sharetrader
Page 20 of 20 FirstFirst ... 101617181920
Results 191 to 200 of 200
  1. #191
    Ignorant. Just ignorant.
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Wrong Side of the Tracks
    Posts
    1,587

    Default

    Out of idle curiosity, why are so many people so certain that the tax system is the best tool for solving the current housing crisis?

  2. #192
    Legend
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Sth Island. New Zealand.
    Posts
    6,428

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GTM 3442 View Post
    Out of idle curiosity, why are so many people so certain that the tax system is the best tool for solving the current housing crisis?
    That would take an extensive professional survey to find the answer. Check with Colmar Brunton or one of the various survey companies for a quote.

  3. #193
    Guru
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    4,612

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GTM 3442 View Post
    Out of idle curiosity, why are so many people so certain that the tax system is the best tool for solving the current housing crisis?
    There needs to be reform in many areas not just tax, imo.

    Ardern has more or less blamed the public for her failure to reform the tax system. She ruled out a CGT or Wealth tax. As Ardern's Party got a majority of votes, I am presuming that there may be more voters who think their self-interest is better served by allowing any housing issues to remain or worsen rather than reform the tax system.

    https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-...s-ive-listened
    Last edited by Bjauck; 16-12-2020 at 06:21 AM.

  4. #194
    Guru
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    , , .
    Posts
    3,257

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GTM 3442 View Post
    Out of idle curiosity, why are so many people so certain that the tax system is the best tool for solving the current housing crisis?
    It isn't but the the tax system isn't right either.
    CGT won't drop the house prices - may do as a one off but then off they go again.
    Even with a CGT residential leveraged property investment is still the best game in town to grow your capital base (for the average punter).

  5. #195
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Location
    Christchurch
    Posts
    1,063

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dobby41 View Post
    It isn't but the the tax system isn't right either.
    CGT won't drop the house prices - may do as a one off but then off they go again.
    Even with a CGT residential leveraged property investment is still the best game in town to grow your capital base (for the average punter).
    While CGT may not solely fix the housing crisis problem in NZ, it will promote investment into more productive areas (as commonly seen overseas in Canada, Aus, US, UK etc). The table is so one sided in NZ that only a fool would choose investments non-other than NZ residential properties. The proof is clear ; look what happen since COVID came about and interest rates crashed. NZ corporations as a % of total of NZ's debt/GDP is insignificant when compared to real estate debt & gov't debt. Other countries don't game it that way. You get the principal resident home as a one off, anything more and the taxation (as how it should be) will be treated at the same level as making any other investment (ie share ownership).

    Frankly i'm sick of the excuses of having no CGT in NZ. The TWG recommended it - why should Jacinda know better? It's like they're trying to find the be all end all 'single' fix solution when CGT was never intended to function that way to address affordable housing.

    Earlier in the week I also heard another silly proposal of taxing in NZ (came out from Auckland Uni if I recall correctly). The person on talk radio explained that to address wealth inequality, the rich will pay a direct tax on their assets based on the bank's 'free market rate' which is basically at term deposit rates. So if a person had $500K in cash and was to invest into NZ residential properties, he/she may get a loan of $1M to buy a house, the new tax proposal is that $500K would be treated as if it was invested in the banks TD rate (ie the risk free rate) and that rate would be taxed at the individual's marginal tax rate.

  6. #196
    Permanent Newbie
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    2,480

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GTM 3442 View Post
    Out of idle curiosity, why are so many people so certain that the tax system is the best tool for solving the current housing crisis?
    personally I don't think it is the best tool. As has been pointed out on here, Aussie has a capital gains tax and their housing market is similar to ours. One thing the govt could do is reduce the central banks inflation target to 0%. As housing and asset price inflation is a result of their policy to raise prices across the board at 2%.

    A capital gains tax could broaden the tax base and (I don't like to use the word fair as FP will attack if I use it) increase the perception of fairness as those with wealth benefiting from central bank and monetary policy would be seen to be contributing.
    Last edited by Aaron; 16-12-2020 at 10:39 AM. Reason: unnecessarily inflammatory

  7. #197
    Permanent Newbie
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    2,480

    Default

    Good news on the demand side of the problem. Everyone keeps yapping about the supply side but if we closed the borders demand for housing would drop considerably and if I understood economics 101 correctly decreased demand should lead to decreasing prices.

    https://www.interest.co.nz/property/...pared-year-ago

    If the country just declared a man made climate emergency surely filling the country up with more people is not an appropriate response unless of course the govt is full of s**t. I think Greta called it virtue signalling.

  8. #198
    Guru
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    , , .
    Posts
    3,257

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
    Good news on the demand side of the problem. Everyone keeps yapping about the supply side but if we closed the borders demand for housing would drop considerably and if I understood economics 101 correctly decreased demand should lead to decreasing prices.

    https://www.interest.co.nz/property/...pared-year-ago

    If the country just declared a man made climate emergency surely filling the country up with more people is not an appropriate response unless of course the govt is full of s**t. I think Greta called it virtue signalling.
    So that article says immigration down 90% but demand doesn't seem to have dropped?
    At the moment the border is open to Kiwis only - is that not enough closure of borders?

  9. #199
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Location
    Christchurch
    Posts
    1,063

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dobby41 View Post
    So that article says immigration down 90% but demand doesn't seem to have dropped?
    At the moment the border is open to Kiwis only - is that not enough closure of borders?
    "Home ownership rates have hit a 70 year low and those working in housing are not at all surprised. A new 150-page report from Stats NZ titled Housing in Aotearoa: 2020 reveals a grim portrait of the housing crisis."

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/progr...it-70-year-low

    Low interest rates encouraging more home ownership for an already limited supply.

    As for returning Kiwis - my opinion is they are only the 'displaced' / lost their job overseas etc. returning to NZ. I'm not sure how much wealth they would of brought back but those that are well established overseas with a decent job, assets, etc. would have no inclination to moving back here.

  10. #200
    Permanent Newbie
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    2,480

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dobby41 View Post
    So that article says immigration down 90% but demand doesn't seem to have dropped?
    At the moment the border is open to Kiwis only - is that not enough closure of borders?
    That would be great if it stayed that way, not likely though. More people, more demand more consumption more growth, in population, prices and money supply.
    The money supply would contract if population leveled off and becomes sustainable.
    Doesn't seem to have affected demand for houses as you say. Mind you S&P 500 up last night on stimulus expectation and gold up as well which I would have expected to fall if everything is coming right.

    I wonder if house buyers, share buyers, goldies and crypto might appreciate that each time central banks print it is getting larger and larger so I wonder if the frenzied buying is just a dawning realisation that dollars are risky and are a bad thing to hold. maybe not even a realisation but a natural response to what is happening. I wonder if this is what a currency collapse looks like with the price of everything shooting up as more and more currency gets printed.

    Shares or Property? Maybe both or whatever you can afford while you can afford it.

    Possibly a bit dramatic but seems to be the way we are headed climate emergency declaration or not.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •