OCA - Oceania Group - retirement villages

[Baa_Baa]

That is imo disingenuous redefining standard accounting practice of calculation of NTA. From page 35 on the 31 March 2023 Balance Sheet, Total Assets (=Assets minus Liabilities) was $962,260,000 / 724,154,779 shares on issue is $1.32 NTA per share. Today it's reported as $1.40 NTA per share (NZX).

People can by all means make up their own valuation formulae, but redefining standard accounting practice of calculating NTA isn't helpful.

[Daytr]

That is imo disingenuous redefining standard accounting practice of calculation of NTA. From page 35 on the 31 March 2023 Balance Sheet, Total Assets (=Assets minus Liabilities) was $962,260,000 / 724,154,779 shares on issue is $1.32 NTA per share. Today it's reported as $1.40 NTA per share (NZX).

People can by all means make up their own valuation formulae, but redefining standard accounting practice of calculating NTA isn't helpful.

Hi Baa_Baa, I'm not redefining anything.
Value is helpful, NTA with the accounting method used is not helpful as a form of value in this instance.
The market doesn't obviously value the accounting NTA and rightly so.

[Bjauck]

You can argue semantics, fact is it's a benefit doled out by WINZ.
And the great irony is people who moan most about people getting hand-outs from the state are collecting cheques that are even more unnecessary every week too.
https://figure.nz/chart/2eIStXKBWssxMIze

The only thing more distasteful about paying it is the current recipients rationalising and being offended by anyone correctly calling it out for what it is.

Heh, that 'one day' is guaranteed to come before, or at least conveniently be timed to coincide with my generation retiring.
Bill English even mooted a date in 2040. Conveniently after the most pandered generation in history are safely across the line.

I have no problem with those folk who have paid NZ income tax at the top marginal rate for decades receiving a non-means tested superannuation. I am in favour of the more stringent requirements for NZ superannuation for those who had spent decades of their working life abroad.

The generations after the boomers may well be the first in a long time to be poorer than their elders until some of them then become the wealthiest generation as they start to inherit the boomer wealth, unencumbered by any transfer tax in NZ. For some they may then be able to buy a house. However many of the kiwi millennials may already be in OZ as they are giving up on getting ahead in NZ in the meantime. So the inherited NZ wealth may end up benefiting OZ to a large extent.

However in the meantime wealthy NZ boomers means a good potential market for Oceania’s offerings.

[Bjauck]

All of the arguing on here is exactly why I would never consider living in one of these Villages.

From an investment point of view. I will invest at rock bottom prices. OCA is not at the bottom yet as this cycle still has time to run.

I am not sure why the arguing on this Sharetrader thread would put you off living in An Oceania village. I often visit an Oceania village and have never seen the residents shouting at each other from their doorsteps hiding behind masks! The worst I have seen are several complaints from residents in the reception book, stating they had been waiting for a week for the maintenance manager.

Visit Oceania’s villages yourself and have a look at the quality of the units and public amenities.

[winner69]

Oh dear, Warriors lose to bottom placed Titans, who hadn’t won a game all season. Warriors now 3 wins, 1 draw and 4 losses. Fans a bit disappointed with todays result but keeping the faith …we’re a great team and have the goods to go whole way. This is our year. The year will end on a high.

Oceania had a bad week as well with share price down 3 cents ..one of worst weeks in recent times. In spite of some bad publicity and a few detractors the loyal fans are like Warriors fans keeping the faith and in adamantly defending the company and expressing their confidence in the future prospects and that’s it only a matter of time before the share price moves up strongly.

To a casual observer these comments on social media seem to sum up the Warriors - and the way Oceania is going probably sums them up as well.

Wahs looking like a side believing too much of their own hype, thinking things would just happen for them. They’re not working hard enough

The warriors would have to be the most disappointing team in Australian/NZ sport. So much talent but continue to disappoint. Is it an attitude problem? To many key players going missing when it gets tough? [

It seems this may not be our year after all …for both Warriors and Oceania

But keep the faith …UP THE WAHS and GO OCEANIA

[nztx]

Deep Value concepts work in weird & wonderful ways .. in space of mere two years all the Boy's & Girl's
OCA Buck has mysteriously turned into 60c

The Buck has also stopped spitting out dividends

Time to buy some more ? or not just yet ?

We all know where investment yields have gone during the same 2 year term.

Where was this NZX sharemarket darling sitting immediately following the Covid Era ?

What's changed ? The Rest Home Ops are still basically neutral more or probably less now in the sector, the elderly are still clambering to secure an OCA Village roof over their heads, the ledger tab still records the notional ups & down on what the valuer's assessments point to, there's still allegedly deep value hidden somewhere and a large dallop of interest free occupant dough recorded as a liability on the other slate opposite

[Antipodean]

Hi Baa_Baa, I'm not redefining anything.

The NTA is bull****.
[...]
The real NTA would be lucky to be the current market cap in my view.

To me this sounds like redefining NTA as a concept.
However if you substituted your word of 'value' instead of 'NTA' in the second sentence I would understand your point being NTA doesn't reflect the value of the company.
NTA is NTA regardless, and is only one of many yardsticks to measure a company on.

The market doesn't obviously value the accounting NTA

Agree here.

...and rightly so.

Disagree here.


The small update from OCA was good to see, even if it wasn't outstanding news many (including myself) have been keen on more market updates so this of some worth regardless.

About one more month until the full reveal for us all.
Place your bets now...

[Daytr]

To me this sounds like redefining NTA as a concept.
However if you substituted your word of 'value' instead of 'NTA' in the second sentence I would understand your point being NTA doesn't reflect the value of the company.
NTA is NTA regardless, and is only one of many yardsticks to measure a company on.



Agree here.


Disagree here.


The small update from OCA was good to see, even if it wasn't outstanding news many (including myself) have been keen on more market updates so this of some worth regardless.

About one more month until the full reveal for us all.
Place your bets now...

Hi Antipodean, what I am trying to say, perhaps poorly, is that I have seen a quite a few posts referring to the NTA as being some figure oto base the valuation for the company on, when it's clearly not.

Accounting or not, assets are valued, not what they cost but on what they return. If an asset is losing money is it an asset or liability? And more importantly, what is someone prepared to pay for an investment that is losing money.
I am referring to the operational day to day business of servicing villas & care suites not sales & resales etc.

[mfd]

Hi Antipodean, what I am trying to say, perhaps poorly, is that I have seen a quite a few posts referring to the NTA as being some figure oto base the valuation for the company on, when it's clearly not.

Accounting or not, assets are valued, not what they cost but on what they return. If an asset is losing money is it an asset or liability? And more importantly, what is someone prepared to pay for an investment that is losing money.
I am referring to the operational day to day business of servicing villas & care suites not sales & resales etc.

OCAs valuations have been met in their recent divestments, did they happen to pick the 9 properties that were valued correctly and everything else is overinflated by 50%?

"This will bring the total number of sites exited, divested and closed since the start of FY2024 to nine, with aggregate gross sales proceeds of circa $40m and in line with book value"

[ronaldson]

OCAs valuations have been met in their recent divestments, did they happen to pick the 9 properties that were valued correctly and everything else is overinflated by 50%?

"This will bring the total number of sites exited, divested and closed since the start of FY2024 to nine, with aggregate gross sales proceeds of circa $40m and in line with book value"

Circa $40m is only $4.5m each. I doubt you could replace the land and buildings component for that. So the "in business" worth is very little.

I have been wondering who are the acquirers - not just from OCA but the other listed entities who have been similarly divesting. It would be interesting to know, to better understand this part of the sector, as any reporting ( unlike the Strathellen sale in Timaru) of that aspect is rare.

Come to think of it Arran Court (ex RAD, where I am an ex-holder) is not too far away from where I live. I will drop by and enquire.