SKT Sky Network Television Limited.

[minimoke]

I've been thinking. I wonder if you could, say stream something. Like maybe cricket. Perhaps a few tests from a couple of big nations. I dont know, maybe charge say $25 for three tests. Thats less than $10 for maybe 5 days sports entertainment. Nah. That will never work. Crawls back under rock for a further snooze.

[Zaphod]

I've been thinking. I wonder if you could, say stream something. Like maybe cricket. Perhaps a few tests from a couple of big nations. I dont know, maybe charge say $25 for three tests. Thats less than $10 for maybe 5 days sports entertainment. Nah. That will never work. Crawls back under rock for a further snooze.

What do sky currently pay for the rights to screen the matches? Regardless of whether these are screen directly or via a third party (Sky, domestic TV, Netflix, Lightbox etc.), NZ Cricket would want the same revenue stream (or more) that they were enjoying from the major broadcasters, so over time we could see reasonably similar pricing emerge over time.

[Zaphod]

I have just gone back to sky after a few years away. Got a bit tired of trying to hunt down feeds on Kodi for my Rugby League. (yes unfortunately I'm a Warriors tragic) and have just enjoyed the Winter Olympics too.
Sky is easy to use and as Iong as I
do some OT at work to pay for it I will probably keep it until the something better comes along.

The big issue for us is how many third party services we end up subscribing to in order to gain access to what we want to watch. We have Netlfix, Lightbox, and have had HBO and Hulu simultaneously in the past. That quickly adds up in terms of cost.

[tga_trader]

The big issue for us is how many third party services we end up subscribing to in order to gain access to what we want to watch. We have Netlfix, Lightbox, and have had HBO and Hulu simultaneously in the past. That quickly adds up in terms of cost.

But if you have specific tastes it allows you to be more selective. As mentioned earlier I have lightbox (free), netflix and amazon prime for a total cost of like $19/month.
The ONLY sport I want to watch is (V8) supercars. I would happily pay $15/ month for the privilege, which I think is generous considering what I'm getting on the other platforms for similar money. I refuse to pay $80-100 for sky to watch one round per fortnight, and surely the V8supercars owners aren't being paid $15 per viewer by sky currently. Fan pass was a perfect idea until they removed the shorter term subscriptions, and hiked the price. Not to mention they didn't have pop up channels on there so I couldn't watch Supercars anyway.

[Rep]

The inevitable first steps...

https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/cricket/102039858/cricket-australia-trumps-sky-to-offer-nz-viewers-live-coverage-of-fiery-south-africa-series

[ratkin]

The inevitable first steps...

https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/cricket/102039858/cricket-australia-trumps-sky-to-offer-nz-viewers-live-coverage-of-fiery-south-africa-series

It not quite the first step. I already have to fork out about 150 per annum to watch the premier league on sky. I dont object to paying, it the fact you also have to have sky that peeves me off


Also just spent 145 US for a seasons MLB.TV (Major league baseball) but am really happy with their model, top quality and nothing to do with NZ

[Zaphod]

But if you have specific tastes it allows you to be more selective. As mentioned earlier I have lightbox (free), netflix and amazon prime for a total cost of like $19/month.
The ONLY sport I want to watch is (V8) supercars. I would happily pay $15/ month for the privilege, which I think is generous considering what I'm getting on the other platforms for similar money. I refuse to pay $80-100 for sky to watch one round per fortnight, and surely the V8supercars owners aren't being paid $15 per viewer by sky currently. Fan pass was a perfect idea until they removed the shorter term subscriptions, and hiked the price. Not to mention they didn't have pop up channels on there so I couldn't watch Supercars anyway.

That's a fair comment, but here's a few things to consider:
1. Based on the pricing you've outlined above, your Amazon Prime membership appears to be the special $2.99/month intro offer, so we should probably talk about the normal full price which is $6/month.
2. Your Light box sub isn't really free, it's just bundled into a larger broadband fee, so that's another $13/month - remember, you could subscribe to an ISP like Bigpipe and get unlimited cap and 100/20 service for $20-$50/month less (dependant upon which plan you are on with your existing ISP)

So for Amazon Prime + Lightbox + Netflix you're really spending $34/month + the extra fees associated with your broadband cap. Let's say you're having to spend another $20 to obtain a higher cap, so now you're up to $54/month. So the savings aren't quite what they appear to be.


My take on Netflix is that although the back-catalogue of older content is large, we (and most of our friends) have seen a large proportion of that over the last 15+ years elsewhere, so it's the new exclusive content that we're interested in. Of that there's a few worth watching but there are a lot of very average shows in the catalogue. Hence why we end up with sub's to multiple services and we're back approaching SkyTV costs.

[LAC]

That's a fair comment, but here's a few things to consider:
1. Based on the pricing you've outlined above, your Amazon Prime membership appears to be the special $2.99/month intro offer, so we should probably talk about the normal full price which is $6/month.
2. Your Light box sub isn't really free, it's just bundled into a larger broadband fee, so that's another $13/month - remember, you could subscribe to an ISP like Bigpipe and get unlimited cap and 100/20 service for $20-$50/month less (dependant upon which plan you are on with your existing ISP)

So for Amazon Prime + Lightbox + Netflix you're really spending $34/month + the extra fees associated with your broadband cap. Let's say you're having to spend another $20 to obtain a higher cap, so now you're up to $54/month. So the savings aren't quite what they appear to be.


My take on Netflix is that although the back-catalogue of older content is large, we (and most of our friends) have seen a large proportion of that over the last 15+ years elsewhere, so it's the new exclusive content that we're interested in. Of that there's a few worth watching but there are a lot of very average shows in the catalogue. Hence why we end up with sub's to multiple services and we're back approaching SkyTV costs.

Very nicely put mate, I fork out every month for Sky and some other streaming platforms....to be honest the best content is still on Sky, I may not like the price but it is still a great option for me to get series, movies, sport and on demand. It is also by far the only one that is reliable enough to get local sport to viewers. Sky just needs to get the Streaming services up to scratch imo.

[tga_trader]

That's a fair comment, but here's a few things to consider:
1. Based on the pricing you've outlined above, your Amazon Prime membership appears to be the special $2.99/month intro offer, so we should probably talk about the normal full price which is $6/month.
2. Your Light box sub isn't really free, it's just bundled into a larger broadband fee, so that's another $13/month - remember, you could subscribe to an ISP like Bigpipe and get unlimited cap and 100/20 service for $20-$50/month less (dependant upon which plan you are on with your existing ISP)

So for Amazon Prime + Lightbox + Netflix you're really spending $34/month + the extra fees associated with your broadband cap. Let's say you're having to spend another $20 to obtain a higher cap, so now you're up to $54/month. So the savings aren't quite what they appear to be.


My take on Netflix is that although the back-catalogue of older content is large, we (and most of our friends) have seen a large proportion of that over the last 15+ years elsewhere, so it's the new exclusive content that we're interested in. Of that there's a few worth watching but there are a lot of very average shows in the catalogue. Hence why we end up with sub's to multiple services and we're back approaching SkyTV costs.
Yeah i get your point but light box IS free as spark matched the much lower price of a competitor i was looking at switching too and we were already only unlimited data before we started all the streaming services, so no extra cost associated there. For most people your points would probably stand, but for us we're way better off without sky

[bull....]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12009751

another possible competitor for sky tv

[Balance]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12009751

another possible competitor for sky tv

Fetch comes into NZ and it will be sayonara to sky tv's share price!

[ratkin]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12009751

another possible competitor for sky tv

Now that looks more like it, they have all the same channels as sky plus lots more. And the big clincher for the Ratkin household will be that they have UK TV with far more up to date programmes, No more series One of QI on an infinite loop (hopefully)

https://www.fetchtv.com.au/tv/guide

[macduffy]

It depends what you watch, doesn't it. Let's know when someone other than Sky pays up to show some live sport!

[Jay]

Agree macduffy, apart from potentially streaming it illegally, where else can you get a lot of the sport that is on Sky here, or without paying 5 different companies a total of the same price.
I note they are not showing the WRC this year, however Duke is showing 1 or two stages live each day(with most being rallies on the other side of the world not all that practical timewise), and I think TV3 have highlights on the following week.
Not the following day as sky did.
Your netflixes, lightbox et all do not show live sport here!

[blackcap]

It depends what you watch, doesn't it. Let's know when someone other than Sky pays up to show some live sport!

That is my dilemma too. I tend to like tennis, cricket, rugby (AB's) basketball and a variety of athletic sports. Problem for me is too paying for 5 different streams + and at this stage that is more costly than the SKY sub.

[Balance]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12011272

"Sky CEO not losing sleep over Aussie newcomer, Fetch"

Breathtaking comment from CEO John Fellet indeed! Appointed CEO in 2001, he has presided over the collapse in the share price from nearly $7 to $2.24 - 68% destruction and he is not losing any sleep!

What a great CEO to have!

Or a case of someone so long in the tooth he has no idea left anymore?

Appointing the Snakk merchant Derek Handley as a director ($112,000 a year) in 2013 was a red flag if ever there was one!

[Scrunch]

35m traded today. I wonder what's happening?

[Entrep]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12011272

"Sky CEO not losing sleep over Aussie newcomer, Fetch"

Breathtaking comment from CEO John Fellet indeed! Appointed CEO in 2001, he has presided over the collapse in the share price from nearly $7 to $2.24 - 68% destruction and he is not losing any sleep!

What a great CEO to have!

Or a case of someone so long in the tooth he has no idea left anymore?

Appointing the Snakk merchant Derek Handley as a director ($112,000 a year) in 2013 was a red flag if ever there was one!

lol, few chuckles out of me on a friday

[Balance]

lol, few chuckles out of me on a friday

I think he inadvertently let out that he has been sleeping on the job?

[Zaphod]

SkyTV v My Box. Some real gems in here to brighten your day!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/102383554/firm-accused-of-piracy-by-sky-tv-receives-10m-offer-from-china

I wonder if he'll ever see the $10m and if he does receive it, whether he'll start a new massage business with that? Hopefully this time he remembers to pay his staff.

[Balance]

SkyTV v My Box. Some real gems in here to brighten your day!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/102383554/firm-accused-of-piracy-by-sky-tv-receives-10m-offer-from-china

I wonder if he'll ever see the $10m and if he does receive it, whether he'll start a new massage business with that? Hopefully this time he remembers to pay his staff.

Chinese firm?

Yup - sounding like the good old days when it was Japanese or Arab money instead of Chinese!

Mosney always just around the corner.

[minimoke]

That's got me worried. I think my computers contain piracy software. Isn't it called an Internet Browser?

[Entrep]

SkyTV v My Box. Some real gems in here to brighten your day!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/102383554/firm-accused-of-piracy-by-sky-tv-receives-10m-offer-from-china

I wonder if he'll ever see the $10m and if he does receive it, whether he'll start a new massage business with that? Hopefully this time he remembers to pay his staff.

How the heck Reddy has even got this far I have no idea. The decision should be a dozee.

[Zaphod]

That's got me worried. I think my computers contain piracy software. Isn't it called an Internet Browser?

While I'm not going to re-enter the circular debate on this, it's worth noting that the issue here is that Reedy has preconfigured the software to enable piracy and is charging for the package. You internet browser isn't pre-configured for that sole task. That's the crux of the argument.

The guy doesn't do himself any favours though. $10m offer from the Chinese? Really? Entrep and Balance's comments hit the nail squarely with the hammer.

[Balance]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12011272

"Sky CEO not losing sleep over Aussie newcomer, Fetch"

Breathtaking comment from CEO John Fellet indeed! Appointed CEO in 2001, he has presided over the collapse in the share price from nearly $7 to $2.24 - 68% destruction and he is not losing any sleep!

What a great CEO to have!

Or a case of someone so long in the tooth he has no idea left anymore?

Appointing the Snakk merchant Derek Handley as a director ($112,000 a year) in 2013 was a red flag if ever there was one!

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/315986

Looks like the Board has finally woken up to the CEO sleeping?

Fellett has no regrets which is good for him because he will continue to sleep well.

Shareholders have not been sleeping too well however?

[minimoke]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/315986

Looks like the Board has finally woken up to the CEO sleeping?

Fellett has no regrets which is good for him because he will continue to sleep well.

Shareholders have not been sleeping too well however?Too little, too late!

[blackcap]

Too little, too late!

And the following snippet is very telling and rather disconcerting...

"John will continue to serve on the SKY Board after the transition is made.”

[Balance]

And the following snippet is very telling and rather disconcerting...

"John will continue to serve on the SKY Board after the transition is made.”

Completely bereft of any accountability and ideas.

News Corp & Todds sold completely out of Sky TV in 2012 and 2013.

They knew what was coming when they saw Fellett sleeping soundly?

[BlackCross]

Looks as if they now plan to move the right way.
http://www.sharechat.co.nz/article/8d9fa883/sky-tv-flags-strategy-shift-toward-on-demand-services-value-adds.html

[Raz]

And the following snippet is very telling and rather disconcerting...

"John will continue to serve on the SKY Board after the transition is made.”

That will reduce the pool of talent looking at the CEO even further...

[Balance]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/315972

Another nail to Sky TV's crucifixion - not of the religious kind but of the thuggery kind for ripping off New Zealanders for over a decade.

[minimoke]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/315972

Another nail to Sky TV's crucifixion - not of the religious kind but of the thuggery kind for ripping off New Zealanders for over a decade.
I'd be happy with 1080p broadcasts!

[Balance]

And the following snippet is very telling and rather disconcerting...

"John will continue to serve on the SKY Board after the transition is made.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/102624281/sky-tv-boss-reckons-it-could-hold-rugby-for-another-15-years

No wonder Sky is going backwards and going backward fast - everybody else is wrong except Fellett!

As for making $1m a week now vs $1m when he became CEO - that was always the game plan when Sky spent hundreds of millions of dollars building up its subscriber base - which Fellett is now losing!

What a donkey!

[Sideshow Bob]

I'm sure they have pressures etc that can see from the inside, but goes to show he is SERIOUSLY out of touch......

Just need to see the share price graph and read a few of the comments to any article about SKY - one of the most disliked companies in NZ.

[Filthy]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/316106 just gets worse for them doesn't it!!

[Putty]

No Rugby World Cup for SKY. Ouch.

[minimoke]

If you skip through the Freeview channels you'll see one reserved for TVNZ to broadcast the Commonwealth Games.

[winner69]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/316106 just gets worse for them doesn't it!!

Not a surprise though

Hope Jacinda steps in ....all NZers deserve to watch the World Cup games live ....for free

[Balance]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/316106 just gets worse for them doesn't it!!

Over and out.

[Balance]

Not a surprise though

Hope Jacinda steps in ....all NZers deserve to watch the World Cup games live ....for free

You volunteering W69 for a seat on the committee to consider free to air, paid by Cindy Astern from income of taxpayers?

Word is that the ranks of consultants have already increased by thousands in Wellington since Labour took office.

You might as well get your share!

[winner69]

You volunteering W69 for a seat on the committee to consider free to air, paid by Cindy Astern from income of taxpayers?

Word is that the ranks of consultants have already increased by thousands in Wellington since Labour took office.

You might as well get your share!

Inbox regularly gets ‘invites’ to join the party ...too old for that sort of stuff ...but tempting if it’s going to be a cold wet winter

[minimoke]

You volunteering W69 for a seat on the committee to consider free to air, paid by Cindy Astern from income of taxpayers?

Word is that the ranks of consultants have already increased by thousands in Wellington since Labour took office.

You might as well get your share!
I don't want throw throw a spanner in the works - but i'd remind you Clair Curran is Minister of Broadcasting. She doesn't know how to work a Diary so I don't think she would have a clue on how to use a remote to find a sports channel. Given I'm sure Fellet reckons the best way to get a great sports broadcast picture is to fiddle with the knob on the back of the TV I don't hold out much hope for NZ managed sports broadcasts.

[bull....]

sky in big trouble if its true about not the preferred bidder for rugby

[Sideshow Bob]

Watch the share price go down today faster than a fat kid on a see-saw.

[minimoke]

Watch the share price go down today faster than a fat kid on a see-saw.
Given they have SANSAAR rights expiring 2020 I see little left to keep propping up the share price.

[winner69]

Head honcho must have got the heads up and resigned b4 this came public

[Balance]

sky in big trouble if its true about not the preferred bidder for rugby

What big trouble?

Fellett reckons it is no big deal if you read the NZX release carefully.

They still have the SANZAAR rights until 2020 and they will squeeze every goddam cent out of rugby mad New Zealanders until then.

Not Fellett's problem after that - he retires next year and will still pick up his $150,000 a year director fees for a few more years after that before Sky goes red and shut down.

[bull....]

What big trouble?

Fellett reckons it is no big deal if you read the NZX release carefully.

They still have the SANZAAR rights until 2020 and they will squeeze every goddam cent out of rugby mad New Zealanders until then.

Not Fellett's problem after that - he retires next year and will still pick up his $150,000 a year director fees for a few more years after that before Sky goes red and shut down.

profits declining, everyone starting to circle the rotting corpse

[Zaphod]

Not a surprise though

Hope Jacinda steps in ....all NZers deserve to watch the World Cup games live ....for free

It's a highly paid professional sport, why should taxpayers foot the bill?

[Sideshow Bob]

It's a highly paid professional sport, why should taxpayers foot the bill?

It shouldn't. But Winnie the Pooh and his bunch of merry men were making things "non-negotiable"

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/10/the-price-of-a-nz-first-coalition-free-sport.html

[Zaphod]

It shouldn't. But Winnie the Pooh and his bunch of merry men were making things "non-negotiable"

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/10/the-price-of-a-nz-first-coalition-free-sport.html

Ah yes, populist policy at its finest! Thanks for the depressing reminder!

[mikeybycrikey]

To me that didn't read like an NZX release and more like a PR release.

"We might have hit an iceberg but we'd like to reassure everyone that we have the most comfortable deck chairs in the fleet and everyone is working really hard to keep the G & T's topped up"

[Sideshow Bob]

"We might have hit an iceberg but we'd like to reassure everyone that we have the most comfortable deck chairs in the fleet and everyone is working really hard to keep the G & T's topped up"

Yes, very Titanic-esque. Captain Fellet reassures everyone, while heading for the nearest life boat.

[winner69]

As long as TVNZ get it and its free to air we'll be OK (that's what the paper says)

[Stranger_Danger]

Interesting "vicious circle" playing out here.

People complain Sky is too expensive/doesn't have what they want = less revenue. Sky then have less firepower to throw at content rights = less content. More people leave as the key content stops being on Sky = less revenue. And on the cycle goes.

P.S My guess is Amazon. I doubt Fellet chose this moment to exit by accident!

[steveb]

Even if Sky had managed to get the world cup,all the important games would have been on Prime( free to air).I had made my decision to flag Sky at the conclusion of the cricket,but might make it next week,as who wants to see a load of aussie cheats play!

[bull....]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/102653096/sky-unlikely-to-be-the-place-to-watch-the-next-rugby-world-cup

spark got it?

[ratkin]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/102653096/sky-unlikely-to-be-the-place-to-watch-the-next-rugby-world-cup

spark got it?

Sky pretending they not bothered

[minimoke]

Havent seen this for a while - only 10 people in the queue on the Buy side.

[Balance]

Interesting "vicious circle" playing out here.

People complain Sky is too expensive/doesn't have what they want = less revenue. Sky then have less firepower to throw at content rights = less content. More people leave as the key content stops being on Sky = less revenue. And on the cycle goes.

P.S My guess is Amazon. I doubt Fellet chose this moment to exit by accident!

Fellett would not give up his $2m a year job too readily so yes, he saw the train coming and is happy to step out of the way for the mug taking over from him to take the hit and the blame.

What a turkey.

[value_investor]

Could be a decent play for Spark giving their lightbox platform to get the limelight and the hope that a few people would stay. I'd be interested to see how much the increase on the rights is vs the last RWC.

Often the Sky argument that it will stick around is that they've got the sports that are near and dear to kiwi's hearts hence they won't go away. This would shake that to the core, as the RWC is the biggest ticket in the sport category for them by far.

Disruption by... disruption. I wonder if Fellet still thinks piracy is the biggest threat to their business or could it be.. competition. Who would have thought it.

Disc: Not a holder just a disgruntled Sky sport subscriber

[jimmybuffett]

What stuck out for me was the comment, rightly in my view, that legislation in NZ means that the finals (and I think semi finals etc.) have to be shown free to air. So by paying a large fee, whoever gets broadcast rights is really just buying rights for pool games like NZ vs Tonga. The CEO makes that point. Could just be spin, but seems to be a valid point.
In any case, as a subscriber I certainly took advantage of the price changes earlier this month, have halves my monthly SKY bill by dumping movies and keeping sport. If they lose Super Rugby they would be toast in my view, but RWC not so much.

[blackcap]

If they lose Super Rugby they would be toast in my view, but RWC not so much.

Interesting you feel that. Because I am totally over super rugby. Used to watch at least 3 games per weekend but now maybe just maybe catch a Hurricanes game or watch the semis and final. These days totally watch All Blacks and that only. I think there is a shift because of over saturation, or it could be because I am getting older I am more picky? Not too sure but for me keeping SKY is not contingent on Super rugby at all. It hinges more on the AB's games. Like I said earlier, I like to watch a wide variety of sports on an ad hoc basis, so for me SKY is still the best option. If I had to pay $20 per month for tennis, $20pm for basketball and also for cricket, rugby etc well I would be spending over $160 per month on sports streams alone. So streaming agreed is the way forward but not for viewers such as me that like to watch 1 game or 2 a week from a wide variety of sports.

[minimoke]

Interesting you feel that. Because I am totally over super rugby. .I'm totally over it as well. Cant keep up with the huge number of rules and rule changes. Constant referral to TMO drives me nuts (should just leave it to on field decisions), TMO's stopping play because they spotted something on Camera 15 5 minutes before last break in play; constant stoppages (if you cant play get off the field and bring a sub on); countless number of medics and water bays on the field. And the sheer number of games which end up being repetitive - the only difference being the colour of the jerseys.

A crusaders game will get my attention, especially if it against Highlanders. Other than that couldn't really care less. Free to air and an hour delayed more than meets my appetite for super rugby

[Jay]

A bit like you blackcap but watch a bit more of the Super rugby (mostly only where a NZ team is involved), but watch other sports like the cricket, F1, Supercars, Tennis, use to be the WRC (now gone to Duke and TV3 this year) etc.
Don't want to be paying 10 different providers $10 -$20 each either

[ratkin]

Bunch of young idiots chasing a ball about just to get it through some sticks. Who cares which bunch of idiots do it the most?

[Balance]

A bit like you blackcap but watch a bit more of the Super rugby (mostly only where a NZ team is involved), but watch other sports like the cricket, F1, Supercars, Tennis, use to be the WRC (now gone to Duke and TV3 this year) etc.
Don't want to be paying 10 different providers $10 -$20 each either

Sky is playing a very marginal game these days of trying to extract more value out of its sports channel.

I was offered (and accepted) a 3 months special Sports channels deal last year during the ABs playing season for $30 (only for residential customers) - just have to ring up and then, ring up again to terminate.

Previous offers usually came with strings attached - like minimum contract of another 12 months etc.

How long can Sly Sky keep its grudging sports customer base with deals like that?

[RGR367]

I’m sure I must have stated it before in ST that you can watch all the Sports worldwide that you like in firstrowau.eu. It may not be perfect to those very very very discerning but it’s FREE and it’s the most “welcoming” (if you know some internet protocols) site of all the free sites out there. Check it out and with a little bit of cyberspace know how, you’ll have an interrupted mostly ads free way to enjoy sports. I’ve used it or go back to it (there are other sites of course) mostly for watching rugby, MMA and boxing ever since I returned my Sky decoder after RWC2015.
Things to note:


Do NOT use Windows Explorer as your browser especially the first time you visit to watch something.
If you know some “techno stuff”, it pays not to be conned into some sort of membership ��
Almost always take the first link it offered.


Hope it helps on why you still need a Sky subscription :ohmy:

[JBmurc]

Been using sky for many years 15yrs+ ....Mysky ,SOHO ,Sport (during NRL / PGA Golf season) at just over $100's (I now think's its going under $100) I see it as cheap entertament ....take the wife out for dinner and you can blow that in 1hr !!

Would actually like to start purchasing a long term holding in SKT in the family trust >>> I think the whole skyTV is stuffed going forward is overblown

[Baa_Baa]

I’m sure I must have stated it before in ST that you can watch all the Sports worldwide that you like in firstrowau.eu. ... [snip]

Looks dodgy to me, won't run the video and wants to download a flash player update even though my flash player is on the latest version, and the down load .dmg filename looks kosha but the install file in it has a non-conventional filename and a dodgy version number. So I didn't bother, god knows what's in the install file.

[Balance]

Been using sky for many years 15yrs+ ....Mysky ,SOHO ,Sport (during NRL / PGA Golf season) at just over $100's (I now think's its going under $100) I see it as cheap entertament ....take the wife out for dinner and you can blow that in 1hr !!

Would actually like to start purchasing a long term holding in SKT in the family trust >>> I think the whole skyTV is stuffed going forward is overblown

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/102711128/rust-never-sleeps--a-tale-of-two-retiring-ceos

Fellett can certainly spend more time resting and sleeping even better now that he has been outed for being a man 'out of times and out of time.'

Maybe Derek Handley will be next CEO - can you imagine his mouth salivating at the $2m a year package?

[RGR367]

Looks dodgy to me, won't run the video and wants to download a flash player update even though my flash player is on the latest version, and the down load .dmg filename looks kosha but the install file in it has a non-conventional filename and a dodgy version number. So I didn't bother, god knows what's in the install file.

No, it's not. But like what I said, you need to know a bit more than the usual knowledge of just browsing and downloading something from the internet.

[RGR367]

No, it's not. But like what I said, you need to know a bit more than the usual knowledge of just browsing and downloading something from the internet.

Someone is also streaming the Joshua v Parker fight right now on https://www.twitch.tv/spowned13 if you cannot get on to the firstrow and if you don't mind the foreign language commentary :p

[ratkin]

Someone is also streaming the Joshua v Parker fight right now on https://www.twitch.tv/spowned13 if you cannot get on to the firstrow and if you don't mind the foreign language commentary :p

Watched it on firstrow, was ok once figured out where all the real x were on the adverts. Norton was busy blocking all the dodgy pop ups and porn links. Had to change feed midway as one cut out.
Was it worth the hassle, or would it have been easier to pay and watch it without constantly having to worry about losing feed. Guess it depends how tight you are with money.

There a slight ethical issue too, im one of those who complain Sky show lots of repeats, but deprive them of revenue by hunting down free feeds. Guess cant have everything

[Balance]

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/SKT/316282/277144.pdf

Fellet bought 10k shares - spending $22,400 of his $2m a year total remuneration to show his confidence in the future of Sky TV!

Breathtakingly courageous - like his 'I sleep very well at nights' even while subscriber numbers were dropping!

[Baa_Baa]

Surprise surprise, a step in the right direction (finally) coincidentally timed shortly after the CEO announces his departure. The devil will be in the details but one might consider whether SKT is now at or around the bottom of its SP if they can make this work. Interesting times ahead.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/tv-radio/102904029/sky-announces-new-strategy-to-keep-up-with-changing-entertainment-trends

[Jay]

A few maybe re thinking sky, going by the comments over the free to air coverage of the Com Games
Yes Baa Baa , the devil will be in the detail, bit a step in the write direction

[sanctus671]

"MacFarlane said the Chromecast functionality would be switched off to stop users watching it on a larger screen, which will keep the price lower."

That doesn't seem to resonate very well with people based on the Stuff comments. Granted that the people commenting probably don't understand business very well. At least that's the impression I get. I agree it's a big step in the right direction (albeit EXTREMELY late) but is it enough to change peoples negative perception of Sky?

[carrom74]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/104012339/Spark-to-sell-Sky-TVs-Fan-Pass-with-more-sports-deals-between-the-companies-on-the-table

Mutually beneficial for both Sky and Spark.Interesting arrangement.

[minimoke]

I have only got as far as


The net loss after tax for the year ended 30 June 2018 is $240.7 million


compared to a net profit after tax of $116.3 million in the previous year.



Very glad I'm no longer holding

[LAC]

I have only got as far as


The net loss after tax for the year ended 30 June 2018 is $240.7 million


compared to a net profit after tax of $116.3 million in the previous year.



Very glad I'm no longer holding

Underlying profit still decent though......

[minimoke]

Underlying profit still decent though......Only from reducing costs. Cant keep skinning that cat for ever. NP $119.3 vs $116m last year. Costs $554 this year vs $601m last year.

[LAC]

Only from reducing costs. Cant keep skinning that cat for ever. NP $119.3 vs $116m last year. Costs $554 this year vs $601m last year.

Very true....tough industry to be in

[minimoke]

Very true....tough industry to be inNot helped with having the likes of Handley on the Board

[bull....]

Not helped with having the likes of Handley on the Board

he can help them feel spiritual over the loss of the 11000 customers

[minimoke]

he can help them feel spiritual over the loss of the 11000 customersHe can help Clare Curran get a new job

[blackcap]

He can help Clare Curran get a new job

Just read the exchange between Handly and Clare. Sounds like he is sick. Or is this normal for him? Does not inspire confidence in me.

[Entrep]

Just read the exchange between Handly and Clare. Sounds like he is sick. Or is this normal for him? Does not inspire confidence in me.

Got a link?

EDIT: Nevermind found it.

[flyer]

imploded a bit today

[minimoke]

imploded a bit todayMarket reacting to teh very disturbing news that Handley might be leaving to take up uber important and flash role of Govt ICT Futurist Guru.

[minimoke]

I missed the market announcment where Handley has resigned from the board to take up the accepted offer in the role of Government Chief Technical Officer - any one with a link?

[winner69]

I missed the market announcment where Handley has resigned from the board to take up the accepted offer in the role of Government Chief Technical Officer - any one with a link?

The notice was sent to the NZX by gmail and ended up in their Spam folder

[stoploss]

Sky will not have F1 next season , so another subscription gone ....

[BlackCross]

Sky will not have F1 next season , so another subscription gone ....
Will anyone else in NZ pick it up? Viewing figures falling and perhaps not worth the cost to broadcasters?

[Jay]

Will anyone else in NZ pick it up? Viewing figures falling and perhaps not worth the cost to broadcasters?

Unless someone picks it up there goes my getting up in the middle of the night.
Sky did not get/want the WRC either this year, instead on Duke we get a few live stages, mostly in the middle of the night, and if you can find it and 1 highlights package if you can find when it is on.
Liked the each day highlights that Sky broadcast.

And someone else gets the rugby and it's all over rover

[mcdongle]

Unless someone picks it up there goes my getting up in the middle of the night.
Sky did not get/want the WRC either this year, instead on Duke we get a few live stages, mostly in the middle of the night, and if you can find it and 1 highlights package if you can find when it is on.
Liked the each day highlights that Sky broadcast.

And someone else gets the rugby and it's all over rover


You can watch online...I watch the next day in HD

[RTM]

Unless someone picks it up there goes my getting up in the middle of the night.
Sky did not get/want the WRC either this year, instead on Duke we get a few live stages, mostly in the middle of the night, and if you can find it and 1 highlights package if you can find when it is on.
Liked the each day highlights that Sky broadcast.

And someone else gets the rugby and it's all over rover

Often when something is not on SKY one can stream it fairly easily.
You may have to pay for it tho, but if you are keen, it’s probably an option.
I like to watch it when I can, as well as Scott Dixon.

[minimoke]

I'm off to get myself a jumbo box of tissues. This is so upsetting: https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/107929146/sky-tv-facing-turbulent-times-chairman-says

Poor poor Derek.

[Balance]

I'm off to get myself a jumbo box of tissues. This is so upsetting: https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/107929146/sky-tv-facing-turbulent-times-chairman-says

Poor poor Derek.

Just not on, it it?

There he sits, Derek, an entrepreneur with one single good deal he can point to - The HyperFactory - sold for $10m but everybody just wants to highlight all the other disasters and non-event companies like Snakk where investors have lost a lot more money than $10m!

Just not fair, is it?

[steveb]

He must really have the gift of the gab.Selling snake oil for a living comes to mind.

[winner69]

Nearly 2 million shares voted against Derek's reappointment

A show of hands and he might have been out ....just as well for passive proxies eh

[Jay]

Spark trying to take over from Sky
Have now picked up F1 - https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12148307
Plus F2, GP# and Porsche Super cup - for the next 3 years
Think I read that Sky paid about $6M for 4 years back in 2014.

[Entrep]

No one cares about the new CEO appointment? https://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?objectid=12166105

[minimoke]

No one cares about the new CEO appointment? https://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?objectid=12166105
Not while Handley is still on the Board (ably assisted by Fellet)

[flyer]

For those that still have SKY TV, they have had the movie channels and BEin Sports free to air over the last week. I think its only up to the 31 Dec. I only found out by accident from flicking through the channels, I was able to watch Liverpool thrash Arsenal this morning. Anyway, as much as this is a good gesture I dont understand (unless I missed it) why they didn't announce/advertise this fact. They may of managed to get existing viewers to sign up to these channels after the free to air is finished hence a win win. From a company that is losing subscribers and their Sports packages to Spark you would think this would be a basic PR promo for them. I still dont think this company is efficiently run, losing so much of its Sports packages to Spark. I see they announced a new agreement with OPTUS (renewed) so we will all be getting new set top boxes to stream content by the end of 2019. Maybe this change may save them but without a serious sports content I cant see how they can grow again or even survive going forward.

[Bobdn]

I got an email from them, it goes until the 7 January. I've been gorging on test match cricket - NZ/Sri Lanka and Australia/India. I forgot how much I love a good test match. I saw my first Big Bash game the other night. I think I could get into that. I've watched over 20 hours of cricket over the last few days.

Cricket World Cup is coming, can't wait :)

[macduffy]

I heard from a friend yesterday - who heard from a friend. No email, possibly because I pay by direct debit. I've My Sky'd and watched some good programmes on the Arts channel - I pay for Sports, not interested in the movie channels, but everything is available apparently.

[Sideshow Bob]

I heard from a friend yesterday - who heard from a friend. No email, possibly because I pay by direct debit. I've My Sky'd and watched some good programmes on the Arts channel - I pay for Sports, not interested in the movie channels, but everything is available apparently.

I think we pay through Vodafone - and got no advice. Just heard through friends. Loading up the MySky for a watch later with a few movies, however these are few and far between.

[macduffy]

I think we pay through Vodafone - and got no advice. Just heard through friends. Loading up the MySky for a watch later with a few movies, however these are few and far between.

A sudden thought. I have a vague memory of a previous "free" viewing period when I MySky'd a couple of programmes, only to find that they disappeared when the free period finished. Any similar experiences ?

[carrom74]

$1.55 and going down and down... wonder what would the price ex-dividend? I sense this would be another takeover target...

[minimoke]

Market reaction to sports price increase.

[carrom74]

I'm starting to seriously consider buying some shares. The PE is about 6 and doom and gloom is factored completely into the current SP. Things aren't that date are they?

I am keen as well.But would rather wait until the dust settles...(the price is still going down)

I still reckon its a takeover candidate...

[Entrep]

Looks like a race to the bottom to me. Sure you get some nice divvies for a while but what will they be in 3-4 years and what will the value of your capital be then too?

[hogie]

I don't know if this is master-class strategy by the directors or not ... raising prices for remaining customers in the midst of losing customers (because of price and content) ... I wouldn't be surprised if they are actually tempting a takeover.

[RTM]

Originally Posted by JeremyALD View Post
I'm starting to seriously consider buying some shares. The PE is about 6 and doom and gloom is factored completely into the current SP. Things aren't that date are they?


I am keen as well.But would rather wait until the dust settles...(the price is still going down)

I still reckon its a takeover candidate...


Do you guys remember Blackberry ? Kodak ?

[Balance]

I am keen as well.But would rather wait until the dust settles...(the price is still going down)

I still reckon its a takeover candidate...

Who will take over this mutt?

Cheap enough but cheap things are no good!

[stoploss]

Blockbuster/ Netflix might be more to the mark

[Jay]

Overall my package price will drop as they drop the $10 for HD content!

[value_investor]

I just don't see where they turn things around.. They'll have to increase ARPU because the numbers game is hard in such a small market. Just with the way streaming is going, I just don't see it.

Perhaps something really drastic happens where they can capitalise but its a shot in the dark.

[carrom74]

Who will take over this mutt?

Cheap enough but cheap things are no good!

"An industry source tells (https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12143301) the Herald that NBC Universal has kicked the tyres at Sky, and may even have moved to a due diligence phase."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12144107

Balance.. this news is about 4 months old,but if NBC thinks the price is right... then even this mutt is worth eh?.

[ShouldHaveHeld]

I dont think we will see SKY in the coming years. The generation coming do not really care for what ever they offer. Many of my friends have no reason to use SKY. Most of their shows come from netflix or other streaming services. If they want to watch some sporting event they go to go to a pub (which has sky lol) or just look for an online stream through reddit (like using ACE stream etc). Movies? torrent / stream online. If they want to display it on their TV they just put in the HDMI. This is just my view around the world of streaming.

[Balance]

"An industry source tells (https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12143301) the Herald that NBC Universal has kicked the tyres at Sky, and may even have moved to a due diligence phase."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12144107

Balance.. this news is about 4 months old,but if NBC thinks the price is right... then even this mutt is worth eh?.

Sp action says deal is off?

[carrom74]

"New Broom at work"...

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12207402

[Balance]

"New Broom at work"...

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12207402

ABs contract with Sky expires in 2020.

If they lose it, it's all over for Sky.

So they are going to have to pay up - big bucks - which will impact on future profitability in a declining subscriber base.

Brave of anyone to invest in this mutt!

[Marilyn Munroe]

Just like real estate where the three most important factors are location location and location the three most important factors in pay TV are sport sport and sport.

Spark with Rugby World Cup rights are nibbling at the edges.

For general broadcasting over the internet the AV1 codec is coming. Smaller transmission bandwidth requirements, smarter image rendering and the support of several tech heavyweights. Watch this space. The internet is an open access resource so there are fewer barriers to entry than a distribution model that relies on satellites.

Boop boop de do
Marilyn

[mistaTea]

For general broadcasting over the internet the AV1 codec is coming. Smaller transmission bandwidth requirements, smarter image rendering and the support of several tech heavyweights. Watch this space. The internet is an open access resource so there are fewer barriers to entry than a distribution model that relies on satellites.

Boop boop de do
Marilyn

Yes indeed. And that all sounds lovely Marilyn, except for the fact that the internet is still unreliable for live streaming. Clearly we are heading to a world that broadcasts more and more content online, and the technology is definitely improving - but, in the words of Mr Fellet, the satellite will still be 'doing the heavy lifting' for some time to come.

It reminds me of the lunatics who think the 'old school' electricity generators will be irrelevant shortly, because we will soon be running our homes and businesses off self-produced solar power since 'battery storage technology is the best thing since sliced bread nowadays'.

Sounds good, but does not stack up when we come back to the real world.

So far as I can tell, SKY TV is the only broadcaster that is able to stream all of their content online AND via satellite. That would virtually guarantee a seamless transmission of live sport, and could be positioned as a competitive advantage.

[Sideshow Bob]

Yes indeed. And that all sounds lovely Marilyn, except for the fact that the internet is still unreliable for live streaming. Clearly we are heading to a world that broadcasts more and more content online, and the technology is definitely improving - but, in the words of Mr Fellet, the satellite will still be 'doing the heavy lifting' for some time to come.

It reminds me of the lunatics who think the 'old school' electricity generators will be irrelevant shortly, because we will soon be running our homes and businesses off self-produced solar power since 'battery storage technology is the best thing since sliced bread nowadays'.

Sounds good, but does not stack up when we come back to the real world.

So far as I can tell, SKY TV is the only broadcaster that is able to stream all of their content online AND via satellite. That would virtually guarantee a seamless transmission of live sport, and could be positioned as a competitive advantage.

End of the day, SKY have had it their own way for so long - and with that they have become largely 'lazy'. There is now competition knocking at the door - which they have never really had, and it is how they respond to that.
SKY is a company people love to hate, but you think Spark is going to be any better?? SKY can stream, the internet doesn't belong to one person, and do all these other things, but if Spark get serious, they would have deeper pockets.

Having said that, SKY have been generating some pretty hefty free cashflows. Typically their depreciation/amortization has been $100-120m per year (except for last year where they wrote off a lot of goodwill). Even in past years, divvies would only be 40-50% of their net profit.

$1.1B of intangible assets sitting on the balance sheet....!

[Stranger_Danger]

It reminds me of the lunatics who think the 'old school' electricity generators will be irrelevant shortly, because we will soon be running our homes and businesses off self-produced solar power since 'battery storage technology is the best thing since sliced bread nowadays'.

Sounds good, but does not stack up when we come back to the real world.



There is a slight difference. I can teach a 5 year old or 90 year old how to obtain Sky's product for free in about 10 minutes. I can't do that with electricity.

In fact, once you factor in administration (paying the bill), satellite/rain fade issues, and the difficulty of obtaining customer service, I would argue it is also easier to get the content for free instead of paying for it.

Once your competitor, in effect, has a price point of zero and a broader offering, you're basically just crossing your fingers and hoping stubborn old people die more slowly, on a low enough valuation. That's the business model and investment case.

[mistaTea]

There is a slight difference. I can teach a 5 year old or 90 year old how to obtain Sky's product for free in about 10 minutes. I can't do that with electricity.



If companies start going bust because it is easy to steal their product instead of paying for it (and becomes so normal that people start bragging about their proficiency in theft...) then God help us all.

[minimoke]

If companies start going bust because it is easy to steal their product instead of paying for it (and becomes so normal that people start bragging about their proficiency in theft...) then God help us all.That is a risk many companies have. The trick is to make it tricky to steal or copy.

[mistaTea]

That is a risk many companies have. The trick is to make it tricky to steal or copy.

Yes no doubt - my point though is that I don't think it is fair to take a crack at Sky because so many people are thieves. That is a separate issue, and one that a number of companies face (as you rightly point out).

I should also state that, I do not have rose-tinted glasses when it comes to Sky Tv. Without a doubt, they have a Herculean task ahead of themselves, including (in no particular order):

1. Battling Piracy
2. Competing with other premium content providers (Amazon, Netflix, Lightbox)
3. Competing for Sporting rights against Spark (and possibly other entrants)
4. Convincing content creators to unbundle their content more so that Sky can offer smaller and cheaper packages (to stabilise or even grow their subscriber base)
5. Release of their new (and much needed) set top boxes

However, those 'experts' who blog about Sky TV's imminent and certain demise are jumping the gun a bit in my view. The company does still have some (narrow moat) competitive advantages. And remember, Vodafone need Sky to do well to ensure they maintain a competitive offering against Spark. If Spark won all of the Sport (and Sky went under) then that would leave Vodafone in a perilous situation. It would not surprise me at all if Vodafone teamed up with Sky to make damn sure they held on to the big sporting events (Investec, tennis, cricket, hockey etc).

Pure speculation of course. Only time will tell if the new CEO makes enough of a difference in time.

[Stranger_Danger]

If companies start going bust because it is easy to steal their product instead of paying for it (and becomes so normal that people start bragging about their proficiency in theft...) then God help us all.

I agree 100% with you. God help us all.

Despite knowing how to, I avoided stealing content for over a decade, being a big believer in the value of IP, willing and able to pay for it.

In the end, it got too hard to remain a paying customer. The DVD's I wanted became basically unavailable in NZ. Various firms treating customers with contempt - literally, the only reason I cancelled Sky is I couldn't get them to fix a problem.

I paid for it at least five years past the point where I knew easily where to get for free each thing I was paying for. On a regular basis, I would go to one of these places to get something I was **already paying Sky for** , but they couldn't deliver due to a rain fade issue.

Eventually, even I, big believer in paying for IP, gave in and moved to the dark side.

If the dark side got me eventually, how the heck do you propose Sky will have a long term customer base? Everybody under 30 that I know has only ever known free content, and unlike you and me, they don't see it as stealing.

[mistaTea]

If the dark side got me eventually, how the heck do you propose Sky will have a long term customer base? Everybody under 30 that I know has only ever known free content, and unlike you and me, they don't see it as stealing.

Very true - I have even had discussions with a 46 year old man at work who steals all of his content. He gets upset when I suggest there is a moral issue with theft...he readily comes up with all sorts of reasons as to why it is not in fact theft, and even if it was - the crime is totally victimless...

Back to the real world.

Piracy is clearly a bigger issue for Sky than Netflix etc in many ways. Remember though, Sky is merely a content distributor. They are not in this alone...I would expect them to be working with all of their major partners to tackle this. It is in the content creators best interests to limit Piracy too.

I do not believe Sky's whack-a-mole approach (whereby they want to get internet providers to police Piracy) is the way forward. Ultimately, I believe, they have to work closely with their content creator partners to further unbundle their packages. Piracy will alway be an issue for them, but a reduced issue if people can pay a modest fee for only the content they want.

I have the Premium Package with VodafoneTV. About $90 a month for the works. Now, for me, $3/day (less than the cost of a flat white) does not seem outrageous considering I have more Movies, Box Sets, interest channels and Sport than I could ever watch... but I appreciate there is a large cohort of potential subscribers that are more price sensitive.

[Zaphod]

I do not believe Sky's whack-a-mole approach (whereby they want to get internet providers to police Piracy) is the way forward. Ultimately, I believe, they have to work closely with their content creator partners to further unbundle their packages. Piracy will alway be an issue for them, but a reduced issue if people can pay a modest fee for only the content they want.


Agreed - however Sky's content licencing agreements with content providers (according to a colleague who is involved) does stipulate that they must take any and all practicable steps to stop piracy.



I have the Premium Package with VodafoneTV. About $90 a month for the works. Now, for me, $3/day (less than the cost of a flat white) does not seem outrageous considering I have more Movies, Box Sets, interest channels and Sport than I could ever watch... but I appreciate there is a large cohort of potential subscribers that are more price sensitive.

For those customers there are alternatives such as Netflix, which is IMO, filled with an ever increasing suite of rather dire exclusives and elderly back catalogues.

[mistaTea]

For those customers there are alternatives such as Netflix, which is IMO, filled with an ever increasing suite of rather dire exclusives and elderly back catalogues.

Indeed. Though I think it is nuts to compare Netflix against traditional Sky TV. If one were to make a fair comparison (apples with apples, as it were) then you would have to compare the content offerings and price points of Netflix vs NEON.

The NEON UX is pretty crappy compared to Netflix, but the overall offering is very competitive IMO. Certainly the NEON content is better than most of the stuff on Netflix as they have all the HBO and Showtime Box Sets etc and most of the Movies Sky offer.

If the Millennials are unaware about the advantages of a NEON subscription, well then that is a failing on Sky's part for not promoting it aggressively enough.

[tga_trader]

I have the Premium Package with VodafoneTV. About $90 a month for the works. Now, for me, $3/day (less than the cost of a flat white) does not seem outrageous considering I have more Movies, Box Sets, interest channels and Sport than I could ever watch... but I appreciate there is a large cohort of potential subscribers that are more price sensitive.
See it's not even the cost of sky for me, its having what I want, when I want it, and Sky doesn't even remotely fulfill that.
The content creators / distributors are their own enemy. I would happily pay MORE than the price of sky if I could have on demand access to EVERYTHING. Instead I need to have Netflix, Neon, Lightbox, Google Play Movies and there is still so much content that is on none of them, that there is literally no legal way to watch.
Lightbox is the only service that has 'Preacher'...but they only have Season 2 & 3...?

[mistaTea]

See it's not even the cost of sky for me, its having what I want, when I want it, and Sky doesn't even remotely fulfill that.
The content creators / distributors are their own enemy. I would happily pay MORE than the price of sky if I could have on demand access to EVERYTHING. Instead I need to have Netflix, Neon, Lightbox, Google Play Movies and there is still so much content that is on none of them, that there is literally no legal way to watch.
Lightbox is the only service that has 'Preacher'...but they only have Season 2 & 3...?

Apparently the next generation of SKY boxes (which have been delayed - like most major projects are, I suppose) will behave like a content aggregator. You would still need your Netflix subscriptions etc...but you would be able to search in the Sky Portal, and all matches (regardless of which platform they live on) will be surfaced. So you could search "James Bond" and it would return all James Bond results from Sky, Netflix, Lightbox and whatever else you subscribe to.

I doubt that functionality would be available in the first release, but if they did introduce that type of feature in the future it would make finding and consuming content so much easier.

[Stranger_Danger]

See it's not even the cost of sky for me, its having what I want, when I want it, and Sky doesn't even remotely fulfill that.
The content creators / distributors are their own enemy. I would happily pay MORE than the price of sky if I could have on demand access to EVERYTHING. Instead I need to have Netflix, Neon, Lightbox, Google Play Movies and there is still so much content that is on none of them, that there is literally no legal way to watch.
Lightbox is the only service that has 'Preacher'...but they only have Season 2 & 3...?

Yep, the "answer" to Sky is various online services, of differing quality, that may or may not have the show you want.

There is one place I've found that has everything though - the dark side.

That's the issue. Even if you're happy to pay. Even if you believe piracy is theft. Even if you, like me, spent years resisting the cold hard fact that it is easier to obtain content by NOT paying than it is to obtain it by paying.

This is the problem that a company like Sky faces. If in doubt, you start a shop selling burgers for $10, and I'll start a shop next door giving burgers away for free. Let's see where people get their burgers.

Of course, I will quickly go broke, but the dark side doesn't have that issue - it's giving away other people's burgers for free, and it can and will go on doing so as long as people make those burgers.

Good luck Sky in fighting those dynamics long term.

[mistaTea]

This is the problem that a company like Sky faces. If in doubt, you start a shop selling burgers for $10, and I'll start a shop next door giving burgers away for free. Let's see where people get their burgers.

Of course, I will quickly go broke, but the dark side doesn't have that issue - it's giving away other people's burgers for free, and it can and will go on doing so as long as people make those burgers.

Good luck Sky in fighting those dynamics long term.

For your analogy to work...Company 2 would have to somehow steal the raw ingredients to enable them to then somehow produce and distribute their burgers for free.

Even if that were possible (and it is one hell of a stretch, but I'm trying to work with you here...), ultimately in the long run we (the consumers) all lose out. The farmers and bakers who produce the key ingredients will go out of business and then there will be no more raw ingredients for the burgers to be assembled and distributed.

So with the digital content you claim to reluctantly steal - ultimately, if too many people formed the same view, you would effectively be shafting yourselves (in the long run).

I do take on board some of the points you make, however content Piracy is a complex issue and 'armchair commentators' like you and I don't really know what we are talking about.

[Stranger_Danger]

For your analogy to work...Company 2 would have to somehow steal the raw ingredients to enable them to then somehow produce and distribute their burgers for free.

Even if that were possible (and it is one hell of a stretch, but I'm trying to work with you here...), ultimately in the long run we (the consumers) all lose out. The farmers and bakers who produce the key ingredients will go out of business and then there will be no more raw ingredients for the burgers to be assembled and distributed.

So with the digital content you claim to reluctantly steal - ultimately, if too many people formed the same view, you would effectively be shafting yourselves (in the long run).

I do take on board some of the points you make, however content Piracy is a complex issue and 'armchair commentators' like you and I don't really know what we are talking about.

The funny thing is, we're actually in full agreement. The only difference is you are observing the filth, whereas with a long pause in the middle, I have now decided to roll around in it.

What makes sense for one person breaks down if everyone does it, and everyone is shafting themselves in the long term. Agreed.

People are not thinking long term at all, and I haven't got a clue what the funding model will be in 20 years time. If you look at the musicians capable of selling out a stadium, most of those stars were created before the funding model for music broke down. Now, you have a bunch of 60 year olds on stage singing old songs, every young person with a band can "release an album" for almost nothing, but boy has distribution, and making any money, got harder.

Is this the future for movies and television?

Quite possibly, but unless the actors can find the equivalent of accepting that recordings are basically unpaid ads for their live shows, then putting on a ticketed concert and touring with it, the consequences could be even worse.

[Bobdn]

I'm happy to pay for content. It's chicken feed compared to the costs of lots of other things.

I watched the most amazing T20 cricket matches between Australia and India on Sky Sports. Wow, this morning it was a second to last ball win and the game before, a last ball win. No one does night matches like India. Brilliant and worth every cent.

[mistaTea]

The funny thing is, we're actually in full agreement. The only difference is you are observing the filth, whereas with a long pause in the middle, I have now decided to roll around in it.



Yes indeed, we are certainly aligned in some key areas. And your comment on rolling around in the filth did make me chuckle out loud, so I thank you for that.

I hope you do make the decision to leave 'the Dark Side' though. You seem like a decent enough individual, and I'd sure like to get a look at you, if only you would come back to The Light.

[see weed]

Have been buying into SKT AIR and SPK for the last week, but do feel like Evel Knievel jumping into SKT. But then I am a gambler :eek2:.

[Beagle]

Have been buying into SKT AIR and SPK for the last week, but do feel like Evel Knievel jumping into SKT. But then I am a gambler :eek2:.

Confucius say : Man who try to swim against outgoing tide at Manukau heads must like big trouble.

[kiwico]

Confucius say : Man who try to swim against outgoing tide at Manukau heads must like big trouble.

But then Confucius also say: man with hand in back pocket feeling cheeky; man with hand in front hand feeling cocky!

[bull....]

new lows , what happens when a companies been so greedy refusing to change with the times

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/111019729/analyst-sees-potential-for-sky-tv-takeover-as-shares-sink-to-143

[TideMan]

Yet the model of broadcasting to everybody who wants to listen, as opposed to each person downloading their individual content over fibre or copper, is a good one.
It's just that Sky has made a pig's ear of managing it.

[Baa_Baa]

new lows , what happens when a companies been so greedy refusing to change with the times

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/111019729/analyst-sees-potential-for-sky-tv-takeover-as-shares-sink-to-143

Is it the worst chart on the NZX, except the ones who've already gone bust? Those $7 highs mid 2014 seems soooo long ago now. Puking investors capital in a race to the bottom, a race that has only one participant, SKT.

[BlackCross]

Kiltearn desperately selling out at almost any price it seems.
SKT undervalued IMO... though I don't yet hold...
I have to say, all this illegal streaming's fine but I, my parner, and many others I know just want to push a button on the remote and watch a HD quality programme. I can't be ar*ed trying to find dodgy streams and torrents every 10 minutes.. most of which are far from HD quality and which often disappear half way through a game/programme.
There's still a place for honest satellite TV imo.

[carrom74]

new lows , what happens when a companies been so greedy refusing to change with the times

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/111019729/analyst-sees-potential-for-sky-tv-takeover-as-shares-sink-to-143

And stuff has picked the “world renowned” brokers such as Morning star and Forsyth Barr for their comments.. one says it’s undervalued and the other the opposite.. yeah right...

[Sideshow Bob]

new lows , what happens when a companies been so greedy refusing to change with the times

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/111019729/analyst-sees-potential-for-sky-tv-takeover-as-shares-sink-to-143

Would probably be a good thing - opportunity for a clean out.....

[see weed]

Have been buying into SKT AIR and SPK for the last week, but do feel like Evel Knievel jumping into SKT. But then I am a gambler :eek2:.
Did a back flip and sold 60% of holding before ex div. at a small loss. Now Morningstar has a Big Green Buy recommendation on it :D.

[bull....]

Did a back flip and sold 60% of holding before ex div. at a small loss. Now Morningstar has a Big Green Buy recommendation on it :D.

are morningstar worth following?

[Balance]

are morningstar worth following?

Do you trust Winston Peters to act in the best interest of NZ?

[bull....]

Do you trust Winston Peters to act in the best interest of NZ?

im sure hes neg hard to get the best thing for nz for his blessing of a cgt lol

[Sideshow Bob]

Continuing to plumb new depths - $1.35 this morning, low of $1.33.

[Balance]

Continuing to plumb new depths - $1.35 this morning, low of $1.33.

A few big sellers all trying to get out through the same door - NZX.

Only one result - sad but unless there's a takeover, things look grim!

[bull....]

writing on the wall once spark get there sport up and running subscribers leaving sky will accelerate. sky revenues will decline quicker . less money to by content etc.

[Sideshow Bob]

Based on the price now, only values the company at $517m. Spark could take them out pretty easy....??

[bull....]

Based on the price now, only values the company at $517m. Spark could take them out pretty easy....??

spark reckon there platform is not the future , so moutter was saying on a conference call. but who knows at the right price?

[Sideshow Bob]

spark reckon there platform is not the future , so moutter was saying on a conference call. but who knows at the right price?

It depends how much over the top Spark has to pay for the rugby rights to kill them off. Sky is an existing business with cashflows and profits - and production capability.

Or they could just drive them into the ground over time.

[tga_trader]

Yeah Sky still has subscriber base, production capability, content rights, and I.P for Neon and Fanpass all of which would be valuable to Spark. But currently the "buy price" is being discounted every month, so Spark will be in no rush.

[Beagle]

I don't think much of Forbar but they're infinitely better than moaningstar in my opinion.
I think the Commerce Commission would have a LOT to say about any proposal for Spark to takeover SKT.
Race to the bottom I think.
Maybe if we see some life and it breaks back up through the 100 day MA but honestly I wonder if that will ever happen ?
I think anyone buying here for yield should have a good long think about what the term "Value Trap" means.

[bull....]

It depends how much over the top Spark has to pay for the rugby rights to kill them off. Sky is an existing business with cashflows and profits - and production capability.

Or they could just drive them into the ground over time.

spark can get production capability thru tvnz who they partner with already and the coverage is greater. anyway if vodaph and sky couldnt merge no way spark gonna get sky same senario so run them into ground is best option

[see weed]

Did a back flip and sold 60% of holding before ex div. at a small loss. Now Morningstar has a Big Green Buy recommendation on it :D.
Yee Ha...Yippy Yi Yay:D, Just did a double back flip and sold the other 40%. Only had them for 7 bus. days. $7,400 loss and $430.40c brokerage at .2%. ASB Securities ph me yesterday to see if I want to attend an investor day in June for their highly valued clients. Wow, how cool is that.:t_up: Might go if not too busy:cool:.

[Beagle]

Confucius say : Man who try to swim against outgoing tide at Manukau heads must like big trouble.


Yee Ha...Yippy Yi Yay:D, Just did a double back flip and sold the other 40%. Only had them for 7 bus. days. $7,400 loss and $430.40c brokerage at .2%. ASB Securities ph me yesterday to see if I want to attend an investor day in June for their highly valued clients. Wow, how cool is that.:t_up: Might go if not too busy:cool:.
Best to call the coast guard out even if it costs you money...better than getting into even more trouble eh mate.

[Balance]

Best to call the coast guard out even if it costs you money...better than getting into even more trouble eh mate.

Michael Savage said this : Man who fishes in neighbour's pond, gets crabs.

Spark needs to be careful!

[bull....]

skt has zero customer loyalty because of there greedy attitude , people will flee in droves once spark cranks up the sport offering

[Beagle]

The roll out of fiber braodband another nail in the coffin of SKT.

[bull....]

The roll out of fiber braodband another nail in the coffin of SKT.

5g will crush skt

[Sideshow Bob]

The roll out of fiber braodband another nail in the coffin of SKT.

Rural Broadband not up to it for RWC.

https://www.odt.co.nz/business/rural-broadband-not-cup

[Timesurfer]

I see Morning Star have upgraded them to a buy, with a valuation of $2.50.
I am sure there are a lot of people that would be happy to see the price up around $2.50 again. Thinking that might take a significant reevaluation of their business model, with $0.50 looking more likely on their current share trajectory.

[Entrep]

Why is there talk about Morning Star? It's completely irrelevant... when have SPs EVER followed Morning Star's recommendations?

[LAC]

Sky still has cash in the bank, there’s time for an acquisition or a takeover whichever comes first lol

[BlackCross]

Though SKT's wished for demise by some on here would potentially be good news for SPK shareholders, for the wider population, handing Spark a free hand to charge whatever they want for media wouldn't bode well.

[Beagle]

I see Morning Star have upgraded them to a buy, with a valuation of $2.50.
I am sure there are a lot of people that would be happy to see the price up around $2.50 again. Thinking that might take a significant reevaluation of their business model, with $0.50 looking more likely on their current share trajectory.

The scary thing is some banks with their house brand Kiwisaver scheme's use these muppets as their research supplier and don't have one of their own.
This probably explains why most house brand bank Kiwsaver funds are extremely poor performers. Just because some junior researcher plugs some assumptions into a DCF model without any real thought does not mean the output is going to be any good ! $2.50 is fantasy land stuff. If they think its a BUY with that target its really a SELL lol

[bull....]

Though SKT's wished for demise by some on here would potentially be good news for SPK shareholders, for the wider population, handing Spark a free hand to charge whatever they want for media wouldn't bode well.

skt been charging like wounded bulls for yrs now spk offering competition , much cheaper competition and skt dont know what to do cause there model relies on charging everyone exorbitant charges.

[Timesurfer]

Sky still has cash in the bank, there’s time for an acquisition or a takeover whichever comes first lol

Might be ripe for the likes of Graeme Hart to strip for parts?


Why is there talk about Morning Star? It's completely irrelevant... when have SPs EVER followed Morning Star's recommendations?

Merely making the note. I suspect that Morning Star have the same funding model as the Better Business Bureau after watching when and what they recommend.

Just by way of disclosure, I do not own SKT or SPK. I do get all of my entertainment streamed through either freeview or netflix though.

[mistaTea]

Yee Ha...Yippy Yi Yay:D, Just did a double back flip and sold the other 40%. Only had them for 7 bus. days. $7,400 loss and $430.40c brokerage at .2%. ASB Securities ph me yesterday to see if I want to attend an investor day in June for their highly valued clients. Wow, how cool is that.:t_up: Might go if not too busy:cool:.

I think this may well be the most ridiculous thing I have ever read during my investing career.

I bet ASB love you very very VERY much :ohmy:

[see weed]

I think this may well be the most ridiculous thing I have ever read during my investing career.

I bet ASB love you very very VERY much :ohmy:
Yes, Yes and Yes:D

[mistaTea]

Yes, Yes and Yes:D

I think I may have purchased some of the shares you dumped yesterday.

Thank you very much for being so generous...

:t_up::t_up::t_up:

[SilverBack]

Morning Star make the point that SKT still has deep pockets and a sound balance sheet. Their valuation model allows for declining dividends and strongly decreasing earnings through to 2020 but with predicted PE of 5.6 and yield of 10.0 (2019) and PE of 6.7 and yield of 8.5 (2020) I do not think they are being silly with their recommendation. With a net margin over 14% (and up on the previous year) and net debt to equity of 22.5 this company still has value at today's SP.
Of course there is risk. You would not be in the market otherwise. However, I remember when the SPK SP (as Telecom) reached $1.50 not too many years ago and all was doom and gloom.
With SPK's increasing strength in media, the Commerce Commission may have a different opinion going forward and it may even be possible that the Vodafone merger plan is resurrected.

[McGinty]

Just posted on the other forum, but I thought that I would share here as well.

Had a bit of time tonight so decided to look into SKT but not at a FA or TA level (as we all should be able to identify a decaying company in a solid down trend – even if Kiltearn Partners can’t), instead I’m looking at the ‘Troughing’ level and from what I’ve seen this company is up with the best in the NZX.

So, I’ll start at the top with John (Managing Director/CEO), Total Remuneration in 2018 of $1.95m incl short and long term bonuses of $562k.

Over the last 5 years his Remuneration has been between $1.8m and $2m, while the Share price has dropped approx. 80%. I’m unsure of the exact hurdle levels that he must achieve to get his bonuses, the categories are listed in the latest Annual Report but none of them are on the total shareholder return or EPS growth (which works well for him)

He’s been in the role for 17 years and is probably looking to clip the tick until the lights finally get turned out.

The Board – Well the board fees range from $100k to $187k (chairman & on committees) for….wait for it……….7 board meetings a year! That’s right, just 7 per year and possibly 8 days of work if the directors decide to attend the AGM . Sweet gig, no wonder why Derek is loving SKT and last year received $146k for rocking up. SKT have omitted the number of board meetings from the last 4 Annual Reports, but up to 2014 they did, and that number was 7 (hmm that’s when the share price was last at a high as well).

The board doesn’t really believe in the company as they have no real skin in the game. John holds a few and has doubled his holding to 240k in the last couple of years, but even the Titanic’s captain thought the ship wouldn’t sink until it did. 26 years in the company and only 240k shares tells me that he’s smart enough to know that getting your snout in the tough with only a part time board to monitor you is a lot more rewarding than owning shares in the company.

If I was a shareholder, I would be asking some serious questions at the AGM, as I think the cast from 7 days would provide shareholders with more value than this current board.

Disc: Don’t hold and never have, might consider buying 1 share to attend what should be an interesting AGM later this year (Even including brokerage it would be cheaper than seeing Elton and you’ll get a snack).

[Airw0lf]

Just posted on the other forum, but I thought that I would share here as well.Had a bit of time tonight so decided to look into SKT but not at a FA or TA level (as we all should be able to identify a decaying company in a solid down trend – even if Kiltearn Partners can’t), instead I’m looking at the ‘Troughing’ level and from what I’ve seen this company is up with the best in the NZX.So, I’ll start at the top with John (Managing Director/CEO), Total Remuneration in 2018 of $1.95m incl short and long term bonuses of $562k.Over the last 5 years his Remuneration has been between $1.8m and $2m, while the Share price has dropped approx. 80%. I’m unsure of the exact hurdle levels that he must achieve to get his bonuses, the categories are listed in the latest Annual Report but none of them are on the total shareholder return or EPS growth (which works well for him)He’s been in the role for 17 years and is probably looking to clip the tick until the lights finally get turned out.The Board – Well the board fees range from $100k to $187k (chairman & on committees) for….wait for it……….7 board meetings a year! That’s right, just 7 per year and possibly 8 days of work if the directors decide to attend the AGM . Sweet gig, no wonder why Derek is loving SKT and last year received $146k for rocking up. SKT have omitted the number of board meetings from the last 4 Annual Reports, but up to 2014 they did, and that number was 7 (hmm that’s when the share price was last at a high as well).The board doesn’t really believe in the company as they have no real skin in the game. John holds a few and has doubled his holding to 240k in the last couple of years, but even the Titanic’s captain thought the ship wouldn’t sink until it did. 26 years in the company and only 240k shares tells me that he’s smart enough to know that getting your snout in the tough with only a part time board to monitor you is a lot more rewarding than owning shares in the company.If I was a shareholder, I would be asking some serious questions at the AGM, as I think the cast from 7 days would provide shareholders with more value than this current board.Disc: Don’t hold and never have, might consider buying 1 share to attend what should be an interesting AGM later this year (Even including brokerage it would be cheaper than seeing Elton and you’ll get a snack).Fair points about John Fellet and the Board, but John's out and there's a new CEO: https://stoppress.co.nz/movingsshakings/sky-tv-announced-martin-stewart-new-ceo

[McGinty]

Fair points about John Fellet and the Board, but John's out and there's a new CEO: https://stoppress.co.nz/movingsshakings/sky-tv-announced-martin-stewart-new-ceo

Thanks for the update, It will be interesting to see what level of compensation the new CEO will be on.

[minimoke]

Thanks for the update, It will be interesting to see what level of compensation the new CEO will be on.


Notice period 6 months by either party
Post-Employment Restraint 6 months
Base salary NZ$1.5 million pa

Short Term/Long Term Incentive Annual on target STI/LTI incentive of 50% of base salary, at the discretion of the Board

Share scheme 200,000 SKY shares to be provided for no consideration on the first four anniversaries of commencement of employment (total 800,000 shares). The shares will vest if the company exercises its no fault termination right or if there is a change of control and Mr Stewart is no longer CEO.


Post termination entitlements These include a mix of remuneration for a limited period, statutory entitlements and relocation costs which vary depending on how the appointment comes to an end.

[mistaTea]

The board doesn’t really believe in the company as they have no real skin in the game. John holds a few and has doubled his holding to 240k in the last couple of years, but even the Titanic’s captain thought the ship wouldn’t sink until it did. 26 years in the company and only 240k shares tells me that he’s smart enough to know that getting your snout in the tough with only a part time board to monitor you is a lot more rewarding than owning shares in the company.


Great points McGinty. It is certainly much better when Management buy shares in the company with their own money - so that they 'eat their own cooking', as it were.

As it happens, Cathryn Oliver did pick up a few shares recently (https://www.nzx.com/announcements/331665). Perhaps there will be more disclosures if more Management take advantage of the low share price.

Though I much prefer Management to have significant skin in the game (creating Owner-Managers - my kind of people!), I don't think it is possible to leap to the conclusion that low levels of ownership must mean that Management think the company is doomed to fail.

In the case of Sky, shares owned by Management have been low for some time. Even when the Vodafone-Sky merger looked like it would go through, Management weren't exactly snapping up shares even though the combined new entity would have certainly been worth more over time.

This might be because Management are not well versed in stock picking. Perhaps if they read Peter Lynch's 'One Up on Wall Street' they would realise that buying stocks in companies you know really well (i.e work for...) can be a winning strategy. Not being confident in picking your own stocks does not necessarily mean you are not passionate and optimistic about the future of the company.

Others may also be wary of putting all of their family eggs in one basket. A (potentially irrational) need to diversify their investments may keep them away from buying into Sky, even though they know there is value.

I would be much more worried if Management had significant holdings and were dumping the stock in a race to the exit.

[mistaTea]

There is a very strong case for directors and management to own shares so they will work to ensure the company's success and FUTURE success. How else does one know that the interests of directors & management are aligned with that of shareholders?



I agree with you 100%. Owner-Managers are preferred.

[see weed]

I think I may have purchased some of the shares you dumped yesterday.

Thank you very much for being so generous...

:t_up::t_up::t_up:
No problem. If I can be of any help in the future let me know. I try to make as much loss as possible in March for tax purposes. I call it LTDT...Loss to dividend transfer. From memory last year made about $75,000 loss in March, but got back about $77,000 in dividends from 16/3/18 to 20/4/18. AIR was the hardest to lose money on, they paid me $14,125.83c div after tax, but when I sold them ex div day they didn't drop the full 11c so only made about a 5c loss. So to cut a long story short, did it with about 12 companies and got my final tax bill down from $60k to $11k in 4 weeks.;) ps forgot derek handley was a director at SKT, otherwise wouldn't of bought any.

[mistaTea]

No problem. If I can be of any help in the future let me know.

We are a match made in Heaven. When your short-term speculative approach meets my long-term 'value investing' approach...

Over time I become filthy rich, and you become less poor.

:D:D:D

[see weed]

We are a match made in Heaven. When your short-term speculative approach meets my long-term 'value investing' approach...

Over time I become filthy rich, and you become less poor.

:D:D:D
Filthy rich in your eyes might be less poor in my eyes. But over time are you referring to 20 years or more. In my time I'm referring 1 to 3 years, most of my portfolio is sharetrading. So we are talking about two different types of investing. No worries, we are both after the same goal in different ways, I just can't be bothered waiting around 20 years. ps How much is filthy rich;).

[mistaTea]

Filthy rich in your eyes might be less poor in my eyes. But over time are you referring to 20 years or more. In my time I'm referring 1 to 3 years, most of my portfolio is sharetrading. So we are talking about two different types of investing. No worries, we are both after the same goal in different ways, I just can't be bothered waiting around 20 years. ps How much is filthy rich;).

You are my new favourite person. I love how you are totally Zen with the world.

And you are bang on - our investing approaches are very different. I have accumulated SKY shares because I want to own the business long-term. The share price is irrelevant to me right now, other than being a potential BUY opportunity if it is low enough.
Your approach is more speculative/short-term. Nothing wrong or immoral with that at all, and you may well be the exception to the rule, but GENERALLY...speculators tend to underperform investors in the long-term.

And how much is filthy rich? Well, given the size of your trades I suspect you are right - filthy rich to me is probably chump change to you :t_up::t_up::t_up:

[carrom74]

some serious dumping/offloading going on...

suspect it would be kiltearn....

[steveb]

I have a friend works for SKY been with them from the start.He has accumulated a reasonable number of shares over the years from his incentive scheme.Last time I saw him he asked "whats happening to the share price!!"

These are the guys I feel sorry for staff who have been loyal to the firm worked hard,and are now looking at possibly a much smaller return when they retire than anticipated.

Now down to $1.25 !

[whatsup]

Yeh, imo SKT was stripped years ago, we could see sub $1.00 shortly, very sad for hard working employees,

[Balance]

Yeh, imo SKT was stripped years ago, we could see sub $1.00 shortly, very sad for hard working employees,

Takeover could be in the offing.

[whatsup]

Takeover could be in the offing.

Yeh I was thinking that late last week when the s p was $1.30ish then saw it add a few cents on Fri and today on opening thinking darn Ive missed this one but after the dumping this arvo am thinking WHO would, as the cash is almost gone, what part could be stripped so that eliminates the bottom feeders, whos left Telecom ?

[whatsup]

More large dumping on the close of trade today, whatsup and what is going on with SKT ?

[Balance]

More large dumping on the close of trade today, whatsup and what is going on with SKT ?

Brave man to stand in the way of Kiltearn selling (if it's them).

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/SKT/331479/296201.pdf

:(

[whatsup]

Brave man to stand in the way of Kiltearn selling (if it's them).

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/SKT/331479/296201.pdf

:(


WOW ++wow, that is going to take a while and destroy the S P (if its them ) !

[Beagle]

This is not swimming at the Manukau heads in an outgoing tide, its much worse than that. Buying now is like standing in front of a Bullet Trian going downhill at 200 m.p.h. :eek2:

[minimoke]

Futurist Derek Handley would have seen this coming. SKT very lucky to have him on the Board as they will have contingency plans.

[carrom74]

Almost 4.5 Million shares traded.... Heavy trading... surely someone is interested in buying up.

[flyer]

Almost 4.5 Million shares traded.... Heavy trading... surely someone is interested in buying up.

9.12 million shares, something is happening!

[Marilyn Munroe]

Futurist Derek Handley would have seen this coming. SKT very lucky to have him on the Board as they will have contingency plans.

I agree MM, they were lucky to get him. It is not often there is a redundant monorail salesman available to fill this type of role.

Boop boop de do
Marilyn

[bull....]

9.12 million shares, something is happening!

short sellers buying back?

[mistaTea]

short sellers buying back?

Christ only knows - I expect some disclosures to be made over the next day or so.

I assume Kiltearn are on the sell side, but will be interesting to see who is buying as aggressively as they are selling.

[mistaTea]

Another 7M traded today.

16M traded in just the last two days - or roughly 4% of total shares outstanding.

So who is the patsy? The buyers or the sellers?

[Entrep]

CFO is out

[mistaTea]

CFO is out

Long-time critics of Sky being outdated and run by old white men (who have been in their jobs too long) should be singing the new CEO's praises! A big clean-out is overdue, or so I hear!

Predictably though, the critics will position this as the company being in turmoil etc.

I expect a big shake-up in 2019 with Martin Stewart. Any fears that he will not be able to 'be his own man' with Fellet breathing down his neck as a Director, so far appear to be unfounded.

[Entrep]

Long-time critics of Sky being outdated and run by old white men (who have been in their jobs too long) should be singing the new CEO's praises! A big clean-out is overdue, or so I hear!

Predictably though, the critics will position this as the company being in turmoil etc.

I expect a big shake-up in 2019 with Martin Stewart. Any fears that he will not be able to 'be his own man' with Fellet breathing down his neck as a Director, so far appear to be unfounded.

Hollingworth is a top operator, big loss IMO.

[mistaTea]

Hollingworth is a top operator, big loss IMO.

I am sure that he is - and with 16 years of IP, that will be challenging to replace.

It is also fair to say that Sky can't keep doing what they have been doing over the last few years if they have any hope of growing their subscription base. A drastically different approach will certainly be uncomfortable for a number of the Old Guard, and when that happens it is probably in everyones best interest to part ways.

This will all go swimmingly for Martin if his new approach leads to success. If he fails though, people will nail him for being too gung-ho and losing key talent in such short order etc etc.

[BlackCross]

"...Hollingworth had said he was considering throwing his hat in the ring for the top job when veteran CEO John Fellet announced his exit last year. However, Sky's board opted for Stewart to oversee the transition from a traditional satellite pay-TV broadcaster to a multi-platform entertainment business...."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12212892

[mistaTea]

"...Hollingworth had said he was considering throwing his hat in the ring for the top job when veteran CEO John Fellet announced his exit last year. However, Sky's board opted for Stewart to oversee the transition from a traditional satellite pay-TV broadcaster to a multi-platform entertainment business...."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12212892

Difficult to support the new guy that took the job you wanted, you reckon?

[Entrep]

"...Hollingworth had said he was considering throwing his hat in the ring for the top job when veteran CEO John Fellet announced his exit last year. However, Sky's board opted for Stewart to oversee the transition from a traditional satellite pay-TV broadcaster to a multi-platform entertainment business...."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12212892
So did he actually throw it in or not? Also given how well regarded he is of course he considered the job

[mistaTea]

About 28M traded today. Who is this mystery buyer?

[moimoi]

Not necessarily a buyer.....

Algorithmic trading via direct market access with no change in beneficial ownership of the shares...

Buyer and seller potentially essentially the same entity.

[waikare]

Not necessarily a buyer.....

Algorithmic trading via direct market access with no change in beneficial ownership of the shares...

Buyer and seller potentially essentially the same entity.

Had to google Algorithmic Trading, still a little unsure of what's it all about, care to enlighten a few of us less knowledgeable punters Moimoi...….

[Chanchay]

Not necessarily a buyer.....

Algorithmic trading via direct market access with no change in beneficial ownership of the shares...

Buyer and seller potentially essentially the same entity.

If there is no beneficial owner change I think it's illegal in NZ. The broker who provides direct access is responsible to ensure clients dont do it either by accident or intentionally. I think Craig's or some other firm got a fine recently for this. Interesting new world of investment.

[mistaTea]

You are right about that, not legal to do that kind of trading here.

Amounts to market manipulation as one attempts to create the illusion that there is high interest in a stock.

The more likely explanation is that Kiltearn are dumping all of their stock in short order, causing the stock price to plunge while some other organisation is buying up just as aggressively.

Wouldn’t surprise me at all if someone was trying to buy up to the 19.99% limit at a bargain price before attempting a takeover (and paying closer to intrinsic value for the remaining shares). That is what Vero tried with Tower a year or so back (though they were ultimately unsuccessful).

[mistaTea]

Looks like Blackrock are the stock-dumping culprits!

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/SKT/332147/296979.pdf

[BlackCross]

Jupiter one of the buyers - picked up 4.24 million.
http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/SKT/332209/297072.pdf

[mistaTea]

Jupiter one of the buyers - picked up 4.24 million.
http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/SKT/332209/297072.pdf

Really interested to see who else was buying up large when Blackrock decided to tank the share price.

If we are to believe them... that they were just rebalancing due to changes in the international indexes...then I think that is a crazy investment philosophy. To buy such a large stake in a company, only to realise a large loss in a relatively short period of time because of a change in The Dow?

Not my idea of investing.

[mistaTea]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/111416957/sky-tv-will-remain-the-home-of-sport-new-boss-martin-stewart-vows

I am sure Chris Keall (now working for The Herald) will write an equally objective piece about Sky and the new CEO when he gets an interview (Yeah, right).

I appreciate robust journalism, and certainly Sky need to answer a number of frank questions - but Chris Keall is so biased against Sky while fawning over Spark. It's embarrassing to read.

[Jay]

Chris Keall's article.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12214820

New CEO not a fan of how Fanpass was sold amongst other things and maybe why the HO sport left

[mistaTea]

Chris Keall's article.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12214820

New CEO not a fan of how Fanpass was sold amongst other things and maybe why the HO sport left

Yep.

However, Martin discussed a wide range of topics yet Chris (unsurprisingly) comes out with a negative and emotive headline: "New Sky TV boss trashes his company's own Fanpass service".
So, of all the things that were discussed - that was the most important talking point in Chris' mind.

He is incredibly biased, and surely can't honestly believe that what he prints is objective journalism.

And, for the record, though Fanpass pricing is absolutely ridiculous you can cast from the Fanpass app to your big screen (unless you buy the $15/month mobile-only option).

[JeremyALD]

Yep.

However, Martin discussed a wide range of topics yet Chris (unsurprisingly) comes out with a negative and emotive headline: "New Sky TV boss trashes his company's own Fanpass service".
So, of all the things that were discussed - that was the most important talking point in Chris' mind.

He is incredibly biased, and surely can't honestly believe that what he prints is objective journalism.

And, for the record, though Fanpass pricing is absolutely ridiculous you can cast from the Fanpass app to your big screen (unless you buy the $15/month mobile-only option).

A good question would be how did they even come up with the $99 a month option? It's absolutely ludicrous.

[mistaTea]

A good question would be how did they even come up with the $99 a month option? It's absolutely ludicrous.

Agreed. If they didn't want people on a month-by-month option with no contract they just shouldn't have offered that option (rather than giving the option but with an insane price that no reasonable person would ever pay).

[steveb]

Agreed. If they didn't want people on a month-by-month option with no contract they just shouldn't have offered that option (rather than giving the option but with an insane price that no reasonable person would ever pay).
I used to pay close to $99.00 for just basic plus sport,when they brought in the new lower cost plans,I phoned them to sort out a new package,after being on hold for over a quarter of an hour,I emailed them to cancel and sent the decoder back to them.Just goes to show simply answering the phone might increase their customer base.

[mistaTea]

,I phoned them to sort out a new package,after being on hold for over a quarter of an hour,I emailed them to cancel and sent the decoder back to them.

Wow, you packed it in entirely because you had to wait 15 minutes?

Nobody likes being put on hold, but it is a reality for many organisations that wait times (often well beyond 15 minutes in some industries) occur.

[peat]

Agreed. If they didn't want people on a month-by-month option with no contract they just shouldn't have offered that option (rather than giving the option but with an insane price that no reasonable person would ever pay).
Personally I dont think thats too unreasonable to bump up price for short termers, I paid for one month at that price to check it out without having to committ. There was one month back then that had an enormous amount of sport in it. I think it was Wimbledon and AB rugby tests (2 or 3 in that month). And there was Conon McGregor fighting Floyd too ! (Extra payment of course) But I consider I got great value.

And then a few months later I signed up for a year. Everyones a winner.

[steveb]

Wow, you packed it in entirely because you had to wait 15 minutes?

Nobody likes being put on hold, but it is a reality for many organisations that wait times (often well beyond 15 minutes in some industries) occur.
Actually no I did not pack it in because of the wait,Whilst on hold it gave me time to think about whether I actually needed Sky given that most of the sport I wanted was on Prime.I worked out I could buy a freeview recorder,for 3 months of sky subs and the rest as they say is all profit.
If Sky had answered their phone straight away,I would not have had time to ponder.You also have to remember that Sky had not answered for over 15 mins,so how much longer I might have been waiting is anyone's guess.

[mistaTea]

Personally I dont think thats too unreasonable to bump up price for short termers


Paying a higher price for a no-contract, no minimum-term is completely acceptable business practice and pricing strategy.

I just think the $99/month is ridiculous, and too much of a hurdle for most people.

Though I obviously don't have their content cost figures to work from, I would have thought that they would end up with a pricing model something like:

1. $39.99 per month all you can eat Sky Sport 1 - 4, 6 month contract
2. $59.99 per month all you can eat Sky Sport 1 - 4, no contract, cancel anytime
3. Add additional channels (like ESPN) $4.99 per month, 6 month contract

Many more people may sign up for a month at 60 bucks to give it a go and then go on to take the contracted pricing if they are happy with the service.

There has to be a sweet spot for Sky where they take less revenue per subscriber, but are able to significantly increase their subscription base thereby maintaining a reasonable level of profitability.

[Jay]

Paying a higher price for a no-contract, no minimum-term is completely acceptable business practice and pricing strategy.

...
There has to be a sweet spot for Sky where they take less revenue per subscriber, but are able to significantly increase their subscription base thereby maintaining a reasonable level of profitability.

Agree including for the "full package" as I have said before, they should be charging much if anything for the channels you can get on freeview, a lot of people will not pay and will not bother trying to stream it from some "dodgy site" or either take up Spark on the stuff they want when they want it

[mistaTea]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/332602

John Fellet gone. All the criticisms before about Martin Stewart not being able to be his 'own man' with John in the background unfounded.

This guy is really cracking the whip! Will it turn into long-term tangible results though?

[minimoke]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/332602

John Fellet gone. All the criticisms before about Martin Stewart not being able to be his 'own man' with John in the background unfounded.

This guy is really cracking the whip! Will it turn into long-term tangible results though?Too little, too late. Handley is still there.

[mistaTea]

Too little, too late. Handley is still there.

:eek2::scared::cool:

Maybe Derek will be gone next! I love your optimism minimoke! :D

[minimoke]

:eek2::scared::cool:

Maybe Derek will be gone next! I love your optimism minimoke! :DI'm a bit grumpy actually. Ages ago I foresaw a drop in SP and consequently sold out totally. And do you think I got tapped on the shoulder for the Chief Technology Officer job. No I didn't! And I obviously had the skills. Even now I am in a loosing position with some of my portfolio so I am still neck and neck with Handley's abilities. (Plus I am probably equally full of sh1te)

[Arbroath]

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/332602

John Fellet gone. All the criticisms before about Martin Stewart not being able to be his 'own man' with John in the background unfounded.

This guy is really cracking the whip! Will it turn into long-term tangible results though?

You gotta love all the PR crap in the announcement. What it should have said is...

John built a great business but then took his customers for granted treating them with contempt for years. Finally he saw the writing on the wall about 5 years after normal human beings did but he did little to change the business ensuring the new CEO would have to be heroic in his endeavours to save the dying dinosaur Sky.

Have to say though the new CEO is certainly trying hard to shake things up - pity he didnt get the job about 2015.

[mistaTea]

You gotta love all the PR crap in the announcement.

****

Have to say though the new CEO is certainly trying hard to shake things up - pity he didnt get the job about 2015.

Personally I think John has been a very good CEO for Sky. Though he was not able to meet the rapid changes in consumer demand more recently, I am not willing to dog him completely. He has built a very profitable media company, and the new CEO now has an opportunity to capitalise on the many excellent assets John developed.

It is fair to say that consumer benefit fell to the wayside (likely due to Sky being a virtual monopoly for premium content for so long). This complacency in addition to the failed Sky-Vodafone merger has certainly cost the company dearly in recent years.

From here either Sky dies a slow and painful death, or this becomes the first chapter of a new book. Though Sky TV definitely need to improve their offerings, I do think NZ would be worse off if they folded. Just my personal opinion, but they do have a lot of really good content not available on more popular platforms such as Netflix.

[LAC]

They need to keep ALL sport and invest in other revenue streams to survive. Media industries in general are facing a tough time especially with Disney due to release their on demand service soon, Apple already announced theirs...interesting times ahead

[mistaTea]

They need to keep ALL sport and invest in other revenue streams to survive. Media industries in general are facing a tough time especially with Disney due to release their on demand service soon, Apple already announced theirs...interesting times ahead

Def need to hold all key sporting competitions that NZers value.

And they need to move away from this obsession with ARPU and price their products in a way that is competitive. Get rid of the $15/month MY Sky Box rental fee for a starter.

The market would value Sky much more if it had 1.5 million subscribers paying $35/month on average versus 750K subscribers paying $70/month on average. Even though the total revenue is exactly the same.

And I don't see why this couldn't be achieved since the vast majority of their costs are fixed. They stay the same whether they have 1 subscriber or 1 million.

If they offered Sky Starter + Entertainment + SOHO + Sport for $49.99/month they would get a lot of subscribers. Offer Movies as an add-on for another $10. No set top box fee (just treat it as the cost of doing business).

Let people who truly just want Sport to stream on FANPASS for $34.99/month.

Their CFO would need to play with the numbers (I am just some guy who doesn't know a hell of a lot at the end of the day...). But my imagination doesn't have to stretch too far to see how Sky could return to growth.

They just have to accept that they probably can't maintain the same types of margins as they did 10 years ago, which is not to say that they cannot still have healthy margins going forward if they offer products and entertainment at a price that consumers really value.

[Arbroath]

[QUOTE=mistaTea;753139]Personally I think John has been a very good CEO for Sky.

When you preside over a share price that goes from $6+ to under $2 that is a hard premise to maintain even if he did a good job in the earlier years...

[mistaTea]

[QUOTE=mistaTea;753139]Personally I think John has been a very good CEO for Sky.

When you preside over a share price that goes from $6+ to under $2 that is a hard premise to maintain even if he did a good job in the earlier years...

Fair comment.

[Jay]

Make some good points mt
Something will give if you have pay Netflix, Lightbox, Amazon Prime etc etc to get everything you want legally, starts adding up quite fast!.
Yes sport is the draw card
At very least Sky should have the one price for their current 2 "basic" packages as most of one of them is free on Freeview than adding sport, movies etc at a reasonable cost, will then keep and may be increase subscribers again

[Sideshow Bob]

D

The market would value Sky much more if it had 1.5 million subscribers paying $35/month on average versus 750K subscribers paying $70/month on average. Even though the total revenue is exactly the same.



Revenue wouldn't be the same, it would be greater due to advertising revenue.

I remember the days when Sky was ad-free......sigh......

[mistaTea]

Revenue wouldn't be the same, it would be greater due to advertising revenue.

I remember the days when Sky was ad-free......sigh......

Perhaps.

Advertising accounts for a very small portion of their revenue though, and it really pisses people off.
If you are paying a premium price for content, getting ads (that are not even tailored to the user based on their viewing preferences) just feels downright cheeky.

If they were to move to an On Demand focus I think advertising should reduce and advertising revenue would go down.

[RTM]

As a Sports Fan I think SKY over the years has had a really detrimental effect on our society. Its been just to dam expensive for many folk to watch. And they have dominated sports broadcasting, especially live, to the extent....that well...many people have simply stopped watching and engaging in sport and formed other recreational habits. I think this is a contributor to a lot less people, kids, young adults, being engaged in sport and finding their recreation at the shopping malls in the weekends. Or other. And our Governments, unlike others, did not force a certain level of content onto "Free to Air TV".

I hate SKY with a passion and look forward to their demise.

[Sideshow Bob]

Perhaps.

Advertising accounts for a very small portion of their revenue though, and it really pisses people off.
If you are paying a premium price for content, getting ads (that are not even tailored to the user based on their viewing preferences) just feels downright cheeky.

If they were to move to an On Demand focus I think advertising should reduce and advertising revenue would go down.

Advertising 8.43% of what subscription revenue was in 2017
In 2018 it was 7.45%.

Indeed relatively much smaller than subscription but was a drop of $11m from 2017 to 2018. Presumably much of which would have dropped to the bottom line.

Whichever way through subscription or advertising, they are going to have to tweak their model to better fend off competition.

[mistaTea]

Indeed relatively much smaller than subscription but was a drop of $11m from 2017 to 2018. Presumably much of which would have dropped to the bottom line.


No doubt, for the old Monopoly-Sky the advertising revenue has been 'money for jam'.

Though I am sure the commercial realities dictate that advertising will continue (and ads, if done the right way can benefit consumers...), I agree that their model needs to change for them to stay relevant.