Black Monday

[SailorRob]

Replace consumer with shareholder welfare and it's true. You're right about prices but there could be a situation where people cannot afford even these low prices, without a secure income.

Consumer welfare and shareholder welfare are the same thing, the richer shareholders become the more cool goods and services are produced for the masses of consumers.

As a business owner or shareholder it's in your own interest to sell to as many customers as possible. The largest market in the world for any product is the entire world, all 8 billion of us. And so in reality, every new technology – even ones that start by selling to the rarefied air of high-paying big companies or wealthy consumers – rapidly proliferates until it’s in the hands of the largest possible mass market, ultimately everyone on the planet.

Your phone Panda... cool gadget.... cool for you cool for shareholders

[Daytr]

Consumer welfare and shareholder welfare are the same thing, the richer shareholders become the more cool goods and services are produced for the masses of consumers.

As a business owner or shareholder it's in your own interest to sell to as many customers as possible. The largest market in the world for any product is the entire world, all 8 billion of us. And so in reality, every new technology – even ones that start by selling to the rarefied air of high-paying big companies or wealthy consumers – rapidly proliferates until it’s in the hands of the largest possible mass market, ultimately everyone on the planet.

Your phone Panda... cool gadget.... cool for you cool for shareholders

One potential weakness in your argument is that a percentage of consumers you refer are out of work. Overall the net profits may increase but potentially into less hands. Further consolidation of wealth is what I think is the likely result & the trickle down economics you refer to will narrow.

[SailorRob]

One potential weakness in your argument is that a percentage of consumers you refer are out of work. Overall the net profits may increase but potentially into less hands. Further consolidation of wealth is what I think is the likely result & the trickle down economics you refer to will narrow.

Everyone who is out of work still consume though. Someone buys them iphones.

But yes anything is possible, perhaps with so many out of work but living well due to the abundance of goods and services, these folk could support elderly or other community initiatives massively improving society.

[mike2020]

I read a really good article on AI recently which I just cannot find at the moment but it should be mandatory reading. Potential for growth as a species is exponential and like todays phone AI will in time become a part of your everyday life. Imagine our greatest minds working alongside AI and the possibilities are endless. The only ones spreading fear are the ones looking to control the ownership or make money from another perspective.
If it does destroy the world though I wouldn't blame it, half of the USA voted Trump at one stage.

[SailorRob]

I read a really good article on AI recently which I just cannot find at the moment but it should be mandatory reading. Potential for growth as a species is exponential and like todays phone AI will in time become a part of your everyday life. Imagine our greatest minds working alongside AI and the possibilities are endless. The only ones spreading fear are the ones looking to control the ownership or make money from another perspective.
If it does destroy the world though I wouldn't blame it, half of the USA voted Trump at one stage.

Yeah, things were so much worse in every single metric under his presidency.

And the bloody wars he started!

[mike2020]

Yeah, things were so much worse in every single metric under his presidency.

And the bloody wars he started!

Your not an idiot, one person does not run a country but they do form a culture.

[SailorRob]

Your not an idiot, one person does not run a country but they do form a culture.

Even more true of America yes.

What you say is true but look at the massive and generational changes that occurred here within Months of a new government.

After 6 years, NZ is changed forever.

The NZ we all knew is gone forever. Period.

[Nor]

Actually SailorRob, re not this but re three waters but I don't remember where it was, I agree with you, it's a very bad idea. Just look at the state of the roads which are entrusted to central government, pot holes everywhere, hardly safe for 100K. If they're in charge of water we can expect the same cost cutting and bad or absent quality. Local people have an interest in getting it right.

(obviously I don't live in Wellington).

[SailorRob]

Actually SailorRob, re not this but re three waters but I don't remember where it was, I agree with you, it's a very bad idea. Just look at the state of the roads which are entrusted to central government, pot holes everywhere, hardly safe for 100K. If they're in charge of water we can expect the same cost cutting and bad or absent quality. Local people have an interest in getting it right.

(obviously I don't live in Wellington).

Yeah for those of us who have lived through it, the changes are awful and clear, but they are slow and incremental too.

If you have been gone for 6 years and then came home, you'd be in total shock.

[ValueNZ]

Yeah for those of us who have lived through it, the changes are awful and clear, but they are slow and incremental too.

If you have been gone for 6 years and then came home, you'd be in total shock.

Reminds me of this clip. Government expands one tiny step at a time, until you have full blown tyranny

"Things get to terrible places, one tiny step at a time.

If I encroach you and I'm sophisticated about it, I'm going to encroach two millimetres. I'm going to encroach right to the point where you begin to protest. Then I'm going to stop.


Then I'm going to wait.


I'm going to encroach again, right to the point where you protest. I'm going to stop. And then I'm going to wait.


I'm just going to do that forever.


Before you know it, you're going to be back three miles from where you started. And you'll have done it one step at a time. You'll ask "Oh, how did I get here?".


The answer is "Well I pushed you a little farther than you should have gone, and you agreed."