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  1. #2356
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    Farmers' small emission price

    Far from perfect but perfect for far mers. We have a start with most onboard.

    Agriculture, the most polluting sector of the economy, looks set to join the Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS), but under a sweetheart deal that will see it pay just 5 percent of its total emissions cost from 2025.
    That would equate to a charge of just $0.01c per kilogram of milk solids and $0.01 cent per kg of beef at the current ETS price of $25 a tonne of carbon.
    Agriculture accounts for nearly half of total greenhouse gas emissions. It has been excluded from the ETS until now
    The ETS works by forcing polluters to pay a price for their emissions, whilst paying a credit to owners of "carbon sinks" like forests.

  2. #2357
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    I just read the latest "emergency" propaganda piece on Stuff. Unwittingly they clearly layout why the whole thing is BS. The graph that displays the corelation between carbon and temperature over thousands of years shows the carbon levels mostly lag behind whatever the temperature is doing. Blindingly obvious that if the temp rises or falls before the carbon level, it aint the carbon level causing it. The historical graph shows temp rising and falling ahead of carbon levels, sometimes 1000s of years apart. This isn't the first time I have seen this graph but I hope it continues to be part of exposing that the emperor is naked.

  3. #2358
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonu View Post
    I just read the latest "emergency" propaganda piece on Stuff. Unwittingly they clearly layout why the whole thing is BS. The graph that displays the corelation between carbon and temperature over thousands of years shows the carbon levels mostly lag behind whatever the temperature is doing. Blindingly obvious that if the temp rises or falls before the carbon level, it aint the carbon level causing it. The historical graph shows temp rising and falling ahead of carbon levels, sometimes 1000s of years apart. This isn't the first time I have seen this graph but I hope it continues to be part of exposing that the emperor is naked.
    It would help to post the link, but I presume this is it.

    https://interactives.stuff.co.nz/201...07-and-rising/

  4. #2359
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    Farmers' small emission price

    Far from perfect but perfect for far mers. We have a start with most onboard.

    Agriculture, the most polluting sector of the economy, looks set to join the Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS), but under a sweetheart deal that will see it pay just 5 percent of its total emissions cost from 2025.
    That would equate to a charge of just $0.01c per kilogram of milk solids and $0.01 cent per kg of beef at the current ETS price of $25 a tonne of carbon.
    Agriculture accounts for nearly half of total greenhouse gas emissions. It has been excluded from the ETS until now
    The ETS works by forcing polluters to pay a price for their emissions, whilst paying a credit to owners of "carbon sinks" like forests.
    With agriculture, probably say 90% plus is exported to feed people in other countries. Also farmers are very limited in how to mitigate emissions currently.

    Us mitigating for food exports is a bit like saying Saudi/Iran should be planting trees for exporting fossil fuels.

  5. #2360
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    Ive read one can buy carbon neutral beef already For that reason alone let alone environmental we need to catch up fast and have value added superior products for a big point of difference and continued premium product and pricing. Well done to the Govt bringing all the farmers, etc to the table but early days yet, more tweaking to come.

  6. #2361
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    Ive read one can buy carbon neutral beef already For that reason alone let alone environmental we need to catch up fast and have value added superior products for a big point of difference and continued premium product and pricing. Well done to the Govt bringing all the farmers, etc to the table but early days yet, more tweaking to come.
    No thoughts on the lag of carbon levels in relation to temperature? Thanks Fungus for posting the link

  7. #2362
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    "Farming leaders unanimously committed to what they called an "historic agreement" to achieve "enduring progress towards the goals of reducing and mitigating agricultural emissions". That they did so in agreement with a Climate Change Minister from the Green Party - something that would have seemed impossible a few years ago - is a credit to the good-will of all involved."
    Farmers exempt from 95 percent of emissions charges under new proposed rules

  8. #2363
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    [FONT="]"Farming leaders unanimously committed to what they called an "historic agreement" to achieve "enduring progress towards the goals of reducing and mitigating agricultural emissions". That they did so in agreement with a Climate Change Minister from the Green Party - something that would have seemed impossible a few years ago - is a credit to the good-will of all involved."
    [/FONT]
    Farmers exempt from 95 percent of emissions charges under new proposed rules
    Still no thoughts on the carbon lag?

  9. #2364
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    I have no wish to drive a rusty redundant old iCE wreck that cant get a WOF or Rego jonu, individual choice.


    Agricultural emissions in ETS firing line – interim climate change report
    Last edited by Joshuatree; 17-07-2019 at 06:10 PM.

  10. #2365
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonu View Post
    Still no thoughts on the carbon lag?
    yeah, trying to narrow a complex system like planetary atmosphere down to a single factor and ignoring all other inputs to make a point is totally daft. I'll trust the scientists.

  11. #2366
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    [QUOTE=Vaygor1;765912]Nice to see the 5-Star rating. There's really no excuse for anything less these days on any type of vehicle.

    With only a tiny uptake of e-vehicles (percentage wise) in the world to-date, the demand on Cobalt and Nickel doubled last year.
    However one looks at it, the answer is to mine and mine and mine and mine, and then mine some more. Quote

    The demand for nickle and cobalt did not double last year but the amounts used for batteries was double the previous year.
    The modern day ICE engine has taken over a hundred years to reach itís present stage of development. It is fueled by a substance that to be obtained has meant thousands of holes drilled,
    hundreds of tankers built to ship it around the world, large numbers of refineries, and a massive infrastructure to provide and service filling stations. The costs must be astronomical.
    To say that EVs will never be viable when compared with an ICE powered vehicle seems a little extreme. Given time and development I am sure there is a future for EVs.

    westerly

  12. #2367
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    I have no wish to drive a rusty redundant old iCE wreck that cant get a WOF or Rego jonu, individual choice.


    Agricultural emissions in ETS firing line – interim climate change report
    I think the carbon lag goes a bit more to the heart of the problem. As in, is carbon really the cause? The faithful to the new dogma don't seem able to explain it. How can the cause be occurring after the effect? Problematic methinks.

  13. #2368
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond47 View Post
    yeah, trying to narrow a complex system like planetary atmosphere down to a single factor and ignoring all other inputs to make a point is totally daft. I'll trust the scientists.
    But we are told the big problem is carbon. If it is not carbon..and I have never seen a cause happen after the effect...isn't it a tad wasteful spending billions solving a cause that isn't?

  14. #2369
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    You sound like Trump just another denialist. Trump himself should at some point be tried for crimes against humanity because he has atp made such a negative impact about climate change principley to get the coal states vote. Meanwhile the world is accepting and doing something about it including our farmers as above.

  15. #2370
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    You sound like Trump just another denialist. Trump himself should at some point be tried for crimes against humanity because he has atp made such a negative impact about climate change principley to get the coal states vote. Meanwhile the world is accepting and doing something about it including our farmers as above.
    But the lag JT...the lag...please explain how a cause happens after an effect.

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