sharetrader
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 40

Thread: Mtfhc

  1. #21
    ShareTrader Legend Beagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    21,362

    Default

    Thanks for clarifying the situation Noodles. Honestly...8.5% in my view is woefully inadequate for this type of perpetual security issued on those terms.
    Another classic Forsyth Barr where they really "looked after" their clients...ranks almost up there with Feltex, Credit Sails and their abhorrent involvement with SCF.
    Last edited by Beagle; 08-01-2015 at 11:44 AM.

  2. #22
    Member Penfold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Wellington
    Posts
    103

    Default

    Hard to price these... No call date/redemption date. How can you price them without knowing when principle will be returned? You would expect some signal to market on redemption, even with perpetuals.

    All I can see in the terms is that they can chose to redeem with 30 days notice (but why would they?), or if they go into liquidation (not ideal).

    Agree with Roger, massively overpriced. I have owned in the past when all the spreads blew out on this complex stuff. Have long since sold as everything has shortened up.

    This quote comes to mind - “More money has been lost reaching for yield than at the point of a gun.”

  3. #23
    percy
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    christchurch
    Posts
    17,221

    Default

    Yes the risks out way the rewards.

  4. #24
    IMO
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Floating Anchor Shoals
    Posts
    9,695

    Default

    Quite a jump,8.6% today to 76c today re a 1 year high on good vol; no idea why.

  5. #25
    percy
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    christchurch
    Posts
    17,221

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    Quite a jump,8.6% today to 76c today re a 1 year high on good vol; no idea why.
    Local broker at Hamilton Hindin Greene in Christchurch has picked up on what we were up to a year ago.!
    Read my original post.

  6. #26
    IMO
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Floating Anchor Shoals
    Posts
    9,695

    Default

    Cool thanks percy.Our fave stock heartland causing the rerate, at least partly a win /win. Hope it goes to $1 as noodles suggests

  7. #27
    Guru
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    3,025

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Joshuatree View Post
    Hope it goes to $1 as noodles suggests
    Why would it be redeemed at face value rather than just bought on market?

  8. #28
    percy
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    christchurch
    Posts
    17,221

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Harvey Specter View Post
    Why would it be redeemed at face value rather than just bought on market?
    Noodle's post #7, and my post #8 on this thread,may explain how we thought at the time.

  9. #29
    ShareTrader Legend Beagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    21,362

    Default Reality Check

    It took the High court circa 5 months to hand down their ruling on this matter.

    If we assume it takes the Supreme court a similar amount of time then we won't expect a final ruling until 5 months after November 2015, somewhere around March 2016 and then the negotiations and shenanigans between HNZ and MTF's board start. Remember MTF's constitution precludes any shareholder holding over 10% without the board's approval and such approval is unlikely to be forthcoming unless HNZ's offer is truly compelling in which case the reticent board members despite knowing they'll be out of a lucrative job will know they have no other legal alternative than to recommend acceptance.

    MTF don't seem all that open to HNZ's approaches and even if HNZ finally get control of the company unless anyone can point to a specific clause in these perpetual notes to the effect of compelling HNZ to buy them out in a takeover situation then I see no reason why HNZ would as these perpetual notes would rank as Basil 3 compliant capital under the Reserve Bank's requirements.

    You can't raise Basil 3 capital at circa 5% and as these are perpetual they would form a sweet and cheap funding source for HNZ....in fact the mere existence of these notes and terms of issue thereof is probably one of the most attractive features of MTF.

    The odds on a capital repayment would appear to be very slim IMHO.
    Last edited by Beagle; 15-10-2015 at 06:20 PM.

  10. #30
    Speedy Az winner69's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    , , .
    Posts
    37,737

    Default

    roger, probably in here somewhere. Your homework!

    http://www.mtf.co.nz/investor/pdfs/MTFProspectus.pdf

    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •