Airlines r a great public service, endorsed by Skol.

[Skol]

Hi Skol and Happy New Year.

Sorry mate. Saw the heading while checking the over night market action and couldnt resist plonking it in here :o

Happy new year to you too.

AIA bought into North Queensland Airports so things looking up.

[Skol]

Airline stocks decline as oil tops $84 a barrel

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/air...1?siteid=yhoof

Not any more.
Having checked the charts of a random selection of 'oilers', airline shares have excelled.

[Skol]

investing in airlines is a disaster...
Id rather fly into Erebus... at least it would be a quick end...

.^sc

A sick post, time to sober up.
Maybe you should give some thought to deleting it.
There might be people here with connections, if you get what I mean!

[tricha]

investing in airlines is a disaster...
Id rather fly into Erebus... at least it would be a quick end...

.^sc

Better a quick end than to suffer like a stunned mullet like this can of worms.
Just a precurser to what owning air shares, is going to be like and when oil hikes again watch them plummet like flys.
Up in the air: Can JAL's fortunes be turned around?



By Roland Buerk
BBC News, Tokyo


JAL could lay off up 15,600 people

Investors have driven Japan Airlines (JAL) shares into the floor, desperate to sell before they lose their shirts.
The price hit 7 yen, just 8 US cents, a new record intraday low. A year ago it was 213 yen.
The selling has been unstoppable, pushing the airline towards the sixth biggest bankruptcy in Japanese history.
That this is being allowed to happen to the national flag carrier says a lot about the change the new government elected last year wants to bring to Japan.
The centre-left Democratic Party of Japan has pledged to spend less taxpayers' money on propping up failing corporations, and more on social programmes to help ordinary people instead.

As a general principle I think shareholders should bear some responsibility


Yukio Hatoyama, Japan's Prime Minister

The conservative Liberal Democratic Party, which governed with just one break for more than 50 years before being losing the election in August, bailed out JAL repeatedly.
Now the Prime Minister Yukio Hatoyama has said that "as a general principle I think shareholders should bear some responsibility".
Asia's biggest airline will not be entirely cut loose though, as old habits die hard.
Bankruptcy
The Enterprise Turnaround Initiative Corporation (ETIC), a state-backed body that has access to public funds, will be giving significant support through a restructuring.
That process is expected to start with JAL seeking protection in the courts from the holders of its estimated 1,400 billion yen ($15bn; £9.4bn) in liabilities - a bankruptcy filing.
The process, similar to Chapter 11 in the United States, allows a company to continue its operations and pursue a revival.

Kazuo Inamori is set to lead JAL through restructuring

Some of Japan's biggest banks will be asked for debt waivers.
It is widely expected that the airline will be delisted from the Tokyo Stock Exchange, wiping out remaining shareholders.
This week the company's pensioners agreed to cuts of around 30% in their payouts - good news for the airline as the black hole in the scheme represents a significant proportion of its liabilities.
Members of staff who have not yet retired had already said they would accept even bigger reductions.
Zen monk
It is Kazuo Inamori who is set to take on the daunting task of leading JAL through a restructuring.
His appointment is being seen as a break with the past management style at the airline, which has been criticized for being slow, overly bureaucratic and too certain of government support.

I'm a complete amateur in the transport industry but I would like to do my best in offering my cooperation


Kazuo Inamori, JAL's new chief executive

At 77, Mr Inamori is regarded as one of Japan's great post-war entrepreneurs, who founded not one, but two, blue chip companies.
He made his first fortune with the electronics component maker Kyocera Corp and his second with KDDI, Japan's number two mobile operator.
He is close to the governing Democratic Party of Japan, but he has no direct experience in aviation.
''I'm a complete amateur in the transport industry but I would like to do my best in offering my cooperation,' he says.

JAL is Asia's biggest airline

''If we steadily implement the rehabilitation plan that is being compiled by ETIC, I believe revival is possible."
The serenity he doubtless enjoys as a Zen monk will probably help. He was ordained in 1997.
And middle managers at JAL will be thumbing through the 11 books he has written about management including Respect the Divine and Love People, and Elevate Your Mind and Expand Your Business.
Generously sprinkled with philosophy, they advocate creating small divisions within companies, each of which must be profitable.
Cutting routes
Japan's government has pledged to keep JAL's planes flying during the coming restructuring.
But the airline that emerges from the crisis could look very different.
It has already announced that it is cutting many international routes and it could lay-off up to 15,600 people - a third of its workforce.
For years Japanese governments spent huge sums on construction projects to try to keep the economy going, including many airports.
It is JAL which has served them.
One option reported to be under consideration is setting up a budget airline with only economy seats to try to make some of the unprofitable routes pay their way.
As investors fight to get out of JAL, global airlines are still circling, hoping to increase their access to the Asian market.
American Airlines and Delta Airlines are competing for a tie up.
But reports in Japan say that with bankruptcy looming both offers may be turned down, for now.

[Skol]

You're flogging a dead horse tricha.
JAL is about the only airline in the world in serious trouble.
You've already run that one by us once before.

You of all people should know better than mention the Erebus thing, I would delete it if I were you, quick time.

Your post (originally shrewds but passed on by you) and shrewd crudes are extremely insensitive to say the least, so let's hear what you've got to say about that.

[tricha]

You're flogging a dead horse tricha.
JAL is about the only airline in the world in serious trouble.
You've already run that one by us once before.

You of all people should know better than mention the Erebus thing, I would delete it if I were you, quick time.

Your post (originally shrewds but passed on by you) and shrewd crudes are extremely insensitive to say the least, so let's hear what you've got to say about that.

Japan Airlines Corp.’s state-backed turnaround will be confirmed on Jan. 19,

All airlines are basically state backed and are going to go through a slow death..
Except maybe VBA, who may have the smarts, but due to unfair competition backed by state backed airlines, not deemed to be worth the risk.

One things sure though, oil will keep going up.

[Phaedrus]

Anyone that owns airline shares must have rocks in their head...

Gosh you say some silly things, Tricha.
Here is a list of a few airline shareprice increases since March :-

Air France 9 - 18
China Eastern 12 - 36
Delta 4 - 12
Lufthansa 10 - 18
Continental 7 - 20
SouthWest 5 - 12
Qantas 1.40 - 2.90
Virgin Blue 14 - 57

Only someone with rocks in their head (or their head in the rocks!) would scoff at performances such as these.

[tricha]

Japan Airlines Corp.’s state-backed turnaround will be confirmed on Jan. 19,

All airlines are basically state backed and are going to go through a slow death..
Except maybe VBA, who may have the smarts, but due to unfair competition backed by state backed airlines, not deemed to be worth the risk.

One things sure though, oil will keep going up.

And this is why airlines are going to crash and burn, the next oil shock is coming faster than this picture depects, China is growing to fast.

"The Next Oil Shock"


I have not changed my view of future oil prices. I described that view in The Price Is Not RIght (December 17, 2008).


Figure 5 — The Boom & Bust view of future oil prices as explained in The Price Is Not Right. The figure has been annotated to show where we are and my best guess concerning the timing of next oil shock. I believe it will occur in 2012 plus or minus 1 year, given the uncertainties about Chimerica discussed above.

[Skol]

Gosh you say some silly things, Tricha.
Here is a list of a few airline shareprice increases since March :-

Air France 9 - 18
China Eastern 12 - 36
Delta 4 - 12
Lufthansa 10 - 18
Continental 7 - 20
SouthWest 5 - 12
Qantas 1.40 - 2.90
Virgin Blue 14 - 57

Only someone with rocks in their head (or their head in the rocks!) would scoff at performances such as these.

Just a couple more Phaedrus to rub the salt into the wound.

REX 88-132
AIR 76-118

[digger]

Gosh you say some silly things, Tricha.
Here is a list of a few airline shareprice increases since March :-

Air France 9 - 18
China Eastern 12 - 36
Delta 4 - 12
Lufthansa 10 - 18
Continental 7 - 20
SouthWest 5 - 12
Qantas 1.40 - 2.90
Virgin Blue 14 - 57

Only someone with rocks in their head (or their head in the rocks!) would scoff at performances such as these.

Phaedrus your a chartest and the problem with that school of thought is that you are always looking back.Firstly your qoute from Tricha is taken off the Peak Oil thread where Tricha is replying to me with a comment that clearly refers to another climb in oil prices and the effect that will have on airlines.To now take the bottom of the present cycle that bottomed in feb 09 until now shows a great profit for sure but is a distortion of what we were talking about.I understand Tricha as saying that a second super oil spike will be very negative for airlines in the future and i can not see the relavaence of your past preformances from feb to now as even being in the same conversation.
Perhaps it would be better to say that a second oil spike will indeed be negative for airline shares but in the process this is great for traders as after the oil prices falls again the airlines shares do seem to recover and show quick profits.However i do agree with Tricha that if there is a coming oil price spike that you would be wise to off load airline shares.