NZ 1st homebuyers are ScReWeD...

[TeslaGod]

We know how much Kiwi's love splurging on property during a pandemic, so the endless lockdown in Auckland must be delivering another huge windfall to sellers as the lemmings pile in - gimme some more of that mountainous debt and 'propertee' they cry, desperately trying to outbid each other.

It's going to get worse before it gets better.

[kiora]

It's called dark humour

Some people get it

Most people don't.

I wonder if these guys get it?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/...YKG6W2WIKBKGA/

[Aaron]

I wonder if these guys get it?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/...YKG6W2WIKBKGA/

I wonder if TeslaGod and SBQ got their letters from IRD? The problems of the super rich, must be hard.

I thought there was some hope for first home buyers when I saw this headline.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/natio...?ocid=msedgntp

Reading below the headline it might not be the game changer I was hoping for. I suspect you would need a sustained drop in Avocado prices to make a real difference to aspirations for home ownership.

[SBQ]

I wonder if TeslaGod and SBQ got their letters from IRD? The problems of the super rich, must be hard.

I thought there was some hope for first home buyers when I saw this headline.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/natio...?ocid=msedgntp

Reading below the headline it might not be the game changer I was hoping for. I suspect you would need a sustained drop in Avocado prices to make a real difference to aspirations for home ownership.

I can assure you IRD audits have changed focus from looking at the small businesses (because so many have been wiped out), to those that do have money. Both TeslaGod and I have accountants.

As i've been saying all along, when you reach to a level of high net worth, your focus on life is not to be more greedy. The wealth came out from society and therefore one should contribute it back to society. I'm doing so through charity, and volunteering (much what Peter Lynch has been doing since he left managing his Magellen Fund in the early 90s). IRD needs to understand that if they want to go on a witch hunt after rich people, there will be consequences. What is the value of my contribution to society? I've paid millions in taxes since moving to NZ over 20 years ago and IRD needs to look at "Do they still want my taxes?" NZ is not the only place in the world where I can show my philanthropy and being a Cdn citizen, my liquid assets can easily flow to Canada if I choose to move back there. This is the advantage of not owning real estate, the conversion of houses to cash can not go without scrutiny by the tax dept.

Mr TeslaGod, do you have plans to give most of your wealth away for good cause or will you do what most rich people do in NZ - form a trust and let it sit in perpetual?

[TeslaGod]

Mr TeslaGod, do you have plans to give most of your wealth away for good cause or will you do what most rich people do in NZ - form a trust and let it sit in perpetual?

My accountant/lawyer takes care of those matters.

I prefer using my time growing my wealth,and of course passing on my knowledge/experience to those who want to learn.

[Aaron]

As i've been saying all along, when you reach to a level of high net worth, your focus on life is not to be more greedy. The wealth came out from society and therefore one should contribute it back to society. I'm doing so through charity, and volunteering (much what Peter Lynch has been doing since he left managing his Magellen Fund in the early 90s). IRD needs to understand that if they want to go on a witch hunt after rich people, there will be consequences. What is the value of my contribution to society? I've paid millions in taxes since moving to NZ over 20 years ago and IRD needs to look at "Do they still want my taxes?" NZ is not the only place in the world where I can show my philanthropy and being a Cdn citizen, my liquid assets can easily flow to Canada if I choose to move back there. This is the advantage of not owning real estate, the conversion of houses to cash can not go without scrutiny by the tax dept.

Your message is coming through a bit confused to me. You say your focus is now on contributing/giving back to society through charity and volunteering. No doubt to causes you support and in amounts you are comfortable giving.

Yet in the same paragraph you threaten to pick up and leave if you are asked to contribute through taxation.

Not that I care you should go wherever suits you and your generous spirit. Ideally a country with a low(no) tax rate that relies on people’s generosity rather than taxation.

[TeslaGod]

Your message is coming through a bit confused to me. You say your focus is now on contributing/giving back to society through charity and volunteering. No doubt to causes you support and in amounts you are comfortable giving.

Yet in the same paragraph you threaten to pick up and leave if you are asked to contribute through taxation.

Not that I care you should go wherever suits you and your generous spirit. Ideally a country with a low(no) tax rate that relies on people’s generosity rather than taxation.

It's a vehicle to writing off tax.

You choose were your money goes/not towards Grant Robertsons café account.

[Aaron]

It's a vehicle to writing off tax.

You choose were your money goes/not towards Grant Robertsons café account.

So not so generous then? Also NZ Taxpayer stumps up with one third if you can claim a donations rebate.
Wouldn't people paid to look at where money would best be spent to help the country (bureaucrats) be able to allocate funds to the needy better than someone focused on increasing their personal wealth.

[fungus pudding]

So not so generous then? Also NZ Taxpayer stumps up with one third if you can claim a donations rebate.
Wouldn't people paid to look at where money would best be spent to help the country (bureaucrats) be able to allocate funds to the needy better than someone focused on increasing their personal wealth.

No. Read the budget and you'll see all sorts of govt. expenditure that you won't be happy about. I promise.

[SBQ]

Your message is coming through a bit confused to me. You say your focus is now on contributing/giving back to society through charity and volunteering. No doubt to causes you support and in amounts you are comfortable giving.

Yet in the same paragraph you threaten to pick up and leave if you are asked to contribute through taxation.

Not that I care you should go wherever suits you and your generous spirit. Ideally a country with a low(no) tax rate that relies on people’s generosity rather than taxation.

Philanthropy comes net of taxation. The problem is the role of IRD (or any tax dept) is beyond just enfocing tax laws and what often happens is the auditors stretch too far beyond what tax they are looking for. This threatens the plan of any charity goal. Kiora's link where IRD is going after 'wealthy' people and their spouse is a clear example of this. Generally wealthy people have accountants and lawyers and have the pockets to fight vs the small business owner usually just accepts IRD's ruling and suffers. In the US it's been shown time and time that the IRS is "simply outgunned" when they try to go after the very rich ; for which when the IRS does want to go after any major corporation for any tax grab, they need to be 100% sure. Unfortunately in my experience, this is not the case for tax auditors in Canada or in NZ. Therefore what generally happens is the news of greedy tax auditors in NZ serve as a deterrent to attract wealth in NZ. I'm thinking of a clear example what comes to my mind, some decades ago Jane Cameron had sold her ownership of Katmandu to Goldman Sac. Her windfall of wealth lead to charity but ran into IRD problems as during that time, NZ had gift duty. So she changed her residency by moving to Australia and began to gift her wealth to NZ recipients. IRD didn't like this and technically, could not tax her directly as she was a NZ non-tax resident. However, what IRD did instead was they taxed the recipients of the charity. In my view this very nasty and sets a clear example of how low dirty IRD operates.

A Canadian example I can think of occurred in the early 90s where Canada experienced a huge wave of wealthy migrants from HK/China. They bought up properties, owned expensive cars, flashed their wealth until the tax authorities went on a auditing spree as these migrants were unaware that Canada (like NZ) taxes residents on a "worldwide basis". The end result? These 'astronauts' ended up moving back, or even better, hopped across to the US where US tax laws are more friendly to wealthy migrants. I recall an economic impact study in Canada during the time that showed Canada's GDP was not only affected by the loss of their spending, but the greater problem being their social / business ties were lost, all attributed because of tax audits. (ie. these wealthy people have ties that have a direct impact on the economy ; such as when Trudeau opens his mouth against the Saudi's political handling of that journalist killing, The Saudi gov't simply cancelled a billion $ military contract with a private Canadian company = loss jobs etc). On a cumulative level, the audits fared worse for the Canadian economy.

I'm not saying there's a fine line about how much taxes should be paid or not. What i'm getting at is having some common sense, for which tax departments don't have. So if IRD wants to create a war by going after the rich AND their spouse (in thinking they're hiding assets), i'm afraid they will lose, a complete waste of time, and the end result will have consequences.