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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by couta1 View Post
    Your wrong, I never commented on the management structure at ARV, only that I preferred the Rym and Sum model. Trader Jackson I'm talking about the top heavy structure that needs new blood once it becomes a listed company, but Mum's the word on any further detail.
    It is hard, I think, to see details on the 'top heavy structure' you speak of, have I missed something, or do you know more information about Oceania's structure that makes it 'top heavy' than what I can seem to find? Would be great if you could share what makes it top heavy, and what new blood you think is required once it becomes a listed company etc

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by trader_jackson View Post
    It is hard, I think, to see details on the 'top heavy structure' you speak of, have I missed something, or do you know more information about Oceania's structure that makes it 'top heavy' than what I can seem to find? Would be great if you could share what makes it top heavy, and what new blood you think is required once it becomes a listed company etc
    Basically under the former CEO, an oversupply of General managers and managers was set up and still remains as we speak, hopefully this will change going forward as the current CEO seems more tuned in and efficient. I know a former employee from their HQ that has given me more info about the above structure than is currently available to the general public. For obvious reasons that's all I can say on the matter.

  3. #33
    Speedy Az winner69's Avatar
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    t_j seeing you going to be in boots and all when ; if this IPOs hope you started doing your homework

    Here is their last set of accounts
    https://www.companiesoffice.govt.nz/...CC7A88F831340D

    Worth as much as Summerset as the AFR sort of suggested?
    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    t_j seeing you going to be in boots and all when ; if this IPOs hope you started doing your homework

    Here is their last set of accounts
    https://www.companiesoffice.govt.nz/...CC7A88F831340D

    Worth as much as Summerset as the AFR sort of suggested?
    Thank you couta1 for your response, and yes winner69 I am interested... but possibly not 'boots and all'... the IPO documents will be of great interest, should the IPO go ahead.
    I don't think it would be fit to compare it to SUM (this did surprise me when AFR mentioned this), at least when comparing on a build rate and land bank, but they do have a strong development ahead, in the short term. On a breif look, Operating cash flows are very strong, and ORA's have experienced good growth, with growth likely to increase in the coming years. Balance sheet heavy with debt, which is nothing new, although I am sure a significant proportion of this will disappear when listing.

  5. #35
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    Attachment 8762
    It would seem Oceania is another step closer...

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    t_j seeing you going to be in boots and all when ; if this IPOs hope you started doing your homework

    Here is their last set of accounts
    https://www.companiesoffice.govt.nz/...CC7A88F831340D

    Worth as much as Summerset as the AFR sort of suggested?
    Interesting....Hmmmm, if it were not for gains on revaluation of properties (IFRS) they would have lost ($13m) in 2016, an improvement from losing ($23m) from operations in 2015. Talk of big growth by promotors does not impress me. Track record to date is well below par. You cannot list on fancy pants multiples because of tailwinds in the sector unless you have a decent track record wherein you've proved your development model. This is why MET who haven't proved their case yet are on an underlying PE of only ~ 16 whereas at the other end of the scale RYM are in the high 20's.
    Promotors promises of future growth when prior growth has been very modest always worry me, Tegal the last example of a float choc-a-bloc full of corporate spin.
    Last edited by Beagle; 21-03-2017 at 01:09 PM.
    Ecclesiastes 11:2: “Divide your portion to seven, or even to eight, for you do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth.
    Ben Graham - In the short run the market is a voting machine but in the long run the market is a weighing machine

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  8. #38
    Speedy Az winner69's Avatar
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    You keen as mustard eh t_j

    Hope you on your brokers favourites list
    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by trader_jackson View Post
    With such a reliance on care beds to drive profit, it will all come down to them keeping their wages to revenue ratio below a certain level, a tough ask. Most of the money from the IPO will be used to pay down debt and until they get more development going, the previous mentioned ratio will determine how successful or not they will be.

  10. #40
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    Must admit I thought something was imminent as institutions from what I have observed in the market seem to have been keeping their powder dry on any buy bids for SUM and RYM lately.
    Key point of difference is care bed focus. Very little money to be made in that sector as I am sure Couta1 who works in that sector will tell you. (Edit I see you already have implied that mate)
    The real money is in development and recycling of churned units. Very unlikely I will participate based on what I have heard of their top heavy management structure and after reviewing their previous year's financial performance already. Lets be honest, promotors can forecast anything they like, (Tegal anyone ?), but their historical financial performance speaks for itself and it isn't flash on an underlying basis !
    https://www.companiesoffice.govt.nz/...CC7A88F831340D
    Last edited by Beagle; 31-03-2017 at 10:46 AM. Reason: Edited to comment regarding Couta1's post)
    Ecclesiastes 11:2: “Divide your portion to seven, or even to eight, for you do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth.
    Ben Graham - In the short run the market is a voting machine but in the long run the market is a weighing machine

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