AIR - Air NZ.

[ratkin]

If you have to ask the price, you cant afford it :-) there's so much more holiday I could have on that extra $20k, or even add $10k more AIR shares at the cost of 48 hours of pain.

Logic goes out the window when it comes to air tickets.
Ask 99.9% of people if they would spend ten hours sitting in a slightly uncomfortable chair in return for 1000 dollars and they would consider it easy money.
Then when it comes to air tickets those same people are prepared to pay 1000 dollars extra just for a slightly more comfortable seat. It makes little sense

[Beagle]

I am not casting doubt on anything.
I provided some solid numbers derived from AIR supplied data.
I was asked a question about same and I answered it and also provided what is a more likely scenario, which is inline with your dreams.

But I get accused of casting doubt.

I demand that you return my Christmas Card promptly.


BTW I have flown in first class, on AIR on a 747. It was a free upgrade from business.
The seat pitch was so great that you had to call the hostess to get and put stuff in your seat pocket for you.

Best Wishes & Happy Holidays If You Are Into That Sort Of Thing
Paper Tiger

Soorry mate, not looking to rock the boat (sleigh ?) especially at this time of year. Another carton of that new Tip Top Tiger icecream on its way to you now

Robomo - LOL mate too funny. Coutts a great guy and a good mate but asking him to pay for my suite in the sky to Europe might be a little bit of a stretch

[Raz]

Go on - your AIR divies will pay for it

The fares are eye watering an't they. I travel with the firm i happen to be involved with to Europe from NZ every six weeks. From CHCH that is 48 flights per year. (8 trips, 3 flights each way) The companies preferred supplier is Emirates, they get a good group discount. They pay business class..like the bar and interesting people you do meet however very few of those people are picking up the tab for the flights..its usually on someone else, who they represent/working for.

They upgrade me as a frequent flyer around 1 flight in 3 to first. In first a few frequent flyers however usually it is a different type of passenger..certainly less social and most i have talked to appear to be more that true ruling elite. Often political privilege or ownership class in their country yet not wealthy or influential enough to have their own private jet....different type of customer..still who is picking up the tab...

First is insane..you can in essence...preselect every ingredient that you eat...very OTT.

[BeeBop]

I happily went to the bottom/back of the aircraft when I began paying myself! In reality, if in a new aircraft my comfort level is adequate and my pocket much much happier....

[Beagle]

Logic goes out the window when it comes to air tickets.
Ask 99.9% of people if they would spend ten hours sitting in a slightly uncomfortable chair in return for 1000 dollars and they would consider it easy money.
Then when it comes to air tickets those same people are prepared to pay 1000 dollars extra just for a slightly more comfortable seat. It makes little sense

Thanks for the feedback above Raz.

This point ratkin makes for something of an interesting debate. I think in the example you've given the vast majority of people would choose a decent airline's economy seat to in effect save $100 per hour.
That said lets look at a different example. Suppose you're flying to Zurich in their peak summer season, July next year. Flight time return is about 50 hours and an economy seat on a decent airline will set you back about $2,300, (got that off Emirates website yesterday). You get a pretty good experience, a reasonable 18 inch width seat with 32-34 inch pitch and in flight entertainment and food seems satisfactory by most accounts reported on www.seatguru.com and its a thoroughly modern plane.

Now suppose you larger than an average person and the extra space of a business class seat including full recline to a flat bed would be very, very nice. Might even get some decent sleep. Suppose you shopped around and found a $5,700 business class service return on a leading airline.... that's another $3,400 over and above an economy ticket for 50 hours of genuine comfort, better food and importantly the genuine prospect of a reasonable sleep, all for $68 per hour. You theoretically, (after a good sleep on your full lie flat seat), arrive in far better shape ready to enjoy Switzerland on your first day, so that has to be worth something meaningful right ?

I used to think people who paid for their own business class ticket had more money than sense but these days I reckon at the right price there's a reasonable argument to be made for it especially if its the trip of a lifetime. Even bean counters get sick of counting beans from time to time, sometimes you have to let your hair down and make a luxury purchase surely ? AIR wants over $10K business class to Zurich, I think that's far too much of a premium over economy but $5,700 on another pretty good airline, maybe not too bad ?
Emirates are $7400 but interestingly their business class seats are only 18.5 inches wide, (18 for economy so hardly any difference) on their A380's (Singapore airways economy seat is 19 inches wide !).

[BlackPeter]

Thanks for the feedback above Raz.
...
Emirates are $7400 but interestingly their business class seats are only 18.5 inches wide, (18 for economy so hardly any difference) on their A380's (Singapore airways economy seat is 19 inches wide !).

For what it is worth - I never used to measure the width of Emirates seats, but did fly with them both economy as well as business class (as well as with a range of other airlines). While Emirates economy seats are pretty good (I'd say if you get the new airbus, best in class - better than the premium economy seats in some of the older AIR NZ planes ...), its business class seats are still by miles better. Lots of space in front of you (and I mean lots) - and for the night the seat can be turned into a bed (totally flat). Some of the most comfortable long haul flights I remember ...

Anyway - enjoy your trip to the UK - are you planning to go to Europe as well?

[Raz]

Thanks for the feedback above Raz.

This point ratkin makes for something of an interesting debate. I think in the example you've given the vast majority of people would choose a decent airline's economy seat to in effect save $100 per hour.
That said lets look at a different example. Suppose you're flying to Zurich in their peak summer season, July next year. Flight time return is about 50 hours and an economy seat on a decent airline will set you back about $2,300, (got that off Emirates website yesterday). You get a pretty good experience, a reasonable 18 inch width seat with 32-34 inch pitch and in flight entertainment and food seems satisfactory by most accounts reported on www.seatguru.com and its a thoroughly modern plane.

Now suppose you larger than an average person and the extra space of a business class seat including full recline to a flat bed would be very, very nice. Might even get some decent sleep. Suppose you shopped around and found a $5,700 business class service return on a leading airline.... that's another $3,400 over and above an economy ticket for 50 hours of genuine comfort, better food and importantly the genuine prospect of a reasonable sleep, all for $68 per hour. You theoretically, (after a good sleep on your full lie flat seat), arrive in far better shape ready to enjoy Switzerland on your first day, so that has to be worth something meaningful right ?

I used to think people who paid for their own business class ticket had more money than sense but these days I reckon at the right price there's a reasonable argument to be made for it especially if its the trip of a lifetime. Even bean counters get sick of counting beans from time to time, sometimes you have to let your hair down and make a luxury purchase surely ? AIR wants over $10K business class to Zurich, I think that's far too much of a premium over economy but $5,700 on another pretty good airline, maybe not too bad ?
Emirates are $7400 but interestingly their business class seats are only 18.5 inches wide, (18 for economy so hardly any difference) on their A380's (Singapore airways economy seat is 19 inches wide !).

Funny enough, when it is our money we value it differently:-) Last family reunion 3 years ago in Europe I went via economy with Emirates..(A380) it was impressive for economy class although I still found it difficult to sleep. They upgraded me to business on the last sector home and I crashed...slept right through.

Next year there is another reunion and it again does not coincide with a business trip.

I will look at economy with a decent stopover or alternatively business class with anyone who is reasonable. You have to look at the overall cost of your trip, which often the airfare is only a small part of the whole cost and look at the cost of each quality/effective hour at your destination. You pay a great deal for you whole trip so you want to maximise your quality time. The cost of not actually travelling well and hitting the ground running could be as much as two effective days more on your schedule. You will still suffer jet lag/time zone changes regardless, so you have enough already to contend with without being overtired and even ill. Also effective time to get on top of things when you return. These long trips are hell if you are not maintaining a basic comfort/health on them.

Naturally I placing aside the affordability question..I know a lot simply could not go if they paid anything other than economy.

[Raz]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ectid=11588156

Happy where we are heading with AIR to 2017 year end however if this continues into 2018 not so certain given Government policy..infrastructure may be a road block to their plans thou.

[Beagle]

For what it is worth - I never used to measure the width of Emirates seats, but did fly with them both economy as well as business class (as well as with a range of other airlines). While Emirates economy seats are pretty good (I'd say if you get the new airbus, best in class - better than the premium economy seats in some of the older AIR NZ planes ...), its business class seats are still by miles better. Lots of space in front of you (and I mean lots) - and for the night the seat can be turned into a bed (totally flat). Some of the most comfortable long haul flights I remember ...

Anyway - enjoy your trip to the UK - are you planning to go to Europe as well?

Just in the "dreaming" process at this stage BP.

[Beagle]

https://www.nbr.co.nz/article/carry-...re-ng-p-198197