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  1. #7541
    Legend peat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snow Leopard View Post
    Mostly Beagle. Repetition personified!
    not denying he doesnt reiterate
    but a cursory glance does not support your analysis.
    For clarity, nothing I say is advice....

  2. #7542
    ShareTrader Legend Beagle's Avatar
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    Cat's and Dog's haven't been getting on since Adam was a boy lol
    Ecclesiastes 11:2: “Divide your portion to seven, or even to eight, for you do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth.
    Ben Graham - In the short run the market is a voting machine but in the long run the market is a weighing machine

  3. #7543
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    Had another look at that chart showing the number of Auckland house sales over the last five years

    While numbers have been declining for about the last three to four years (the slow down hasn’t just started which is interesting) but the trend looks less sad of late (like the decline is slowing down) —that’s not too bad

    Doesn’t suggest an impending property collapse in Auckland
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by winner69; 12-04-2019 at 04:28 PM.
    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

  4. #7544
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    Had another look at that chart showing the number of Auckland house sales over the last five years

    While numbers have been declining for about the last three to four years (the slow down hasn’t just started which is interesting) but the trend looks less sad of late (like the decline is slowing down) —that’s not too bad

    Doesn’t suggest an impending property collapse in Auckland
    triple bottom?
    or descending triangle.
    either way if it goes less than a thou, mollywoppy!
    For clarity, nothing I say is advice....

  5. #7545
    Speedy Az winner69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrunch View Post
    I wonder whether it's driven by accounting issues. A cash back might be accounted for as a selling expense and buried in other expenses. Dropping the price would impact the development margin and impact a key operational metric. So how was the development margin calculated on finished but empty units again? Is it on the estimated value less the cost of construction?
    Probably is how it works ...important to maintain that development margin

    Just take the amount of the cash back off the price would affect margin by a couple of percentage points

    Sneaky eh
    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

  6. #7546
    ShareTrader Legend Beagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    Probably is how it works ...important to maintain that development margin

    Just take the amount of the cash back off the price would affect margin by a couple of percentage points

    Sneaky eh
    So no big deal considering their development margin has grown steadily over the years from ~ 12% years 5-6 years ago to ~ 33% in 2018.
    Ecclesiastes 11:2: “Divide your portion to seven, or even to eight, for you do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth.
    Ben Graham - In the short run the market is a voting machine but in the long run the market is a weighing machine

  7. #7547
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    Quote Originally Posted by allfromacell View Post
    It's great to see the region's continuing their resilience however Aucklands sales down just shy 20% on March last year and the HPI falling 0.5% in the last month is a concern. Until we see Auckland turn around I won't be celebrating.
    I heard from a builder in tauranga today,he said all the big developer/ house builders have stopped building any more as buyers have dried up.

  8. #7548
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    I think what we are seeing now is a return to a more pedestrian and dare I say 'normal' property market that has been skewed to the higher end. Which might be a bit scary for some considering how it has been in the past few years and judging from share price a few cages have been rattled.

    Well maintained and presented property in good areas will still sell as they are always going to be desirable places to live.

    From SUMs point of view, they are a little bit insulated from it but not as much as OCA due mostly because OCA have care as part of their core competency while SUM does not. Hence why I have not added any SUM during this downturn but have on OCA. SUM is not needs based, care is.

  9. #7549
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    Quote Originally Posted by value_investor View Post
    I think what we are seeing now is a return to a more pedestrian and dare I say 'normal' property market that has been skewed to the higher end. Which might be a bit scary for some considering how it has been in the past few years and judging from share price a few cages have been rattled.

    Well maintained and presented property in good areas will still sell as they are always going to be desirable places to live.

    From SUMs point of view, they are a little bit insulated from it but not as much as OCA due mostly because OCA have care as part of their core competency while SUM does not. Hence why I have not added any SUM during this downturn but have on OCA. SUM is not needs based, care is.
    I think SUM is in a better position than OCA in the profitability of business.

    We all know care business is very labour intensive business, nearly 50/50 patients/employee ratio.
    Cost of employee has been increased sharply for the last couple of years (roughly more than 20%) but the govt has not increased the fee to compensate the cost. And I do not think they will pay the increase for some time or never as current govt's socialism. That is why OCA is changing their business focus to building/selling unit rather than increasing care bed.

    Money is in selling units not caring patients. Good care can promote selling units but cost is also increase. That is why I think last OCA profit has dropped.
    On the other hand, I think SUM's reduced sale will not affect their profit much because less sales means less seller fee.

    I hold both of them plus MET in case, because I can not predict future and I do not want to miss opportunity when I am wrong.
    Last edited by tuaman; 15-04-2019 at 07:56 AM.

  10. #7550
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    I heard from a builder in tauranga today,he said all the big developer/ house builders have stopped building any more as buyers have dried up.
    A poor tradesman who can't find work always looks to lay blame somewhere else, something I have personally seen among clients and people I know many many times. I think we can take this anecdotal evidence with a grain of salt. Most projects take several years from design and consenting to implementation and the build out of larger projects so it seriously stretches plausibility that they all would stop operations all at once.

    I think we have seen the bottom already. Fisher Funds announcing a substantial shareholder notice last week gives the clue that they see value here and with word on the street saying they have 270,000 clients and fresh money coming to the market every month with Kiwisaver and what with it being "so easy" to find high quality growth companies on compelling metrics...you think there might be a "slight" chance they will hoover up any more small panicking reef fish left ?
    Last edited by Beagle; 15-04-2019 at 11:11 AM.
    Ecclesiastes 11:2: “Divide your portion to seven, or even to eight, for you do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth.
    Ben Graham - In the short run the market is a voting machine but in the long run the market is a weighing machine

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