Auckland housing market

[MAC]

The Demograghics can also be nullified by immigration.

Immigration trends may influence short term moves up or down, it won’t prevent a secular cycle.

Not unless the government decided to do something radical like double the population in 20 years, but who would really want or vote for that, far too many arriving as it is IMO.

[BFG]

Immigration trends may influence short term moves up or down, it won’t prevent a secular cycle.

Not unless the government decided to do something radical like double the population in 20 years, but who would really want or vote for that, far too many arriving as it is IMO.

I agree. You guys already let one too many Canadians in. Next thing you know you'll be known as the Land of the Long White Cloud... and Maple-Flavoured Moose

[artemis]

If they are really renting the property from the trust, the rent being charged must be at a market value otherwise IRD will have issues with that if deductions are claimed. However if they a renting the property in their capacity as discretionary beneficiary of the trust its likely no rent is being paid and there should be any claim for tax deductions. Its possible that the trustees resolve to require the beneficiaries pay of all outgoings on the property and maintain it to a standard. The kids might be final beneficiaries of the trust but they don't own it, the trustees do.

Well I was mainly commenting on what might happen if the post war generation do or don't downsize. Still, 'market rent' still leaves a lot of wiggle room. The market rents tables on the DBH website, which are based on bond lodgement info, show a wide variation in rents for similarly sizes of property types. It's a blunt instrument but IRD would accept it as 'proof' I'm sure, since it is the most comprehensive and current data.


Correct, neither the settlor/s or the beneficiaries own the property outright, yet anyway. But in practice living in a place owned by a trust in which one is a beneficiary is quite different to a rental owned by an independent third party.

[artemis]

Immigration trends may influence short term moves up or down, it won’t prevent a secular cycle. Not unless the government decided to do something radical like double the population in 20 years, but who would really want or vote for that, far too many arriving as it is IMO.

I take it you are not an employer struggling to find skilled staff, then.

[MAC]

I take it you are not an employer struggling to find skilled staff, then.

Ha Artemis, you may consider paying the staff you have more to stay or to attract more, perhaps then wages here might actually match those we see in Australia someday.

There's 5% unemployment in Christchurch if you want to take and train them, the next boat load of Philippeno's suppressing wage growth will probably mean they will no doubt be available for you.

There are no native New Zealanders, we are all from immigrants whether we arrived in 1350, 1840 or 2015. Less people and burden on the environment long term though has got to be a better thing to leave for our great grandchildren.

Perpetual immigration growth is not necessary for a sustainable prosperous economy, it’s a mechanism used by politicians to stabilise cyclical economic dips and consumer sentiment to garner votes or minimise electoral impacts.

[Bjauck]

Well I was mainly commenting on what might happen if the post war generation do or don't downsize. Still, 'market rent' still leaves a lot of wiggle room. The market rents tables on the DBH website, which are based on bond lodgement info, show a wide variation in rents for similarly sizes of property types. It's a blunt instrument but IRD would accept it as 'proof' I'm sure, since it is the most comprehensive and current data.


Correct, neither the settlor/s or the beneficiaries own the property outright, yet anyway. But in practice living in a place owned by a trust in which one is a beneficiary is quite different to a rental owned by an independent third party.

When the baby boomers head for retirement, the government will probably boost immigration from countries with a surplus of younger people to replace them in the workforce and the immigrants will snap up the houses the boomers will sell when they downsize or move into retirement units.

NZ trust law is so liberal now...trusts were traditionally for assets over which the settlor had surrendered a beneficial interest or control. NZ family trusts where settlors are also beneficiaries and/or trustees would fail that test. It seems strange that a settlor be able to settle his house on a trust, yet still retain the de facto level of control over it he had prior to transferring into a trust. The assets of a trust should be regarded as the assets of the settlor who retains an interest in them as a trustee or a discretionary beneficiary.

[MAC]

When the baby boomers head for retirement, the government will probably boost immigration from countries with a surplus of younger people to replace them in the workforce and the immigrants will snap up the houses the boomers will sell when they downsize or move into retirement units

Over populating the country so that real estate speculator annual profits don't dip by a percent or two. Not if they actually want to get re-elected.

[Bjauck]

Over populating the country so that real estate speculator annual profits don't dip by a percent or two. Not if they actually want to get re-elected.

I think it is already happening to a point... and to mix a metaphor, the government does not want to stop the music as the whole house of cards could come crashing down!

[MAC]

I think it is already happening to a point... and to mix a metaphor, the government does not want to stop the music as they whole house of cards could come crashing down!

Not necessarily, if the housing market went flat for 10 years like it has in the past many might think that was a good thing.

I was content when the pop was around 3M, since then we now have more crowded beaches, more traffic congestion, Auckland water supplies from Hamilton waste crapped into the Waikato river, and well the beautiful sight that is a much greater South Auckland, ..........

Well, yes, and a shortage of housing of course.

I don't believe we are on the eve of destruction, but it would seem that it shouldn't just keep going.

[Bjauck]

...As a South Aucklander, I can say there are some lovely areas here still! I have been to the plush northern slopes of Remuera and Mission Bay and seen some infill housing where you could almost bring in your neighbour's washing from your living room. It would be good if the housing market went flat...as opposed to a boom-bust scenario. Unfortunately unlike UK and Aus, we do not have a well-developed share market or capital market to provide much of a buffer.