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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by STMOD View Post

    However there is obviously a degree of dissatisfaction with recent events and this feedback will be taken into consideration in the future.

    STMOD
    Thanks for a more detailed response Mr STMOD - I think everyone realizes being STMOD is a fairly thankless task.....

    will we be seeing Rog back soon? ( just asking - no offense intended! )

  2. #32
    percy
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    Quote Originally Posted by STMOD View Post
    This post is from STMOD and does not represent the views of Vince or the Site owners.

    Thank you all for your posts and private messages received so far expressing your views.

    Not all the bans that happen on this site are by STMOD and at there is no intention of discussing individual bans.

    Much as posters have different views of individual companies, forum members have different views of what are acceptable posts and behaviours and this does lead, at times, to moderators being in a no-win situation. Someone is unhappy whatever decision is made.

    Moderators do not read every single post on this forum, though certain threads do at times get some attention, but in the main it is up to forum members to report posts that are considered inappropriate.
    Moderators are also not necessarily in a position to respond quickly to such reports and patient is required before the report is either acted on or not. Also whilst it is considered a courtesy to reply to reports that are not acted on, this is not always practicable.

    However there is obviously a degree of dissatisfaction with recent events and this feedback will be taken into consideration in the future.

    STMOD
    I think you must try harder.
    Banning members without reading the thread is a hopeless situation.
    You do yourself no credit,and let down Sharetrader site.
    In this latest case you banned both Roger and Paper Tiger,while there was no cause to ban Paper Tiger,had you read the thread.
    You did the same to me one time Roger baited me,and I questioned your judgementand.It would appear it has only been "good" members pointing out the errors of your ways, that both Paper Tiger and myself were quickly reinstated.
    Had you read the threads, and followed conversations over the years, you would have realised the best moderator the site has had has been a poster.! That poster has been Paper Tiger, who has questioned a number of posters, when they have had their facts wrong,or have just lost the plot.
    Banning Paper Tiger by mistake, just means your credibility is further lowered.
    I would also point out I have not seen Paper Tiger post since his ban was lifted.
    I would think you owe him an apology.
    Last edited by percy; 07-12-2015 at 07:05 PM.

  3. #33
    percy
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    Quote Originally Posted by STMOD View Post
    This is disappointing, but illustrated how things can get out of hand quickly.

    "Moderators do not read every single post on this forum" was meant to mean that the Moderators do not read every single post on this forum and not also mean that Moderators only read reported posts. I think we deserve a little more credit than that.

    Otherwise as stated earlier there is no intention of discussing individual bans.

    The intention is to move the debate forwards.

    STMOD
    I think we all would agree with your "intention to move the debate forward"and it is what a lot of us keep trying to achieve....??!!!

  4. #34
    Membaa
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    Quote Originally Posted by STMOD View Post
    This is disappointing, but illustrated how things can get out of hand quickly.

    "Moderators do not read every single post on this forum" was meant to mean that the Moderators do not read every single post on this forum and not also mean that Moderators only read reported posts. I think we deserve a little more credit than that.

    Otherwise as stated earlier there is no intention of discussing individual bans.

    The intention is to move the debate forwards.

    STMOD
    I agree, it is disappointing but healthy nevertheless, that at this juncture that a debate is sought.

    Many might not realise that STMOD is multiple identities, some privileged members, another with ultimate influence. The small differences in 'current user title' is perhaps lost on some, perhaps many? Explaining that would be a good start, along with what the role and powers of a moderator really is.

    My suggestion fwiw is an amnesty. That STMOD, the really angry guy, who decides ST online life and death, gives everyone in say the past year who has been banned or decided to leave an opportunity to return.

    (I should add that STMOD, I can't tell which one(s), has been equally as hard on me four times [and I deserved most of them in hindsight] as he has been concerned for my well being!)

    STMOD, you have their emails, invite them back, all of them, offering contrition and a definition of consequence. Restate the rules if it helps. Maybe those who are banned won't come back, maybe they will, I hope they will, all of them. We miss them, we miss the healthy debate, albeit sometimes heated. That's life, people have differing opinions, better to hear the opinion and debate it, sometimes battle it, than censor it forever.

    ST now lacks a certain colour and vibrancy without those folk who have been around a long time, are very astute and in the past twelve months or so suffered the ignominy of being permanently banned, or banned frequently enough, or for sufficient time as to decide with the delete button.

    Jmho, trying to progress the debate. Think amnesty, bring back the quality, and the colour.

    BAA

  5. #35
    percy
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    STMOD is right with "the intention to move the debate forwards. "
    This last banning came about by Paper Tiger trying exactly to do this.
    Years ago we had a poster,Dr.Who who used to post "I would never go near this dog". This sort of comment is very disappointing to the person who has spent a great deal of time researching a company,and putting forward solid reasons why this company is worth investing in.He never gave his reasons for why each company was a dog.He never "moved the debate forward."
    Time and time again we have seen posters posting similar type posts.In fact on the HNZ thread I have pointed this out time and time again;yes HNZ will receive a banking licence,no HNZ will not need to raise more capital,no HNZ do not have a large exposure to dairying or Auckland property market,yes HNZ have researched the no deposit Holden promotion,
    Yet every bit of bad news about dairying was posted on HNZ thread.We have been blessed lately with posters on that thread going back to their memory of GFC, while another poster retains his miss guided thoughts about the reason CSB joined in the formation of HNZ.Neither realise no depositor lost money with Marac,and CSB shareholders benefited by being part of a listed bank.
    So an AMNESTY sounds fine,so long as we have a strong STMOD, who will in fact do as he says "move the debate forward".
    Should this happen we will all benefit.
    As a sidebar it is interesting to note banned BFM, has won this year's NZX stock picking contest,being up a massive 75.22%.That is skill,not luck,yet we are missing out with him sharing his knowledge.
    Last edited by percy; 08-12-2015 at 08:17 AM.

  6. #36
    percy
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    Positive negative share knocking.!!
    The thread on ASX;"Dick Smith IPO."
    This thread makes for interesting reading.
    Posters Stranger Danger,Trader Jackson,Macduffy and Born2invest need to be thanked for their sage advice.
    Would have saved any one who thought of investing in the Dick Smith IPO a lot of money.
    A case of sharetrader working for the benefit of others.

  7. #37
    Legend minimoke's Avatar
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    So I got my first serve from STMOD today and posts deleted. I’m OK with that - I’ve already said that is their right. But it has given me a first hand experience of Moderation so I feel I am much better qualified to post on this thread.

    First up there is obviously no “natural justice” being applied by Moderators. It’s a simple concept. An bad poster gets a right to respond to accusations before sentence is passed. In my case I apparently strayed off topic (something I dispute) so that’s an immediate deletion of posts but I don’t get any right of reply even off line.

    Next, what do we do if there is a dispute? I reckon I was generally on topic, STMOD disagrees. How about a function where STMOD crosses out the post (you know that rule line thing through text) to give a poster a warning shot as well as a chance to edit and amend. Also other posters get to see the type of post that transgresses and learns from others without repeating the mistakes.

    And back to natural justice. What’s with the SDMOD being accuser, prosecution, Judge and executioner? Regardless of forum owners having rights, that’s a shed load of power to be wielding by one individual.

    I have already said I like the idea of an amnesty (or was that post deleted as well). I’d also like a note against forum members profile showing how long they are banned for and when they can re enter the fray. For example “Roger “seems to have disappeared off the Member list - how about a note showing how long he is banned for – temporary or permanent. Obviously my suggestion on a date of return didn’t go down well since that post was deleted.

    And finally how about having a precedent section – a section which shows posts that earnt a ban. It would help us understand limits and also describe the thresholds.

    Oh and one last idea. Consistency. Given my posts have been deleted due to being off topic (or whatever reason) we should expect all posts that don’t meet that standard to have the same treatment. Time will tell.

  8. #38
    percy
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    Well I think it is great we had our posts deleted as we had "lost focus" and moved "off topic."
    I had a good chuckle to myself when some one added to my reputation for a post I posted on this thread.
    [It was not STMOD].lol.

  9. #39
    Legend minimoke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by percy View Post
    Well I think it is great we had our posts deleted as we had "lost focus" and moved "off topic."
    I had a good chuckle to myself when some one added to my reputation for a post I posted on this thread.
    [It was not STMOD].lol.
    That may be so, but Forum rules only give a Mod the opportunity to delete posts if a rule is infringed. Those posts didn't infringe any rule as far as I can tell so the Mod is acting outside their authority. So to stay on topic I would like to see Mods acting with the rules - summarized below for reference. I dont see any rule that gives the Mod the right to delete something '"distracting from the important subject of this thread"

    By accessing, using and posting material on Tarawera Publishing Ltd's ("Tarawera") share information web site ("Sharetrader"), you as the User agree to abide by the following terms, conditions and rules ("Agreement").While Tarawera invites Users to engage in open discussion and presentation of views on Sharetrader, Tarawera and Users agree to seven basic rules designed to maintain Sharetrader as an interesting, informative, and legally permissible forum:
    1. Users will not interfere with the use and enjoyment of Sharetrader by other Users (for example, by harassing or threatening another participant of the message boards, including the use of expressions of bigotry, racism, sexism, hatred, or profanity);
    2. Users will not use Sharetrader to conduct any activity that is illegal (such as misleading and deceptive conduct) or violates the rights of others, provide instructional information about illegal activities, or promote physical harm or injury against any group or individual;
    3. Users will not use Sharetrader to advertise or sell products or services (including financial products and services such as securities) to others; or for spamming purposes to promote or encourage members to purchase products, services, or membership recruitment to others; doing so may incur a fee
    4. Users will not post or transmit material that is libellous, defamatory, obscene, fraudulent, harmful, threatening, or abusive, that violates the property rights of others (including without limitation copyright or trademark), that violates the privacy or publicity right of others, or that is used to circumvent manufacturer-installed copy-protection devices, including digital watermarks and registration numbers for software programs;
    5. Users will not post or disclose any personally identifiable information belonging to children or displaying material that exploits persons under 18 years of age;
    6. Users will not impersonate another User or Tarawera staff member; and
    7. User shall not post information on the site if they are a licensed investment adviser or representative of a licensed investment adviser.
    Tarawera has no responsibility for the content of any material posted by Users and Users are individually liable for the accuracy and authenticity of their postings. User profiles and any content posted by Users contains the opinions and views of theirs or others and Tarawera is not responsible for such content. Users should also be aware that it may be difficult to identify and locate the person making postings therefore taking legal action may not be possible.
    If a User violates this Agreement or if Tarawera believes in good faith that any portion of the material a User posts is infringing any copyrights or proprietary rights after Tarawera becomes aware of such breach, Tarawera reserves the right in its sole discretion to:

    1. edit or delete in whole or in part such User's posted material appearing on Sharetrader;
    2. refuse access to all or portions of Sharetrader to such User; and/or
    3. terminate such User's right to access or use and/or membership.
    4. Charge such User a spamming or advertising fee as follows;

  10. #40
    percy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crackity View Post
    Is it true some of the members are on strike? Please clarify anyone in the know - I'd hate to be a scab! Solidarity Brothers....?
    When is the strike due to start.?

  11. #41
    percy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crackity View Post
    Already I believe thru the grapevine
    Must be a very local [Auckland] strike,as it has had no affect down here.!

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by minimoke View Post
    That may be so, but Forum rules only give a Mod the opportunity to delete posts if a rule is infringed. Those posts didn't infringe any rule as far as I can tell so the Mod is acting outside their authority. So to stay on topic I would like to see Mods acting with the rules - summarized below for reference. I dont see any rule that gives the Mod the right to delete something '"distracting from the important subject of this thread"

    By accessing, using and posting material on Tarawera Publishing Ltd's ("Tarawera") share information web site ("Sharetrader"), you as the User agree to abide by the following terms, conditions and rules ("Agreement").While Tarawera invites Users to engage in open discussion and presentation of views on Sharetrader, Tarawera and Users agree to seven basic rules designed to maintain Sharetrader as an interesting, informative, and legally permissible forum:
    1. Users will not interfere with the use and enjoyment of Sharetrader by other Users (for example, by harassing or threatening another participant of the message boards, including the use of expressions of bigotry, racism, sexism, hatred, or profanity);
    2. Users will not use Sharetrader to conduct any activity that is illegal (such as misleading and deceptive conduct) or violates the rights of others, provide instructional information about illegal activities, or promote physical harm or injury against any group or individual;
    3. Users will not use Sharetrader to advertise or sell products or services (including financial products and services such as securities) to others; or for spamming purposes to promote or encourage members to purchase products, services, or membership recruitment to others; doing so may incur a fee
    4. Users will not post or transmit material that is libellous, defamatory, obscene, fraudulent, harmful, threatening, or abusive, that violates the property rights of others (including without limitation copyright or trademark), that violates the privacy or publicity right of others, or that is used to circumvent manufacturer-installed copy-protection devices, including digital watermarks and registration numbers for software programs;
    5. Users will not post or disclose any personally identifiable information belonging to children or displaying material that exploits persons under 18 years of age;
    6. Users will not impersonate another User or Tarawera staff member; and
    7. User shall not post information on the site if they are a licensed investment adviser or representative of a licensed investment adviser.
    Tarawera has no responsibility for the content of any material posted by Users and Users are individually liable for the accuracy and authenticity of their postings. User profiles and any content posted by Users contains the opinions and views of theirs or others and Tarawera is not responsible for such content. Users should also be aware that it may be difficult to identify and locate the person making postings therefore taking legal action may not be possible.
    If a User violates this Agreement or if Tarawera believes in good faith that any portion of the material a User posts is infringing any copyrights or proprietary rights after Tarawera becomes aware of such breach, Tarawera reserves the right in its sole discretion to:

    1. edit or delete in whole or in part such User's posted material appearing on Sharetrader;
    2. refuse access to all or portions of Sharetrader to such User; and/or
    3. terminate such User's right to access or use and/or membership.
    4. Charge such User a spamming or advertising fee as follows;
    Mini - you seem to have killed all discussion / debate about STMod fairness or not

    Is it game,set and match then
    “In a roaring bull market, knowledge is superfluous and experience is a handicap.”

    –Benjamin Graham”

  13. #43
    always learning ... BlackPeter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    Mini - you seem to have killed all discussion / debate about STMod fairness or not

    Is it game,set and match then
    Not sure whether it was Mini killing the discussion. I would have hoped to see Roger and PT by now back into action, but it appears STMOD does not desire to right past wrongs.

    Regrettably we haven't heard either about an intention to improve the process moving forward. Begs the question: why bother to continue this discussion?
    ----
    "Prediction is very difficult, especially about the future" (Niels Bohr)

  14. #44
    The approachable Admin Guy

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    Ok, this is all new to me, haven't been around for the past two weeks.

    With regards to bannings, going to be having a look at things to see what's happened to bring this about about. Not too sure why Roger & PT have been banned but I'll look into that also.

    In the interim I've taken the bans off both Roger & PT till I work out what has happened.

    Cheers,
    Vince

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    Ok, this is all new to me, haven't been around for the past two weeks.

    With regards to bannings, going to be having a look at things to see what's happened to bring this about about. Not too sure why Roger & PT have been banned but I'll look into that also.

    In the interim I've taken the bans off both Roger & PT till I work out what has happened.

    Cheers,
    Vince

    That gets a big from me Vince!
    Last edited by Crackity; 11-12-2015 at 11:28 PM. Reason: sp

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