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Thread: AIR - Air NZ.

  1. #17291
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    Are they obliged to refund non-refundable tickets? Providing a credit seems reasonable to me.

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    That Herald article Beagle linked to a page or two back with Wallace claiming they had to make some tough calls re refunds etc, said this:

    While he would not disclose how much paying out the non-refundable tickets would cost, it could be close to $100 million.


    Either that figure is wildly conservative, or there is something seriously wrong with the decision makers at AIR. Really at the end of the day, what difference is $100m going to make in the broad scheme of things? I don't know what their advertising budget is in the good times, but the damage being done here is going to take a hell of a lot to put right. As someone pointed out above, it's not the customer's job to fund AIR through these troubled skys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tim23 View Post
    Are they obliged to refund non-refundable tickets? Providing a credit seems reasonable to me.
    I think what gets me is cancelled bookings when the flights are not actually cancelled and credit is not even available to rebook.

  4. #17294
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    Quote Originally Posted by tim23 View Post
    Are they obliged to refund non-refundable tickets? Providing a credit seems reasonable to me.
    I don't think they are (that's why they are called non-refundable), and if I couldn't use my ticket (in normal circumstances), I would have to suck up the 100% loss of my ticket price, so from that perspective I am happy that I get a credit, although a refund would be preferable, as circumstances change. But you get what you pay for, and I wasn't going to pay a lot extra for a flexi-fare (or whatever) on a flight I was 100% going to be on.
    However, I didn't decide to not use my ticket. I had every intention to be on that flight. They cancelled the flight...….(which I know wasn't their choice).
    But yeah. I'm okay with a credit on a non-refundable ticket.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimy View Post
    I don't think they are (that's why they are called non-refundable), and if I couldn't use my ticket (in normal circumstances), I would have to suck up the 100% loss of my ticket price, so from that perspective I am happy that I get a credit, although a refund would be preferable, as circumstances change. But you get what you pay for, and I wasn't going to pay a lot extra for a flexi-fare (or whatever) on a flight I was 100% going to be on.
    However, I didn't decide to not use my ticket. I had every intention to be on that flight. They cancelled the flight...….(which I know wasn't their choice).
    But yeah. I'm okay with a credit on a non-refundable ticket.
    You can cancel a non-refundable ticket with a fee I believe? We paid around $1600 for some.flights and went to cancel on the website in early march, it showed we would need to pay around $400 in fees which we were going to just write off and take the loss, but at least get some money back. At the last stage of the process it said no online refunds, call if your flight is within 48 hours or bugger off until closer to the time.

  6. #17296
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclical View Post
    That Herald article Beagle linked to a page or two back with Wallace claiming they had to make some tough calls re refunds etc, said this:

    While he would not disclose how much paying out the non-refundable tickets would cost, it could be close to $100 million.


    Either that figure is wildly conservative, or there is something seriously wrong with the decision makers at AIR. Really at the end of the day, what difference is $100m going to make in the broad scheme of things? I don't know what their advertising budget is in the good times, but the damage being done here is going to take a hell of a lot to put right. As someone pointed out above, it's not the customer's job to fund AIR through these troubled skys.
    He was interviewed by HEDPA tonight she said why don't you refund everyone bearing in mind you have Govt money to call on ? He said they were trying to conserve their cash so they could come out of this in the best way . when pushed from memory he said if they refunded everyone it would be all gone . He also stated they would need the Govt money in the short to med term to fund all the operations, staff,maintenance , fuel,.....This was Newstalk ZB I think 5.30-6.00 roughly.

  7. #17297
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    Looking at the FY19 annual report, it has "Revenue in advance" of $1.372b. This was broadly in line with FY18.

    Would have to think a reasonable chunk of that $1.3b want their money back, as alot will be international flights, no timeline for border openings etc. Say if 50% wanted their money back, that is $650m.

    They started this with about $1b until they started burning cash, and now down to $650m. If they drained all of those pre-paid fares, then they would have...…$650m - $650m = $0m.

    And they'd be then starting to burn their major shareholders loan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sideshow Bob View Post
    Looking at the FY19 annual report, it has "Revenue in advance" of $1.372b. This was broadly in line with FY18.

    Would have to think a reasonable chunk of that $1.3b want their money back, as alot will be international flights, no timeline for border openings etc. Say if 50% wanted their money back, that is $650m.

    They started this with about $1b until they started burning cash, and now down to $650m. If they drained all of those pre-paid fares, then they would have...…$650m - $650m = $0m.

    And they'd be then starting to burn their major shareholders loan.
    The fiscal angle has been, revenue in advance has always been greater than liquid assets until the government funding facility was established. They are buying for time which is understandable yet they have not really worked hard enough on the cash burn rate as they have chosen to utilised revenue in advance and risk brand value. They think they have a captive market in the end so you will be forced to fly with the us regardless.

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    Chris Faafoi on the job (imo one of 3 competent Govt Ministers) ,lead news item . As this is "our " airline ,expect Jacinda to compassionately allow for refunds by lunchtime when she realises how many jobs are at stake , whoops I mean votes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raz View Post
    I think what gets me is cancelled bookings when the flights are not actually cancelled and credit is not even available to rebook.
    I know Couta1 has experienced this and is still waiting for his credit...but wait, all is well, (sarcasm intended), they will have an online credit system by the end of July. Just another 2 months for him to wait, so three months to get his credit for bookings that were cancelled when the flights still flew.

    My thoughts are that the real figure if they had to refund all tickets would run to many hundreds of millions. Possibly over $500m. The truth is they probably need all of the Govt's $900m loan and then some more to get through this crisis and if they had to refund all tickets they would need substantially more Government "support".

    Thing is though, the amount of brand damage being done here is incalculable. What are Mr and Mrs Joe Bloggs who booked business class tickets to London for $20,000 going to use their credit on ? Where can they fly ?

    Might go to Queenstown in September. Not sure yet, see how long we stay Covid 19 free. Might as well just book, (if and when I feel safe enough to do so), the very cheapest flights I can get as both airlines flying in N.Z. treat their customers like ****. I suspect there will be millions of people in N.Z. thinking like me in the future who would previously taken a parochial approach and backed "their" national airline thinking they would get better service...what a joke.
    Last edited by Beagle; 04-06-2020 at 08:11 AM.
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