If National wins ...

[Panda-NZ-]

Compared to the 5 leaders.. throwing people out there and hoping one sticks.

[fungus pudding]

After reading your comments I listened to the whole interview. Personally I didn't Jack was "feral" at all (I've seen him let the dogs out and this wasn't one of those times), in fact his questions were mostly insightful and progressed across a far wider range of topics than many of the soundbite interviews and clickbait articles in the media this week. And Mr Luxon I thought did an admirable job of answering those questions, though whether people will like his answers or not is another matter.

I wouldn't disagree with that summary at all. So far I like what I see of Luxon.

[Panda-NZ-]

Should have been asked how old the earth is in his opinion.

[Panda-NZ-]

Feudal stuff... similar to that bloke in Aust.

[dobby41]

Evidence right there that you have no idea at all, just a shill with unfounded comments and soundbites. Labour have done huge damage to the economy. They (the PM) got in on their 2020 covid response and it will be their 2021/22 covid response (oppressive, controlling, damn civil liberties and personal freedoms) and particularly the economic aftermath, a disaster which is just unfolding now that will get Labour voted out in 2023.

But who knows what National really think about Covid.
When there are no cases we should have opened up already, when there is a case we should have closed up already.
This is so true - from the Herald yesterday
13282

[dobby41]

It's great that National finally has a credible leader - the country deserves a real, functioning, opposition.

[BDL]

It's great that National finally has a credible leader - the country deserves a real, functioning, opposition.

Yes, and one that believes in partnership with Maori, NOT co governance, like Jacinda.

[Panda-NZ-]

Yes, and one that believes in partnership with Maori, NOT co governance, like Jacinda.

They mean the same thing lol. lets change the terms?

[BDL]

They mean the same thing lol. lets change the terms?

They don't mean the same thing at all.

[dobby41]

Yes, and one that believes in partnership with Maori, NOT co governance, like Jacinda.

What do they believe in now?
They keep changing their mind as they change leaders.
Luxon didn't believe that there should be a 'no protest' zone around abortion clinics but now he does.

He didn't believe in raising the minimum wage - now he does.
Who knows what they'll believe in tomorrow?

Some people need to get over the religion and wealth bit though.
They can make a person what they are but they aren't the person.

[Panda-NZ-]

He didn't believe in raising the minimum wage - now he does.
Who knows what they'll believe in tomorrow?

He talked about the imposts of holiday pay along with a minimum wage increase in his interview.

Why? -- theres full employment.

[BDL]

This is what a lot of New Zealanders have been waiting to hear, NOT co governance.

This will be the start of the end of this racist government.

Who won't stand up for human rights, Hong Kong or Woman's tennis sexual assault by China CCP.

"Be Kind"

[Panda-NZ-]

Do only the workers pay tax in NZ?

Lux doesn't want kiwis to have holiday pay, while he enjoys tax free gains.

[BDL]

If you don't want him to have tax free gains, Jixcinda could change the law. But she won't.
So don't blame him for using the laws as intended.

[davflaws]

Should have been asked how old the earth is in his opinion.

Are you claiming Luxon is a Biblical Literalist? A "young earther"?

I thought he performed very well, even when he pretended not to understand JTs question about the inconsistency of believing that NZers invest far too much in residential real estate, as vs something productive , while himself having 7 houses.

[Panda-NZ-]

We don't know do we --a good opportunity to ask the question.

[davflaws]

owooooo, crime of the century ! he believes there may be a power greater than himself.

You can believe in a power greater than yourself without being a biblical literalist or that the earth is less than 10000 years old.

[Panda-NZ-]

You can believe in a power greater than yourself without being a biblical literalist or that the earth is less than 10000 years old.

Another revision.. nice.

If it's watered down so as to be worthless then why believe. Learning more would have been nice given its his guiding philosophy in his life and business dealings.

[davflaws]

Another revision.. nice.

If it's watered down so as to be worthless then why believe at all. Learning more would be nice given its his guiding philosophy in life and business.

I don't understand your point. What is watered down? What do you think Luxon believes? I can understand that for many people (including me) biblical literalism and young eartherism would call rationallity into question and would be a disqualification for high office.

[Panda-NZ-]

I think he does believe in a rapture event in the future, maybe jesus returning to earth (as most evangelicals do).

Somewhat a different beast from catholiscm.

[Panda-NZ-]

Can't be any worse than Cindy.

It can always get worse. Plenty of examples in the world of that unfortunately.

[BDL]

It can always get worse. Plenty of examples in the world of that unfortunately.

I doubt it can get worse than where this little dictator is taking us.....

[Panda-NZ-]

Don't like her then vote her out. Though don't act surprised if the opposition are no different, and probably worse.

[Panda-NZ-]

Australia, UK, USA can easily beat out the "disaster" of full employment and no corona deaths.

I much prefer leadership stability too.

[justakiwi]

If you seriously believe what we have now is dictatorship, you need your head read. Sometimes I really wonder just how old some of you are. It seems that you have no knowledge of basic political systems or how they work. We have never experienced dictatorship in this country and never will. You are living in La La Land.


So you are comfortable with her dictatorship ?

[couta1]

It's great that National finally has a credible leader - the country deserves a real, functioning, opposition. Absolutely, hopefully the shambles is over.

[Baa_Baa]

Can't be any worse than Cindy. [snip] Co- governance, 3 waters, etc, no mandate for any of it.

While I agree with the sentiment albeit probably a bit less hyperbolic, the above is of course true, it could get worse under this government. They do have a mandate though, they were the elected majority and they can do whatever the heck they want to for almost two more years. Politics, making the laws. Labour were voted into this unfolding mess by the majority. I wonder how those voters feel now, and for the immediate future.

[couta1]

Should have been asked how old the earth is in his opinion. Well how about yourself, can you prove beyond a shadow of a doubt exactly how old it is? Personally I don't care if its 6000 or 6 billion yrs old cause I believe in creation either way.

[Panda-NZ-]

Well how about yourself, can you prove beyond a shadow of a doubt exactly how old it is? Personally I don't care if its 6000 or 6 billion yrs old cause I believe in creation either way.

Ricky on Noah's ark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6omFJhKr6o

[davflaws]

Well how about yourself, can you prove beyond a shadow of a doubt exactly how old it is? Personally I don't care if its 6000 or 6 billion yrs old cause I believe in creation either way.

I don't believe anyone can prove exactly how old the earth is, and someone believing in creation is not a problem per se.

But believing that the Bible is literally true and that the earth is only thousands of years old is (for me) a disqualification for high public office, because it involves a denial of rationality.

If anyone is able to perform the mental gymnastics required to ignore the mountain of evidence available, I don't want them anywhere near the levers of power.

[fungus pudding]

I don't believe anyone can prove exactly how old the earth is, and someone believing in creation is not a problem per se.

But believing that the Bible is literally true and that the earth is only thousands of years old is (for me) a disqualification for high public office, because it involves a denial of rationality.


Who believes that?

[davflaws]

Who believes that?

Not Luxon (I hope) - but this aspect of the discussion cropped up when someone suggested JT should have asked him how old he believed the earth is.

[iceman]

It will be interesting to see the "shadow cabinet" when announced by Luxon soon, in particular his front bench. I hope that, in addition to himself, Willis (Housing) & Bridges (Finance/Infrastructure), the front bench will also have Mark Mitchell (Defence ?), Erica Stanford (Immigration/Social welfare ?), Chris Bishop (Covid/Leader of the House?), Shane Reti (Health), Simeon Brown (Police/Corrections ?), Louise Upston (Education ?), Chris Penk (Justice ?), Nicola Grigg (Agriculture or trade ?), Andrew Bayly (Business/Revenue?)

Anyway, just speculation from me. It will be paramount that Luxon does this well and gets a united and powerful team behind him to really start attacking the many weak Ministers in the Government. They are very vulnerable to prolonged & well delivered attacks.
I even question whether he should give Collins (well experienced attack dog) a portfolio against a weak Minister such as Poto Williams, but Simeon Brown has been doing well there so is probably a better choice. Muller should be assigned to the backbenches and leave at the end of this term or earlier.

[winner69]

Those who don't get a portfolio of sorts will be a lonely lot methinks ...espif not on talking terms with Muller and Collins

[iceman]

A pretty good lineup, even though I had preferred a few different changes. What I am reading from this is:

Look forward to Ministerial roles (apart from the obvious):
Doocey, Brown, Kuriger, van de Molen, Penk, Grigg, Mooney, Simmonds, Watts

DCM:
Collins, Mcclay, Bennett, Woodhouse & maybe even Bayly. Don't understand what's happening with Muller. I reckon Mark Mitchell may now seriously consider running for the Auckland Mayoralty after what I find a surprisingly low ranking (14)

[Panda-NZ-]

Those who don't get a portfolio of sorts will be a lonely lot methinks ...espif not on talking terms with Muller and Collins

They are their own opposition.

Judith will probably want more to be asking questions of bridges.

[iceman]

They are their own opposition.

Judith will probably want more to be asking questions of bridges.

Too funny for an obviously paid Labour keyboard warrior. You are clearly shaking in your boots now that a credible opposition may be arising, easily exposing your Dear Leader's failings on every issue possible :p

[Panda-NZ-]

Too funny for an obviously paid Labour keyboard warrior. You are clearly shaking in your boots now that a credible opposition may be arising, easily exposing your Dear Leader's failings on every issue possible :p

NZ has heard it all before though. Maybe the 5th times the charm and they will present a united front.

[justakiwi]

They have a long row to hoe before they can be considered "credible opposition." Regardless of whether one supports the current government or not.


Too funny for an obviously paid Labour keyboard warrior. You are clearly shaking in your boots now that a credible opposition may be arising, easily exposing your Dear Leader's failings on every issue possible :p

[fungus pudding]

They have a long road to hoe before they can be considered "credible opposition." Regardless of whether one supports the current government or not.

Are they really going to hoe a road?

[Panda-NZ-]

Are they really going to hoe a road?

Don't have the skills for that as there are too many lawyers.

[justakiwi]

Auto-correct is a bitch. Fixed.


Are they really going to hoe a road?

[davflaws]

Are they really going to hoe a road?
Any reference to "street Walkers" would be disrespectful to sex workers.

[iceman]

NZ has heard it all before though. Maybe the 5th times the charm and they will present a united front.

Haha. Funny. Remember Labour in 2017. Lost the election but Winston got bribed to let an unknown MP become a PM ?

[iceman]

They have a long row to hoe before they can be considered "credible opposition." Regardless of whether one supports the current government or not.
I don’t think so. Not when fighting a Government that is increasingly being shown as completely out of their depth

[Panda-NZ-]

Haha. Funny. Remember Labour in 2017. Lost the election but Winston got bribed to let an unknown MP become a PM ?

There was a "TOP " wasted vote of 2% too.

[justakiwi]

Possibly, but don't underestimate the power of the "better the devil you know" mentality. National has a long way to go between now and the election. They need to demonstrate a cohesive, "on the same page" party front, and develop and present sensible, rational policy on which to campaign. If current non-National supporters are to be enticed to vote National, they have a heck of a lot of convincing to do yet. If they believe they are a shoe-in, and become complacent, they may be in for a shock.


I don’t think so. Not when fighting a Government that is increasingly being shown as completely out of their depth

[Panda-NZ-]

Oneroof survey says NZers blame property investors for high house prices, with foreign buyers second. The govt a more distant third.

https://www.oneroof.co.nz/news/40597

[iceman]

Oneroof survey says NZers blame property investors for high house prices, with foreign buyers second. The govt a more distant third.

https://www.oneroof.co.nz/news/40597

2/3 of New Zealanders blame property investors Most of them property investors themselves. Really great “survey” ����

[Panda-NZ-]

Most own a house, they're not investors.

[Blue Skies]

We expected much better from Luxon than that!
Will need to polish up his debating skills.
Adern made him look weak, unbelievably lost his question at one stage, left shuffling through his papers & apologising to the House.
And stood up a couple of times to speak (out of turn) & had to sit straight back down again. Maybe some coaching from Chris Bishop or Simon Bridges needed.

He shouldn't underestimate Adern again, she is a superb debater, all over detail, quick on her feet, & like a good debater turned his questions against him.
Still its early days.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/national-leader-chris-luxon-takes-on-jacinda-ardern-in-first-parliament-showdown/3GRHZEY6HH54T3P7YRQPRAD2Q4/

[justakiwi]

Yep. Watching right now and he is already clearly out of his depth. He does not seem to have sufficient experience or understanding of the debating process, which is probably understandable, but someone needs to give him a crash course quickly.

Jacinda is eating him alive.


We expected much better from Luxon than that!
Will need to polish up his debating skills.
Adern made him look weak, unbelievably lost his question at one stage, left shuffling through his papers & apologising to the House.
And stood up a couple of times to speak (out of turn) & had to sit straight back down again. Maybe some coaching from Chris Bishop or Simon Bridges needed.

He shouldn't underestimate Adern again, she is a superb debater, all over detail, quick on her feet, & like a good debater turned his questions against him.
Still its early days.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/national-leader-chris-luxon-takes-on-jacinda-ardern-in-first-parliament-showdown/3GRHZEY6HH54T3P7YRQPRAD2Q4/

[Sir Ten]

Yep. Watching right now and he is already clearly out of his depth. He does not seem to have sufficient experience or understanding of the debating process, which is probably understandable, but someone needs to give him a crash course quickly.

Jacinda is eating him alive.

Looked like a human salt-lick

[Balance]

Yep. Watching right now and he is already clearly out of his depth. He does not seem to have sufficient experience or understanding of the debating process, which is probably understandable, but someone needs to give him a crash course quickly.

Jacinda is eating him alive.

Watched Mistress of spin in action - all BS & no delivery.

Yawn.

[justakiwi]

We know you don't like her Balance, but Luxon was floundering. He will have to get his act together very quickly if he is to present any semblance of a credible alternative. His questions were all over the place. Felt like he randomly plucked many of them out of thin air. He also needs to learn debating etiquette. It sounded very unprofessional when he asked questions beginning with "Does she.....?" Jacinda addressed all her questions to the Speaker, which I assume is what Luxon should have done. I will give him the benefit of the doubt as obviously this is new territory for him, but if he doesn't shape up fairly smartly, he will lose credibility.

P.S what you insist on calling "spin" was actually her presenting facts, in response to questions presented. She answered his questions professionally and succinctly. He got what he asked for.


Watched Mistress of spin in action - all BS & no delivery.

Yawn.

[Balance]

We know you don't like her Balance, but Luxon was floundering. He will have to get his act together very quickly if he is to present any semblance of a credible alternative. His questions were all over the place. Felt like he randomly plucked many of them out of thin air. He also needs to learn debating etiquette. It sounded very unprofessional when he asked questions beginning with "Does she.....?" Jacinda addressed all her questions to the Speaker, which I assume is what Luxon should have done. I will give him the benefit of the doubt as obviously this is new territory for him, but if he doesn't shape up fairly smartly, he will lose credibility.

I saw right through her as a con-artist after her first 2 years, just as I saw right through the directors & managers of the finance companies during the 2000s before they all crashed.

[justakiwi]

Of course you did.

It would be really nice if you could actually respond to what has been posted, rather than just spiel forth yet another rant. The discussion here is currently about Luxon and his performance in his first House debate. Care to comment on that?


I saw right through her as a con-artist after her first 2 years, just as I saw right through the directors & managers of the finance companies during the 2000s before they all crashed.

[Crypto Crude]

13295
:t_up:cc

[dobby41]

I saw right through her as a con-artist after her first 2 years, just as I saw right through the directors & managers of the finance companies during the 2000s before they all crashed.

Well, Luxon didn't see through her - he couldn't decide which inane question to ask her next.
Again, Seymour was the most effective.
We can only hope that Luxon sorts himself out.

I, too, saw through the finance companies and managed to stop a number of friends and family from losing their shirts.

[justakiwi]

Thanks CC! My favourite Shrek character, so I'm in fine company :)

(assuming of course, that was for me - perhaps try using "reply with quote" in future. It might be a bit tricky for you so if you have any trouble give me a shout and I'll walk you through it!)



:t_up:cc

[Crypto Crude]

Thanks CC! My favourite Shrek character, so I'm in fine company :)

(assuming of course, that was for me - perhaps try using "reply with quote" in future. It might be a bit tricky for you so if you have any trouble give me a shout and I'll walk you through it!)

You do understand who they represent?
;)cc

[Blue Skies]

I saw right through her as a con-artist after her first 2 years, just as I saw right through the directors & managers of the finance companies during the 2000s before they all crashed.



Don't remind us of Key's National govt bailing out South Canterbury Finance's depositors with $1.7 billion of taxpayers money, (including interest on their deposits) instead of protecting taxpayers from an obviously failing SCF (you could see it coming, I could see it, everybody but the finance minister couldn't see it or closed his eyes to it ) by prudently limiting or withdrawing SCF from the govt guarantee deposit scheme when alarm bells started ringing. Terrible waste of taxpayers money by our experts in economic management, for purely political reasons.

[justakiwi]

Oops, my bad. This is why you need to "reply with quote" so people understand your intent. I assumed you were calling me a donkey for my previous post (in lieu of a negative rep vote).

Guess I need to stop making assumptions ;)


You do understand who they represent?
;)cc

[Panda-NZ-]

He provided me with a negative rep for a "bird brain posting" in the corona thread. funny.. :)

I must be the Kea then.

https://www.firstlighttravel.com/blog/cheeky-kea.

[Balance]

Well, Luxon didn't see through her - he couldn't decide which inane question to ask her next.
Again, Seymour was the most effective.
We can only hope that Luxon sorts himself out.

I, too, saw through the finance companies and managed to stop a number of friends and family from losing their shirts.

Maybe the difference is that I made my stance on finance companies very public at various investment seminars & conferences up and down NZ - so much so that several finance companies made formal complaints to the firm I worked for.

[dobby41]

Maybe the difference is that I made my stance on finance companies very public at various investment seminars & conferences up and down NZ - so much so that several finance companies made formal complaints to the firm I worked for.

I don't see what difference that makes to the thread.
You imply that your insight is more valuable.
Like you saw through Covid as just the flu and will be over in 2 months (170k deaths you said).
Very insightful.

[Balance]

I don't see what difference that makes to the thread.
You imply that your insight is more valuable.
Like you saw through Covid as just the flu and will be over in 2 months (170k deaths you said).
Very insightful.

Yup - like you see Clueless Cindy as your one source of truth.

I am not afraid to stick my neck out when I assess something or someone as being a con. That’s the difference.

And Cindy is a con. A spin mistress of no substance taking NZ down a destructive divisive economic & racist path.

[SBQ]

Don't remind us of Key's National govt bailing out South Canterbury Finance's depositors with $1.7 billion of taxpayers money, (including interest on their deposits) instead of protecting taxpayers from an obviously failing SCF (you could see it coming, I could see it, everybody but the finance minister couldn't see it or closed his eyes to it ) by prudently limiting or withdrawing SCF from the govt guarantee deposit scheme when alarm bells started ringing. Terrible waste of taxpayers money by our experts in economic management, for purely political reasons.

During that time, I had relatives that invested in Hanover Finance (and another subsidiary by another relative). If I recall correctly, they only got like 10% back on the total $ they invested. It happened to so quick too when they kept rolling their previous year's deposit, they added more and BOOM. Insolvency and National didn't bail them out. I guess if you're a bank, you get preferential treatment than a real estate investment holding. The strange thing, why did the creditors force sale considering how much real estate prices have gone up in Auckland over the past 10+ years.

[justakiwi]

Oh the irony. This coming from the Master of Spin himself.


A spin mistress of no substance

[Balance]

Oh the irony. This coming from the Master of Spin himself.

Ah, from she who swallows Cindy’s spin whole!

[justakiwi]

That is one huge assumption to make buddy. Yes, I voted Labour, but don't automatically assume I support everything they do, or every decision they make. Because I don't.


Ah, from she who swallows Cindy’s spin whole!

[Balance]

That is one huge assumption to make buddy. Yes, I voted Labour, but don't automatically assume I support everything they do, or every decision they make. Because I don't.

You voted her in (yes, that's the main reason) and she now spins her way into turning NZ into a lesser, poorer, divided and race based country.

You don't get to choose what policies she implements - it's the power brokers and the Maori cabal behind her who do.

[dobby41]

That is one huge assumption to make buddy. Yes, I voted Labour, but don't automatically assume I support everything they do, or every decision they make. Because I don't.

Arguing with Balance is arguing with an idiot - give it up for your own sanity.

[Balance]

Arguing with Balance is arguing with an idiot - give it up for your own sanity.

And debating with you with your indoctrinated Cindy mindset is most rewarding - showing to all what a bunch of mindless devotees you all are. :t_up:

[justakiwi]

You are 100% correct.


Arguing with Balance is arguing with an idiot - give it up for your own sanity.

[Joshuatree]

Yup - like you see Clueless Cindy as your one source of truth.

I am not afraid to stick my neck out when I assess something or someone as being a con. That’s the difference.

And Cindy is a con. A spin mistress of no substance taking NZ down a destructive divisive economic & racist path.


Neck!What neck,just a talking head,floating around like a Cheshire cat with no grin.Folks you are debating with another ego out of control,always right.Most people grow out of this tiny tot/teen state,this balance entity,emoji hasn't ,it thrives on attention, and hot air and fear of female humans.It needs a cork.

[Balance]

Neck!What neck,just a talking head,floating around like a Cheshire cat with no grin.Folks you are debating with another ego out of control,always right.Most people grow out of this tiny tot/teen state,this balance entity,emoji hasn't ,it thrives on attention, and hot air and fear of female humans.It needs a cork.

Out comes indoctrinated Cindy devotee #3 - as clueless as Cindy and as misguided as all the others.

[justakiwi]

That much is blatantly obvious.


.... and fear of female humans.

[Balance]

That much is blatantly obvious.

Two mindless & clueless dejected bitter females reaffirming their prejudices.

[artemis]

Arguing with Balance is arguing with an idiot - give it up for your own sanity.

I think what you are saying is there is no point debating with someone you disagree with, just call them idiots and out of control egos. There's a lot of that about these days.

And actually there is a lot of spin emanating from the Beehive, even the MSM are picking up on it. Not often, but occasionally. And polls are shifting, so that is actual voters starting to wonder.

How about debating that?

[Panda-NZ-]

I think what you are saying is there is no point debating with someone you disagree with, just call them idiots and out of control egos. There's a lot of that about these days.

And actually there is a lot of spin emanating from the Beehive, even the MSM are picking up on it. Not often, but occasionally. And polls are shifting, so that is actual voters starting to wonder.

How about debating that?

Every new politician has a honeymoon period, maybe except for Judith.

[dobby41]

How about debating that?

That would be a good idea.
Repeating the same stuff (as per a certain poster) isn't debate - in my view. You may have a different view and are, of course, free to have and express that.

[westerly]

Two mindless & clueless dejected bitter females reaffirming their prejudices.

But you confirm your prejudices with every post. All rather boring . Yawn

westerly

[Balance]

As insightful a cartoon as it’s possible to get about Cindy :


P.M's Xmas wish list ---

13308

[tim23]

But you confirm your prejudices with every post. All rather boring . Yawn

westerly

Spot on - I Haven’t had a sticky at this section for weeks - nothing changes Balance and Gus - brothers in arms

[Balance]

Spot on - I Haven’t had a sticky at this section for weeks - nothing changes Balance and Gus - brothers in arms

And the weak mind brigade of dobby41, tim23, westerly, justakiwi, joshuatree and panda-NZ, so easily manipulated and indoctrinated by Cindy spin, can be counted upon to always surface like a sewage rate pack to defend the Clueless one - by using spin!

I find it most satisfying! :t_up:

[davflaws]

And the weak mind brigade of dobby41, tim23, westerly, justakiwi, joshuatree and panda-NZ, so easily manipulated and indoctrinated by Cindy spin, can be counted upon to always surface like a sewage rate pack to defend the Clueless one - by using spin!

I find it most satisfying! :t_up:

I'm feeling discriminated against! I hope you are not in breach of the HRA.

[justakiwi]

And this is pretty much the crux of the matter isn't it? You stir **** purely for the sake of it, because you simply enjoy the drama.

Which is why you are now going back on my ignore list. I suggest others follow suit.

Merry Christmas Balance!

(from one of the strong, far from clueless, sometimes dejected but never bitter, females, you are so intimidated by)



I find it most satisfying! :t_up:

[tim23]

Two mindless & clueless dejected bitter females reaffirming their prejudices.
Gee - if you meant this it says it all pretty crass.

[dobby41]

And the weak mind brigade of dobby41, tim23, westerly, justakiwi, joshuatree and panda-NZ, so easily manipulated and indoctrinated by Cindy spin, can be counted upon to always surface like a sewage rate pack to defend the Clueless one - by using spin!

I find it most satisfying! :t_up:

When reasoned arguments fail bring out the insults.
Will you bring out more false quotes as well?

[Balance]

When reasoned arguments fail bring out the insults.
Will you bring out more false quotes as well?

What false quotes?

Cindy & her team of spinners are your one source of truth - that is so clear from your postings!

[Balance]

And this is pretty much the crux of the matter isn't it? You stir **** purely for the sake of it, because you simply enjoy the drama.

Which is why you are now going back on my ignore list. I suggest others follow suit.

Merry Christmas Balance!

(from one of the strong, far from clueless, sometimes dejected but never bitter, females, you are so intimidated by)

Merry Christmas, justakiwi and may good things happen for you over the festive season.

Far from intimidated by strong females, I have great admiration and utmost respect for leaders like Angela Merkel, Golda Meir, Margaret Thatcher, Indira Gandhi and Tsai Ing-Wen. I also respect Helen Clark even though I disagree with her politics. Leaders of substance with unwavering convictions of what they want/wanted their countries to be and who stand/stood on their own platforms with conviction and courage.

Compare and contrast with Cindy - clueless, useless and controlled from behind by Labour power brokers and the Maori cabal. She is a spinning mouse of no substance! Incapable of delivering anything but spin. There is nothing intimidating about her - she is but a vassal of those who are driving NZ towards a divisive, poorer and race based future.

[tim23]

Merry Christmas, justakiwi and may good things happen for you over the festive season.

Far from intimidated by strong females, I have great admiration and utmost respect for leaders like Angela Merkel, Golda Meir, Margaret Thatcher, Indira Gandhi and Tsai Ing-Wen. I also respect Helen Clark even though I disagree with her politics. Leaders of substance with unwavering convictions of what they want/wanted their countries to be and who stand/stood on their own platforms with conviction and courage.

Compare and contrast with Cindy - clueless, useless and controlled from behind by Labour power brokers and the Maori cabal. She is a spinning mouse of no substance! Incapable of delivering anything but spin. There is nothing intimidating about her - she is but a vassal of those who are driving NZ towards a divisive, poorer and race based future.

The fact that you admire Thatcher says it all - seek help quickly

[davflaws]

The fact that you admire Thatcher says it all - seek help quickly
Nah -rhetorical bull****.

[moka]

Far from intimidated by strong females, I have great admiration and utmost respect for leaders like Angela Merkel, Golda Meir, Margaret Thatcher, Indira Gandhi and Tsai Ing-Wen. I also respect Helen Clark even though I disagree with her politics. Leaders of substance with unwavering convictions of what they want/wanted their countries to be and who stand/stood on their own platforms with conviction and courage.

Compare and contrast with Cindy - clueless, useless and controlled from behind by Labour power brokers and the Maori cabal. She is a spinning mouse of no substance! Incapable of delivering anything but spin. There is nothing intimidating about her - she is but a vassal of those who are driving NZ towards a divisive, poorer and race based future. I think, and so do others (see below) that Jacinda is a leader of substance, who has an unwavering conviction of what she wants NZ to be and who stands on her own platform with conviction and courage. The problem is that you don’t agree with her agenda. If she was really delivering nothing you wouldn’t be so obsessed with her. You would just ignore her.

“Leadership Analysis:
Leading a nation with a population of only five million people in a remote part of the world does not often attract worldwide attention. Jacinda Ardern, on the other hand, is everything from average. It’s no secret that New Zealanders have looked up to the prime minister because of her humble and sympathetic personality, which puts her in a league of her own.

Jacinda Ardern is a powerful and successful leader because of her qualities such as solidarity, responding to challenges effectively, showing genuine concerns, acknowledges her weaknesses, works for women rights, being down to Earth, showing kindness, empathy, and compassion, her honesty, and agility, her standing for the right in every situation, and passion for climate change.”

https://academicsaid.com/leadership-analysis-the-leadership-of-jacinda-ardern/

[Balance]

I think, and so do others (see below) that Jacinda is a leader of substance, who has an unwavering conviction of what she wants NZ to be and who stands on her own platform with conviction and courage. The problem is that you don’t agree with her agenda. If she was really delivering nothing you wouldn’t be so obsessed with her. You would just ignore her.

“Leadership Analysis:
Leading a nation with a population of only five million people in a remote part of the world does not often attract worldwide attention. Jacinda Ardern, on the other hand, is everything from average. It’s no secret that New Zealanders have looked up to the prime minister because of her humble and sympathetic personality, which puts her in a league of her own.

Jacinda Ardern is a powerful and successful leader because of her qualities such as solidarity, responding to challenges effectively, showing genuine concerns, acknowledges her weaknesses, works for women rights, being down to Earth, showing kindness, empathy, and compassion, her honesty, and agility, her standing for the right in every situation, and passion for climate change.”

https://academicsaid.com/leadership-analysis-the-leadership-of-jacinda-ardern/

Compiled and put together unquestionably by one of the hundreds of state paid spin artists employed by Cindy & Labour government using taxpayers funds.

Moka being one of them btw.

From low grade journalism vogue etc etc and from 2020 before the star dust fissipated, 3 Waters, delta outbreak, misinformation, deviousness and failures to deliver on all fronts surfaced so clearly in 2021 for all to see.

Academic said - indeed enough said about the ultimate spin mistress in the Western world, Clueless Cindy!

All spin and no delivery.

[iceman]

[FONT=&]I think, and so do others (see below) that Jacinda is a leader of substance, who has an unwavering conviction of what she wants NZ to be and who stands on her own platform with conviction and courage. The problem is that you don’t agree with her agenda. If she was really delivering nothing you wouldn’t be so obsessed with her. You would just ignore her.


The problem many people have is she has never told us what her supposedly "unwavering conviction" is and put her nation changing policies up as election promises and asked the country whether they want them. She won the last election without any mention of most of the damaging policies she is now ramming through, think 3 waters, separate maori health system etc etc. She has been misleading and deceitful.
Many of the left leaning commentators on here attacked Key viciously for the partial sales of the power companies and Air NZ, sales that were great for both NZ Inc and the powercos. The difference is he knew it would be a contentious policy so he went to the electorate with it and got the mandate. Jacinda has done no such thing.

[moka]

'50 Shades of Beige': Labour's Grant Robertson gives National's leader Chris Luxon his induction roasting.

Video of Deputy Prime Minister Grant Robertson's traditional roasting of new National leaders is worth watching.

Robertson kicked off by referring to the most recent chapter in the "National Party's Grab A Seat sale" before referring to Luxon's decision to use a black Mercedes to drive the 100m journey from his apartment to Parliament on the day he was elected leader.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/50-shades-of-beige-labours-grant-robertson-gives-nationals-leader-chris-luxon-his-induction-roasting/QWHQDWYDRPVPDPRZY272GDEGBA/

[iceman]

'50 Shades of Beige': Labour's Grant Robertson gives National's leader Chris Luxon his induction roasting.

Video of Deputy Prime Minister Grant Robertson's traditional roasting of new National leaders is worth watching.

Robertson kicked off by referring to the most recent chapter in the "National Party's Grab A Seat sale" before referring to Luxon's decision to use a black Mercedes to drive the 100m journey from his apartment to Parliament on the day he was elected leader.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/50-shades-of-beige-labours-grant-robertson-gives-nationals-leader-chris-luxon-his-induction-roasting/QWHQDWYDRPVPDPRZY272GDEGBA/

The Leader of the Opposition, same as the PM, need to follow security services recommendation, whatever we think of the recommendations !! He's hardly going to go against them on the first day in the job. But good soundbites from Robinson, with the printing machines busily chugging away in the background !!

[Balance]

An appraisal of Luxon’s first week as leader of National Party by political commentators:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/457674/the-week-in-politics-christopher-luxon-s-first-test

[Balance]

Refreshing to see a new leader laying out a clear vision of how NZ should be like in the future:

https://ondemand.parliament.nz/parliament-tv-on-demand/?person=419

Scroll down to General Debate, video 4

[Panda-NZ-]

Looks and sounds rather boring. few people watch parliament TV.

[dobby41]

What false quotes?

What a short memory you must have - this false quote.
Totally abhorrent that you would make up a quote. What you say can't be trusted.
13313

[Balance]

What a short memory you must have - this false quote.
Totally abhorrent that you would make up a quote. What you say can't be trusted.
13313

If the cloak fits, wear it.

Your postings show clearly that Clueless Cindy is your one source of truth.

[moka]

I like to read the comments to get an idea of what Herald readers think of Luxon. A common theme seems to be how you talk, Jacinda and Bridges out and Luxon in. I think it says more about those posting the comments and how they see their relationships (one up, one down or parent/child relationships) than actual leadership ability.

Barry Soper: National gets what it wanted - NZ Herald (https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/barry-soper-national-gets-what-it-wanted/4WM4OMOMDOEE24TKSCXPTGTI2Q/)
Felt and sounded like an adult had finally come to talk…refreshing

At last a grown up, talking in sentences I could understand and without arm waving, head tilting, deflecting and assuming we are all idiots.

Yep. Sounded like a CEO not a kindy teacher.

Yeah it was awesome. Free from condescending tones, platitudes, and deflection. So much better than Collins too.

Living in NZ at the moment feels like being a toddler strapped into a high chair being force fed cold mushy peas by an over bearing mother. Chris is a breath of fresh air - I love the emphasis on delivery, competence, hard work, certainty - what a start!! well done. NZ is craving all of this.

Thank goodness, finally an leader with a clear and concise delivery:
Didn’t preach
Speak down to me
Speak to me as if I am a child
In short he thinks I am an adult who wants to earn a living, look after my family, look after the climate and the country, and do as well as I can in life.

Luxon didn’t get a thing wrong. Smooth delivery, the right points “reset”. Empathised family and unity. Handled the press well. Excellent reply about his faith. Well done. Mind you i thought Todd Mullers opening speech was good too. One thing is certain National will do better under him than Collins.

Bridges lack of like ability is why he was rolled in the first place. He’s unpopular.

[moka]

If the cloak fits, wear it.

Your postings show clearly that Clueless Cindy is your one source of truth. A quick fact check. We have been here before on 26/11/21. dobby41 did not say "Clueless Cindy is my one source of truth."


dobby41 did not say "Clueless Cindy is my one source of truth" as below. When you click on the link it comes up with completely different comments. It appears that Balance has edited dobby41's original comment.

Originally Posted by dobby41 https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?p=927874#post927874) Clueless Cindy is my one source of truth

[tim23]

I like to read the comments to get an idea of what Herald readers think of Luxon. A common theme seems to be how you talk, Jacinda and Bridges out and Luxon in. I think it says more about those posting the comments and how they see their relationships (one up, one down or parent/child relationships) than actual leadership ability.

Barry Soper: National gets what it wanted - NZ Herald (https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/barry-soper-national-gets-what-it-wanted/4WM4OMOMDOEE24TKSCXPTGTI2Q/)
Felt and sounded like an adult had finally come to talk…refreshing

At last a grown up, talking in sentences I could understand and without arm waving, head tilting, deflecting and assuming we are all idiots.

Yep. Sounded like a CEO not a kindy teacher.

Yeah it was awesome. Free from condescending tones, platitudes, and deflection. So much better than Collins too.

Living in NZ at the moment feels like being a toddler strapped into a high chair being force fed cold mushy peas by an over bearing mother. Chris is a breath of fresh air - I love the emphasis on delivery, competence, hard work, certainty - what a start!! well done. NZ is craving all of this.

Thank goodness, finally an leader with a clear and concise delivery:
Didn’t preach
Speak down to me
Speak to me as if I am a child
In short he thinks I am an adult who wants to earn a living, look after my family, look after the climate and the country, and do as well as I can in life.

Luxon didn’t get a thing wrong. Smooth delivery, the right points “reset”. Empathised family and unity. Handled the press well. Excellent reply about his faith. Well done. Mind you i thought Todd Mullers opening speech was good too. One thing is certain National will do better under him than Collins.

Bridges lack of like ability is why he was rolled in the first place. He’s unpopular.

Maybe Barry sometimes you should be spoken to like a child?

[Balance]

A quick fact check. We have been here before on 26/11/21. dobby41 did not say "Clueless Cindy is my one source of truth."

His postings show that to be the case. If the cloak fits, wear it.

[Balance]

Some media & posters here like panda-NZ have gone out of their way to demonise Luxon’s success, and the wealth he has earned in this process.

These people are quick to judge our successful entrepreneurs and businesspeople as if they have something to apologise for. They don't.

Luxon should not apologise for his success, the number of houses he has, or the car he drives. Instead, we should be grateful that someone with his background and experience is willing to serve in public office.

Yes, success brings financial rewards. But this is the result of incredibly hard work and huge personal sacrifice.

Every successful businessperson or entrepreneur I have ever met has sacrificed to get to where they have got to — late nights, time away from their families and missing milestones with their children.

Isn't making these sacrifices a trait we want in a leader?

[tim23]

Some media & posters here like panda-NZ have gone out of their way to demonise Luxon’s success, and the wealth he has earned in this process.

These people are quick to judge our successful entrepreneurs and businesspeople as if they have something to apologise for. They don't.

Luxon should not apologise for his success, the number of houses he has, or the car he drives. Instead, we should be grateful that someone with his background and experience is willing to serve in public office.

Yes, success brings financial rewards. But this is the result of incredibly hard work and huge personal sacrifice.

Every successful businessperson or entrepreneur I have ever met has sacrificed to get to where they have got to — late nights, time away from their families and missing milestones with their children.

Isn't making these sacrifices a trait we want in a leader?

You sound like Hosking in hoping he’s John Key Mark 2!

[moka]

https://bryangould.com/what-else-do-we-know-about-luxon/
“What do we know so far about Christopher (or is it to be “Chris”?) Luxon?

He was chief executive of Air New Zealand, that he is an evangelical Christian (that is, a proselytising, and not just your everyday,) Christian, and that he is a friend and political protege of John Key.

What do those sparingly released items of information add up to? The first two, taken together, present a somewhat unattractive picture – of a business leader who believes that his view of how society should be run is not only endorsed but also demanded by the God he worships.

Such a belief is well encapsulated in the words of the old hymn –
The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate,
God made them, high or lowly,
And ordered their estate.

The picture they paint is of a socially conservative man who believes that everyone “has his place” and that this is ordained by God. This seems hardly the stance of a political leader who can lead us through the manifold and rapidly changing challenges of the modern world – with all the varying needs and demands of a society that is increasingly heterogeneous, in terms of its ethnicity and sexual preference and religious belief and need for social mobility.

The “reset” he promises seems likely to mean a return to a past era, not just for the National party, but also for a country that should be preparing for a post-Covid future.

We are now sufficiently distanced from Key to recognise that he was an old-fashioned con-man – a skilled one, perhaps, but a con-man nevertheless.

Luxon may well be what you see – no more, no less – a middle-aged white male who succeeded in business, and who is burdened by most of the inflexible prejudices and ingrained beliefs that most such people typically acquire.

His one claim to suitability as leader of the country seems to be that he is not Judith Collins.’

[moka]

https://thespinoff.co.nz/the-bulletin/01-12-2021/chris-luxons-plan-for-the-national-party
(https://thespinoff.co.nz/the-bulletin/01-12-2021/chris-luxons-plan-for-the-national-party)
“In his first speech as leader, Luxon said: “I have built a career out of reversing the fortunes of under-performing companies and I’ll bring that real-world experience to this role.” However, aviation experts questioned Luxon’s description of his time as chief executive of Air New Zealand, reports Stuff. He inherited a profitable and well-run company, and then rode one of the greatest travel booms in history. His only other notable experience is as a manager at the Canadian subsidiary of Unilever. However, there’s been no indication he was ever in any position to “reverse the fortunes” of the successful global giant.”

[Panda-NZ-]

Unilever has underperformed even the Dow jones index over the last 10 years.

[Balance]

Unilever has underperformed (even) the Dow jones index over the last 10 years.

Where is your source & link that Luxon paid no tax?

You are a raging liar and your postings are worth nothing until you back up your
BS.

[Panda-NZ-]

Free speech. :)
Conservatives don't seem like it when it goes against them (see scomo's religious discrimination bill).

[Balance]

Free speech. conservatives don't seem like it when to goes against them (see scomo's religious discrimination bill).

Where is your source that Luxon paid no tax?

You are a liar.

[Panda-NZ-]

We will probably find out either way from the media sometime within these next two years.

[Balance]

We'll find out either way from the media sometime within these next two years.

Where is your source Luxon paid no tax?

You are a liar and a paid Labour Party shill.

[Panda-NZ-]

--- deleted

[Panda-NZ-]

$90k per week with no tax payable:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/127154254/christopher-luxons-property-gains-soar-as-national-promises-to-tackle-housing-crisis

[Balance]

$90k per week with no tax payable:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/127154254/christopher-luxons-property-gains-soar-as-national-promises-to-tackle-housing-crisis

That’s not what you posted and wrote about Luxon paying no tax.

You are a paid Labour Party shill and liar. To be expected from a government of incompetent losers in the real world.

[Panda-NZ-]

That’s not what you posted and wrote about Luxon paying no tax.

You are a paid Labour Party shill and liar. To be expected from a government of incompetent losers in the real world.

So negative when most things are good. It's bad for mental health.

Which you should know more about having previously tried make suicides last year political. How low can one person go?

[Balance]

So negative when most things are good. It's bad for the mental health.

Which you should know about having previously tried make suicides last year political. How low can you go?

Where’s your source that Luxon paid no tax?

To post blatant lies about someone in public life in the public arena as you do takes some nerve - of the panicking Labour type.

A paid Labour Party shill and a liar - that’s who you are.

[Panda-NZ-]

See the post(s) above.

[Balance]

I already proved it. See the posts above.

Even though I have no desire to be accountable to someone who is lacking in any form of balance.

You proved nothing.

Everyone who owns property in NZ pays no tax if they are within the bright line rule - but they have to pay tax on net rental income. And that includes all the ministers and Labour Party MPs who own rental properties.

You wrote that Luxon paid no tax - clearly intended to disparage his status as a tax paying NZer.

Then you wrote that National set up Whanau Ora to get Maori votes when it was set up by Helen Clark government. Another lie.

So you are a liar paid by the Labour Party to post lies in public forums like this.

[Balance]

Who authored the marine coastal bill if we assume whanau ora is from Labour (another Balance lie).

Whānau ora became part of government policy in November 2002, when the Ministry of Health published a strategy for Māori health. In the strategy, whānau ora meant, briefly, "healthy families".

Who was in power in 2002? Helen Clark.

[artemis]

I already proved it. See the posts above.

Even though I have no real desire to be accountable to someone who is lacking in any form of Balance.


Your post does not prove Mr Luxon pays 0 tax at all. Actually it sounds like an accusation of tax evasion so potentially libel. To be fair, I don't think you have an understanding of New Zealand's tax system so perhaps there is some excuse.

[Balance]

It's not tax evasion but the legal situation here in NZ with no cgt, fully imputed dividends among many other perks.

You can achieve zero percent using only tax avoidance.

Ducking and diving after posting lies - where is your source for Luxon not paying tax & Whanau Ora being a National Party creation to get Maori votes?

You are a paid Labour Party shill & lousy liar.

[artemis]

It's not tax evasion but the legal situation here in NZ with no cgt, fully imputed dividends among many other perks.

You can achieve 0% with tax avoidance.

That would be rather hard to do when drawing a salary, collecting rental income and possibly unimputed dividends. Not even possible to offset residential rental losses against other income any more. And it depends on the ownership entities anyway, including whether any are considered by IRD to be a trader.

You seem to trying to walk back your original claim that he pays zero tax while at the same time wanting to confirm it. Why?

[iceman]

$90k per week with no tax payable:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/127154254/christopher-luxons-property-gains-soar-as-national-promises-to-tackle-housing-crisis

Panda I'm not sure if you're mischievous or stupid, with your recent posts about Luxon not paying tax, but you've shown yourself up to be a complete fool with regard to the NZ tax system. . You've provided no evidence about your stupid claim that Luxon did not pay the tax he should have and if there is a moderator on this thread worth they're name, your posts should be removed and you thrown out. You're obviously an idiot that does not let facts get in your way.

[Balance]

Luxon's candidacy will shift the focus towards income & wealth in NZ so it is relevant for two years yet.

You posted Luxon paid no tax - period.

Where is the proof and source that Luxon paid no tax?

Changing the subject is not going to get you off the hook for knowingly making a libellous post like that, with callous intention to damage Luxon’s reputation.

Then there’s Whanau Ora which you posted was set up by National to get Maori votes

You were given several opportunities to retract but you choose to continue to lie.

What kind of sewage pond did you crawl out of?

[iceman]

You posted Luxon paid no tax - period.

Where is the proof and source that Luxon paid no tax?

Changing the subject is not going to get you off the hook on making a libellous post like that.

Then there’s Whanau Ora which you posted was set up by National to get Maori votes

You were given several opportunities to retract but you choose to continue to lie.

What kind of sewage pond did you crawl out of?

For the first time in my many years on this site. I've reported someone. Panda should not be allowed to continue with his/hers unfounded slanderous accusations. I do note how the lefties on here have okayed it with their silence

[Balance]

Free speech until it doesn't suit your limited worldview. Rather sad.

Yours is not free speech - it’s libellous lies you post.

[tim23]

For the first time in my many years on this site. I've reported someone. Panda should not be allowed to continue with his/hers unfounded slanderous accusations. I do note how the lefties on here have okayed it with their silence
You shouldn’t tell tales and you assume too much.

[iceman]

Free speech until it doesn't suit your limited worldview. Rather sad.

Again you get shown up with not knowing the difference between free speech and outright slander & untruths

[iceman]

You shouldn’t tell tales and you assume too much.

So you've shown yourself as a supporter of complete and serious lies about the Leader of the Opposition. I don't agree with you on much but never thought you would stoop this low

[tim23]

So you've shown yourself as a supporter of complete and serious lies about the Leader of the Opposition. I don't agree with you on much but never thought you would stoop this low

You’ve assumed again - I even agreed with Balance earlier today re crime - who would have thought?!

[Panda-NZ-]

There is no capital gains or real dividend tax so it isn't a stretch.

Hopefully the current opposition can provide an example of being open and transparent on this issue for voters.

[iceman]

You’ve assumed again - I even agreed with Balance earlier today re crime - who would have thought?!

What have I assumed and what tales have I told ? We have a poster saying Luxon has paid "0 tax" Are you serious ?

[Panda-NZ-]

In the stuff article I linked they said his property gains was untaxed. So take it up with them.

Even that's conservative though because it doesn't account for deductions which reduce tax on combined income.

[iceman]

In the stuff article I linked they said his property gains was untaxed. So take it up with them.

Even that's conservative though because it doesn't account for deductions which reduce tax on combined income.

Every property owner in NZ is in the same situation, due to the law in NZ. It is a complete lie to say Luxon paid "0 tax". He has probably paid more tax each and every year than you pay in your lifetime. Pull your head in and stop digging

[dobby41]

Where is your source that Luxon paid no tax?

You are a liar.

It's OK for you to post lies though?
A very deceitful person.

[dobby41]

Ducking and diving after posting lies - where is your source for Luxon not paying tax & Whanau Ora being a National Party creation to get Maori votes?

You are a paid Labour Party shill & lousy liar.

Maybe Panda-NZ learnt a lot from you?
You seem inordinately upset by the post - "you doth protest too much"!

[dobby41]

For the first time in my many years on this site. I've reported someone. Panda should not be allowed to continue with his/hers unfounded slanderous accusations. I do note how the lefties on here have okayed it with their silence

Not sure the protest will get you very far - Balance was allowed to give me a false quote.
Where does it lead if you can't even trust 'reply with quote'?

[iceman]

Not sure the protest will get you very far - Balance was allowed to give me a false quote.
Where does it lead if you can't even trust 'reply with quote'?

I do not condone that at all, nor do I condone people getting away with obviously untrue and slanderous comments

[dobby41]

I do not condone that at all, nor do I condone people getting away with obviously untrue and slanderous comments

plus one to that!

PS - I liked the Icelandverse ad from the AIR thread - I want to visit now (or maybe tomorrow or whenever, I'm easygoing).

[Panda-NZ-]

Do we really want the country to be run like a business?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/paul-catmur-do-we-really-want-the-country-to-be-run-like-a-business/DD57WCX2ADWNHPDTDP3Y6WW7JA/

The last time didn't work out too well.

[dobby41]

Do we really want the country to be run like a business?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/paul-catmur-do-we-really-want-the-country-to-be-run-like-a-business/DD57WCX2ADWNHPDTDP3Y6WW7JA/

The last time didn't work out too well.

Premium article
This is the 'business' bit

Anyway, anyhow, anywhere

Luxon has in the past declared his wish to be brand manager of New Zealand and sometimes refers to voters as "stakeholders", which aligns with the fear that he wants to run New Zealand as a business. Most evidence suggests that countries are actually best run as countries. After all, businesses are run for the express benefit of the shareholders and management, and while staff have their uses, most companies would replace them with robots given half a chance. I hope that most people would agree that our goal should be of making all citizens happy, rather than the elites rich.

[Balance]

Do we really want the country to be run like a business?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/paul-catmur-do-we-really-want-the-country-to-be-run-like-a-business/DD57WCX2ADWNHPDTDP3Y6WW7JA/

The last time didn't work out too well.

Another lie from the paid Labour Party shill liar.

Where is your source that Luxon paid no tax?

[Panda-NZ-]

Premium article
This is the 'business' bit


Mid to Large Business seems to do better under labour.

NZX 50 Nov 2008 2800
NZX 50 Sept 2017 7800 (555 gain per year in 9 years)
NZX 50 2021 12800 (1250 per year in 4 years)

Everyone seems to be better off.

[Baa_Baa]

Another lie from the paid Labour Party shill liar.

Called out many months ago, but no rebuttal, no defence, no repudiation, no reply, nothing ... says it all. Just carries on deflecting, diverting, spamming.

[Balance]

Called out many months ago, but no rebuttal, no defence, no repudiation, no reply, nothing ... says it all. Just carries on deflecting, diverting, spamming.

He will not get away with the libellous lie.

[dobby41]

Mid to Large Business seems to do better under labour.
<snip>
Everyone seems to be better off.

It isn't a matter of whether large or small companies are better off under one govt or another.
Should a country be run like a business (is it appropriate)?
Businesses are profit-oriented (though they are slowly becoming more socially or holistically aware) but countries aren't about profit and loss.

"Everyone seems better off" compared to what?
Certainly, some sectors don't look as 'better off' as other sectors.

When National was in power last they cut expenditure on Hospitals and Education (in real terms if not in the actual budget (though memory says that it was cut in absolute terms but I could be wrong there)) resulting in the slow deterioration of the sectors.
There were reasons - probably good business reasons - for that but a country isn't a business and has different key metrics.

[Panda-NZ-]

:D
Called out many months ago, but no rebuttal, no defence, no repudiation, no reply, nothing ... says it all. Just carries on deflecting, diverting, spamming.

That's not a rebuttal to independent facts.

All we ever hear from you is that everything is a disaster when many NZers don't think so. Echo chamber.

[dobby41]

He will not get away with the libellous lie.

Neither should you!

[Balance]

Called out many months ago, but no rebuttal, no defence, no repudiation, no reply, nothing ... says it all. Just carries on deflecting, diverting, spamming.

He will not get away with the libellous lie.

He is simply doing what the Labour Party does of course and think they can get away with the spinning. NZers are waking up as we can increasingly read and hear these days from the MSM.

[Balance]

Neither should you!

Clueless Cindy is your one source of truth - try refuting that.

[Balance]

:D

That's not a rebuttal to independent facts.

All we ever hear from you is that everything is a disaster when many NZers don't think so. Echo chamber.

Another lie from the paid Labour Party shill & liar.

Where is your proof that Luxon paid no tax?

And that Whanau Ora was set up by National to get Maori votes?

[Panda-NZ-]

Another lie from the paid Labour Party shill & liar.

Where is your proof that Luxon paid no tax?

And that Whanau Ora was set up by National to get Maori votes?

Could you please stop spamming the same stuff which has already been answered. Mix it up a bit.

Who knows why balance is allowed to pollute every topic with copy and paste memes.

[Balance]

Could you please stop spamming the same stuff which has already been answered. mix it up a bit.

Who knows why you are still permitted to post - one of the enduring mysteries of ST.

You have not answered - you tried deflecting, diverting and spamming.

Again, just another lie from the paid Labour Party shill & liar.

Where is your proof that Luxon paid no tax?

And that Whanau Ora was set up by National to get Maori votes?

[Panda-NZ-]

It's authored by balance so enough said. The same sort of language as a russian troll posting on youtube.

[Balance]

It's authored by balance so enough said. The same sort of language as a russian troll posting on youtube.

Again, just another lie from the paid Labour Party shill & liar.

Where is your proof that Luxon paid no tax?

And that Whanau Ora was set up by National to get Maori votes?

[Panda-NZ-]

Again, just another lie from the paid Labour Party shill & liar.

Someone needs to mod this guy out so a sensible on-topic discussion can continue.

Maybe hide this thread from him..

[Panda-NZ-]

And maybe you should get off this thread until you deny your are paid by the Labour party.

I don't feel any need to respond to bots.

[justakiwi]

OMG. This thread is now beyond ridiculous :t_down::t_down::t_down:

[Panda-NZ-]

Agreed, how is balance still here :\

[justakiwi]

I was not only referring to Balance. You are all as bad as each other. You're all behaving like 3 year olds! :angry:


Agreed, how is balance still here :\

[Panda-NZ-]

Maybe the off topic and irrelevant postings do need to be removed more pro-actively.

[Getty]

He will not get away with the libellous lie.

I have not done a Crocodile Dundee style test (yet), but I think Panda may be of the female gender.

[Getty]

Someone needs to mod this guy out so a sensible on-topic discussion can continue.

Maybe hide this thread from him..

This is a telling comment.

The right give the left a voice, because they believe in democratic principles, but the left will use any available tool to shut down the right.

[Panda-NZ-]

You shouldn't be able to attack daily other users though.

He calls me a liar every day which is rather bad for my mental wellbeing :(

[Getty]

You shouldn't be able to attack daily, other users though.

He calls me a liar every day which is rather bad for my mental health :(

Pandas are durable beasts, but they do lie around a lot.

[Panda-NZ-]

Then people can simply point it out in a mature fashion.

[justakiwi]

I have no idea whether it is Vince who "owns" the ST site, or someone else, but at the rate things are going, I wouldn't blame them if they decided to just pull the plug and shut it down. This place has gone to Hell in a hand basket, and is beyond redemption now. Bloody disappointing.

[Panda-NZ-]

If the shoe fits ..

Take the vaccine .

[Getty]

I have no idea whether it is Vince who "owns" the ST site, or someone else, but at the rate things are going, I wouldn't blame them if they decided to just pull the plug and shut it down. This place has gone to Hell in a hand basket, and is beyond redemption now. Bloody disappointing.

What a total over reaction.

This site is only lukewarm, but if you cant stand the heat in the kitchen, simply withdraw yourself from the site, or more sensibly, just the threads you dont like.

Don't expect others to throw the baby out with the bath water!

[Panda-NZ-]

Youtube and other social media is far worse unfortunately.

Hopefully an AI can be deployed to moderate forums sometime soon.

[Balance]

You shouldn't be able to attack daily other users though.

He calls me a liar every day which is rather bad for my mental wellbeing :(

Posting that Luxon paid no tax - lie.

Posting that Whanau Ora was set up by National to get Maori votes - lie.

Which part of being you being a liar do you not understand?

And I see you are now going back and have been busy trying to delete some of your posts.

[Bill Smith]

You shouldn't be able to attack daily other users though.

He calls me a liar every day which is rather bad for my mental wellbeing :(

I understand English is not your 1st language, but the solution should be clear to you. Either admit your links to labour or stop coming to this thread. Not difficult to understand is it.

[Panda-NZ-]

I don't have any links to labour (even though they are at 51%). I'm probably a swing voter.

Though after seeing scomo and boris not so much. I voted for sir john twice but left after the asset sales, huge migration and frozen kiwisaver.

All voters should reconsider their options when there is a bad choice.

[Panda-NZ-]

Plus people have to be blind not to see the strong economy with low corona numbers (unique in the world currently).

[Balance]

Plus people have to be blind not to see the strong economy with low corona numbers (unique in the world currently).

What about your lie that Luxon paid no tax?

[Balance]

I don't have any "links" to Labour (even though they are at 51%).

I voted for Sir john twice until he sold the assets after it was apparent it didn't stack up and the NZ median wage started stalling.

You posted Luxon paid no tax - lie.

You posted Whanau Ora was set up by National to get Maori votes - lie.

Once a liar, always a liar.

[Panda-NZ-]

What about your lie that Luxon paid no tax?
You posted Whanau Ora was set up by National to get Maori votes - lie.


We all understand that you have a difference of opinion so don't need to copy and paste it all the time.

[Balance]

We all understand that you have a difference of opinion and don't need to copy and paste it all the time.

There is no difference of opinion - you posted lies.

[Panda-NZ-]

There is no difference of opinion - you posted lies.
You will simply ignore so what's the point.

Will you admit we have a strong economy which is far different to the situation "National" tries to portray.

[Balance]

You will simply ignore so what's the point.

Will you admit we have a strong economy which is far different to the situation "National" tries to portray.

Ignore your lies?

Like your lie about Luxon not paying any tax?

[Panda-NZ-]

Ignore your lies?

Like your lie about Luxon not paying any tax?

Keep up with the negativity -- see how far that gets with most people in 2023.

[Balance]

Keep up with the negativity -- see how far that gets with most people in 2023.

Keep up with your lies and Clueless Cindy can keep up too with her spins and deceitful conduct.

[Panda-NZ-]

Decent article by the respected journalist Andrea vance:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/127234357/luxons-views-speak-volumes-about-his-attitude-to-women

Asking about birth control could be rather interesting for many people.

[Balance]

Decent article by the respected journalist Andrea vance:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/127234357/luxons-views-speak-volumes-about-his-attitude-to-women

Asking about birth control would be interesting.

Asking about how you lie about Luxon not paying tax would be even more interesting.

[Panda-NZ-]

Cool stuff (another copy and paste).

How does someone get to 15k content free posts while not being moderated to any extent.

[justakiwi]

Oh I can stand the heat. But you know what? I no longer want to. This place is beyond toxic.

I'm out.


.... but if you cant stand the heat in the kitchen, simply withdraw yourself from the site....

[Balance]

Cool stuff (another copy and paste).

How does someone get to 15k content free posts while not being moderated to any real extent.

How does a liar like you get to post lies so freely?

[Panda-NZ-]

How does a liar like you get to post lies so freely?

Into the basket of deplorables you go (ignore list).

Even though I tend to prefer having open discussions.

[Balance]

Into the basket of deplorables you go (ignore list).

Even though I tend to prefer having some open discussions.

Open discussions around your lies? Now that is revealing!

To be ignored by a liar like you is one of the biggest compliments any person can get.

[FTG]

How does someone get to 15k content free posts while not being moderated to any extent.


How does a liar like you get to post lies so freely?

Perhaps you should BOTH put significantly more effort into the quality of your contribution, rather than the quantity of posts?

It's intriguing to observe that despite having an entirely different membership tenure on ST, your respective run-rates for daily posts are within a cat's whisker of each other.
:cool:

[winner69]

What Chris Lee wants Luxon to do to make National great

https://www.chrislee.co.nz/taking-stock

[Panda-NZ-]

A country with very low savings rates outside of housing needs investor protectionism to stop offshore people taking ownership of key companies.

This should be be addressed under any new proposal.

[Balance]

A country with very low savings rates outside of housing needs investor protectionism to stop offshore people taking ownership of key companies.

This should be be addressed under any new proposal.

How about your lie that Luxon paid no tax?

[dobby41]

How about your lie that Luxon paid no tax?

How about your lies?
How do you reconcile that?


Clueless Cindy is your one source of truth - try refuting that.
It is impossible to refute because you have made up your mind.
My mind is quite open, I do my own research, weigh up the facts and come to my conclusions.
You prefer to sling accusations and makeup posts by false attribution of quotes.

Take a breath - this is affecting your mental health again.

[Balance]

How about your lies?
How do you reconcile that?


It is impossible to refute because you have made up your mind.
My mind is quite open, I do my own research, weigh up the facts and come to my conclusions.
You prefer to sling accusations and makeup posts by false attribution of quotes.

Take a breath - this is affecting your mental health again.

What lies?

You need to get a grip, dobby41 - you cannot tell the difference between outright lies from your fellow Labour Party shills & inferences based upon accurate assessments of postings from said shills.

[Panda-NZ-]

As I predicted Act support drops while Lab unchanged:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/national-leadership-first-poll-since-chris-luxon-took-over-national-shows-boost-at-acts-expense/Z77Z2BJBARLBANAGQYP6CIM5FA/

It's a pity the right have so many ready to adopt christian social views.

Though Mr colin craig did recieve 4% so there's a constituency out there.

[Entrep]

As I predicted Act support drops while Lab unchanged:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/national-leadership-first-poll-since-chris-luxon-took-over-national-shows-boost-at-acts-expense/Z77Z2BJBARLBANAGQYP6CIM5FA/

It's a pity the right have so many ready to adopt christian social views.

Though Mr colin craig did recieve 4% so there's a constituency out there.

Labour and the Greens staying so high while NZ continues to go to $hit is highly alarming. Cindy's PR team along with the media doing an amazing job.

[Panda-NZ-]

The opposition are not really an alternative when they wanted so many covid deaths here in 2020 and changed leader 5 or 6 times.

[Getty]

The opposition are not really an alternative when they wanted so many covid deaths here in 2020 and changed leader 5 or 6 times.

Pandaaaa, Is your abacus faulty, or have you had too much porkie fried rice?

Since 27/2/18, Nats have had 4 leaders, counting Lux.

[Balance]

The opposition are not really an alternative when they wanted so many covid deaths here in 2020 and changed leader 5 or 6 times.

What about your lie that Luxon paid no tax?

[Panda-NZ-]

Since 27/2/18, Nats have had 4 leaders, counting Lux.

There was also Sir john to bill - > then bill to Simon.

[Balance]

The opposition are not really an alternative when they wanted so many covid deaths here in 2020 and changed leader 5 or 6 times.


There was also Sir john to bill - > then bill to Simon.

Paid Labour Party shill posting lies - like the lie that Luxon paid no tax.

[Getty]

There was also Sir john to bill - > then bill to Simon.

You have more twists than a chinese puzzle.

In your desperation you have gone back to 2006, and you know its not unusual for leaders to change as govt's go in and out of power.

Are you going to post how many Leaders Labour has had since 2006?

[Balance]

You have more twists than a chinese puzzle.

In your desperation you have gone back to 2006, and you know its not unusual for leaders to change as govt's go in and out of power.

Are you going to post how many Leaders Labour has had since 2006?

Don’t waste time arguing with the paid Labour Party shill & liar - just call him for what he is. Otherwise, he enjoys getting under your skin with deflection, diversion and lies.

[Panda-NZ-]

You have more twists than a chinese puzzle.

In your desperation you have gone back to 2006, and you know its not unusual for leaders to change as govt's go in and out of power.

Are you going to post how many Leaders Labour has had since 2006?

No only to 2016.

Similar to Australia and UK.

[Getty]

No only to 2016.

Similar to Australia and UK.

Let me help you.

6, six,, and in fact 7 when Helen Clark is counted in till 2008.

Touche, or too ashamed?

Do you want to rest your case, or have a rest?

[Balance]

No only to 2016.

Similar to Australia and UK.

So posts the paid Labour Party shill & liar.

[Balance]

Labour and the Greens staying so high while NZ continues to go to $hit is highly alarming. Cindy's PR team along with the media doing an amazing job.

It’s about momentum and National has got it now while Labour is simply holding on.

A 5% swing will see National eclipse Labour.

[Getty]

Don’t waste time arguing with the paid Labour Party shill & liar - just call him for what he is. Otherwise, he enjoys getting under your skin with deflection, diversion and lies.

We're not going to get any change out of that shilling...

[Entrep]

The opposition are not really an alternative when they wanted so many covid deaths here in 2020 and changed leader 5 or 6 times.

If people actually looked further into David Seymour and his common sense approach I think they would be surprised.

[westerly]

Don’t waste time arguing with the paid Labour Party shill & liar - just call him for what he is. Otherwise, he enjoys getting under your skin with deflection, diversion and lies.

Prove he is a shill for the Labour party anymore than you are for some right wing outfit.

westerly

[Balance]

Prove he is a shill for the Labour party anymore than you are for some right wing outfit.

westerly

Writes another Labour Party shill but at least you are not a blatant liar (yet).

[Balance]

It’s about momentum and National has got it now while Labour is simply holding on.

A 5% swing will see National eclipse Labour.

Clueless Cindy's response tonight :

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/52aca146e4b06d986ca82df3/1638487493997-A6TTQYBAY1OK4CLE8NEB/Bribes.jpg?format=2500w

[dobby41]

Writes another Labour Party shill but at least you are not a blatant liar (yet).

Deflection.
Are you paid by National or any other right-wing organisation?

[Balance]

Deflection.
Are you paid by National or any other right-wing organisation?

I am my own person - have voted for Labour, National & Act in my time as long as their policies are what I consider to be in the best long term interests of NZ.

I have never received a single cent from any political organization and both right wing & left wing organizations can get screwed.

[tim23]

Let me help you.

6, six,, and in fact 7 when Helen Clark is counted in till 2008.

Touche, or too ashamed?

Do you want to rest your case, or have a rest?

Well your lot has had 5 leaders since 2017

[Balance]

Well your lot has had 5 leaders since 2017

Fact check :

5 leaders since 2009 vs 7 (seven) for Labour since 2008.

[Panda-NZ-]

The future is bright for National long term I wouldn't worry.

The boomer low income working class in Australia will retire within 10 years. They will have grown up with aussie talk radio, sky news and christian memes and restore national to government eventually.

[Balance]

The future is bright for National long term I wouldn't worry.

The boomer low income working class in Australia will retire within 10 years. They will have grown up with aussie talk radio, sky news and christian memes and restore national to government eventually.

More garbage from the resident paid Labour Party shill & liar.

From the same garbage dump he lives in from which he posted Luxon paid no tax.

[dobby41]

More garbage from the resident paid Labour Party shill & liar.

From the same garbage dump he lives in from which he posted Luxon paid no tax.

About the same as false quotes.

[Balance]

About the same as false quotes.

Where is the false quote(s)???

You post quotes (quotes) completely out of context and think that is acceptable behaviour?

[dobby41]

Where is the false quote(s)???

You post quotes (quotes) completely out of context and think that is acceptable behaviour?

Do you want me to post the false quote attributed to me again?
Is your memory so short that you don't even remember this?

It does seem that you don't like the tables being turned on you by someone using your tactics.
I find it boring after a short while and can't show the rabid determination that you do - I'm probably just more balanced.

[Balance]

Do you want me to post the false quote attributed to me again?
Is your memory so short that you don't even remember this?

It does seem that you don't like the tables being turned on you by someone using your tactics.
I find it boring after a short while and can't show the rabid determination that you do - I'm probably just more balanced.

Absolutely. Where are the False quote(s) you keep referring to?

And you might as well post the quoteS from you which are totally & completely out of context too.

Then we know the colour of your balance.

You are of course very very tolerant of the outright libellous lies from your fellow Labour Party shill?

[dobby41]

Absolutely. Where are the False quote(s) you keep referring to?



Here you go to refresh your lagging memory
13327

[Balance]

Here you go to refresh your lagging memory
13327

That?

#1 - Only you would be upset if with such an obvious made-up quote to mock your obvious devotion to Cindy.

#2 - Did I ever post it again to have you refer to it as 'quotes'?

Since it causes you so much aggravation and hurt (I would have thought you would love it), consider it deleted and I apologize for causing you such unhappiness.

[dobby41]

That?

#1 - Only you would be upset if with such an obvious made-up quote to mock your obvious devotion to Cindy.

#2 - Did I ever post it again to have you refer to it as 'quotes'?

Since it causes you so much aggravation and hurt (I would have thought you would love it), consider it deleted and I apologize for causing you such unhappiness.

Wow - that took a while.
I asked for you to delete it straight away.
I can't consider it deleted until it is and it isn't!
So seems like a bit of an empty apology.
And apologies like that aren't real anyway - you apologise for the act rather than the effect it caused.

[westerly]

Writes another Labour Party shill but at least you are not a blatant liar (yet).



"A shill, also called a plant or a stooge, is a person who publicly helps or gives credibility to a person or organization without disclosing that they have a close relationship with said person or organization."

Spreading misinformation does you no credit or give any credibility to your posts. I have never had and never will have any connection to Labour or any other party apart from a vote every 3 years.

westerly

[Panda-NZ-]

Balance is like Ben shapiro. Manages to talk endlessly (without a breath) but offers little of lasting value for the readers.

[Balance]

Balance is like Ben Shapiro. Manages to talk endlessly (without a breath) but offers little of lasting value to the readers.

Out of the sewage pond comes the paid Labour Party shill & liar. Where is your source for Luxon paying no tax? And Whanau Ora being a National set up to win Maori votes?

[dobby41]

Out of the sewage pond comes the paid Labour Party shill & liar.

Good comeback - if you don't have an argument spew insults.
Very Trumpist!

The person with the false apologies.

[Blue Skies]

Mind boggling to see National MP Harete Hipango posting her support (again) for anti-vaccination protest groups, this time 'Voices for Freedom.'

That's clever, after the messy disastrous past few years, a good start to the New Year showing what they've so desperately been missing, all pulling together, unity and loyalty under new leader Luxon. ( I am joking in case anyone misses it)


https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/01/covid-19-national-mp-harete-hipango-deletes-post-showing-her-at-another-anti-vaccine-mandate-and-lockdown-protest.html

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127457854/whanganui-mp-harete-hipango-posts-support-for-voices-for-freedom-protest (https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127457854/whanganui-mp-harete-hipango-posts-support-for-voices-for-freedom-protest)

[fungus pudding]

Mind boggling to see National MP Harete Hipango posting her support (again) for anti-vaccination protest groups, this time 'Voices for Freedom.'

That's clever, after the messy disastrous past few years, a good start to the New Year showing what they've so desperately been missing, all pulling together, unity and loyalty under new leader Luxon. ( I am joking in case anyone misses it)


https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/01/covid-19-national-mp-harete-hipango-deletes-post-showing-her-at-another-anti-vaccine-mandate-and-lockdown-protest.html

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127457854/whanganui-mp-harete-hipango-posts-support-for-voices-for-freedom-protest (https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127457854/whanganui-mp-harete-hipango-posts-support-for-voices-for-freedom-protest)

She is a strong supporter of vaccination - and also a supporter of free speech. 'What's a gal to do?'

[Balance]

She is a strong supporter of vaccination - and also a supporter of free speech. 'What's a gal to do?'

See the media (paid off by this government) attempting to make a mountain out of a molehill.

The media should be focusing on how NZers are being lied to, misled and failed in everything by this racist divisive & incompetent government led by a clueless spin mistress. But of course not - they are getting so well fed by Cindy - with taxpayers' funds.

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/52aca146e4b06d986ca82df3/1631845087037-P157E5Y20OVM451POK2S/lap+dogs+copy.jpg?format=2500w

[Blue Skies]

Another current National MP supporting anti vaccination mandates, Matt King.

Whooaaa.... what's happening to the 'turned over a new leaf' & 'fresh start' under new leader Luxon?
This sort of thing was all supposed to have been sorted out & in the past.











https://twitter.com/PouTepou/status/1479873809800777730

[Balance]

Another current National MP supporting anti vaccination mandates, Matt King.

Whooaaa.... what's happening to the 'turned over a new leaf' & 'fresh start' under new leader Luxon?
This sort of thing was all supposed to have been sorted out & in the past.

[/url]

Getting desperate bringing up an ex-MP as a current MP.

Get your facts right before posting lies which appear to be only what you are capable of.

[Blue Skies]

Getting desperate bringing up an ex-MP as a current MP.

Get your facts right before posting lies which appear to be only what you are capable of.


Yes should have said Former National anti-vax MP Matt King, another one who lost his seat.
They lost so many MP's to Labour at the last election its hard to keep up, losing even safe Blue seats like Northland.
Hard to imagine it going to Labour after 82 years.

[fungus pudding]

Yes should have said Former National anti-vax MP Matt King, another one who lost his seat.
They lost so many MP's to Labour at the last election its hard to keep up, losing even safe Blue seats like Northland.
Hard to imagine it going to Labour after 82 years.

Yes. It's difficult to imagine Labour winning ANY seat.

[westerly]

“See the media (paid off by this government) attempting to make a mountain out of a molehill.
The media should be focusing on how NZers are being lied to, misled and failed in everything by this racist divisive & incompetent government led by a clueless spin mistress. But of course not - they are getting so well fed by Cindy - with taxpayers' funds. “
Balance

It is ironic you say the media is paid off by the this Government but you keep publishing cartoons from Tremaine who is obviously no fan .
Janet Wilson from Stuff, Bill Ralston from the Listener, `Heather du Plessi-allen, and Barry Soper and all from the Herald are no fans of the Government either but continue to criticise at every opportunity.
The Govt. never paid them enough?
Keep spreading misinformation and lies.

westerly

[Balance]

“See the media (paid off by this government) attempting to make a mountain out of a molehill.
The media should be focusing on how NZers are being lied to, misled and failed in everything by this racist divisive & incompetent government led by a clueless spin mistress. But of course not - they are getting so well fed by Cindy - with taxpayers' funds. “
Balance

It is ironic you say the media is paid off by the this Government but you keep publishing cartoons from Tremaine who is obviously no fan .
Janet Wilson from Stuff, Bill Ralston from the Listener, `Heather du Plessi-allen, and Barry Soper and all from the Herald are no fans of the Government either but continue to criticise at every opportunity.
The Govt. never paid them enough?
Keep spreading misinformation and lies.

westerly

There are those in the media with integrity who cannot be bought by this clueless corrupted Cindy led government - fortunately. Thanks for pointing them out.

Isn’t it great to know that there are those who cannot be bought by Cindy?

Election bribe to Maoris of $120m to create 3000 jobs and fix marae - 150 jobs created and where have the funds gone to? That’s corruption on a grand scale - that’s your Cindy. Spin mistress and rotten to her soles.

[Panda-NZ-]

NZ celebrity complaining about MIQ (..not noticing there's a pandemic on).

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/kiwi-fashion-blogger-and-socialite-jaime-ridge-hits-out-at-jacinda-ardern-over-miq/5HH6ZJH23DWQZTWGTUSF7CTRLM/?utm_campaign=nzh_tw&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter&utm_campaign=nzh_tw#commenting-widget

[Balance]

NZ celebrity complaining about MIQ (..not noticing there's a pandemic on).

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/kiwi-fashion-blogger-and-socialite-jaime-ridge-hits-out-at-jacinda-ardern-over-miq/5HH6ZJH23DWQZTWGTUSF7CTRLM/?utm_campaign=nzh_tw&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter&utm_campaign=nzh_tw#commenting-widget

She’s not lying like you.

[BDL]

www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/01/national-leader-christopher-luxon-responds-to-man-at-public-meeting-who-got-round-of-applause-for-denouncing-use-of-te-reo-m-ori.html

And this is why National's new "leader" is not a leader, just another follower...

[davflaws]

www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/01/national-leader-christopher-luxon-responds-to-man-at-public-meeting-who-got-round-of-applause-for-denouncing-use-of-te-reo-m-ori.html (http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/01/national-leader-christopher-luxon-responds-to-man-at-public-meeting-who-got-round-of-applause-for-denouncing-use-of-te-reo-m-ori.html)

And this is why National's new "leader" is not a leader, just another follower...

Justa nuther woke closet NINO leftie. Bring back Don Brash!