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Thread: Power shares

  1. #901
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    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/124...-hydrogen-plan

    Interesting article that highlights the advantages of hydrogen, and also points out it needs massive amounts of green energy to produce it.

  2. #902
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    Methane and the higher level alkanes cannot readily escape from the existing natural gas network so network losses are relatively low, where-as hydrogen can easily escape containment vessels and has a propensity to eat away metal causing what is termed Hydrogen Metal Embrittlement. Large changes to the distribution network would be required to resolve this issues. Hydrogen also contains around 20% to 30% the energy of natural gas by volume, so we'll need vast additional quantities of hydrogen just to supplant natural gas use all of which is extremely energy inefficient to produce using green methods.

    There are lots of issues to address, some of which fundamental physics dictates will be extremely difficult if not impossible to resolve. From what has been published by FirstGas thus far, I'm unconvinced that hydrogen will successfully replace natural gas.

  3. #903
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    Stx on the asx have a "green" gas into fertilizer with potential geothermal electricity play. They are drilling 4.5-5km into the ground. Thought you guys might be intrested.

  4. #904
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jantar View Post
    Yes, and we already have a suitable site and power station in NZ that could give us very similar results at a much cheaper price.

    Tokaanu power station was originally designed to able to be used as pumped storage between Rotoaira and Taupo. However it never received consent to use a suitable operating range at Rotoaira which was limited to 30 cm, instead of the 1 m it needed.

    The station exists, both lakes are already there. All it needs is for the machines to be retrofitted and get resource consent (good luck with that one) and IWI approval (not a chance in Hades). Total plant cost around $120 M.
    Times and needs change .
    This sounds such a simple solution in an ideal location that requires minimal cost and enviromental impact .
    Is there a reason why new plans and an uptodate resource consent are not happening ?

  5. #905
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    They'd have to be careful in messing with Tokaanu. I understand that when digging the tailrace, they went to lunch, having put in a few post-holes. They returned to find several were geysering.

  6. #906
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    Power struggle: industry warns thousands of jobs at risk due to electricity prices
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/...ectid=12434530

    Interesting article. Apologies if posted elsewhere.
    Last edited by RTM; 14-04-2021 at 05:39 PM. Reason: Addition

  7. #907
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    Some interesting bits and pieces in here...

    http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-websit...967/345726.pdf

    Worth browsing through.

  8. #908
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    Quote Originally Posted by RTM View Post
    Some interesting bits and pieces in here...

    http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-websit...967/345726.pdf

    Worth browsing through.
    From p27 of the presentation.

    "A Tiwai smelter closure by the end of 2024 could see 5TWh of excess Southland-Otago generation attempting to flow northward."

    "Significant new demand in Southland that is also flexible could address regional energy balance and create an alternative mechanism for dry-year."

    The next slide goes on to talk about the 'Onslow overbuild'. I take that to mean that Meridian are not keen on the Onslow scheme? The alternative suggestion of 'flexible demand' is an interesting one. You would need a very highly automated plant to make that practical. Is all this code for Meridian's support for a hydrogen fuel production plant in Southland?

    From p40

    "The cost of producing green hydrogen is currently significantly higher than fossil fuels. Carbon taxes or subsidies will be key enablers."

    Translation: "Please government, can we have some help?"

    SNOOPY
    Last edited by Snoopy; 18-05-2021 at 09:37 AM.
    Watch out for the most persistent and dangerous version of Covid-19: B.S.24/7

  9. #909
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoopy View Post
    From p27 of the presentation.

    "A Tiwai smelter closure by the end of 2024 could see 5TWh of excess Southland-Otago generation attempting to flow northward.".....

    Translation: "Please government, can we have some help?"

    SNOOPY
    Meridian's main concern is for the period between 2024, when there would be excess energy available in Otago/Southland and 2030 which is the earliest that Onslow could be built.

    They are also worried that once Onslow is built it will replace the thermal stations in the market which are the current price setters. Whoever owns and operates Onslow will have huge market power in setting the price going forward. The interesting part about Meridian and Onslow is that a previous Meridian CEO, Keith Turner, is in favour of Onslow and has commented on how it would stabilize wholesale prices.

  10. #910
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    Interesting to see comments by media about high energy prices again. Until the fate of Tiwai is known it seems the industry is inclined to keep supply very tight.

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