Allied Farmers Limited Capital Notes (ALF010)

[Alan3285]

26% alone tells you what the market thinks of the risk?

That's right - but no matter what, I can't 'lose' on them over 12 months now, since I have 10,000 units remaining held, and I am already cash positive on them.

Any real analysis that implies they will fall over would be interesting to go through.

Alan.

[percy]

That's right - but no matter what, I can't 'lose' on them over 12 months now, since I have 10,000 units remaining held, and I am already cash positive on them.

Any real analysis that implies they will fall over would be interesting to go through.

Alan.

I am sure you will find Chalkie's article on ALF of interest.

[Alan3285]

I am sure you will find Chalkie's article on ALF of interest.

Where is it?

Alan.

[Alan3285]

Saw your post in the ALF shares thread:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/.../...s-to-get-angry

Thanks!

Alan.

[Alan3285]

ALF is putting their $19m capital raising on hold:

Stuff

Allied Farmers' attempt to raise $19.3 million capital has hit a snag as its trustee continues to ask questions about a breach of financial trust deed obligations by its finance subsidiary, Allied Nationwide Finance.

The company had set a record date for the partially underwritten capital raising of tomorrow, August 10, but has opted to delay, says Allied Farmers chairman John Loughlin.

"Our preference is for the prospectus to disclose the very latest information, and with our Trustee having some questions over our finance subsidiary we feel it is prudent to delay the prospectus.

"We believe the Trustee's concerns can be resolved quickly and we have been working towards a speedy resolution since we were informed of NZ Guardian Trust's concerns on Friday. "

Loughlin says at issue is its "future liquidity position and how it would be funded after the Government's guarantee expires on October 11".

"The finance business has been self funding for the last three years or so. While our current audit is yet to be signed off, our numbers show that continues to be the case, and we are confident we will continue to have or obtain sufficient funds necessary to pay back debenture holders."

He also says a solution might involve Allied Farmers contributing further capital to Allied Nationwide Finance, perhaps out of assets recently acquired from Hanover Finance and United Finance.

Alan.

[Alan3285]

Further announcement by ANF (not ALF - the subsidiary):

http://www.nzx.com/markets/NZDX/ANFH...der-Trust-Deed


Putting pressure on the trustee?

Alan.

[winner69]

Bloody disaster the whole affair though isn't it Alan

[minimoke]

If they didn't pay debenture maturities due yesterday - isn't that a default event so the Deposit Guarantee is triggered?

[Alan3285]

Bloody disaster the whole affair though isn't it Alan

For the original ALF shareholders - absolutely. They should have sold when the Hanover deal was put on the table (or voted it down).

For the ex-Hanoverians? Difficult to say - the assets might have been worth the same within ALF or outside, in which case, no real difference to them either way. I guess they might think they could have had a pop at the Hanover guys, but in reality those amounts would have been relatively small compared to the overall book values (although perhaps not so small compared to actual values in hindsight!)

Alan.

[Beagle]

For the original ALF shareholders - absolutely. They should have sold when the Hanover deal was put on the table (or voted it down).

For the ex-Hanoverians? Difficult to say - the assets might have been worth the same within ALF or outside, in which case, no real difference to them either way. I guess they might think they could have had a pop at the Hanover guys, but in reality those amounts would have been relatively small compared to the overall book values (although perhaps not so small compared to actual values in hindsight!)

Alan.

The deal letting those crooks off wasn't it $20m and the way that Hanover was heavily dividend stripped in its last two years of operation, from memory over $80m in dividends were stripped by the Hanover owners, were major factors why investors should have voted this fiasco down in the first place.

The irony of just squeaking through by the barest of margins just over 75% isn't lost on me. I'm sure Eric Watson and Mark Hotchin will be lauging into their Pina Colada's while they sun themselves in 5 star luxury somewhere in a sunny part of the world.

Don't forget to tell us about your losses when they go under Alan, oh no wait, I suppose your ahead on these as well....