Pie funds

[couta1]

Yes Bilbo and reading posts from some posters on other threads I don't know why they bother getting out of bed in the morning after all it's a risky activity.

[Harvey Specter]

The day I met Pie Funds and Mike for the first time I was buzzing because I had finally found an investment manager who shared my beliefs instead of the overly conservative investment advisers I had dealt with previously.

Do you think he has changed over time. His funds are getting bigger so it is harder for him to still apply his original strategy.

I know this is something Milford struggled with as their FUM increased. Likewise Kingfisher. Any decision is pretty much a self fulfilling prophecy when committing a lot of money because as you deploy funds, the price will drift up and as you withdraw funds, the price will drift down.

[Joshuatree]

[QUOTE=KW;584817]Anyone else noticed the Pie newsletters are getting sent out later and later? Pay attention to AKG down 25%, VSC down 31% and MNY down 22% over the last month. Not very helpful when you are trying to increase your fee generating funds under management is it?

quote KW.Also, I notice that Pie have stopped telling investors what the top holdings are in their portfolio, (other than a couple that they choose to share the good news on). Seems transparency has gone by the wayside as soon as performance started slipping. Not very honest is it?

14/12/14 KW [/QUOTEThose companies you are buying into are the same ones Pie has deemed to be rubbish enough that they have actually exited them by the time you get that newsletter. Still think those newsletter tips are fantastic? More fool you.

No pleasing you i know KW.Managed funds are a button pusher for you.I think they have their place and also that the industry has cleaned up alot;its not the Rort it used to be; however there still are legacy things like trailing fees which aint good.Many of us don't have your confidence and skills in managing all our picks.
Its possible PIE aren't so generous with their stocksharing (and transparency)now because of criticism like yours above14/12/14.Which is a shame. The boat fund and a number of my sophisticated faves on H/C rate PIE highly and are often in/talking about their picks(or were when PIE were more open.

They aren't a passive fund btw, active in fact and cash up when necessary.

Hey Entrep i thought it was the gambling that created the THRILL , initially anyway

[Bilbo]

Do you think he has changed over time. His funds are getting bigger so it is harder for him to still apply his original strategy.

I know this is something Milford struggled with as their FUM increased. Likewise Kingfisher. Any decision is pretty much a self fulfilling prophecy when committing a lot of money because as you deploy funds, the price will drift up and as you withdraw funds, the price will drift down.

Yes valid point. He has committed to keeping the fund size small and has talked about returning funds to investors when fund size gets too large. They have been able to grow total FUM by adding new funds rather than letting existing funds get too large, but more funds will spread the focus of the key staff more thinly.

My biggest concern with small companies is the effect of buy/sell decisions of the fund on the underlying sp and maybe selling down by Pie is some of the reason the shares mentioned previously have dropped in value. I think Pie may be much more active in taking profits than most of the Milford funds.

[1leon]

Yes valid point. He has committed to keeping the fund size small and has talked about returning funds to investors when fund size gets too large. They have been able to grow total FUM by adding new funds rather than letting existing funds get too large, but more funds will spread the focus of the key staff more thinly.


My biggest concern with small companies is the effect of buy/sell decisions of the fund on the underlying sp and maybe selling down by Pie is some of the reason the shares mentioned previously have dropped in value. I think Pie may be much more active in taking profits than most of the Milford funds.

But it seems to me that with several Funds including holdings in the same companies the idea that the individual Funds are kept small is becoming increasingly meaningless. The new Fund will exacerbate that situation.

The combined holding over several Funds plus the new super sized Fund might seem to have greater liquidity problems.

As I posted earlier the new Fund extends beyond small caps to mid caps and other financial products. The investment statement gives no indication of any intended split. Given also Taylor has always only claimed specialty in small caps the rationalisation of moving to other fields isn't obvious.

[stoploss]

Anyone else noticed the Pie newsletters are getting sent out later and later? Pay attention to AKG down 25%, VSC down 31% and MNY down 22% over the last month. Not very helpful when you are trying to increase your fee generating funds under management is it?

Also, I notice that Pie have stopped telling investors what the top holdings are in their portfolio, (other than a couple that they choose to share the good news on). Seems transparency has gone by the wayside as soon as performance started slipping. Not very honest is it?

Hot off the press !!!
http://www.piefunds.co.nz/newsletter...b168-346237729

[Bilbo]

I'd love to know how Pie managed to get a 50% increase on YTD returns for the Growth Fund in the single month of July (going from 9.9% end of June to 15.1% end of July), considering the performance of the stocks I mentioned. Seems suss to me. Anyone got an explanation?

My thoughts: The stocks you mentioned have a low weighting in the fund, they may even have sold out of those stocks. Other stocks, e.g TIL more than made up for the weakness in the stocks you mentioned.

[Bilbo]

I'd love to know how Pie managed to get a 50% increase on YTD returns for the Growth Fund in the single month of July (going from 9.9% end of June to 15.1% end of July), considering the performance of the stocks I mentioned. Seems suss to me. Anyone got an explanation?

Also, data is for July. MNY tanked after 31 July, and was actually up for July. Likewise VSCs big fall happened after July month end.

[stoploss]

I'd love to know how Pie managed to get a 50% increase on YTD returns for the Growth Fund in the single month of July (going from 9.9% end of June to 15.1% end of July), considering the performance of the stocks I mentioned. Seems suss to me. Anyone got an explanation?

KW correct me if I am wrong but I think Trustees Executors do all the calculations on performance of the funds etc , so unfair of you to be saying this is "suss" and fingering PIE imo.
I am pretty sure as of June this was around 25 % Cash , so could have been paring back the losers over July and riding the winners like VTG ?? Don't know but the valuations etc are out of their hands , so think they can be relied upon .

[Snoopy]

I think the newsletter demonstrated the problems with small cap fund managers - exiting poorly performing stocks. PIE are quite good stock pickers (except for those TTN and WDS picks) but its foolish to think that small caps are a buy and hold position. Its extremely hard to get out of them when you need to, its hard enough for people with small individual holdings to exit due to the lack of liquidity, so trying to exit a substantial shareholding without dragging the price down substantially, is nigh on impossible. And in that case, the actions of funds like PIE drag everyone's returns down as well.

KW has articulated very well why small cap shares are difficult to book trading profits with. This is quite a well documented effect, where profits on paper suddenly disappear due to liquidity problems when a fund that owns the small cap shares in question tries to sell. However, I do disagree with the bit I have emboldened.

It is precisely this poor liquidity that makes small caps a buy and hold proposition. You have to buy in full knowledge that you will very likely not be able to get out in a hurry. That means you have to do very good due diligence knowing that if your small cap does have issues it will more than likely get over those issues eventually.

SNOOPY