If National wins ...

[Daytr]

Yeah its amasing what they can fast track when they want to, but when its actually about workers rights or even safety they drag the chain. One worker a week is killed in NZ, that is a very poor statistic imo. National is living up to its reputation of screwing workers. Zero hour contracts, tea breaks etc.
Perhaps if these politicians actually worked with their hands or physically or laborious work they may have more empathy.

[craic]

In my time as a Timber Inspector for forestry, I came within an inch of being killed or maimed on two or three occasions. It wasn't anyones fault and virtually impossible to avoid. Various industries have a bad history but if you look at that history, there was a time, within a generation or two, where loss of life and injury was an everyday occurrence and gained little attention. And cutting up trees with chainsaws reminds me that every time I think that I have made every mistake in the book and learned from it, something else happens. No one with half a brain would go down a coalmine in this earthquake ridden land. Nor would anyone go miles out into the Pacific to fish in a thirty or forty-foot boat knowing the history of that ocean but they do. Tea breaks or higher pay will not really affect anything.

[blackcap]

In my time as a Timber Inspector for forestry, I came within an inch of being killed or maimed on two or three occasions. It wasn't anyones fault and virtually impossible to avoid. Various industries have a bad history but if you look at that history, there was a time, within a generation or two, where loss of life and injury was an everyday occurrence and gained little attention. And cutting up trees with chainsaws reminds me that every time I think that I have made every mistake in the book and learned from it, something else happens. No one with half a brain would go down a coalmine in this earthquake ridden land. Nor would anyone go miles out into the Pacific to fish in a thirty or forty-foot boat knowing the history of that ocean but they do. Tea breaks or higher pay will not really affect anything.

Im with you on this one Craic. Accidents at work are bound to happen, regardless of all the Work and Safety rubbish they prescribe us. I was a few years ago felling trees on a mates farm and nearly had a tree fall on me. I had done nothing wrong, had not ignored any safety prescriptions. It just happens. Driving a car kills about 400 a year in NZ and I do not see them calling for a ban on driving.

[westerly]

Im with you on this one Craic. Accidents at work are bound to happen, regardless of all the Work and Safety rubbish they prescribe us. I was a few years ago felling trees on a mates farm and nearly had a tree fall on me. I had done nothing wrong, had not ignored any safety prescriptions. It just happens. Driving a car kills about 400 a year in NZ and I do not see them calling for a ban on driving.

In 1985 there were 747 road deaths. Last year 297 It just happens ?

westerly

[elZorro]

I'm not sure what gst has to do with The Napier electorate. I am personally in favour of increased GST as a fairer means of gathering tax but as far as our local labour lad is concerned, He will have real difficulty next time now that Garth McVicar will not be there to to take out 7000 votes and guarantee his passage. Nor will he have the "save the rail link" voters and it's highly unlikely that the anti-amalgamation people will help either as the Hasting voters in the referendum are more than keen to get rid of their present administration. As to elZorros sheeples, I assume that he is referring to the 75% or so of Kiwis who did not vote labour in the last election and are therefore somewhat less intelligent than his lot. That is a sad comment on one who appears to be a leading odvocate of the left.

No Craic, I was referring to W69's cartoon about sheep on a couch, agreeing with all the good stuff National are doing. John Key was at Fieldays today, opening the event (but it started 4 hours before that of course, it was symbolic). His speech was not very memorable, although the stage setup was fairly flash. I spoke to an exhibitor who was not impressed with the R&D part-funding setup at Callaghan for SMEs, it's so difficult and tedious to fill out that they don't even try. They'll work on stuff slowly by themselves, from cashflow. That leaves all the big guys to help themselves to most of the funding, which of course is what we see now.

[Daytr]

Accidents just happen! Tell that to the families of the Pike River mine disaster. Yes sometimes they do happen & sometimes they are preventable.
Work & safety rubbish, as you term it is the reason we don't have as many people dying in work accidents as we used to.
No one is asking for work to be banned either, just made as safe as possible.
Quite frankly your post is utter rubbish & that sort of view belongs in the Victorian age.

Im with you on this one Craic. Accidents at work are bound to happen, regardless of all the Work and Safety rubbish they prescribe us. I was a few years ago felling trees on a mates farm and nearly had a tree fall on me. I had done nothing wrong, had not ignored any safety prescriptions. It just happens. Driving a car kills about 400 a year in NZ and I do not see them calling for a ban on driving.

[elZorro]

Accidents just happen! Tell that to the families of the Pike River mine disaster. Yes sometimes they do happen & sometimes they are preventable.
Work & safety rubbish, as you term it is the reason we don't have as many people dating in wok accidents as we used to.
No one is asking for work to be banned either, just made as safe as possible.
Quite frankly your post is utter rubbish & that sort of view belongs in the Victorian age.

Daytr, Patrick Smellie agrees with you, except about wok accidents (overcooked?).

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opin...y+11+June+2015

[blackcap]

Accidents just happen! Tell that to the families of the Pike River mine disaster. Yes sometimes they do happen & sometimes they are preventable.
Work & safety rubbish, as you term it is the reason we don't have as many people dating in wok accidents as we used to.
No one is asking for work to be banned either, just made as safe as possible.
Quite frankly your post is utter rubbish & that sort of view belongs in the Victorian age.

I guess we will just disagree then on the definition of an accident. Pike River was no accident. But what I really mean is that you cannot legislate against stupid. In some cases legislation will not help prevent accidents but grossly impede the ability to work productively and in my opinion we are at that point now where to go further would be detrimental to this country. I am not advocating going back to a Victorian age (those days were terrible) but the sliding scale is starting to get out of hand. Example.. we could legislate for 0 road deaths per year (speed limit of 20km/h) but we do not... because it impedes progress.

[winner69]

When's the next TPPA protest March?

Key doing a good job for his mates in helping getting thisget through, not just in NZ but touting it across the world.

He must be brought to account before its too late.

EZ, I sense Labour is on the 'inside' as well

[Daytr]

Yep I get your point & agree some 'accidents' were people/companies ignoring current regulations.
However Pike River being an example, where were the inspectors in regards the quite obvious departures from either good or even legal practice?
It appears there was a complete departure from compliance by both the company and mine inspectors.
Having recently managed an industrial plant with 100+ workers per shift, I didn't see one instance where safety got in the way of productivity, but I did see a few examples of the opposite. I'm sure there are examples where the regulations are in the way of good practice, however what are your examples of this? It only takes one fatality to think what was the cost of preventing that. You can to a degree prevent stupid accidents as well through training, although accidents obviously aren't fully preventable in dangerous environments.

Anyway back to the point. National are dragging their heels in regards safety regulations for NZ workers. They have taken away other protections in regards zero hour contracts that even the fast food chains have had to backflip on to prevent a public backlash & then tea breaks. Tea breaks may sound like a fairly small thing, but when you are doing physical work particularly those breaks are not only important for the worker to refuel & re-hydrate it will also add to productivity. Having managed large teams of people for many years in differing environments I have always got far more out of my staff if they are respected, feel safe & given at least what they are due & when they need it flexibility. When you need them to go that extra mile, there is no argument & they will be happy to oblige rather than feel they are just being taken advantage of again.

I guess we will just disagree then on the definition of an accident. Pike River was no accident. But what I really mean is that you cannot legislate against stupid. In some cases legislation will not help prevent accidents but grossly impede the ability to work productively and in my opinion we are at that point now where to go further would be detrimental to this country. I am not advocating going back to a Victorian age (those days were terrible) but the sliding scale is starting to get out of hand. Example.. we could legislate for 0 road deaths per year (speed limit of 20km/h) but we do not... because it impedes progress.