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  1. #16
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    [QUOTE=JBmurc;650293]Martin Armstrong-

    all these people calling Trump racist or Nazi, are just insane. They should go to Europe and see how people are living in fear because of the refugees. And as for Trump building his wall, well they should take notice of London. They are looking to build a steel wall all around London to protect it from terrorist attacks. These same type of people welcomed the refugees and allowed terrorists to infiltrate Europe. This very same reasoning they are now applying to the United States and calling Trump a racist because he wants to block people coming from those countries in the Middle East. It is one thing to accept genuine families. Not 25 year old males pretending to be children.
    I am sorry. I will have no problem calling Trump out for creating a police state. But I am willing to stand and observe before I jump on words. As they always say – actions speak louder than words. We will see. None of what Obama said he would do from closing Guantanamo Bay prison to shutting down the NSA unconstitutional abuse of George Bush ever took place. We just have to see. The very tolerance these people say Trump does not have, is exactly what they practice concerning anyone who disagrees with them.

    https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/i...against-trump/



    Thanks JB for the link to Martin Armstrong which you posted on another link. I spent hours reading his blog which is fascinating. I think his analysis is really good and interesting, however I don’t like his personal beliefs. I need to separate the two. A person can be a very successful economist, businessman or politician or whatever and can also be sexist, racist, a bully or any sort of unpleasant person to deal with if you are don’t belong to the ‘in” group and/or don’t agree with him.

    I don’t like his personal beliefs because I see equality as an desirable goal and I don’t like sexism, racism, classism or any other – isms including narcissism that oppress groups of people.
    It is great to debate the issues but don’t attack and belittle people in order to win your argument, and in his discussion of people who disagree with Trump he scores highly on 2 below. Saying or acting as if you hate, dislike or fear the group.

    http://crooksandliars.com/kenneth-qu...ms-racism-sexi
    So here you go, if you do any of these things below in connection with your interactions with or discussion of a particular group of people based on their demographic characteristics (race, gender, age, religion, sexual identity, ethnicity, national origin, etc.), then you are entering into territory where you are being offensive and morally wrong. This doesn’t make you a racist, sexist, etc., automatically, but it does push you in that direction and you should examine your actions, words, etc.

    1. Directing physical or emotional harm or wishing harm upon the group
    2. Saying or acting as if you hate, dislike or fear the group
    3. Denying rights to members of the group
    4. Refusing to hire, associate with or otherwise interact with members of the group, including segregating the group in society
    5. Opposing government programs that disproportionately help a group that faces a history or present marked by discrimination or mistreatment
    6. Treating members of the group differently than you treat members of your group
    7. Treating everyone in the group the same–even if the treatment is positive
    8. Saying you know better than the group does what is happening to them or what is best for them
    9. Denying real-life experiences or statistically-proven challenges that the group disproportionately faces
    10. Use of language that is derogatory towards the group, even if you don’t agree that it is derogatory or that you didn't know was derogatory
    11. Ignorance of the history, challenges, language and culture that causes the group problems
    12. Being blind to the differences between the group and other groups
    13. Stating that your group faces the same problems as a group that statistically faces more of the problem or more intense versions of the problem
    14. Telling members of the group that they shouldn’t be “sensitive” about problems that they face
    15. Using the term “politically correct” (or some variation) to dismiss complaints from the group about discrimination or prejudice directed at them
    16. Use of words that specifically or through implication imply that the group is inferior or disfavored
    17. Failure to include members of the group in your media portrayals (unless warranted), focus groups, advertising targets, voter outreach, etc.

  2. #17
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    Mutual admiration societies like the one created here to salve the minds of the left losers who were so sure that they would drive Trump out and have a victory for once, are common and have been around for years. Usually they become so heated that their arse catches fire and that distracts them long enough to see them drift into oblivion while the rest of the world get on with it.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by craic View Post
    Mutual admiration societies like the one created here to salve the minds of the left losers who were so sure that they would drive Trump out and have a victory for once, are common and have been around for years. Usually they become so heated that their arse catches fire and that distracts them long enough to see them drift into oblivion while the rest of the world get on with it.
    Craig, I am surprised that you still don't get that this has nothing to do with Left and Right. Trumps advertised policies (well, if you can find some he still sticks with) are not particularly hard right, but only populist, while admittedly his actions seem to be designed to make the rich richer (tax cuts for the billionaires) and the poor people die earlier (take their health insurance).

    This discussion is not about the political spectrum, but about decent people highlighting the actions of a liar and a deeply corrupted politician.

    And yes - there are corrupt politicians on both sides of the political spectrum, but this does not make it right to trust the biggest gator to drain the swamp.

    It is important to keep the crooked actions of Trump and his buddies in peoples minds. And yes - you are right, it won't change the world immediately, but given that Italy managed to get after 12 years rid of Berlusconi and the world managed after 12 years to get rid of Adolf Hitler ... I am sure, that while it will be a painful time to come for everybody (but a few selected rich), I am sure the world will get rid of him and will be better for it.

    Just let me ask you a question: Given that members of your family died fighting for free speech, equality, against racism and for human rights - why are you supporting a crook who wants to turn the clock back to the dark ages of fascism?
    Last edited by BlackPeter; 05-01-2017 at 10:37 AM. Reason: removed bracket surplus to requirements
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBmurc View Post
    “I would have no problem. I would love that. That would be wonderful,” Trump said in response to Howard Stern asking his daughter Ivanka Trump if she would date a black man during a 2005 interview.

    Attachment 8578
    Just because Trump says something does not mean it is true. As far as I am concerned Trump has very little integrity and I don’t believe or trust what he says. Trump says what is convenient at the time and that is the issue. For me this discussion is about the truth and what is true and what is not. This article may be exaggerating that only 9% of what Trump says is true or mostly true, but even if 25% is true or mostly true that is a very sad state affairs for the world. That means 75% to 89% of what Trump says is lies or deliberately misleading. That means that most of the time you cannot trust or believe him.

    We are living in a culture of denial, lies and deception and that is the issue. I expect better from our leaders. How can America be great if the best of the politicians are lying nearly half the time?

    http://www.politicususa.com/2016/03/31/ninety-one-percent-donald-trump-false.html

    Donald Trump, the Republican front-runner, is at the bottom of the Politifact list with a sad 9% of true or mostly true statements. Just 9% of the things Donald Trump says are mostly related to the truth.
    What does it mean that the man who tells the most lies is the most popular with the Republican base? This is a question I would be asking myself if I were a Republican strategist. The answer is not simple, in spite of the escalating finger pointing on the right. But I would direct them toward their propensity for denial, lack of accountability, and refusal to take responsibility for their own policies.

    Republicans started off by not holding their own to the fire of accountability and those justifications and that sense of entitlement have been the only trickle down they’ve seen. Now they have a party full of voters who do not want to deal with reality, who feel entitled to have privileges over minorities, and who love to be lied to. Think of the aging wealthy man who believes the young girl is with him because he’s so hot. That’s the base level deception and emotional motivation driving the Republican party voters – they want someone who makes them feel good about themselves, who holds up a mirror that makes them hot, right and rich.

    They love the lie because ideologies comfort the voter. Everyone wants to feel like they are right, righteous, and morally superior. The problem comes when people can’t accept reality because reality says they were not right. And instead of admitting that and adjusting course, they demand that everyone get blamed equally while still claiming they never made a mistake. (And the “fourth estate” not only allows this but plays dumb regarding basic facts in order to make this work.) This level of petulant avoidance of reality is what got the Republican party to the point where their base loves the biggest liar the best.

    They don’t care that Donald Trump lies; they love him because his lies soothe them. His lies appease them. His lies make them feel justified and righteous. His lies make them feel good about who they are. The voters are the children who do not want to be grown ups and the grown ups in the party have indulged them and fed them candy to keep from having to parent, and now they are stuck with a monster of a child.

  5. #20
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    Though Donald Trump has been exposed because of the election, trumping really starts come the 20th of January '17. So hold your fire and keep your powder dry until it becomes obvious he's not really good after all. At least he's not that Duterte guy eliminating all drug addicts/pushers/suppliers without the benefit of a trial.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPeter View Post
    Done .....
    Thanks BP. Maybe the correct answer to your thread title is now, "all of the preceding"

    Quote Originally Posted by Raz View Post
    Well put, not that the people here wish to consider another point of view. Antichrist is ridiculous.
    Okay it is a little OTT and highly speculative BUT you never know do you ? To me he embodies just about everything there is in being evil. Even makes horrible disparaging remarks about his own daughter Ivanka. Just my opinion, everyone is entitled to their own mate.
    No butts, hold no mutts, (unless they're the furry variety).

  7. #22
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    Huge defense forces cheering for Trump at Army Vs Navy game ...recently

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONZWKXY0hGI


    And years earlier when Obama was there ?? >>>>>>>>>>

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzEqbE_Jmn4
    Last edited by JBmurc; 05-01-2017 at 03:06 PM.
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBmurc View Post
    Huge defense forces cheering for Trump at Army Vs Navy game ...recently

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONZWKXY0hGI


    And years earlier when Obama was there ?? >>>>>>>>>>

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzEqbE_Jmn4
    Trump's deliberately getting off-side with China and wants to give a bit of boost to the arms race - when the disadvantaged in the USA become more disadvantaged, Trump will give them a job in the armed forces. Nuremberg PA ought to prepare their parade grounds...

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raz View Post
    ... Antichrist is ridiculous.
    Thank you for this contribution - actually made me think.

    If you come from a religious perspective, you might be right. I am no specialist on this subject but I suppose that Trump is just a normal (though very indecent and morally corrupt) mortal. We can agree on that.

    Now - it was always customary to call very bad people "devil". Mugabe earned this title. So did Pol Pot, Hitler, Stalin and many more.

    Question is whether Trump reached already the threshold to deserve this title. Well, lets ask the man himself:

    Trump did set the bar by calling his political opponent Hillary Clinton "the devil".

    http://fortune.com/2016/10/09/presid...clinton-devil/

    Given that Trump is a much worse liar (you don't need to do a lot of research to find that out), given that he is much more corrupted than Clinton (actually it is now the Trump foundation which is under investigation), and given that Trump is (as he proudly admitted) a sexual predator - if he calls Hillary the devil, what would be an appropriate name for him?
    ----
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  10. #25
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    Top post BP, I couldn't agree more.
    No butts, hold no mutts, (unless they're the furry variety).

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPeter View Post

    Given that Trump is a much worse liar (you don't need to do a lot of research to find that out), given that he is much more corrupted than Clinton (actually it is now the Trump foundation which is under investigation), and given that Trump is (as he proudly admitted) a sexual predator - if he calls Hillary the devil, what would be an appropriate name for him?
    Certainly not the Anti-Christ. He just doesn't match the biblical description.

    Then I saw another beast that rose out of the earth; it had two horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. It exercises all the authority of the first beast on its behalf, and it makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound had been healed. It performs great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in the sight of all; and by the signs that it is allowed to perform on behalf of the beast, it deceives the inhabitants of earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that had been wounded by the sword and yet lived; and it was allowed to give breath to the image of the beast so that the image of the beast could even speak and cause those who would not worship the image of the beast to be killed. Also it causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead, so that no one can buy or sell who does not have the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name.

    — Revelation 13:11–17 NRSV (1989)


    And I saw three foul spirits like frogs coming from the mouth of the dragon, from the mouth of the beast, and from the mouth of the false prophet. These are demonic spirits, performing signs, who go abroad to the kings of the whole world, to assemble them for battle on the great day of God the Almighty.

    — Revelation 16:13–14 NRSV (1989)


    Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies gathered to make war against the rider on the horse and against his army. And the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who had performed in its presence the signs by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped its image. These two were thrown alive into the lake of fire that burns with sulfur.

    — Revelation 19:19–20 NRSV (1989)


    And the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

    — Revelation 20:10 NRSV (1989)

    I can't wait for the real one to arrive. Might get in a bigger telly, like they do for the Olympics and world cup.
    Last edited by fungus pudding; 05-01-2017 at 05:26 PM.

  12. #27
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    My Dad was a Presbyterian minister for over 40 years and never preached on Revelation. When asked why he said there were so many different ways if could be interpreted...so I won't try either.
    Last edited by Beagle; 05-01-2017 at 05:33 PM.
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  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by fungus pudding View Post
    Certainly not the Anti-Christ. He just doesn't match the biblical description.

    Then I saw another beast that rose out of the earth; it had two horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. It exercises all the authority of the first beast on its behalf, and it makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound had been healed. It performs great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in the sight of all; and by the signs that it is allowed to perform on behalf of the beast, it deceives the inhabitants of earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that had been wounded by the sword and yet lived; and it was allowed to give breath to the image of the beast so that the image of the beast could even speak and cause those who would not worship the image of the beast to be killed. Also it causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead, so that no one can buy or sell who does not have the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name.

    — Revelation 13:11–17 NRSV (1989)


    And I saw three foul spirits like frogs coming from the mouth of the dragon, from the mouth of the beast, and from the mouth of the false prophet. These are demonic spirits, performing signs, who go abroad to the kings of the whole world, to assemble them for battle on the great day of God the Almighty.

    — Revelation 16:13–14 NRSV (1989)


    Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies gathered to make war against the rider on the horse and against his army. And the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who had performed in its presence the signs by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped its image. These two were thrown alive into the lake of fire that burns with sulfur.

    — Revelation 19:19–20 NRSV (1989)


    And the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

    — Revelation 20:10 NRSV (1989)

    I can't wait for the real one to arrive. Might get in a bigger telly, like they do for the Olympics and world cup.
    Hi FP - you are probably more proficient with the bible (and certainly with an English language copy) than I am, so I take your expert advise. As well - I have no intent in turning this thread into a religious discussion.

    On the other hand ... anybody who watched relevant TV Programs (Buffy springs to mind, or the Charmed ones) knows that demons can change their shape and form - so really "How do you know that Trump is not the Anti Christ" ?

    More seriously (for religious people) ... just check the bible - as far as I remember from my religious studies appears the devil in many different forms. He tempted Jesus during his 40 days in the desert in human form and he appears in the Genesis as snake (successfully tempting Eve). I think just trusting that he appears as described in the verses of revelation might be a bit risky ... better consult your local priest .
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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPeter View Post
    Hi FP - you are probably more proficient with the bible (and certainly with an English language copy) than I am, so I take your expert advise.
    I doubt it. That's straight from the Wikipedia scriptures.

  15. #30
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    Actually - just consulted expert advise ... and happy to report that FP is right: Donald Trump is NOT the Anti-Christ (as described in the bible).

    http://www.prophecyproof.org/2016/06...mp-antichrist/

    There are apparently two certain indicators:

    1) The Antichrist does not desire women, but Donald Trump does (as we all know, he loves to touch their genitalia without consent, while the Anti Christ would never do that (with or without consent)

    “Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.” (Dan 11:37)
    2) The Antichrist is much more charismatic than Donald Trump ever will be.
    (sorry - no citation on that, you just need to trust the expert)

    So glad we could sort this tricky problem out. Still - I think it is a great question, and hey - we don't need to tell the others that we now know the answer. I like the title of this thread ...
    ----
    "Prediction is very difficult, especially about the future" (Niels Bohr)

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