MVN Methven

[Lizard]

Maybe. Maybe just typical of how groomed and pumped companies get for listing... and maybe one of the reasons so few listings go ahead these days is that investors are fed-up with most listings taking 5-10 years to get back to justifying the price they paid for them.

[percy]

A poor business can have good years,while a good business can have bad years.Often hard to tell which is which.
So I think Lizard is right about grooming and pumping a company for listing.I do think MVN is a poor business and winners69's analysis of shareholder wealth destruction confirms this.
I do not know the company well enough to have an opinon of Rick Fala,but he never returned my phone call,which is always a sign of laziness,or poor office [management] skills.

[Silverlight]

I seem to be playing contrary on a few threads recently.

While Methven has had disappointment in the past few years, it has a dominant position in NZ, and growing recognition in Australia. 10 cents EPS forecast with 90% payout, places the yield at current prices very well. We are at historic lows in the building sector, and with significant spending expected in future from Christchurch alone, Methven seems to be well positioned, just a bit out of favour because of the cyclical nature of the construction industry.

Last 6 months, ACC buying more, directors buying more. Good entry level price.

[percy]

[QUOTE=Silverlight;367576]I seem to be playing contrary on a few threads recently.

Makes the threads more interesting.
I always enjoy and learn from your posts.

[Snoopy]

I do think MVN is a poor business and winners69's analysis of shareholder wealth destruction confirms this.

Everyone seems to be having their own rant, so I thought I would add mine.

I think there is a lot of over-engineered tapware about. Suppose I had a time machine with just a few dial dates. Say I was allowed to go back in time; but purely in the interests of bettering the future of the human race. Using one date on the dial, I would take a modern day stealth firearm and go back to about 1910. Taps, baths and showers for the middle class masses were IMO pretty much perfected by then. I think the old two bar and four bar ended tap handle plated metal design of that era was pretty well spot on: functional, elegant to look at, practical. And they hadn’t started to go down the path of cheapening everything in the material sense, and unnecessarily complicating things in the design sense (think mixers).

Having traveled back to 1910, I would systematically go around all the tap manufacturers and quietly rub out all of tap designers of the day. Then I would TNT the design offices to freeze tap technology at that point. But given I don’t have a time machine and don’t have a real appetite for intergenerational murder, I will give you my take on how to deal with the tap situation today.

Lizard is getting all-nostalgic about the downgrading of product to plastic. I say that for many applications plastic is fine. And if you don’t like it then pay more for the real (metal) thing. You can still get it from Methven at a cost. About five years ago I bought a single new pair of (Methven) taps for my bathroom sink. Cost $550 before installation. Outrageous you say? Superficially yes. But they still look as good as when they were new (they are stainless steel) and I’ll never have to replace a washer inside them. Given these taps are used many multiple times per day, I think it was money well spent. Another source for good older style taps, if you don’t want to spend the money I did, is demolition yards. Polish them up, stick new washers inside and you are away.

I hope Winner gets a good run from his Italian taps. Good stuff comes out of Italy but the Italians are equally known for building stuff down to a price. ‘Italian’ and ‘metal’ is not always a happy adjective noun pairing. But if it looks good in the showroom it must be ok – eh. Amazingly Italy still seems to get away with subsidizing some of their production as well (even if they don’t publicly use the ‘s’ word). So we can’t guarantee the Italians will always be as competitive as they seem.

I have visited Europe, the US, Argentina, Australia and Hong Kong (some of those albeit stopover briefly) over the last few years. After fiddling with various hotel shower and tap systems on three different continents I have come to he conclusion that no-one can do tapware and showers better than Methven. Methven IMO really are a world class supplier. But because most sharechatters don’t get exposure to or don’t pay attention to the worldwide alternatives, they just don’t realize it.

OK, here ends my rant of the day. I am not a good enough student of the business model of Methven to know if diving into the UK market in the way they did was a good idea. But if you have a world class product, I would think restricting your market horizon to Oceania is selling yourself short. I will spend the rest of my day hanging out at the World War One flying ace café sipping a root beer. 1914 was still a good year for tapware.

SNOOPy

[Silverlight]

The current price still looks great to get in at, to mimic my post on the Pumpkin Patch thread, insiders know more than we do about the business, and are not likely to throw away there hard earned cash.

5/01/2012 Nigel Darbyshire 18k @ 1.05
8/12/2011 Deidre Campbell 25k @ 1.1360
2/12/2011 Richard Cutfield 25k @ 1.1227
2/12/2011 Peter Stanes 20k @ 1.0993
2/12/2011 Phil Lough 25k @ 1.13
10/10/2011 ACC 769k @ 1.37
10/06/2011 David Mair 50k @ 1.55
10/06/2011 Phil Lough 100k @ 1.55
10/06/2011 Rick Fala 280k @ 1.54

Not the only factor, but an excellent indicator.

[Lizard]

Tidy result from MVN today. Doing well to hold the divs and still looks reasonably good value at $1.21.

[winner69]

A couple of months ago they were pretty positive and said half year npat might be lower than last year

But heck they didn't say it was going to be 20% down ......bloody poms not buying enough taps etc

Only made $3.2m last year so the 20% only a few bob

Looks like the share price was jousting getting ahead of itself .....punters just a little too excited


No doubt good news for some .....buy on the dips eh ......but they wouldn't want to cause too many dips though would they

Good company .....more innovative than FPA in my opinion .....but don't get te same kudos

[winner69]

You'd have to assume that revenues for H1 are down on pcp. ....or heck something really wrong

I know things are tough but heck 8 consecutive half years of sales decline is starting too push credibility a bit too much ......ESP as the consistent message is always the next half is looking good

H2F12 revenues were nearly 30% less than in 2008 ......heck


However buy on the dips ....like all innovative companies we'll be ok

[percy]

[QUOTE=winner69;381856]


However buy on the dips ...

With a tap manufacturer is it ;buy on the drips,or a drip to buy on the dips.Either way you end up taking a bath,while the SP goes down the plug hole.!!! lol.