HLG - Hallenstein Glasson

[Waltzing]

"Undoubtedly one of the most attractive annual reports I've read all year in more ways than one "

yes the balance sheet page for current assets is riveting!

Im out for the afternoon testing some law of maths relating to carbon fibre under tension and the thread descends into a fight over tax payer funds. or did that get ignored?

Reminds me of the muldoon years.. tax this, tax that, trade tariff this , apply for import this and that...

oh i miss those fire side chats and that laugh....

sorry sorry, back to the special dividend. Dont worry when im back in sweden i cant post in the middle of the day...

I know i should have taken that writing job after all and worked on my gram ma.

[Beagle]

I can't speak for others but I know I've heard more than enough already of some people's sanctimonious grandstanding saying companies should pay the wage subsidy back.
Blind Freddy can tell you that the Govt set this scheme up to pay for some of the cost of keeping people employed during the lockdown, (in the case of HLG while the shops and websites were closed). Maybe these people would have been happier seeing mass layoff's ?

[winner69]

I can't speak for others but I know I've heard more than enough already of some people's sanctimonious grandstanding saying companies should pay the wage subsidy back.
Blind Freddy can tell you that the Govt set this scheme up to pay for some of the cost of keeping people employed during the lockdown, (in the case of HLG while the shops and websites were closed). Maybe these people would have been happier seeing mass layoff's ?

Yes, companies were acting as de facto WINZ offices during the lockdown .....got the ‘benefit’ paid through the employer
....and most still had a job at the end of it

Very efficient

And Kiwisaver, Student Loans etc etc were collected as well.

But not really a good look paying out huge divies so soon after.

[Waltzing]

could MR B please point to the more interesting parts of the report other than the current assets page please ????? :confused::eek2:

winner (n) does have a point i sssuuupppooose....

[nztx]

Yes, companies were acting as de facto WINZ offices during the lockdown .....got the ‘benefit’ paid through the employer
....and most still had a job at the end of it

Very efficient

And Kiwisaver, Student Loans etc etc were collected as well.

But not really a good look paying out huge divies so soon after.

Seen ACT Leader's comments on MOED suddenly discovering Kid's scoring a Covid-19 Wage Subsidy allowance Windfall ? ;)

All Legal & Good on them too ;)

Let's face it the T&C on the first Wage Subsidy were so open & done in such a hurry that just about anyone could have driven a fleet of tractors through it & still legally & quite happily qualified .. ;)

[Balance]

result without the little disruptions would have been ? anyone want to stammer out a number? Mr B thinks enough to increase the Div. Stats for Xmas will be very very interesting.

Did we know this already?

"The first eight weeks of thenew financial year have seenGroup sales grow +10.71% onthe prior year, this has beendriven predominantly byonline sales as physical storegrowth has been slower,particularly in CBD locations."

Potentially another $30m of sales and $10m of NPAT if the momentum is carried through for the rest of the financial year.

[Beagle]

result without the little disruptions would have been ? anyone want to stammer out a number? Mr B thinks enough to increase the Div. Stats for Xmas will be very very interesting.

Did we know this already?

"The first eight weeks of the new financial year have seen Group sales grow +10.71% on the prior year, this has been driven predominantly by online sales as physical store growth has been slower, particularly in CBD locations."

As Balance has alluded too above, this is the most interesting part of the annual report. (I fixed your grammar for you) ;)

[winner69]

As Balance has alluded too above, this is the most interesting part of the annual report. (I fixed your grammar for you) ;)

Jeez ...another $10m npat will take Total npat to nearly $40m

That’s an eps of 66 cents (and that’s includes $8m or so of depreciation ...non cash)


Huge divies coming up

[Waltzing]

MR B thanks for fixing my gram ma. I found that gem in the PDF and did a cut and paste.

Im very very surprised at this and is why we are still holding as we usually sell when we see a shooting sky rocket...:ohmy:

im having kittens not selling, it goes against my natural finger keyboard movements for retail.

I thought we werent supposed to mention you know what... :eek2: at this time.

[Beagle]

I have never felt more comfortable holding HLG which is why my stake is twice the size its ever been before and I am a very happy and comfortable holder. FAR more likely to go to > $7+ than < $5- in my carefully considered opinion. Then there's the dividends and oh my goodness...they really are going to be quite something.
The resiliency of HLG in these extraordinary times has been truly eye opening and to be honest I see the company in a whole new light.

I still don't think the market has woken up to how this company is performing, the level of cash on the balance sheet, the very strong growth in online sales and the fully imputed dividend of 24 cps in December.

Balance yesterday suggested possible extra sales of $30m and extra profit of $10m and I haven't dared to consider how much better it could be this year than last before but I think he might be right. Another 2% gross margin due to the much better exchange rate this year compared to last could itself add ~ $6.5m and another 10% in sales another ~ $5m, total $11.5m. Then there's the lower cost of servicing growing online sales through efficient distribution centers, less logistical, freight and supply chain challenges and costs compared to last year and all this off a base where they started the year with a whopping $50m cash in the bank and no debt.
Its early days for FY21 but I think going close to $40m its quite plausible which is 67 cps and rather embarrassingly the company has such incredibly strong liquidity I think its quite plausible they could pay out over 60 cps in dividends and potentially the whole 67 cps in fully imputed dividends. Oh my goodness :blush:

More embarrassing could be when the market starts to accord HLG with a fair PE of about 14, (same as Briscoes), to partially reflect their prospects. 67 cents x 14 = $9.38 ! Surely a 50%+ share price increase in the next year couldn't happen, or could it ;)

It still blows my mind that this company in the first 8 weeks of this year with Covid and (with lockdown's in Victoria and Auckland until quite recently), is making sales at nearly 11% more than last year before anyone had ever heard of Covid !! The brand power of Glassons is really starting to shine and I seriously doubt that the market has yet accorded HLG with a share price that reflects Glassons excellent prospects in the years ahead. If they reinvigorate Hallensteins performance as well...WOW, we'll really be cooking with gas then !

[Jantar]

I have never felt more comfortable holding HLG. Far more likely to go to > $7 than < $5 in my carefully considered opinion. Then there's the dividends and oh my goodness...they really are going to be quite something. My crude spreadsheet gives HLG a fair SP of $7.72 for the next 12 months and $8.49 in 24 months if that 10% growth is maintained.

[Waltzing]

NOW before that shooting rocket goes full SATAN 5. Built to go far beyond the moon apparently.

Info Metrics forecast a recession for next year 2021.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYzlLhinEeQ

I think prehaps a look at the statistics now and again would be a good thing. No to pore cold water on things but spring looks a bit rain.

Im glass half full, half empty at the moment. Stats people stats. Yes HLG performance is great and the stats point to increase in apparel yes for the economy. But there are other stats for the last quarter also.

I just cant see the market giving an apparel retailer a "hugely" "Bigly" higher PE in NZ. Once again the stats for the quarter are not in its favour for an explosion in the PE. Increase on the present P/E? yes very possible.

if the stock was a certain german brand or a Nike then sure.

[Jantar]

…...
I just cant see the market giving an apparel retailer a "hugely" "Bigly" higher PE in NZ. Once again the stats for the quarter are not in its favour for an explosion in the PE. Increase on the present P/E? yes very possible...... I will be very happy if the SP stays around the $:6.00 mark. That means I can slowly buy more and get a return after tax of 6.3%. Far better than money in the bank.

[Waltzing]

6 dollars? Mr B has a run rate that is pretty good. We are just saying that the stats for apparel are not yet in a bull market Nike like stratosphere yet... awaiting the next quarters NZ economy stats with great interest.

[jimdog31]

6 dollars? Mr B has a run rate that is pretty good. We are just saying that the stats for apparel are not yet in a bull market Nike like stratosphere yet... awaiting the next quarters NZ economy stats with great interest.

To be fair HLG has been around almost 30 years longer than Nike, and has survived through a lot more recessions.

I think the fact that its a tightly held register doesn't do it any favours, it seems to go up and down based on the sentiment of a few.

For the life of me I cant see why its not worth more.

Where would you rather your money? a company that's been around for 70 years with no debt, majority shareholder owners involved in management , or "growth" companies like afterpay or ATM.

I think i'll take the company that knows how to withstand a recession.

[couta1]

To be fair HLG has been around almost 30 years longer than Nike, and has survived through a lot more recessions.

I think the fact that its a tightly held register doesn't do it any favours, it seems to go up and down based on the sentiment of a few.

For the life of me I cant see why its not worth more.

Where would you rather your money? a company that's been around for 70 years with no debt, majority shareholder owners involved in management , or "growth" companies like afterpay or ATM.

I think i'll take the company that knows how to withstand a recession. Market sentiment always determines price not what we think a company is worth or not, you can't compare HLG in any way to APT or ATM as an investment and in fact you can't even compare the latter two they are so different, HLG is a longstanding trusted NZ divvy payer whilst APT and ATM are international monsters, the gains from the latter two for early investors is mind blowing along with XRO.

[Waltzing]

Yes HLG still performed in the GFC. we await the stats for apparel in the next govt Qtr stats reports.

[Beagle]

I believe earnings matter, (its my life's work), and sentiment is driven off people's perception of future earnings. Investing on sentiment alone is building one's house on shifting sands and the Bible warns about that. I invest, I do not speculate, (Its Sunday so I will point out again that the Bible warns about speculating too), I leave the "crazy" valuations of stocks like XRO and other SAAS and tech companies to others.


I just cant see the market giving an apparel retailer a "hugely" "Bigly" higher PE in NZ. Once again the stats for the quarter are not in its favour for an explosion in the PE. Increase on the present P/E? yes very possible. Waltzingironmansinlges

I'd like to consider this further so lets consider what is an appropriate PE for HLG.
I think the most useful yardstick is Briscoes which closed on Friday with a PE of 14.62. I think this is a widely respected retailer but there's a very important distinction between Briscoes and HLG (quite apart from what they sell), which is something I think the market is overlooking.
Here we see that ostensibly Briscoes isn't growing. Average earnings projection of analysts for the next 3 years out to FY23 of 28 cps are the same as the last 3 years ! (That's right, no growth out to FY23 compared to FY18. https://www.marketscreener.com/quote/stock/BRISCOE-GROUP-LIMITED-6495562/financials/ Six years and no growth for Briscoes whatsoever and yet the market accords them a PE of 14.62 ! WOW...reflect on that for a while and ask yourself what the right PE is for HLG ?

Unfortunately analyst coverage on HLG doesn't appear to exist ? Market screener which compiles analyst coverage data has no forecast information, it merely records the last 6 years earnings data. https://www.marketscreener.com/quote/stock/HALLENSTEIN-GLASSON-HOLDI-6495564/financials/ We have to be our own analyst with this one and there are one or two people crunching the numbers other than myself who I respect who are all signaling earnings growth and it should be clear from the companies own disclosure that current year sales have started very well.

When looking into the future with forecasting I will always believe the best guide to the future is the past. What we see with HLG is that in the last 3 years their average earnings have been 47.3 cps whereas the average earnings in the 3 years before that were just 27 cps. This is 75% growth most recently compared to earlier years which is in stark contrast to Briscoes numbers above. My vision for HLG is that as earnings continue to grow its likely it will be rerated to at least the 14.62 PE of Briscoes so my mid level estimate of 55 cps x 14.62 = $8.04 is where I see it in a years time. The possibility of NZX50 inclusion at some future point and analysts starting to cover this stock and the impact of these two things on the share price should not be overlooked. While we wait for that we have one of the highest yields on the NZX to enjoy !

So sheeting all this back to earnings matter again, what is my estimate of the current PE ?
My mid case is they can do 55 cps this year (they could potentially do 60 cents+) the shares currently trade on a theoretical ex divvy price of ($6.12 - 0.24) of $5.88.
5.88 / 0.55 = forward PE of 10.7. A no growth PE for where interest rates are is 12.0 in my opinion so HLG's forward PE makes no sense to me whatsoever.

I think that's very cheap for a company with Glassons excellent growth prospects. Even the Warehouse with its very "patchy" (putting it politely) track record and modest if any growth prospects trades on 14 times next years forecast earnings https://www.marketscreener.com/quote/stock/THE-WAREHOUSE-GROUP-LIMIT-6491364/financials/

In conclusion I think HLG is a very mispriced and underappreciated stock. In time if they keep growing earnings that will change. I can be afford to be a very patient investor when I'm being paid 11.8%* gross yield.
* Based on my estimate of 50 cps in dividends for FY21, gross dividends 69.44 / 588 = 11.8% gross.

[winner69]

Picture better then words - what Beagle is saying above/below re HLG and BGP earnings is in chart

Red line pretty impressive eh

HLG earnings growth expected to be 20% pa from 2016 to 2023

[Beagle]

Thanks mate. I always greatly appreciate your work on charts like this. Its true ! A picture says a thousand words !

Forward PE of 10.7 is absolutely nuts for a company growing earnings at 20% per annum.

[jimdog31]

Market sentiment always determines price not what we think a company is worth or not, you can't compare HLG in any way to APT or ATM as an investment and in fact you can't even compare the latter two they are so different, HLG is a longstanding trusted NZ divvy payer whilst APT and ATM are international monsters, the gains from the latter two for early investors is mind blowing along with XRO.

I wasn't really comparing them , I was more contrasting them - they are at completely different ends of the spectrum. I agree that all of those growth companies have delivered mind blowing gains, I was more saying in these uncertain times Id rather have the money in a company that's stood the test of time and can deliver gains during uncertain times.. ATM IMO has been unfortunate in a current rerate, but will regain its ground at some point in the future. I believe Afterpay will go through the same rerate at some point.

[Gunner]

Has been a remarkably resilient retailer during covid but where is the growth going to come from? They are already in every mall. Steady as she goes but a good divvy?

[winner69]

Thanks mate. I always greatly appreciate your work on charts like this. Its true ! A picture says a thousand words !

Forward PE of 10.7 is absolutely nuts for a company growing earnings at 20% per annum.

That's a PEG of about 0.5 isn't it

Some would say that makes HLG very very cheap

[nztx]

That's a PEG of about 0.5 isn't it

Some would say that makes HLG very very cheap


Indeedy .. some would say a Winner yet to be seen as a Bigger Winner ;)

Maybe time to fill up the truck before the sleeping awake ..

[jimdog31]

Has been a remarkably resilient retailer during covid but where is the growth going to come from? They are already in every mall. Steady as she goes but a good divvy?

Online. Growth here is uncapped. And mostly straight to the bottom line with no new overheads.

[macduffy]

In time if they keep growing earnings that will change.

There's that very big, little word, IF, again.

;)

[Gunner]

Yes agreed growth is here but online is open to the world. Competition is fierce. Wheres the online moat?

[jimdog31]

Yes agreed growth is here but online is open to the world. Competition is fierce. Wheres the online moat?

As an established brand in bricks in mortar, that can act as your moat. Returns, swaps and touch and feel is available and tangible if you are sitting on the fence with a product. Reputation is already established too.

[Snow Leopard]

When I called $6 others were 'skeptical' & now we are pulling numbers out of a hat to try and ramp it up beyond reasonable.

:cool:

Disc: hold, but not buying.

[Beagle]

That's a PEG of about 0.5 isn't it

Some would say that makes HLG very very cheap

Yes ! Glassons Australia sales and store count is still just a little behind NZ but Australia has more than 5 times the total "dressable" market.
Management seem quite bullish on Australian growth prospects, with good reason looking at growth there in recent years.
Anyone wondering where the growth is going to come from need look no further. Australia !!

I see no valid reason why HLG should not at least trade on the same PE metrics as Briscoes and the Warehouse which average 14.3, if anything, its fairly easy to make the case it should trade at a modest PE premium. 60 cents x a PE of 15 = $9
When you invert this thing and look at the valuation from a bottom analysis, that 6 starts looking suspiciously like a 9...you see what I did there ;)

[winner69]

That much touted 11% sales increase over last year in first 10 weeks of new year ...ie August/September and a bit of October

Has to be seen in the context of what the market / sector

ABS report Clothing etc retail sales in Australia down 11% in August. September number out Wednesday

NZ Stats Electronic Card Spend had Apparel sales in NZ down 12%

Wow - HLG group sales up 11% when market / sector down 11%/12% - huge share gains - amazing effort

Selling heaps more when clothing sales remain in the doldrums

What a resilient brand Glassons must be ...amazing stuff. (Hallensteins remains a real dog I reckon)

[Beagle]

Excellent point mate.

What if they can primp Hallensteins back into good shape as well ?

[winner69]

Excellent point mate.

What if they can primp Hallensteins back into good shape as well ?

Imagine what would happen if Di came back

[winner69]

Interesting article eZ SMH

Has COVID-19 changed shopping forever?

https://www.smh.com.au/business/companies/has-covid-19-changed-shopping-forever-20201028-p569fm.html

Fascinating bit -

Every dollar spent on e-commerce requires four more metres of space than shopping through traditional bricks-and-mortar stores, says Richard Seddon, industrial manager with the $8.4 billion diversified developer Mirvac.

It’s taken up by storage, sorting, deliveries and returns - nearly half of all clothes bought online get sent back by consumers. All this need for space is causing a surge in demand for warehouses across the country.

[couta1]

When I called $6 others were 'skeptical' & now we are pulling numbers out of a hat to try and ramp it up beyond reasonable.

:cool:

Disc: hold, but not buying. Sounds like a cautionary tail.

[Mr Slothbear]

Interesting article eZ SMH

Has COVID-19 changed shopping forever?

https://www.smh.com.au/business/companies/has-covid-19-changed-shopping-forever-20201028-p569fm.html

Fascinating bit -

Every dollar spent on e-commerce requires four more metres of space than shopping through traditional bricks-and-mortar stores, says Richard Seddon, industrial manager with the $8.4 billion diversified developer Mirvac.

It’s taken up by storage, sorting, deliveries and returns - nearly half of all clothes bought online get sent back by consumers. All this need for space is causing a surge in demand for warehouses across the country.

warehouses out in industrial parks and the boondocks much cheaper than those fancy prestigious flagships stores on the queen streets and cashel malls though aren’t they

[Beagle]

Sounds like a cautionary tail.

Is that caution misplaced though with WHS and Briscoes on a PE of 14+ and HLG on maybe just 10 ?
With investing its best not to let such cautionary tails get the better of you, keep that tail in check if you like https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/snow-leopards-biting-tail-funny-cats-4-573db41b413a6__880.jpg
and also assess the opportunity not just the risk
Sure keep a close eye on tails of risk but don't let the tails blind you to the opportunity and effectively allow the tail to wag the dog. https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=ND9yU%2fzV&id=92D00A62984633F41B7FE4A339F52E006DAD558C&thid=OIP.ND9yU_zVOWEm1wR9Orm6RgHaEK&mediaurl=https%3a%2f%2fi.ytimg.com%2fvi%2fP-5CZQ2Igxo%2fmaxresdefault.jpg&exph=720&expw=1280&q=beagle+CHASING+ITS+TAIL&simid=608040569199135119&ck=DB1AD759613CD34F15488BB11F7CA385&selectedIndex=13&FORM=IRPRST&ajaxhist=0

For instance consider this... HLG now have a proven multi year track record of growth in Australia with Glassons and consider the size of the addressable market there whereas neither Briscoes or WHS are in Australia. Briscoes and WHS are covered by analysts, Hallensteins doesn't appear to be well covered, if at all. What happens if it gets into the NZX50 and analysts start covering it ? Hmmm ... If things go as I hope over the next few years I'm going to need a bigger dog food bowl for my dividend feeds https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=pXITqv2j&id=8D9BEE61551F4429CF74111F589C4FD98682208C&thid=OIP.pXITqv2jL4xcgTDKmsOzZgHaHa&mediaurl=https%3a%2f%2fae01.alicdn.com%2fkf%2fHTB1 070qXcfrK1Rjy0Fmq6xhEXXax%2f3-pcs-Silver-Pet-Dog-Cat-Non-slip-Food-Bowl-Stainless-Steel-Large-Travel-Feeder-Water.jpg&exph=1000&expw=1000&q=huge+dog+food+bowl&simid=608018256703589178&ck=2CD6C589B7720D0AF369F3C89551B31B&selectedIndex=54&FORM=IRPRST&ajaxhist=0

[winner69]

Next review of NZX50 next month isn't it?

Hmm

[Beagle]

I was more saying in these uncertain times Id rather have the money in a company that's stood the test of time.

You're on to it mate. HLG has proven to be a "dogged" performer in good times and bad. Listed on 1 October 1947, its now in its 74th year.
Has been listed on the market longer than any other company on the NZX. That has to be worth something and definitely is as far as I am concerned.

[Beagle]

Next review of NZX50 next month isn't it?

Hmm

Yes. Hmmmmm Got to have another think about my portfolio allocation. Bible says to invest in 7 or 8 things. Importantly what it doesn't say is in equal measure.
Not too many really good value opportunities in the market like this and OCA which are priced as no growth companies and you ostensibly get the growth for free.

Might have to give this one the OCA portfolio sized treatment.

[couta1]

Next review of NZX50 next month isn't it?

Hmm The Liquidity test will continue to be the main problem here and of course the index can remain unchanged.

[Beagle]

The Liquidity test will continue to be the main problem here and of course the index can remain unchanged.

We need you back on board trading it mate ;)

[couta1]

We need you back on board trading it mate ;) Lol for over 2 yrs I never sold a single share of my large holding but thats past now and its highly unlikely I will ever be in the same position again unfortunately.

[Beagle]

Lol for over 2 yrs I never sold a single share of my large holding but thats past now and its highly unlikely I will ever be in the same position again unfortunately.

Yeah mate...unfortunately those were dark days in March-April...some old dogs found themselves in an unfortunate position...this probably says it best https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPYmtEQiG18

From the latest annual report...Only 114 people with 50,000 shares or more, maybe a new target to aim for ?...whereas over at OCA 406 people own 100K shares or more...crikey...they let any old Tom Dick or Dog into their top club.

[Ferg]

The Liquidity test will continue to be the main problem here and of course the index can remain unchanged.

Are you referring to the relative liquidity test? A back of the fag packet calculation suggests the absolute liquidity test is ok for the past 6 months at ~9% , but I haven't looked at the 2 prior periods of 6 months (I believe you need to pass 3 consecutive periods to be considered). I'm not sure I fully understand the relative liquidity test and/or how to calculate that figure.

I see 2 other major hurdles for HLG making it into the NZX50 - being they may not be first in line and they have to make it to position 44* (and not 50) to be included.

Delegats would be ahead of HLG on IWF, assuming DGL can pass their liquidity tests (which I have not examined). I believe the IWF for Delegats is higher than HLG (i.e. 24m shares @ $14.85 > 48m shares @ $6.12). Keep in mind strategic/founder holdings have been removed from my BOTFP calc's.

*The second major hurdle, assuming I'm reading/interpreting the rules correctly is that HLG would need to not only pass the liquidity tests above (over 3 consecutive periods), and beat DGL, but also have a higher IWF than #44 on the list being FSF. The IWF for FSF looks to be about $482m vs HLG IWF of ~$292m. This would require a share price for HLG over $10 to have a higher IWF.

I too would like to see this happen, but I'm not holding my breath.....unless I have completely misunderstood how this works. Happy to be corrected.

[Jantar]

Has been a remarkably resilient retailer during covid but where is the growth going to come from? They are already in every mall. Steady as she goes but a good divvy? I have said it before, but still worth repeating.

Even in a depression people need clothes. Some retail clothing shops did not make it through the lockdown. A few others who tried to enter the NZ market found it too tough and pulled out even before the crisis. That leaves fewer and fewer shops for people to buy their clothes from, and not everyone is happy with shopping at the red shed. So as shops close that leaves HLG picking up a larger percentage of the trade without having to open more stores.

Add to that their quick reaction at building their on line trade, and its easy to see where that growth comes from.

[kiora]

Physical stores vs on line
https://www.livewiremarkets.com/wires/5-bad-ideas-to-avoid-in-2021

[Beagle]

I have said it before, but still worth repeating.

Even in a depression people need clothes. Some retail clothing shops did not make it through the lockdown. A few others who tried to enter the NZ market found it too tough and pulled out even before the crisis. That leaves fewer and fewer shops for people to buy their clothes from, and not everyone is happy with shopping at the red shed. So as shops close that leaves HLG picking up a larger percentage of the trade without having to open more stores.

Add to that their quick reaction at building their on line trade, and its easy to see where that growth comes from.

Add to that the fact that Glassons has less stores in Australia (32) than N.Z. (36) despite there being more than 5 times the dressable market in Australia and Blind Freddy should be able to see where the growth is going to come from, exactly that sentiment is stated clearly in the annual report.

I wish people would do at least some basic reading before making ill considered remarks. The annual report is here http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/HLG/362283/333885.pdf

[BlackPeter]

I have said it before, but still worth repeating.

Even in a depression people need clothes. Some retail clothing shops did not make it through the lockdown. A few others who tried to enter the NZ market found it too tough and pulled out even before the crisis. That leaves fewer and fewer shops for people to buy their clothes from, and not everyone is happy with shopping at the red shed. So as shops close that leaves HLG picking up a larger percentage of the trade without having to open more stores.

Add to that their quick reaction at building their on line trade, and its easy to see where that growth comes from.

I hear you ... and I agree that people will always need clothing, even in a depression. However - do they really need new and fashionable (i.e. fast outdated) clothing and do they really need to replace their wardrobe every season?

I am pretty sure that most of us could well survive for the next decade without the need to buy any (or hardly any) new clothes (well, maybe with the exception of replacing from time to time underwear and socks) - well, we could. And even if the fashion freaks under us choose to replace their stuff only every other year instead of every season, revenue will drastically drop.

I don't want to rain onto the parade, but linear extrapolations are always dangerous, given that most things in life move in circles. We well might have reached peak cloth buying season for some time.

Yes, if HLG keeps growing as it did the recent years, and if it manages to keep the margins as it did the recent years, it is still reasonable priced, but didn't we think the same thing with many other shares short before they reached their peaks?

This share clearly has a place in any income portfolio, but not quite sure whether now is really the time to buy or accumulate ...

Discl: used to hold in the past, but not now.

[couta1]

I hear you ... and I agree that people will always need clothing, even in a depression. However - do they really need new and fashionable (i.e. fast outdated) clothing and do they really need to replace their wardrobe every season?

I am pretty sure that most of us could well survive for the next decade without the need to buy any (or hardly any) new clothes (well, maybe with the exception of replacing from time to time underwear and socks) - well, we could. And even if the fashion freaks under us choose to replace their stuff only every other year instead of every season, revenue will drastically drop.

I don't want to rain onto the parade, but linear extrapolations are always dangerous, given that most things in life move in circles. We well might have reached peak cloth buying season for some time.

Yes, if HLG keeps growing as it did the recent years, and if it manages to keep the margins as it did the recent years, it is still reasonable priced, but didn't we think the same thing with many other shares short before they reached their peaks?

This share clearly has a place in any income portfolio, but not quite sure whether now is really the time to buy or accumulate ...

Discl: used to hold in the past, but not now. Going by some of your comments I don't think you understand the female species too well. PS-My wife buys most of my clothes for my one wardrobe as well as all of her own for her three wardrobes.

[BlackPeter]

Going by some of your comments I don't think you understand the female species too well. Lol

Happily married with the same woman for the last 40 odd years. Not sure this proves I understand the female part of the "species", but I must have done something right in that regard (and it was not replacing her wardrobe every season :p:). We both prefer to buy quality which lasts ...

Maybe time to check whether some of the stereotypes which swirl around about women are really true?

[Cyclical]

Going by some of your comments I don't think you understand the female species too well. PS-My wife buys most of my clothes for my one wardrobe as well as all of her own for her three wardrobes.

LOL. Hope HLG management are reading this...it should be pretty easy for them to extrapolate from your post that they need 3 times as many Glassons stores as they do Hallensteins.

[Beagle]

That much touted 11% sales increase over last year in first 10 weeks of new year ...ie August/September and a bit of October

Has to be seen in the context of what the market / sector

ABS report Clothing etc retail sales in Australia down 11% in August. September number out Wednesday

NZ Stats Electronic Card Spend had Apparel sales in NZ down 12%

Wow - HLG group sales up 11% when market / sector down 11%/12% - huge share gains - amazing effort

Selling heaps more when clothing sales remain in the doldrums

What a resilient brand Glassons must be ...amazing stuff.

Bears repeating. Their performance in the context of the overall apparel market is absolutely stunning.
This fact seems lost on a lot of people here as does the fact that a very average retailer like WHS is on a forward PE of 14, (one professional analyst very recently put a value of $3.00 on it which suggest a PE of 17.5 !!) and a company like Briscoes which is not growing is on a PE of 14.6
Some people seem stuck in their mind with the notion this will only ever break above $6 temporarily and are ignoring recent years growth and the growth potential going forward.

[dibble]

I hear you ... and I agree that people will always need clothing, even in a depression. However - do they really need new and fashionable (i.e. fast outdated) clothing and do they really need to replace their wardrobe every season?


Discl: used to hold in the past, but not now.

True but I tend to think of them less as a fashion house, perhaps more of an essential apparel thing. Yes they obviously have to (and have a knack for) get the style right but one might easily pop in and procure something under $5000 that works at a tidy bbq/work function and may well be acceptable a year (even two) later. One would have to be at a rather undemanding work gig to get away with last year's "Fashion" item. Probably counter intuitive but to me it increases demand as a go-to outlet. Mind you, never been into a glassons, could be a completely wrong on dresses.

[Cyclical]

Bears repeating. Their performance in the context of the overall apparel market is absolutely stunning.
This fact seems lost on a lot of people here as does the fact that a very average retailer like WHS is on a forward PE of 14, (one professional analyst very recently put a value of $3.00 on it which suggest a PE of 17.5 !!) and a company like Briscoes which is not growing is on a PE of 14.6
Some people seem stuck in their mind with the notion this will only ever break above $6 temporarily and are ignoring recent years growth and the growth potential going forward.

One thing I often find when people ask what I invest in is that they are surprised to hear Hallenstein Glassons. I don't imagine I'd get the same response if I said The Warehouse. Maybe Briscoes would fall somewhere in the middle. I can't speak entirely from experience though as haven't held the latter two. But possibly this is one of the issues, it hasn't taken off with the Sharesies crowd, or the analysts, and hence we have this liquidity issue and subsequently it probably won't make it into the NZX50, which in itself means the cycle can't be broken and the share price will continue to languish with a conservative PE. Oh well, treat it as a gift and accumulate. One day the market will figure it out.

[Cyclical]

True but I tend to think of them less as a fashion house, perhaps more of an essential apparel thing. Yes they obviously have to (and have a knack for) get the style right but one might easily pop in and procure something under $5000 that works at a tidy bbq/work function and may well be acceptable a year (even two) later. One would have to be at a rather undemanding work gig to get away with last year's "Fashion" item. Probably counter intuitive but to me it increases demand as a go-to outlet. Mind you, never been into a glassons, could be a completely wrong on dresses.

You dress in gold leaf?

[couta1]

One thing I often find when people ask what I invest in is that they are surprised to hear Hallenstein Glassons. I don't imagine I'd get the same response if I said The Warehouse. Maybe Briscoes would fall somewhere in the middle. I can't speak entirely from experience though as haven't held the latter two. But possibly this is one of the issues, it hasn't taken off with the Sharesies crowd, or the analysts, and hence we have this liquidity issue and subsequently it probably won't make it into the NZX50, which in itself means the cycle can't be broken and the share price will continue to languish with a conservative PE. Oh well, treat it as a gift and accumulate. One day the market will figure it out. The Sharesies crowd were all over this one earlier in the year, they were stacking the depth chart with their trademark pattern.

[winner69]

HLG were in the NZX50 about 5 years ago

Got kicked out and replaced by PEB

[couta1]

HLG were in the NZX50 about 5 years ago

Got kicked out and replaced by PEB Lol and PEB prevented them from getting back in 5 yrs later, who would have thought, see its true every dog really does have its day.

[winner69]

HLG financial year F20 NZD.USD average was 0.6355

Seems to be about 0.66 at the moment ...and forecasts suggest its going to get stronger

[jimdog31]

HLG financial year F20 NZD.USD average was 0.6355

Seems to be about 0.66 at the moment ...and forecasts suggest its going to get stronger

Id almost trust long range weather forecasts more than forex forecasts at the moment.

[Beagle]

One thing I often find when people ask what I invest in is that they are surprised to hear Hallenstein Glassons. I don't imagine I'd get the same response if I said The Warehouse. Maybe Briscoes would fall somewhere in the middle. I can't speak entirely from experience though as haven't held the latter two. But possibly this is one of the issues, it hasn't taken off with the Sharesies crowd, or the analysts, and hence we have this liquidity issue and subsequently it probably won't make it into the NZX50, which in itself means the cycle can't be broken and the share price will continue to languish with a conservative PE. Oh well, treat it as a gift and accumulate. One day the market will figure it out.

That's exactly what I'm doing mate. I have unlimited patience when getting an 11.8% gross yield.

[Ferg]

But possibly this is one of the issues, it hasn't taken off with the Sharesies crowd, or the analysts, and hence we have this liquidity issue and subsequently it probably won't make it into the NZX50

Did you see my post 5045 above? HLG#post853639 (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?4494-HLG-Hallenstein-Glasson&p=853639&viewfull=1#post853639)

Are you referring to absolute or relative liquidity? My calculations suggest absolute liquidity is fine but I have no idea on relative liquidity. Can you elaborate on the liquidity issue?

Methodology is here: https://www.spglobal.com/spdji/en/indices/equity/sp-nzx-50-portfolio-index/#

[Cyclical]

Did you see my post 5045 above? HLG#post853639 (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?4494-HLG-Hallenstein-Glasson&p=853639&viewfull=1#post853639)

Are you referring to absolute or relative liquidity? My calculations suggest absolute liquidity is fine but I have no idea on relative liquidity. Can you elaborate on the liquidity issue?

Methodology is here: https://www.spglobal.com/spdji/en/indices/equity/sp-nzx-50-portfolio-index/#

Yeah I did, Ferg, and in a way my post was a follow on from what you are saying, but I'm no expert on the subject of inclusion into the NZX50 and haven't really delved into it to be honest. One thing that's pretty obvious though is this stock doesn't see a lot of turnover and consequently it doesn't take much to move the SP...which can be good and bad of course. Anyway, it's not like PEB have dashed off into the sunset with their recent inclusion, although they had massive growth in June / July, so would probably take a lot more than that to move them up from this point.

Guys, who was that Aussie investment house that did the little video piece on HLG early last year, pretty little thing, still wet behind the ears I recall someone saying haha...back when they were about 4 bucks. Shortly after that they started to head north quite strongly. Just need a rerun of that :)

[Ferg]

Thanks for that. Yeah the rules are not light reading and I'm not sure I have fully got my head around them. I don't think HLG will get there naturally, I reckon it will be a case of others dropping out. Plus, as you say, inclusion in the NZX50 might not be the pot of gold we think. I'm less bullish on growth prospects than others given that over the decades HLG have taken a very conservative approach to expansion and growth. Australia may be slow to grow (purposely), but online does not have the same constraints as bricks & mortar so maybe we are seeing a new type of growth given they appear to transitioned to that relatively easily. I finally got back into this stock late July off the back of some NZ Stats numbers and the expectation of high local turnover and resumption of dividends. Wishing I had got more....oh well, hindsight is 20/20!

[winner69]

Thanks for that. Yeah the rules are not light reading and I'm not sure I have fully got my head around them. I don't think HLG will get there naturally, I reckon it will be a case of others dropping out. Plus, as you say, inclusion in the NZX50 might not be the pot of gold we think. I'm less bullish on growth prospects than others given that over the decades HLG have taken a very conservative approach to expansion and growth. Australia may be slow to grow (purposely), but online does not have the same constraints as bricks & mortar so maybe we are seeing a new type of growth given they appear to transitioned to that relatively easily. I finally got back into this stock late July off the back of some NZ Stats numbers and the expectation of high local turnover and resumption of dividends. Wishing I had got more....oh well, hindsight is 20/20!

Interested to know what Stats NZ numbers gave you optimism.

[Ferg]

Interested to know what Stats NZ numbers gave you optimism.

There were a few factors. I used the NZ Stats electronic card transaction data plus similar data from Australia. Whilst the initial focus was on apparel, I was also looking at overall spending trends, e.g. NZ Department store spending in May & June was +10% and -4% vs prior year which was encouraging.

I compared the HLG H1 report to the market overall, projected H2 based on data available to 30 June and added the COVID subsidies which were in the public domain to estimate earnings. Whilst Apparel was flat for the market for H1, HLG was up 5.7% which suggested they may experience falls smaller than the market during lockdown. H2 was a half of two halves; Q3 the apparel market was down 43% due to lockdown but Q4 was -21% May and +6% June. This gave me some confidence spend was coming back.

Also, the clients I work with had been experiencing a massive surge in local spending (albeit in unrelated industries, more on this below*) which added to my confidence. This was probably the biggest factor, and NZ Stats did not contradict this. It wasn't so much that NZ Stats gave me optimism, rather I thought the base of sales was still there post lockdown and HLG had been over-sold. Given HLG was debt free with a proven track record, then expecting a resumption of dividends wasn't unreasonable. Same goes for FRE into which I jumped at a similar time, pretty much for the same reasons (except they have debt), but with a popular DRP any such FRE dividends are mostly non-cash.

*Like I said, the single biggest factor for me was seeing growth in my clients revenues of between 30-60% per month year on year since May. The industries are fencing, sheds, kitchen and bathroom hardware, and benchtops etc sold nationwide. I figured that sort of increase had to be flowing through other parts of the economy not exposed to tourism. By the way, we are still seeing those percentage increases right through to the end of October - and forward volumes show no sign of abating which gives me confidence buying other local stocks. I touched on this in another post. I have the reverse Midas touch where the SP usually goes down after I buy, and true to form HLG did but it has bounced nicely.

I'm curious to know whether or not my picks are simply part of a wider rising tide that is lifting all boats. I don't want to burst my bubble yet so I will probably look at that when I start getting over-confident. I'm guessing part luck + part contrarian.
:)

[Baa_Baa]

Not meaning to rain on the ramping parade, but this cyclical has massive capital swings and is in the top zone right now, heavily over bought on all TA metrics. If it breaks up great, but history says if it doesn’t, well buyer beware. A delicate balance happening now

Not holding, it’s too volatile for me. Those who don’t care about capital value and have the stomach for sustained earnings regardless of share prices should be able to withstand any volatility, not me though at any yield.

[Balance]

Thanks Ferg for posting your thoughts and assessments. 👍

[Cyclical]

...the single biggest factor for me was seeing growth in my clients revenues of between 30-60% per month year on year since May. The industries are fencing, sheds, kitchen and bathroom hardware, and benchtops etc sold nationwide. I figured that sort of increase had to be flowing through other parts of the economy not exposed to tourism. By the way, we are still seeing those percentage increases right through to the end of October - and forward volumes show no sign of abating which gives me confidence buying other local stocks.
:)

Nice work there Ferg. Some of those industries you've listed there are of course the likely recipients of cheap mortgage money, which is exactly what our friend Grant has been gunning for in the hope that low interest rates mean home owners enjoy a wealth effect and borrow and spend accordingly, with the resultant trickle down keeping things bubbling along. Not sure how far the trickle needs to go before it hits HLG's coffers, but I'll run with it.

Meanwhile it's good to see the HLG SP seems to be relatively immune to the current market nervousness. Bucking the trend even.

[couta1]

Not meaning to rain on the ramping parade, but this cyclical has massive capital swings and is in the top zone right now, heavily over bought on all TA metrics. If it breaks up great, but history says if it doesn’t, well buyer beware. A delicate balance happening now

Not holding, it’s too volatile for me. Those who don’t care about capital value and have the stomach for sustained earnings regardless of share prices should be able to withstand any volatility, not me though at any yield. Bolly bands coming together, toss a coin to determine which way its going to go.

[Ferg]

Thanks Ferg for posting your thoughts and assessments. 

You're welcome, happy to share and I enjoy reading your analyses.

The other factor I look at is depth, i.e. bid versus offer volumes and support/resistance points based on live market depth data. If the numbers look good that is 1 less objection. Where the numbers are bad (i.e. sellers outweigh buyers at certain price points) then I won't buy until the numbers shift. Otherwise it is like trying to catch the falling knife (which I once did and ended up stabbing myself in the foot, rather than the hand). I'm trying to measure demand versus supply on the assumption it is an indicator of future price movements and/or there is some support if I want to bail.

I have a few shares on my watch list that are popular on this forum but in some cases sellers outweigh buyers by factors from 2:1 to 4:1 so I won't buy until I see a swing in nett demand, irrespective of the fundamentals. It's a crude measure and I'm trying to avoid the reverse Midas touch I frequently have.

But back to HLG, buyers have outweighed sellers between support/resistance levels for some time by factors of around 2:1 (factors of 190%-230%). I reckon such numbers create short term price strength. However, these numbers have recently turned where resistance sellers outweigh support buyers such that buyers/sellers is about 85%. So I expect to see some minor short term weakness until the next "event" that either reverses or amplifies the current weakness. The "event" could be anything like the US election for instance (edit: which confirms couta's & Baa Baa's comments that the SP can go either way from here).

All extremely boring I know and very unemotional but, before I part with my money, I want to know what I am getting myself into.

Cheers

[Ferg]

Nice work there Ferg. Some of those industries you've listed there are of course the likely recipients of cheap mortgage money, which is exactly what our friend Grant has been gunning for in the hope that low interest rates mean home owners enjoy a wealth effect and borrow and spend accordingly, with the resultant trickle down keeping things bubbling along. Not sure how far the trickle needs to go before it hits HLG's coffers, but I'll run with it.

Meanwhile it's good to see the HLG SP seems to be relatively immune to the current market nervousness. Bucking the trend even.

Thanks and agreed. Regarding the the bold part: there are other companies that will benefit more immediately from the stimulus, but I would expect a small trickle due to disposable income. On another note I'm also seeing increased staff employment with my clients and new hires are hard to come by. This is putting pressure on wage budgets.

[Waltzing]

BA BA , short hand, is correct but in 2019 the share price DID not sell off as it often does and went up for a full Year until the GPD. It actually follows no pattern except skittishness. It a stock that get scared and then rebuilds itself. It like an a cat in a garden it doesnt own.

I dont think TA matters much at the moment as the TA doesnt really cater for global events of this magnitude.

If you did drawn line it would be at about 5.50 as the next lower support level.

it will take a big spike in unemployment and a drop in next quarter GDP and credit/ Pos card retail spending to take it under that level at pace.

[winner69]

Hey Ferg =, good insights. I'd add to your industry insights that paint sales are booming and Mitre 10 Mega / Bunnings sales are miles ahead of last year

You might be interested in these 2 charts using same Stats NZ ans ABS data

Shows that apparel / clothing sales have yet to recover to pre Covid levels. There are updates to each this week so that will be interesting

Even more amazing that HLG sales for August/September are up 11% on last year ...and what may happen if things get back to normal

[Beagle]

Not meaning to rain on the ramping parade, but this cyclical has massive capital swings and is in the top zone right now, heavily over bought on all TA metrics. If it breaks up great, but history says if it doesn’t, well buyer beware. A delicate balance happening now

Not holding, it’s too volatile for me. Those who don’t care about capital value and have the stomach for sustained earnings regardless of share prices should be able to withstand any volatility, not me though at any yield.

Its worth observing that interest rates are a LOT lower than when this went above $6 in 2018 and 2019.
PE's of other retailers WHS and BGR average 14.3 and illustrate my point that PE's have expanded because of ultra low interest rates.
Even if earnings were unchanged in FY21, (and I am very confident of solid growth), this is worth every bit of the 14.3 PE ascribed to the other retailers in my opinion.
14.3 x 48 cents = $6.86 + 24 cent divvy next month = $7.10.

My money is firmly on this hitting a new all time high in the year ahead.
Disc: Topped up some more yesterday.

[Waltzing]

The sector not performing is new car sales but apparel up slightly up on NZ quarter GDP. If they arnt going to expand in AUS then they will have to pay out a small top up in DIV which could support the Price. If they do the same reporting as in 2018 then you might well see a sell off and then a rebuild in share price.

You could use the sell off to top up! Because the balance sheet is very very strong. Heck who cares if brothers stays where it is.

[winner69]

Hey Beagle - I reckon you need to revisit your forecast for F21

A bit of a flaw in your logic - you extrapolated the 10% increase in sales for first 12 weeks to get a full year sales figure - but that overlooks that H2 was down 6%. Doesn't that mean that that H2 (if things don't turn to custard) will be much stronger this year.

Briscooes last quarter sales up 15% - retail in NZ on fire ...and watching Melbourne Cup coverage the ladies are buying new dresses to go Cup parties ....though Delta Goodram should buy some decent clothes from Glassons to replace that indecent outfit she's got on today.

And NZD v USD getting stronger - could be 8%/10% more favourable to HLG this year

Maybe npat $45m not beyond bounds of possibility?

[winner69]

Why Delta needs to shop at Glassons - her Cup Day outfit

[Beagle]

WOW...Delta's sure going to get some attention in that outfit !
Yeah saw that Briscoes sales data....its seems to me ultra low mortgage rates, inability to spend money on travel and the stimulus money is really igniting retail sales !
Looking forward to HLG's December sales update and annual meeting.

[Waltzing]

all i want to know is there going to be champagne at the meeting ... cheap will do..heck the way things are going 2022 will be here before i know it.

[Beagle]

Hey Beagle - I reckon you need to revisit your forecast for F21

A bit of a flaw in your logic - you extrapolated the 10% increase in sales for first 12 weeks to get a full year sales figure - but that overlooks that H2 was down 6%. Doesn't that mean that that H2 (if things don't turn to custard) will be much stronger this year.

Briscooes last quarter sales up 15% - retail in NZ on fire ...and watching Melbourne Cup coverage the ladies are buying new dresses to go Cup parties ....though Delta Goodram should buy some decent clothes from Glassons to replace that indecent outfit she's got on today.

And NZD v USD getting stronger - could be 8%/10% more favourable to HLG this year

Maybe npat $45m not beyond bounds of possibility?

I wouldn't go that high unless the narrative at the annual meeting is truly stunning. They use a bit of forward cover on their forex.
Mid - late thirty something million is on the cards though in my opinion. Need more sales evidence and narrative before refining that any further.

On the other hand if you can talk Delta Goodrum into being a brand ambassador for Glassons then clearly the sky is the limit :t_up:

[Ferg]

Hey Ferg =, good insights. I'd add to your industry insights that paint sales are booming and Mitre 10 Mega / Bunnings sales are miles ahead of last year

You might be interested in these 2 charts using same Stats NZ ans ABS data

Shows that apparel / clothing sales have yet to recover to pre Covid levels. There are updates to each this week so that will be interesting

Even more amazing that HLG sales for August/September are up 11% on last year ...and what may happen if things get back to normal

Thanks for those. Considering the NZ graph is a rolling 12 months, the fact that consumables is back up to pre-COVOD levels on a 12 month basis is likely concealing the jump we are all seeing since May. Apparel looks soggy but I think the rolling 12 is concealing the fact spend in the latest months is similar to last year. Given HLG are gaining market share says there must be others doing it tough...!
Cheers

[Waltzing]

Yes the apparel stats dont show a recovery and we whatch those stats every year and its why we havnt agreed that profit increases are certain. If those profits do keep coming in then MR B might indeed have picked another WINNER (n)!

I must say MR B is fearless and also prudent.

[Balance]

Yes the apparel stats dont show a recovery and we whatch those stats every year and its why we havnt agreed that profit increases are certain. If those profits do keep coming in then MR B might indeed have picked another WINNER (n)!

I must say MR B is fearless and also prudent.

In tough times, winners come through.

Unlike a race car competition, it can be hard to spot the winners in business unless you follow closely.

Thanks to everyone for contributing constructively to this HLG discussion, positive or negative.

[winner69]

In tough times, winners come through.

Unlike a race car competition, it can be hard to spot the winners in business unless you follow closely.

Thanks to everyone for contributing constructively to this HLG discussion, positive or negative.

Very sage advise Balance

But in car races and horse racing those sometimes those set up to win (on form) crash or break a leg

[King1212]

yeah...sad..the last horse die yesterday. Melbourne cup

[Waltzing]

Amended statement. Apparel has shown an increase in the stats and in this environment the increase recorded in the september stats might well be considered indeed a positive.

If we consider that increase in relation new car sales then we see that apparel has perhaps almost outperformed.

It just which lens you look through.

[winner69]

For what's it worth retail clothing still in doldrums in Australia according to latest data released today by ABS

Overall retails sales (non food stuff) for Sep20 were up 6% on Sep19 but clothing stores (inc online) were down 8%

Doesn't really matter if Glassons are creaming the competition .... and also gives an idea of what increased sales could be once punters start buying clothes like they used to.

[Waltzing]

What was the HLG results in there AUS operation up to the last lock down. The fact that after 20 years companies do not produce extensive stats in XML formats in appalling. It just shows that the management of these companies dont know where the on button is.

No uniform IDS nor a publish schemas for data transformations. Its a disgrace and just shows that most people in management arent sure where to plug the devices in.

Its as if software development has gone back to the main frame mind set and i dont think the implications of that are well understood yet.

The charts produced back in the late 80 and early 90;s were far better then the on line junk supplied by professional platforms.

[winner69]

Hey waltz - HLG have always been very quiet on the disclosure front

A few brief announcements a year and not much fanfare around interim and final reports

They keep a lot to themselves ....and I have a few suspicions about what's not been fully 'disclosed' in the F20 result that may come out in F21

That's the way they operate - just have to put up with it

With many companies you do get the impression that shareholders are a necessary pain - especially those solid companies that never need to go to the market to get capital.

[causecelebre]

What was the HLG results in there AUS operation up to the last lock down. The fact that after 20 years companies do not produce extensive stats in XML formats in appalling. It just shows that the management of these companies dont know where the on button is.

No uniform IDS nor a publish schemas for data transformations. Its a disgrace and just shows that most people in management arent sure where to plug the devices in.

Its as if software development has gone back to the main frame mind set and i dont think the implications of that are well understood yet.

The charts produced back in the late 80 and early 90;s were far better then the on line junk supplied by professional platforms.

Regardless of whether you believe in crypto or not the free access to data, API's and charting/trading tech in that industry is simply astounding compared to 'traditional' capital markets. To be fair there is a cost to getting cleaned data for algo's but by comparison there is no comparison

FYI XML is old tech now, lol. Json for text, Protobufs, etc for Binary formats

[Waltzing]

Sure i can do a jason transformation .

JSONString = JSON.ToJSON(Product)

{"PROD:NAME:: "Widget", "PROD:PRICE": 45.99, "PROD:QUANTITY": 12}

the point im getting at is that stats should be accessible to share holders in a managed data format rather than great but fancy set of PDF that simply make it almost impossible to get at data.

Yes there is some market sights with some data.

But its simply pathetic when we have self landing rockets and bots like Sarah that we have put up with a standard of stats that is more a case of a public that is satisfied with very little.

its really just pathetic. its beyond the pale.

we have our own advanced scripting language and therefore we are not the general public.

in general (all companies on the NZX and ASX)shareholders are being treated in a very very poor way.

[macduffy]

OK, just don't invest in companies that don't do things your way.

;)

[Waltzing]

"Our way"

its now about our way, or your way. Its about moving forward and using technology that empowers share holders and investors.

Its a opportunity for AUS and NZ to lead the world in disclosure. It not our way, its the WAY FORWARD. And its about 20 years behind where we should be.

[causecelebre]

I understand your frustration. I really want order flow data, not just the book, but the trades. If data and API's are accessible then surely they can only benefit from the liquidity. That said the NXZ would be crippled with any real volume....just look at at the recent DDOS. It's a creaking, brittle piece of infrastructure. And don't get me started on the really crappy offerings from the likes of ASB Sec. Even Sharesies UX is better. Anyhoo, chat for another forum....

I wonder how many here would use a proper trading interface if avail?

[Waltzing]

Yes the live data is expensive and i understand people with tech skills would love to get it. We would settle for a data and XML with a schema is best for company accounts and schedules. I dont think jason is expansive enough for data transformations for company accounts. XML and XLD Dictionaries can handle that.

at least stats NZ let us download in good old CSV. and excel will open it. getting that data sent by NZ stats is something we must enquire about.

[Waltzing]

Are we likely to see supplied problems this summer with retailers getting product shipped to new zealand?

[Beagle]

Are we likely to see supplied problems this summer with retailers getting product shipped to new zealand?

HLG have done an exceptional job with their sales and supply chain logistics challanges throughout the covid period.

[Snow Leopard]

What was the HLG results in there AUS operation up to the last lock down. The fact that after 20 years companies do not produce extensive stats in XML formats in appalling. It just shows that the management of these companies dont know where the on button is.

No uniform IDS nor a publish schemas for data transformations. Its a disgrace and just shows that most people in management arent sure where to plug the devices in.

Its as if software development has gone back to the main frame mind set and i dont think the implications of that are well understood yet.

The charts produced back in the late 80 and early 90;s were far better then the on line junk supplied by professional platforms.


Regardless of whether you believe in crypto or not the free access to data, API's and charting/trading tech in that industry is simply astounding compared to 'traditional' capital markets. To be fair there is a cost to getting cleaned data for algo's but by comparison there is no comparison

FYI XML is old tech now, lol. Json for text, Protobufs, etc for Binary formats

Bring back ASN1 and BER for everything! :p

Meanwhile I still hold HLG (& BGP) :cool:

[causecelebre]

Bring back ASN1 and BER for everything! :p

Haha. Who said they ever left?

[Waltzing]

David Lange is alive and well.....

[bull....]

need to boycott halleisteins for not giving back the wage subsidy

another big nzx company did today

Metlifecare wage subsidy handback 'right thing to do'

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/123320097/metlifecare-wage-subsidy-handback-right-thing-to-do

[Greekwatchdog]

If the Govt is happy with the way its been dealt with so be it. Lets move on from this. If individuals wish to Boycott so be it. I can only assume that you want to buy in..

[850man]

need to boycott halleisteins for not giving back the wage subsidy

another big nzx company did today

Metlifecare wage subsidy handback 'right thing to do'

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/123320097/metlifecare-wage-subsidy-handback-right-thing-to-do


Yeah but HLG had stores closed and employees at home, MET didn't close any villages or cut back on staff working

[Beagle]

need to boycott halleisteins for not giving back the wage subsidy

another big nzx company did today

Metlifecare wage subsidy handback 'right thing to do'

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/123320097/metlifecare-wage-subsidy-handback-right-thing-to-do


A dirt cheap public relations stunt by EQT after effectively strong-arming directors and shareholders out of their shares for hundreds of millions less than fair value. EQT are complete hypocrites...nothing they have done to date with MET and its shareholders is fair or reasonable. They have pillaged N.Z. assets far below fair value.
Rod Duke pillages Kiwi's pockets for cheap Chinese made goods sold far above fair value and has used the ruse of a real "sale" to disingenuously gain vast wealth out of Kiwi's for decades.
These are not nice people Bull.

You've already spread this nonsense B.S. on the HLG thread before.
I'll say it again nice and slow just so a simple bull can understand it.
HLG stores and their online platforms were completely closed during Covid. Do you understand what "Closed" means ?
The Government set up this wage subsidy scheme to cover some of the costs, (not all of them) of keeping those workers in employment.

Please take your left wing socialist agenda elsewhere. I for one have had a complete guts full of people like you with their sanctimonious garbage on this subject.
You boycott them if you like, I am sure they won't miss the business.

[sb9]

Big gain for NZD overnight with USD, currently sitting around 0.676c. Adds further boost to their margins.

[Jantar]

need to boycott halleisteins for not giving back the wage subsidy

another big nzx company did today

Metlifecare wage subsidy handback 'right thing to do'

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/123320097/metlifecare-wage-subsidy-handback-right-thing-to-do

A question for you Bull.

What other clothing retail businesses in NZ have paid back the subsidy? Just one will do.

If you are going to boycott HLG are you also going to boycott all those other retail clothing businesses?

[BlackPeter]

A question for you Bull.

What other clothing retail businesses in NZ have paid back the subsidy? Just one will do.

If you are going to boycott HLG are you also going to boycott all those other retail clothing businesses?

Great question ... but consider the consequences - we might need to put up from now on with a naked bull :scared:

[Balance]

Great question ... but consider the consequences - we might need to put up from now on with a naked bull :scared:

Does not bear thinking about!😳😰

[bull....]

A dirt cheap public relations stunt by EQT after effectively strong-arming directors and shareholders out of their shares for hundreds of millions less than fair value. EQT are complete hypocrites...nothing they have done to date with MET and its shareholders is fair or reasonable. They have pillaged N.Z. assets far below fair value.
Rod Duke pillages Kiwi's pockets for cheap Chinese made goods sold far above fair value and has used the ruse of a real "sale" to disingenuously gain vast wealth out of Kiwi's for decades.
These are not nice people Bull.

You've already spread this nonsense B.S. on the HLG thread before.
I'll say it again nice and slow just so a simple bull can understand it.
HLG stores and their online platforms were completely closed during Covid. Do you understand what "Closed" means ?
The Government set up this wage subsidy scheme to cover some of the costs, (not all of them) of keeping those workers in employment.

Please take your left wing socialist agenda elsewhere. I for one have had a complete guts full of people like you with their sanctimonious garbage on this subject.
You boycott them if you like, I am sure they won't miss the business.

theres a big difference when companies then go and pay dividends using the wage subsidy. this has been written about many times.

take the subsidy yes alright , but you dont need it if you pay out dividends. do the right thing hlg pay it back to nz taxpayers. just dont pay the next dividend will cover it

[Jantar]

theres a big difference when companies then go and pay dividends using the wage subsidy. this has been written about many times....
The alternative to taking the subsidy would have been to lay off the workers. Why would you think that would be better for the economy of the country?

[bull....]

The alternative to taking the subsidy would have been to lay off the workers. Why would you think that would be better for the economy of the country?

that was the right thing to do take the subsidy at the time for all businesses.

in hindsight we know the right thing to do now is pay it back as they didnt need it in hindsight

[Balance]

that was the right thing to do take the subsidy at the time for all businesses.

in hindsight we know the right thing to do now is pay it back as they didnt need it in hindsight

What a load of leftist garbage.

You better start with the multi nationals & essential companies first if you are really serious and when you are successful, I will join you and lobby for all companies which do not need the wage subsidy to return it.

Here’s one you can really get your teeth into to set the ball rolling : Fulton Hogan.

[bull....]

What a load of leftist garbage.

You better start with the multi nationals & essential companies first if you are really serious and when you are successful, I will join you and lobby for all companies which do not need the wage subsidy to return it.

Here’s one you can really get your teeth into to set the ball rolling : Fulton Hogan.

fulton hogan is a private company so only the govt could make them pay it back but if they were able to be boycotted i guess we could , hlg as a public company means shareholders can ask them to pay it back.

big difference shareholders can ask them to pay it back

[Beagle]

Lets move on. You've made you opinion known on this many times bull.

[winner69]

Fulton Hogan have 3,132 shareholders ...that’s quite a few

[Balance]

fulton hogan is a private company so only the govt could make them pay it back but if they were able to be boycotted i guess we could , hlg as a public company means shareholders can ask them to pay it back.

big difference shareholders can ask them to pay it back

Not true - it is a public company. And it was allowed to operate during the lockdowns.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/fulton-hogan-to-keep-33m-wage-subsidy-despite-bumper-profit-shareholder-dividends/IDI7INJG2MIB5WYFCQFI4HHMQ4/

Come on, bull .... don’t talk, do.

Look forward to seeing your letters etc to government and to shareholders of Fulton Hogan.

[winner69]

At least HLG got some wage support from the Aussies as well.

[Beagle]

At least HLG got some wage support from the Aussies as well.

$5m...best money the Australian Govt ever invested :D

[winner69]

$5m...best money the Australian Govt ever invested :D

Hope they got even more with the extended closures in Victoria

[winner69]

Interesting chart from Westpac giving an idea how punters are spending in Aussie

[Waltzing]

off topic and reply to MR B's comments on mr Duke and his products.

Some of the russell hobbs kitchen products we bought from mr Duke just died within a year. We are thinking of bring some dutch stuff back in the bike bags next time..

yes sometimes the sweds can be a bit viking in there raids... whatch out but once you are resident in the country and learn some of the local speak you will find them a very warm bunch... i much prefer riding bikes in sweden than in NZ... here you almost as good as dead in the central north island..its even safer down in holland.. until you live in those country's you just hate coming back and fear for you life on NZ roads.

surfs better here though and no rip curl in holland that i can find..

maybe i will try selling rip curl tops in south sweden summer next time!

[winner69]

In Hallensteins Lambton Quay this morning

In casual conservation with guy serving said that they must still be flat out since lockdown finished .....no no it’s been slack as the last month or so. ....but smiled and said it gives him more time to chat up the chicks in Glassons cos they not that busy either

Felt sorry for him so bought 2 tee shirts....seeing they were 2 for 30 bucks.

Maybe it’s just a Wellington thing

[Ferg]

Interesting, maybe the worm will turn? I'm still seeing super-growth in my clients, even in October - although these are not in retail apparel. Nothing has slowed yet. That said, HLG mentioned in their annual report that casual clothes were going well at Hallensteins, whereas the tailored clothing was not performing as well.

It can be hard to reconcile observations and anecdotes with the financials and NZ Stats. From what your chap described it does not sound good. Per the 2020 AR, Hallensteins stores sales were down 9%, as was Glassons NZ which is kind of consistent with being closed for a month of -8% ignoring seasonality. Note Glassons Australia was up 22% which is impressive.

It appears the average annual sales per Hellensteins store is around $1.88m (not adjusted for being closed or for Online) and Glassons was around $2.85m. This equates to sales of around an average of $6k sales per day per store for H and $9k per store per day for G NZ. This feels like a lot compared to your chap's anecdote on Lambton Quay, and also my local store in Hastings. I visited it recently and there were a a few customers on a weekday but no clothing to my liking.

Given online sales are not separately disclosed, their sales must be included in the overall brand sales. Adjusting for 22% online sales (and 15% last year) and also adjusting for the fact the stores were closed for 4 weeks, H sales per store were down 9%, G NZ was down 10% and G Aust was up an impressive 21%. This is assuming online sales can be pro-rated across the reported segments in line with top-line sales. Note the addition of 4 weeks to normalise the closures, adds about 7% to NZ and 9% to Aust for YoY growth. Note that Auckland stores may have been subject to additional losses due to their second closure which will be hard to quantify.

HLG have been conservative over the years (and a survivor) and I imagine that if there are any under-performing stores then Management will be on to them like a limpet, or like a young actress onto an elderly millionaire. If this results in the closure of some stores or range reduction with an increased focus on online sales, that could be good for the bottom line. That is assuming top-line sales are not lost which is not guaranteed.


In Hallensteins Lambton Quay this morning

In casual conservation with guy serving said that they must still be flat out since lockdown finished .....no no it’s been slack as the last month or so.

[winner69]

Hi ferg - yes it can be hard to reconcile observations and anecdotes with the financials.

I shouldn’t really mentioned it as it’s just a little bit of local noise that probably doesn’t reflect the big picture

After all sales were up 11% on last year in Aug/Sep even though 25 NZ stores were closed in August and 11 stores closed in Oz for those 2 months

And FYI paint sales still booming and Mitre 10 and Bunnings are still going gangbusters

[Beagle]

Risk free rate has fallen a long way from when HLG was last $6, worth about 1.5 PE extra just on that factor alone by my calculations, as evidenced by Briscoes and WHS share prices. Growth this year is on top of that. Still trades cum a 24 cent fully imputed dividend next month. Hmmm.

[bull....]

What a load of leftist garbage.

You better start with the multi nationals & essential companies first if you are really serious and when you are successful, I will join you and lobby for all companies which do not need the wage subsidy to return it.

Here’s one you can really get your teeth into to set the ball rolling : Fulton Hogan.

looks like you got your wish all companies on notice

Yesterday, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said she would be asking the Ministry of Social Development to make do an audit on companies that had taken the wage subsidy offer over the past few months.
That was on the back of companies such as Fulton Hogan, which took up the offer of a wage subsidy then went on to make a huge profit.
"There is a moral question here," Ardern said.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/covid-19-coronavirus-grant-robertson-on-the-state-of-the-economy/7GV3OKIBI3YJB4UXPINZP7GKUA/

[winner69]

looks like you got your wish all companies on notice

Yesterday, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said she would be asking the Ministry of Social Development to make do an audit on companies that had taken the wage subsidy offer over the past few months.
That was on the back of companies such as Fulton Hogan, which took up the offer of a wage subsidy then went on to make a huge profit.
"There is a moral question here," Ardern said.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/covid-19-coronavirus-grant-robertson-on-the-state-of-the-economy/7GV3OKIBI3YJB4UXPINZP7GKUA/


NZME took wage subsidy and now going to pay divie

Suppose no more coverage of this issue in the media

[arekaywhy]

I think the donkey toothed fairy can take her "morals" and place them carefully where the sun shineth not. The question is merely a legal one for business. Any pretense of "morals" these days is usually a signal of virtue and not in shareholders interest in any way.

[jonu]

looks like you got your wish all companies on notice

Yesterday, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said she would be asking the Ministry of Social Development to make do an audit on companies that had taken the wage subsidy offer over the past few months.
That was on the back of companies such as Fulton Hogan, which took up the offer of a wage subsidy then went on to make a huge profit.
"There is a moral question here," Ardern said.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/covid-19-coronavirus-grant-robertson-on-the-state-of-the-economy/7GV3OKIBI3YJB4UXPINZP7GKUA/


Virtue signal speak which translates as.....Grant and I ****ed up big time. Never mind, it's not like it's our money.

[Waltzing]

Well now that the EFCY rate is 90%

we have moved off shore . funds moving to ASX .. some stocks there will rerate very quickly now.

Will still hold a small retail NZ.

DISC: reduced local retail at 50% profit.

[winner69]

NZ Electronic Card Spend for October stats out today

Apparel sales up 13% on October last year

Overall retail sales really booming - core retail up 10% in October v pcp and now on annualised basis running ahead of pre-covid times. Apparel however still down 11% on pre-covid levels ---- how long to recover or were sales lost during lockdown lost forever

[Beagle]

NZ Electronic Card Spend for October stats out today

Apparel sales up 13% on October last year

Overall retail sales really booming - core retail up 10% in October v pcp and now on annualised basis running ahead of pre-covid times. Apparel however still down 11% on pre-covid levels ---- how long to recover or were sales lost during lockdown lost forever

Happy days :t_up:
Disc: Topped up with a few more this morning. Can't get enough of a good thing.

[Raz]

Happy days :t_up:
Disc: Topped up with a few more this morning. Can't get enough of a good thing.

They still have good stock, economy is still going well, only thing I am hearing is supply lines issues from overseas and that does not relate to HLG.

[Waltzing]

we are pleased for all holders of this wonderful stock and we may move back in after next results but we are not expecting a 100 percent move in the stock price in the next 2 years and thats whats on offer on stock purchased this morning on the ASX we purchased in a holding company as we expect to add more of recovery sector stocks on the ASX in the company 8 weeks.

[moka]

I think the donkey toothed fairy can take her "morals" and place them carefully where the sun shineth not. The question is merely a legal one for business. Any pretense of "morals" these days is usually a signal of virtue and not in shareholders interest in any way.Morals matter, perhaps not to you in certain circumstances if you benefit from a lack of morals or ethics but if you are disadvantaged you may change your mind and think that morals do matter.

There is a lot of immoral behaviour in business that is not illegal or it is hard to prove it is illegal e.g. Feltex, Mainzeal, Wynyard, CBL.

Morals matter in business. So if a business is lying, stretching the truth, manipulative, fibbing, fabricating, pulling the wool over our eyes, twisting, distorting, falsifying, misrepresenting the facts, evasive, scheming, conniving, deceitful, deceptive, a hypocrite, a cheat, a liar, a fraud, a hoax, a sham, a scam, two faced, it does matter to the general public. And reputation matters.

[Cyclical]

They still have good stock, economy is still going well, only thing I am hearing is supply lines issues from overseas and that does not relate to HLG.

I might be reading that wrong...do you know for sure that supply line is not an issue for HLG? Or are you saying that what you've heard is unrelated to HLG? I've been thinking about this myself lately, while I sit here patiently waiting for some consignments I ordered from China some weeks ago. I don't know how deep it goes but surely this inability to get stuff around the world in a timely fashion is going to be hugely detrimental to a lot of businesses and wider economies. On top of that, the usual supply and demand forces will be impacting shipping costs (especially air freight) and hurting margins...definitely something to bear in mind for HLG I think.

[Balance]

Morals matter, perhaps not to you in certain circumstances if you benefit from a lack of morals or ethics but if you are disadvantaged you may change your mind and think that morals do matter.

There is a lot of immoral behaviour in business that is not illegal or it is hard to prove it is illegal e.g. Feltex, Mainzeal, Wynyard, CBL.

Morals matter in business. So if a business is lying, stretching the truth, manipulative, fibbing, fabricating, pulling the wool over our eyes, twisting, distorting, falsifying, misrepresenting the facts, evasive, scheming, conniving, deceitful, deceptive, a hypocrite, a cheat, a liar, a fraud, a hoax, a sham, a scam, two faced, it does matter to the general public. And reputation matters.

Tell us about Cindy continuing to wear the hijab after it was pointed out to her that she was supporting the oppression of women in certain Muslim countries.

Seems like morals do not matter in politics?

[bull....]

Morals matter, perhaps not to you in certain circumstances if you benefit from a lack of morals or ethics but if you are disadvantaged you may change your mind and think that morals do matter.

There is a lot of immoral behaviour in business that is not illegal or it is hard to prove it is illegal e.g. Feltex, Mainzeal, Wynyard, CBL.

Morals matter in business. So if a business is lying, stretching the truth, manipulative, fibbing, fabricating, pulling the wool over our eyes, twisting, distorting, falsifying, misrepresenting the facts, evasive, scheming, conniving, deceitful, deceptive, a hypocrite, a cheat, a liar, a fraud, a hoax, a sham, a scam, two faced, it does matter to the general public. And reputation matters.

well said. it esp important for brand based companies

[Snow Leopard]

What about the hijab?...!

Do HLG sell them ?

[Balance]

Do HLG sell them ?

They do not sell the symbol of oppression, worn by Cindy to spite Muslim women in Iran & other oppressive Muslim countries.

[winner69]

Do HLG sell them ?

Clarke got a suit from Hallensteins

Think Jacinda gone more upmarket

[moka]

Tell us about Cindy continuing to wear the hijab after it was pointed out to her that she was supporting the oppression of women in certain Muslim countries.

Seems like morals do not matter in politics?


They do not sell the symbol of oppression, worn by Cindy to spite Muslim women in Iran & other oppressive Muslim countries.She wore the hijab to show respect and support for Muslim community in Christchurch. And that is how most people saw it. Her intention was to show solidarity with the Muslim community affected by the shootings. It was right at the time in the eyes of most people here in New Zealand.

So what is your intention in continually repeating this theme? It does not show support or respect for our Prime Minister. You are distorting the truth to promote your own agenda. What about your morals?

[Beagle]

Maybe we could get back to talking about HLG now ? After the great news on the vaccine today who can even be bothered exchanging harsh words and arguing about politics ? Don't worry, be happy !! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3HQMbQAWRc

Someone mentioned to me the other day No new cases in Melbourne in the last 6 days, Oh my goodness, I reckon there is going to be some really explosive pent up shopping demand over there after such a long "nuclear" winter. Vaccine on the horizon and light at the end of the tunnel. 24 cent fully imputed dividend in time for Christmas. Happy days :t_up: :t_up:

[Balance]

Maybe we could get back to talking about HLG now ? After the great news on the vaccine today who can even be bothered exchanging harsh words and arguing about politics ? Don't worry, be happy !! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3HQMbQAWRc

Someone mentioned to me the other day No new cases in Melbourne in the last 6 days, Oh my goodness, I reckon there is going to be some really explosive pent up shopping demand over there after such a long "nuclear" winter. Vaccine on the horizon and light at the end of the tunnel. 24 cent fully imputed dividend in time for Christmas. Happy days :t_up: :t_up:

Happy days indeed but you can sense the bare faced envy at missing out by bull & Moka.

Which is fine but for their bare faced hypocrisy quoting the hijab wearing cynical PM, citing moral issues!

[bull....]

Happy days indeed but you can sense the bare faced envy at missing out by bull & Moka.

Which is fine but for their bare faced hypocrisy quoting the hijab wearing cynical PM, citing moral issues!

funny you might need to remove the hijab from your head to read the facts

YTD HLG is up 1.6% thats right the impressive amount of 1.6% lol if you trade it you may have done better than 1.6%

CNU is up 44% YTD so i am indeed feeling good.

[arekaywhy]

You guys are right, sentiment is high at the moment and it shows almost right across the market. Now time to take advantage of that.

The thing I get annoyed with is all this talk of companies having to give back taxpayer money, when taking the offer was the right thing to do, and legal, for any business adversely affected by the decisions that the government made.

Just to be clear, I don't agree with it being there as an offer in the first place, much as I don't agree with the government's actions around shutting businesses down, but hey, they set the rules, and companies have stuck to them as far as I can tell.

[Balance]

funny you might need to remove the hijab from your head to read the facts

YTD HLG is up 1.6% thats right the impressive amount of 1.6% lol if you trade it you may have done better than 1.6%

CNU is up 44% YTD so i am indeed feeling good.

Try over 60% gain for HLG by buying when the panic was profound.

Go back to your postings around that time - you were basically shxtting in your pants. So thanks for the gloom!

I ❤️ It!

[bull....]

Try over 60% gain for HLG by buying when the panic was profound.

Go back to your postings around that time - you were basically shxtting in your pants. So thanks for the gloom!

I ❤️ It!

we all have to admit it was not a very comfortable time

[nztx]

Try over 60% gain for HLG by buying when the panic was profound.

Go back to your postings around that time - you were basically shxtting in your pants. So thanks for the gloom!

I ❤️ It!


Only 60% ? -- I'm looking potentially at 300% + coming up shortly on US market using said strategy

9% Div here = 18% + in places up there, with things only just starting to go totally bonkers

[Balance]

Only 60% ? -- I'm looking potentially at 300% + coming up shortly on US market using said strategy

9% Div here = 18% + in places up there, with things only just starting to go totally bonkers

Good on you!

Well done!

Always pleased to see posters do very well.

Been a trying time so time to reap appropriate rewards. 👍

[couta1]

You guys like to see who's got the biggest one, it would be good to hear more about the not so good returns for a change.

[nztx]

You guys like to see who's got the biggest one, it would be good to hear more about the not so good returns for a change.


SCY - Sold 50% a week or so before Receivership & then got left sucking the Kumara on the rest ;)

[nztx]

Good on you!

Well done!

Always pleased to see posters do very well.

Been a trying time so time to reap appropriate rewards. ��


Indeed - sniffing out potential undervalued up there is .. well uncharted territory & can be hit & miss

Don't get me wrong - HLG is & has been quite a star performer, for which I remain very grateful
for the informative posts of the many on this forum contributing here

[Ferg]

Morals matter in business. So if a business is lying, stretching the truth, manipulative, fibbing, fabricating, pulling the wool over our eyes, twisting, distorting, falsifying, misrepresenting the facts, evasive, scheming, conniving, deceitful, deceptive, a hypocrite, a cheat, a liar, a fraud, a hoax, a sham, a scam, two faced, it does matter to the general public. And reputation matters.

So it's good to see that HLG abided by the rules and is none of those things. No morals or rules were broken, so there is nothing for HLG to repay. If this applies to other businesses, then I suggest you post that in the appropriate thread because it doesn't belong here.

[nztx]

funny you might need to remove the hijab from your head to read the facts

YTD HLG is up 1.6% thats right the impressive amount of 1.6% lol if you trade it you may have done better than 1.6%

CNU is up 44% YTD so i am indeed feeling good.

but how's the Div Yield looking between the two ?

that is even taking into account HLG's reduced deferred Interim due to Covid-19 ?

and taking into account CNU's promises of further shareholder joy in the future before the Telecoms
Regulator waved their magic wand in between then and now ? .. ;)

[Balance]

So it's good to see that HLG abided by the rules and is none of those things. No morals or rules were broken, so there is nothing for HLG to repay. If this applies to other businesses, then I suggest you post that in the appropriate thread because it doesn't belong here.

Well said & well written, Ferg.

[Robomo]

funny you might need to remove the hijab from your head to read the facts

YTD HLG is up 1.6% thats right the impressive amount of 1.6% lol if you trade it you may have done better than 1.6%

CNU is up 44% YTD so i am indeed feeling good.

I bought HLG in November 2016 @ $2.93 per share. Dividends since then total $1.04 and current price $6.24 per share. So 'buy and hold' has given me a 249% return in 4 years. I see no compelling reason to sell.

[Beagle]

I bought HLG in November 2016 @ $2.93 per share. Dividends since then total $1.04 and current price $6.24 per share. So 'buy and hold' has given me a 249% return in 4 years. I see no compelling reason to sell.

Well said and you'll enjoy another 24 cent fully imputed dividend next month and another one in April 2021...that's a total of $1.52 in dividends in 4 1/2 years.
What's the point in having money in the bank these days at less than 1% per annum before tax when you can get returns like that !!

[Waltzing]

Congratulations to 3 dollar holders. You had the last laugh. We always trade this stock above 6 dollars. Yesterdays vaccine reports will reward long term holders in value NZ stocks. Talking to the choir and MR B will also have the last laugh as always.

[Beagle]

Congratulations to 3 dollar holders. You had the last laugh. We always trade this stock above 6 dollars. Yesterdays vaccine reports will reward long term holders in value NZ stocks. Talking to the choir and MR B will also have the last laugh as always.

Thanks. I first bought in August 2016 at ~ $2.75. Quite apart from the ongoing growth this company is enjoying with interest rates where they are now relative to the last two times HLG were over $6 my sense is $6 something now is equal to $5 something back then. In other words there's at least another dollar of value in this share now just because interest rates are at 100 year lows. There's also the 24 cent dividend due next month.

I am sure you have found something else that will also do well though and best wishes with that. For what its worth I leave me Australian investing to Barramundi which outperformed the Australian index by a staggering 19% last year !

[Waltzing]

we started yesterday to move back to off shore beaten down sectors as we want higher value currency investments. These sectors are at low values and will return higher value returns even of business travel does not return to previous levels as tourism kicks back hard. All over the overnight news programs and new outlets the investment professionals have called it a game changer as they dont need so many people to take the vaccine and eventually there will be a rush line up for such effective treatments every winter..

Travel is back soon and its time to invest now.... yesterday for the big returns on investment money...

[Beagle]

Fair enough mate. I only ever invested in HLG for the yield which was a stunning 15% gross back in August 2016 at ~ $2.70, but things worked out far, far better than I originally envisaged.

Thing is though. The yield today of *11.5% gross is just as stunning for where interest rates are now compared to 15% gross in 2016 so I am a very happy holder and am continuing to accumulate more.

* Based on assumed fully imputed dividends of 50 cps in FY21 (50 / 0.72) = 69.44 cps gross. 69.44 cps gross as a function of the theoretical ex divvy price ($6.04) of HLG shares $6.30 - $0.24 cent divvy due shortly = $0.6944 / $6.06 = 11.459% gross yield. I think that's a truly extraordinary yield for where interest rates are now !

[winner69]

Fair enough mate. I only ever invested in HLG for the yield which was a stunning 15% gross back in August 2016 at ~ $2.70, but things worked out far, far better than I originally envisaged.

Thing is though. The yield today of *11.5% gross is just as stunning for where interest rates are now compared to 15% gross in 2016 so I am a very happy holder and am continuing to accumulate more.

* Based on assumed fully imputed dividends of 50 cps in FY21 (50 / 0.72) = 69.44 cps gross. 69.44 cps gross as a function of the theoretical ex divvy price ($6.04) of HLG shares $6.30 - $0.24 cent divvy due shortly = $0.6944 / $6.06 = 11.459% gross yield. I think that's a truly extraordinary yield for where interest rates are now !

Yield I’d even better ....11.63% gross .....you should take $0.33 of current price (the imputed amount)

Pretty good eh

Hope we DO get that 50 cents

[Waltzing]

"11.459% gross yield"


It would be rated A but its not a certain german brand...but its Rate A for NZX.

Mr B's rating system.


Moving off shore right now into certain sectors comes at high risk and we dont recommend for retail investors in NZ. (100*n)% higher risk than this stock.

These high risk stocks have potential 60 to 100% returns over 2 to 3 years.

Or they cap raise some more or go broke...the vaccine reduces the risk of the later.

but remember its not NZ dollar.

[Beagle]

It should be rated BBB = Beagle Busy Buying :)

[Waltzing]

we were thinking BB +

the Brilliant Mr B... but we thought as it has outperformed for a decade but the balance sheet is certainly am A.

[James108]

Beagle question for ya, what % of your portfolio is hlg currently? Just curious I’m at 15% and I don’t think I would want much more unless I think there is huge value.

[Balance]

Beagle question for ya, what % of your portfolio is hlg currently? Just curious I’m at 15% and I don’t think I would want much more unless I think there is huge value.

Can never have too much of a great thing - that’s Beagle’s philosophy?

[Beagle]

Beagle question for ya, what % of your portfolio is hlg currently? Just curious I’m at 15% and I don’t think I would want much more unless I think there is huge value.

Great minds think alike ! Got up to just under 15% this morning.

[jimdog31]

I wonder, if this stock struggles with the liquidity teat for inclusion on the Nzx50, would a stock split help?

Does the board prefer flying under the radar ?

[winner69]

I wonder, if this stock struggles with the liquidity teat for inclusion on the Nzx50, would a stock split help?

Does the board prefer flying under the radar ?

Don’t think the Board / big shareholders give a stuff about the shareprice

Too busy running the business ...and not distracted by meaningless things like a share price

[Beagle]

Currency nearly at 69 cents U.S. !

[jimdog31]

Don’t think the Board / big shareholders give a stuff about the shareprice

Too busy running the business ...and not distracted by meaningless things like a share price

I wonder if Mr Glasson would agree with the above statement.

[winner69]

I wonder if Mr Glasson would agree with the above statement.

From what I’ve been told about Mr Glasson as a long time shareholder and one that’s likely to be for many years the share price doesn’t really matter

He knows that the whims and fancies of punters (so called investors) means the share price sometimes is 2 bucks something and at times 6 bucks plus.

Main aim is to ensure the company performs consistently well ....and he gets his zillion dollar divie on a regular basis....ie a true long term ‘owner’

Maybe his accountant might tell what his shares are worth

Be a worry if he sold out wouldn’t it.

[dreamcatcher]

I wonder if Mr Glasson would agree with the above statement.

His holding is probably the reason why HLG pays such great divvies call it a reward.

[jimdog31]

From what I’ve been told about Mr Glasson as a long time shareholder and one that’s likely to be for many years the share price doesn’t really matter

He knows that the whims and fancies of punters (so called investors) means the share price sometimes is 2 bucks something and at times 6 bucks plus.

Main aim is to ensure the company performs consistently well ....and he gets his zillion dollar divie on a regular basis....ie a true long term ‘owner’

Maybe his accountant might tell what his shares are worth

Be a worry if he sold out wouldn’t it.

Of course. I do agree that the share price is neither here nor there if the underlying business is profitable.

Ultimately as director of a company your duty is to maximise return to shareholders. They tick the box in regards to dividends, but i do think the market cap is beneath where it could be.

Another angle is branding too. Ramping up expansion in aussie at some point will they consider asx opportunities to help with brand awareness.

Its more than likely a case of if its not broken dont fix it.

[winner69]

Of course. I do agree that the share price is neither here nor there if the underlying business is profitable.

Ultimately as director of a company your duty is to maximise return to shareholders. They tick the box in regards to dividends, but i do think the market cap is beneath where it could be.

Another angle is branding too. Ramping up expansion in aussie at some point will they consider asx opportunities to help with brand awareness.

Its more than likely a case of if its not broken dont fix it.

The old maximising shareholder value imperative eh .....a dumb idea that’s finally dying

Providing long term customer value is far better and I reckon HLG have grasped that concept and doing it very well.

[jimdog31]

The old maximising shareholder value imperative eh .....a dumb idea that’s finally dying

Providing long term customer value is far better and I reckon HLG have grasped that concept and doing it very well.

Thanks for your input winner. I wont take offence as the “dumb” idea is not my own.

I’m a director and I take that duty very seriously. Call me dumb if you want but my shareholders sure appreciate it, thats why when i go to them with business ideas they invest without question.

I’m on sharetrader to share compare ideas - and learn. Not sure what the above interaction is all about , but i definitely don’t feel I’ve learnt anything useful.

Let me clarify what I was initially suggesting.

Alot of seasoned posters on here have said how undervalued the company is, on pricing multiples and that its only heading north. I’m onboard with that narrative (significantly), im not a short term investor like you insinuated. I do believe that the share price is heading in the right direction, however in looking through the history of this share price it seems to reach these prices and then at the first sign of trouble it drops substantially back down, which based on this companies fundamentals doesn’t make sense.

I believe and others have mentioned that a significant reason this happens is the size of the free float, and that it doesnt garner enough coverage from the brokers.

What I was suggesting is that if they considered a stock split it may help with any liquidity issues they have to get onto the index.

I saw a comment today on another thread that summerset did this a way back and look where their shareprice is now.

More shares = more investors = more coverage = more value - Right?

Is the above suggestion that outrageous? sorry if I’m completly missing something here.

My next confusing thought is this; as a long term shareholder arent you interested in the long term value of your portfolio growing? I know I am, so I dont get the mentality of “the boards to busy running the company to worry about the share price” especially when long term posters on here have demonstrated that this company is still being materially undervalued ( I do recognise its heading in the right direction).

Again, maybe Ive got this wrong somewhere, but like I said I’m here to learn, so educate away!

[couta1]

Can never have too much of a great thing - that’s Beagle’s philosophy? You can't have too many until you do.

[nztx]

Thanks for your input winner. I wont take offence as the “dumb” idea is not my own.

I’m a director and I take that duty very seriously. Call me dumb if you want but my shareholders sure appreciate it, thats why when i go to them with business ideas they invest without question.

I’m on sharetrader to share compare ideas - and learn. Not sure what the above interaction is all about , but i definitely don’t feel I’ve learnt anything useful.

Let me clarify what I was initially suggesting.

Alot of seasoned posters on here have said how undervalued the company is, on pricing multiples and that its only heading north. I’m onboard with that narrative (significantly), im not a short term investor like you insinuated. I do believe that the share price is heading in the right direction, however in looking through the history of this share price it seems to reach these prices and then at the first sign of trouble it drops substantially back down, which based on this companies fundamentals doesn’t make sense.

I believe and others have mentioned that a significant reason this happens is the size of the free float, and that it doesnt garner enough coverage from the brokers.

What I was suggesting is that if they considered a stock split it may help with any liquidity issues they have to get onto the index.

I saw a comment today on another thread that summerset did this a way back and look where their shareprice is now.

More shares = more investors = more coverage = more value - Right?

Is the above suggestion that outrageous? sorry if I’m completly missing something here.

My next confusing thought is this; as a long term shareholder arent you interested in the long term value of your portfolio growing? I know I am, so I dont get the mentality of “the boards to busy running the company to worry about the share price” especially when long term posters on here have demonstrated that this company is still being materially undervalued ( I do recognise its heading in the right direction).

Again, maybe Ive got this wrong somewhere, but like I said I’m here to learn, so educate away!

PPH has recently announced a 4:1 Split coming up & on that looks like it's mostly gone south from higher $9.30/9.40 levels since

Nothing wrong with PPH earnings looking forward either

Why reorganise the HLG capital structure when it's working just fine right now with market forces at play ? ;)

Beagle & I may have to start buying a few less in future to help the share liquidity along though ;)

Mind you no-one would mind at all, if unnamed punters at large decided that HLG looked like tomorrow's MFT
and voted accordingly ;)

[winner69]

Hey Jim, nothing personal intended in my responses.

The maximising shareholder value imperative debate has been going on for a while and no doubt will continue - there are obviously a few different views.

Best not discussed on this thread as it will upset a few as not on topic. One day soon I’ll get around to outline my thoughts and start a new thread and anybody interested can take it from there.

In HLGs case as long as they continue to look after customers and Keep them happy and give them long term value they’ll do well. After a company isn’t worth much without customers. The market will decide what the company is worth (throughout the business cycle). Of course we need to remember that the value given to it is rather subjective at the best of time. I also believe ‘artificial’ means to try and influence a share price never work in the long term.

Good day for HLG share price today ....all time high coming soon.

[jimdog31]

PPH has recently announced a 4:1 Split coming up & on that looks like it's mostly gone south from higher $9.30/9.40 levels since

Nothing wrong with PPH earnings looking forward either

Why reorganise the HLG capital structure when it's working just fine right now with market forces at play ? ;)

Beagle & I may have to start buying a few less in future to help the share liquidity along though ;)

Mind you no-one would mind at all, if unnamed punters at large decided that HLG looked like tomorrow's MFT
and voted accordingly ;)

PPHs split was definitely not the reason for my split suggestion, completly different set of scenarios happening there, they arent tightly held and they don’t suffer from low liquidity.

I Think their price drop is more related to inisder selling, which as winner hinted at isnt likely to happen with HLG

I do agree the market pricing is working fine right now, im more worried about down the track with any percieved wobbles as in the past the share price goes south fairly quickly with the low levelnof retail investors on the register.

Maybe ill keep all my outlandish ideas on the skt thread instead 😜

[jimdog31]

Hey Jim, nothing personal intended in my responses.

The maximising shareholder value imperative debate has been going on for a while and no doubt will continue - there are obviously a few different views.

Best not discussed on this thread as it will upset a few as not on topic. One day soon I’ll get around to outline my thoughts and start a new thread and anybody interested can take it from there.

In HLGs case as long as they continue to look after customers and Keep them happy and give them long term value they’ll do well. After a company isn’t worth much without customers. The market will decide what the company is worth (throughout the business cycle). Of course we need to remember that the value given to it is rather subjective at the best of time. I also believe ‘artificial’ means to try and influence a share price never work in the long term.

Good day for HLG share price today ....all time high coming soon.

All good winner, like I said I didn’t take offence, was more confused as to why the idea wasn’t properly considered.

Differing views are what makes a market work right?

Short and long, bull and bear, ta vs fa , value vs growth, yield vs share price.....

All time high you say - good time to split ?? 😂

[nztx]

PPHs split was definitely not the reason for my split suggestion, completly different set of scenarios happening there, they arent tightly held and they don’t suffer from low liquidity.

I Think their price drop is more related to inisder selling, which as winner hinted at isnt likely to happen with HLG

I do agree the market pricing is working fine right now, im more worried about down the track with any percieved wobbles as in the past the share price goes south fairly quickly with the low levelnof retail investors on the register.

Maybe ill keep all my outlandish ideas on the skt thread instead ��


Insider selling could be the case with PPH indeed.

Perhaps MFT is a better comparison on comparable issued shares 100 million for MFT
with just shy of 60 million for HLG

MFT obviously must believe in retaining Shareholder value in their SP (which hit $60 today)

There is no reason why HLG could not be taking similar stance, which could do similar
and see SP advance north of present values.

Obviously comparable Div Yields differences between the two exist with respective SP's for each

Xero in not paying Dividends along with ATM similarly retain value in their respective SP's

A larger Share Register obviously means higher Registry costs, whilst a smaller
Register may contain a higher degree of long term holders - translating into perhaps
less market liquidity accordingly, less cost on the company & loyal bunch of holders.

Would a HLG share split necessarily see more scrip on the market or similar proportionate
holdings retained by the group of loyal stakeholders, as currently exists ?

I dont see major HLG stakeholders selling down if share split was undertaken, but may be wrong.
I certainly wouldnt, but would look at adding further to the current pile

In the scheme of other offerings on NZX $6.00 more or less is not exactly a high SP
for a quality performing company with good consistent established past record

[Cyclical]

More shares = more investors = more coverage = more value - Right?

Hey jimdog, I'm not sure I understand your logic. If it was as simple as that, wouldn't all stocks be at BLT type prices? It might grab the attention of a few beginner investors who don't understand that there is no direct correlation between the face value of a share and the value of the company (my mother springs to mind), but other than that, I'm struggling to see any real positive. What am I missing?

[Cyclical]

You guys like to see who's got the biggest one, it would be good to hear more about the not so good returns for a change.


You can't have too many until you do.

You've probably got a stomach churning story you could share on this one to temper the somewhat bullish mood around here...keep it to yourself, won't you!

For me, average buy is in the 3s and it's close to 30% of my portfolio - doesn't help that it keeps going up in value! Average would be somewhat lower if I hadn't lost my bottle with falling knives on a couple of occasions. It's a bottom of the drawer stock for me, I'll enjoy that divvy yield for a long time to come I hope.

[jimdog31]

Hey jimdog, I'm not sure I understand your logic. If it was as simple as that, wouldn't all stocks be at BLT type prices? It might grab the attention of a few beginner investors who don't understand that there is no direct correlation between the face value of a share and the value of the company (my mother springs to mind), but other than that, I'm struggling to see any real positive. What am I missing?

I’m not advocating infinitely more shares, i’m advocating more shares in the retail float, ie being freely traded. Alot of the shares on this register are being tightly held.

i think you are oversimplifying my oversimplification :)

[jimdog31]

Insider selling could be the case with PPH indeed.

Perhaps MFT is a better comparison on comparable issued shares 100 million for MFT
with just shy of 60 million for HLG

MFT obviously must believe in retaining Shareholder value in their SP (which hit $60 today)

There is no reason why HLG could not be taking similar stance, which could do similar
and see SP advance north of present values.

Obviously comparable Div Yields differences between the two exist with respective SP's for each

Xero in not paying Dividends along with ATM similarly retain value in their respective SP's

A larger Share Register obviously means higher Registry costs, whilst a smaller
Register may contain a higher degree of long term holders - translating into perhaps
less market liquidity accordingly, less cost on the company & loyal bunch of holders.

Would a HLG share split necessarily see more scrip on the market or similar proportionate
holdings retained by the group of loyal stakeholders, as currently exists ?

I dont see major HLG stakeholders selling down if share split was undertaken, but may be wrong.
I certainly wouldnt, but would look at adding further to the current pile

In the scheme of other offerings on NZX $6.00 more or less is not exactly a high SP
for a quality performing company with good consistent established past record

You make some valid points, and thats what I was looking for when I raised the idea - discussion :)

My underlying point was to try and help with the liquidity and inclusion in the nzx50, and therefore more broker coverage.

[Cyclical]

I’m not advocating infinitely more shares, i’m advocating more shares in the retail float, ie being freely traded. Alot of the shares on this register are being tightly held.

i think you are oversimplifying my oversimplification :)

Haha, maybe. I guess when I'm purchasing stocks, I'm looking to spend X amount of dollars, or I want it to make up X% of my portfolio. The X number of shares doesn't concern me in the slightest, but maybe I'm a bit simple :)

[jimdog31]

Haha, maybe. I guess when I'm purchasing stocks, I'm looking to spend X amount of dollars, or I want it to make up X% of my portfolio. The X number of shares doesn't concern me in the slightest, but maybe I'm a bit simple :)

Different strokes for different blokes mate. Maybe I'm the simple one. I prefer larger qty with lower $$. I guess i needed to articulate my idea better, I'm not advocating a big drop in prices, I was thinking a 2 for 1 split so down to $3.20ish with the hope that the price could then head up to say $4-5 which would then be more in line with retail PE rates.

[Cyclical]

Different strokes for different blokes mate. Maybe I'm the simple one. I prefer larger qty with lower $$. I guess i needed to articulate my idea better, I'm not advocating a big drop in prices, I was thinking a 2 for 1 split so down to $3.20ish with the hope that the price could then head up to say $4-5 which would then be more in line with retail PE rates.

Yep, you could be right, the market can be a fickle thing. But the theory doesn't seem to be helping OCA vs SUM for example.

[winner69]

Jim ...much revered company director Rob Turner essentially sayings have a greater responsibility than just ‘maximising shareholder value’

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/123361914/skycity-chair-calls-for-end-to-excessive-ceo-salaries

No doubt some on ST will say Rob’s lost the plot - or ascRob himself says ''my views maybe a bit idealistic to some''.

Good on you Rob

[Waltzing]

"2 for 1 split "

would be a good move prehaps increasing vol.

others would say that other platform where you dont own the shares does the job for stock splits.

[winner69]

"2 for 1 split "

would be a good move prehaps increasing vol.

others would say that other platform where you dont own the shares does the job for stock splits.

Seeing so undervalued may as well do a share buyback as well -- got a mountain of cash not doing much

[Beagle]

On the stock split thing, I don't have a firm opinion on it at this stage one way or the other. I wouldn't be averse to such a move but I think its a more pertinent question for the boards of the likes of Mainfreight and Fisher and Paykel Healthcare. Once we crack $10 its something I'd be happy to advocate for.

Lets just get some more runs on the board and get up to that $35-40m earnings zone and then see what happens to the share price :t_up:
We're all being paid so well with a projected 11.5% gross yield I think we can all afford to be patient :)

[Balance]

On the stock split thing, I don't have a firm opinion on it at this stage one way or the other. I wouldn't be averse to such a move but I think its a more pertinent question for the boards of the likes of Mainfreight and Fisher and Paykel Healthcare. Once we crack $10 its something I'd be happy to advocate for.

Lets just get some more runs on the board and get up to that $35-40m earnings zone and then see what happens to the share price :t_up:
We're all being paid so well with a projected 11.5% gross yield I think we can all afford to be patient :)

Yup - relax and enjoy the steady high dividend yield & capital growth.

A stock spilt will definitely increase liquidity in NZ - such is the nature of NZX as a general comment - and could accelerate HlG’s re-entry back into NZX50 index.

[Balance]

Yup - relax and enjoy the steady high dividend yield & capital growth.

A stock spilt will definitely increase liquidity in NZ - such is the nature of NZX as a general comment - and could accelerate HlG’s re-entry back into NZX50 index.

I understand HLG missed out to PEB due to liquidity but could be in the running to replace SKT next month.

We shall see!

[Balance]

It should be rated BBB = Beagle Busy Buying :)

$6.38 and on bugger all volume.

Imagine if HLG gets back into the index!

Suspect $7.50 will be easy!

You have to pause buying, Beagle - allow others to buy in and spread the HLG wealth effect!

[Waltzing]

"share buyback"

not sure its there style, prehaps a big special div in end of financial year.

not happy until we see how the brothers side of the business does. Its only clothes after all and it can be disrupted at any time but like KMD, never under estimate these retail operations and they seem to have kept there staff that know there business and understand there customer base.

Its a really impressive performance that is prehaps world class? or is the customer just not that discerning..after all the national past time for this demography is whatching a very physical form of sport.

My dutch sport science doctor tells me she stays dressed down more when she is in NZ then when she returns home.

[Beagle]

LOL Balance. I'm not getting too carried away with that index thing at all. At some stage it will happen, I am quite confident of that and in the meantime I am very happy to relax and enjoy the dividends. This is arguably the best dividend hounds / value stock on the NZX. I am a dividend hound and value investor at my core so this one fits me like a custom made velvet glove :)

[moka]

So it's good to see that HLG abided by the rules and is none of those things. No morals or rules were broken, so there is nothing for HLG to repay. If this applies to other businesses, then I suggest you post that in the appropriate thread because it doesn't belong here.
It is a matter of opinion and in the opinion of University of Auckland accounting professor, Jilnaught Wong morally Hallensteins should not have taken the wage subsidy. They took advantage of the high trust system when they were profitable and paid dividends, he said.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/122972883/accounting-professor-singles-out-nzx-companies-which-morally-shouldnt-have-taken-wage-subsidy?rm=a
University of Auckland accounting professor, Jilnaught Wong, who has been studying NZX stock exchange-listed companies that claimed wage subsidies, said many were justified in claiming the subsidy, including widely criticised casino operator SkyCity.
But the claiming of wage subsidies by companies including Duke’s Briscoe Group, retirement village operator Summerset and retailer Hallenstein Glasson Holdings “was not in the spirit of the law”, he said.
“Morally they shouldn’t have taken it,” Wong said.

[Balance]

It is a matter of opinion and in the opinion of University of Auckland accounting professor, Jilnaught Wong morally Hallensteins should not have taken the wage subsidy. They took advantage of the high trust system when they were profitable and paid dividends, he said.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/122972883/accounting-professor-singles-out-nzx-companies-which-morally-shouldnt-have-taken-wage-subsidy?rm=a
University of Auckland accounting professor, Jilnaught Wong, who has been studying NZX stock exchange-listed companies that claimed wage subsidies, said many were justified in claiming the subsidy, including widely criticised casino operator SkyCity.
But the claiming of wage subsidies by companies including Duke’s Briscoe Group, retirement village operator Summerset and retailer Hallenstein Glasson Holdings “was not in the spirit of the law”, he said.
“Morally they shouldn’t have taken it,” Wong said.

An accounting professor talking about morality? That's like Cindy talking about accounting for kiwibuild & solving the housing crisis.

The professor can come and kiss my .... :D

And what about Cindy continuing to wear the hijab to spite the Muslim women who pleaded with her not to support the oppression of women in Muslim countries - is that moral?

[winner69]

When I applied for the wage subsidy for a couple of companies I essentially agreed to the criteria to applying for it. This included -

Your business must have taken active steps to mitigate the financial impact of COVID-19.

This could include:

- drawing from your cash reserves (as appropriate)
Etc
Etc

[Beagle]

It is a matter of opinion and in the opinion of University of Auckland accounting professor, Jilnaught Wong morally Hallensteins should not have taken the wage subsidy. They took advantage of the high trust system when they were profitable and paid dividends, he said.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/122972883/accounting-professor-singles-out-nzx-companies-which-morally-shouldnt-have-taken-wage-subsidy?rm=a
University of Auckland accounting professor, Jilnaught Wong, who has been studying NZX stock exchange-listed companies that claimed wage subsidies, said many were justified in claiming the subsidy, including widely criticised casino operator SkyCity.
But the claiming of wage subsidies by companies including Duke’s Briscoe Group, retirement village operator Summerset and retailer Hallenstein Glasson Holdings “was not in the spirit of the law”, he said.
“Morally they shouldn’t have taken it,” Wong said.

Can you and your supporters take your sanctimonious socialist agenda to a separate off market thread.

[winner69]

"share buyback"

not sure its there style, prehaps a big special div in end of financial year.

not happy until we see how the brothers side of the business does. Its only clothes after all and it can be disrupted at any time but like KMD, never under estimate these retail operations and they seem to have kept there staff that know there business and understand there customer base.

Its a really impressive performance that is prehaps world class? or is the customer just not that discerning..after all the national past time for this demography is whatching a very physical form of sport.

My dutch sport science doctor tells me she stays dressed down more when she is in NZ then when she returns home.




Hey waltzing ...I know you you love with KMD but you shouldn’t tout dogs on the HLG thread ..and don’t compare them to HLG

One horse race.

[moka]

Can you and your supporters take your sanctimonious socialist agenda to a separate off market thread.

Some relevant words of wisdom from Phaedrus.



These "toxic" threads share many similarities and are quite easily identified. Here are a few pointers :-
Watch for a preponderance of overly loyal extremely positive contributions.
Any negative posters are "run off the thread".
When negative posters are accused of "downramping" you can be sure that all objectivity has been lost.
Look out for multitudinous "cut and paste" entries of scarcely relevant articles from the net.
Beware of threads where anyone posting a negative comment is personally attacked.
Dissenting views should be encouraged, not rubbished. We learn nothing from those that agree with us.
Watch for comments on "ignorant" selling by institutions, techies etc - by people that think they know better.

[nztx]

Some relevant words of wisdom from Phaedrus.

Meanwhile HLG touched $6.39 today with another 3 weeks to going ex Div

[Balance]

Some relevant words of wisdom from Phaedrus.

Beagle is making a perfectly reasonable and very helpful suggestion that you start a separate off market thread regarding the wage subsidy - that way, you and the others can highlight the issue which you feel strongly about and invite others to voice their opinions as well.

What is your problem with doing that?

BTW, you have yet to answer the question regarding the morality of Cindy continuing to wear the hijab to spite the Muslim women who pleaded with her not to support the oppression of women in Muslim countries.

[nztx]

Can you and your supporters take your sanctimonious socialist agenda to a separate off market thread.

Good point - all the 'after the event' Wage Subsidy dribble concentrated in one thread, rather than than interdispersed across many is
probably not a bad call IMO

[Waltzing]

KMD and HLG ..

now really i like both these stocks and H&M

to be fair i did not say that KMD outperforms HLG or that KMD was superior as they cater for different markets and i do see that the performance numbers for HLG do outperform by some fair margin and then some.

But these stocks are the major retailers on the market and since there lows they have both doubled there price.

DISC: we both hold and trade both at various times and have made some nice profits in the last 6 months for which we are gratefully respectful of the wonders of the public listed market models of capitalism..or as Sir Ken Clark said as he was transported on a Amsterdam canal ferry in "Civilisation"

C a P i T a l i s m.

I contend they are both successful retailer stocks and KMD deserves as much attention as HLG due to its global brand potential.

Vol today KMD over 600,000 , HLG 25000. I am sure liquidity in HLG would improve if it made the NZX 50 and here is hoping for that.

[Snow Leopard]

Beagle is making a perfectly reasonable and very helpful suggestion that you start a separate off market thread regarding the wage subsidy - that way, you and the others can highlight the issue which you feel strongly about and invite others to voice their opinions as well.

What is your problem with doing that?

BTW, you have yet to answer the question regarding the morality of Cindy continuing to wear the hijab to spite the Muslim women who pleaded with her not to support the oppression of women in Muslim countries.

Another poster with a do as I say not as I do mentality.

[Ferg]

It is a matter of opinion and in the opinion of University of Auckland accounting professor, Jilnaught Wong morally Hallensteins should not have taken the wage subsidy. They took advantage of the high trust system when they were profitable and paid dividends, he said.

It's not about opinions of irrelevant internet sources (per your later post) or morals; it is about what is lawful. Who gets decide morality? That is a question fraught with difficulty as indicated by other posters who mention a certain hijab-wearing politician.

HLG did not "take advantage of a high trust system". The Government imposed lockdown resulted in a fall in sales for HLG well in excess of the threshold required to apply. That funding was used to support employees who were paid to not come into work at a time revenues had collapsed. They were definitely not profitable at the time of the lockdown when they applied for the subsidy, but you are saying they were profitable when they applied which is incorrect. Which part of that are you not understanding?

I'm curious - do you think shareholders should pay employees to sit at home based on a Government imposed lockdown? If so, on what basis? IMO if the Government imposes the lockdown then they pay either though subsidies or through higher dole payments, and I think we all agree mass layoffs was not a good option.

If you think a business can be profitable with no sales and fixed overheads then please share with us your magical recipe for business success. Subsequent dividends were paid from earnings earned after the lockdown was removed, not while they were applying for the subsidy as you are implying. You do understand a business is capable of making losses in one period and then profits in another...do you?

You can claim victim hood and being chased out of this thread all you like, but if you stay on topic and relevant then this won't happen. As others have said, start a thread in the appropriate place for a debate on the wage subsidy - it does not belong here.

[bull....]

It's not about opinions of irrelevant internet sources (per your later post) or morals; it is about what is lawful. Who gets decide morality? That is a question fraught with difficulty as indicated by other posters who mention a certain hijab-wearing politician.

HLG did not "take advantage of a high trust system". The Government imposed lockdown resulted in a fall in sales for HLG well in excess of the threshold required to apply. That funding was used to support employees who were paid to not come into work at a time revenues had collapsed. They were definitely not profitable at the time of the lockdown when they applied for the subsidy, but you are saying they were profitable when they applied which is incorrect. Which part of that are you not understanding?

I'm curious - do you think shareholders should pay employees to sit at home based on a Government imposed lockdown? If so, on what basis? IMO if the Government imposes the lockdown then they pay either though subsidies or through higher dole payments, and I think we all agree mass layoffs was not a good option.

If you think a business can be profitable with no sales and fixed overheads then please share with us your magical recipe for business success. Subsequent dividends were paid from earnings earned after the lockdown was removed, not while they were applying for the subsidy as you are implying. You do understand a business is capable of making losses in one period and then profits in another...do you?

You can claim victim hood and being chased out of this thread all you like, but if you stay on topic and relevant then this won't happen. As others have said, start a thread in the appropriate place for a debate on the wage subsidy - it does not belong here.

hallensteins wage subsidy is relevant to this thread obviously you and the like dont like it being raised because of your vested interest and potential lack of understanding about whats right and whats wrong

[Balance]

hallensteins wage subsidy is relevant to this thread obviously you and the like dont like it being raised because of your vested interest and potential lack of understanding about whats right and whats wrong

Coming from bull who does not even know that Fulton Hogan is a public company 🤣

What about the hijab? Is it right for Cindy to continue to wear the hijab or is it wrong?

[bull....]

Coming from bull who does not even know that Fulton Hogan is a public company 藍

What about the hijab?

i dont think hijab is relevant to hallensteins is it? do they even sell them ? i suggest you try the nike store they sell the nike pro womans hijab

[Beagle]

Here is an appropriate off market thread to discuss the moral issue of companies paying back the wage subsidy and my initial thoughts are contained in my opening post.
You can expect a very robust debate on this subject from me in that thread.
https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?11929-Should-companies-who-were-perfectly-entitled-to-claim-the-wage-subsidy-pay-it-back&p=856336#post856336

I believe the majority have clearly spoken and would like the moral discussion taken to its own separate thread

[bull....]

These "toxic" threads share many similarities and are quite easily identified. Here are a few pointers :-
Watch for a preponderance of overly loyal extremely positive contributions.
Any negative posters are "run off the thread".
When negative posters are accused of "downramping" you can be sure that all objectivity has been lost.
Look out for multitudinous "cut and paste" entries of scarcely relevant articles from the net.
Beware of threads where anyone posting a negative comment is personally attacked.
Dissenting views should be encouraged, not rubbished. We learn nothing from those that agree with us.
Watch for comments on "ignorant" selling by institutions, techies etc - by people that think they know better.

wise words from mr p thx for sharing moka

[Balance]

Here is an appropriate off market thread to discuss the moral issue of companies paying back the wage subsidy and my initial thoughts are contained in my opening post.
You can expect a very robust debate on this subject from me in that thread.
https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?11929-Should-companies-who-were-perfectly-entitled-to-claim-the-wage-subsidy-pay-it-back&p=856336#post856336

I believe the majority have clearly spoken and would like the moral discussion taken to its own separate thread

Well done, Beagle.

You and Ferg are to be commended on your patience and forbearance in replying to and putting up with the leftist sanctimonious Cindy apologists like moka and bull.

[Beagle]

Greed and Envy are both ugly things. Some people don't seem to understand that and are making complete fools of themselves rehashing the same issue over and over and over again. Deeds not words...get a life for goodness sake.

[Waltzing]

off topic: got another objection today. edited removed statements, ill be a RED one soon. Honestly they should remove the option as im sure it doesnt work. While we are stuck here in NZ we dont want to offend the shaky isles.


It would be interesting to know what testing HLG do in focus groups to decide what the average customers is going to buy.

Does anyone have any inside knowledge on the retail purchase process? and how in depth this is as with such large amounts of money at stake in the buying program it would be interesting to know how random this process is or how scientific.

[Beagle]

My understanding mate is that HLG's buying managers are very cool and trendy types who really know their stuff when it comes to knowing what's hot and what will sell.
Have a look at the Glassons summer collection on their website, you'll see what I mean. HLG to the best of my knowledge have the highest stock turn of any listed retailer. What they buy usually sells very well. I would imagine there's some really serious pent up buying demand in Melbourne and now that people can go shopping they most certainly will...and with a vengeance !
Plenty have money but can't travel. Their mortgage is at an unprecedented low rate and they WILL spend on retail !

[Waltzing]

I think its clear i spend to much time in the country side and not enough in cities or at the races! I would make a hopeless buyer!

Your comments are almost making me a full time professional whatcha of this stock when i should be taking a greater interest in europe right now. Ive almost got HLG fever due to your fervour for the stock! This is a casual forum is it? or have i not understood its purpose as it does not display active live statistical data and require a paid sub.

[Beagle]

I think its clear i spend to much time in the country side and not enough in cities or at the races! I would make a hopeless buyer!

Your comments are almost making me a full time professional whatcha of this stock when i should be taking a greater interest in europe right now. Ive almost got HLG fever due to your fervour for the stock! This is a casual forum is it? or have i not understood its purpose as it does not display active live statistical data and require a paid sub.

LOL You should go to the annual meeting. Rumor has it that many of the senior buyers and management are extremely good looking and could easily double as models modeling the swimwear. Oh my goodness, that's something I would buy an AIR ticket to see :D Would be fun to talk to Tim Glasson too. I should head down there to the annual meeting this year now I have "a few" shares.

[Waltzing]

we held a few thousand back.. checked one of the portfolios..they arnt all up on screens at once as the server update is not real time.. updating has occured and we have some still... can attend AGM prehaps but the next 6 months is very very hectic.


This time we have the trading range at 5.80 to 7.50 for the next 12 months based on your estimates.

As you know we have had these share for over 15 years and will hold again with a month im sure.. ASX and europe have taken the profits from here to there.

many thanks for your public comments when your valuable time can be employed else where.

note: vol again today - KMD over 1 Mil - hlg ... virtually nothing...

[Beagle]

I understand your frustration on the liquidity front mate. North of an average of 19% annual compound growth rate in eps the last 4 years, a forward PE of just 10 by my estimate for a company growing at that rate and a gross yield of 11.5% are compelling metrics however. For what its worth I just chip away at it accumulating when I am building a position. I have more now than I have ever held in the past. That yield is just insanely good for where interest rates are now.
That huge dividend coming just before Christmas is going to be put to very good use and enjoyed.

[Ferg]

Here is some light relief. I can't tell if the Simply Wall Street website is a ramper, a shyster or if it is for real, but they have a "fair value" for HLG of $32.79 per share. That is not a typo and it isn't quoted in pesos.

https://simplywall.st/stocks/nz/retail/nzx-hlg/hallenstein-glasson-holdings-shares#valuation

On a more serious note: talk of inclusion in the NZX50 is extremely premature. For inclusion you need to meet a number of criteria for multiple consecutive quarters, and you need to make it to position 44 or 46 (can't recall), not just scrape in at 50, to be included. They are a long way from that, plus I'm not sure they are first in the queue. By the way, I believe dual listing in Australia to increase liquidity may harm HLG's chances for inclusion given dual listed stocks are devalued to the NZ component of their business for the purposes of inclusion in the NZX50.

[nztx]

we held a few thousand back.. checked one of the portfolios..they arnt all up on screens at once as the server update is not real time.. updating has occured and we have some still... can attend AGM prehaps but the next 6 months is very very hectic.


This time we have the trading range at 5.80 to 7.50 for the next 12 months based on your estimates.

As you know we have had these share for over 15 years and will hold again with a month im sure.. ASX and europe have taken the profits from here to there.

many thanks for your public comments when your valuable time can be employed else where.

note: vol again today - KMD over 1 Mil - hlg ... virtually nothing...

A sign of Stakeholder satisfaction in HLG ? ;)

Bodes well for further HLG SP appreciation .. surely ?

Have you considered that there are twice as many KMD shares on issue now to be considered
for any dividend ? Assuming all goes well - expect at best half the dividend previously & possibly following
in past KMD dividend tradition - at least one of the two KMD Div's to be bare of any Imputation credits
(the IRD 33% W/Tax knife applied to it) assuming they resume paying 2 Divs a year as in past years..

One of the consequences of the Cap Raise to rescue things for KMD in midst of the Covid-19 slump
late March - early April 20, with heavy dilution of holders pre Cap Raise - holders must now wear lower
cps Div as ongoing cost of the exercise.. unless trading is something north of exponentally astounding..

[Waltzing]

Expect the Div for KMD to be well below previous.

KMD is the trader stock of the two for sure and HLG a longer interval investment . yes we agree with you.

[James108]

A compound growth rate of 19% in last 4 years or 1.7% in last 14 years, really makes you think....

[Beagle]

A compound growth rate of 19% in last 4 years or 1.7% in last 14 years, really makes you think....

Sure does...Glassons has really taken off as a brand in recent years in Australia that's for sure ! Huge market and huge opportunity for ongoing strong growth.

I topped up even more this afternoon and if that helps burn anyone who is short, well that would really make my day !!

Might get a few more next week too.

[Waltzing]

Thank you for supporting the stock price! BB+.

still wondering where that MET money has gone.....

[James108]

Huge growth out of Australia but HLG were doing similar EPS (inflation adjusted) in 2006. I guess that means there is room for even more growth!

[Beagle]

Thank you for supporting the stock price! BB+.

still wondering where that MET money has gone.....

Its going to be a bumper December dividend for the Beagle household that's for sure ! Wow...that's a lot of incoming cash due next month :ohmy:
On your second point, looking at the chart in the last two weeks you'd be easily forgiven for thinking MET shareholders simply chose MEL to reinvest in the most similar alternate stock ticker handle they could find !

Huge market James, more than 5 times the size and they still have less Glassons stores in Aussie than here.

[Waltzing]

Very disappointing ... lucky we lightened OCA until some good news and then hopefully those investing in MEL will regret there investment...

MEL and MCY the new blue water investments ... we used to trade those stocks and we regret we stopped..

Expecting opportunities in HLG as the USA melts down in a complete over run of the health system.

expect some very heavy pressure on the DOW in january and feb.

[Beagle]

Yes it hasn't escaped my attention that HLG's sales are in N.Z. and Aust which in terms of the virus are in vastly better shape than most of the rest of the world.
I am expecting a strong test of the upper $6.50 resistance level in the next few weeks.

US will have to go into lockdown for a month or so, no choice.

[Waltzing]

We have been expecting just this :

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/covid-19-high-demand-slow-ports-behind-delivery-delays-freight-boss/ar-BB1aYrJH?ocid=mailsignout&li=BBqdg4K

Regards to US the famous DR Fauci says no lock down if they can do it right... well we give that a fat chance there is a new joke in our camp ground (local bubble up the long road drive) that NZ does not have a Ghost Buster team complete with vehicles to lock down buildings and contains the local kiwis running around inside and out...

The farce over the auckland apartments is a case study in how long NZ has had to create the Ghost Buster Team response units and so far not one of these high response teams has made it out of the big new Covid head quarters on to a motor way near anywhere...

No amount of QE can keep the market up if cases go sky high. Theres a new insanity afoot and its in the air waves.

History repeats itself . We have made good profits as Mr Quest would say from HLG share price repeating itself based on events in the market.

PS: i can feel big red notifications coming anytime...:eek2:

[Beagle]

That's the beauty of HLG mate. They have been around for more than 73 years and are highly experienced at dealing with all sorts of challenges.
The exchange rate is very high which will help Autumn and winter stock purchases and there will be a lot less discounting this year which will really help margins.
Tim Glasson with his just over 20% stake has his owners eye very firmly on the ball. I get a lot of reassurance from that.

[iceman]

Yes it hasn't escaped my attention that HLG's sales are in N.Z. and Aust which in terms of the virus are in vastly better shape than most of the rest of the world.
I am expecting a strong test of the upper $6.50 resistance level in the next few weeks.

US will have to go into lockdown for a month or so, no choice.

We are increasingly hearing about difficulties in accessing stock from various industries. I heard from a mate that works at ITM that they are fast running out of stock of building materials and delivery times that used to be 1-2 months are already up to 5-6 months. He believes it will seriously slow down housebuilding this summer. Some shipping companies have or are considering canceling some NZ routes and are bypassing little old NZ because of our very stringent COVID port controls and small market.
I wonder if this is already affecting HLG as well !

[Cyclical]

We are increasingly hearing about difficulties in accessing stock from various industries. I heard from a mate that works at ITM that they are fast running out of stock of building materials and delivery times that used to be 1-2 months are already up to 5-6 months. He believes it will seriously slow down housebuilding this summer. Some shipping companies have or are considering canceling some NZ routes and are bypassing little old NZ because of our very stringent COVID port controls and small market.
I wonder if this is already affecting HLG as well !

Hope this isn't the reality, or if it is, that it's short lived...would have some pretty big repercussions for our economy.

[Balance]

Clothings are generally high margin relatively light weight and non bulky items (especially summer wear) so air freight is a realistic alternative?

[Beagle]

Clothings are generally high margin relatively light weight and non bulky items (especially summer wear) so air freight is a realistic alternative?

Not much fabric in these...I could scarcely believe a good friend of mine suggested tongue in cheek that HLG could keep raising their profit margins more and more and more by using less and less and less fabric https://www.glassons.com/offer/swim-separates-2-for-30-338?s=SORT_RELEVANCE
:blush: I suggested management are already on to pushing the boundaries to a pretty "fine line" in that regard !

[iceman]

Clothings are generally high margin relatively light weight and non bulky items (especially summer wear) so air freight is a realistic alternative?

Hopefully, but we are also seeing huge increases in airfreight charges and very limited space. For example its very difficult to get our fresh lamb to Europe for Christmas. I worry that we are about to see a significant negative economic shock in NZ due to this but hopefully I'm wrong

[Beagle]

Hopefully, but we are also seeing huge increases in airfreight charges and very limited space. For example its very difficult to get our fresh lamb to Europe for Christmas. I worry that we are about to see a significant negative economic shock in NZ due to this but hopefully I'm wrong

I think Tim Glasson and his team are well accomplished with handling logistical challenges. Freight costs as a challenge are mentioned in page 4 of the annual report.

[Scrunch]

I think Tim Glasson and his team are well accomplished with handling logistical challenges. Freight costs as a challenge are mentioned in page 4 of the annual report.

So with Air NZ also having a lot of experience handling logistical challenges are you now long not short them? If the volume available through sea freight drops, its going to be a big problem. The cargo space in a plane hold is just not the same as in a cargo ship.

[winner69]

Mention of the Annual Report made me have a closer look

So glad they now include a few pages on Sustainability. People, Planet and Product a good framework to start.

Has this been included because Mary thinks it’s more important than previous MDs did

Besides the discussion on bad fabrics, waste and slave labour it’s good to see HLG also have a diversity policy that ensures they have a diverse and inclusive workforce.

https://www.hallensteinglasson.co.nz/files/Diversity-and-Inclusion-Policy.pdf

[Beagle]

So with Air NZ also having a lot of experience handling logistical challenges are you now long not short them? If the volume available through sea freight drops, its going to be a big problem. The cargo space in a plane hold is just not the same as in a cargo ship.

At some stage AIR will be a speculative buy but we need to see some definite glimmer of light at the end of the Covid tunnel. I think Pfizer's announcement this week amounts to the possibility of a glimmer of light but time will tell and speaking of logistical challenges the difficulties with up tooling sufficient manufacturing capacity and then distributing this throughout the world and storing it at -75 degrees cannot be underestimated !. First AIR have to undertake a large cash issue to get their balance sheet into reasonable shape and I think the risk reward balance is skewed heavily towards risk until at the very earliest that's behind the company.

[Beagle]

Mention of the Annual Report made me have a closer look

So glad they now include a few pages on Sustainability. People, Planet and Product a good framework to start.

Has this been included because Mary thinks it’s more important than previous MDs did

Besides the discussion on bad fabrics, waste and slave labour it’s good to see HLG also have a diversity policy that ensures they have a diverse and inclusive workforce.

https://www.hallensteinglasson.co.nz/files/Diversity-and-Inclusion-Policy.pdf

I thought you'd enjoy pages 10-13 of the annual report ;) If you go onto www.hallensteinglasson.co.nz/sustainability you can download the whole 61 page report and really fill your boots to your hearts content.

[Snow Leopard]

We are increasingly hearing about difficulties in accessing stock from various industries. I heard from a mate that works at ITM that they are fast running out of stock of building materials and delivery times that used to be 1-2 months are already up to 5-6 months. He believes it will seriously slow down housebuilding this summer. Some shipping companies have or are considering canceling some NZ routes and are bypassing little old NZ because of our very stringent COVID port controls and small market.
I wonder if this is already affecting HLG as well !

It would be a shame if you all end up with "My partner went pressie shopping at Hallensteins and all I got was this T-shirt" T-shirts.

Clothing bundled up for transport is pretty dense freight.