GNE - Genesis Energy

[iceman]

I have 5Kw of solar and going to 15. Pay back on the 5 has been 5years but we did it ourselves mostly. I agree have to have the capital but I have that . The batteries are getting cheaper. You are correct the Govt is biased since they own 50% of the generators and that is why the market has not been straightened out. There have been two studies showing the generators are making excessive profits buty they get ignored.
Stop loss I reformed in 87/88 and in 93-96 .Not Bradford.

May I ask why you are going to 15 Kw ? Are you efficiently going to store your production or do you use it all during the day ? I've looked into increasing mine but would achieve little other than selling more production cheaply back to the grid, which is not economical. Have also been looking at whether it is an option to get a couple of neighbours to join the same retailer and for them to buy my excess production at an agreed price, which would be significantly less than what they pay now and I would get more than just selling it back to the grid. If we can negotiate this, I'd quickly increase my capacity !

[iceman]

Sorry for the repeat post above. Not sure how it happens but my slow internet in the Southern Ocean does not allow me to edit nor delete it :0(

[Beagle]

Well put Beagle and my thoughts exactly. Joe average is many years away from installing solar, wind or any alternative power generation to supply their homes. Ditto for any large scale solar generation. I installed solar panels on my home 2 years ago and have a hybrid vehicle, so am comfortable with the investment, but mainly a feel good result though. I suspect economically I would have been better of putting the money into GNE shares. No doubt this will happen more in the future but I think we are a long way away from this in NZ, where much of our generation is not so unfriendly to the environment with 2/3 non CO2 emitting.

My neighbour just put some solar...I must get around to asking him whether he did a full cost-benefit analysis. Just curious if you did one Iceman ? The numbers I have seen generally show a payback period of > 15 years which simply doesn't work if one wants a more than 6% return on capital. Good for you though doing your bit for the environment.

Interestingly, just as an aside my environmental engineer friend reckons some people are spending $30-40K for a professionally installed system to go completely off grid. Heaps of solar, small wind turbine, massive battery bank and invertor and a diesel back up generator. The only way he reckons this makes sense for most people is if they live in a fairly remote location and have to pay heaps to get power to their new home.

[horus1]

Iceman, the !5KWh comes with a 10KWHR battery . Have 1 electric car and will get a second.Save $5500 on fuel per year and the car charger only works when the solar is on. We buy and sell on the spot thru Flick which is where the real benefits come in. The keys are to do a lot of it yourself, paybacks are a lot less than 15 years , that is the industry story. If you really want to make it work hard you go off grid. as Beagle notes above , more and more in remote areas will do that. Overseas the trends are clear because of subsidies but the prices are reducing so fast that they compensate and are equivalent to subsidies.In the states solar farms are being installed on long term contracts for 2.2c/Kwhr Us $ .
New technology is coming thru all the time . In China , solar subsidies are being reduced for EV's but they are being increased for Fuel cells which I believe will be better than EV's for transport. If Fuel cells become common the Electricity industry is dead.
If you want to see the affects of change and what it can do just look at coal prices dropping ,the same can happen in Electricity and will.

[percy]

I use approx $1,400 worth of electricity a year.Having 8,254 GNE shares,[$26,000] produces dividends to pay my power bill.Owning a good few more GNE and MEL the power bill is not a problem.
I have decide not to swap my Nissan Slyphy, for a Nissan Leaf, as the price difference of approx $14,000 is enough to pay for my petrol for the next 7.5 years.

[horus1]

Good on you Percy. I owned Flick shares but sold to Z . If the share price of GNE falls it will be more than the divs are worth, so far they have gone up and I am wrong but I do Ok investing in the Sharemarket.

[Beagle]

I use approx $1,400 worth of electricity a year.Having 8,254 GNE shares,[$26,000] produces dividends to pay my power bill.Owning a good few more GNE and MEL the power bill is not a problem.
I have decide not to swap my Nissan Slyphy, for a Nissan Leaf, as the price difference of approx $14,000 is enough to pay for my petrol for the next 7.5 years.

Like you I own shares in several and pay for the power bill several times over with dividends, likewise I pay for the Beagle clans fuel with ZEL dividends. Having a natural hedge against these costs makes common sense to me. On top of that the gains since acquisition of these shares have been very rewarding !!

[iceman]

Iceman, the !5KWh comes with a 10KWHR battery . Have 1 electric car and will get a second.Save $5500 on fuel per year and the car charger only works when the solar is on. We buy and sell on the spot thru Flick which is where the real benefits come in. The keys are to do a lot of it yourself, paybacks are a lot less than 15 years , that is the industry story. If you really want to make it work hard you go off grid. as Beagle notes above , more and more in remote areas will do that. Overseas the trends are clear because of subsidies but the prices are reducing so fast that they compensate and are equivalent to subsidies.In the states solar farms are being installed on long term contracts for 2.2c/Kwhr Us $ .
New technology is coming thru all the time . In China , solar subsidies are being reduced for EV's but they are being increased for Fuel cells which I believe will be better than EV's for transport. If Fuel cells become common the Electricity industry is dead.
If you want to see the affects of change and what it can do just look at coal prices dropping ,the same can happen in Electricity and will.

Thanks for the response and detail horus1. It sure is an interesting debate in an industry with technological advances moving ahead very fast and getting much cheaper.

Beagle, yes I did a cost-benefit analysis. It requires quite a bit of guess work because we are dealing with nature for production and future energy prices being unknown. My best conservative estimate prior to installation was 12-13 years payback, assuming no maintenance on the solar system. Experience in the first year indicated 11-12 years. Then I bought a hybrid main family vehicle and charge it mainly on solar or after midnight on very cheap rates. I now believe my pay back time is down to about 7-8 years, again assuming no maintenance.

[winner69]

Like you I own shares in several and pay for the power bill several times over with dividends, likewise I pay for the Beagle clans fuel with ZEL dividends. Having a natural hedge against these costs makes common sense to me. On top of that the gains since acquisition of these shares have been very rewarding !!

Interesting conceptual way of looking at things

You forgot to mention the ‘free’ three round the world trips with Mrs beagle courtesy of AIR (divies)

[Beagle]

Thanks for the response and detail horus1. It sure is an interesting debate in an industry with technological advances moving ahead very fast and getting much cheaper.

Beagle, yes I did a cost-benefit analysis. It requires quite a bit of guess work because we are dealing with nature for production and future energy prices being unknown. My best conservative estimate prior to installation was 12-13 years payback, assuming no maintenance on the solar system. Experience in the first year indicated 11-12 years. Then I bought a hybrid main family vehicle and charge it mainly on solar or after midnight on very cheap rates. I now believe my pay back time is down to about 7-8 years, again assuming no maintenance.

That's pretty good mate. Can't complain about that sort of payback period ! I know you bought a plug-in hybrid so it must be quite cool charging up off your solar system and then driving for free.

Interesting conceptual way of looking at things

You forgot to mention the ‘free’ three round the world trips with Mrs beagle courtesy of AIR (divies)

LOL quite right ..Mrs Beagle not a great traveller though so might have to spend that on something else.