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  1. #436
    Legend minimoke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bjauck View Post
    Australians have visa free access to NZ to live and work. He had been living in NZ. It is a NZ & Australian issue requiring co-operation.
    The issue here is: where was he radicalised? NZ or Australia. Or was it it while he was in Europe or Asia. It does however, so far seem clear that he was not radicalised by White Supremacists in NZ - or in Australia for that matter.

    Apparently he was influenced the most by Candace Owens, a black american woman with conservative views. She in turn was most influenced by Ann Coulter (A white america woman with quite conservative Christian views), Milo Yinnopoulos (a white english homosexual who has a black american husband who is no fan of Radical Islam), Ben Carson (a black american neurosurgeon republican with presidential aspirations) and Thomas Sowell ( a black American Economist who describes himself as Liberterian)

  2. #437
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    Quote Originally Posted by minimoke View Post
    The issue here is: where was he radicalised? NZ or Australia. Or was it it while he was in Europe or Asia. It does however, so far seem clear that he was not radicalised by White Supremacists in NZ - or in Australia for that matter......
    Of course it goes without saying that All Australians and NZers, not just white supremacists, are heavily influenced by people who do not live in either NZ or Australia. Philosophers, religious leaders and cultural trend-setters influence us here in NZ. The international reach of trend-setters has never been faster, easier or more pervasive.

    Whilst the need for Co-operation between NZ and Australia security agencies is obvious, given our common travel area. International co-operation extending beyond our five eyes partners is also necessary.

  3. #438
    Legend minimoke's Avatar
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    Checked out the Tivo last night. It had just recorded Patriots day. Started watching it - its a movie about Islamist extremists who bombed the Boston Marathon in 2013. Seems to me to be very poor taste on broadcasting part given the Christchurch Marathon is on in a few weeks time. I wonder if there will be as much police presence there as there is at mosques during Ramadan (my guess is people will have already forgotten the hysterical calls for the Crusaders to change their name in fear of reprisal attacks)

  4. #439
    Legend minimoke's Avatar
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    Two police still outside the Mosque.

    Heres an idea of what they are protecting https://youtu.be/cGt7odesOTY
    (play from the 4 minute mark)

    This guy is hoping to join Christchurch City Council on the Peoples Choice ticket
    Last edited by minimoke; 25-05-2019 at 06:42 PM.

  5. #440
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    Many people donít realise that Facebook sets videos to auto-play by default (at least it did. This may have changed since). As you scroll through your feed videos start playing automatically. So it is very easy to see something and inadvertently watch a few seconds of it before you even realise what it was. Many years ago this happened to me. A video of a beheading played automatically and in less than one second I had already seen someone lose their head. It was traumatic at the time but it happened so quickly I had no time to even register what was happening, let alone push the stop button. After that incident I learned how to go in and change my settings so nothing like this would ever auto-play again.

    So give Jacinda a break. Regardless of what you think of her as a PM, I think people have a pretty good idea of the kind of human being she is, and that this is not something she would have intentionally chosen to view.

    Quote Originally Posted by minimoke View Post
    So the Prime Minister has seen the video
    "I use and manage my social media just like anyone else. I know the reach of this video was vast, because I too inadvertently saw it," the Prime Minister says in an op-ed article published this weekend in the New York Times.
    "Many people report seeing it autoplay on their social media feeds and not realising what it was - after all, how could something so heinous be so available?"


    Does social media not have a STOP button. Even I can manage my social media - I havent seen the video.

  6. #441
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    Quote Originally Posted by minimoke View Post
    Two police still outside the Mosque.

    Heres an idea of what they are protecting https://youtu.be/cGt7odesOTY
    (play from the 4 minute mark)

    This guy is hoping to join Christchurch City Council on the Labour ticket
    Doesn't appear to be any women listening. How will they ever learn?

  7. #442
    Legend minimoke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by justakiwi View Post
    Many people don’t realise that Facebook sets videos to auto-play by default (at least it did. This may have changed since). As you scroll through your feed videos start playing automatically. So it is very easy to see something and inadvertently watch a few seconds of it before you even realise what it was...….

    So give Jacinda a break. Regardless of what you think of her as a PM, I think people have a pretty good idea of the kind of human being she is, and that this is not something she would have intentionally chosen to view.
    I wonder how much did she see - no mention she hit the STOP button after 5 seconds ('ve moved on form this now - more worried about what is being enabled through this event)

  8. #443
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    Quote Originally Posted by minimoke View Post
    Two police still outside the Mosque.

    Heres an idea of what they are protecting https://youtu.be/cGt7odesOTY
    (play from the 4 minute mark)

    This guy is hoping to join Christchurch City Council on the Labour ticket
    And your point is? He says that wives should obey their husbands. This stuff is directly from the bible which is the basis of the in our country majority Christian faith as well. Ah yes - and don't forget the Jews ...

    Sure - it is not PC and I don't agree with it either, but if you use this to point finger at politicians, than better point at any politician who ever visited a church or a mosque or a synagogue ...

    Epheser 5:22-24
    22 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife even as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands.
    1 Mose 3:16
    To the woman he said, “I will surely multiply your pain in childbearing; in pain you shall bring forth children. Your desire shall be contrary to your husband, but he shall rule over you.”
    Last edited by BlackPeter; 25-05-2019 at 05:08 PM.
    ----
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  9. #444
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPeter View Post
    And your point is? He says that wives should obey their husbands. This stuff is directly from the bible which is the basis of the in our country majority Christian faith as well. Ah yes - and don't forget the Jews ...

    Sure - it is not PC and I don't agree with it either, but if you use this to point finger at politicians, than better point at any politician who ever visited a church or a mosque or a synagogue ...

    Epheser 5:22-24


    1 Mose 3:16
    That bit that you quoted from Ephesians, actually means that husbands have a huge obligation to their wives. They must be prepared to lay down their lives for their spouses. Nothing belittling women or denigrating in that one BP. you forgot the following verses from the same book....

    25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing[b] her by the washing with water through the word, 27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.

  10. #445
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackcap View Post
    That bit that you quoted from Ephesians, actually means that husbands have a huge obligation to their wives. They must be prepared to lay down their lives for their spouses. Nothing belittling women or denigrating in that one BP. you forgot the following verses from the same book....

    25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing[b] her by the washing with water through the word, 27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.
    Yep you must always read the whole context of the passage, any random verse can be made to look negative on it's own, understanding the history and culture of the time is also important.

  11. #446
    Legend minimoke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPeter View Post
    And your point is?
    I dont have any difficulty with him saying what he says even though I disagree with it. I do have a difficulty with the State providing unnecessary protection to an organisation that enables such speech. That protection is provided at an opportunity cost of other people in Christchurch not being protected.

    I'm also concerned that this person thinks bridges need to be built between the muslim community and Christchurch city. (https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/112...local-politics) Given how the city has supported that community thats pretty disparaging.

    Thankfully we are in a democracy where those that support him can vote for him. If I was in the Halswell area he wouldn't be getting my vote

  12. #447
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    My condolences to the muslim peoples for what happen in Christchurch. Also condolences to the the christian peoples, about 77 per week, about 4000 last year killed for what they believe.

  13. #448
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    Quote Originally Posted by see weed View Post
    My condolences to the muslim peoples for what happen in Christchurch. Also condolences to the the christian peoples, about 77 per week, about 4000 last year killed for what they believe.
    Christchurch is part of our immediate local responsibility.

    Most international terrorist casualties are Moslem - often targeted for their differences in faith by other muslims. Just as so many Christians have been killed by Christians of other denominations.
    Last edited by Bjauck; 26-05-2019 at 08:49 AM.

  14. #449
    always learning ... BlackPeter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by couta1 View Post
    Yep you must always read the whole context of the passage, any random verse can be made to look negative on it's own, understanding the history and culture of the time is also important.
    Absolutely - and shouldn't we practise the same courtesy to the Muslim community instead of judging them on one snippet out of one sermon?
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  15. #450
    always learning ... BlackPeter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by minimoke View Post
    I dont have any difficulty with him saying what he says even though I disagree with it. I do have a difficulty with the State providing unnecessary protection to an organisation that enables such speech. That protection is provided at an opportunity cost of other people in Christchurch not being protected.
    Hmm - just lets think that through, shall we?

    This is a group of people who gathered peacefully to worship their faith. A madman armed with a gun killed 51 of them and injured another 50 or so. I don't know exactly how many muslims there are in Christchurch, but I assume that this is roughly 1% of their local community dead. Another 1% injured. Most of them will have lost family or friends to a gun wielding crook, and it could be quite understandable if they are concerned and fearful that something like that could repeat when they gather again.

    I would be worried if this would be my church or temple or mosque or synagogue and I gather with my parish again only a couple of months after such an event. Wouldn't you?

    And you are complaining about the taxpayer funding two policemen standing in front of their mosque during their gatherings?

    Are you for real? This is what police is there for: protect our society ... and they are part of it.
    Last edited by BlackPeter; 26-05-2019 at 05:40 PM.
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