Pie funds

[Joshuatree]

Will get back to you when i update myself. As i said i keep expecting the fund to revert to the norm as its pretty hard to keep outperforming as they have/had and when /if it does i will reassess.

[stoploss]

Not trying to antagonize you Joshuatree but a genuine question, is this the fund you're invested in ? The one that's had a net return before tax of only 1.4% over the last year vs a market index return of 13% ?
https://www.piefunds.co.nz/assets/Fa...ets/Growth.pdf

One of the main advantages / disadvantages managed funds that chase large shareholdings in illiquid stocks like TIL have is that while they're building a large stake they can enjoy significant market outperformance (earning very substantial performance fees) simply through the weight of their money driving up the share prices of the companies they invest in.
However the opposite is equally true, once they have a large position they can easily find they've dug themselves into an intransigent position that's extremely difficult to extricate themselves from without inflicting a lot of pain on their investors. "Strange" that they never refund those performance fees when the very shares that created those performance fees go into meltdown isn't it.
Just thinking out loud here does that explain why they've closed this fund and opened a growth fund MK2 ?
Perhaps you would be so kind as to update us on your 3 years 10 months performance and share your thoughts on how well you feel they handled the TIL share price meltdown ?
Do you remain confident going forward in their ability to outperform the market after their management fee and performance fees and tax especially taking into account the sort of fiasco TIL turned out to be ?

Emerging Market fund has also dramatically underperformed the relevant index in the last year...more examples of TIL out there ?

While it is fair to say their new growth fund Mk2 has slightly outperformed, (before tax) the relevant index in the last year, after tax investors still would have been better off with the index return with no tax.

I am not convinced and the old investor adage of "past performance is no guarantee of future performance" springs readily to mind.
Disc No advice here, just plenty of food for thought and good banter.

Hi Roger ,
If you take a read of the March newsletter they acknowledge that mistakes have been made and they have had a review .So some soul searching going on.....
https://www.piefunds.co.nz/assets/ne...er-Februarypdf
As an investor I never expect them to win all the time and we all know nobody does .So if they have learnt from the TIL experience that's a bonus , I take your point about funds driving up the price of an asset . However I think a lesson might have been learnt here re position size . PIE would have realised they are no longer a boutique with a capped pool of funds @ 50 mio ......being a mini tanker still takes some turning around .... Just remember the PIE staff don't want the funds to be losing money " Staff , Directors and shareholders have $ 65 mio invested in PIE funds "
Lastly re the emerging fund "dramatically under performing the index
1 year return of the xec 14.43 %
Pie says the emerging fund is up 9.5 % in the past year .
5 year return of the XEC is - 5.36 % PA vs Pie since April 2013 ( inception ) + 184 % 30.6 % PA
I think these numbers speak for themselves .
http://us.spindices.com/indices/equi...ompanies-index

[Beagle]

Hi Stoploss

Thanks for those links, looking forward to reviewing that info tomorrow and discussing further.

[Joshuatree]

Thanks stoploss for the facts.
Just checked my own holdings and yes after expenses/fees
Australasian Emerging is up 173% since 14/5/13 roughly 45.5% per annum
Australasian Div Fund is up 60.3% since june 2013 roughly 16% per annum
Global Small companies the laggard up 32.32% since Sept 2013 roughly 8.94% per annum.

​Not sure where i got the 75% from previously but have double checked these figs above, this time.

[TJP]

Any Pie Hole-ders (ha excuse the dad joke) noticing the pie performance recently? pretty crappy (across several funds). Pie aren't very transparent about what is going on behind the scenes. Any thoughts? Imagine that TIL was a super bad investment for them. But what other lemons?

disc. holding

[percy]

Any Pie Hole-ders (ha excuse the dad joke) noticing the pie performance recently? pretty crappy (across several funds). Pie aren't very transparent about what is going on behind the scenes. Any thoughts? Imagine that TIL was a super bad investment for them. But what other lemons?

disc. holding

I was at a HBL presentation last Wednesday night, and spoke to a very highly regarded ChCh fund manager.I told him I always read his news letter,and watched what he invested in.He said "I hope you are doing better than us this year".
I also follow a small cap Australian fund which has had two bad months.
So I don't think Pie are alone.

[Sideshow Bob]

Recently sold out as needed the money elsewhere, but wasn't disappointed to withdraw funds. I only rate the return as average at best, given the market it had been riding.

[TJP]

I was at a HBL presentation last Wednesday night, and spoke to a very highly regarded ChCh fund manager.I told him I always read his news letter,and watched what he invested in.He said to "I hope you are doing better than us this year".
I also follow a small cap Australian fund which has had two bad months.
So I don't think Pie are alone.

Yea, I guess so far I've been put some interest into shares like GTK, ATM and FPH and seen better returns in the past couple of months that in Pie. Wondering if I can do better on my own. I know the suggested investment window is 5 years, but I get a little impatient knowing my money could be working harder for me. I mean these guys are meant to do this stuff for their day jobs, should do better than your average schmo.

[Felonius]

Pie Funds first invested in Ecoya in April 2012 at 90 cents per share, alongside Milford Asset Management and before the company changed it's name to Trilogy. By Sept '15 or thereabouts Pie were extremely bullish about Trilogy's prospects and had started buying heavily from $1.00 per share or less. Despite having paid too much for their last holdings, I believe Pie Funds will have made good money from investing in this company.

[TJP]

Recently sold out as needed the money elsewhere, but wasn't disappointed to withdraw funds. I only rate the return as average at best, given the market it had been riding.

Yea I am feeling you there too Bob, starting to get a little ansy and thinking about a withdrawl myself...