OCA - Oceania Group - retirement villages

[Maverick]

Guys, I'm off to Hamilton this week...worth doing a walk by of the village that's getting a makeover?

If your interested in OCA then why wouldn`t you? While your there make time to check out SUM`s new Rototuna and RYM`s new Linda Jones. Having a look at all three will give a good representation of different styles between the operators.

If you are tech savvy enough is there any chance of a photo? It was just foundation work for the apartments there 4 months ago.

I've never understood why people would visit the Hamilton gardens when there are just so many retirement villages to tour.

[BlackPeter]

Agreed in principal, BP, but I'm not sure you understand my calculations...

Buy @ 136
Sell @ 163
Margin = 27c or 20%

Unfortunately it's not going to be 33% tax on the 27c (9c) because my average buy for OCA over the year is about 80c, so in the eyes of the IRD...

Sale of new parcel @ 163
Average buy = 80
Realised gain = 83
Tax @ 33% = 27c

That's a pretty tough result. Breaking even and that's before you consider brokerage and the risk that it may not see a 20% gain. Surely the system, if it is indeed strictly FIFO, is flawed and that LIFO would be a much fairer accounting method in this instance? Grey AF I suspect, unless it's well documented somewhere...?

You might want to consider to change your tax accountant ... or if you don't have any, hire one :

[couta1]

You might want to consider to change your tax accountant ... or if you don't have any, hire one :

Just do it yourself, study up and listen to people who know what they are talking about, people that haven't used an accountant for yonks and get things right.PS-Havent used an accountant in over 20 yrs and see no reason to use one going forward, no disrespect to Beagle of course who im sure does a top job for his clients.

[BlackPeter]

Just do it yourself, study up and listen to people who know what they are talking about, people that haven't used an accountant for yonks and get things right.PS-Havent used an accountant in over 20 yrs and see no reason to use one going forward, no disrespect to Beagle of course who im sure does a top job for his clients.

I agree ... so do I.

However depending on the individuals situation and inclination to study tax law, this can be a little bit like driving a car without seatbelt. Most times it is fine, but if not ... the mess can be big ...

[couta1]

I agree ... so do I.

However depending on the individuals situation and inclination to study tax law, this can be a little bit like driving a car without seatbelt. Most times it is fine, but if not ... the mess can be big ...

For sure, you have to put the time in and be confident that your methods are correct or at least more likely to be correct, but for sharetrading it ain't exactly rocket science, always remember the tried and true KISS principle.

[Beagle]

I consult with this firm for anything really difficult. https://www.nsatax.co.nz/ I hope people understand I can't put myself in a position of giving tax advice on here without the full knowledge of all relevant details including a full analysis of investing activity in recent years.
Can we get back to OCA finally ?

[couta1]

I consult with this firm for anything really difficult. https://www.nsatax.co.nz/
Can we get back to OCA finally ?

Must be really boring this OCA when everyone keeps drifting off track.PS-RYM has always been known to be really boring and look how that turned out.

[Beagle]

RYM has always been known to be really boring and look how that turned out.

A truly fascinating case study in the power of compounding annual tax free growth, one that all students of value creation should take careful note of.

RYM listed in 1999 at about the same price OCA is today and 21 years later after a stock split 5:1 = over $15 today.
By my calculations original investors have made 57 times their original investment in capital gain plus all dividends along the way.

SUM listed about this time of year in 2011 also at about the same price OCA is today and they're now worth 8.3 times the original float price just 9 years later plus all dividends.

Nothing like the above could ever happen again, surely not ?...or could it

[Cyclical]

You might want to consider to change your tax accountant ... or if you don't have any, hire one :

If I can do it myself, I'd rather invest my funds into shares. Although my last year or two of self employment in the UK I did hire an accountant. He was pretty cheap and absolutely more than paid for himself. He had with him a book titled something along the lines of "Legal Tax Evasion". I suspect there were a whole lot more hand outs, concessions, loop holes and write offs etc over there that could be exploited with the appropriate knowhow...

Just do it yourself, study up and listen to people who know what they are talking about, people that haven't used an accountant for yonks and get things right.PS-Havent used an accountant in over 20 yrs and see no reason to use one going forward, no disrespect to Beagle of course who im sure does a top job for his clients.

I agree ... so do I.

However depending on the individuals situation and inclination to study tax law, this can be a little bit like driving a car without seatbelt. Most times it is fine, but if not ... the mess can be big ...

For sure, you have to put the time in and be confident that your methods are correct or at least more likely to be correct, but for sharetrading it ain't exactly rocket science, always remember the tried and true KISS principle.

Yep, happy to learn the ropes, I'm a numbers guy and do find this stuff interesting, plus used to do my own accounting in my self employed days (pre UK).

I consult with this firm for anything really difficult. https://www.nsatax.co.nz/ I hope people understand I can't put myself in a position of giving tax advice on here without the full knowledge of all relevant details including a full analysis of investing activity in recent years.

Thanks for the clarification, Beagle, I had wondered, as you are usually pretty mum on the subject and quick to try steer conversation in a different direction (back on track as it were). Cheers for the link too.

Can we get back to OCA finally ?

Roger, Roger.

Thanks all for some great discussion and sorry once again for high jacking the thread.

An update on Awatere is coming...

[Cyclical]

If your interested in OCA then why wouldn`t you? While your there make time to check out SUM`s new Rototuna and RYM`s new Linda Jones. Having a look at all three will give a good representation of different styles between the operators.

If you are tech savvy enough is there any chance of a photo? It was just foundation work for the apartments there 4 months ago.

I've never understood why people would visit the Hamilton gardens when there are just so many retirement villages to tour.

Just arrived here this evening, meetings all day tomorrow before heading back to the Naki, so thought I'd better do as instructed... It was wet and dismal and starting to get dark, so apologies for the average pics.

The first thing that stuck me was how big the site is. From what I could see, and from yacking to one of the residents, we've currently got an apartment building, opened in 2002, to the left end of the site (looking from the road), and the rather flash and modern looking care suites / hospital building to the right end, which said resident was raving about. She told me to come back for the full tour...that will have to be another time unfortunately...

Between those two existing buildings and set back further from the road is the new block that I guess you were saying was just foundations 4 months ago, Maverick? It's now 2 stories high and she tells me this will be 5 stores when done, which I'd expect will give pretty awesome views up and down the river, which is out the back.

Attachment 12079

Attachment 12080

Then out the back of the existing apartment building, left of site, they've laid the foundations for another apartment building which she tells me will be 2 stories plus a carpark underneath. I don't know that this will see the river, unless there is some serious pruning/culling of trees out the back, or maybe it will, hard to tell. This pic shows the foundations for the 2 story, with the back of the existing apartment block on the right and another angle of the growing 5 story in the background.

Attachment 12081

Here's a shot of the care suites complex.

Attachment 12082

Back in my landscaping days, I used to have a monopoly on the lovely big old houses back towards the Fairfield bridge, so I know the area pretty well and it's certainly in the upper end as far as Hamilton goes. Seems to me like a great place for OCA to be doing this development and the visit gave me some appreciation as to why they've gone down the demo/rebuild path as opposed to the greenfields out on the edge of town approach. Was great to meet one of the residents that had been there for a few years and to hear her enthusiasm for what was going on. I somewhat doubt this particular site has reached the "inflection point" but when it does, it'll be a cracker.