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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by POSSUM THE CAT View Post
    Mac Dunk we are being robbed on all NZ product NZ cheese far cheaper in AUS than here.
    Why is it you can buy garden furniture imported from overseas cheaper than I can buy the timber here to make it. The 15% GST tax on everything before you start that the poor potential home owner cant claim back Is one of the main reasons people cant afford their first home. Macdunk

  2. #12
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    My dad had a saying he often repeated, and I think it is relevent, "Whenever someone get something for nothing, someone
    else gets nothing for something." In my opinion we have have too many that get too much for too little, right through the
    economy from top to bottom.

  3. #13
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    Why is it you can buy garden furniture imported from overseas cheaper than I can buy the timber here to make it. The 15% GST tax on everything before you start that the poor potential home owner cant claim back Is one of the main reasons people cant afford their first home. Macdunk

    Agree. My relatives imported door and window frames from the USA, and even accounting for GST it still worked out cheaper than here.

    That said, IMHO there is no such thing as "affordable housing" -- it's a meaningless term that has been used by politicians trying to gain traction for years.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist View Post

    Agree. My relatives imported door and window frames from the USA, and even accounting for GST it still worked out cheaper than here.
    And that perhaps is part of the problem.

    Say a NZ manufacturer has a $100,000 overhead regardless of output which is spread amongst 100 consumers. Your relatives act has put the price up for NZ buyers - the pool of NZ consumers has shrunk by One meaning the overhead now has to be spread amongst 99.

    At some point 99 goes to 98 and then 97 and eventually the firm can no longer afford to invest in new technology or plant to make their product cheaper to produce.

    The skilled staff, perhaps feeling nervous about their future, start to head offshore leaving the manufacturer even more vulnerable.

    We forget we are a tiny wee nation at the bottom of the world. We imply do not have the population and demand to create the efficiencies in production that Australia or America can do.

    We need to support local trades and manufacturers - if we don't they will shrivel and die. At some point an equilibrium between local and import will occur. But if we start complaining of a lack of local support or employment we won't have far to look to see the reason why.

  5. #15
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    Thumbs down

    arhghhhhhhhhh


    I think Mini wants us back in the protected market days and Oldrider wants us run by the communists/Keith Locke arghhhhhhhh

  6. #16
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    No not at all. I'm all for an open market. I just wish people would look at consequences rather than just the "cheapest" deal. Where I can my money goes to locals - and I don't need a government to tell me to do that. When these aftershocks stop I'm going to give my door supplier a call and they'll be around to unjamb it. What chance do you reckon I've got if I had to call the States!

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by belgarion View Post
    Not so ... It means that the majority of public buy and own their own homes rather than the state having to provide them either by building them and renting them out at below market rates or by subsidising them indirectly one way or another. Its a basic tenant of Capitalism, Captialist ...
    The market decides what is 'affordable' or not, just plain supply and demand usually. THAT is capitalism folks .

    Ask yourself, affordable (or unafforable) to whom?

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist View Post
    The market decides what is 'affordable' or not, just plain supply and demand usually. THAT is capitalism folks .

    Ask yourself, affordable (or unafforable) to whom?
    That is true, but why should people who only can afford to buy a jap Import be forced to buy a Rolls Royce. Thats where the building game gets it so wrong making houses so expensive that the poor hard working couple is forced to live in Mum and Dads garage. Take your pick out of this lot.
    !, double glazing.
    2,insulation fit for the antartic circle.
    3, Engineers reports for simple little details that were common sense when building inspectors of the past made the decision.
    4,plans that cost three times as much drawing common sense detail.
    5,Developers donating bought land, and building roads at the whim of the council.
    We have now reached the inevitable where people are forced to rent and the landlord stuck with the GST that the tenant ends up paying one way or the other. The GOVT dont want private landlords but want to control everything.
    We are now destined to be a country where private home ownership will decline and the bludging of the GOVT will be the common trend in housing. Macdunk

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by duncan macgregor View Post
    That is true, but why should people who only can afford to buy a jap Import be forced to buy a Rolls Royce. Thats where the building game gets it so wrong making houses so expensive that the poor hard working couple is forced to live in Mum and Dads garage. Take your pick out of this lot.
    !, double glazing.
    2,insulation fit for the antartic circle.
    Well those depend on where you live.
    Ive done both. Double glazing was a bit dearer than single but on a scale of things not too much. Strangely I was flogging old windows off on trade me and they were selling for a little less than single glazed new. So in the end didn't cost too much at all.

    I also went for above spec insulation in walls and ceilings. Cost a bit more but I did the installation myself so saved a bit there.

    Two important consideration. Talking to some friends over Christmas who have a similar situation. two heat pumps, large house in Christchurch. My winter power bill is $350. Theirs is $700. I'm toasty warm they aren't.

    Can't see why you'd want to double glaze up north (noise perhaps?) or over insulate (heat perhaps) but MacD's point is quite valid. So many new homes are way over specced. If we want to keep up with the Jones then this is what we must expect.

  10. #20
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    There are many areas in NZ even in Auckland where you can buy a 3 bedroom 95 sq m modal house on a 750 sq m freehold section for $240,000 or so. There are vast suburbs full of such properties in Manukau, and whole cities worth in provincial NZ. I don't think that is over-priced at all. Analysing, that's $140,000 or so for the land and $100,000 or so for the improvements. On the house itself minus other improvements that's a rate of $950/sq m which is well below replacement cost. And no developer can produce a new section for $140,000 that's a fact as I am in this business. I can tell you that a developer in Manukau cannot provide a section for sale at less than $175,000 or so as the development cost is so high at +$80,000 or so. Council's massive development fees are a large part of the problem. Drainage levies alone are $15-20,000 per section then you have 6% reserve contributions say $10-11,000, waste-water network growth charge of $5,000 or so, new house development levy of $6,000 etc etc. as well as $6-10,000 consent fees, then engineer, surveyor, drainage, electrical, telecom etc etc etc.

    At 6.5% interest rate that's $300/week, and on a 30 year mortgage that's $350/week, in both cases less than rent is for the same property in South Auckland.

    My company has a few rentals in Manukau with numbers similar to the above, except better, eg rental $380/week, purchase price $210,000, a cash-flow annual return after rates, insurance, maintenance of 7.5% or so on a self-managed basis. All we need now is a bit of capital gain.

    The rental market is getting tighter and tighter in Auckland too with rental growth of 5% pa these last 3 years.

    Even here in Christchurch there are whole tracts of the city where $240,000 will buy you a solid average house on a full section, and add $100,000 for a significantly better area such as Burnside.

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