Labour / NZ First Government

[Raz]

Seems like a basic idea to me. Even I could mark papers and free up primary school teachers from a load of assessments. Figure out a decent hourly rate and pay on a piece basis- that would be productive.

A large part of the paper work is incident reports for special needs children within the classroom.

[minimoke]

A large part of the paper work is incident reports for special needs children within the classroom.

Thats an even more basic task that can be completed by a person on Minimum wage. If its a regular thing then a simple check box for could be filled in in about 10 seconds. Sounds to me like teaching is a Make Work scheme.

[BlackPeter]

Sounds to me like teaching is a Make Work scheme.

Well, yes - there is a longstanding unholy alliance between the Ministry against Education, who work hard to create year after year more useless paperwork for schools and teachers to complete (instead of teaching) and the teachers unions who work hard to prevent new people and ideas (like charter schools) from gaining access to the industry. Classical loose - loose for students and parents.

Ah yes - and special needs students belong on special schools (as in most civilised countries). The NZ system is serving neither them nor the other students. Again - loose-loose for everybody.

Lets do it!

[westerly]

Ah yes - and special needs students belong on special schools (as in most civilised countries). The NZ system is serving neither them nor the other students. Again - loose-loose for everybody.

Not sure, though it can be cured by government policies - it well might be as difficult to cure like the quarter of an acre disease, the 6 foot high board fence disease or the urge to fix everything with No 8 wire ...

!

You don,t like the locals, that is fairly obvious . I am not sure what country you are trying to change us into but it must be a wonderful place to live in.

As for teachers and their troubles, modern society and its treatment of children as young gods is responsible for most of their so called problems.
Teacher shortages, most men would run from teaching these days, the risk of being fingered by a child with a grudge being too great. Bring back the strap etc.

Obviously I am a product of the “ children should be seen and not heard generation “

westerly

[BlackPeter]

Entire contents deleted by an annoyed STMOD.

[macduffy]

About time to leave this subject?

(Thread is: "Labour/NZ First Government")

[minimoke]

About time to leave this subject?

(Thread is: "Labour/NZ First Government")

Good idea. NZ First been a bit silent of late. No surprise given Shane Jones shredding cash in his forestry balls up. "Here you go, have a million trees" "Oops make that one hundred thousand - shame the land is full of scrub and weeds. Shoulda thought about that"

So Shane - are you just throwing cash at a Maori Trust that lost $264k last year when its income was only $1.1m

[Bjauck]

Well, yes - there is a longstanding unholy alliance between the Ministry against Education, who work hard to create year after year more useless paperwork for schools and teachers to complete (instead of teaching) and the teachers unions who work hard to prevent new people and ideas (like charter schools) from gaining access to the industry. Classical loose - loose for students and parents.

Ah yes - and special needs students belong on special schools (as in most civilised countries). The NZ system is serving neither them nor the other students. Again - loose-loose for everybody.

Lets do it!

Top rate education, teacher aides and good special education cost money.

I am not sure what you mean by "most civilised countries". However does that mean you support a CGT if the "most civilised" have a CGT too?

[Raz]

Thats an even more basic task that can be completed by a person on Minimum wage. If its a regular thing then a simple check box for could be filled in in about 10 seconds. Sounds to me like teaching is a Make Work scheme.

That the most lack of though comment I have seen in a long time, if you understood the legal approach that has to be taken you would not be so flippant 😊 each has a certain approach that legally has to report to the MOE and Board. We are talking often serious asssalts often resulting in people in hospital.

[BlackPeter]

Top rate education, teacher aides and good special education cost money.

I am not sure what you mean by "most civilised countries". However does that mean you support a CGT if the "most civilised" have a CGT too?

Various quite different education themes linked into a quite complicated and unrelated tax issue - and this in just two lines ...

so - what do you really want to know - if anything?

Lets see ...

1) "top rate education .... cost money". True, however - not necessarily as much money as we currently spend. Our school system suffers under the typical problems of any bureaucracy. More bureaucrats create more bureaucracy requiring more money. Does not improve the education, though. Smart spending of money would be preferrable and we don't need a tax hike.

2) "teacher aids ... cost money". True. Have seen countries with a better educations system and without (or with less) teacher aids - i.e. they are not necessarily a reflection on the quality of the education system, more a reflection on the non standard tasks our standard schools have to deal with. A better and smarter task allocation (like e.g. concentrating special needs children in purpose build schools) would actually save money. What are we doing with the freed up funds - reduce taxes?

3) "good special education costs money". True, however significantly less than the current system where basically every school needs to spend huge amounts of money for a very small number of special needs children. Our local primary school had to pay more than one million dollars to cater for one single special needs child which moved into the township. After completion of the building activities moved the family on and the facilities have never been used. Mindboggling inefficiency.

Not mentioned by you, but I have seen many classes with suboptimal education for everybody because the teacher had to cater for one or two special needs children as well who loved to disturb the class. Absolutely brain dead approach to have all children suffer just because they don't want to concentrate the special needs children.

4) Capital gains tax: While we don't need more money for education (see above) do I have no problems with the introduction of a capital gains tax if it is fair (i.e. no exceptions, no loopholes) and efficent (i.e. cost to collect the tax is significantly lower than the collected tax). I have not yet seen though a fair and efficient capital gains tax in any country. Have you?

Discl: have seen three children through the NZ school system and served as well on a board of trustees and on a community board. I do know the system.