AIR - Air NZ.

[KiwiGekko]

Way back on this thread I think it was Roger (probably) who said that Chris Luxon told the annual meeting they paid only $150m for their Dreamliners and they're getting 24% better seat mile costs than the 767-300's that they were replacing.

Yes it was Roger, is he still around? From what I have read its quite common for aircraft to be sold at a discount off the list price, so I worked on $150m for the 787's in my above assumptions.

[Joshuatree]

Unless "Roger probably who" ;worked for AIR and had inside info ,what an airline paid for its planes i would have thought to be commercially very sensitive taboo subject ?. Its inevitable competition is and will increase when Airlines are in such a lucrative sweet spot we are in. Its conceivable that all these incredibly cheap older planes could compete despite maintenance and higher fuel costs; be int to see your finished spreadsheet kg.

AIR I'm hoping will be a good performer for awhile and I'm watching the s/p slowly ,slowly crawl up and it will be testing the last 3 peaks shortly($2.95-$2.99). With such handsome profits coming and similar expectations (look at the number of AIR picks in the 2016 share comp). I hope it overcomes that hurdle in the 4th attempt.We will know shortly.

[KiwiGekko]

The 787 will last you ten years without major work. The old 777 ,less than two...

I'd be keen to know if you have any more information on what maintenance an older 777 might need and how frequently after 10 years. AIR obviously think their older aircraft are worth upgrading spending $100m on refitting the internals as written here: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ectid=11349416

Some articles I have read estimate around US $20m to overhaul the aircraft and NZ $12m (so US $8.5m) for an internal refit so have updated my figures now assuming a $36.5m 777-200ER. I would be keen to hear from anyone who might be able to confirm how realistic these figures would be?

[winner69]

Robomo once mentioned about $30m for an E check on a 777 - whatever that is

May help

[brend]

Yes it was Roger, is he still around? From what I have read its quite common for aircraft to be sold at a discount off the list price, so I worked on $150m for the 787's in my above assumptions.

AIR was the launch customer so they got a pretty decent discount and $150mill sounds about right from the ASM. In addition to this AIR acquired 2x787 that was test models at an even better price but unfortunately they are a little bit heavier.

The fuel efficiency are better than expected from Luxon.

The 777 fleet upgrade I believe is now completed and they need as many planes out over the summer break. In terms of the maintenance costs its the D check thats the most expensive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aircra...tenance_checks

D checks say $1.5Million to $2million

Might be fair to say the D checks were done on the 777 fleet while getting the refurb done since they did have to gut the plane out to get an extra seat per row in.

[Robomo]

AIR was the launch customer so they got a pretty decent discount and $150mill sounds about right from the ASM. In addition to this AIR acquired 2x787 that was test models at an even better price but unfortunately they are a little bit heavier.

The fuel efficiency are better than expected from Luxon.

The 777 fleet upgrade I believe is now completed and they need as many planes out over the summer break. In terms of the maintenance costs its the D check thats the most expensive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aircra...tenance_checks

D checks say $1.5Million to $2million

Might be fair to say the D checks were done on the 777 fleet while getting the refurb done since they did have to gut the plane out to get an extra seat per row in.

My post 4051: A D check takes about 50,000 man hours and cost is about 70% labour, 30% parts. Assuming charge-out rate of $100 per hour that would mean about $8 million for the most expensive D check. Basically, pull the plane apart, check and renew as needed, put it back together again. Planes have a finite life so those with high hours and lots of landings have limited flying time left. The Delta CEO (Anderson) announced he had signed a letter of intent to purchase a 777-200 for $7.7 million but no details on usage, what checks and refurb are needed etc. It would be an intersting question to put to him at the next shareholdrs meeting about how much was spent to get that particular plane into service and how reliable it proved to be once in service.

[Zaphod]

Adding to what's been outlined above, short-haul routes cause the most damage due to jets due to the landing/take-off forces exerted on the aircraft, and metal fatigue caused by much higher numbers of pressurisation/depressurisation cycles.

[Zaphod]

Adding to what's been outlined above, short-haul routes cause the most damage due to jets due to the landing/take-off forces exerted on the aircraft, and metal fatigue caused by much higher numbers of pressurisation/depressurisation cycles.

[Zaphod]

Yes it was Roger, is he still around?

He usually disappears from Sharetrader around December for his well earned break from posting.

[777]

He usually disappears from Sharetrader around December for his well earned break from posting.

Still sitting out his banning sentence I think.