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  1. #7771
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    Quote Originally Posted by mondograss View Post
    I guess you'd just work it that they pay a lower purchase for the ORA but a higher monthly fee. If it's a choice between that and having a unit empty for years, then yes I can see the argument being reasonably compelling. Time was that local councils had retirement units that they offered out to the low income community, but a lot have been sold off now (at least in Auckland, probably smaller provincial councils still do it).
    That would be a good compromise. I am not sure if they should take up the role of the provision of social retirement housing.

    A hybrid Ora/lease arrangement could be the way to make a retirement village affordable or more appealing to a wider market. I think the retirement villages would be well placed to meet and surpass NZ’s rental housing obligations/regime.
    Last edited by Bjauck; 07-05-2019 at 03:45 PM.

  2. #7772
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bjauck View Post
    I think there is room for the retirement village operators to offer units for rental. There would be group of people who may not necessarily be able to afford, or perhaps want to make the outlay for an ora but who could pay rent out of retirement savings and the sale of a cheaper house.

    .
    It is not the role of private rest home / aged care to provide services for those who cant afford those services. Thats why we encourage people to save for their retirement years.

  3. #7773
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bjauck View Post
    That would be a good compromise. I am not sure if they should take up the role of the provision of social retirement housing.

    A hybrid Ora/lease arrangement could be the way to make a retirement village affordable or more appealing to a wider market. I think the retirement villages would be well placed to meet and surpass NZ’s rental housing obligations/regime.
    I know a lot about rental housing in New Zealand, current and proposed rules. I would be alarmed if any company I owned shares in decided to enter that market. Check out the Residential Tenancies Act, Labour and Greens rental housing policies (and the current consultations under way), and try a sampling of the tens of thousands of Tenancy Tribunal cases every year. Almost all brought by landlords for rent arrears and damage.

    Best for the villages to stick to their knitting and leave rentals to the ever shrinking pool of landlords, and the taxpayer.

    As a general thing, I expect that those planning to buy into a retirement village will have homes at the more attractive end. Attractive to buyers, that is, because more likely to be standalone houses than say high rise studios. So most won't need a hybrid option, though their heirs might!

  4. #7774
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    Quote Originally Posted by artemis View Post
    I know a lot about rental housing in New Zealand, current and proposed rules. I would be alarmed if any company I owned shares in decided to enter that market. Check out the Residential Tenancies Act, Labour and Greens rental housing policies (and the current consultations under way), and try a sampling of the tens of thousands of Tenancy Tribunal cases every year. Almost all brought by landlords for rent arrears and damage.

    Best for the villages to stick to their knitting and leave rentals to the ever shrinking pool of landlords, and the taxpayer.

    As a general thing, I expect that those planning to buy into a retirement village will have homes at the more attractive end. Attractive to buyers, that is, because more likely to be standalone houses than say high rise studios. So most won't need a hybrid option, though their heirs might!
    Well said artemis.

  5. #7775
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    Reviewing all the economic stuff that impacts the housing market and putting them all into a matrix and assessing what usually happens to the housing market when an indicator changes I reckon we could see the number of house sales over the next year increase by more than 10% and that prices on the average could will be 5% or more higher in a years time

    Good for Summerset I reckon .......as long as Julian stirs up his sales people and doesn’t accept that non existent longer days to sell as an excuse for the sales people to finalise sales.
    Last edited by winner69; 08-05-2019 at 07:39 PM.
    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

  6. #7776
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    Good for Summerset I reckon .......as long as Julian stirs up his sales people and doesn’t accept that non existent longer days to sell as an excuse for the sales people to finalise sales.
    For sure, didn't miss the elephant in the room, but an inadequate response to arresting the multiyear declining % of sales vs total product available and longer times to sell the ones that actually got sold. I wouldn't want to be the sales manager, I bet they're having a few sleepless nights trying to figure out how to reverse the trend without manipulating other things like slowing the builds, that's just fudging the numbers. I want to see them push on with the build programme and fix their sales performance.

  7. #7777
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    Quote Originally Posted by winner69 View Post
    Reviewing all the economic stuff that impacts the housing market and putting them all into a matrix and assessing what usually happens to the housing market when an indicator changes I reckon we could see the number of house sales over the next year increase by more than 10% and that prices on the average could will be 5% or more higher in a years time

    Good for Summerset I reckon .......as long as Julian stirs up his sales people and doesn’t accept that non existent longer days to sell as an excuse for the sales people to finalise sales.
    No argument from me

    Quote Originally Posted by Baa_Baa View Post
    For sure, didn't miss the elephant in the room, but an inadequate response to arresting the multiyear declining % of sales vs total product available and longer times to sell the ones that actually got sold. I wouldn't want to be the sales manager, I bet they're having a few sleepless nights trying to figure out how to reverse the trend without manipulating other things like slowing the builds, that's just fudging the numbers. I want to see them push on with the build programme and fix their sales performance.
    Rome wasn't built in a day. SUM's track record of profit growth speaks for itself.
    Ecclesiastes 11:2: “Divide your portion to seven, or even to eight, for you do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth.”
    Ben Graham - In the short run the market is a voting machine but in the long run the market is a weighing machine

  8. #7778
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beagle View Post
    No argument from me

    Rome wasn't built in a day. SUM's track record of profit growth speaks for itself.
    I know you're not making excuses for the multiyear decline in sales performance and I think I understand your motivations for backing out to the macro metrics of 'record profit growth' (I share the motivation but not the response), but even you have alluded to/acknowledged the sales performance issue.

    It is unavoidable, it is the elephant in the room with SUM. As a shareholder I'd prefer that they confronted that and shared a convincing plan to avoid a continuation of the sales under-performance. Without fudging the numbers by slowing development growth, just fix the root cause sales under-performance.

  9. #7779
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baa_Baa View Post
    For sure, didn't miss the elephant in the room, but an inadequate response to arresting the multiyear declining % of sales vs total product available and longer times to sell the ones that actually got sold. I wouldn't want to be the sales manager, I bet they're having a few sleepless nights trying to figure out how to reverse the trend without manipulating other things like slowing the builds, that's just fudging the numbers. I want to see them push on with the build programme and fix their sales performance.
    They are doing mystery shopping to help sales along ....thats good

    But maybe thats a sign that prospective buyers turn have reasons to turn cold on Summerset and Summerset are trying to find out.
    Last edited by winner69; 08-05-2019 at 08:08 PM.
    “ At the top of every bubble, everyone is convinced it's not yet a bubble.”

  10. #7780
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baa_Baa View Post
    I know you're not making excuses for the multiyear decline in sales performance and I think I understand your motivations for backing out to the macro metrics of 'record profit growth' (I share the motivation but not the response), but even you have alluded to/acknowledged the sales performance issue.

    It is unavoidable, it is the elephant in the room with SUM. As a shareholder I'd prefer that they confronted that and shared a convincing plan to avoid a continuation of the sales under-performance. Without fudging the numbers by slowing development growth, just fix the root cause sales under-performance.
    Over the last two years I have been bending Julian's ear a heck of a LOT about moving to fixed weekly fee's for life. I have followed him up in a very "dogged" way.
    I gathered the sense that I might finally be getting through to him after following him up yet again about this matter last week....watch this space.
    This won't be a panacea for all the reasons some of their units are slow sellers but it will help if they finally do this.
    Ecclesiastes 11:2: “Divide your portion to seven, or even to eight, for you do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth.”
    Ben Graham - In the short run the market is a voting machine but in the long run the market is a weighing machine

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