How much capital do I need to retire comfortably on ?

[winner69]

Calm down Aaron

You can't take away my entitlement - and I'm not being 'F**king greedy'


Anyway most of that entitement of mine goes back into the government coffers along with heaps of ither taxes I pay - orobably to support the whingers of your generational cohort eh. Should that make me puke?

[Aaron]

The only "entitlement" is your mentality. If you are paying a lot of tax you must be earning a lot of income? What about NZ Super only being provided to those in need like all other welfare?

Am I whinging? More just getting angry at people(a whole lot of people, in fact an entire generation) and views I don't consider reasonable.

[winner69]

The only "entitlement" is your mentality. If you are paying a lot of tax you must be earning a lot of income? What about NZ Super only being provided to those in need like all other welfare?

Am I whinging? More just getting angry at people(a whole lot of people, in fact an entire generation) and views I don't consider reasonable.

I think life was tougher for my generation in the 60's /70's than it is for the same age group today - OK let's be conciliatory and say just as tough!

It's not really my fault many of my generation are 'accidental milionaires' as a result of a few housing booms ( and exhuberant share markets)

If anything its been a mis-allocation of resources by a succession of governments that have got us into this 'mess'

[Aaron]

I don't have a problem with millionaries and people who have done well for themselves and climbed the ladder of success. It is just when they knock out the rungs on the ladder after they have climbed it that I get annoyed.
-For example tertiary education need I say more.
-Also currently unaffordable housing you would have been able to buy at 3 to 4 times your annual income rather than 7 to 8 times, (the reasons for the increase in the housing boom are many and varied I would propose the following,1/ low interest rates and easy money as well as inflation, 2/immigration (foreign buyers can afford boomer houses and why would you accept less for your house from young NZers), 3/baby boomers realizing that although generous, NZ Super isn't enough to live on so with memories of Oct 1987 and recent finance company collapses the good old rental is really the only safe option and world central banks policy is designed to ensure it succeeds.
-In spite of John Key's assurances most people with half a brain know NZ Super is not sustainable we are just now seeing from Diane Maxwell how the next generation will need to adjust their expectations and save hard for the future as well as pay higher taxes in their best earning years to sustain the current boomer cradle to grave gravy train.
- Also you can't blame previous govts. they were voted in by a majority of the population. the last election was a good example. Labour proposed a capital gains tax, compulsory retirement savings, and raising the age of retirement to 67. National proposed changing the flag. Labour has never recovered from proposing what I thought were pretty good policies to address approaching problems.

[artemis]

......... Also currently unaffordable housing you would have been able to buy at 3 to 4 times your annual income rather than 7 to 8 times ...........

You've bought right in to the media driven narrative which seems to be based on averages and Auckland.

Whereas the median house price (November 2016 sales) for NZ is $520,000. This means half of sales were under $520,000. In some areas the median is a lot lower. Like Manawatu - median $270,000.

And whose annual income? The individual's? The household's? They can be very very different.

[Aaron]

You've bought right in to the media driven narrative which seems to be based on averages and Auckland.

Whereas the median house price (November 2016 sales) for NZ is $520,000. This means half of sales were under $520,000. In some areas the median is a lot lower. Like Manawatu - median $270,000.

And whose annual income? The individual's? The household's? They can be very very different.

True Auckland house price inflation is exceptionally high and I would hope that we will get a dip at some stage as has happened in the past and those people who have saved something will get a chance. It is just frustrating that world central banks are keeping interest rates so low when we have runaway asset price inflation and I am not leveraged to the eyeballs. Here is what the RBNZ had to say in Jan 2016 regarding house prices.
http://www.rbnz.govt.nz/-/media/Rese...016jan79-1.pdf
Here is the first paragraph in the conclusion "New Zealand house prices have risen significantly over the past five decades. In real terms, house prices have more than tripled, with a strong upward trend since 1994. Nonetheless, there have been several instances where real house prices have fallen."

Here is a chart on inflation. haven't actually considered CPI inflation compared to house price inflation other than the CPI currently has no relationship to house prices.
http://www.rbnz.govt.nz/statistics/k...raph-inflation

Some other graphs on mortgage rates but they only go back to 1990 I know boomers like to bleat on about 20% interest rates back in the 70,s still up around 15% in the 1990s I would note. Anyway house prices is just one issue. Looking at all the earthworks around Auckland supply is being dealt with. We could address demand immediately by curbing immigration but maybe we need that as workers to retirees is set to reduce over the next couple of decades.

[Aaron]

And whose annual income? The individual's? The household's? They can be very very different.

call me old fashioned but I like the idea that a mother or father can stay home to bring up a family's kids (Note I said family please don't bring up the DBP issue). Although I think the main burden for the kids should be placed on the parents we are all paying for other people's parent's retirements and not complaining why can't we pay for tertiary education for NZ's young people as well as they are the future of this country. Maybe well off retirees shouldn't receive NZ Super? That is where Labour's compulsory Kiwisaver idea made sense. Even a bludger is forced to put something aside for their retirement. If we accept taxation then compulsory retirement savings isn't that bad and it will benefit you or your family directly which is why everyone hates tax because it benefits all of society and you can't see any direct benefit for yourself. The only downside is that the funds management industry come across as not crooks necessarily but definitely well paid for the service they provide.

[winner69]

.........I know boomers like to bleat on about 20% interest rates back in the 70,s .........

No no Aaron - My first house the first mortgage was 22% with a second mortgage of 27.5% in the early 1970's. That house cost me $18.000 - a cruddy but cute stucco house with a flat malthoid roof - still standing but has been reroofed and looks rather nice these days (probably says something about the better building standards those days eh)

I didn't complain because that's what one paid those days and repayments were a huge part of the weekly income - couldn't afford a car and even had to rent a TV - but life was fun anyway

Talking of baby boomers and retirement - I have always been extremely grateful to a dear old lady who told me when I first started working to put 5% of my pay into a subsidised company super fund. Never missed by 5% but along with the company contributions and it being a defined benefit scheme the final pay out was heaps

Pity more NZers never joined a super fund and there was no alternative like Kiwisaver until recently. Pity compulsory super was scrapped in 1975, might have made made things easier now.

Some cynics say that low interest rates these days is god's way of 'punishing' the boomers - they need to spend it to survive because term deposit rates don't give them enough cash to live (and let alone pay the council rates on the stupidly highly inflated property they own)

Don't let it get you down Aaron - you'll be OK and live a prosperous live

[fungus pudding]

(and let alone pay the council rates on the stupidly highly inflated property they own)

The council rates are struck by the costs the council incurs or budget to incur, so values only play a part as far as relativity is concerned. IOW it's a way of dividing the costs between ratepayers. So even if you think properties are 'stupidly inflated' it has no effect on the rates. That's a long held misconception that should be buried a long way from a forum like this.

[Raz]

What is Diane Maxwell suggesting in this article? That NZ Super is unaffordable? John Key assured us it was affordable and he is a nice guy so was he lying? Surely not.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opin...m-from-culture

Just when you think Diane is being traitorous to her baby boomer generation (the greedies) her suggestion is to push the retirement age up to 67 by 2034. Do the maths the last baby boomer retires in 2029. Why doesn't she suggest that after 2034 people not already on NZ Super will have to fund their own retirement with limited Govt. assistance much like they did after the last baby boomer graduated from University. Tertiary education then became unaffordable.

I bet lots of boomers will vote for a National govt tax cut next year rather than contributions to the Cullen fund to help us through the bulge. F**king greedy boomers make me want to puke.

Hope this doesn't come across too strong for those born between 1946 and 1964 but come on give the next generation a chance.

Sorry just realized this should really be in the off market discussion section, it is just that I discussed the retirement issue earlier in this thread so I used it.

p.s. some of my best friends are baby boomers.

She is just running a political agenda, if the tax take was more equitable, as an example whole sectors are set up for tax free capital gain in this country let alone the charities set up.. the tax take would easily cover the change in age from 65 to 67. Generation x onwards will be screwed. Many baby boomers are not wealthy and need the super however I have met a lot of the wealthy ones are generally greedy and selfish and don't need super. They are usually the ones running the place. A older set on this forum for sure so don't expect them to be able to relate.