anyway, I'm happy to see SP continue its climb and will be pleased when the next announcement comes to underpin it.

Bonne chance to all holders.

[Mel]

Some local news that should enable higher adoption rates for CxBlabdder in NZ in the current environment:
Patients waiting too long for cancer diagnoses under Covid-19 restrictions - doctor | RNZ News (https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/450814/patients-waiting-too-long-for-cancer-diagnoses-under-covid-19-restrictions-doctor)

[Harrie]

Aussie insto's buying ahead of the ASX listing would be a definite play IMO pierre. The same thing happened before ATM listed as A2M on the ASX .
I'm not sure the SP is being driven exclusively by FOMO. I suspect its driven more by the expected growth trajectory of this diagnostic procedure being accepted worldwide when taking into account its efficacy in comparison with any current alternatives including cytology and cystoscopys.
Added to this is the reluctance of patients looking for ways of avoiding visits to public and private health facilities where potential covid contagion may exist

[pierre]

Trading halt

nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/PEB/378790/354281.pdf (http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/PEB/378790/354281.pdf)

[zs_cecil]

Interesting to see how much money it will raise this time...

[t.rexjr]

Its a $1bn+ company yet still needs a cap raise. That to me suggests the SP has gotten ahead of itself. Time will tell. The ASX listing announcement meant this was highly likely. Will be interesting to know for what cause/reason

[barney]

Setting up a Singapore lab perhaps ?

[pierre]

The company's statement says:

"PEB has requested the trading halt while it prepares a response to an announcement regarding its ASX dual listing application and intended capital raise."

I wonder who made the announcement - as far as I'm aware the company has made no mention of a capital raise at this point.

[Snow Leopard]

From ASX upcoming floats & listings

12937

[Minerbarejet]

Setting up a Singapore lab perhaps ?
Could be Barney.
Could also be Aus deciding to climb aboard and wanting their own CLIA approved cxBladder test processing facilities.
Whos got a spare lab we can upgrade?:)
Especially one with a background in developing one of the test components.

[winner69]

$70m is quite a lot

Advisors letting PEB down by forcing a 'disclosure' from PEB - bit embarassing

[Greekwatchdog]

Issue Price $1.20. Thats 20% discount on todays price. Well could be last chance to get cheap shares. Be nice to know where they are spending it.

[zs_cecil]

Where did that 70m and $1.2 issue price come from??

[Greekwatchdog]

On the link snow Leopard provided Screenshot_20210908_084205_com.android.chrome.jpg (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/attachment.php?attachmentid=12937&d=1631061886)

[winner69]

Where did that 70m and $1.2 issue price come from??

see Snowies post above - something on the ASX

[whatsup]

On the link snow Leopard provided Screenshot_20210908_084205_com.android.chrome.jpg (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/attachment.php?attachmentid=12937&d=1631061886)

Is it a SPP or cash issue ?

[pierre]

see Snowies post above - something on the ASX

Here's the link:

Upcoming floats and listings (asx.com.au) (https://www2.asx.com.au/listings/upcoming-floats-and-listings)


Seems a bit odd. The listing date is 23 September and the expected offer close date is 10 September - this Friday!


Hope this doesn't mean existing shareholders are going to be diluted.

[iamaskier]

Its a $1bn+ company yet still needs a cap raise. That to me suggests the SP has gotten ahead of itself. Time will tell. The ASX listing announcement meant this was highly likely. Will be interesting to know for what cause/reason

Would you be able to elaborate on this? Do you mean that one would normally expect a $1bn+ company to be paying their own way or that they should be able to borrow the $ from lenders instead? Cheers!

i'm a holder.

[LoungeLizzard]

Here's the link:

Upcoming floats and listings (asx.com.au) (https://www2.asx.com.au/listings/upcoming-floats-and-listings)


Seems a bit odd. The listing date is 23 September and the expected offer close date is 10 September - this Friday!


Hope this doesn't mean existing shareholders are going to be diluted.

That sounds a bit ominous. Hope retail investors are not going to get locked out of the capital raise - ie all pain, no gain.

[Ggcc]

Here's the link:

Upcoming floats and listings (asx.com.au) (https://www2.asx.com.au/listings/upcoming-floats-and-listings)


Seems a bit odd. The listing date is 23 September and the expected offer close date is 10 September - this Friday!


Hope this doesn't mean existing shareholders are going to be diluted.
Could it be a tying error

[Greekwatchdog]

More info https://www.nzx.com/announcements/378795

[thegreatestben]

Naughty ASX

[Snow Leopard]

So no capital raise.

[LoungeLizzard]

Phew! As you were.

[zs_cecil]

Phew!! Some plan behind the scene was revealed by mistake ;-p

[pierre]

It's now fixed on the ASX upcoming listings page.

[LoungeLizzard]

When Truscreen - also a NZ cancer detection company - listed on the ASX back in January it's share price rocketed from about 8c to 17c in the space of a week. Of course, it has now plunged to current sp of 6c! Hopefully PEB can get the rocket increase without plunging back to earth;)

[850man]

The machine is back on again. Seems some holders spooked by the cap raise comms resulting in a 5c dip in price.

[LoungeLizzard]

The machine is back on again. Seems some holders spooked by the cap raise comms resulting in a 5c dip in price.

Yep, weak hands at work. Nothings changed - could be an opportunity to get a 5c discount.

[winner69]

Phew!! Some plan behind the scene was revealed by mistake ;-p

Yep, only a matter of time before the cap raise becomes 'official'

[Balance]

Yep, only a matter of time before the cap raise becomes 'official'

What a stuff up.

Imagine revealing that the placement of $70m is going to be done at $1.20!

ASX’s fault?

[calledone]

Man!! That was interesting. I was hoping to apply for another big load at $1.2 but I’m sure the purpose of listing in ASX has always been to raise capital which If I remember correctly was discussed in passing by DD in one of the past meetings.

[LoungeLizzard]

Bit of a mess. Its provoked a bit of a sell down as existing holders think the placement might be offering shares at $1.20. Timeframe for placement might be pushed back - nothing has been approved by the Board at this stage.

[Minerbarejet]

I suppose they would be Monitoring the ASX listing process, were able to Detect an anomaly and Resolved the situation.

[bullfrog]

The conspiracy theory is that's it a cunning plan to pump the SP, claim your stake for the up and coming record date to get the discounted shares

[zs_cecil]

$1.2 might not be a bad issue price though if the "speculating" capital raise had a really compelling reason.
I hope it will bring us some good news on Singapore or Australia too.

Hm... ASX listing, $1.2 issue price, 20% discount capital raise...
these numbers sound very familiar... somewhere....another company with the first letter 'P'...

[850man]

Maybe the $1.20 was a number in mind 2 weeks ago, been a bit of a surge since then. Regardless, the ASX slip up has rocked the boat today

[Maxtrade]

Phew!! Some plan behind the scene was revealed by mistake ;-p

PEB announces it was misinformation. But you raise a valid point, could it be something in the works that leaked out early??? Seems odd to be announced by ASX out of the blue?

But then again maybe its like ATM Australian rumour of Nestle buy out. Would have thought ASX would have been more careful about announcing misinformation that was unsubstantiated though?

Seems odd

[barney]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/pacific-edge-share-price-drops-after-asx-announcement-withdrawn/4W5R4G5WIEA7UDR7WJ7JIM2WEA/

[pierre]

PEB announces it was misinformation. But you raise a valid point, could it be something in the works that leaked out early??? Seems odd to be announced by ASX out of the blue?

But then again maybe its like ATM Australian rumour of Nestle buy out. Would have thought ASX would have been more careful about announcing misinformation that was unsubstantiated though?

Seems odd

Very odd - especially as the initial ASX data not only included the CR total of $70m and price of $NZ1.20 per share - it also listed the names of two underwriters (one was Jarden but can't remember the other). The other odd bit of course was the highly unlikely closing date of 10 September.

Where would ASX get that much detail though? Maybe someone just confused PEB with some other outfit on the ASX that IS doing a cap raise?

All quite strange really.

Just got this from the story in the Herald:

"The ASX is understood to have uploaded incorrect information about a $70 million capital raise at $1.20 a share slated to close on September 10. Prominent firms Bell Potter, Jarden Australia and Forsyth Barr were named as advisers to the offer."

[850man]

Very odd - especially as the initial ASX data not only included the CR total of $70m and price of $NZ1.20 per share - it also listed the names of two underwriters (one was Jarden but can't remember the other). The other odd bit of course was the highly unlikely closing date of 10 September.

Where would ASX get that much detail though? Maybe someone just confused PEB with some other outfit on the ASX that IS doing a cap raise?

All quite strange really.

Just got this from the story in the Herald:

"The ASX is understood to have uploaded incorrect information about a $70 million capital raise at $1.20 a share slated to close on September 10. Prominent firms Bell Potter, Jarden Australia and Forsyth Barr were named as advisers to the offer."

"Aussies..... no surprises there"

[pierre]

Here's a quote from NBR in their story about the ASX stuff-up:

"NBR understands the capital raise information was genuine and released by mistake."

So who wants to guess:

a) on what basis they'll raise the cash?

b) why they suddenly need $70 mill?

Very intriguing - but also potentially incredibly positive.

[t.rexjr]

Here's a quote from NBR in their story about the ASX stuff-up:

"NBR understands the capital raise information was genuine and released by mistake."

So who wants to guess:

a) on what basis they'll raise the cash?

b) why they suddenly need $70 mill?

Very intriguing - but also potentially incredibly positive.

The statement only clarified that a raising was not approved by the board. It did not dismiss that a raising was in the pipeline...

[Greekwatchdog]

Its been a very clumsy announcement. Where there is smoke there's fire. Can someone confirm with a listing on ASX does that mean more shares issued? If so surely that would raise xxx cash..

[t.rexjr]

They don't have to issue more shares. The ASX/NZX/CHI... are merely exchanges to trade a companies shares

Personally I see little benefit to shareholders in listing on the ASX unless the company is looking for capital or perhaps attracting attention... It can bring with it a lot of volatility too...

[Greekwatchdog]

OK Thank you.

[whatsup]

The statement only clarified that a raising was not approved by the board. It did not dismiss that a raising was in the pipeline...

I wonder , IF, " that the capital raising was not approved by the board " YET !!

[Harrie]

How often does the ASX make a complete stuff up like that? That's critical market information which has caused a reasonably significant change in market valuation, a change that has come about through misinformation and should be actionable if it caused loss.
How true may be the unfortunate pre release of "unofficial" information be? It sort of ties up with the possibility that more cash is required for opening up new facilities and staff, but $70mil seems way OTT. For a start their lab throughput is increasing and they are getting remunerated by the insurers, plus they have surplus cash.
There is of course the possibility that they may wish to front load the sanctioning of their product with a large health provider like john Hopkins by paying off urologists who will be disadvantaged by its introduction in terms of a diminution of income gained from conducting cystoscopys? Bit of a conspiracy theory though!
The other positive is that raising money by 10th September is impossible, so hopefully it was a genuine mistake

[pierre]

How often does the ASX make a complete stuff up like that? That's critical market information which has caused a reasonably significant change in market valuation, a change that has come about through misinformation and should be actionable if it caused loss.
How true may be the unfortunate pre release of "unofficial" information be? It sort of ties up with the possibility that more cash is required for opening up new facilities and staff, but $70mil seems way OTT. For a start their lab throughput is increasing and they are getting remunerated by the insurers, plus they have surplus cash.
There is of course the possibility that they may wish to front load the sanctioning of their product with a large health provider like john Hopkins by paying off urologists who will be disadvantaged by its introduction in terms of a diminution of income gained from conducting cystoscopys? Bit of a conspiracy theory though!
The other positive is that raising money by 10th September is impossible, so hopefully it was a genuine mistake

I think that's a fair assumption.

So far as I can ascertain PEB has never raised that much in one CR before. The last few have been ~$20m to keep the ship sailing.

However, if a $70m CR is really under consideration there must be something major in the wind - and provides a clear rationale for the upcoming ASX listing.

Interesting days ahead - better start raiding the piggy bank to top up in case the shares are on sale soon at $1.20.

[Riskkiwi]

100% 100%

[Minerbarejet]

How often does the ASX make a complete stuff up like that? That's critical market information which has caused a reasonably significant change in market valuation, a change that has come about through misinformation and should be actionable if it caused loss.
How true may be the unfortunate pre release of "unofficial" information be? It sort of ties up with the possibility that more cash is required for opening up new facilities and staff, but $70mil seems way OTT. For a start their lab throughput is increasing and they are getting remunerated by the insurers, plus they have surplus cash.
There is of course the possibility that they may wish to front load the sanctioning of their product with a large health provider like john Hopkins by paying off urologists who will be disadvantaged by its introduction in terms of a diminution of income gained from conducting cystoscopys? Bit of a conspiracy theory though!
The other positive is that raising money by 10th September is impossible, so hopefully it was a genuine mistake

Working from home and frantic Covid related disruption might end up with a few mistakes attached.

Johns Hopkins have been doing their own commercial appraisal of cxBladder for a couple of years now.

Christchurch did a commercial appraisal some years ago before taking the bull by the horns so to speak.
The National Health Board was very surprised to learn after a while that the Christchurch waiting lists had nearly vanished due to the effects of cxbladder utilization.

If the States are picking it up bigtime it wont take long before there is a need for another CLIA approved lab or a large addition to the existing facilities in the States.

In addition a lot of the initial contact is done through physicians. I believe a Triage test indicating further investigation is required, results in the Urologist becoming involved

[Merc]

I missed the news this afternoon (Level 4, raining, reading a good book in front of the fire...) but once again this weird thing called "The Sharemarket" has me scratching my head in bemusement.

How does a company quelling rumours that they NEED money lead to a drop in the share price???

I've been a shareholder since around 2014 and have bought more over time. Sometimes in Capital Raising, others on the market.

There were a few years when it was consistently in the red... but I held on and bought more.... and have read various investment companies info on it.

Originally the info was "iffy." Could go either way.

This morning, before the book took hold, I read something:

https://simplywall.st/stocks/nz/pharmaceuticals-biotech/nzx-peb/pacific-edge-shares

A complete reversal on what they were saying a few short years ago!

This Sharemarket thing is weird!

(Signed: Property Investor from way back!)

[Brain]

If the States are picking it up bigtime it wont take long before there is a need for another CLIA approved lab or a large addition to the existing facilities in the States.



I look forward to that day. The Hershey lab can process 250,000 tests/year or approx $250m revenue for roughly $200m PBT.

[Balance]

Its been a very clumsy announcement. Where there is smoke there's fire. Can someone confirm with a listing on ASX does that mean more shares issued? If so surely that would raise xxx cash..

They could do a combination primary capital raise (say $35m) and a secondary selldown by NZ institutional shareholders & executives (say $35m).

That's what I believe Trilogy did when it dual listed on ASX.

[Minerbarejet]

70 million is a lot of money if we are to believe the amount bandied about

It is up in Clinical trial territory.

Methinks that they are about to resume or would like to progress with the pipeline attached.

https://www.pacificedgedx.com/products/pipeline/

No sense sitting on their laurels if the money is starting to come in and Im sure Parry Guilford would like to see things progress a bit quicker than they have.

There is a lot more to PEB than just cxBladder.

[850man]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/378854 further rebuffing the ASX announcement. They cannot subsequently do a cap raise for some time after this

[Minerbarejet]

Sharesies are into it by the looks of the depth :)

[Balance]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/378854 further rebuffing the ASX announcement. They cannot subsequently do a cap raise for some time after this

Not at all.

[Harrie]

Looks to me that this "unofficial" statement has spooked the market somewhat which is a bit unfortunate. Its created uncertainty around where that information has come from and could a capital raise be a possibility in the near future. This all culminates in knocking a good 4c off the SP

[Brain]

Looks to me that this "unofficial" statement has spooked the market somewhat which is a bit unfortunate. Its created uncertainty around where that information has come from and could a capital raise be a possibility in the near future. This all culminates in knocking a good 4c off the SP

Not to worry though as a month ago it was trading at $1.15 ish

[Retired Doc]

Not at all.
Sorry Balance for clarity do you mean that you confirm that PEB would not be able to have a Cap raise in the near future or that you contradicted that statement. Thanks

[Balance]

Sorry Balance for clarity do you mean that you confirm that PEB would not be able to have a Cap raise in the near future or that you contradicted that statement. Thanks

PEB will be going ahead with the capital raise.

The statement today simply reaffirms the statement yesterday that the board has not as yet ‘approved’ the terms of the capital raise as set up by the ASX site yesterday.

[pierre]

An updated report in today's NBR on the Pacific Edge confusion contains the following:

"An ASX spokesperson told the Australian Financial Review: "The application, which included the capital raising, was lodged and the information published in accordance with ASX's standard process when it receives listing applications".

Looks to me like a CR is/was definitely planned to be announced in conjunction with the ASX listing. According to PEB yesterday a CR has not been signed off by the Board so, someone has jumped the gun sending the docs to the ASX.

PEB saying this morning that the ASX information is incorrect doesn't necessarily infer they aren't going to proceed. Certainly the closing date of 10 September will have been wrong, but it also might simply mean they change the CR to $65m or $75m, or the issue price to a figure higher or lower than $1.20.

I bought a bundle of PEB shares in a November 2019 CR at 10cents each. Getting more capital in while the SP is at current levels is an intelligent move - provided they have a good use for the funds.

Watching with interest.

[Minerbarejet]

Not to worry though as a month ago it was trading at $1.15 ish
16 months ago it was at about 7 cents so its even less of a worry now.

[Harrie]

Small fluctuations in SP are actually irrelevant as are SP values one month or 16 months ago.
The question now is that the ASX was in possession of information that could only have come from PEB. As I have said before how often would market sensitive information have been released to the market by mistake on the ASX’s behalf. You can’t make that stuff up.
Assuming that there is some substance behind this announcement and $70 mio is required along with increasing lab throughputs with lower cash burn I think that could mean that additional capacity is required which is actually good news. This combined with the advertising for more staff seems to be the more likely reason for requiring additional funding IMHO. Who better than the Aussies to tap for this expansion?

[Harrie]

I’m also pretty sure that if there is a CR they will make sure existing shareholders also get a chance to buy at a reduced price based on their current holdings,

[winner69]

Harbour Capital reported as not knowing about any impending cap raise

Surely they would know ;)

[Balance]

Harbour Capital reported as not knowing about any impending cap raise

Surely they would know ;)

Chinese walls.

[zs_cecil]

PEB will be going ahead with the capital raise.

The statement today simply reaffirms the statement yesterday that the board has not as yet ‘approved’ the terms of the capital raise as set up by the ASX site yesterday.

Your view makes me nervous. It doesn't sound unreasonable. :-) It would be very disappointed to see part of the raise was for some major investors to exit.

I hope Harrie is right. Speculating 70m cap raise + 20m existing cash + potential cash flow improvement this FY sounds a lot of money. It'd better be used for extra staff and potential uptake in the markets other than US.

[dobby41]

Your view makes me nervous. It doesn't sound unreasonable. :-) It would be very disappointed to see part of the raise was for some major investors to exit.

I hope Harrie is right. Speculating 70m cap raise + 20m existing cash + potential cash flow improvement this FY sounds a lot of money. It'd better be used for extra stuff and potential uptake in markets other than US.

The announcement came from somewhere - I don't think it was 'made up'.
It may have been premature but it had to much detail for it to be a total lie - IMHO.

[Getty]

Chinese walls.

https://youtu.be/wFP-htHmNBk

[Count von Count]

The announcement came from somewhere - I don't think it was 'made up'.
It may have been premature but it had to much detail for it to be a total lie - IMHO.

That was my read on it too. Too specific.

[Minerbarejet]

From the Pacific Edge Pipeline - CxcolorectalCxcolorectal is a prognostic gene signature for patients diagnosed with stage II or stage III colorectal cancer. The test predicts the aggressiveness of the tumour, allowing physicians to make the best decision regarding treatment for the patient.
The gene signature passed a clinical study in Europe and Pacific Edge is currently refining Cxcolorectal to reduce cost and increase ease of delivery of the service. Cxcolorectal (Prognosis Gen I) has completed clinical trials and is preparing for commercial launch.

Just one of several possibilities if there is anything to it.

At twice the number of new patients annually than bladder cancer and probably a separate facility required this may be where it would go.

[850man]

That was my read on it too. Too specific.

Reflecting on the comms after this happened.... If ASX had made a mistake they would have issued a message that they did it. The fact that the correction came from PEB suggests the CR information came from them initially.

[winner69]

Reflecting on the comms after this happened.... If ASX had made a mistake they would have issued a message that they did it. The fact that the correction came from PEB suggests the CR information came from them initially.

Of course it came from PEB and their advisors …..ASX don’t make things up

No disputing that

[whatsup]

I wonder , IF, " that the capital raising was not approved by the board " YET !!

We still do not have a satisfactory answer to the debacle of what went on, not good from N Z public company enforcer the NZX

[barney]

https://www.odt.co.nz/business/global-domination-dunedin

The second to last sentence in this ODT article might be a clue.

[Maxtrade]

Would seem like a bit of a low blow to current investors to throw the SP under that much downwards pressure to allocate a capital raise of anything in the 1.2 range though. Might get a bit of negativity from current shareholders.

[Harrie]

My reading of it, so as to be equitable to all shareholders would be as follows: A CR of $70mio is around a 7% dilution based on current SP. NZ shareholders will be offered around that in form of additional shares at the issue price. eg a shareholder who has 100000 shares may be offered the chance to buy 7000 shares at the issue price. If the issue price is $1.20 then the shareholder pays $8400 and ends up with 107000 shares.
Personally I think that an issue price of NZ$1.20 is too low. Peb could easily raise NZ$70 mio with issuing less shares at a higher price especially given the wider pool of funds available on the Australian market

[Balance]

From ASX upcoming floats & listings

12937

Luckily Snow Leopard took a screen shot for posterity & for the record.

The information posted is too definitive to be fictitious, and the ASX would not have posted it unless it came from a credible source, like from PEB or the brokers representing PEB.

So what happened?

Note 2 critical items on the notice :

1. Expected Offer close date : 10 September 2021
2. Underwriter : Bell Porter, Jarden & Forbar.

Looks to me like PEB was supposed to go onto trading halt yesterday to facilitate the placement

BUT

Something happened which stopped the placement from going ahead.

So what was that something?

I do not buy for 1 second the directors not approving the above deal - $70m is a lot of money to raise for PEB and the company would have been happy to grab the money with both hands.

I think that the underwriters could not get sub-underwriters across the line (could be amount, could be price or could be both) - hence the withdrawal of the CR yesterday.

So it's back to the drawing board to come out with another CR deal imo.

[pierre]

My reading of it, so as to be equitable to all shareholders would be as follows: A CR of $70mio is around a 7% dilution based on current SP. NZ shareholders will be offered around that in form of additional shares at the issue price. eg a shareholder who has 100000 shares may be offered the chance to buy 7000 shares at the issue price. If the issue price is $1.20 then the shareholder pays $8400 and ends up with 107000 shares.
Personally I think that an issue price of NZ$1.20 is too low. Peb could easily raise NZ$70 mio with issuing less shares at a higher price especially given the wider pool of funds available on the Australian market


Assuming they raise $70m @ $1.20 = 58.3m new shares

Current shares issued = 729m

Assuming they offered all the new shares to existing holders the ratio would be approximately: 1 new share for every 12.5 held

However, they will probably do a placement for a large chunk of it to get traction in the Aussie market, with a pro-rata offer to existing holders for the balance.

Not saying these are the numbers, but for example: Say a $40m placement which leaves $30m for holders = 25m shares. That equates to about 1:29 held.

[Minerbarejet]

Luckily Snow Leopard took a screen shot for posterity & for the record.

The information posted is too definitive to be fictitious, and the ASX would not have posted it unless it came from a credible source, like from PEB or the brokers representing PEB.

So what happened?

Note 2 critical items on the notice :

1. Expected Offer close date : 10 September 2021
2. Underwriter : Bell Porter, Jarden & Forbar.

Looks to me like PEB was supposed to go onto trading halt yesterday to facilitate the placement

BUT

Something happened which stopped the placement from going ahead.

So what was that something?

I do not buy for 1 second the directors not approving the above deal - $70m is a lot of money to raise for PEB and the company would have been happy to grab the money with both hands.

I think that the underwriters could not get sub-underwriters across the line (could be amount, could be price or could be both) - hence the withdrawal of the CR yesterday.

So it's back to the drawing board to come out with another CR deal imo.
Could it not be all explained by someone unfortunately typing September instead of October in the close date for a Cap Raise?
Especially if the date of 10 September was already upfront with the ASX listing documents

[pierre]

Could it not be all explained by someone unfortunately typing September instead of October in the close date for a Cap Raise?
Especially if the date of 10 September was already upfront with the ASX listing documents

There are numerous possibilities about what went wrong but it's pretty clear the problem came from the PEB side.

I posted this earlier:

"An updated report in today's NBR on the Pacific Edge confusion contains the following:

"An ASX spokesperson told the Australian Financial Review: "The application, which included the capital raising, was lodged and the information published in accordance with ASX's standard process when it receives listing applications".

[Balance]

There are numerous possibilities about what went wrong but it's pretty clear the problem came from the PEB side.

I posted this earlier:

"An updated report in today's NBR on the Pacific Edge confusion contains the following:

"An ASX spokesperson told the Australian Financial Review: "The application, which included the capital raising, was lodged and the information published in accordance with ASX's standard process when it receives listing applications".

A broker usually facilitated the CR & ASX listing so it is not necessarily PEB’s fault.

What is clear as I wrote in my previous post is that something went awry with the CR.

PEB should have been in trading halt first thing yesterday morning to facilitate the placement.

Hope it’s not a case of the Australian institutions invited to sub-underwrite having a look and deciding the CR is not for them.

[t.rexjr]

Charts are always interesting... perhaps providing insight? ('We are but pawns in someone else's game' is a phrase that comes to mind)

12942

A mere clerical slip up at the end of the day... Doesn't change much other than providing folks with some excitement. The companies path is still the companies path.

[whatsup]

obviously the bad taste lingers in the mouths of current and possible PEB S Hers, how and when this "taste " disappears is a matter of interest to all atm !!

[calledone]

I've scaled down my holdings for now in the last 3 days which was quite painful to let go but I was disappointed with the lack of clarity on how and why the error happened. I don't care who made the error but as a public company it was PEB's responsibility to find out and report to the market more details. I think just saying "the information was incorrect" twice does not give any clarity. I'll still apply for a big portion if they do offer at a later date.

[Brain]

Possibly a number of people will view this as a chance to sell at 140 and buy back in at 120 and this will both cap the share price and weaken it. Not for me these games. I will hold on to my overweight position as The future looks good.

[thegreatestben]

I too will continue to hold and apply for more if there is a cap raise, pending details of course.

[jridler]

Charts are always interesting... perhaps providing insight? ('We are but pawns in someone else's game' is a phrase that comes to mind)

12942

A mere clerical slip up at the end of the day... Doesn't change much other than providing folks with some excitement. The companies path is still the companies path.

Still trading within a range, reaching higher highs and higher lows. If it breaches support of 1.21 then I may be concerned. Otherwise, nothing to see here folks. The trend remains bullish.

[Minerbarejet]

Still trading within a range, reaching higher highs and higher lows. If it breaches support of 1.21 then I may be concerned. Otherwise, nothing to see here folks. The trend remains bullish.
Id be concerned if it got under 8 cents again. :)

[850man]

Volume is not large. Perhaps people spooked by the annoncement that wasn't an announcement.

[jridler]

Id be concerned if it got under 8 cents again. :)

After first purchasing PEB shares in 2014 and having experienced the long, dark days that were the next 6 years (this forum had a very different tone during that time), I dearly hope that the days of 8c are well behind us!

[thegreatestben]

I think his shares only owe him 8 cents a pop.

[Beagle]

This company has a very long history of double speak. No we don't need more capital, no we definitely don't need more capital, actually, yes we do.

Good earnings are coming....lost track of how many times I've heard that over many many years. Its like the boy who cried wolf too often. I call B.S. How many capital raises have they had ? 8, 10 ?...sorry I have lost count there have been so many...

I'm calling it, they have been caught red handed by the ASX telling more porkies.

[RRR]

7 million sales revenue but loss making, and market cap of 1.2 billion! Only one product (CXbladder) which has not really changed the landscape of urology cancer diagnosis..good luck to holders

[RGR367]

.............................................Only one product (CXbladder) which has not really changed the landscape of urology cancer diagnosis..good luck to holders

Thanks as we all need that especially for those of us that got in back at 24 cents in mid June '20 :cool:

[Minerbarejet]

Maybe this happened

Brrr Brrr at PEB

"Hullo, ASX here"

"Can I help you"

" Yes that document for a cap raise attached to the Listing application has a closing date of September 10th."

"OMG how did that happen?"

"No idea, but as PEB is not even listed yet over here we cant see a cap raise being too successful by Friday.

"OK, we will have to reapply as that document is incorrect"


Market advised " document is incorrect"

What's " porkies" about that?

[Balance]

Maybe this happened ….

"No idea, but as PEB is not even listed yet over here we cant see a cap raise being too successful by Friday.

"OK, we will have to reapply as that document is incorrect"


Market advised " document is incorrect"

What's " porkies" about that?

Flaw with that scenario is that a CR is always done prior to a listing. Not the other way round.

[Minerbarejet]

Flaw with that scenario is that a CR is always done prior to a listing. Not the other way round.
The only information we had to work on was a listing being applied for by the end of the month. Hopefully.
Regardless, there was not enough time to do a CR by the 10th.

[Balance]

The only information we had to work on was a listing being applied for by the end of the month. Hopefully.
Regardless, there was not enough time to do a CR by the 10th.

Not true.

Companies do CR placements all the time within 2 or 3 workings days.

Have a look at PX1 and you will see exactly how it happens.

[Minerbarejet]

Not true.

Companies do CR placements all the time within 2 or 3 workings days.

Have a look at PX1 and you will see exactly how it happens.
OK I stand corrected.

[Harrie]

This screw up will disapear very quickly whether they go for a CR or not if they can show significant growth in lab test output, a new group association like Kaiser, adoption in Australia or somewhere else.

[Minerbarejet]

This screw up will disapear very quickly whether they go for a CR or not if they can show significant growth in lab test output, a new group association like Kaiser, adoption in Australia or somewhere else.

Or perhaps even show a payment for tests done for CMS prior to acceptance.

We are not running a US Medical Subsidy Scheme here.

[Harrie]

They have the proof, they have affirmations by the AUA, they have a methodology/ IP that no one in their right mind would want to spend millions on trying to beat, they have a sales force in the USA, so they better have some very good reason to want to tap existing and new shareholders for $70 mio. The only reason I can think of, and would like to think of, is a massive uptake in demand

[Brain]

They have the proof, they have affirmations by the AUA, they have a methodology/ IP that no one in their right mind would want to spend millions on trying to beat, they have a sales force in the USA, so they better have some very good reason to want to tap existing and new shareholders for $70 mio. The only reason I can think of, and would like to think of, is a massive uptake in demand

If they have exhausted the Hershey test facility of 250,000 tests per year and need more capacity then that would be a stunning achievement and probably unlikely. Fast tracking the trials and acceptance for other types of cancer as miner suggests would be a good use of the additional spondooli and shareholders would support that.

[zs_cecil]

If they have exhausted the Hershey test facility of 250,000 tests per year and need more capacity then that would be a stunning achievement and probably unlikely. Fast tracking the trials and acceptance for other types of cancer as miner suggests would be a good use of the additional spondooli and shareholders would support that.


I would imagine PEB will need a lab in Singapore since it is considered as a medical hub for its neighbor countries. They might also need a lab in a smaller scale for the Australian market. If PEB had gained some tractions in both countries, they might need to build the labs in early days just like what they did ten years ago in US. Speculating in a good way :-)

[psychic]

They have the proof, they have affirmations by the AUA, they have a methodology/ IP that no one in their right mind would want to spend millions on trying to beat, they have a sales force in the USA, so they better have some very good reason to want to tap existing and new shareholders for $70 mio. The only reason I can think of, and would like to think of, is a massive uptake in demand

Disagree, proof is what is still said to be needed, the AUA do not support it, there is a world of competition and development in this field.

The tests are not covered by US Insurers and I suspect, only in a small way as an adjunct through CMS and KP.

The last financial update did not support uptake of any scale and I will suggest that neither will the next.
The shares are absurdly priced for the evidence to hand and, as I have argued in the past, have got here on the back of four announcements that simply exaggerate reality.

Why might they need $70m from the Aussie? Because they will need this w/cap if to continue over the next several years. A cash raise after the Sept results come out will be awkward, and much better if they can do it while the SP is over the moon.

The ASX has a world of experience when it comes to dealing with liars at the top of a hole, the market there will not be so easily duped.

[Rawz]

The ASX has a world of experience when it comes to dealing with liars at the top of a hole, the market there will not be so easily duped.

Plexure managed to pull a quick one on investors when listing on the ASX. Raised heaps of cash only to see the sp halve because the business didn't deliver on its promises. Now it's raising heaps more at half the price.

Hope PEB delivers

[Balance]

Now that PEB has applied for ASX listing and showed its hand by initiating a $70m $1.20 sp CR - what follows from hereon in will tell us a lot about how the Australian institutions and investors view PEB as an investment.

Will the CR go ahead? At what sp and for how much?

The Australians are definitely more savvy when it comes to biomed & biotech stocks - they have many success stories to relate to and there is real depth in the market.

Watching with interest & hanging on to some of my shareholding.

[psychic]

The Aussie Healthcare market hasn't run with Cxbladder, odd that they think the insto's might.

[Minerbarejet]

The Aussie Healthcare market hasn't run with Cxbladder, odd that they think the insto's might.
Aussies mate, no surprises there.:)

[Harrie]

Disagree, proof is what is still said to be needed, the AUA do not support it, there is a world of competition and development in this field.

The tests are not covered by US Insurers and I suspect, only in a small way as an adjunct through CMS and KP.

The last financial update did not support uptake of any scale and I will suggest that neither will the next.
The shares are absurdly priced for the evidence to hand and, as I have argued in the past, have got here on the back of four announcements that simply exaggerate reality.

Why might they need $70m from the Aussie? Because they will need this w/cap if to continue over the next several years. A cash raise after the Sept results come out will be awkward, and much better if they can do it while the SP is over the moon.

The ASX has a world of experience when it comes to dealing with liars at the top of a hole, the market there will not be so easily duped.

One may possibly assume that with a name like psychic a little more understanding of human psychology would be a given. Motivation for different forms of human behavior comes down to basic self preservation which is manifested in greed, power, denial, distraction, lies, etc, anything to maintain or enhance ones own survival in an unequal world.
Vested interests are one of those manifestations of survival. Professional bodies act to protect their members from economic loss even if this is against the interests of those who would most benefit from a better solution to a problem either health or financial wise.
You say there is a world of competition in this field. Maybe, but the world is waiting for years of trials and data to prove that whatever this new test may be, why it would be more predictive than something that is already proven over several years of data collection. The AUA is already begrudgingly accepting Cxbladder as being more effective in detection of bladder cancer than a $4 grand invasive biopsy. They certainly are not shouting from the rooftops about it, but why would they when most of their members are on the cystoscopy gravy train.
Insurance companies are not that stupid as to continually pay out on cystoscopys when they can pay around 80% less for an alternative with a better NPV. Its just a matter of time and education which is more likely to come about through consumers, similar to PCR tests for HPV, nasal swap tests vs saliva tests etc

[Minerbarejet]

For those who may be interested here is a recently shared link for your perusal.

Its pretty big so it may take a while.

cxBladder is mentioned (eventually)


https://pc.icurology.org/DOIx.php?id=10.4111/icu.20210194

[psychic]

One may possibly assume that with a name like psychic a little more understanding of human psychology would be a given. Motivation for different forms of human behavior comes down to basic self preservation which is manifested in greed, power, denial, distraction, lies, etc, anything to maintain or enhance ones own survival in an unequal world.
Vested interests are one of those manifestations of survival. Professional bodies act to protect their members from economic loss even if this is against the interests of those who would most benefit from a better solution to a problem either health or financial wise.
You say there is a world of competition in this field. Maybe, but the world is waiting for years of trials and data to prove that whatever this new test may be, why it would be more predictive than something that is already proven over several years of data collection. The AUA is already begrudgingly accepting Cxbladder as being more effective in detection of bladder cancer than a $4 grand invasive biopsy. They certainly are not shouting from the rooftops about it, but why would they when most of their members are on the cystoscopy gravy train.
Insurance companies are not that stupid as to continually pay out on cystoscopys when they can pay around 80% less for an alternative with a better NPV. Its just a matter of time and education which is more likely to come about through consumers, similar to PCR tests for HPV, nasal swap tests vs saliva tests etc

Harrie. Thanks for the insights! :) My understanding is that an office cystoscopy costs around $350- $650. A single Cxbladder test costs more in the US. Not so in NZ and perhaps this is why it has been adopted here? Happy to be corrected on this?

Also, need to be careful with that NPV. It does not apply to all Cxbladder tests. Each test is designed for a certain stage of diagnosis or management.

I have followed the coverage decisions of the major US Insurers for years. No sign that they are warming to Cxbladder yet.

[psychic]

**CMS reimbursement schedule 2021 $234.21 for office cystoscopy.
Harrie - the AUA do not "begrudgingly accept Cxbladder" at all. They say Urinary biomarkers should not be used in place of cystoscopy.

[Ggcc]

Now that PEB has applied for ASX listing and showed its hand by initiating a $70m $1.20 sp CR - what follows from hereon in will tell us a lot about how the Australian institutions and investors view PEB as an investment.

Will the CR go ahead? At what sp and for how much?

The Australians are definitely more savvy when it comes to biomed & biotech stocks - they have many success stories to relate to and there is real depth in the market.

Watching with interest & hanging on to some of my shareholding.
My guess is that if they ask for $70 million there must be a good reason. Either sales have far exceeded what they thought was going to happen and that need to expand their sales and processing centre.

[Ggcc]

**CMS reimbursement schedule 2021 $234.21 for office cystoscopy.
Harrie - the AUA do not "begrudgingly accept Cxbladder" at all. They say Urinary biomarkers should not be used in place of cystoscopy.
I feel things in the medical profession take slow steps to change. They will change their mind when/if the US decide it is best for them to do so.

[Brain]

**CMS reimbursement schedule 2021 $234.21 for office cystoscopy.
Harrie - the AUA do not "begrudgingly accept Cxbladder" at all. They say Urinary biomarkers should not be used in place of cystoscopy.

When I google the cost of cystoscopy for the USA I find that there appears to be a huge variation in prices charged. Between $350 and $3500 has been mentioned. The lower amounts are for a doctors office procedure and the higher amount for a hospital procedure. Why would anybody pay $3500 for a procedure that can be done at a tenth of the price in a doctors office? This does not make sense.

[LoungeLizzard]

When I google the cost of cystoscopy for the USA I find that there appears to be a huge variation in prices charged. Between $350 and $3500 has been mentioned. The lower amounts are for a doctors office procedure and the higher amount for a hospital procedure. Why would anybody pay $3500 for a procedure that can be done at a tenth of the price in a doctors office? This does not make sense.

A cystoscopy is a very invasive procedure - most people wouldn't want it done in a doctor office and I wouldn't blame them. But here's the thing. The US don't have a Public Health system, so those people needing the procedure don't care about the cost - that will be paid by their private health insurer. So if there's no cost to you - why would you choose the cheaper $350 procedure? This is the advantage of the CXbladder test - it is much cheaper ($750) for the Health provider than the the hospital Cystoscopy and it's much better for the patient who doesn't have to endure an unpleasant procedure. And the test isn't designed to replace the cystoscopy - that may be required if the result looks bad - but it is an incredibly efficient, safe and certifiably proven detection procedure. Kaiser Permanente have endorsed it, and they are one of the biggest non-profit health providers in the US.

[Brain]

A cystoscopy is a very invasive procedure - most people wouldn't want it done in a doctor office and I wouldn't blame them. But here's the thing. The US don't have a Public Health system, so those people needing the procedure don't care about the cost - that will be paid by their private health insurer. So if there's no cost to you - why would you choose the cheaper $350 procedure? This is the advantage of the CXbladder test - it is much cheaper ($750) for the Health provider than the the hospital Cystoscopy and it's much better for the patient who doesn't have to endure an unpleasant procedure. And the test isn't designed to replace the cystoscopy - that may be required if the result looks bad - but it is an incredibly efficient, safe and certifiably proven detection procedure. Kaiser Permanente have endorsed it, and they are one of the biggest non-profit health providers in the US.

Yes that is the point that I was in the process of drilling down to. Comparing the price of a probably very painful office procedure and a non invasive urine test is comparing apples with potatoes. I am very sure that PEB would have priced their test as being the best price point to optimise profit since the test costs only $100 to do. As long as the insurance companies wil not force their policy holders into the cheap procedure the future looks very bright for PEB

[psychic]

Sigh, the stuff you read here

[LoungeLizzard]

Sigh, the stuff you read here

I'm guessing you didn't buy in 15 months ago at 14c?;)

The balls-up of the Capital raising aside - and it's price and terms - I like to think it may be a sign of expansionism to meet building demand. They do have $20m in cash to help fund current operations. Q1 throughput and cash receipts were double the previous quarter so my guess is that they need another lab and more staff. Q2 and Aus listing will tell the story. Watching and Waiting.
Disc. Holder from way back (15 months ago).

[Brain]

Sigh, the stuff you read here

Please explain further psychic. The pricing of CX bladder vs cystoscopy is very key to my understanding of the future of PEB. Maybe you consider me to be stupid and that is OK I respect your view but it would be good if you could explain the large variation in quoted cystoscopy pricing.

[LoungeLizzard]

Please explain further psychic. The pricing of CX bladder vs cystoscopy is very key to my understanding of the future of PEB. Maybe you consider me to be stupid and that is OK I respect your view but it would be good if you could explain the large variation in quoted cystoscopy pricing.

You are basically correct in what you have said - the range is $350-$3500 depending on where you get the procedure done. If you have no health insurance you would go for the cheap -in-office procedure - but I stand by what I said, if you privately insured why would you choose the cheap procedure if you are fully insured privately with low deductibles?
Getting Health systems to adopt new procedures/technology is like turning a supertanker around. US Health providers have contracts with hospitals to use their expensive facilities and equipment. Bio-marker testing - in the first instance - undercuts all that. But a non-invasive procedure that is also cheaper is a win-win. It will just take time to convince the skeptics, is all.

[psychic]

There are relatively easy office based procedures using a thin flexible scope and there are full blown operating theatre procedures using a rigid scope and often general anaesthesia. I don't know but suspect that biopsies are taken with the rigid scope. Guess it depends on what the Urologist is wanting to do.

[Harrie]

Why would PEB price their tests higher than a cystoscopy at a doctors office, and why are medical facilities like Kaiser adopting Cxbladder when they could do it cheaper in house. Think about it

[psychic]

I'm guessing you didn't buy in 15 months ago at 14c?;)

The balls-up of the Capital raising aside - and it's price and terms - I like to think it may be a sign of expansionism to meet building demand. They do have $20m in cash to help fund current operations. Q1 throughput and cash receipts were double the previous quarter so my guess is that they need another lab and more staff. Q2 and Aus listing will tell the story. Watching and Waiting.
Disc. Holder from way back (15 months ago).

Brain noted prev page that the US lab was good for 250000pa tests. They managed about 5000 tests last qtr worldwide, so a new lab would seem unlikely in the US? $70m ? That is a lot of fitout...

[psychic]

Why would PEB price their tests higher than a cystoscopy at a doctors office, and why are medical facilities like Kaiser adopting Cxbladder when they could do it cheaper in house. Think about it

You have zero evidence that KP have adopted. Saying they have a commercial agreement is one thing, adoption is another.
I have asked the question here before why the test is so expensive in the US.
The model works here in NZ at 1/3rd the price. Anyway, I've thought about it, what's the answer?

[LoungeLizzard]

Brain noted prev page that the US lab was good for 250000 tests. They managed about 5000 tests last qtr worldwide, so a new lab would seem unlikely in the US? $70m ? That is a lot of fitout...

But if throughput is double from last 1/4 and treble from a year ago - and only PEB know what may be coming down the pipe as far as acceptance by other providers is concerned - wouldn't they have to be thinking 1-2 years ahead? You don't get train new staff and get lab accreditation at the drop of a hat.

[psychic]

Double off a tiny base. Nothing.
**actually ...
Total Laboratory Throughput in Q1 FY22 was:
Up 79% on Q1 FY21
Up 9% on Q4 FY21
Up 35% on quarterly average from FY21

Oh yeah, and remember they were bleating on about how Q1 21 was down because of covid anyway right?

[LoungeLizzard]

If you are paying $US7,000 a year in premiums - the average in the US - as a client you are not going to opt for a cheap invasive procedure, when there is a non-invasive procedure available with equal or better detection rate. And in the US - as long as you have insurance - you do have the choice. For Kaiser they will have looked at the ratio of people opting for a hospital procedure compared to the cheaper in-office procedure and have worked out that CXBladder is cheaper OVERALL.

[psychic]

But there is not the confidence that Cxbladder offers an equal or better detection rate.
They are not there yet

[LoungeLizzard]

Double off a tiny base. Nothing.
**actually ...
Total Laboratory Throughput in Q1 FY22 was:
Up 79% on Q1 FY21
Up 9% on Q4 FY21
Up 35% on quarterly average from FY21

Oh yeah, and remember they were bleating on about how Q120 was down because of covid anyway right?

From PEB:

"Laboratory throughput has risen consistently over the last five quarters § 179% on the same time last year
§ 109% on the preceding quarter (Q4 FY21)
Cash Receipts from Customers also continue to grow as reimbursement success and volumes grow.
§ 242% on the same time last year
§ 121% on the preceding quarter (Q4 FY21)"





The jury is still out but SP doesn't lie - so far the market likes what it is hearing. Let's wait for Q2 eh?

[Balance]

You have zero evidence that KP have adopted. Saying they have a commercial agreement is one thing, adoption is another.
I have asked the question here before why the test is so expensive in the US.
The model works here in NZ at 1/3rd the price. Anyway, I've thought about it, what's the answer?

Is it because anything connected with healthcare in the US is damn expensive?

A good example :

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/why-do-covid-rapid-tests-cost-so-much-even-after-n1278934

But at $10 or $15 a test, the price is still far too high for regular use by anyone but the wealthy. A family with two school-age children might need to spend $500 or more a month to try to keep its members — and others — safe.

For Americans looking for swift answers, the cheapest over-the-counter Covid test is the Abbott Laboratories BinaxNOW two-pack, for $23.99. Close behind are Quidel's QuickVue tests, at $15 a pop.
In Germany, grocery stores sell rapid tests for under $1 apiece. In India, they're about $3.50. The U.K. provides 14 tests per person free of charge. Canada is doling out free rapid tests to businesses.

[psychic]

The figures I have quoted are the same only you have read them to be up 109% when what they mean is the quarter was 109% of previous (ie up 9%)

And yeah, share prices do lie, particularly when mislead and misunderstood. And there is buckets of both here.

(oops sorry - in reply to earlier post lounge lizard)

[psychic]

Is it because anything connected with healthcare in the US is damn expensive?

A good example :

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/why-do-covid-rapid-tests-cost-so-much-even-after-n1278934

But at $10 or $15 a test, the price is still far too high for regular use by anyone but the wealthy. A family with two school-age children might need to spend $500 or more a month to try to keep its members — and others — safe.

For Americans looking for swift answers, the cheapest over-the-counter Covid test is the Abbott Laboratories BinaxNOW two-pack, for $23.99. Close behind are Quidel's QuickVue tests, at $15 a pop.
In Germany, grocery stores sell rapid tests for under $1 apiece. In India, they're about $3.50. The U.K. provides 14 tests per person free of charge. Canada is doling out free rapid tests to businesses.

Thanks. Yes perhaps that is part of it? Interesting to see the article notes how expensive a PCR test is at $100, well ahh - isn't that what Cxbladder is?

PE were quoted as charging something like $1500 for a while there before the CMS rate was set. I just don't get it. Surely if your hope is to nibble into the cystoscopy market then the cost of that would be a consideration? The CMS rate for office cystoscopy is like $240. Add a cheap cytology test and you have the gold standard.

[LoungeLizzard]

The figures I have quoted are the same only you have read them to be up 109% when what they mean is the quarter was 109% of previous (ie up 9%)

And yeah, share prices do lie, particularly when mislead and misunderstood. And there is buckets of both here.

(oops sorry - in reply to earlier post lounge lizard)

What I mean is, SP is a reflection of market sentiment and valuation. And at the moment, the market likes what is coming out of PEB. Whether you agree with that sentiment- and you obviously don't, which is fine - is another thing. The market is what it is - up to the point that it isn't!

[pierre]

While it's always good to have robust debate I' m rather worried about Psychic's handle.

I think I'd feel more comfortable about my PEB investment if he/she would change it to "Sceptic". :)

[Harrie]

You have zero evidence that KP have adopted. Saying they have a commercial agreement is one thing, adoption is another.
I have asked the question here before why the test is so expensive in the US.
The model works here in NZ at 1/3rd the price. Anyway, I've thought about it, what's the answer?

What is the point of having a commercial agreement and not adopt it? Do you think Kaiser has nothing else to do than to go out and sign up commercial agreements with suppliers if they never intend to do anything about it?
The answer to my question to you is a legal one. I'm sure you can work it out

[psychic]

Huh? Quite common to have a commercial agreement between parties that specifies terms but does not require full adoption or exclusive use!

The tests are clearly useful as an adjunct in diagnosis, timely identification of high risk patients and deferment of cystoscopy in certain low risk monitoring situations. How often and in which situation the tests are being used is the question.

[Roskat]

Eight cancers could be diagnosed with a single blood test
For many cancers, diagnosis is a long and challenging process. A new blood test, however, could offer a much-needed simpler and more effective diagnostic technique. Called CancerSEEK, it has the potential to identify eight cancer types from one blood sample.



https://i0.wp.com/cdn-prod.medicalnewstoday.com/content/images/articles/320/320679/a-doctor-holding-a-blood-sample.jpg?w=1155Share on Pinterest (https://www.pinterest.com/pin/create/button?guid=2trKY9HKa5BH-1&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.medicalnewstoday.com%2Fartic les%2F320679&media=https%3A%2F%2Fcdn-prod.medicalnewstoday.com%2Fcontent%2Fimages%2Fart icles%2F320%2F320679%2Fa-doctor-holding-a-blood-sample.jpg&description=Eight%20cancers%20could%20be%20diagnos ed%20with%20a%20single%20blood%20test)Researchers have created a blood test that could detect eight cancer types.
In the new study, researchers reveal how the blood test demonstrated high sensitivity and specificity for cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/info/cancer-oncology/) detection in more than 1,000 people with the disease.
The team — from the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine in Baltimore, MD — recently published their results (http://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2018/01/17/science.aar3247) in the journal Science.
Worldwide, cancer remains one of the leading causes of death. It is estimated that by 2030, the number of cancer deaths will have risen from 8 million to 13 million (https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/understanding/statistics).
Early diagnosis is key to reducing cancer-related deaths; the earlier the disease is diagnosed, the higher the chances of treatment success. But sadly, many cancers are not caught until the later stages, and this is largely due to a lack of fast and effective diagnostic tools.
However, the Johns Hopkins researchers believe that CancerSEEK could bring us closer to a quick, simple way to detect cancer in its early stages.

Test produced high sensitivity and specificity
When cancerous tumors form, they release small fragments of mutated DNA and proteins into the bloodstream, and these can act as markers for cancer.
The new blood test works by identifying the markers for 16 gene mutations and eight proteins that are associated with eight different cancer types. These include breast, lung, and colorectal cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/155598.php), as well as five cancers — ovarian, liver, stomach, pancreatic, and esophageal — for which there are currently no routine screening tests for people at average risk.
“A novelty of our classification method is that it combines the probability of observing various DNA mutations together with the levels of several proteins in order to make the final call,” explains study co-author Cristian Tomasetti, Ph.D., an associate professor of oncology and biostatistics at Johns Hopkins University.
For their study, the researchers tested CancerSEEK on 1,005 individuals who had been diagnosed with non-metastatic forms of one of the eight cancers.
They found that the test was able to identify 70 percent of the cancers, with sensitivity ranging from 33 percent for breast cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/37136.php) to 98 percent for ovarian cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/159675.php). Sensitivity ranged from 69 percent to 98 percent for the five cancers that currently have no routine screening tests, the researchers report.
In terms of specificity, the test yielded an overall result of more than 99 percent. On testing CancerSEEK on 812 healthy adults, it only produced seven false-positive results.
As study co-author Kenneth Kinzler, Ph.D. — co-director of the Ludwig Center for Cancer Genetics and Therapeutics at Johns Hopkins — notes, “Very high specificity was essential because false-positive results can subject patients to unnecessary invasive follow-up tests and procedures to confirm the presence of cancer.”
What is more, the researchers found that their test was able to pinpoint the location of tumors for 83 percent of patients.

[Getty]

On TV the other night, they showed dogs that can sniff out bowel cancer.

So next time you are are sniffed out by a dog at the airport, dont throw away your stash, drop ya guts instead!

[Minerbarejet]

Eight cancers could be diagnosed with a single blood test


For many cancers, diagnosis is a long and challenging process. A new blood test, however, could offer a much-needed simpler and more effective diagnostic technique. Called CancerSEEK, it has the potential to identify eight cancer types from one blood sample.



https://i0.wp.com/cdn-prod.medicalnewstoday.com/content/images/articles/320/320679/a-doctor-holding-a-blood-sample.jpg?w=1155Share on Pinterest (https://www.pinterest.com/pin/create/button?guid=2trKY9HKa5BH-1&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.medicalnewstoday.com%2Fartic les%2F320679&media=https%3A%2F%2Fcdn-prod.medicalnewstoday.com%2Fcontent%2Fimages%2Fart icles%2F320%2F320679%2Fa-doctor-holding-a-blood-sample.jpg&description=Eight%20cancers%20could%20be%20diagnos ed%20with%20a%20single%20blood%20test)
Researchers have created a blood test that could detect eight cancer types.
In the new study, researchers reveal how the blood test demonstrated high sensitivity and specificity for cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/info/cancer-oncology/) detection in more than 1,000 people with the disease.
The team — from the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine in Baltimore, MD — recently published their results (http://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2018/01/17/science.aar3247) in the journal Science.
Worldwide, cancer remains one of the leading causes of death. It is estimated that by 2030, the number of cancer deaths will have risen from 8 million to 13 million (https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/understanding/statistics).
Early diagnosis is key to reducing cancer-related deaths; the earlier the disease is diagnosed, the higher the chances of treatment success. But sadly, many cancers are not caught until the later stages, and this is largely due to a lack of fast and effective diagnostic tools.
However, the Johns Hopkins researchers believe that CancerSEEK could bring us closer to a quick, simple way to detect cancer in its early stages.

Test produced high sensitivity and specificity


When cancerous tumors form, they release small fragments of mutated DNA and proteins into the bloodstream, and these can act as markers for cancer.
The new blood test works by identifying the markers for 16 gene mutations and eight proteins that are associated with eight different cancer types. These include breast, lung, and colorectal cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/155598.php), as well as five cancers — ovarian, liver, stomach, pancreatic, and esophageal — for which there are currently no routine screening tests for people at average risk.
“A novelty of our classification method is that it combines the probability of observing various DNA mutations together with the levels of several proteins in order to make the final call,” explains study co-author Cristian Tomasetti, Ph.D., an associate professor of oncology and biostatistics at Johns Hopkins University.
For their study, the researchers tested CancerSEEK on 1,005 individuals who had been diagnosed with non-metastatic forms of one of the eight cancers.
They found that the test was able to identify 70 percent of the cancers, with sensitivity ranging from 33 percent for breast cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/37136.php) to 98 percent for ovarian cancer (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/159675.php). Sensitivity ranged from 69 percent to 98 percent for the five cancers that currently have no routine screening tests, the researchers report.
In terms of specificity, the test yielded an overall result of more than 99 percent. On testing CancerSEEK on 812 healthy adults, it only produced seven false-positive results.
As study co-author Kenneth Kinzler, Ph.D. — co-director of the Ludwig Center for Cancer Genetics and Therapeutics at Johns Hopkins — notes, “Very high specificity was essential because false-positive results can subject patients to unnecessary invasive follow-up tests and procedures to confirm the presence of cancer.”
What is more, the researchers found that their test was able to pinpoint the location of tumors for 83 percent of patients.





We shall look forward to it after a lifetime of clinical trials and winding its way through FDA and CMS guidelines.
Dont see any reference to bladder cancer in that lot anyway.
But thanks for your efforts.

[LoungeLizzard]

Huh? Quite common to have a commercial agreement between parties that specifies terms but does not require full adoption or exclusive use!

The tests are clearly useful as an adjunct in diagnosis, timely identification of high risk patients and deferment of cystoscopy in certain low risk monitoring situations. How often and in which situation the tests are being used is the question.

Huh, indeed! No one is saying that Kaiser is giving CXBladder exclusivity or full adoption. That's not how the US - or any - health system work. What the agreement is saying is that Kaiser have accepted CXBladder as a valid procedure and will, as determined by the patient and their clinician, re-imburse PEB for the cost of the test. When the announcement was made we saw the share price double in a letter of days. Being accepted buy Health providers and added to their list of re-imburseable treatments is a major milestone for any health device or procedure. If PEB can get accepted by other major providers like Kaiser throughput/receipts/Share price will continue to accelerate dramatically. They are not there yet but anyone who invested in them early enough is pretty happy as of now.

[Count von Count]

The media release about the blood test for multiple cancers is an interesting one. The blood test was not that sensitive (picking up cancers when there is one there) for some of the cancers (about a 2 in 3 hit rate) but was specific (if there is a positive test, then it pretty much indicates the cancer is present). From the top of my head, I wold say that much of that is likely due to the relationship between the particular cancer and the mutation, and relationship between the cancer and the vascularity of the location of the cancer is present (the more vascular, the more likely the byproducts of the cancer cells are expressed in the blood).

CxBladder has a sensitivity of around 93% and a negative predictive value of 97% (a negative test is correct 97% of the time). They claim that handsomely beats the current gold-standard test (a bladder endoscopy). Of course, the indications for a bladder endoscopy are obvious (haematuria, or blood in the urine), whereas for the blood test, I imagine the manufacturers envisage this as a kind of yearly screening thing.

So what PEB are arguing is that there is a specific indication for their test, that it beats the current gold standard, and they accept that it has to be used alongside the gold standard for a while before it gains universal acceptance (and funding).

The other use of CxBladder is to monitor cancers once they have been proven to be present. So a once a cancer is found, and the profile is proven to be sensitive to the CxBladder test, then even post op / post radiotherapy the CxBladder can be used to monitor for recurrence of the cancer in a much less invasive way that a bladder endoscopy can. So this is a monitoring procedure, rather than a screening procedure.

Disclaimer: haven't had a good look at the data, but thought it would be helpful to provide a broad interpretation of terms used in clinical trials.

[Harrie]

Well said CvC and well balanced. Your comment about working alongside the Current gold standard IMO is exactly what is happening as more and more evidence is gathered to support the efficacy of Cxbladder both in initial testing and monitoring.
There is no evidence that I am aware of that would suggest that Cxbladder is inferior to the current gold standard in either initial or monitoring proceedures.
As Cxbladder inevitably gains momentum, urologists using the current gold standard start to open up the possibility of legal recourse when a patient suffers from infection or some other health issue as a direct result of this procedure especially if the result is negative. In the USA it’s all about protection from legal action for medical misdemeanor

[whatsup]

Very strong action into todays close, $1.45- $1.47 whatsup ?

[LoungeLizzard]

The sell-off after the listing/cap raise leak was typical market over-reaction. People are buying the dips as nothing has really changed. If the listing on the Aus exchange is going well, as PEB state, then it is still most likely to occur this month, with or without cap raise. I'm picking a good SP uplift on the back of getting access to a bigger and broader range of investors.
Disc. Holder.

[Harrie]

I wonder if the market is expecting an upsurge in demand from Australia and USA which will then naturally lead to Europe. Evidence has been collected now for over 7 years and with the majority of NZ DHB’s adopting Cxbladder as the gold standard along with the relationship with Kaiser, more and more evidence is being accumulated and documented, and it’s positive.
My other theory is, possible insider info. That’s a fairly big move right on the close. Someone is keen all of a sudden although not sure how many sellers were taken out to get that move?
Pure speculation on my behalf only.

[McPussPuss]

Might just be a run-up in price as it is expected to list on the ASX on the 23rd of September.

https://www2.asx.com.au/listings/upcoming-floats-and-listings

[whatsup]

Might just be a run-up in price as it is expected to list on the ASX on the 23rd of September.

https://www2.asx.com.au/listings/upcoming-floats-and-listings

Great find McP

[LoungeLizzard]

The original listing with the capital raise details, had that date as well. Looks like they are shelving the capital raise for now perhaps - although who can really tell? It does seem they are sticking with the 23/9 listing date which is good - the sooner the better!

[Harrie]

I wonder if they have dropped the CR because an institutional investor in Australia has been granted a placement of shares at an agreed price similar to what the ANZ did in NZ?
To be disclosed to the market before Sept 23rd

[Balance]

I wonder if they have dropped the CR because an institutional investor in Australia has been granted a placement of shares at an agreed price similar to what the ANZ did in NZ?
To be disclosed to the market before Sept 23rd

That would be a good outcome.

Don’t think so however as the whole idea behind listing on ASX is to expand the shareholders’ base with Oz institutional investors. That is best achieved via a placement of shares to them - as in Plexure, Serko, Trilogy etc.

[barney]

Interesting article by Tim Hunter in today's NBR. His theory is that the capital raise on the asx could have been pulled if an offer from a third party had presented itself. Guess time will tell.

[pierre]

Interesting article by Tim Hunter in today's NBR. His theory is that the capital raise on the asx could have been pulled if an offer from a third party had presented itself. Guess time will tell.

Yes - Tim Hunter is speculating the Board pulled the CR due to a possible overseas acquisition offer. I sincerely hope that's not the case - it's far too soon for this company to head off to what is eventually likely to be US ownership.

He does emphasise though that his comment is "just a hypothesis with no evidential basis".

[LoungeLizzard]

Yes - Tim Hunter is speculating the Board pulled the CR due to a possible overseas acquisition offer. I sincerely hope that's not the case - it's far too soon for this company to head off to what is eventually likely to be US ownership.

He does emphasise though that his comment is "just a hypothesis with no evidential basis".

I think it's more likely that the Board were just embarrassed by the leaked CR information and being forced to say that they hadn't approved one. Either a CR announcement will be made in due course, or some sort of deal is being made behind the scenes with the Insto's. The real question is what they need all that money (70m) for. Time will tell, but I am looking forward to seeing the effect the Aus listing will have on the SP.

[850man]

An acceptable reason for a CR will be to expand facilities to cope with higher testing volumes or to develop a presence in Aussie / Asia - I'd be very pleased if that were the case

[Minerbarejet]

A little context.

The capacity of the US facility is about 260,000 tests per year.

If they are approaching capacity and need further facilities there then at the rate of 1000 NZD per test there would be getting near 260 million filling the coffers.

If they had that much going through what would be the need for a miniscule 70 million?

Lets not forget they are owed a fair bit from previously done CMS tests - we have no definite answer on that one as yet either.

Personally I think if the document was actually something that will be revealed then it would be either for expansion into Asia or Australia, perhaps both.

Pacific Edge also has a pipeline of other products some of which have been through some clinical trials and are ready to market, if still viable.

[LoungeLizzard]

A little context.

The capacity of the US facility is about 260,000 tests per year.

If they are approaching capacity and need further facilities there then at the rate of 1000 NZD per test there would be getting near 260 million filling the coffers.

If they had that much going through what would be the need for a miniscule 70 million?

Lets not forget they are owed a fair bit from previously done CMS tests - we have no definite answer on that one as yet either.

Personally I think if the document was actually something that will be revealed then it would be either for expansion into Asia or Australia, perhaps both.

Pacific Edge also has a pipeline of other products some of which have been through some clinical trials and are ready to market, if still viable.

It likely as you suggest a combination of things. To perhaps open a lab in Asia - Singapore probably - expand into other products - colol-rectal cancer testing is being trialed - and to increase capacity in the US ahead of acceptance by other providers. Lab accreditation, training staff, developing new products takes time as well as money. Despite the mishandling, I see the CR as being a positive sign. Hopefully the market will see it that way as well;)

[wanimoeen]

I emailed PE last week to get more information re the capital raise and received the below standard response, which we already knew.

"Thank you for your interest.

The Company’s releases to the market via the NZX covered two main points;

the information released by the ASX was incorrect.
the information was removed from the ASX website by the ASX


The company cannot speculate as to how and why the ASX released the information."

[pierre]

Nice end of week finale at 149 - looks like all is forgiven about the CR announcement cock-up.

I note that the ASX listing date has moved out one day to Friday 24 September. Maybe that's another thing they can say was wrong about the original notice.

Whatever, it will be interesting to see what happens on the ASX next Friday - with or without a CR.

[Harrie]

Think I would rather see one or two Aussie insto’s come in even at a reduced placement price than an offer from an o/seas group. This happens far to regularly at the expense of NZ shareholders. The foreign offeror entity then go on to make millions for foreign investors.
Ideally having a US partner/investor plus some Aussie insto’s would be the ideal scenario.
The idea of a US investor would certainly help if Aussie insto’s climbed in. A billion dollar company is really too small for large US fund managers ie not enough liquidity.
Having said that we need to see much more lab throughput for this to even be a possibility.

[LoungeLizzard]

Think I would rather see one or two Aussie insto’s come in even at a reduced placement price than an offer from an o/seas group. This happens far to regularly at the expense of NZ shareholders. The foreign offeror entity then go on to make millions for foreign investors.
Ideally having a US partner/investor plus some Aussie insto’s would be the ideal scenario.
The idea of a US investor would certainly help if Aussie insto’s climbed in. A billion dollar company is really too small for large US fund managers ie not enough liquidity.
Having said that we need to see much more lab throughput for this to even be a possibility.

Agreed. A CR, even at the leaked price of AUS$1.20 would be a good thing on the whole - increase liquidity, bring in some major AUS Insto's and to (hopefully) fund expansion to meet demand. PEB are not there yet but the signs are very good - and lets face it those of us that backed them 15 months ago when shares were 15c can't really lose at this point.:cool:

[Minerbarejet]

In this morning and confirmed by an outside source with audio

Cxbladder tests identify high-impact and low-impact tumors (urologytimes.com) (https://www.urologytimes.com/view/cxbladder-tests-identify-high-impact-and-low-impact-tumors)

Jay Raman has been for CxBladder for several years and appears in the author section on about 2 or 3 peer reviewed papers. He mentions the 3 CxBladder cancer tests for the diagnosis on haematuria. CxBladder Triage which if positive leads to CxBladder Detect which leads to CxBladder Resolve. He outlines that these are very accurate tests.

The plot thickens :)

[Retired Doc]

In this morning and confirmed by an outside source with audio

Cxbladder tests identify high-impact and low-impact tumors (urologytimes.com) (https://www.urologytimes.com/view/cxbladder-tests-identify-high-impact-and-low-impact-tumors)

Jay Raman has been for CxBladder for several years and appears in the author section on about 2 or 3 peer reviewed papers. He mentions the 3 CxBladder cancer tests for the diagnosis on haematuria. CxBladder Triage which if positive leads to CxBladder Detect which leads to CxBladder Resolve. He outlines that these are very accurate tests.

The plot thickens :)

Thanks Miner. That reinforces my feelings expressed in an earlier post that these tests/ in particular Cx Bladder Triage if available in my practicing lifetime could have significantly lessened my clinical anxiety and the tedious creation of many ultimately low risk referrals not too mention the removal of a major burden on the patients.