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  1. #9281
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    Quote Originally Posted by bull.... View Post
    well done to your son. It seems to me the new way of investing for young people these days is meme investing. chasing what ever the coolest thing is according to there friends and message boards etc ... maybe ?
    Investing, not really, gambling more like.

  2. #9282
    Speedy Az winner69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ynot View Post
    Investing, not really, gambling more like.
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

  3. #9283
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    Risk versus reward. You be the judge

    https://sorted.org.nz/guides/saving-...esting-basics/

    "When it comes to investing, there are some key fundamentals. Think of these basics of investing as a cycle to come back to repeatedly. To be successful investors, we’ll need to:

    Be clear and realistic about what we want to achieve
    Think about financial goals, like saving for a car, buying a house or saving for retirement. It helps to ask, ‘What goal will investing help me achieve?’

    We can set our investing goals in the short term (1–3 years), medium term (4–9 years) or long term (10 years plus). Writing them down as “I will have $X in X months’ time for X” can help set a target to aim for.

    Then we can invest in a way that can help us reach those goals.

    Research, compare and review choices
    We need to do our homework, or get a professional to do it for us. Or both!

    There are so many choices to make – such as whether to invest in professionally managed funds such as KiwiSaver or to take more of a DIY (do-it-yourself) direct approach. Then there are the many kinds of investments to choose from, such as bank deposits, bonds, property or shares.

    While studying the options for investing, keep in mind that looking at past results is not a reliable way of predicting what the future will bring.

    Find the right balance between risk and return
    The greater the returns we chase, the more risk we have to be prepared to accept. In the short term, higher-risk investments tend to be more of a roller coaster. Yet over the long term, they can typically come out with better results.

    A great place to start is to find out your investor type, which gauges your attitude toward risk and how well you can handle any ups and downs or possible losses. To find out, answer the nine questions in Sorted's investor kickstarter.

    That way you can base your investment decisions on your attitude toward risk.

    Find the right mix of investments
    You need to find a mix of investments (what experts call ‘asset allocation’) to match your investor type. Look at typical mixes of shares, property, bonds and cash for each investor profile in the kickstarter results.

    Specific mixes of investments lead to different results, and the investor kickstarter also gives you an idea of what to expect.

    Not put all our eggs in one basket
    A good way to reduce the risks we take is to spread our money within a given kind of investments (what experts call ‘diversifying’). So when investing in shares, for example, instead of buying part of just one company (a ‘share’), we can buy shares in different companies, a variety of industries and even different countries.

    While some investments will do badly, others will do well. Spreading investments in this way helps to smooth out the ups and downs in value that happen, and helps protect us from losing money.

    Understand how investments grow and compound over time
    Keeping your whole financial situation in mind (for example, paying down your mortgage may get you ahead and improve your net worth faster than investing), starting investing early helps. The longer the timeframe, the more the value of investments can compound upwards and grow.

    Regularly adding to investments can greatly improve the results. If you regularly reinvest your returns or constantly drip feed more money into your fund, you will see the highest growth."

  4. #9284
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    I think if you're invested in a single stock or two (or even 10), yeah it's gambling for sure.

    Very hard to lose money if one is invested in whole markets for the long term.

    Very good video here that talks about the difference between gambling and investing. WealthTrack is essential viewing for new and old investors

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWLYO7Ax45s
    Last edited by Bobdn; 21-04-2021 at 09:43 AM.

  5. #9285
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    Quote Originally Posted by bull.... View Post
    well done to your son. It seems to me the new way of investing for young people these days is meme investing. chasing what ever the coolest thing is according to there friends and message boards etc ... maybe ?
    Interesting discussion...I tend to think similar to Bull...."s post.
    Caution ...A Wednesday rant below

    We are living in IR4 (4th industrial revolution)
    From my perspective IR4 was just chugging along being "managed" by large corporate tech to guard their self interests and hampered by old infrastructure, legal processes, lack of desire to future proof, etc...

    However we all know from history that a Global Crisis or a World War helps to break down old established systems and creates a sudden surge of change and with it new disruptive companies/systems emerge and start to dominate.

    I think Co-vid pandemic has done this...This crisis has accelerated change which was previously forecast (managed) to happen in the late 2020's to happen now.....a leap

    Why I'm jealous of my son is partially money-wise but mostly because this leap is threatening to leave me behind..basically put..I'm old school using old school thinking and old school ways of doing things and that includes the way I invest..I have old memories which causes me to use bias decision-making, such as remembering about the aftermath of the "Dot Com Bubble". So.. as a "experienced investor I wag my finger at my son and say "you got away with it this time young man but this "pass the parcel" game is a mugs game ..

    ...but...Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** and the switched on people are profiting from this window of opportunity?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..

    We are accustomed to bots running within all industry sectors. The Equity Market has bots which are algorithms*** Is TA becoming more important as this discipline is growing mass over that of Fundamental reasoning?

    Looking back at History... The problem with "managing" change is the risk of falling behind and with pent up "demand for change" pressure the flood-gates inevitably suddenly open up causing disruption to the old entrenched systems

    Is the latest wave of meme investing using social media tools becoming a powerful force, if true is it becoming a disruptive force capable of causing a paradigm shift within the stock market sector??

    Will this ongoing price/demand influence continue to turn fundamentals (and it's logic theories) on its head as it has done this last few years with egg over the Guru's faces and the industry's "so-called inexpenced call" young tech investors continue to make "quick-fire" money against all fundamental odds?

    Will this form of volatile investing (long and short) using quicker data transfer become the new normal and dominant form of investing at the expense of the more slow less intensive data transfer traditional long term buy and hold investing strategies?

    Does the Equity market sector believe this new way of investing is here to stay?..If so, can it continue to create and update ultra-fast data communication to cater for it...If the market sector disbelieves and is correct life carries on as before...but what happens if it is wrong?

    Time will tell....And as I said in my last post my son may be able to teach me how to invest...eh

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...

    ** a paradigm shift is defined as "an important change that happens when the usual way of thinking about or doing something is replaced by a new and different way." ...

    *** Algorithms are always unambiguous and are used as specifications for performing calculations, data processing, automated reasoning, and other tasks.
    Last edited by Hoop; 21-04-2021 at 10:50 AM.

  6. #9286
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    Interesting discussion...I tend to think similar to Bull...."s post.
    Caution ...A Wednesday rant below

    We are living in IR4 (4th industrial revolution)
    From my perspective IR4 was just chugging along being "managed" by large corporate tech to guard their self interests and hampered by old infrastructure, legal processes, lack of desire to future proof, etc...

    However we all know from history that a Global Crisis or a World War helps to break down old established systems and creates a sudden surge of change and with it new disruptive companies/systems emerge and start to dominate.

    I think Co-vid pandemic has done this...This crisis has accelerated change which was previously forecast (managed) to happen in the late 2020's to happen now.....a leap

    Why I'm jealous of my son is partially money-wise but mostly because this leap is threatening to leave me behind..basically put..I'm old school using old school thinking and old school ways of doing things and that includes the way I invest..I have old memories which causes me to use bias decision-making, such as remembering about the aftermath of the "Dot Com Bubble". So.. as a "experienced investor I wag my finger at my son and say "you got away with it this time young man but this "pass the parcel" game is a mugs game ..

    ...but...Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** and the switched on people are profiting from this window of opportunity?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..

    We are accustomed to bots running within all industry sectors. The Equity Market has bots which are algorithms*** Is TA becoming more important as this discipline is growing mass over that of Fundamental reasoning?

    Looking back at History... The problem with "managing" change is the risk of falling behind and with pent up "demand for change" pressure the flood-gates inevitably suddenly open up causing disruption to the old entrenched systems

    Is the latest wave of meme investing using social media tools becoming a powerful force, if true is it becoming a disruptive force capable of causing a paradigm shift within the stock market sector??

    Will this ongoing price/demand influence continue to turn fundamentals (and it's logic theories) on its head as it has done this last few years with egg over the Guru's faces and the industry's "so-called inexpenced call" young tech investors continue to make "quick-fire" money against all fundamental odds?

    Will this form of volatile investing (long and short) using quicker data transfer become the new normal and dominant form of investing at the expense of the more slow less intensive data transfer traditional long term buy and hold investing strategies?

    Does the Equity market sector believe this new way of investing is here to stay?..If so, can it continue to create and update ultra-fast data communication to cater for it...If the market sector disbelieves and is correct life carries on as before...but what happens if it is wrong?

    Time will tell....And as I said in my last post my son may be able to teach me how to invest...eh

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...

    ** a paradigm shift is defined as "an important change that happens when the usual way of thinking about or doing something is replaced by a new and different way." ...

    *** Algorithms are always unambiguous and are used as specifications for performing calculations, data processing, automated reasoning, and other tasks.
    Well, I'm an "old" investor and have heard all that before. In the end, fundamentals, like facts, matter. Every generation seems to forget that at some point.

  7. #9287
    ShareTrader Legend bull....'s Avatar
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    this is getting interesting

    POLITICS
    Nanaia Mahuta likens New Zealand-China relationship to 'dragon and taniwha


    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/polit...ays-agree.html



    China heaps praise on Nanaia Mahuta's 'remarkable' Five Eyes comments

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/polit...-comments.html



    New Zealand secures its interests by distancing from US-led clique

    https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202104/1221610.shtml


    British media claims Five Eyes has 'become four' after Nanaia Mahuta's comments on New Zealand's position


    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/polit...-position.html


    is NZ about to choose sides ?
    one step ahead of the herd

  8. #9288
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** ?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..
    Thats a solid negative to me for all of those three.
    For the sector question its not a paradigm shift, just a demand shift.
    For clarity, nothing I say is advice....

  9. #9289
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    Hah...one lucky foray by your son and you are ready to re-invent yourself? Just say no. Gambling enriches the few at the expense of the many and investing wisely enriches the majority of those with the discipline and experience to be able to differentiate between the two. Those who venture into the "dark side" ramp up the risks and as the statistics advisers to casinos will tell you.."the house always comes out on top". Calling it by a different name may sound cool and up with the times but for the vast majority of people wanting to make their money work for them ...slow and steady will be less likely to have poor results. Making risky investments with several thousand dollars is not a big deal but try doing that with larger amounts and the results could be life altering and non recoverable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    Interesting discussion...I tend to think similar to Bull...."s post.
    Caution ...A Wednesday rant below

    We are living in IR4 (4th industrial revolution)
    From my perspective IR4 was just chugging along being "managed" by large corporate tech to guard their self interests and hampered by old infrastructure, legal processes, lack of desire to future proof, etc...

    However we all know from history that a Global Crisis or a World War helps to break down old established systems and creates a sudden surge of change and with it new disruptive companies/systems emerge and start to dominate.

    I think Co-vid pandemic has done this...This crisis has accelerated change which was previously forecast (managed) to happen in the late 2020's to happen now.....a leap

    Why I'm jealous of my son is partially money-wise but mostly because this leap is threatening to leave me behind..basically put..I'm old school using old school thinking and old school ways of doing things and that includes the way I invest..I have old memories which causes me to use bias decision-making, such as remembering about the aftermath of the "Dot Com Bubble". So.. as a "experienced investor I wag my finger at my son and say "you got away with it this time young man but this "pass the parcel" game is a mugs game ..

    ...but...Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** and the switched on people are profiting from this window of opportunity?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..

    We are accustomed to bots running within all industry sectors. The Equity Market has bots which are algorithms*** Is TA becoming more important as this discipline is growing mass over that of Fundamental reasoning?

    Looking back at History... The problem with "managing" change is the risk of falling behind and with pent up "demand for change" pressure the flood-gates inevitably suddenly open up causing disruption to the old entrenched systems

    Is the latest wave of meme investing using social media tools becoming a powerful force, if true is it becoming a disruptive force capable of causing a paradigm shift within the stock market sector??

    Will this ongoing price/demand influence continue to turn fundamentals (and it's logic theories) on its head as it has done this last few years with egg over the Guru's faces and the industry's "so-called inexpenced call" young tech investors continue to make "quick-fire" money against all fundamental odds?

    Will this form of volatile investing (long and short) using quicker data transfer become the new normal and dominant form of investing at the expense of the more slow less intensive data transfer traditional long term buy and hold investing strategies?

    Does the Equity market sector believe this new way of investing is here to stay?..If so, can it continue to create and update ultra-fast data communication to cater for it...If the market sector disbelieves and is correct life carries on as before...but what happens if it is wrong?

    Time will tell....And as I said in my last post my son may be able to teach me how to invest...eh

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...

    ** a paradigm shift is defined as "an important change that happens when the usual way of thinking about or doing something is replaced by a new and different way." ...

    *** Algorithms are always unambiguous and are used as specifications for performing calculations, data processing, automated reasoning, and other tasks.
    www.dividendyield.co.nz
    Conservative Investing and dividend producers...get rich slowly!
    https://www.facebook.com/dividendyieldnz

  10. #9290
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    Ridiculous comment.

    A govt bond is an investment as is a term deposit. If you have a definition for gambling that comfortably includes such instruments then you're being pedantically augmentative and should also include "hoping the ice cream doesnt melt on the way home". Sure speculating is a close verb to gambling but that is a subset of investing not an equivalent.

    Is crossing the road gambling or merely tying to get to the other side (or not if you are a chicken)?

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