sharetrader
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 57
  1. #31
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    453

    Default

    And on that note ANZ today ann. raising 3B in a placement

  2. #32
    Ignorant. Just ignorant.
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Irresident
    Posts
    836

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwitrev View Post
    And on that note ANZ today ann. raising 3B in a placement
    But we only get to line up for a share of 500m

  3. #33
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    453

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GTM 3442 View Post
    But we only get to line up for a share of 500m
    When you say we are you talking about bond holders as well as SH? I might have missed something in the ann. but the only reference I noticed was "eligible" SH. In any event limited to $15k and not sure if NZ holders in the mix.

  4. #34
    Veteran novice
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    , , .
    Posts
    6,636

    Default

    Australian and NZ shareholders qualify. Not bond holders. But as the current SP is below the SPP price is doesn't look as if the SPP will be rushed. Unless things change, of course.

  5. #35
    An Awesome Cool Cat winner69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    , , .
    Posts
    24,592

    Default

    Interesting article

    Things may have changed?

    Mind you punters still like them - the 7.2% ANZ jobs are yielding 4% odd if you buy them today


    http://www.interest.co.nz/personal-f...ies-issue-same
    Last edited by winner69; 12-02-2016 at 07:12 PM.
    “In a roaring bull market, knowledge is superfluous and experience is a handicap.”

    –Benjamin Graham”

  6. #36
    ShareTrader Legend Beagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    13,803

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    Interesting article

    Things may have changed?

    Mind you punters still like them - the 7.2% ANZ jobs are yielding 4% odd if you buy them today


    http://www.interest.co.nz/personal-f...ies-issue-same
    This is absolutely crazy. Do people not realise that as a Tier 2 capital note these in tandem with shares are first cab off the rank when it comes to the Reserve Bank's open bank resolution ?
    Are people unaware that the ANZ bank has had the sharpest fall in its ordinary SP of any of the major Aussie banks and that they have MASSIVE exposure to the mining and dairy sectors with many of their customers unable to pay their bills ?

    I thought these things were stupid at the issue price...at 4% that is a completely ludicrous situation IMO most especially in light of what is a pretty serious correction in banking shares globally. Have grannies and orphans really had the risk explained to them properly ????? or is this the next Credit Sails situation where people sue the bank for misrepresenting the risks involved ?
    Last edited by Beagle; 14-02-2016 at 06:08 PM.
    No butts, hold no mutts, (unless they're the furry variety).

  7. #37
    Advanced Member BIRMANBOY's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Wellington
    Posts
    1,562

    Default

    It would appear that you have fallen into the trap of assuming that the SP somehow is a valid indicator of a company's worth and viability and then further compounded this by making a grandiose statement "that they have MASSIVE exposure to the mining and dairy sectors with many of their customers unable to pay their bills ?".. what's the question mark for? Not quite sure of the facts so covering your nether regions? "MASSIVE" implies a dangerously large amount...where are you getting that information from? Or is it a hypothetical adjective based on your assumption that (A) mining sector has been suffering generally so therefore a majority of this sector are at the bankruptcy level...and /or (B) that the ANZ is more affected by this than Westpac or ASB etc. AND that if this is the case that they have somehow managed to hide this from everybody...except you of course. LOL A lot of stocks and shares have had their SP drop...this happens all the time and is normal. Why is it normal? Because people of similar ilk jump on and off based on emotion and the latest market sentiment. Seen it all before and no doubt will see it all again. If holders of these bonds knew anything they would be selling...appears not...so falls upon you to warn us all. Thanks. If you could back up your statement with some cold hard evidence would certainly be interested but hyperbole and panic doesn't convince me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    This is absolutely crazy. Do people not realise that as a Tier 2 capital note these in tandem with shares are first cab off the rank when it comes to the Reserve Bank's open bank resolution ?
    Are people unaware that the ANZ bank has had the sharpest fall in its ordinary SP of any of the major Aussie banks and that they have MASSIVE exposure to the mining and dairy sectors with many of their customers unable to pay their bills ?

    I thought these things were stupid at the issue price...at 4% that is a completely ludicrous situation IMO most especially in light of what is a pretty serious correction in banking shares globally. Have grannies and orphans really had the risk explained to them properly ????? or is this the next Credit Sails situation where people sue the bank for misrepresenting the risks involved ?
    www.dividendyield.co.nz
    Conservative Investing and dividend producers...get rich slowly!
    https://www.facebook.com/dividendyieldnz

  8. #38
    An Awesome Cool Cat winner69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    , , .
    Posts
    24,592

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BIRMANBOY View Post
    It would appear that you have fallen into the trap of assuming that the SP somehow is a valid indicator of a company's worth and viability and then further compounded this by making a grandiose statement "that they have MASSIVE exposure to the mining and dairy sectors with many of their customers unable to pay their bills ?".. what's the question mark for? Not quite sure of the facts so covering your nether regions? "MASSIVE" implies a dangerously large amount...where are you getting that information from? Or is it a hypothetical adjective based on your assumption that (A) mining sector has been suffering generally so therefore a majority of this sector are at the bankruptcy level...and /or (B) that the ANZ is more affected by this than Westpac or ASB etc. AND that if this is the case that they have somehow managed to hide this from everybody...except you of course. LOL A lot of stocks and shares have had their SP drop...this happens all the time and is normal. Why is it normal? Because people of similar ilk jump on and off based on emotion and the latest market sentiment. Seen it all before and no doubt will see it all again. If holders of these bonds knew anything they would be selling...appears not...so falls upon you to warn us all. Thanks. If you could back up your statement with some cold hard evidence would certainly be interested but hyperbole and panic doesn't convince me.
    Hi Birman - woken up from your nap - good for cats to snooze through a warm lazy summer?

    Suppose if ANZ have suspended your interest payments and you have become the proud owner of tens of thousands of cheap ANZ shares we ALL will have many other things on our mind.

    But why worry as Mark Knopfler said there should be sunshine after rain / these things have always been the same / so why worry now
    Last edited by winner69; 15-02-2016 at 07:21 AM.
    “In a roaring bull market, knowledge is superfluous and experience is a handicap.”

    –Benjamin Graham”

  9. #39
    Advanced Member BIRMANBOY's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Wellington
    Posts
    1,562

    Default

    Hah....I'm sure Roger would say that "Dire Straits" is a most appropriate choice. I'll go for Cream, (I like full fat dairy after all) and "the sunshine of your love"..snooze away.
    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    Hi Birman - woken up from your nap - good for cats to snooze through a warm lazy summer?

    Suppose if ANZ have suspended your interest payments and you have become the proud owner of tens of thousands of cheap ANZ shares we ALL will have many other things on our mind.

    But why worry as Mark Knopfler said there should be sunshine after rain / these things have always been the same / so why worry now
    www.dividendyield.co.nz
    Conservative Investing and dividend producers...get rich slowly!
    https://www.facebook.com/dividendyieldnz

  10. #40
    ShareTrader Legend Beagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    13,803

    Default

    I haven't got the time like Snoopy does but it seems quite obvious from ANZ's significantly more serious decline in SP relative to the other Australasian banks the market is concerned by questions about their asset quality. If people are silly enough to continue to hold these capital instruments when they could book a capital gain and get out then good luck to them.
    I was actually thinking Dire Straits...Money for Nothing and..well you know the rest of the title, probably too sexist in these politically correct days.
    Last edited by Beagle; 15-02-2016 at 10:02 AM.
    No butts, hold no mutts, (unless they're the furry variety).

  11. #41
    An Awesome Cool Cat winner69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    , , .
    Posts
    24,592

    Default

    As the article said - ........focus is very much on protecting the banks. Not their investors.


    No doubt Heartland will come up with something similar as well
    “In a roaring bull market, knowledge is superfluous and experience is a handicap.”

    –Benjamin Graham”

  12. #42
    Advanced Member BIRMANBOY's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Wellington
    Posts
    1,562

    Default

    That's amazing... wish I had your astounding abilities. "You don't have the time but yet it seems obvious"...(wow) The market decline is due to questions about asset quality (to me it looks like the market is declining in many places so how do you know its due to a specific item such as asset quality) Wow again. Holders are all silly...wow, wow wow. Sure some of us are but ALL of us...ok I guess if you say so..must be right. I retire suitably rebuked and humbled by your superior abilities. However always finish on a positive said my mum...so appreciate your comments and thanks for your wishing us good luck.
    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    I haven't got the time like Snoopy does but it seems quite obvious from ANZ's significantly more serious decline in SP relative to the other Australasian banks the market is concerned by questions about their asset quality. If people are silly enough to continue to hold these capital instruments when they could book a capital gain and get out then good luck to them.
    I was actually thinking Dire Straits...Money for Nothing and..well you know the rest of the title, probably too sexist in these politically correct days.
    www.dividendyield.co.nz
    Conservative Investing and dividend producers...get rich slowly!
    https://www.facebook.com/dividendyieldnz

  13. #43
    Reincarnated Panthera Snow Leopard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Kuching
    Posts
    426

    Thumbs up Nothing but praise

    Quote Originally Posted by BIRMANBOY View Post
    That's amazing... wish I had your astounding abilities...
    He is very good at knowing when the market is being rational (selling down Australia New Zealand Bank) and being irrational (selling down Air New Zealand).

    Best Wishes
    Paper Tiger
    (Member of the DNRC)
    om mani peme hum

  14. #44
    ShareTrader Legend Beagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    13,803

    Default The feeding order of security

    But this old dog has been right about HBL and maybe, just maybe he knows a fair bit about these unsecured capital bonds. When it hits the fan you want to be at the front of the queue eating what's there first not the back accepting any mopped up mess you're offered. The Credit Sails issue promised great unsecured returns too and some of us remember how that ended.

    A few months back I called the top on MTFHC's at 76, now 68 and no real depth on the buy side. Does it really make the cat's skim milk go so sour when I'm right again.
    What did your mother say about sarcasm BB...
    Last edited by Beagle; 15-02-2016 at 04:30 PM.
    No butts, hold no mutts, (unless they're the furry variety).

  15. #45
    Advanced Member BIRMANBOY's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Wellington
    Posts
    1,562

    Default

    You obviously have a need to be top dog and generally regarded as Guru material Roger. Those days are gone for me...my testosterone, along with Elvis, has got up and left the building. I, along with probably many posters, look at shares and the share market as competition to compete with the financial system and to try and eke out a few more % points than what is offered at the bank. We don't look at this as being a competition among other investors. I'm happy for your wins and learn from your losses whomever you are. However when critiques are penned it is always wise to phrase them in non derogatory terms and with a softness as opposed to "you're an idiot for doing whatever".' That's just rude and to be blunt a little arrogant. I'm sure that's not the case but that's the way it comes across. You were dismissive of my request for some information to back up your claim saying "I don't have time". Ok that's fine but that then poses the question why did you post in the first place. Surely it makes sense to have some basis and facts before making a dismissive post. At a primitive, human level, we all have made decisions on what to invest in. It should be obvious that criticism needs to be well founded and robust to be accepted. Poorly researched or unfounded criticism runs the risk of being questioned, as it should be. Your example of Credit Sales although somewhat relevant is like comparing apples and oranges.....ANZ is a much larger, stronger entity. So I stand by my assertion that (A) the SP has bugger all to do with ANZ ability to withstand pressure and (B) that your claim of MASSIVE issues with dairy and mining is just gross exaggeration. However I will watch developments and keep an eye on what is happening...and refrain from making any statements until something actually happens. (As opposed to speculation and guesswork.)
    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    But this old dog has been right about HBL and maybe, just maybe he knows a fair bit about these unsecured capital bonds. When it hits the fan you want to be at the front of the queue eating what's there first not the back accepting any mopped up mess you're offered. The Credit Sails issue promised great unsecured returns too and some of us remember how that ended.

    A few months back I called the top on MTFHC's at 76, now 68 and no real depth on the buy side. Does it really make the cat's skim milk go so sour when I'm right again.
    What did your mother say about sarcasm BB...
    www.dividendyield.co.nz
    Conservative Investing and dividend producers...get rich slowly!
    https://www.facebook.com/dividendyieldnz

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •