If National wins ...

[Major von Tempsky]

Don't shed any tears for them. All they have to do is say the word to the authorities and they're on the plane to NZ into the loving arms of their extended whanau where they will be free to do drug dealing, bashing, raping, stealing, domestic abuse until the NZ law catches up with them.

[Sgt Pepper]

Don't shed any tears for them. All they have to do is say the word to the authorities and they're on the plane to NZ into the loving arms of their extended whanau where they will be free to do drug dealing, bashing, raping, stealing, domestic abuse until the NZ law catches up with them.

Major
You could argue that some of the NZers caught up in this situation may have been let down by their families. When leaving for Australia prior to 2002 they could/should have availed themselves to applying for Australian citizenship, compared to now a relatively straight forward process back them. It would not have compromised their New Zealand citizenship as we permit dual citizenship. Many kiwis leaving to work and reside in Australia have had a false sense of security. Only when things go wrong, e.g. their children enrol for tertiary courses, (non citizens must pay full fees) become unemployed(not entitled to any benefits) etc do they realise the full impact of not being a citizen.

[BlackPeter]

Major
You could argue that some of the NZers caught up in this situation my have been let down by their families. When leaving for Australia prior to 2002 they could/should have availed themselves to applying for Australian citizenship, compared to now a relatively straight forward process back them. It would not have compromised their New Zealand citizenship as we permit dual citizenship. Many kiwis leaving to work and reside in Australia have had a false sense of security. Only when things go wrong, e.g. their children enrol for tertiary courses, (non citizens must pay full fees) become unemployed(not entitled to any benefits) etc do they realise the full impact of not being a citizen.

Are you saying that there are still people who don't know that Kiwis in Australia are treated as second class people? Don't they read newspapers? Do they have no access to social media in Australia? It is not difficult to find out that while Kiwis have in Australia the duty to pay full taxes, they are not entitled to most of the benefits (including the "benefit" to stay in Australia"), if the realm of Aussie so chooses at their whim.

Australia is happy to suck Kiwis out (take their work and taxes) and than spit them back across the ditch ... but given that everybody knows the rules as well as the Australian attitude, is it obviously easy to avoid for the individual. Maldoon said once that Kiwis emigrating to Australia improve the average intelligence in both countries. Maybe though, the Aussies are just better in hiding there brains ...

The only thing I don't understand is why we don't reciproke the Australian treatment: trim the benefits for Aussies in NZ and kick them out if they misbehave ... - and focus our politicians again on solving our issues instead of whinging about the "unfair" treatment of Kiwi criminals in Australia. Is this really our biggest concern?

[Sgt Pepper]

BP
Good point about why doesn't NZ reciprocate. Its intriguing. There doesn,t seem any desire on the part of JK to address this

[Sgt Pepper]

I see the Canadian election looks set to throw out Stephen Harper and the Conservatives. John Key seems to be quite close to Stephen Harper and no doubt will be privately very disappointed with the outcome. A portent for things to come here I think.
I state my proposition again
There is a high probability John Key will announce his resignation in late 2016/early 2017.

[macduffy]

All countries tailor their immigration policies to their needs. Aust needed Kiwi immigrants for their mining jobs - amongst others - once, now they don't and are tightening accordingly. NZ still, apparently, needs certain skilled/qualified immigrants and hasn't yet reassessed the need. I expect that this will happen.

As an aside, there seems to be a widespread lack of understanding that Australia is a separate country from NZ. We don't expect any other nation to treat us as "one of them"!

[iceman]

I see the Canadian election looks set to throw out Stephen Harper and the Conservatives. John Key seems to be quite close to Stephen Harper and no doubt will be privately very disappointed with the outcome. A portent for things to come here I think.
I state my proposition again
There is a high probability John Key will announce his resignation in late 2016/early 2017.

It will be hard for him as his popularity continues to be sky high, sitting at 40% against Little's 8% according to latest Colmar Brunton poll :-)

[artemis]

As has been said before, those NZers in detention are there only because they have appealed their deportation. But they can leave right away and continue their appeal from NZ. It was reported that around 30% of appeals are successful. Probably not too many of those are serious criminals though. But still, it is voluntary detention is it not?

Of course incarceration is also voluntary. I read recently that in NZ people appear on average 11 times before they are sent to prison. May be different in Australia.

[Daytr]

Well they aren't all serious crimes, sometimes they are multiple minor crimes. You also mentioned around human rights. These people as others detained are being transported thousands of miles away interstate etc and being 'detained'. They aren't on special visas they are on the standard visa that all Kiwis go over on & many don't get citizenship. Kelvin Davis has not made a fool of himself at all and it appears many agree with him. I'm not saying & neither is he if the person's 'home' is basically NZ then it makes sense to send them back here, but the blanket approach is poorly thought out & gives no consideration to circumstance. I was also referring to detention generally in Australia which is shameful. They just denied access by one of their own MPs to visit one of the centres and as I said have also denied access by the Red Cross. There are kids, and families separated & 'detained' in quite harsh conditions for years on end.

So there was quite a bit incorrect in regards your post

What is quote incorrect about it Daytr ? Are they not all convicted criminals ? None of them are Australian citizens so all have some sort of Visa or authorisation to stay in Australia and have committed serious crimes while doing so.
Labour with Kelvin Davis making a fool of himself are yet again barking up the wrong tree

[Major von Tempsky]

I see the Canadian election looks set to throw out Stephen Harper and the Conservatives. John Key seems to be quite close to Stephen Harper and no doubt will be privately very disappointed with the outcome. A portent for things to come here I think.
I state my proposition again
There is a high probability John Key will announce his resignation in late 2016/early 2017.

"John Key seems to be quite close to Stephen Harper". Come again? No one else has ever observed that. My son and family live in Montreal and I have been over there....the news media silence re Stephen Harper and John Key is absolutely deafening.

The marker for John Key in John Key's mind is not Helen Clark but Keith Holyoake who won 4 elections in a row for National - 1960-1969. JK naturally wants to create a new record, a new marker.

So I state my more logical proposition again

[B] There is a high probability John Key will announce his resignation in late 2022/early 2023.

Think also Menzies of Australia. Relax Pepper, you fret too much.

(PS You need to have a rethink about the Canadian result means in the light of Canadian history and politics. So far with nearly all the results declared only 4 parties have seats. In Canada the Liberals were the old traditional governing party (think Pierre Trudeau and further back), the Conservatives were the old traditional opposition party, the New Democratic Party are a newish left of centre party, the Bloc Quebecois are a regional party irrelevant to the national scene and then there is the Green Party. The Liberal Party has 174 seats, a return to the old traditional slightly right of centre party of government, the Conservatives have 95 seats, the left wingers have just 32, the Bloc Quebecois just 8 and the Greens just 1. So the NPD and Greens have failed to penetrate. JK and National would relate more easily to Liberal of all those parties. Its another defeat for the Left.)