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Thread: Black Monday

  1. #9281
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    This is the deli in New Jersey that is currently trading at a $100 million market cap under HWIN

    They have one store and $35k in annual sales


    Cool
    Watching Jeremy Grantham interview recorded on Jan 23rd 2021 (38 minutes). He is 82 years old and still working as Boston's GMO's chief investment strategist..The interview covers many areas..He believes green investment will attract increasing amount of money from other investing areas as the years go by..
    He believed the market was in an epic bubble waiting to burst. The euphoria is the sign of the market at its limits as all investors have spent everything to get into the market and can't contribute more to sustain the market. What causes the crash is the change of investors attitude away from being euphoric..He thinks the next crash will rival 1929, 2000 and take years to regain the losses as they have done throughout history..
    Last edited by Hoop; 17-04-2021 at 12:59 AM.

  2. #9282
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    dodge coin on fire. this value play lol has been under - rated by the market for a long time. even my uni son brought it in the cents as a laugh with his friends. guess they are laughing now.
    dont worry the fed has our backs and in this current environment the biggest gamblers are the most rewarded.
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  3. #9283
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    Golden rather than Black Monday news

    "the stock market rally to continue throughout 2021. Why?

    1 Pent-up economic demand will fuel consumer spending as the COVID-19 vaccine gives people a semblance of normalcy.

    2 The Conference Board reported that its consumer confidence index surged to 109.7 in March up from 90.4 in February.

    3 ISM manufacturing reported that the Atlanta Fed raised its first quarter GDP estimate to a 6% annual pace, up from its previous 4.7% estimated annual growth rate.

    4 ADP announced that private payrolls soared 517,000 in March, the biggest monthly gain in six months.Stocks historically do well the year after a presidential election.

    These are just four factors that have formed my opinion that there's no limit to the potential upside for the market in 2021."

    Louis Navellier
    Last edited by Habits; 19-04-2021 at 09:44 PM.

  4. #9284
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    Plenty of doomsday & exuberance articles & opinions out there from the ‘experts’ - take your pick really to play to whatever sentiment & emotion you choose to follow!

    For me, focus on the big picture.

  5. #9285
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    dodge on fire still this morning up to 42 odd a little while ago, probably money from other coins / crypto,s moved into dodge after the flash crashes on the weekend. anyway it never pays to be too greedy in cypto land you never know really how long it last.

    Dogecoin Eclipses XRP as 4th Largest Cryptocurrency Ahead of ‘Dogeday’

    https://www.coindesk.com/dogecoin-eclipses-xrp-dogeday
    bull
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    Quote Originally Posted by bull.... View Post
    dodge coin on fire. this value play lol has been under - rated by the market for a long time. even my uni son brought it in the cents as a laugh with his friends. guess they are laughing now.
    dont worry the fed has our backs and in this current environment the biggest gamblers are the most rewarded.
    My son cashed in last week..Got $15,000 off a $2,000 quick-fire investment...I jealous, maybe he should teach me how to invest..

  7. #9287
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    My son cashed in last week..Got $15,000 off a $2,000 quick-fire investment...I jealous, maybe he should teach me how to invest..
    but he will think its easy and probably try again with a different result?

    who knows - but crypto is making fools of us all.

    when the brown flies around though I'd still rather have HLG than BTC.
    For clarity, nothing I say is advice....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    My son cashed in last week..Got $15,000 off a $2,000 quick-fire investment...I jealous, maybe he should teach me how to invest..
    No, he could teach you how to speculate... and you could teach him how to invest.

    However, for the young person's game, I can understand why speculation appeals. Biggest gains as fast as possible to get you ahead of the pack will never come from the NZX50. And you're young enough to weather some early hits betting wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    My son cashed in last week..Got $15,000 off a $2,000 quick-fire investment...I jealous, maybe he should teach me how to invest..
    well done to your son. It seems to me the new way of investing for young people these days is meme investing. chasing what ever the coolest thing is according to there friends and message boards etc ... maybe ?
    bull
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    Quote Originally Posted by bull.... View Post
    well done to your son. It seems to me the new way of investing for young people these days is meme investing. chasing what ever the coolest thing is according to there friends and message boards etc ... maybe ?
    Investing, not really, gambling more like.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ynot View Post
    Investing, not really, gambling more like.
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    When investors are euphoric, they are incapable of recognizing euphoria itself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    Risk versus reward. You be the judge

    https://sorted.org.nz/guides/saving-...esting-basics/

    "When it comes to investing, there are some key fundamentals. Think of these basics of investing as a cycle to come back to repeatedly. To be successful investors, we’ll need to:

    Be clear and realistic about what we want to achieve
    Think about financial goals, like saving for a car, buying a house or saving for retirement. It helps to ask, ‘What goal will investing help me achieve?’

    We can set our investing goals in the short term (1–3 years), medium term (4–9 years) or long term (10 years plus). Writing them down as “I will have $X in X months’ time for X” can help set a target to aim for.

    Then we can invest in a way that can help us reach those goals.

    Research, compare and review choices
    We need to do our homework, or get a professional to do it for us. Or both!

    There are so many choices to make – such as whether to invest in professionally managed funds such as KiwiSaver or to take more of a DIY (do-it-yourself) direct approach. Then there are the many kinds of investments to choose from, such as bank deposits, bonds, property or shares.

    While studying the options for investing, keep in mind that looking at past results is not a reliable way of predicting what the future will bring.

    Find the right balance between risk and return
    The greater the returns we chase, the more risk we have to be prepared to accept. In the short term, higher-risk investments tend to be more of a roller coaster. Yet over the long term, they can typically come out with better results.

    A great place to start is to find out your investor type, which gauges your attitude toward risk and how well you can handle any ups and downs or possible losses. To find out, answer the nine questions in Sorted's investor kickstarter.

    That way you can base your investment decisions on your attitude toward risk.

    Find the right mix of investments
    You need to find a mix of investments (what experts call ‘asset allocation’) to match your investor type. Look at typical mixes of shares, property, bonds and cash for each investor profile in the kickstarter results.

    Specific mixes of investments lead to different results, and the investor kickstarter also gives you an idea of what to expect.

    Not put all our eggs in one basket
    A good way to reduce the risks we take is to spread our money within a given kind of investments (what experts call ‘diversifying’). So when investing in shares, for example, instead of buying part of just one company (a ‘share’), we can buy shares in different companies, a variety of industries and even different countries.

    While some investments will do badly, others will do well. Spreading investments in this way helps to smooth out the ups and downs in value that happen, and helps protect us from losing money.

    Understand how investments grow and compound over time
    Keeping your whole financial situation in mind (for example, paying down your mortgage may get you ahead and improve your net worth faster than investing), starting investing early helps. The longer the timeframe, the more the value of investments can compound upwards and grow.

    Regularly adding to investments can greatly improve the results. If you regularly reinvest your returns or constantly drip feed more money into your fund, you will see the highest growth."

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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    I think if you're invested in a single stock or two (or even 10), yeah it's gambling for sure.

    Very hard to lose money if one is invested in whole markets for the long term.

    Very good video here that talks about the difference between gambling and investing. WealthTrack is essential viewing for new and old investors

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWLYO7Ax45s
    Last edited by Bobdn; 21-04-2021 at 10:43 AM.

  14. #9294
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    Quote Originally Posted by bull.... View Post
    well done to your son. It seems to me the new way of investing for young people these days is meme investing. chasing what ever the coolest thing is according to there friends and message boards etc ... maybe ?
    Interesting discussion...I tend to think similar to Bull...."s post.
    Caution ...A Wednesday rant below

    We are living in IR4 (4th industrial revolution)
    From my perspective IR4 was just chugging along being "managed" by large corporate tech to guard their self interests and hampered by old infrastructure, legal processes, lack of desire to future proof, etc...

    However we all know from history that a Global Crisis or a World War helps to break down old established systems and creates a sudden surge of change and with it new disruptive companies/systems emerge and start to dominate.

    I think Co-vid pandemic has done this...This crisis has accelerated change which was previously forecast (managed) to happen in the late 2020's to happen now.....a leap

    Why I'm jealous of my son is partially money-wise but mostly because this leap is threatening to leave me behind..basically put..I'm old school using old school thinking and old school ways of doing things and that includes the way I invest..I have old memories which causes me to use bias decision-making, such as remembering about the aftermath of the "Dot Com Bubble". So.. as a "experienced investor I wag my finger at my son and say "you got away with it this time young man but this "pass the parcel" game is a mugs game ..

    ...but...Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** and the switched on people are profiting from this window of opportunity?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..

    We are accustomed to bots running within all industry sectors. The Equity Market has bots which are algorithms*** Is TA becoming more important as this discipline is growing mass over that of Fundamental reasoning?

    Looking back at History... The problem with "managing" change is the risk of falling behind and with pent up "demand for change" pressure the flood-gates inevitably suddenly open up causing disruption to the old entrenched systems

    Is the latest wave of meme investing using social media tools becoming a powerful force, if true is it becoming a disruptive force capable of causing a paradigm shift within the stock market sector??

    Will this ongoing price/demand influence continue to turn fundamentals (and it's logic theories) on its head as it has done this last few years with egg over the Guru's faces and the industry's "so-called inexpenced call" young tech investors continue to make "quick-fire" money against all fundamental odds?

    Will this form of volatile investing (long and short) using quicker data transfer become the new normal and dominant form of investing at the expense of the more slow less intensive data transfer traditional long term buy and hold investing strategies?

    Does the Equity market sector believe this new way of investing is here to stay?..If so, can it continue to create and update ultra-fast data communication to cater for it...If the market sector disbelieves and is correct life carries on as before...but what happens if it is wrong?

    Time will tell....And as I said in my last post my son may be able to teach me how to invest...eh

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...

    ** a paradigm shift is defined as "an important change that happens when the usual way of thinking about or doing something is replaced by a new and different way." ...

    *** Algorithms are always unambiguous and are used as specifications for performing calculations, data processing, automated reasoning, and other tasks.
    Last edited by Hoop; 21-04-2021 at 11:50 AM.

  15. #9295
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    Interesting discussion...I tend to think similar to Bull...."s post.
    Caution ...A Wednesday rant below

    We are living in IR4 (4th industrial revolution)
    From my perspective IR4 was just chugging along being "managed" by large corporate tech to guard their self interests and hampered by old infrastructure, legal processes, lack of desire to future proof, etc...

    However we all know from history that a Global Crisis or a World War helps to break down old established systems and creates a sudden surge of change and with it new disruptive companies/systems emerge and start to dominate.

    I think Co-vid pandemic has done this...This crisis has accelerated change which was previously forecast (managed) to happen in the late 2020's to happen now.....a leap

    Why I'm jealous of my son is partially money-wise but mostly because this leap is threatening to leave me behind..basically put..I'm old school using old school thinking and old school ways of doing things and that includes the way I invest..I have old memories which causes me to use bias decision-making, such as remembering about the aftermath of the "Dot Com Bubble". So.. as a "experienced investor I wag my finger at my son and say "you got away with it this time young man but this "pass the parcel" game is a mugs game ..

    ...but...Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** and the switched on people are profiting from this window of opportunity?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..

    We are accustomed to bots running within all industry sectors. The Equity Market has bots which are algorithms*** Is TA becoming more important as this discipline is growing mass over that of Fundamental reasoning?

    Looking back at History... The problem with "managing" change is the risk of falling behind and with pent up "demand for change" pressure the flood-gates inevitably suddenly open up causing disruption to the old entrenched systems

    Is the latest wave of meme investing using social media tools becoming a powerful force, if true is it becoming a disruptive force capable of causing a paradigm shift within the stock market sector??

    Will this ongoing price/demand influence continue to turn fundamentals (and it's logic theories) on its head as it has done this last few years with egg over the Guru's faces and the industry's "so-called inexpenced call" young tech investors continue to make "quick-fire" money against all fundamental odds?

    Will this form of volatile investing (long and short) using quicker data transfer become the new normal and dominant form of investing at the expense of the more slow less intensive data transfer traditional long term buy and hold investing strategies?

    Does the Equity market sector believe this new way of investing is here to stay?..If so, can it continue to create and update ultra-fast data communication to cater for it...If the market sector disbelieves and is correct life carries on as before...but what happens if it is wrong?

    Time will tell....And as I said in my last post my son may be able to teach me how to invest...eh

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...

    ** a paradigm shift is defined as "an important change that happens when the usual way of thinking about or doing something is replaced by a new and different way." ...

    *** Algorithms are always unambiguous and are used as specifications for performing calculations, data processing, automated reasoning, and other tasks.
    Well, I'm an "old" investor and have heard all that before. In the end, fundamentals, like facts, matter. Every generation seems to forget that at some point.

  16. #9296
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    this is getting interesting

    POLITICS
    Nanaia Mahuta likens New Zealand-China relationship to 'dragon and taniwha


    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/polit...ays-agree.html



    China heaps praise on Nanaia Mahuta's 'remarkable' Five Eyes comments

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/polit...-comments.html



    New Zealand secures its interests by distancing from US-led clique

    https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202104/1221610.shtml


    British media claims Five Eyes has 'become four' after Nanaia Mahuta's comments on New Zealand's position


    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/polit...-position.html


    is NZ about to choose sides ?
    bull
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** ?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..
    Thats a solid negative to me for all of those three.
    For the sector question its not a paradigm shift, just a demand shift.
    For clarity, nothing I say is advice....

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    Hah...one lucky foray by your son and you are ready to re-invent yourself? Just say no. Gambling enriches the few at the expense of the many and investing wisely enriches the majority of those with the discipline and experience to be able to differentiate between the two. Those who venture into the "dark side" ramp up the risks and as the statistics advisers to casinos will tell you.."the house always comes out on top". Calling it by a different name may sound cool and up with the times but for the vast majority of people wanting to make their money work for them ...slow and steady will be less likely to have poor results. Making risky investments with several thousand dollars is not a big deal but try doing that with larger amounts and the results could be life altering and non recoverable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    Interesting discussion...I tend to think similar to Bull...."s post.
    Caution ...A Wednesday rant below

    We are living in IR4 (4th industrial revolution)
    From my perspective IR4 was just chugging along being "managed" by large corporate tech to guard their self interests and hampered by old infrastructure, legal processes, lack of desire to future proof, etc...

    However we all know from history that a Global Crisis or a World War helps to break down old established systems and creates a sudden surge of change and with it new disruptive companies/systems emerge and start to dominate.

    I think Co-vid pandemic has done this...This crisis has accelerated change which was previously forecast (managed) to happen in the late 2020's to happen now.....a leap

    Why I'm jealous of my son is partially money-wise but mostly because this leap is threatening to leave me behind..basically put..I'm old school using old school thinking and old school ways of doing things and that includes the way I invest..I have old memories which causes me to use bias decision-making, such as remembering about the aftermath of the "Dot Com Bubble". So.. as a "experienced investor I wag my finger at my son and say "you got away with it this time young man but this "pass the parcel" game is a mugs game ..

    ...but...Is it possible my advice is not relevant in today's way of investing?

    Is my twenty-something son actually more experienced than me ?

    Is it possible that we are experiencing a paradigm shift** and the switched on people are profiting from this window of opportunity?...

    Are we seeing a paradigm shift in certain sectors caused by the covid crisis (tech leap)? such as Health sectors Retail sectors etc..

    We are accustomed to bots running within all industry sectors. The Equity Market has bots which are algorithms*** Is TA becoming more important as this discipline is growing mass over that of Fundamental reasoning?

    Looking back at History... The problem with "managing" change is the risk of falling behind and with pent up "demand for change" pressure the flood-gates inevitably suddenly open up causing disruption to the old entrenched systems

    Is the latest wave of meme investing using social media tools becoming a powerful force, if true is it becoming a disruptive force capable of causing a paradigm shift within the stock market sector??

    Will this ongoing price/demand influence continue to turn fundamentals (and it's logic theories) on its head as it has done this last few years with egg over the Guru's faces and the industry's "so-called inexpenced call" young tech investors continue to make "quick-fire" money against all fundamental odds?

    Will this form of volatile investing (long and short) using quicker data transfer become the new normal and dominant form of investing at the expense of the more slow less intensive data transfer traditional long term buy and hold investing strategies?

    Does the Equity market sector believe this new way of investing is here to stay?..If so, can it continue to create and update ultra-fast data communication to cater for it...If the market sector disbelieves and is correct life carries on as before...but what happens if it is wrong?

    Time will tell....And as I said in my last post my son may be able to teach me how to invest...eh

    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...

    ** a paradigm shift is defined as "an important change that happens when the usual way of thinking about or doing something is replaced by a new and different way." ...

    *** Algorithms are always unambiguous and are used as specifications for performing calculations, data processing, automated reasoning, and other tasks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    ‘Investing’ is a ‘gamble’ as well ..... isn’t it .......maybe more respectable but still gambling
    Ridiculous comment.

    A govt bond is an investment as is a term deposit. If you have a definition for gambling that comfortably includes such instruments then you're being pedantically augmentative and should also include "hoping the ice cream doesnt melt on the way home". Sure speculating is a close verb to gambling but that is a subset of investing not an equivalent.

    Is crossing the road gambling or merely tying to get to the other side (or not if you are a chicken)?

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    Perhaps he should have quantified that as speculative investing?

    On the other hand, are Government bonds without risk? Plenty of dodgy Governments/Countries around the world, and I am not sure we are not one of them.
    Same can be said of term investments. It wouldn't be the first time a Government has reached into bank accounts of private individuals to prop themselves up. Never mind what might happen to a currency during the course of your fixed term.

    Having wealth of any kind is a risk, but most of us see it as a risk we would happily take on. Others spend it and will go to their graves happily knowing that the experience can't be taken from them (baring a dose of alzheimer's).

    As for the bleeding red portfolio I am looking at today - should have cashed up yesterday.

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