If National wins ...

[Joshuatree]

We are a responsible country doing the right humane thing for a woman and her two childen.Aus is not, it has totally abandoned them, thats not a modern , civilised country. thats callous and cruelty.

[Balance]

"Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has been given assurances from Australia that it won't "arbitrarily" cancel citizenship of those who are also New Zealand citizens, without first discussing it. "

Yeah, right!

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/polit...in-future.html

What happens when you have a BS & spin driven PM in NZ.

[dobby41]

Citizenship can be revoked by the country of birth. Let's face it, we got 'owned' yet again. We know Australia's modus operandi in these situations. We could have revoked her citizenship before Australia did, but we didn't. Now we're stuck with a known associate of a terrorist organisation who hasn't lived in NZ since age six, along with her children. We now have a very expensive on-going security threat to deal with, that was made in Australia. Well done New Zealand.

How if that makes them stateless?
In 2006 NZ became a party to the 1961 Convention on the Reduction of Statelessness
We did so with the following statement
Declaration:
"[New Zealand] declares that in accordance with
paragraph 3 of article 8 of the Convention New Zealand
retains the right to deprive a person of his New Zealand
citizenship on the following grounds, being grounds
existing in New Zealand law at the present time:
the person has, while a New Zealand citizen and while
of or over the age of 18 years and of full capacity,
(a) Acquired the nationality or citizenship of another
country by any voluntary and formal act, and acted in a
manner that is contrary to the interests of New Zealand; or
(b) Voluntarily exercised any of the privileges or
performed any of the duties of another nationality or
citizenship possessed by him in a manner that is contrary
to the interests of New Zealand."

So we could have dropped her as a citizen if we had done it before Aussie but it is now too late under our law.

Australia never signed - they don't give a toss really.

[dobby41]

What happens when you have a BS & spin driven PM in NZ.

She was given those assurances - they mean nothing but just what do you think she (or Judith) can do about it?

Let's face it, you, I and the Govt know that Aussie will discuss it but the discussion will go something like - "we are doing it, discussion over, get stuffed if you don't like it".

[Zaphod]

How if that makes them stateless?

So we could have dropped her as a citizen if we had done it before Aussie but it is now too late under our law.

Exactly the point I was making, as per the quote below:

We know Australia's modus operandi in these situations. We could have revoked her citizenship before Australia did, but we didn't.

The consequence of the government's inaction is that we now must take the woman and her children. Outsmarted yet again by Australia.

[Blue Skies]

Exactly the point I was making, as per the quote below:



The consequence of the government's inaction is that we now must take the woman and her children. Outsmarted yet again by Australia.

Before we (mostly) all rush to what seems to be the default outrage setting, just a quick cursory check shows there are 2 innocent vulnerable children being overlooked here, a 2year old and a 5 year old who are both NZ citizens.
I don't believe any decent person here would refuse to offer them refuge from the extreme trauma & suffering they must have experienced, even if they weren't NZ citizens.

So before we rage at the govt over another difficult & complex issue, we have a moral & a legal obligation to take this family back & its a real shame Judith Collins is so desperate she has to appeal to & exploit the worst traits in human nature, fear, anger, selfishness & ignorance to shore up her fading leadership. This is not the National Party of Bill English or John Key.

Further it appears the young mother a 19 year old at the time, on seeing first hand the reality didn't match the seductive recruitment propaganda, may have had second thoughts and attempted to pull out of crossing into Syria & return home, but was stymied by the group she was travelling with. I can understand that with a group as brutal as ISIS.

And really does anyone believe she & her 2 children pose more of a threat to NZ'ers than some of the anti-vaxers we find here or the gang members being sent back from Aussie ?
I don't think so.

Save your outrage for the anti-vaxers, & the deeply cynical Aussie politicians who are abusing NZ'ers human rights by deporting them.

[Balance]

Before we (mostly) all rush to what seems to be the default outrage setting, just a quick cursory check shows there are 2 innocent vulnerable children being overlooked here, a 2year old and a 5 year old who are both NZ citizens.
I don't believe any decent person here would refuse to offer them refuge from the extreme trauma & suffering they must have experienced, even if they weren't NZ citizens.

So before we rage at the govt over another difficult & complex issue, we have a moral & a legal obligation to take this family back & its a real shame Judith Collins is so desperate she has to appeal to & exploit the worst traits in human nature, fear, anger, selfishness & ignorance to shore up her fading leadership. This is not the National Party of Bill English or John Key.

Further it appears the young mother a 19 year old at the time, on seeing first hand the reality didn't match the seductive recruitment propaganda, may have had second thoughts and attempted to pull out of crossing into Syria & return home, but was stymied by the group she was travelling with. I can understand that with a group as brutal as ISIS.

And really does anyone believe she & her 2 children pose more of a threat to NZ'ers than some of the anti-vaxers we find here or the gang members being sent back from Aussie ?
I don't think so.

Save your outrage for the anti-vaxers, & the deeply cynical Aussie politicians who are abusing NZ'ers human rights by deporting them.

And the two 'innocent' children will be brought up by a radicalized damaged woman to become model citizens? Screw that for a joke.

[artemis]

And the two 'innocent' children will be brought up by a radicalized damaged woman to become model citizens? Screw that for a joke.

Will there be anything stopping her and the children travelling to Australia? Where she has family.

[Balance]

Will there be anything stopping her and the children travelling to Australia? Where she has family.

Australia can stop anyone (save their citizens) from entering any time - as many a NZer has found.

[dobby41]

And the two 'innocent' children will be brought up by a radicalized damaged woman to become model citizens? Screw that for a joke.

Do you know for sure if she is 'radicalized' or now regrets her foolishness?
I suspect you have made some assumptions about her current state of mind.
It will be interesting to see how she reacts.
She will need a lot of support either way, as will the children.