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  1. #21981
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snow Leopard View Post
    I may be interpreting this incorrectly but anyway let me say this (again).

    Some people seem to have this fixation that if they lose money on a particular stock that they must make it back on the very same stock.


    This is a VERY BAD mindset for investors or traders, and needs to be overcome.

    You possibly learn a lesson from your failed purchase but going forward you look for the best opportunities in the market based on your criteria and that is how you how you successfully make you money back and then some.
    Thanks for that Snow Leopard, I have fallen into that mindset/trap recently with ATM and a few wee pesky Aussie shares. Looking for better opportunities in the market to make your money back is sage advice That being said I find it EXTREMELY difficult to sell for a loss

  2. #21982
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    Quote Originally Posted by RupertBear View Post
    Thanks for that Snow Leopard, I have fallen into that mindset/trap recently with ATM and a few wee pesky Aussie shares. Looking for better opportunities in the market to make your money back is sage advice That being said I find it EXTREMELY difficult to sell for a loss
    Likewise. Makes a lot of sense. Just hard to do.
    Last edited by Maxtrade; 18-06-2021 at 12:27 PM.

  3. #21983
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackPeter View Post
    Please accept my condolences for your loss. I recon most of us went through a similar experience one time or another - my biggest loss was when I was holding CBL shares (roughly 10% of my NZ share portfolio) and the company got shut down by the FMA. Apparently some crooks on board. 100% of my CBL investment gone, but who knows - the courts might return some day some cents in the dollar.

    Just mentioning that to show you that the investment game is inherently dangerous, never a good idea to put all eggs in one basket.

    Where to go from here? I don't want to discourage you, but it is hard to make money with trading, even if you understand your trade. So - if you want to get some of your money back with trading ... good luck, but I recommend you first learn more than just how to establish the first resistance level.

    If you want to make money with investing - this is easier, but you should not put your expectations too high. I am targeting for my investments a long term average of 8% (after tax) using a quite diversified portfolio - including some hedges (which hold the earnings back in good years, but protect them in bad years). So far I reached my long term targets (despite losses like CBL, which I have fully written off - s. above). Obviously - it would take this way many years to recover a 70% loss like the one you are describing. Ouch.

    If I would be you I probably would first take my remaining money out of A2. Sure - they might go up again, but than they might not. Something like playing in the casino, not good to do with money you can't afford to (or don't want to) lose. Will they reach their previous hype driven heights? I doubt it.

    Pick a diversified portfolio out of solid companies with good boards (no, not A2 ): and watch them growing. Want to find these solid companies? That's the ones who have proven over time that they can make money, they are typically less discussed in these forums and normally (over long periods of time) considered to be too dear. Easy to find :
    Thank you for solid advice

  4. #21984
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoop View Post
    Hi Maxtrade.
    My condolences too...However the action at the time was not stupid..With hindsight and the current $6.31 (down -11c) yes it turned out to be a poor buy in entry point..However with hindsight and a $30 or $40 price tag you wouldn't be thinking stupid would you?
    I'm a Chartist and charting often uses the TA Discipline it comes part and parcel with each other as using charts it is easy to see the trading behaviour of people and institutions..So ,,the chart below is the history up to the present of ATM trading behaviour...To chart the price accurately into the future is impossible, but TA can offer odds for or against using the past data and analyzing it with the present behaviour...A change of trading behaviour is nearly always a signal that something is about to change and TA picks up this up..As you can see in the chart ATM is in a severe downtrend and any change of behavour has not lasted..Lack of buying demand (low volume or no increase in volume) shows that minimal optimistic buyers failed to create any decent rally and the change in behaviour quickly fizzled out..
    Now at the moment we have another change of trading behaviour and TA charts shows this one looks a little stronger, however it too seems to be fizzling out, but it hasn't yet been confirmed so I'm still watching with interest...

    The chart below is very messy but I drew it with you (Maxtrade) in mind. The chart only focuses on the use of S&R lines (support & resistance) and the indicators RSI DMI below reflect the state of price in relation to the S&R lines..

    When I drew this chart I noticed that the buying/selling behaviour was very TA friendly..With a high volume trading stock TA tends to be more accurate as trading programs automatically rely on buy and sell trigger points and active traders tend to rely on trading behaviours to actively enter or exit...
    Also of interest on the chart is the downtrend behaviour..There is an exit rule "sell when the price drops below the second support level from when you bought in"...It seems this rule is being used and the every second support break sees a flood of sellers causing a gap down.
    Chartists have observed over the years that history can repeat itself and the opposite (odds better than random) can also happen...So chartists keep a close eye on gap zones and we tend to get rather exited when the stock price gets close to a gap zone and we think of market physics could play out..For the layman or non chartists think gap zones as air pockets and as the plane enters one it suddenly drops...if there is air pocket around then there is air turbulence in the similar height area further along and so we can expect the plane to hit an updraft and the plane suddenly elevates..
    We chartists call this sudden elevation within the gap zone as closing the gap...
    As you can see on the ATM chart there are many gaps that can be closed so for that market physics reasoning we chartists keep an eye on the price as it approaches a gap zone..
    I'm not saying it will happen now, ATM can fail yet again and as I said in my past post it wouldn't surprise me if the price fell to $6.00..
    At the time of the post with price failing after nearly reaching $7.00 that $6.00 figure looked a bit ridiculous but on the chart with the downtrend still operating, unless that trend ends $6.00 and below must happen...This is why I said buying into a downtrend is an idiotic move...TA says wait until that trend breaks and confirmed..

    When to sell out and when is it too late to sell out... When I was a newbie (so long ago I had a pet pterodactyl) I was very conservative and waited before I bought in thinking that was the safest time to invest..when actual fact it was the most dangerous of investor strategies..Looking at my record I was buying in near the top and selling out near the bottom...
    Even now some 48 years later I still fall in love with a stock and fail to sell out (ignore my TA discipline) and more often than not that has cost me dearly....We never learn!!! there is always some sort of media advice out there that you shouldn't listen to but you do as it says nice things about your pet poodle which helps to reinforce your belief.
    The most stressful thing about having shares is failing to sell out (very hard thing to do) and being trapped in a stock. You now face a dilemma with no right or wrong answer..Sell and risk the stock reversing of stay in and risk further loses...With all dilemmas I can't give you any advice what to do...
    One thing though being a strict TA discipline investor that TA discipline will never let you get into a dilemma situation. There are other types of investors that use the second support break rule , trailing stops, etc..The one thing that any experienced investor has irrespective of what discipline they use is they all have an exit strategy after they purchase something..
    Hope this post helps....

    PS Sharetrader won't let post a chart (web glitch) on this post
    Thank you very much for taking the time to help provide some insight Hoop. Very interesting and informative. I will look into TA further. Did you create the chart below? Or where can I access/ find such charts for different shares to try to apply TA logic?

  5. #21985
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxtrade View Post
    Thank you very much for taking the time to help provide some insight Hoop. Very interesting and informative. I will look into TA further. Did you create the chart below? Or where can I access/ find such charts for different shares to try to apply TA logic?
    I use Big Charts to post on this forum..Big Charts is free and easy to navigate. As with most freebies there are limitations, however it's good enough to learn and play with.

  6. #21986
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
    ...Losing money on a trade means you made a wrong decision, it does not mean you are an idiot. (however, it also doesn't mean that you aren't an idiot).
    At the risk of this becoming the trader psychology thread.

    If you bought for the right reasons and you sold for the right reasons then whether you made a profit or not is immaterial.

    Good buys can turn bad and though you did nothing wrong you are losing money.

    Just make sure that you are making a good bit more than you lose in the long run.
    om mani peme hum

  7. #21987
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    Today is 18th June the final day of China's 618 Shopping Extravaganza

    https://www.scmp.com/tech/big-tech/a...field-countrys

  8. #21988
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    Hi folks,interested to hear where people think this stock is headed...Beagle,Balance ??

  9. #21989
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruby View Post
    Hi folks,interested to hear where people think this stock is headed...Beagle,Balance ??
    Not really interested in short term sp direction until strategy reset is announced and implications are assessed.

    Stock will trend meanwhile to traders' whims & fancies around broader industry issues and company specific developments like law suits.
    Last edited by Balance; 21-06-2021 at 09:18 AM.

  10. #21990
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    Agreed,thanks

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