AIR - Air NZ.

[BlackPeter]

@BlackPeter (looking after customers who out of no fault of their own could not use the service they paid for)

Same could be said for AIR (through no fault of their own could NOT DELIVER the service paid for)

Absolutely. No service, no pay. That's the way it should be. However AIR didn't deliver (no matter why) but still kept the money. This is highway robbery.

But be that as it may ... AIR prefers to smear their brand and who am I in trying to stop them to do so? Many other carriers around the world behaved more customer friendly and either repaid or provided full credit (some even 110% credit if customer choose credit vs. refund).

Next time I am going to fly I will pick a carrier where my money is safe. If you prefer to feed AIR's troughers - feel free to do so. I am sure they are happy to take donations as well, why don't you send them money now?

[Blue Skies]

Despite the fact Cam Wallace Chief Revenue Officer said in so many words, if AIR had to refund all the prepaid tickets it would bankrupt the airline ( & would have to draw down on Govt loan to keep flying), the SP is up 6% today.
Just shows how utterly irrational & unpredictable the market is now.

[Beagle]

Irrational exuberance with airline stocks at present, certainly not limited to AIR N.Z.
Reality will bite really hard in due course. Their most recent operating statistics out on Wednesday were an absolute shocker. http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-websit...105/323806.pdf

[Jantar]

If the airline cannot provide the service that you booked, then there are certain rights under the CGA and FTA. Some airlines are portraying themselves as being generous when in fact, they are merely (nearly) obeying the law.

But they could still provide that service. That flight did go to Queenstown on that day at that time. It was our decision to not fly.

[k14]

Absolutely. No service, no pay. That's the way it should be. However AIR didn't deliver (no matter why) but still kept the money. This is highway robbery.

But be that as it may ... AIR prefers to smear their brand and who am I in trying to stop them to do so? Many other carriers around the world behaved more customer friendly and either repaid or provided full credit (some even 110% credit if customer choose credit vs. refund).

Next time I am going to fly I will pick a carrier where my money is safe. If you prefer to feed AIR's troughers - feel free to do so. I am sure they are happy to take donations as well, why don't you send them money now?

Agree. The lack of flexibility around the credit is the real problem. If they provided the option of a cash refund or dollar for dollar airpoints credit (solely to be used to buy flights) then I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people opted for the credit. I am relatively unaffected (about $1k of flights for 4 people flying domestically) but the people with overseas credits are being rorted which is totally unfair imo. The shareholders should be the ones that take the loss (just like they have been taking the gains for the last 10 years) not the customers.

[biker]

Irrational exuberance with airline stocks at present, certainly not limited to AIR N.Z.
Reality will bite really hard in due course. Their most recent operating statistics out on Wednesday were an absolute shocker. http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-websit...105/323806.pdf

Irrational or not, a lot of money says AIR has a great future.
IMO Foran and his merry men and women will dice then drive this airline so hard the profits will be surprising. Lean and very Mean but very profitable.
The ideal corporate outcome.
It’s not about the people. It’s about the shareholders.
Glad I’m not short.

[dobby41]

Agree. The lack of flexibility around the credit is the real problem. If they provided the option of a cash refund or dollar for dollar airpoints credit (solely to be used to buy flights) then I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people opted for the credit. I am relatively unaffected (about $1k of flights for 4 people flying domestically) but the people with overseas credits are being rorted which is totally unfair imo. The shareholders should be the ones that take the loss (just like they have been taking the gains for the last 10 years) not the customers.

If I was offered a refund I'd take it - I'd use the cash later for a flight but it is mine.
So then the company would have a huge run on cash.
The credit is flexible - I just (2 days ago) used $400 of a $1100 international credit (one of several we have) for a domestic flight. The rest of the credit is back with me to use later. In fact the credit is held in A$ as it was a oneway return from Aus.

[Beagle]

They can't issue cash refunds while keeping enough in reserve (including the Govt's loan) to have any sort of shot at getting through Covid 19 so they have no option but to burn up customer goodwill at an unprecedented rate.
We are nowhere near any sort of resolution of Covid 19 overseas.
I think they will burn up all existing equity and lose over $2,000m before they're properly on the other side of Covid 19. I think including extraordinary items about $700 - $800m of losses in FY20, (only 4 months effects from Covid 19) and a similar size in FY21 (12 months effects from Covid 19) and more losses in FY22. They might turn a small profit in FY23. Their international business is in complete tatters and will be for at least 2 years in my opinion.

I am very comfortable with my short position.

[Zaphod]

But they could still provide that service. That flight did go to Queenstown on that day at that time. It was our decision to not fly.

The service is the entire booking not just one sector within the booking. Unless this was a one-way booking, two separate one-way bookings, or the return sector was somehow booked to occur after lockdown lifted (unlikely given the date was unknown), then they were liable.

[macduffy]

Is Beagle's assessment is correct and if we assume that "cancelled" customers are unsecured creditors, shouldn't AIR be liquidated as an insolvent company?