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Thread: Harmoney

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  1. #1
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    Oct 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by whitt View Post
    Xmas is looming.
    I am contemplating temporarily tightening up my Auto lend criteria for Nov/Dec as i was assuming some people could get into debt more easily during this period.
    However when I look at stats I cant find any p2p data in my Dashboard which would suggest this so I might end up leaving my Auto lend rules untouched.

    If I go into my dashboard and check arrears I can see a couple from 2016 December but they are A and B grades, I would have expected to see a spike of arrears if true.

    Do any of the bigger investors here see a high spike for loans started in the December periods? Maybe my data set is too small or my logic is wrong
    It quietened down last year around December if I recall correctly.

  2. #2
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    Another one appears

    http://moolainvest.co.nz

  3. #3
    yeah, nah
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    Quote Originally Posted by 777 View Post
    Another one appears

    http://moolainvest.co.nz
    They truly are scary. See what fees/interest they charge: https://www.moola.co.nz/

    $1000 for 4 weeks => Fees and Interest = $269.92

    Hmmm, that works out at...351% pa !!!

    I guess if you are desperate for a short term loan, but ... words fail me ...

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by 777 View Post
    Another one appears

    http://moolainvest.co.nz
    They appear to be seeking to borrow investment capital (debt not equity), minimum $50,000 for 1 - 3 years returning 8%-12% p.a. Unless there's some upside in the form of equity or a bonus at the end, Harmoney's $25 loan fractions look to have a better return and less risk.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by joker View Post
    They appear to be seeking to borrow investment capital (debt not equity), minimum $50,000 for 1 - 3 years returning 8%-12% p.a. Unless there's some upside in the form of equity or a bonus at the end, Harmoney's $25 loan fractions look to have a better return and less risk.
    Rates like that are usually referred to as "points" and the default process "crowbars". 351% p.a. is morally repugnant. Payday loan sharks accessible by phone app are a disaster waiting to happen.

  6. #6
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    Yes it is quite astonishing to see. The business is clearly a loan shark. I'm amazed they received an award from Deloitte despite being involved in a highly unethical area of the finance industry.

  7. #7
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    I wonder whether 'payment protect' is misleading people with literacy issues into believing there are no consequences for not paying back the loan. NZ has about 40% of people defined as having literacy issues with 20.7% of people having level 1 literacy (this means they struggle to read and understand simple sentences). I would imagine, given the creative spelling of the majority of the reasons for the loans, that the proportion of people with literacy issues taking out Harmoney loans is quite a lot more than the average.

    Since Oct 15 last year, 9 months after payment protect was launched, 8 of 13 of my charged off loans have payment protect, and I didn't typically invest in that many payment protect loans. "Payment protect" sounds like they are protected from consequences and, in a way, they are. The description is here: https://www.harmoney.co.nz/payment-protect/borrowers It covers terminal illness, which many people get, and your remaining loan payments are waived.

    I've stopped investing in loans that have payment protect as my earnings from the protect rebates are $45.73 while the losses are $231.50. The recent spate of bad loans has taken my returns from around 17% down to 15% and I've been treading water for 3 months. I've stopped investing in anything over D2 since the rate changes. I'm 40% weighted in C with about 5% in A, 20% in B, 25% in D and 10% in E.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by darrenc View Post
    I wonder whether 'payment protect' is misleading people with literacy issues into believing there are no consequences for not paying back the loan. NZ has about 40% of people defined as having literacy issues with 20.7% of people having level 1 literacy (this means they struggle to read and understand simple sentences). I would imagine, given the creative spelling of the majority of the reasons for the loans, that the proportion of people with literacy issues taking out Harmoney loans is quite a lot more than the average.

    Since Oct 15 last year, 9 months after payment protect was launched, 8 of 13 of my charged off loans have payment protect, and I didn't typically invest in that many payment protect loans. "Payment protect" sounds like they are protected from consequences and, in a way, they are. The description is here: https://www.harmoney.co.nz/payment-protect/borrowers It covers terminal illness, which many people get, and your remaining loan payments are waived.

    I've stopped investing in loans that have payment protect as my earnings from the protect rebates are $45.73 while the losses are $231.50. The recent spate of bad loans has taken my returns from around 17% down to 15% and I've been treading water for 3 months. I've stopped investing in anything over D2 since the rate changes. I'm 40% weighted in C with about 5% in A, 20% in B, 25% in D and 10% in E.
    I agree that payment protect loans are best avoided. I have chosen to invest in them for the time being due to a lack in the supply of loans.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by darrenc View Post
    I wonder whether 'payment protect' is misleading people with literacy issues into believing there are no consequences for not paying back the loan. NZ has about 40% of people defined as having literacy issues with 20.7% of people having level 1 literacy (this means they struggle to read and understand simple sentences). I would imagine, given the creative spelling of the majority of the reasons for the loans, that the proportion of people with literacy issues taking out Harmoney loans is quite a lot more than the average.

    Since Oct 15 last year, 9 months after payment protect was launched, 8 of 13 of my charged off loans have payment protect, and I didn't typically invest in that many payment protect loans. "Payment protect" sounds like they are protected from consequences and, in a way, they are. The description is here: https://www.harmoney.co.nz/payment-protect/borrowers It covers terminal illness, which many people get, and your remaining loan payments are waived.

    I've stopped investing in loans that have payment protect as my earnings from the protect rebates are $45.73 while the losses are $231.50. The recent spate of bad loans has taken my returns from around 17% down to 15% and I've been treading water for 3 months. I've stopped investing in anything over D2 since the rate changes. I'm 40% weighted in C with about 5% in A, 20% in B, 25% in D and 10% in E.
    I don't get the same correlation. 10 of my 90 charged off loans (11.11%) had payment protect. 623 of my 4123 all time investments (15.11%) were payment protect loans.

  10. #10
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    I disagree - Harmoney isn't that quiet. Seems to be averaging $600k+ per day still. I see plenty of loans each day.

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