Martin Jetpack [Archive] - Page 2

minimoke

22-12-2014, 12:36 PM

Not too late to get in. IPO extended to 19 January with a 20% discount. Shares now just $0.40 '- a boxing day sale come early.

Looks like robbo is right - $21m coming into the offer from KsL.

Looks like they are the white Knight with not much other interest. New offer is for $27m in shares. So they didn't get to the $10m threshold witout ksl.

I guess they need to keep the offer open to try and drive some liquidity into the maret.

robbo24

22-12-2014, 12:39 PM

BFG

22-12-2014, 12:41 PM

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/64384297/Martin-Aircraft-drops-jetpack-shareprice

robbo24

22-12-2014, 12:42 PM

Where did you dig this information up from? Links, my man.

Nevermind, my bad: http://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20141219/pdf/42vmdf5l67wrwt.pdf

Should have read this sooner :D:D:D:D:D

minimoke

22-12-2014, 12:43 PM

No mention in new supplementary prospectus of the $37.5m buy back by MJP of HKCo

KSl apparently has a nickname "alien tech". Noice!

Edit.oops. my bad. There it is under the bit about mjp paying $2m into the joint venture company.

So the $21m now looks like $19m - still not as bad payday

robbo24

22-12-2014, 12:47 PM

Nevermind, my bad: http://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20141219/pdf/42vmdf5l67wrwt.pdf

Should have read this sooner :D:D:D:D:D

Clause 1.4 of this is interesting :D

robbo24

22-12-2014, 12:50 PM

Clause 1.4 of this is interesting :D

As is cls 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, 1.8, 1.9, 1.10 and 1.11 are also very interesting.

It's good to see some of my conclusions were correct - but could have saved myself a lot of effort by reading this a lot sooner :D

robbo24

22-12-2014, 12:56 PM

No mention in new supplementary prospectus of the $37.5m buy back by MJP of HKCo

KSl apparently has a nickname "alien tech". Noice!

Clause 1.5, man. It's still there :D

minimoke

22-12-2014, 01:29 PM

Looks like they are the white Knight with not much other interest. New offer is for $27m in shares. So they didn't get to the $10m threshold witout ksl.

Possibly also worth pointing out that if the KSL transaction doesn't go ahead the IPO will not proceed at which point I think we can say it is goodye to MJP.

So nervous times for existing holders. They will be looking closely at any potential insolvency event. At june 2014 they had $700k in cash and $500k in current liabilities. They have incurred costs between july 2014 and January 2015 with no apparent income. IPO costs have just gone up but offset by a $1m loan from KSL.

minimoke

22-12-2014, 01:35 PM

Clause 1.5, man. It's still there :Dspied it. My word this is a weighty document. The listing gets more complex the longer it goes on. And still no word from/about Avwatch.

Any Idea Why MJP want access to KSL's advanced materials? I thought this thing was ready to fly without more trials on some unknown alien technology.

robbo24

22-12-2014, 01:37 PM

Possibly also worth pointing out that if the KSL transaction doesn't go ahead the IPO will not proceed at which point I think we can say it is goodye to MJP.

So nervous times for existing holders. They will be looking closely at any potential insolvency event. At june 2014 they had $700k in cash and $500k in current liabilities. They have incurred costs between july 2014 and January 2015 with no apparent income. IPO costs have just gone up but offset by a $1m loan from KSL.

I wouldn't be so concerned about insolvency as delay. In my view the MJP has value but it is "so very scary" for investors that they cry about it and run away.

Still bullish. As minimoke once quipped, "I concede that time will tell."

robbo24

22-12-2014, 01:44 PM

spied it. My word this is a weighty document. The listing gets more complex the longer it goes on. And still no word from/about Avwatch.

Any Idea Why MJP want access to KSL's advanced materials? I thought this thing was ready to fly without more trials on some unknown alien technology.

My guess is that there may be some potential way to use the MJP to launch or deal with The Traveller - purely a guess though.

Alternatively, we're moving into the Mega Man era whereby the world is catching up with the Air-Man level of Mega Man (Nintendo game technology (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v614/Addy_03/airman.gif)).

I note the use of ducted fan propulsion systems armed with varying types of weaponry, including lightning bolts.

GuessX

22-12-2014, 01:49 PM

minimoke

22-12-2014, 01:53 PM

My guess is that there may be some potential way to use the MJP to launch or deal with The Traveller - purely a guess though.

I had thought mjp had come up with some special fly by wire technology. But I also see the balloon is going to be tethered at a couple of km high. So can't see quite the use for fly by wire and I'm quite sure the jet pack isn't designed to go that high. Unless you strap some unsuspecting Chinese or congoles pilot into it.

robbo24

22-12-2014, 02:05 PM

Both Robbo and Minimoke seem to be getting along after weeks of debates.

What's changed after todays announcement? :P

I've spent a bit of time following this thread and really enjoyed seeing both sides argued so very well. How are each of you guys feeling after todays announcement? Has it changed / softened your opinion at all?

My view is that the advisors to MJP, or MJP, probably went with a higher initial IPO valuation than was necessarily cogent with the risk profile of the investment. The risk profile will drop off once a sale or two comes through - MJP only need to sell a few jetpacks to demonstrate some fundamental value.

Therefore, I see no problem with reducing the offer price as a foolhardy investor who sees value in MJP but accepts the risk involved.

Although, in all honesty I haven't calculated whether the new deal with KSL actually represents more shares at a lesser price so it doesn't change the mCap at all.

If the KSL deal goes ahead then MJP has the money in the bank to get the jetpack to customers - who cares where it's coming from, in my view, because KSL is taking on more risk than anyone (except some of the current holders like No 8 Ventures who I believe put in like NZ$12m a long time ago)... Money in the bank, jetpacks to customers, sales = derisk = rerate = $$$.

I really like the inclusion of a "if the share price reaches $1.20 for 30 days or more then..." in the supplementary prospectus :D Where did they pull that sum from, I wonder?

robbo24

22-12-2014, 02:08 PM

I had thought mjp had come up with some special fly by wire technology. But I also see the balloon is going to be tethered at a couple of km high. So can't see quite the use for fly by wire and I'm quite sure the jet pack isn't designed to go that high. Unless you strap some unsuspecting Chinese or congoles pilot into it.

Yeah, f*** knows but if the cash is being paid over then there must be something to it:

Through the investment in Martin Jetpack, the Group can share the advance technologies of the Group including advanced materials technology and computational simulation technology to support the development of the jetpacks. On the other hand, the Group will benefit from the aviation and flying technology from Martin Jetpack for the development of the civil near space flying apparatus, namely the Traveller, and the wifi broadcasting technology, namely the Cloud. The Group considers this investment is a stepping stone to establish a new research and development centre in Australia and New Zealand region and also to facilitates and support the launch of the Traveller in New Zealand by year 2015.

minimoke

22-12-2014, 02:15 PM

How are each of you guys feeling after todays announcement? Has it changed / softened your opinion at all?
im even more bearish now. I reckon this ksl is super dodgy - based on a company worth $25m a couple of months ago and now worth according to MJP $3b. Also that there entry into near space is new and before that there expertise was in paper ( and making a loss).

I think things are now very dire. MJP seem to have all their eggs in one KSL basket. If the deal fails they don't have the cash to continue and with no IPO no way of getting more cash. Based on there appearing to be little interest in the IPO other than this very late run by KSL.

And even if it does go ahead is China really interested in a jet pack first responder. With cheap labour I don't think they place too high a value on life do its cheaper to send in people in jeeps rather than a jetpack. Unless there is plans to harass the tibetans- imagine jetpacks running up and down your boarder! Or as a way of disrupting falun gong meetings.

And I'm not sure I like the web of convertible securites which is being woven - it just seems to add a layer of complexity to a relatively simple jet pack build. If you have a product that flies how hard is it to get to market?.

Add to this the fact they seem no nearer to getting a product to market I cant see where research ends and sales begin

So, I continue with the view that I won't be putting my money in

GuessX

22-12-2014, 02:18 PM

nice to see that the report strengthens both of your pre announcement feelings ;)

GuessX

22-12-2014, 02:45 PM

http://www.aastocks.com/en/stocks/news/aafn-content/NOW.644552/latest-news

KuangChi trading halt.

minimoke

22-12-2014, 02:52 PM

http://www.aastocks.com/en/stocks/news/aafn-content/NOW.644552/latest-news

KuangChi trading halt.
They have already announced their plans to enter the jetpack space so the mind boggles on what this news could be.

robbo24

22-12-2014, 04:15 PM

I had thought mjp had come up with some special fly by wire technology. But I also see the balloon is going to be tethered at a couple of km high. So can't see quite the use for fly by wire and I'm quite sure the jet pack isn't designed to go that high. Unless you strap some unsuspecting Chinese or congoles pilot into it.

Fly by wire is not unique technology - lots of different aircraft use similar technology to smooth/control the ride.

The uniqueness for MJP is that it's a freakin' jetpack - not a helicoptor, a fighter pilot, a harrier jet or anything like it.

Whether there is some mysterious application for a near-space vehicle, or whether the MJP has some other use, remains to be cleared up.

:D:D:D

Edit: As discussed here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fly-by-wire

minimoke

22-12-2014, 05:07 PM

Fly by wire is not unique technology - lots of different aircraft use similar technology to smooth/control the ride. I was hoping they had come up with somthing new. Aside from it being a "jet pack" there is not much else new. A Bit Of aluminium for an airframe, a balistics parachute, an engine strapped to you, the Stig dressed in black - it's all been done before

The uniqueness for MJP is that it's a freakin' jetpack - not a helicoptor, a fighter pilot, a harrier jet or anything like it. A misnomer now befuddling the Chinese. It's a ducted fan arrangement. Nothing new there - the idea has been put into flight back in the '60s. What is novel is the idea of strapping an engine to your back

Whether there is some mysterious application for a near-space vehicle, or whether the MJP has some other use, remains to be cleared up.
Some one here will know - at what altitude does a petrol engine stop working?. I've driven one at 4500m and it was dangerously sluggish. I can't see an unmanned jet pack sending supplies to an unmanned balloon - unless the balloon will be manned in which case it might be easier to dock a jetpack than land a helicopter.

Lets face it - I'm not imaginative enough to come up with workable idea for a use for a jet pack near land, let alone near space[/QUOTE]

GuessX

22-12-2014, 06:16 PM

Some one here will know - at what altitude does a petrol engine stop working?. I've driven one at 4500m and it was dangerously sluggish. I can't see an unmanned jet pack sending supplies to an unmanned balloon - unless the balloon will be manned in which case it might be easier to dock a jetpack than land a helicopter.
[/QUOTE]

Petrol engines can be engineered to work at pretty high altitudes if required. I imagine a generator works fine in the himalayas .. the problem with flight becomes the thin air, less air over the wings to cause lift.

minimoke

22-12-2014, 07:12 PM

Petrol engines can be engineered to work at pretty high altitudes if required. I imagine a generator works fine in the himalayas .. the problem with flight becomes the thin air, less air over the wings to cause lift.
When in doubt google is my friend and I can be an instant expert haha. Anyway, according to someone there is half as much oxygen at 18,000 feet as there is at sea level. As we know a petrol engine needs to gets its air / fuel ratio right to fire. And we know the JetPack has been tested to 5,000 feet so probably not a lot of research gone into fuel systems. So how are they going to get one of these things to fly in near space at 65,000 - 328,000. Expect delivery perhaps in 2099. Do the fan blades count as wings?

Anyway, probably safe to say the jetpack has absolutely nothing to do with near space so KSL aren't spending for this reason.

minimoke

22-12-2014, 08:46 PM

The risk profile will drop off once a sale or two comes through - MJP only need to sell a few jetpacks to demonstrate some fundamental value.

MJP did tell us they already have. Remember - 3 jetpacks and a stimulator for $1m to the americans

Does anyone else wonder how (ominously) quiet MJP has gone about this ground breakING deal. This was a significant event but no mention of it in Prospectus v2.7. Very strange I reckon

Jay

23-12-2014, 08:12 AM

Does seem strange.
Appear to have been struggling to get investors then a "white knight" suddenly appears and no one quite sure of what it all means - except for deadlines being extended every 5 minutes, more than enough to say stay away in my book.
Personally, I cannot see much call for it, too big and cumbersome - limited load, limited time in the air, not exactly quiet, almost cheaper to buy a small helicopter. I think in 5 -10 years or sooner there will be something smaller lighter etc.

Best use maybe the "adventure" market, X$ for a 20 minute ride, but have sell a truckload or 2 of those to make any money.

Frostwind

23-12-2014, 09:02 AM

http://www.innovator.mosquito.net.nz/mbbs2/specs4.asp

A product like this will be in the similar market as a MJP. MJP does have an advantage of needing less space to maneuver, however at a cost that's much higher than these things.

What do you guys think?

As for the new prospectus, KSL seems to be making many "strange" bets, they also subscribed to a new Canadian company called Solar Ship or something, also developing something similar.

minimoke

23-12-2014, 11:11 AM

Best use maybe the "adventure" market, X$ for a 20 minute ride, but have sell a truckload or 2 of those to make any money.

Sorry to deflate your idea but there is no way regulators in the western world will allow someone to rock up to a place like queenstowen, strap on a jet pack and go for a 20 minute ride. An altetnative may be some tandem type arrangement but given mjp are struggling to get one person off the ground I reckon it will be years away before it can do 2 pepole.

Unless of course you are in China which may be a whole lot less regulated. In which case it will be only a matter of time before we hear of the first tourist has crashed and burned.

Jay

23-12-2014, 01:57 PM

There would be a market somewhere mm until as you say someone crashes

robbo24

29-12-2014, 11:13 AM

There would be a market somewhere mm until as you say someone crashes

People die of things all the time - deal with it.

In other news, a potentially very interesting use for the MJP payload and flight characteristics: http://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/64513141/drones-could-join-battle-against-pests-and-disease

Why didn't minimoke think of this?

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

robbo24

15-01-2015, 08:43 AM

Interesting reading about KCS! http://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20150114/pdf/42w01xgk54tght.pdf

Harvey Specter

15-01-2015, 09:43 AM

Get in quick - only 4(?) days to go. ;)

robbo24

15-01-2015, 10:00 AM

Get in quick - only 4(?) days to go. ;)

Almost forget! Quick minimoke, get amongst it!!

babymonster

15-01-2015, 11:05 AM

got some in Nov when it first came out.. it's risky but backing NZ company and I do like its design..

minimoke

15-01-2015, 10:18 PM

Almost forget! Quick minimoke, get amongst it!!
Given Jenny Morel is quitting 54% of her stake I think I'll follow her lead - that is increase my distance from MACL.

Also given KSL is likely to own 55% of MACL the question needs to be asked if there is there more to be made in investing in KSL direct rather than back dooring though MACL.

I have little interest in investing in MACL, even less interest in investing in a Chinese company

minimoke

15-01-2015, 10:21 PM

Get in quick - only 4(?) days to go. ;)
You've until 14 Feb to get out!

Harvey Specter

15-01-2015, 10:47 PM

Given Jenny Morel is quitting 54% of her stake I think I'll follow her lead Are they selling down or is that just dilution? Is that a recent change with the new major shareholder or was that always going to happen?

You've until 14 Feb to get out!Just quoting the spam I get on this - they have obviously bought access to a few mailing lists.

babymonster

16-01-2015, 08:53 AM

on stuff today
http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/65097267/jetpack-ipo-set-for-liftoff

robbo24

16-01-2015, 11:11 AM

Given Jenny Morel is quitting 54% of her stake I think I'll follow her lead - that is increase my distance from MACL.

I'm on my phone at the moment but I'll be back to correct you on this later.

minimoke

16-01-2015, 01:18 PM

I'm on my phone at the moment but I'll be back to correct you on this later.
Sorry. I should be more specific. The prospectus at page 7 says she intends selling 268419 shares or 53.7% of her existing holding. Not 54% as I stated

Oh, and love the press release. Apparently the jetpack can carry up to two passengers as a first responder. Wee porkies like that don't get past me but will other potential investors

GuessX

17-01-2015, 07:09 AM

It has a letter of intent from the US Department of Homeland Security for the provision of jetpacks and says it is negotiating another letter of intent with an undisclosed business

We all know how deep US pockets are.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11387402

babymonster

17-01-2015, 09:02 AM

i do hope one day we can fly this thing to work.

robbo24

17-01-2015, 11:55 AM

robbo24

17-01-2015, 12:04 PM

Sorry. I should be more specific. The prospectus at page 7 says she intends selling 268419 shares or 53.7% of her existing holding. Not 54% as I stated

Oh, and love the press release. Apparently the jetpack can carry up to two passengers as a first responder. Wee porkies like that don't get past me but will other potential investors

I'm tired of having to hold your hand through these simple tasks. I give you more credit than this most of the time but these whimsical ideas just go on and on...

NO 8 VENTURES NOMINEES LIMITED (http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/973351) owns 37802040 shares (21.57%) in Martin Aircraft Limited, as per this link (http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/901393/shareholdings).

NO 8 VENTURES MANAGEMENT LIMITED (http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/967265) owns 100 shares (100.00%) in NO 8 VENTURES NOMINEES LIMITED, as per this link (http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/973351/shareholdings).

AURIGA HOLDINGS LIMITED (http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/423663) owns 100 shares (100.00%) in NO 8 VENTURES MANAGEMENT LIMITED, as per this link (http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/967265/shareholdings).

Jennifer Ann MOREL & Alan Esmond BOLLARD own 96000 shares (99.79%) own 100% of AURIGA HOLDINGS LIMITED (http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/423663) in the name of the Morel Bollard Family Trust.

Now, I'll let you work this out, as a percentage how much of a 37,802,040 shareholding is a selldown of 268,419 shares?

Better luck next time mate.

Harvey Specter

17-01-2015, 12:14 PM

Robbo - the nominee company doesn't hold all those shares (37m) for the benefit of its shareholders (which you have traced through to be 99.79% Jenny Moral). It holds them as nominee for other investors, hence the use of the word 'Nominee'.

Without doing any research, Jennys beneficial ownership would be a lot less than 37m and I assume must in the 500k region based on the little I have read. The other 36.5m must be being held for other investors (which include you and me as taxpayers via the NZVIF).

Frostwind

18-01-2015, 09:58 AM

Guys,

Just want to chip in my 2c worth:

I've never seen an IPO that extends deadlines like this... And the sentiment is shifting quickly from risk on to risk off, and the longer they drag on, the worse it would be... Mounting IPO cost aside, the market internals have weakened dramatically over the last few weeks.

You cannot take the 40c KCS' application at face value, as they get a lot of other benefits on top. So if they are willing to pay 40c for a share incl benefits, the market will likely be considerably lower than that.

Future dilution after KCS exercise of CB is also something that should be considered. If all goes well, it'll dilute the IPO buyers, and market price will adjust sharply lower when they exercise the CBs, as it always does to massive dilution. If it doesn't go well, it'll take KCS out as well.

I also don't like the fact that insiders are dumping shares by the millions at IPO.

Also this management has a track record of excuses and missed deadlines, I failed to see how a pending IPO can affect engineering development in any significant way and deadlines have been pushed out again.

The cost for a unit has also grown from 100K USD to 200K USD, so the market will be much smaller, at that price you can buy a micro helicopter, or some very advanced drones.

Now to the good part:
with such a steep price, they won't have to sell many units to generate a lot of profit :D

Schrodinger

19-01-2015, 01:36 PM

Harvey Specter

19-01-2015, 01:43 PM

yip - search Youtube.

I think it has gone up remotely but only a meter or so with a human pilot onboard

Frostwind

19-01-2015, 02:03 PM

Is it correct to assume they still have to produce a working prototype. Who would be willing to see their cash flow away while they tinker in the garage?

It's not an assumption, they stated it clearly, they have only just finished the simulator preliminary design, not even the final design.

As for the actual product, it is only at the design stage, with the 1st delivery to be in Q3 2016, and that's *if* they meet the deadline.

Meanwhile I doubt they'll generate much cashflow. I would be surprised if they can close above 40c even for a day after IPO. I think it'll do a King Digital or Zynga on its big day.

robbo24

19-01-2015, 02:16 PM

Is it correct to assume they still have to produce a working prototype. Who would be willing to see their cash flow away while they tinker in the garage?

https://www.youtube.com/user/MartinJetPack/videos

Here's a few videos for you, playa :D:D:D:D

ryuzaki

23-01-2015, 09:30 AM

Hi guys,

It's my first time applying for shares during IPO phase. I completed the form on Martin jetpack website and paid the money.
I did this last week and I haven't heard anything since then. Am I supposed to be getting a letter or email about the shares from the company or something?

Harvey Specter

23-01-2015, 09:44 AM

robbo24

23-01-2015, 09:47 AM

Frostwind

23-01-2015, 11:33 AM

You should get an automatically generated email confirming your application.... I'm surprised you didnt get it, have you checked the spam folder?

ryuzaki

23-01-2015, 01:34 PM

You should get an automatically generated email confirming your application.... I'm surprised you didnt get it, have you checked the spam folder?

I did get email about confirmation of application and the BPAY details with a note saying "NOTE: YOUR APPLICATION IS NOT COMPLETE UNTIL YOUR PAYMENT IS RECEIVED." and then I paid through BPAY and that was it. Nothing else came through and I've checked the spam mail as well. I guess I'll wait until next week.

babymonster

23-01-2015, 03:49 PM

the money will go through in a few days..

minimoke

24-01-2015, 03:19 PM

I'm tired of having to hold your hand through these simple tasks. I give you more credit than this most of the time but these whimsical ideas just go on.......

Better luck next time mate.
I sited my source robbo - which was the third ( is this the latest?) Prospectus. If you can't believe the prospectus then what can you believe?

minimoke

24-01-2015, 03:31 PM

Pilot + petrol + 100kg... Slim down a bit and you'll be fine man. large I may be, but no matter how slim this thing isn't carrying two people. According to the videos it cannot take off with one person without two ground crew so I don't know how it is expected to carry out a slimmed down MM.

Reminds me of that puzzle - how does it go?
There is a jet pack pilot on one side of the river and slim damsel in distress on the other. How many trips across the river does it take to rescue the damsel? First round trip gets the first ground crew man across to the damsel.oops we need 3 ground crew. The third trip gets the second crewman across the river. Now the damsel can jump on board ( oh, by the way where precisely is she going to jump on to ?) With the help of the 2 ground crew And be flown back to the safe side of the river. Trouble is there are now two crewmen stuck on the far side of the river. How does the jetpack get them back?

minimoke

24-01-2015, 03:35 PM

Hi guys,

It's my first time applying for shares during IPO phase.?
Seriously? MJP is your first taste at an IPO. My god, I'm lost for words!

ryuzaki

24-01-2015, 04:05 PM

Seriously? MJP is your first taste at an IPO. My god, I'm lost for words!

Yeah, why?
do you think it's a bad choice?

RGR367

24-01-2015, 04:31 PM

Yeah, why?
do you think it's a bad choice?

As for experiencing IPO, no. But choosing this Jet**** for your first IPO, certaintly was. But who knows really, so GL still.

minimoke

24-01-2015, 04:58 PM

Yeah, why?
do you think it's a bad choice? I glance over my previous posts in this thread and the other one will give you a clue. I love ipo's from a stag perspective where demand outstrips supply. BAR you and a few others there is little dermand - so little the price was reduced 20%. The only other reason to get in at ipo is capital gain. Why not wait a bit to see how the price settles?. The other problem I see is liquidity no demand for shares at ipo suggests little demand post ipo - unless the price collapse in which case why would you try to catch a falling knife. No dermand means you can't offload easily. The final reason is in the prospectus - words to the effect this is a very high risk punt.

troyvdh

25-01-2015, 08:28 PM

ditto...I for one appreciate that you bothered to reply mini...me hopes that RGR appreciates same..cheers

Frostwind

26-01-2015, 06:55 AM

There's a lot of risk involved with this one, it's highly speculative and there's a good chance the shares will moved significantly from its IPO price. The managements have a track records of missed deadlines, and the products are expensive while the cash burning rate is very fast.

Be careful with the risks.

The Real Bud Fox

26-01-2015, 11:09 AM

The proliferation and advancement in drone technology has buggered this company before it starts, IMHO

minimoke

26-01-2015, 12:06 PM

The proliferation and advancement in drone technology has buggered this company before it starts, IMHOhaving lived through them I tend to use the christchurch earthquakes as a benchmark for assessing the mjp as a first responder. I am at a loss to work out how a mjp would have added anything extra to the situations. Indeed I would go as far as saying they would have made matterrs worse. My heart still skips whenever I hear a helicopter overhead. I can't imagine the additionAl stress the added noise of a mjp overhead would have added - it would be a lot more.

Which brings me back to drones. It was a drone that entered the damaged cathedrAl and basilica. It was a drone that surveyed port hill properties and drones are assisting with demolitions. A much safer and cheaper option than a mjp and arguably just as effective.

robbo24

26-01-2015, 12:08 PM

My heart still skips whenever I hear a helicopter overhead.

Why is this exactly, minimoke? :D:D:D:D

minimoke

26-01-2015, 02:33 PM

Why is this exactly, minimoke? :D:D:D:Dif you had been through a natural disaster or three and your house was near the flight path of the helicopters who were making the only sound (excepting sirens) you might understand. Given the question i suspect you haven't so a more detaled answer is pointless

robbo24

26-01-2015, 02:36 PM

if you had been through a natural disaster or three and your house was near the flight path of the helicopters who were making the only sound (excepting sirens) you might understand. Given the question i suspect you haven't so a more detaled answer is pointless

I have lived here in Christchurch for 10 years, minimoke. I'd love to understand what on earth you're talking about :D:D:D:D:D

Frostwind

26-01-2015, 04:21 PM

I do think they have a market for people like Kim Dotcom, but that alone might be too small, and too late. It looks like late 2016 before they could have anything ready, and by then, the chance of alternative products in the market will be greater and greater.

KCS shares also in a massive bubble and is bursting, the longer this IPO drags on the worse it will be for MJP. They need to move fast and get the units developed and built.

minimoke

26-01-2015, 08:47 PM

I have lived here in Christchurch for 10 years, minimoke. I'd love to understand what on earth you're talking about :D:D:D:D:Dmust be my PTSD.

robbo24

26-01-2015, 09:40 PM

must be my PTSD.

What do you do on rubbish day when those loud noisy trucks drive around outside? :D

Harvey Specter

27-01-2015, 08:03 AM

I do think they have a market for people like Kim Dotcom,Even if this thing can carry 2 normal sized people, there is no way it is getting of the ground with KDC. Apparently he paid the helicopter company to fit a special seat in the black one he always hires. From the few Helicopter trips I have taken, I can assume he had single seat installed in the space where me and my wife sat.

robbo24

27-01-2015, 08:14 AM

Even if this thing can carry 2 normal sized people, there is no way it is getting of the ground with KDC. Apparently he paid the helicopter company to fit a special seat in the black one he always hires. From the few Helicopter trips I have taken, I can assume he had single seat installed in the space where me and my wife sat.

Pretty sure KDC needs something along the lines of this (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/080301-F-2207D-394.jpg).

Frostwind

27-01-2015, 10:57 AM

Lol guys, "people like KDC" is not KDC, i was referring to his monetary status/lifestyle not his body weight :D

But yes good spotting and thanks for correcting me, nice attention to details :D

minimoke

27-01-2015, 01:04 PM

I have lived here in Christchurch for 10 years, minimoke.
great. So rather than my view how would you deploy, with the benefit of hindsight, mjp as a first responder on 22 Feb 2011. With particuIar attention to the cTV building, pine guild building, forsyth barr building and clarendon towers, the CBD, Port hills and any thing else you can think of.

robbo24

27-01-2015, 01:18 PM

great. So rather than my view how would you deploy, with the benefit of hindsight, mjp as a first responder on 22 Feb 2011. With particuIar attention to the cTV building, pine guild building, forsyth barr building and clarendon towers, the CBD, Port hills and any thing else you can think of.

Apply remote control headset and controls, fly it up, fly people down. Shake hands with survivors.

I bet you have some real problems driving your 'moke around if you're scared of the noise...

minimoke

27-01-2015, 03:24 PM

Apply remote control headset and controls, fly it up, fly people down. Shake hands with survivors.
.
I get the remote control controls but what is a remote control headset.?

robbo24

27-01-2015, 03:37 PM

I get the remote control controls but what is a remote control headset.?

Sunnies and a hat... And maybe some earmuffs to drown out an irate minimoke yelling about the noise? :D

Look how happy Pitch is wearing his 3d visor on the simulator (http://www.martinjetpack.com/news/160-pitch-johnson-visits-martin-aircraft)...

minimoke

27-01-2015, 04:07 PM

What do you do on rubbish day when those loud noisy trucks drive around outside? :D
Those trucks are quieter (@80dB) than a mjp by around 10 dB so my coping mechanisms aren't stretched too hard

minimoke

27-01-2015, 04:34 PM

Look how happy Pitch is wearing his 3d visor on the simulator (http://www.martinjetpack.com/news/160-pitch-johnson-visits-martin-aircraft)...
in that first photo it could be he's looking at the heavens and praying for the souls that get to fly one of these. From the photo obviously not a happy place.

minimoke

27-01-2015, 05:01 PM

Apply remote control headset and controls, fly it up, fly people down. Shake hands with survivors.
..
Ok, so you are going to have it parked somewhere, perhaps on a trailor. Pilot, remote controller pilot and 2 ground crew get call out - so they are somewhere like a fire station. They drive over damaged roads to a place where remote control pilot can view scene. Offload jetpack onto solid ground manhandling 180kg while ground crew clears area of debris. Sunhat donned off they fly. First stop cTV.oops too late that one is up in flames. Head north to Pyne gold. Oops that one is pancaked and the mjp can't fly in the spaces. Off then to forsyth barr oops stair Wells collapsed so no one is heading to the roof so have to attempt rescue out of 14th floor window. Problematic for remote controller so that part of mission abandoned. ( never mind a large crane managed) Now off to clarendon towers same story there so not much to be achieved. Ok let's head off to the grand chancellor - Oh dear running low on fuel head back to base nothing achieved.

Obviously a few technologies missing at the moment - like being able to fly remotely out of view from controller. Also tool that will enable window rescues without affecting drag or lift.

Frostwind

28-01-2015, 09:49 AM

Actually their simulators look like a lot of fun, maybe they can just sell those like those VR games and forget about the physical jetpacks altogether, they won't need nearly as many engineers and will be able to get to the market quick. Just attach a FB app on it to share flying experience socially and MJP will be immediately valued at $1B

minimoke

28-01-2015, 10:18 AM

Actually their simulators look like a lot of fun, maybe they can just sell those like those VR games and forget about the physical jetpacks altogether, As I recall there has already been a flight simulator company established in Christchurch who had such a good product airlines were using it for training. Can't remember the name but I recall they listed or got near to IPO but went bust.

Frostwind

28-01-2015, 11:03 AM

As I recall there has already been a flight simulator company established in Christchurch who had such a good product airlines were using it for training. Can't remember the name but I recall they listed or got near to IPO but went bust.

But the MJP version looks like it's actually lifted off the ground, which is better than just a screen.

minimoke

28-01-2015, 11:47 AM

But the MJP version looks like it's actually lifted off the ground, which is better than just a screen.they are using 3d goggles to give it the "feel" of flight. Can you imagine OSH with some device that actually takes off?? It would turn the simIlator into the same category as a fair ground attraction which you can do for a couple of bucks.

robbo24

28-01-2015, 12:14 PM

they are using 3d goggles to give it the "feel" of flight. Can you imagine OSH with some device that actually takes off?? It would turn the simIlator into the same category as a fair ground attraction which you can do for a couple of bucks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ii__3Pt5hY

It's fine - stop crying.

Frostwind

28-01-2015, 01:38 PM

they are using 3d goggles to give it the "feel" of flight. Can you imagine OSH with some device that actually takes off?? It would turn the simIlator into the same category as a fair ground attraction which you can do for a couple of bucks.

3D googles cannot replicate the effect that you are actually "off" the ground :D I think it'll be a fun game. They should forget about the jetpack and just focus on the simulator

minimoke

28-01-2015, 03:43 PM

3D googles cannot replicate the effect that you are actually "off" the ground :D I think it'll be a fun game. They should forget about the jetpack and just focus on the simulator
In which case you should perhaps look at Pacific simulators Ltd as an investent option. They already have the backing of big name Stephen tindall, a product that works and an interest in getting into China.

Robbo had his Man flying around Hong Kong airport On a jet pack. Stick me on a bouncy chair (with a lawn mower going in the back yard) and google earth and i could do the same thing. But Imagine trying to land a 737!

Frostwind

31-01-2015, 11:21 AM

I think KCS and MJP will be the short of the year :D

I'm looking for both shares to decline over 50%, that is HKD $2 for KCS and AUD 20c for MJP.

Frostwind

31-01-2015, 05:44 PM

The Initial Public Offering ("IPO") for Martin Aircraft Company Limited (“Martin Aircraft”or “Company”) was due to close today; however, Martin Aircraft is in ongoing discussions with a potential significant investor into the IPO, and while there is no guarantee that the investor will ultimately subscribe for shares, the Board considers it prudent in the circumstances to extend the offer for a further two weeks to allow these discussions to continue.

The IPO will now close at 5.00pm (Sydney time) on Friday 12 December 2014. However, the Company reserves the right to further extend the IPO, to vary the terms of the IPO, or to close the IPO early or at any time without further notice to any applicants. The Company will advise the revised issue date for shares, date for despatch of holding statements and ASX listing date once the IPO closes.

It is the Board’s current intention to immediately close the IPO if the significant investor subscribes for shares during the extended period.

This is their original announcement, with all the extensions it just doesn't pass the sniff test. Looks like they failed to secure enough investors, even at 40c.

Any bets on where it'll end up at IPO close, 1M post IPO and EoY (IF they manage to get the IPO off the ground at all)

My bet, IPO day close - 38c
1M post IPO - 29c
EoY - 18c

Let see who can get it closest, we should keep this thread :D

Schrodinger

01-02-2015, 09:14 AM

ryuzaki

02-02-2015, 01:11 AM

Hello all,
I've decided to pull out from this IPO. Hopefully my letter requesting refund will reach them this week.
Should have invested my money in AJX stock instead ><....

Frostwind

02-02-2015, 11:45 AM

Hello all,
I've decided to pull out from this IPO. Hopefully my letter requesting refund will reach them this week.
Should have invested my money in AJX stock instead ><....

Have you tried emailing them? Just send them a ref # or something to them and then falling it up with a call. This way you are not subject to the mercy of the snail mail. I'm pretty sure you are entitled to the refund because of all the supplementary prospectus that they released, it gives you a chance to pull out.

I was the original subscriber of the IPO too and then I instructed my bank to dishonor the payment and returned my money because after careful consideration it just didn't pass the sniff test. As it turned out I could have got my money back anyway because of all the extensions, but at the time I felt it was too risky to let my money ride on the IPO.

Sure I might miss out some profits if it surged following the IPO and have a successful story, but it's far too speculative for my liking after I've done my maths properly and I can find better risk/reward opportunities elsewhere :)

Good luck, let us know how it goes Ryuzaki :)

ryuzaki

02-02-2015, 12:05 PM

Have you tried emailing them? Just send them a ref # or something to them and then falling it up with a call. This way you are not subject to the mercy of the snail mail. I'm pretty sure you are entitled to the refund because of all the supplementary prospectus that they released, it gives you a chance to pull out.

I was the original subscriber of the IPO too and then I instructed my bank to dishonor the payment and returned my money because after careful consideration it just didn't pass the sniff test. As it turned out I could have got my money back anyway because of all the extensions, but at the time I felt it was too risky to let my money ride on the IPO.

Sure I might miss out some profits if it surged following the IPO and have a successful story, but it's far too speculative for my liking after I've done my maths properly and I can find better risk/reward opportunities elsewhere :)

Good luck, let us know how it goes Ryuzaki :)

I actually typed up a letter explaining that I wish to cancel my application for the shares and asked for refund as instructed in the third prospectus. And I also gave the BPAY info that I received from them just in case they may need it to track down the payment. I'll let you guys know what happens next.

minimoke

02-02-2015, 01:46 PM

.....

Sure I might miss out some profits if it surged following the IPO.....
:)
I always enjoy the humour and optimism posters have on these forums. No product, no market, no sales just expenses and here's Frostwind with an eye for profit.

GuessX

02-02-2015, 01:51 PM

I always enjoy the humour and optimism posters have on these forums. No product, no market, no sales just expenses and here's Frostwind with an eye for profit.

At the time of its pre-IPO capital raise the company touted 40 pre-orders for jetpacks representing $6 million in sales, with a further potential $20 million worth of serious interest.

So as far as I was aware - they have recorded a number of sales and "serious interest" of further sales.
I did also read somewhere homeland security had secured several as-well.

robbo24

02-02-2015, 02:10 PM

At the time of its pre-IPO capital raise the company touted 40 pre-orders for jetpacks representing $6 million in sales, with a further potential $20 million worth of serious interest.

So as far as I was aware - they have recorded a number of sales and "serious interest" of further sales.
I did also read somewhere homeland security had secured several as-well.

Indeed, as reported: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11349391

To my knowledge the company accepts deposits and customers are put on a waiting list.

Harvey Specter

02-02-2015, 02:56 PM

At the time of its pre-IPO capital raise the company touted 40 pre-orders for jetpacks representing $6 million in sales, with a further potential $20 million worth of serious interest.I expressed 'serious interest' in the IPO and may have even been construed as a pre-order.

Indeed, as reported: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11349391

To my knowledge the company accepts deposits and customers are put on a waiting list.Dispite me registering serious interest, I didn't actually read the IPO pack. Were there deposits disclosed as a current/non current liability (revenue in advance) in the accounts?

GuessX

02-02-2015, 03:01 PM

I expressed 'serious interest' in the IPO and may have even been construed as a pre-order.

Dispite me registering serious interest, I didn't actually read the IPO pack. Were there deposits disclosed as a current/non current liability (revenue in advance) in the accounts?

I'll assume you didn't contact the company and give them a deposit for a jetpack. In which case your "serious interest" would not be classified as a pre order.

robbo24

02-02-2015, 03:06 PM

Dispite me registering serious interest, I didn't actually read the IPO pack. Were there deposits disclosed as a current/non current liability (revenue in advance) in the accounts?

Where does one look for deposits held in escrow in the accounts? :D

minimoke

02-02-2015, 03:33 PM

So as far as I was aware - they have recorded a number of sales and "serious interest" of further sales.
I did also read somewhere homeland security had secured several as-well.
letters of intent aren't sales. I'm wondering how home land security will look at mjp are now going to be owned by the Chinese.

To be fair I should mention the "sale" of three jetpacks to that small American company. But I think that is probably best described as a marketing /agency type arrangement rather than a sale. Which incidentally seems to have gone quiet.

minimoke

02-02-2015, 04:00 PM

Where does one look for deposits held in escrow in the accounts? :Dgiven mjp has apparently inked a $1m deal with Avwatch and that with deals comes the payment of consideration I'd have expected some notes in the financials in the third supplementary prospectus.

Even a mention of the "sale" of three jetpacks should warrant a mention. given the third prospectus and the first one is all investors need to know a mention would help guide potential investor decisions. But both prospecti (?) are silent on sales deposits I think it is fair to assume there are no deposits.

So I think we can safely assume there are no "sales".

Frostwind

02-02-2015, 04:04 PM

Since then No 27 has continued dissolving the joint venture but is no longer referencing the return of payment, and no provision for the return of those funds has been made in the financial statements.

Looks like MJP have some potential legal and financial cost related to this as well, no provision has been made so the "best outcome" has been booked. If they are forced to fight a lengthy legal battle the lawyers will devour the pre-IPO cash, especially if they lose then there's another 500K liability to be put on the books.

I can see their shares put on suspension not long after IPO pending release of "material information related to #27 Joint Venture" and bam, they'll KMD the shareholders. A conservative management style will put the cost on their liability book and then proceed to wipe it off once they win the case, but not having a provision for something as material as this is a bit... fishy

GuessX

02-02-2015, 04:27 PM

letters of intent aren't sales. I'm wondering how home land security will look at mjp are now going to be owned by the Chinese.

To be fair I should mention the "sale" of three jetpacks to that small American company. But I think that is probably best described as a marketing /agency type arrangement rather than a sale. Which incidentally seems to have gone quiet.

I may be wrong here - so I'm not debating or arguing, just wanting to clarify my position.

But wouldn't an article that mentions "Pre-orders" be assuming that some cash has changed hands?

I mean, I don't pre-order computer software without giving the company some sort of deposit to actually secure my pre-order.
In which case .. it would be classed as a sale?

minimoke

02-02-2015, 05:06 PM

I may be wrong here - so I'm not debating or arguing, just wanting to clarify my position.

But wouldn't an article that mentions "Pre-orders" be assuming that some cash has changed hands?

I mean, I don't pre-order computer software without giving the company some sort of deposit to actually secure my pre-order.
In which case .. it would be classed as a sale?I think you are right. A "sale" story is one that mjp desperately needs to sell to potential investors. If we don't see the facts in the prospectus we must take it that those facts don't exist.

No cash changing hands means no preorders. If it's an "in kind" sale then it's not a sale.

I think mjp understand this. For years now they have been saying sales are secured, production imminent, orders are coming in. They under stand the liability associated with media rhetoric (none)and the difference with words in a prospectus (Loads)

Frostwind

02-02-2015, 09:09 PM

I may be wrong here - so I'm not debating or arguing, just wanting to clarify my position.

But wouldn't an article that mentions "Pre-orders" be assuming that some cash has changed hands?

I mean, I don't pre-order computer software without giving the company some sort of deposit to actually secure my pre-order.
In which case .. it would be classed as a sale?

I hope some accountant corrects me if I'm wrong but as far as my experience go, there's considerable flexibility in the accounting of these, depending on the management's interpretation of what's the likely outcome. I've seen letter of intent recorded as revenue only to have it readjusted big time when it didn't eventuate. I've also seen inventory that are essentially worthless being recorded by their full purchase price. As a rule I would like to invest in companies that have conservative managements so I don't get KMD'ed later down the track. I might miss out some gains as a results but I feel more comfortable that way.

tosspot

02-02-2015, 09:52 PM

jeez what date is this company listing. seems to be debate about it for months on this site.

Frostwind

03-02-2015, 07:10 AM

jeez what date is this company listing. seems to be debate about it for months on this site.

That's the question? I wonder what excuse they will use to extend the deadline this time. They have extended deadline many times now as they struggle to find enough interests. If an IPO is in high demand there's no way it'll extend deadline, let alone multiple times.

minimoke

03-02-2015, 12:35 PM

jeez what date is this company listing. seems to be debate about it for months on this site.
at this stage you have until 13 February to apply for shares. Trading expected to start on asx 23 February.

If all is going to plan notice of the special meeting went out to shareholders on 28 January. I don't know if it did get sent. The special meeting is due on or before 16 February.

Still a few targets to be hit before listing actually takes place.

Followers of mjp will see they have a solid history of indicating sales and production at future dates and have consistently failed to deliver. It remains to be seen if they can achieve a 23 February listing. I wouldn't bet the house on it.

Frostwind

03-02-2015, 01:26 PM

at this stage you have until 13 February to apply for shares. Trading expected to start on asx 23 February.

If all is going to plan notice of the special meeting went out to shareholders on 28 January. I don't know if it did get sent. The special meeting is due on or before 16 February.

Still a few targets to be hit before listing actually takes place.

Followers of mjp will see they have a solid history of indicating sales and production at future dates and have consistently failed to deliver. It remains to be seen if they can achieve a 23 February listing. I wouldn't bet the house on it.

Yes, their management have a solid track record of consistently missing deadline. Just look at how long they are taking to actually float this thing. If you look at their roadmap from the original prospectus, you'll see solid proof that they don't meet deadlines at all.

B

minimoke

04-02-2015, 07:23 AM

GuessX

04-02-2015, 08:55 AM

Investors shouldn't be surprised. This jet pack hs taken 30 years to get from concept to protype stage. I am seriously struggling to think what other product has taken so long in the history of mankind. Sure there was the wheel, that took a while but I don't think the combustion engine took that long. Electricity and light bulb? Jet engines only took a few years during WWII ( I know - you'll say the Germans had the Nazi war machine behind them but Martin has the benefit of known technology and $20m). Here we basically have an engine, a couple of fans, a bit of ducting and a harness. So to lighten the mood who can come up with things that have taken 30+ years to develop, get to market and return a profit to the company. - lets try to focus on the last 100 years.<br>

I feel you're being very flippant here.

The guy was doing this as a hobby initially - he wasn't devoting full time towards it, he didn't have a team of scientists he was paying money towards .. this was a single person who had a dream.  During his hobby he has realise that he MIGHT actually have something.

As for your examples the biggest one that springs to mind is the electrical car
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_car

The electrical car has been toyed with for many decades. The first one was designed in the early 1900's, Yet they've only just come into mass production in the last decade. This is because the idea has finally been brought to realisation by people who have the ability to do so.

The dream of flight was another one that took many many years .

You simply can not compare a war funded dedicated team designing a jet engine .. to a single man with a hobby. That is being very ignorant.

minimoke

04-02-2015, 11:17 AM

<br>

I feel you're being very flippant here.
Moi?

As for your examples the biggest one that springs to mind is the electrical car
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_car

The electrical car has been toyed with for many decades. The first one was designed in the early 1900's, Yet they've only just come into mass production in the last decade. This is because the idea has finally been brought to realisation by people who have the ability to do so.
You are heading way back here. Lead acid battery came in around 1859. First electric car production in 1884 with the Thomas Parker car. Less than 30 years

The dream of flight was another one that took many many years .

Let's exclude da VincI. The Wright brothers (or Richard Pearce - take your pick ) were tinkering in the early 1890's. After they took off in 1903 the first commercial flight was in 1914. Less than 30 years.

You simply can not compare a war funded dedicated team designing a jet engine ..I specifically didn't

to a single man with a hobby there you have it in a nutshell.

Any Other Examples?

robbo24

04-02-2015, 12:07 PM

Through all this twatwaffle, I still maintain my stance that the Martin Jetpack with its promise of a low-cost, versatile and easy to use vertical flight system will find its way into many recreational and industry uses.

The proposition that existing drones - ranging from lightweight surveillance drones to long range weapon delivery drones - fill the same market as the MJP is incorrect, in my view.

There's many possibilities, even beyond the first responder and sky-winch capacities already put forward by the company. Current drone designs encompass completely different applications to the specifications of the Martin Jetpack. Just look at what's available (http://www.coolinfographics.com/storage/post-images/Drone%20Survival%20Guide.jpg?__SQUARESPACE_CACHEVE RSION=1400079711471) - they are a completely different product in every sense. The Martin Jetpack can carry out drone-like functions but by no means are those functions the primary purpose of the product.

As much as minimoke wants to overlook it, there's a lot of things you can do with 100kg payload (over and above pilot and fuel). There's plenty more things you can do remotely with a larger payload sans pilot.

Not much point posting on here with genuinely interesting ideas for a novel product - it's just the standard old copy-and-paste-minimoke-on-the-whiskies response every time :D

minimoke

04-02-2015, 12:47 PM

As much as minimoke wants to overlook it, there's a lot of things you can do with 100kg payload (over and above pilot and fuel). There's plenty more things you can do remotely with a larger payload sans pilot. like what? Let's be clear. As at today this thing cannot take off without two ground crew nor is very stable in above moderate winds. That is with one pilot and fuel. How many more years will it take to develop so it can fly in more turbulence and with a load that is bound to affect lift and drag.

Not much point posting on here with genuinely interesting ideas for a novel product - it's just the standard old copy-and-paste-minimoke-on-the-whiskies response every time :Dc'Mon, give me some credit. The effect of the whiskies doesn't come in to play until well after lunch.

minimoke

04-02-2015, 01:25 PM

The proposition that existing drones - ranging from lightweight surveillance drones to long range weapon delivery drones - fill the same market as the MJP is incorrect, ...
That as maybe. But if martin are touting business in the USA it is useful to look at drones from a regulatory view point. They can't fly above 500 feet or within 5 miles of an airport. And as more drones come out so will more regulations. So you wouldn't want a mjp to be a drone.

We know martin don't want it to be an ultralight. There's a 5 gallon fuel limit with them. I don't think 5 gallons would get a loaded mjp far. Then there is the daylight operating hours and keeping clear of urban areas which would also be an impediment for a mjp

Or could it be a light sport aircraft. You need a sport pilot certificate for that one so its a bit limiting. And I'm not sure if martin have got the max stall speed issues sorted entry into this class - robbo can probably enlighten us.

So attention should be given to the regulatory environment in which a mjp is being developed. Hence perhaps the interest in China where with a large population the value of life is said to be cheap.

robbo24

04-02-2015, 01:37 PM

like what? Let's be clear. As at today this thing cannot take off without two ground crew nor is very stable in above moderate winds. That is with one pilot and fuel. How many more years will it take to develop so it can fly in more turbulence and with a load that is bound to affect lift and drag.

You've seen one video on YouTube showing the MJP being held by two ground crew in a test flight and conclude that is how it is launched.

I recently posted you a video of the Martin being controlled by remote control (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZEAZksq38k). There is no ground crew and it seems to take off just fine... The windsock in the backround is waving around too...

minimoke

04-02-2015, 01:57 PM

You've seen one video on YouTube showing the MJP being held by two ground crew in a test flight and conclude that is how it is launched.
Of course - it's the one promoted by mjp.

I recently posted you a video of the Martin being controlled by remote control (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZEAZksq38k). There is no ground crew and it seems to take off just fine... The windsock in the backround is waving around too...
Robbo - where is your viewer advisory on the noise!. Those are grade 5 ear muffs the remote operator is wearing? Yes You have me on the windsock - it is surely moving. Just! That looks like a west Melton paddock surrounded BY shelter belts with a wee breeze through a gap to get the windsock moving. A very rare wind free Canterbury day. Take the camera out today with 100 kph winds forecast and show us the video. Or how about one with a 99kg load attached.

GuessX

04-02-2015, 04:47 PM

Of course - it's the one promoted by mjp.

Robbo - where is your viewer advisory on the noise!. Those are grade 5 ear muffs the remote operator is wearing? Yes You have me on the windsock - it is surely moving. Just! That looks like a west Melton paddock surrounded BY shelter belts with a wee breeze through a gap to get the windsock moving. A very rare wind free Canterbury day. Take the camera out today with 100 kph winds forecast and show us the video. Or how about one with a 99kg load attached.

I think many light aircraft would struggle with 50knot winds. I know I wouldn't fly a Cessna in them.

minimoke

04-02-2015, 05:27 PM

I think many light aircraft would struggle with 50knot winds. I know I wouldn't fly a Cessna in them.
true.I'd settle for a video of a mjp in a 10 knot wind.

minimoke

04-02-2015, 07:42 PM

I think many light aircraft would struggle with 50knot winds. I know I wouldn't fly a Cessna in them.
After dodging one of the regions 3 scrub fires tonight I think it fair to say we can take "Weather Related Fire First Responder" off the list of things a MJP could do.

Frostwind

04-02-2015, 08:45 PM

I think the problem is not that their product is not unique, they are very unique in the market, but at that price range there are plenty other alternatives that will cover all the scenarios that the jetpack is covered for. On top of that, the management is very bad at meeting deadlines, and the longer they take to launch this, the greater the chance of competitors propping up. It would be funny if someone else take their concept and get it to the market before them

Frostwind

11-02-2015, 11:43 AM

Will they extend deadline again due to lack of demands?

Harvey Specter

11-02-2015, 11:57 AM

Will they extend deadline again due to lack of demands?Has this thing not taken off yet? ;)

minimoke

11-02-2015, 02:49 PM

Will they extend deadline again due to lack of demands?they appear to have a corner stone investor in place. So assuming the conditions of the investment are met it would appear we can look forward to take off in a week. (Why did an image of Challenger just come to mind?). Two more days to find a place to invest your hard earned loot. And early next week we should have heard how the special meeting went.

ryuzaki

11-02-2015, 02:57 PM

I was just contacted by Martin Aircraft.
I'm getting refund via bank transfer soon for pulling out.

Yay~! :)

Frostwind

11-02-2015, 04:27 PM

I was just contacted by Martin Aircraft.
I'm getting refund via bank transfer soon for pulling out.

Yay~! :)

Congratz Ryuzaki!! Great outcome, took them long enough....

Now you can grab some popcorn and watch this thing take off, or not.... without any tears :D

ryuzaki

12-02-2015, 10:10 PM

Congratz Ryuzaki!! Great outcome, took them long enough....

Now you can grab some popcorn and watch this thing take off, or not.... without any tears :D

Got my money back today! Yay!!! :t_up:

*rolling rolling on the floor* :lol:

minimoke

13-02-2015, 08:32 PM

Got my money back today! Yay!!! :t_up:

*rolling rolling on the floor* :lol:I think it's closing time in Australia about now. You had your chance to get on at ipo but that's gone now. You'll have to wait until the exchange opens in a week for your next chance - assuming of course there are no further delays.

ryuzaki

13-02-2015, 11:29 PM

I think it's closing time in Australia about now. You had your chance to get on at ipo but that's gone now. You'll have to wait until the exchange opens in a week for your next chance - assuming of course there are no further delays.

Nah I'm cool.
I'll move on to something else. I'm a supporter of AJX now. At least they are very close to announcing multiple contracts unlike MJP. Could be this month or next month.

Frostwind

17-02-2015, 03:43 PM

minimoke

17-02-2015, 08:58 PM

http://www.shop.martinjetpack.com/

Does anyone notice this new page? Looks like they are entering the consumers's market for jacket and hat :D

This will be big, a MJP jacket will be fashion of the future!they have to be effing joking. I buy technical tee shirts from rebel sports for $30 on special. I don't feel too much of a dick with an asics logo but mjp? May as well tattoo looser on my forehead

GuessX

20-02-2015, 04:10 PM

Listing going ahead.

http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/martin-jetpack-maker-list-asx-next-tuesday-cs-p-168891

My favourite line comes right at the end.

It has a letter of intent from the US Department of Homeland Security to provide jetpacks and says it is negotiating another letter of intent with an undisclosed business in the renewable crude oil production sector.

robbo24

21-02-2015, 09:22 AM

May as well tattoo looser on my forehead

An apt observation minimoke. Your abilities are improving.

minimoke

21-02-2015, 10:12 PM

ryuzaki

23-02-2015, 12:20 PM

I had a dream last night that MJP shares quickly dropped to 30 cents. That was one scary dream if i hadn't pulled myself out of IPO. lol

ryuzaki

23-02-2015, 12:20 PM

I had a dream last night that MJP shares quickly dropped to 30 cents. That was one scary dream if i hadn't pulled myself out of IPO. lol

Frostwind

23-02-2015, 12:54 PM

Apparently they have a Woolston manufacturing facility. I thought it was wigram

It could be a typo, or maybe they have already expanded into Woolston from their Wigram HQ.

The east side of Christchurch was badly damaged by Earthquakes and I reckon the residents living there are keen to buy MJP to keep them safe from the next EQ (they can fly to work and jump off the rooftop of any building safely) with their EQC money. So a woolston manufacturing facilities will make sense (it reduces the cost of transportation vs a Wigram factory)

minimoke

23-02-2015, 01:36 PM

Listing going ahead.

and it is true to form - more delayed promises . The latest prospectus indicated normal trading of shares to start on 23 February. A day late

GuessX

23-02-2015, 03:52 PM

You may know that the IPO Offer was almost $2m oversubscribed. As a result of this, most IPO applicants were scaled back. Priority applicants were scaled back up to 35% while public applicants were scaled back by as much as 80%, depending on when they applied for shares. On Thursday 19th Feb, Link Market Services mailed out Holding Statements to all IPO applicants and refund cheques to those who were scaled back.

Well .. I guess I wait to see how many shares I actually received then. Should be seeing some mail today.

GuessX

23-02-2015, 03:53 PM

and it is true to form - more delayed promises . The latest prospectus indicated normal trading of shares to start on 23 February. A day late

On this note .. it's been stuck in my head for listing tomorrow. Not sure where I got this, but it's come from somewhere - So they've kept interested parties in the loop.

minimoke

23-02-2015, 04:34 PM

You may know that the IPO Offer was almost $2m oversubscribed. As a result of this, most IPO applicants were scaled back.of course. The original offer was for up to 50,000,000 shares of which very few were taken up.

Then along came KCS who picked up 52m shares. So the people who got scaled back will think they are missing out which is one way of generating support on listing. Let's see how much demand there is tomorrow

Frostwind

23-02-2015, 04:35 PM

Wow, looks like it'll surge on the IPO, ppl must be piling in, let's hope it opens above $1 AUD tomo~!

Frostwind

24-02-2015, 10:43 AM

Huge buying pressure, this will fly very high, high bidder at 43c already, no sellers in sight yet!

robbo24

24-02-2015, 10:57 AM

Huge buying pressure, this will fly very high, high bidder at 43c already, no sellers in sight yet!

I don't expect many shares to come online for sale... Many of the buyers through capital raisings will not have had the nous to set up CHESS accounts, and the big holders are locked in for 12 months to 24 months before they can sell.

Those smart people who took part in a capital raising prior to 24 February 2014 could make good though :D:D:D:D:D

Frostwind

24-02-2015, 11:13 AM

I don't expect many shares to come online for sale... Many of the buyers through capital raisings will not have had the nous to set up CHESS accounts, and the big holders are locked in for 12 months to 24 months before they can sell.

Those smart people who took part in a capital raising prior to 24 February 2014 could make good though :D:D:D:D:D

44c already, quick 10% profit

robbo24

24-02-2015, 12:19 PM

Interesting to see a large order at 55 cents :)

:D:D:D:D

minimoke

24-02-2015, 12:32 PM

Interesting to see a large order at 55 cents :)

:D:D:D:D
NZ super fund?

robbo24

24-02-2015, 12:33 PM

NZ super fund?

I thought it may be you, minimoke :D:D:D

minimoke

24-02-2015, 12:43 PM

I thought it may be you, minimoke :D:D:D
No nor am I the one after 747 @ .67.
I love this pre opening jostling looks like a couple of stags will do very nicely.

minimoke

24-02-2015, 12:55 PM

And whose the nutter with th $0.80 bid?
edit 2 nutters

minimoke

24-02-2015, 01:03 PM

Congratulations and we'l done robbo. 1st cross @ $0.60 and a nice 50% profit. I hAve a hat around here somewhere and I'm about to start lunch!

Frostwind

24-02-2015, 01:33 PM

Sure enough, this thing is finding its equilbrium well below the open, now only 44c, and dropping fast, huge sellers piling up. Who shorted into the open will have made a fortune :D

Frostwind

24-02-2015, 01:38 PM

40c now, i maintain my original guess that this thing will close:
38c today
33c by 1 month anniversary
<30c by 1 year anniversary

minimoke

24-02-2015, 01:42 PM

Jeez, that didn't take long. From 34 buyers now down to 9 and as pointed out sellers coming to play - perhapse a bit late.

trackers

24-02-2015, 01:42 PM

well done on this one guys! Personally am a bit surprised (albeit less so than before the cornerstone investor was announced)

Frostwind

24-02-2015, 02:50 PM

40c buyers have been fully digested, normally IPO buyers don't want to sell at a loss (on the first day anyway, until later on), and there are people who missed out and will want to buy at the IPO price, so the IPO price has some natural support near the IPO day.

I do however think that the selling pressure will be strong enough to push it below 40c, and as soon as a trade below 40c is registered, there will be plenty of people wanting to get out and thus further add to the selling pressure, let's see if it can close at 38c today

robbo24

24-02-2015, 02:59 PM

Frostwind

24-02-2015, 03:01 PM

I'm just going through your posts to find where you so accurately called a listing-day top of 65 cents?

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Didnt mention 65c top, I did predict 38c close tho, so let's see

minimoke

24-02-2015, 03:05 PM

2 hours in and we are at $0.40. May I stop eating my hat now?

robbo24

24-02-2015, 03:07 PM

Didnt mention 65c top, I did predict 38c close tho, so let's see

Oh, you didn't call a 65 cent top? Just a 38 cent close? That's a shame, you could have made some good gains today.

Maybe next time.

DISC: Bought in during a round of capital raising, no restrictions :D

robbo24

24-02-2015, 03:08 PM

2 hours in and we are at $0.40. May I stop eating my hat now?

I'm sure your hat is long eaten by now, minimoke :D If only you had the foresight to buy into the IPO!

Jay

24-02-2015, 03:39 PM

Heard Mr Martin on the radio today saying they are a couple of generations ahead of what is publicly known/shown - don't want to give all our secrets away - or something like that I think he said

So what does that mean - fly further/longer/bigger payload???

Disc: Have not bought any and not likely to, just interested to see what happens.

Harvey Specter

24-02-2015, 03:42 PM

Heard Mr Martin on the radio today saying they are a couple of generations ahead of what is publicly known/shown - don't want to give all our secrets away - or something like that I think he saidSo he didn't put info into the prospectus but does disclose (what I would consider price sensitive info) on the radio. Hes going to struggle with a listed company and continuous disclosure isn't he.

robbo24

24-02-2015, 03:50 PM

So he didn't put info into the prospectus but does disclose (what I would consider price sensitive info) on the radio. Hes going to struggle with a listed company and continuous disclosure isn't he.

No need to disclose commercially sensitive information to the market - you know this.

Mr Martin is more than welcome to make comment on the on-going operations of MJP.

Today's price surge disclosed one thing - you were all wrong. Boo hoo hoo :t_up:

Harvey Specter

24-02-2015, 04:05 PM

No need to disclose commercially sensitive information to the market - you know this.

Mr Martin is more than welcome to make comment on the on-going operations of MJP.When their nearest competitor is apparently only capable of 30 seconds, then I would argue it isn't commercially sensitive, especially if you are telling people on the radio.

Today's price surge disclosed one thing - you were all wrong. Boo hoo hoo :t_up:I am an investor, not a stagger/trader so end of day is what is important. (and dont get me wrong, I have bought some companies at IPO that have gone into negative - WYN and the Gentailers spring to mind).

The fact you got them in the pre-IPO round (I think) means you are sitting on a good paper gain at this stage. Its just good to see you being humble about it.

Out of interest, what is your long term plan (serious question). Do you think they have a shot at making it big (ie. you plan to hold long term all going well) or was this only ever about the short term gain (in which case, you have been talking your book quite well).

minimoke

24-02-2015, 04:48 PM

No need to disclose commercially sensitive information to the market - you know this.
How us working on version 37.9tai commercially sensitive?

Mr Martin is more than welcome to make comment on the on-going operations of MJP. as he is now "founder director" he is probably not the best person to speak on on going operations.

Today's price surge disclosed one thing - you were all wrong. Boo hoo hoo :t_up: currently at $0.45 so still below the $0.50 they were looking for. Not a bad stag all the same!

minimoke

24-02-2015, 07:34 PM

I'm sure your hat is long eaten by now, minimoke :D If only you had the foresight to buy into the IPO!
Cant say I wasn't warned. Up 10% on $1.3m sales. A good result by any measure

robbo24

25-02-2015, 12:29 PM

Keep up all the great analysis guys - you're all doing so well with MJP.

Frostwind

25-02-2015, 12:34 PM

This is speculator's heaven! Up 30%!

GuessX

25-02-2015, 12:55 PM

This is speculator's heaven! Up 30%!

While I believe in the company .. I'm very surprised at this share price result today.

robbo24

25-02-2015, 01:08 PM

It's so lucky all those frightened and naive investors listened to minimoke and got their IPO money back.

I would hate to see undeserving types make windfall gains when they don't believe in their investment...

minimoke

25-02-2015, 01:21 PM

Today is just nuts. How can it possibly get to $0.91 when there were no takers at the $0.50 pre ipo and not many at the $0.40 ipo.

I can only conclude brokers have read something into glens comments yesterday and somehow generated $2m worth of sales Today already.

robbo24

25-02-2015, 01:41 PM

Seriously? MJP is your first taste at an IPO. My god, I'm lost for words!

Hello all,
I've decided to pull out from this IPO. Hopefully my letter requesting refund will reach them this week.
Should have invested my money in AJX stock instead ><....

I was just contacted by Martin Aircraft.
I'm getting refund via bank transfer soon for pulling out.

Yay~! :)

Yay!! Lucky you got out just in time ryuzaki!! Close one!!

minimoke

25-02-2015, 02:09 PM

Yay!! Lucky you got out just in time ryuzaki!! Close one!!
Let's not forget it took 3 goes to get this thing off the ground. That in itself is a warning sign. I have no explanation for the heights it is currentky reaching - and it will be a total surprise to MJP who had to discount the initiAl $0.50 asking price down to $0.40 in order to gain some traction.

A quick glance at the ask list shows lots of small interest around $3-$4000 mark suggesting it's a broker driven demand.

Take your pleasure now while it lasts. Let's see how long the smile stays on your face. As at today I have lost nothing Except an opportunity to stag. Given the risk profile pre ipo and given no change to that today (excepting glens comments yesterday) the forseeable reward does not stack up.

So, at what point do you take your money and run? Or are you in for the long haul.

Harvey Specter

25-02-2015, 03:07 PM

troyvdh

25-02-2015, 04:59 PM

Dear Mini...I actually agree with you ...this is nuts...this whole thing is quite surreal....delayed IPO....and all...overall it don't make sense......I hate staggers anyways cheers.

minimoke

25-02-2015, 05:25 PM

I must say if I was in this for the long haul (im not in at all) I would be selling now and looking to buy in cheaper. I cant see this high price being maintained and it will revert back down to IPO price.you would of course account for loosing around 30% of your profit to the tax man. But as a wise man once said - paying tax I's a great thing because you have made a profit.

robbo24

25-02-2015, 05:42 PM

you would of course account for loosing around 30% of your profit to the tax man. But as a wise man once said - paying tax I's a great thing because you have made a profit.

I invested long enough ago to be enjoying capital gains right now - profits are for traders :D

minimoke

25-02-2015, 08:44 PM

I invested long enough ago to be enjoying capital gains right now - profits are for traders :D
Robbo, I truly hope you have liquidated your gains and not just sitting on a paper win. That way we can bask in the shadow of your success and I can reflect on my "stupidity". But more importantly I'm expecting a "please Explain" from the ozzie exchange.

Do punters not realise that Jenny Morrel, No. 8 Ventures and Glen Martin were people who were likely closest to market information including tasty morsels of inside information right up to Monday morning. And they choose to sell out at $0.40. And for some reason Mom and Pops seem to know better and are prepared to double the price to $0.80 in two days. Where is the sense in that?

Harvey Specter

25-02-2015, 09:16 PM

robbo24

26-02-2015, 10:24 AM

Not only that, No* and GM accepted a reduction from 40% which also resulted in a higher dilution.

Robbo - I recommend you lock in some gains, at least take out your investment so your net cost is zero as I expect this is a repeat of GEO. You'll be able to buy back in at a lower cost I am sure.

Years old blood sweat and tears for Mr Martin and Ms Morel - they are more than entitled to cash out a little bit.

If you really think Jenny doesn't have a large interest in No 8's interest in MJP then you are "acting da' foo'."

Jenny has a truckload of warrants and options. You might even find, if I recall correctly, those shares were paid in lieu of money for her services at director. Why wouldn't she take some cash?

Put it in context and it's not quite the extravagant sell down you would have other believe.

Thanks for all your good advice guys, happy to forge my own trail with this one. MJP provided some great capital gains, now it's acting as a good trading stock.

Have fun sitting on the side lines.

Disc: Buy-in 30 NZ cents :D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Harvey Specter

26-02-2015, 11:01 AM

Why wouldn't she take some cash?Agree. But why would she accept 40c if she could get 80c? There is leaving money on the table but thats a bit extreme.

minimoke

26-02-2015, 12:50 PM

Put it in context and it's not quite the extravagant sell down you would have other believe.

absolutely they are entitled to sell. And good on them for getting something back . But don't undercook it.

Glen sold 3.7m shares so he has taken a $1.5m hit. A hit he can ill afford given his public statement that the sale would see him in about the same financial position as if he had stayed on his original career path. And there is no valuing the years his son had to sleep in the garage because they couldnt afford a bigger home. So I reckon that is a huge hit.

And morel was sellING out 54% of her holding in macl. Selling more than half of your holding at half price is also a huge hit.

They have both taken a bath over the past two days - and these were people closest to the facts.

robbo24

02-03-2015, 02:52 PM

40c now, i maintain my original guess that this thing will close:
38c today
33c by 1 month anniversary
<30c by 1 year anniversary

You didn't pick 118 by right now did you???

Or 139 right now??

Poor old rizuyaki, he could have made a killing if not for you negative nancies...

Harvey Specter

02-03-2015, 03:15 PM

must say I am surprised. Well done.

minimoke

02-03-2015, 04:45 PM

This a crazy. How can it possibly be discounted to $0.40 and now at $1.46. Less than a week later?

I am struggling to think of any other company that has done do well with so little in the history of ipo's.. amazon didn't do it,eBay couldn't, Google didn't

How on earth has Martin managed when only a month ago no one (except robbo ) wanted a bar of it.

minimoke

02-03-2015, 04:46 PM

And what's the trading halt about?

Kees

02-03-2015, 05:06 PM

You would have to think someone is laundering the $ on this one.

minimoke

02-03-2015, 05:14 PM

Let it not be said I know it all. So could someone please teach me how a company with net assets of $1.8m possibly be valued at the current capitalisation of $288.7m?

robbo24

02-03-2015, 05:18 PM

Let it not be said I know it all. So could someone please teach me how a company with net assets of $1.8m possibly be valued at the current capitalisation of $288.7m?

Over $300m, then add the rights, options and warrants :) There's lots of them.

MJP is worth more than DIL :D

robbo24

02-03-2015, 05:22 PM

Let it not be said I know it all. So could someone please teach me how a company with net assets of $1.8m possibly be valued at the current capitalisation of $288.7m?

When the product is as revolutionary and unique as MJP the punters will line up for shares. The media hype following the IPO provided unabated coverage of the product and the stock.

Wouldn't be surprised if MJP was a $1bn company in no time.

It's lucky you scared off so many people from the IPO with your expert opinions, they could clearly use the lesson in when to DYOR.

minimoke

02-03-2015, 06:14 PM

The media hype following the IPO provided unabated coverage of the product and the stock.
.
I haven't seen much hype post ipo certainly not to the level pre ipo. And pretty much nothing in nz which seems surprising the media like good news stories like this. So I'm not sure you can attribute the demand to that.

I've had quick look at the latest financial reports and cant see anything there that would stimulate demand. Could well be I am simply missing it so please feel free to point me in the right direction.

minimoke

02-03-2015, 07:29 PM

Over $300m, then add the rights, options and warrants That puts it in the NXZ50 - and that's crazy for a company with no sales, no revenue and a mil or two in assets. Even PEB has product to market, revenue and $21m in net assets and its worth less.

robbo24

02-03-2015, 09:52 PM

]I haven't seen much hype post ipo[/U] certainly not to the level pre ipo. And pretty much nothing in nz which seems surprising the media like good news stories like this. So I'm not sure you can attribute the demand to that.

I've had quick look at the latest financial reports and cant see anything there that would stimulate demand. Could well be I am simply missing it so please feel free to point me in the right direction.

Well minimoke there's these news articles (https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&gl=nz&tbm=nws&authuser=0&q=martin+jetpack&oq=martin+jetpack&gs_l=news-cc.3..43j0l3j43i53.23610.24909.0.25113.14.10.0.3.3 .2.213.1132.3j5j2.10.0...0.0...1ac.1.nWtVru8yVXk&gws_rd=ssl#q=martin+jetpack&hl=en&gl=nz&authuser=0&tbm=nws&tbs=sbd:1).

There's also lots of other stuff flying around on the net - just keep an eye out.

IMO - yes it's a bubble and some people are going to get spanked when it pops :D:D:D

Who knows where it will get to first, though!

$1bn mCap here we come!!! :D:D

minimoke

02-03-2015, 10:04 PM

Well minimoke there's these news articles (https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&gl=nz&tbm=nws&authuser=0&q=martin+jetpack&oq=martin+jetpack&gs_l=news-cc.3..43j0l3j43i53.23610.24909.0.25113.14.10.0.3.3 .2.213.1132.3j5j2.10.0...0.0...1ac.1.nWtVru8yVXk&gws_rd=ssl#q=martin+jetpack&hl=en&gl=nz&authuser=0&tbm=nws&tbs=sbd:1).

There's also lots of other stuff flying around on the net - just keep an eye out.

IMO - yes it's a bubble and some people are going to get spanked when it pops :D:D:D

Who knows where it will get to first, though!

$1bn mCap here we come!!! :D:D
I'm going to have to pull out my texts on Pump and Dump. This one is re writing the books given the VWA only needs to be $1.20 as I recall.

So are you riding this for the long haul?

GuessX

03-03-2015, 07:42 AM

robbo24

03-03-2015, 08:37 AM

Robbo - I'm fully on your side on this - but hotcopper makes me nervous.

There are a lot of "Newbie" investors talkng about this one, and I think have been caught up in the ridiculous gains.

Signs for a big pop in a week or two (if not before).

I hope you're comfortable with this coming back down to a more sane level of share price.

Of course - I could be totally wrong.

Bubble to the max at this point.

At 30 NZ cents MJP was a risky investment. At 40 AU cents MJP was a 33% riskier investment. At $2.00 AU MJP is, in my view, exceptionally overvalued for this point in time. If there were enough tradeable shares to sell down then it may happen at any time.

Then again, you're talking to a guy who got in at 30 NZ cents and uses live charts - entering and exiting bubbles is an exciting game ;) :D

Xerof

03-03-2015, 09:00 AM

Congrats robbo from an early dismisser.

I picked this as Apollo 1, and it has survived being a Challenger, however, now looks like a Columbia. Have your shute ready

:D

GuessX

03-03-2015, 09:55 AM

Bubble to the max at this point.

At 30 NZ cents MJP was a risky investment. At 40 AU cents MJP was a 33% riskier investment. At $2.00 AU MJP is, in my view, exceptionally overvalued for this point in time. If there were enough tradeable shares to sell down then it may happen at any time.

Then again, you're talking to a guy who got in at 30 NZ cents and uses live charts - entering and exiting bubbles is an exciting game ;) :D

I have to say - I'm in admiration of your brass balls on this one.

robbo24

03-03-2015, 10:13 AM

I have to say - I'm in admiration of your brass balls on this one.

At $2.00 per share, consider the value of 500 produced per year @ $200,000 US per jetpack.

That's $100,000,000USD in sales.

So we're talking about a $500,000,000AUD company that could potentially manufacture and sell 500 jetpacks per year.

Even the potential price to sales ratio is astronomical - roughly 5. At 30 NZ cents a share this number was more like .6.

MJP just seems overvalued and too risky to dip your toes in now! :D:D:D:D

minimoke

03-03-2015, 02:18 PM

Clearly mjp has taken off and landed in the asylum. A high of $3.15!!!! These must be over excited day traders having a ball. It sure makes entertaining watching from the sidelines.

The only question now is how much fuel is left in the beast before it crashes and burns.

NZSilver

03-03-2015, 02:57 PM

Enjoy following MJP - very interesting, ive never quite seen a hotcopper pump and dump like it. Congrats to those who have made money on it. I wont be buying anytime soon.

robbo24

03-03-2015, 03:01 PM

Enjoy following MJP - very interesting, ive never quite seen a hotcopper pump and dump like it. Congrats to those who have made money on it. I wont be buying anytime soon.

Nobody on HotCopper liked it or discussed it until momentarily after the IPO.

The best analysis you could get is minimoke and other esteemed commentators on here for the bears and ROBBO 24 for the bulls.

I just wanna know how much money ryuzaki withdrew from the IPO so I can calculate how much money he would have got from a sell at today's intraday high.

Harvey Specter

03-03-2015, 03:23 PM

s and ROBBO 24 for the bulls.Love it - talking about yourself in the third person. ;)

Did you lock some gains in when it hit a 10-bagger for you?

Amazing thing is it is on decent volume too - $12m turn over so far today when they were struggling to raise $25m before the Chinese turned up.

robbo24

03-03-2015, 03:25 PM

Love it - talking about yourself in the third person. ;)

Did you lock some gains in when it hit a 10-bagger for you?

Amazing thing is it is on decent volume too - $12m turn over so far today when they were struggling to raise $25m before the Chinese turned up.

Here's one for you Harvey:

This HotCopper guy. (http://hotcopper.com.au/threads/after-lunch-trading.2469109/?get_post=true&direction=previous#.VPUbNdSrEdU)..

Well what a rollercoaster ride MJP shares have been on this last week. Great if you were able to capitalise on it.

Now that it seems to have been brought down to earth ( couldnt help myself http://hotcopper.com.au/styles/default/xenforo/clear.png ) somewhat, where do you guys and gals see the SP going over the next week or so now that the novelty has worn off slightly?

The post continues,

[MJP (ASX) Price at posting: $2.15Sentiment: HoldDisclosure: Held

LOL... It's back down to earth at circa $2.15 :D:D

Robbo 24 loves dumshi*ts.

Edit: I hope he does well but in my view this is the type of attitude that leads to large losses for him and gains for people like sharetrader forum readers.

minimoke

03-03-2015, 03:54 PM

LOL... It's back down to earth at circa $2.15 :D:D

.
gotta love your optimism Robbo. I reckon it will go lot below that before it hits earth.

DiS'sc: I've been wrong on mjp before!

robbo24

03-03-2015, 04:05 PM

gotta love your optimism Robbo. I reckon it will go lot below that before it hits earth.

DiS'sc: I've been wrong on mjp before!

I was being sarcastic, my sarcasm directed towards the HotCopper guy. I think it's got a long way down too.

robbo24

03-03-2015, 05:39 PM

Here's a wee test of charting theories...

MJP daily chart (http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/advchart/frames/frames.asp?show=&insttype=Stock&symb=au%3Amjp&x=56&y=13&time=4&startdate=1%2F4%2F1999&enddate=3%2F2%2F2015&freq=1&compidx=aaaaa%3A0&comptemptext=&comp=none&ma=0&maval=9&uf=0&lf=1&lf2=0&lf3=0&type=4&style=320&size=4&timeFrameToggle=false&compareToToggle=false&indicatorsToggle=false&chartStyleToggle=false&state=9) at this time of day appears to show a shooting star candlestick (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_star_%28candlestick_pattern%29).

The long upper wick of the candlestick pattern (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candlestick_pattern) indicates that the buyers drove prices up at some point during the period in which the candle was formed but encountered selling pressure which drove prices back down for the period to close near to where they opened. As this occurred in an uptrend the selling pressure is seen as a potential reversal sign. After encountering this pattern traders often check for a lower open on the next period before considering the sell-signal valid.

As with the Inverted hammer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_hammer) most traders will see a longer wick as a sign of a greater potential reversal and like to see an increase in volume on the day the Shooting Star forms.

Let's see how she goes at the end of today and on open tomorrow :D:D

Xerof

03-03-2015, 07:55 PM

Yes indeed. A full blooded bear candle tomorrow, about the size of the last bull candle, will confirm todays severe reaction is justified.

7166

robbo24

04-03-2015, 08:32 AM

I can't believe stuff.co.nz quoted Hot Copper and not us... :D

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/66913463/martin-enjoys-rollercoaster-rise

robbo24

04-03-2015, 08:45 AM

I also can't believe OMF Brokers (https://www.omf.co.nz) would make such a low-brow comment (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11411192)without any additional justification:

Daniel Metcalfe, a senior client adviser at sharebrokers OMF, said speculation was driving the "extreme volatility" in the stock.
"I wouldn't touch [the stock] with a barge pole," Metcalfe said.

Why not, Danny? I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but some context behind your sage-like advice would be great...

minimoke

04-03-2015, 11:07 AM

I also can't believe OMF Brokers (https://www.omf.co.nz) would make such a low-brow comment (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11411192)without any additional justification:

Why not, Danny? I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but some context behind your sage-like advice would be great...
I agree with your view. But I guess in this age of sound bites and twitter outrageous staments can be made with no justification. And Our lazy media don't know how to probe below the superficial

robbo24

04-03-2015, 12:12 PM

Yes indeed. A full blooded bear candle tomorrow, about the size of the last bull candle, will confirm todays severe reaction is justified.

7166

I tried to sell shares I don't hold at open (to take advantage of end-of-day instantaneous settlement) in order to do a short sell.

Unfortunately Direct Broking wouldn't let me do it without holding the stock in my CHESS account - otherwise would have made a further quick buck.

What a crock!!

Xerof

04-03-2015, 12:24 PM

yes, you can BUY shares on tick, (up to $40k, IIRC) but not sell them on that platform.

minimoke

04-03-2015, 12:51 PM

I can't believe stuff.co.nz quoted Hot Copper and not us... :D

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/66913463/martin-enjoys-rollercoaster-rise
I've had a quick look and what a bunch of dimwits. one guy has compared the jet pack invention with the invention of the airplane attributing that to another couple of kiwis- the Wright brothers.

robbo24

04-03-2015, 04:54 PM

yes, you can BUY shares on tick, (up to $40k, IIRC) but not sell them on that platform.

That's a shame, I would be inclined to buy back the shorted sell at 148.5 open for 105 cents right now.

Would have been a nice quick 30-40%.

Such a shame to miss the shooting star opportunity.

Oh well, made money going long so can't be too upset.

Will be keeping an eye out for a bounce, maybe off 80 cents? :D

Joshuatree

04-03-2015, 06:33 PM

Wow this has gotta be an extremely rare experience where the Dumb and dumber come out on top:t_up:. Now , I'm off to Alibaba ,to buy a flying carpet:t_up:

minimoke

05-03-2015, 08:00 AM

robbo24

05-03-2015, 08:28 AM

I don't hold any Australian shares and this is the only company on that board I have followed reasonably closely. There are times I think nz is like the wild west. But trading in mjp puts Australia in another galaxy.

A similar thing happened with ASX:PYL (http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/advchart/frames/frames.asp?show=&insttype=Stock&symb=au%3Apyl&time=8&startdate=1%2F4%2F1999&enddate=3%2F4%2F2015&freq=1&compidx=aaaaa%3A0&comptemptext=&comp=none&ma=0&maval=9&uf=0&lf=1&lf2=0&lf3=0&type=4&style=320&size=4&timeFrameToggle=false&compareToToggle=false&indicatorsToggle=false&chartStyleToggle=false&state=9&x=58&y=12) on its opening day too. IPO was at 20 cents, opened at 30 cents then it hit 90 cents two days later.

Now it's back down to earth, as they say on Hot Copper :D

fungus pudding

13-05-2015, 10:53 AM

What's this outfit all about?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11447760

Joshuatree

13-05-2015, 12:37 PM

WOW if they're for real i want one:eek2:

minimoke

13-05-2015, 04:43 PM

What's this outfit all about?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11447760
like glen this guy has been pottering around in his back shed but only since the early 2000' s. Not petrol fueled but kero.
compared with glens efforts this beast has an average speed of 200 kph. Flight time 6 to 14 minutes. Wing Weighs Around 55kg And Each Of The 4 jet turbine engines a few kilos each. 300 kph on descent or 180 on ascent. Now that's what I call a jet pack!!

Note: Also comes with a parachute and free will writing service.

Harvey Specter

13-05-2015, 05:09 PM

Now that's what I call a jet pack!!But I think it is launched by jumping out of a plane, not from the ground which is quite a large difference.

minimoke

13-05-2015, 05:34 PM

But I think it is launched by jumping out of a plane, not from the ground which is quite a large difference.
Probably the simplest way of overcoming the problem of weight vs lift. no insurmountable problem - just a matter of compromise.

trackers

04-06-2015, 09:19 AM

WTF

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/businessnow/2015/06/03/16132/

Guess that begs the question.. Was the float just a way for Martin to cash out, or has he been rolled by the (new) big holders? Surely that's one hell of a lot of intellectual property walking out the door? Seems a bit of a shambles to me

Harvey Specter

04-06-2015, 09:30 AM

robbo24

04-06-2015, 11:39 AM

Looks like he has been pushed, otherwise it would have been gradual (staying on as advisor kind of thing). Wonder what he will do with his 15% holding - will they buy off him or will he dump on market.

Thoughts Robbo?

My understanding is that Mr Martin's main motivation was to see his jetpack dream turned into reality.

Business wise, Mr Martin's dream has been slowly eroded further and further by business savvy types.

Ultimately, I think, Mr Martin's dream became an ASX listing that resulted in his dream turning into an NZ incorporated company, listed in Australia and owned and managed from China. All the while, the new Chinese directors are probably strangers to Mr Martin.

Speaking from the Chinese city of Shenzhen, where the firm has just held a board meeting, chairman Jon Mayson also declined to give a reason for Martin's departure (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11459758)

If I were Mr Martin, I would be looking for a one-off placement of my shares (if I wanted to sell out).

Although, if I was Mr Martin and I was still confident in my dream becoming reality then I would offer my services as a highly paid consultant to the Chinese owner of Martin Jetpack - all the while holding onto my shares.

I guess we'll see won't we? :D

minimoke

04-06-2015, 03:51 PM

An interesting development. Clearly Glens vision and that of the board are not aligned. Sudden departures are never a good look.

Given investors recently bought in on the back of Glens vision this has to be a disappointment for investors.

On the other hand it might be that this board can actually create a profitable business using mjp technology which Glen and the old board were never able to achieve. There may be a silver lining.

I think it a very sad day for Glen. A few months ago he had IP, a business and a dream. Now he has neither. All he is left with its a parcel of shares that he can't sell for two years. If we follow the trajectory of the sp it may be the shares have very little value after that time. I also don't think he has the skills to be a consultant. If he was that able / skillef he would have turned out a personal jet pack well before now.

I think what we will see now is development into the unmanned aircraft space. Perhaps something between a drone and a helicopter. Not sure quite what the market will be for such a thing - will need to give that some thought.

I'm also picking a close down of Christchurch with a move to perhaps China where manufacture is cheaper, close to a probable market and still able to fly in skills when required.

robbo24

04-06-2015, 04:22 PM

An interesting development. Clearly Glens vision and that of the board are not aligned. Sudden departures are never a good look.

Martin JetPack founder Glenn Martin reveals why he quit and why he said 'don't f@#k it up!' (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11459758)Very similar to my guess.

minimoke

04-06-2015, 04:55 PM

Martin JetPack founder Glenn Martin reveals why he quit and why he said 'don't f@#k it up!' (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11459758)Very similar to my guess.
I find that all a bit tragic really.

What did he expect when a large corner stone investment is made? People don't invest to keep you tinkering in your larger back shed. They want a plan for a return on investment.

And he's really not in a position to dish out advice. Following his lead may see a dream being pursued , as was proven, never generate a revenue let alone a profit.

He is also showing his nativity. If the cornerstone investors want to go in a certain direction then that is their right. It is also their right to **** things up however they please. Let's face it - the mjp was never a resounding success under glens governance anyway.

minimoke

04-06-2015, 05:29 PM

And it maybe pure speculation or coincidence that two christchurch founding directors suddenly leave their babies this week. Are we going to see the advent of a well lit flying machine?

ari

05-06-2015, 01:02 PM

I find that all a bit tragic really.

What did he expect when a large corner stone investment is made? People don't invest to keep you tinkering in your larger back shed. They want a plan for a return on investment.

And he's really not in a position to dish out advice. Following his lead may see a dream being pursued , as was proven, never generate a revenue let alone a profit.

He is also showing his nativity. If the cornerstone investors want to go in a certain direction then that is their right. It is also their right to **** things up however they please. Let's face it - the mjp was never a resounding success under glens governance anyway.

I feel everything you have said was confirmed on Paul Henry (TV1) this morning when he interviewed Glen Martin.

Harvey Specter

05-06-2015, 01:38 PM

I feel everything you have said was confirmed on Paul Henry (TV1) this morning when he interviewed Glen Martin.
A bit sad that he will probably never see his dream take off (literally, or at least with FAA approval).

minimoke

05-06-2015, 03:52 PM

I feel everything you have said was confirmed on Paul Henry (TV1) this morning when he interviewed Glen Martin.
I think that is even more tragic. Why would he go on the Paul Henry show? Its hardly a business show. I thought the most serious topic was anything to do with Paul - had he put an order in for a jet pack?

Harvey Specter

05-06-2015, 04:18 PM

I think that is even more tragic. Why would he go on the Paul Henry show? Its hardly a business show. I thought the most serious topic was anything to do with Paul - had he put an order in for a jet pack?
Ha - thats pretty much how Henry started it. describing the jet pack as a toy for people like him. Apparently Martin was on the show a month or so ago and shot his mouth off not realising confidential info, market disclosures etc. Got a letter from his own legal team.

minimoke

05-06-2015, 04:39 PM

Ha - thats pretty much how Henry started it. describing the jet pack as a toy for people like him. Apparently Martin was on the show a month or so ago and shot his mouth off not realising confidential info, market disclosures etc. Got a letter from his own legal team.
Oh no - it just gets worse. He sounds like a lamb led to slaughter. I appreciate he is a back shed potterer but seriously where are his advisors? He should have people protecting him from this sort of nonsense. I hate to see naive people exploited and it seems to me that mjp is dishing it up at both ends of the deal.

minimoke

20-09-2015, 04:45 PM

Robbo. Where are you? I see you have been banned. I hope its because you sold out your MJP at their peak and your gloating over you new found wealth got you sent to the naughty corner. If not I hope you still aren't holding. I see today they are looking like a failed MJP which has used its ballistic parachute to come slowly and gently back to earth. Sitting around 42.5 cents - just a tad over the listing price now. And the trend not looking great.

minimoke

22-09-2015, 05:06 PM

There's a first. Hit 39.5 today. Ouch!

Snow Leopard

10-11-2015, 05:55 PM

Don't know whether this has come up before but this looks like eventual competition (http://www.gizmag.com/jetpack-aviation-new-york-flight/40286/):

I want one!

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

fungus pudding

10-11-2015, 06:49 PM

Don't know whether this has come up before but this looks like eventual competition (http://www.gizmag.com/jetpack-aviation-new-york-flight/40286/):

I want one!

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFal77EVUeM

One of these for me.

minimoke

10-11-2015, 07:33 PM

Oh hush PT and FP. Dont spoil robbo's dream https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgTyvmP3Okg
USD$200k now with sales late 2016.

ari

13-11-2015, 10:59 AM

Don't know whether this has come up before but this looks like eventual competition (http://www.gizmag.com/jetpack-aviation-new-york-flight/40286/):

The JB-9 Jetpack certainly looks competitive against Martin's cumbersome setup which I don't think has even had a manned flight yet!

fungus pudding

13-11-2015, 12:27 PM

The JB-9 Jetpack certainly looks competitive against Martin's cumbersome setup which I don't think has even had a manned flight yet!

Don't overlook this one. Posted link above, but worth a look if you missed it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFal77EVUeM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFCQJ5sYGtI

ari

13-11-2015, 12:48 PM

Don't overlook this one. Posted link above, but worth a look if you missed it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFal77EVUeM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFCQJ5sYGtI

Totally different set up. Launch from helicopter and landing via parachute.

minimoke

07-12-2015, 09:54 PM

And now for something completely different
http://news.nus.edu.sg/press-releases/9747-frogworks-personal-flying-machine

Edit - video https://youtu.be/PO_1w6mM21c
Technologies seem to be advancing at a faster rate then MJP's ability to get to market.

minimoke

08-03-2016, 02:20 PM

Couple of director resignations over the past couple of days. Not necessarily much to be made from that. Old crew going, new crew coming on board.

More importantly it appears nz regulators (CAA) won't alow the vehicle to be registered as a "microlight". Now they are faced with trying to create a new category as experimental and restricted. I'm not sure how that could be good news for the manned version. Possibly not an issue for unmanned version - but that was never the dream.

minimoke

29-03-2016, 08:01 PM

Just got back form Warbirds over Wanaka where there was a live demonstration of the jet pack.

First impression: "LOUD". I knew this thing was noisy but had no idea it was as noisy as it was. Put any ideas of this being a personal jetpack away. There is no way on earth any local authority is going to let anyone fly this thing anywhere within suburban limits. It is so loud only the wealthiest who can afford to piss of their neighbors in some boondock republic will be buyers.

Next impression: under whelmed. The demonstration was pilotless. There was an explanation but I couldn't hear it over the din this thing was making. Why do this - unless of course it is never going to be a Personal Jetpack

Granted it did fly a few meters above ground and it did hover over a dime and it did fly a few meters out. But that was it. Thats all - nothing else. What a lost opportunity. Is this what MJP are doing at every expo - if so they are wasting money.

They didn't even try to demonstrate any first responder stuff. They could have tried to lift a 100kg weight and move it fro A to B. Or perhaps strap some emergency gear and fly it to someone on the ground. No - nothing like that. Just a very boring up, across hover and down while making a hurr of a din. I have i mentioned the noise!

No wonder their test base is out at Oxford (where no doubt even the sheep are running scared) and not in the city. I reckon this thing would make more noise than the Christchurch Engine Centre on a still night.

All I can say is I remain convinced that anyone with money in this stock are muggs. There was nothing in the demonstration to convince me otherwise.

Drones will be the way to go. Electric powered, powerful and quiet. Watch this space,.